John q
Member
Hope you manage to sort something out regards the fish mate, and whist it won't help atm I'm thankful you managed to get yourself, your partner and neighbour out of the house.
Sending good thoughts.
Sending good thoughts.
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Consistency Deficiency
- Thread starter Hufsa
- Start date
💓 Im relieved that we made it out ok. It was a close call when I was trying to get back out again. Had to run down through a passage where it was really thick with smoke and I just had to hold my breath through it. It was so hot and I could tell the fire was burning right below that floor and wasn't sure how much longer before I would have been stuck upstairs.
Fortunately(?) this isnt my first rodeo, so im quite
And I am really glad I have insisted to have the travel cages for the birds easily accessible in case of emergency. One of the lil blighters didn't like how fast I was grabbing at him and bit me of course, but he got so shocked by my relentlessness that he released his grip, maybe realised I wasn't messing around and was in a bit of a hurry
Sorry to hear this @Hufsa but damn good job getting folks out safely 🫡
Glad you are safe.
One point you may not be thinking about as there’s a lot going on… unplug your filters if you can next time you gain access to the property. Preferably before they get power back to your home. The consumer board has probably tripped due to the fire so wouldn’t worry, unless you flip it back on it won’t happen without your intervention.
If the outage isn’t too long it won’t matter. If it’s extended then you’ll be best draining your filters, rinsing media and refilling with fresh water before running them again.
Glad you are safe.
One point you may not be thinking about as there’s a lot going on… unplug your filters if you can next time you gain access to the property. Preferably before they get power back to your home. The consumer board has probably tripped due to the fire so wouldn’t worry, unless you flip it back on it won’t happen without your intervention.
If the outage isn’t too long it won’t matter. If it’s extended then you’ll be best draining your filters, rinsing media and refilling with fresh water before running them again.
Good point, happened to me once, my filter had stopped and I was not sure for how long on a shrimp tank, I managed to get it going but all the stuff it dumped into the tank killed all my shrimp in seconds :/
Good luck Hufsa, hope your property was not damaged and glad everyone is safe!
Sid.scapes
Member
So sorry to hear that, Hufsa. Hope you all are feeling better now.💓 Im relieved that we made it out ok. It was a close call when I was trying to get back out again. Had to run down through a passage where it was really thick with smoke and I just had to hold my breath through it. It was so hot and I could tell the fire was burning right below that floor and wasn't sure how much longer before I would have been stuck upstairs.
Fortunately(?) this isnt my first rodeo, so im quiteemotionally bluntedadept at dealing with traumatic events 🫠
And I am really glad I have insisted to have the travel cages for the birds easily accessible in case of emergency. One of the lil blighters didn't like how fast I was grabbing at him and bit me of course, but he got so shocked by my relentlessness that he released his grip, maybe realised I wasn't messing around and was in a bit of a hurry
Good luck for the immediate future Hufsa, I hope your residence and all your belongings are salvageable.
I'm sure the collective 'we' are all wishing you well and hoping for your life to be returned to as normal as soon as possible.
I'm sure the collective 'we' are all wishing you well and hoping for your life to be returned to as normal as soon as possible.
The Miniaturist
Member
What @bazz said, glad you're all safe & hoping for the best for your fish.
Myrtle
Member
I hope your property isn't too badly damaged and I'm sure your fish will be fine with all the plants filtering the tank. Fingers crossed that you can get back to normal soon.
Power is back on and I think we will be allowed to stay here tonight. Ive got the tank up and running again, the fish look unaffected so far, I think it helped that its precisely aquarium temperature outside these days, so they didn't get cold. The filters smelled ok, perhaps a touch stale but not bad. Im really glad I clean my filters very often, so there wasn't much to rot in there. Time will tell if the tank has suffered any setbacks, the plants look a bit miffed about the lack of light. Im hoping I wont have to do too many water changes as im kinda exhausted. Thank you so much for the kind wishes and advice, ill check back in when ive rested up a bit 💓
After I had a few hours of rest yesterday I got the water tested and had nitrite in both main tank (0.1) and kitchen tank (0.05) 😟
I was so tired so I didnt do an ammonia test but I think the nitrite is the most important one.
I prepared a batch of water as quickly as I could and did a large water change on the main tank, but there was no energy left for the poor kitchen tank.
Before the hastatus arrived I did panic buy a bottle of Seachem Stability. If I had to rate my belief that this product is effective and beneficial I would have to rate it at a 1 out of 10.
But I dosed the kitchen tank with it on the off chance it could help and went to bed 😔
I havent had the courage to test the water yet this morning, but I know I need to do that within a few hours.
Part of me doesnt want to know what the results are, because if theres still nitrite I will feel compelled to do another large water change, and im just so exhausted..
Im hoping very much that the main reason for the spike is because the plants havent had access to light or CO2 and thus havent been growing.
If the plants have previously been doing a sizable portion of the biological work in the tank, then having them actively growing today might mean that things will get back on track soon.
The CO2 is on and I will try to make sure its getting that 1 point ph drop. I also increased the light intensity by 10% on both lights, in case it might mean the plants could grow even quicker.
If I get a little bit of algae from that I dont even care, the main goal now is to try to save the fish to the best of my very limited capacity.
Cross your fingers that the plants will again save the day 🤞
I was so tired so I didnt do an ammonia test but I think the nitrite is the most important one.
I prepared a batch of water as quickly as I could and did a large water change on the main tank, but there was no energy left for the poor kitchen tank.
Before the hastatus arrived I did panic buy a bottle of Seachem Stability. If I had to rate my belief that this product is effective and beneficial I would have to rate it at a 1 out of 10.
But I dosed the kitchen tank with it on the off chance it could help and went to bed 😔
I havent had the courage to test the water yet this morning, but I know I need to do that within a few hours.
Part of me doesnt want to know what the results are, because if theres still nitrite I will feel compelled to do another large water change, and im just so exhausted..
Im hoping very much that the main reason for the spike is because the plants havent had access to light or CO2 and thus havent been growing.
If the plants have previously been doing a sizable portion of the biological work in the tank, then having them actively growing today might mean that things will get back on track soon.
The CO2 is on and I will try to make sure its getting that 1 point ph drop. I also increased the light intensity by 10% on both lights, in case it might mean the plants could grow even quicker.
If I get a little bit of algae from that I dont even care, the main goal now is to try to save the fish to the best of my very limited capacity.
Cross your fingers that the plants will again save the day 🤞
I tested the water. Zeroes across the board, 0 nitrite in both main tank and kitchen, and 0 ammonia as well in both.
Oh god thats a relief! 😌
It could be the effect of the large water change last night, but that doesnt explain the kitchen tank, or how in my experience if you have a certain amount of nitrite reading, you wont lower it to a clear 0 with a water change, only to a minimal reading of nitrite. (Unless you replace literally 100% of the water which is usually hard to do with fish in the tank)
I think having the circulation back and having the plants back online is what's done this.
Im going to allow myself a few more hours to try to relax and sort out some more practical things related to the fire, and then ill prep the barrel with water for tomorrow just in case the levels go back up again.
That way it would just be ready for later and I could spread out some of the work.
And ill test again tomorrow or perhaps later tonight if I am able to 💪
Every time I walk into the area of the apartment that got affected by the smoke im having some bad feelings come back from the house fire that happened when I was young. In that one we lost everything.
Im hoping we can get the smell out completely from the things in that area, otherwise it might be a constant stressful reminder.
Im going to speak to the insurance again to hear if they could help with having things like winter jackets cleaned, because im not sure how I could wash those in the machine without ruining them, and things like that.
I dont really want to be dealing with any of it though, so im thinking of contacting them in a few days, surely they would understand that.
Sorry for going very off topic from the journal, its supposed to be about the fish and plants after all.
Oh god thats a relief! 😌
It could be the effect of the large water change last night, but that doesnt explain the kitchen tank, or how in my experience if you have a certain amount of nitrite reading, you wont lower it to a clear 0 with a water change, only to a minimal reading of nitrite. (Unless you replace literally 100% of the water which is usually hard to do with fish in the tank)
I think having the circulation back and having the plants back online is what's done this.
Im going to allow myself a few more hours to try to relax and sort out some more practical things related to the fire, and then ill prep the barrel with water for tomorrow just in case the levels go back up again.
That way it would just be ready for later and I could spread out some of the work.
And ill test again tomorrow or perhaps later tonight if I am able to 💪
Every time I walk into the area of the apartment that got affected by the smoke im having some bad feelings come back from the house fire that happened when I was young. In that one we lost everything.
Im hoping we can get the smell out completely from the things in that area, otherwise it might be a constant stressful reminder.
Im going to speak to the insurance again to hear if they could help with having things like winter jackets cleaned, because im not sure how I could wash those in the machine without ruining them, and things like that.
I dont really want to be dealing with any of it though, so im thinking of contacting them in a few days, surely they would understand that.
Sorry for going very off topic from the journal, its supposed to be about the fish and plants after all.
Myrtle
Member
I can only guess at how traumatic the whole thing has been for you, especially given the previous childhood fire. Be kind to yourself, especially with the memories the smell is bringing up. PTSD and trauma isn't just for reserved for people who have experienced war or abuse.
I had to do the tests again tonight. It was a choice between trying to rest with the dread of the unknown status looming, or check to see. Either have to do another round of water changing, or could get to relax knowing everything is ok (which is a much better way to rest).
It was another round of 0's
If the water is still good tomorrow morning ill even give the fish a little bit of food, imagine that 😊
Previously a bunch of boraras attempted to protest the lack of food by jumping into the skimmer while they were shoaling around near the corners trying to get attention. The boraras were escorted out and got sternly told I don't negotiate with terrorists 😛
They dont have as good of a reason to complain about no food as the wild caught hastatus do, but I think all of them will be very happy to have something more to eat soon. I will be carefully ramping up feeding amounts to make sure the system is keeping up though.
It was another round of 0's
If the water is still good tomorrow morning ill even give the fish a little bit of food, imagine that 😊
Previously a bunch of boraras attempted to protest the lack of food by jumping into the skimmer while they were shoaling around near the corners trying to get attention. The boraras were escorted out and got sternly told I don't negotiate with terrorists 😛
They dont have as good of a reason to complain about no food as the wild caught hastatus do, but I think all of them will be very happy to have something more to eat soon. I will be carefully ramping up feeding amounts to make sure the system is keeping up though.
I realised I never had time to write about the new plants I got a little while ago 😃🌿 (So this was before the fish and the chaos)
But I really enjoy writing about and sharing pictures of my plants, so thats what ill do this evening 😊
That shipment of plants was very delayed, and some of the plants suffered pretty badly from it.
My plan had been to receive the plants within the expected timeframe (of course), and then have a whole week to plan placements and gradually prepare and plant the ones in invitro cups.
Basically spread it all out over many days so I wouldnt get so burnt out from all the planting.
Well... That week just passes with no package, and after much annoying back and forth I finally get a hold of the package.
The plants were damaged from being delayed so long and desperately needed to get into a fresh new environment.
I could just forget about gradually planting out healthy invitro cups (which store easily for a week+ in suitable conditions if they are sealed).
No, these needed planting immediately if they were to have any chance of surviving.
Many of the cups had gotten opened in transit (no longer sterile), and a few of them were already growing mold. One was so incredibly yeasty, it smelled like a pizza dough on steroids
So all the plants got planted out as well as I could manage, and since I didnt have time to plan all of them quite well some of them are in temporary locations.
But also sometimes when starting with invitro plants, I dont really feel like they can be planted directly in their intended destination.
They are usually so small and if its supposed to grow into a really big plant, I think the plantlets stand a better chance if they start off as foreground plants without shading by big towering neighbors. If they are really really small I even like to just lodge them into another bushy plant so that the tiny plantlet is not damaged by the planting and can uptake directly from the watercolumn.
Im getting quite satisfied with my plant collection 😃 I have the majority of the plants that I have wanted, and there are not that many more that I feel like I must have 😊
The plant goblin is happy.
For a while ive been wanting mostly more green plants, because I think colorful (red/pink/yellow/etc) plants look their absolute best when surrounded by mostly green.
For me its a bit of a "if everything is special then nothing is really special" kind of thing.
So while I have been happy to grow my plant collection this past year or so, I have been a bit dissatisfied with having too much other colors overpowering the green.
I have also planned to shift how much maintenance my tank requires by trying to tweak the plant mass so that most of it will consist of slower growing and/or easier to trim plants.
There are some high maintenance species that I cant see myself getting rid of, but instead I want to try having just a small handful of those instead of a very large group.
Its faster to pull up, cut and replant 5 stems than 30, at least it is for me and the way I handle the plants.
So what were the plant additions?
Bacopa madagascariensis: A big plain green bacopa, doesnt grow very fast, almost looks like a big version of B. monnieri 'Compact' (which is to the left).
Seems to be well behaved (the essential word for a good high tech plant
)Limnophila rugosa: Another green stem, the emersed form of this looks like an absolute thug that has nothing to do with water, but the new leaves that are coming out are much more moderately sized. Pleased to see this one also doesnt seem to be growing super fast, although it is a very eager brancher.
Ludwigia palustris "Green": No dedicated picture of this one yet, the plant I got was very damaged from the shipping delay and only some very small shoots that grew out of the rotting bits survived. Its probably visible in some of the fish pictures in the background though. I think this one might go yellow in high light, which I dont really want. Im kinda trying out these new green plants to see which ones I prefer, and I dont think I will keep all of them, some will probably go to the kitchen for keeping the preciouses purposes.
Lysimachia nummularia (green form): The one that I picked up from the norwegian roadside is doing well, and the one from the aquatic plant order is coming around too.
It has a slightly slanted growth habit, I guess its because it creeps when growing emersed. Will try to get a dedicated picture of this one too.
Bacopa salzmannii "Purple": Just one more colored plant, I swear
Its purple, how could I resist?!Very itty bitty shoots that got planted into the tripartita. Finally coming around and getting some size and color. Soon they can be moved to a different location I think.
Cryptocoryne parva: A very common plant that I have never had before. I wanted something green and shade tolerant that I could plant below big spreading plants that have a void by their base. I think this one might do a good job, im thinking of blending it with the Anubias Mini Coin throughout the planting. Right now its planted in a very boring monoculture lawn in the foreground. I need to know where the big feature plants are going before I can place the parva below, and those plantlets just needed somewhere to be until that time comes. Its a shame to have to move a crypt again soon(ish), but I didnt see any other option at the time, letting them float makes them curly and super annoying to plant later.
Cryptocoryne spiralis "Cook's Form": This was the cup that smelled like yeasty pizza dough
Im surprised the plantlets came out so well to be honest I thoroughly rinsed of the yeast and nutrient gel and in they went. No melt 🤷♀️
I dont know why many people see so much melting from generally all invitro cups of plants. I rarely get that sort of melting in my tank. What is the difference?
Anyway, this is a background plant for suure, but they were too small right now. So they are allowed to gain size up front before moving.
Eriocaulon sp. "Japan Needle Leaf": The cup I got had three of these guys, and none of them had any roots.
They just had a brown mushy gooey stump of some sort where the roots might/should/could have been
I bent a piece of stainless steel wire into a U shape, and have used this to hold the plants down near the substrate, but not touching the sand.
I wanted the "pest" snails to have full access to cleaning the mushy stuff, because regular small pest snails are way better at knowing what is dead and what is alive than a big fumbling human.
If I had buried the ends of the plants I would have cut off their access.
There has been some leaves senescing but im seeing some delicate root growth come out of the confused looking stumps.
I think they used some sort of invitro black magic sorcery to propagate these plants, and thats why they look so strange.
Im glad water circulation, snail pedicures and some time has allowed them to recover 😊 These should form really nice wispy curtains in the future 😍
Helanthium tenellum "parvulum": I missed the lime green color and shape that Sagittaria had. But Sag did not want to stay small for me. Reluctant to try that again just to have it turn ginormous once more. So gonna try this one, just sprinkled in here and there to add a bit of different texture 😊
Lobelia cardinalis 'Mini': I hear this is pretty slow growing and the shape and color is attractive, so I was thinking it could be useful to have as a part of the low maintenance plantmass.
Since its very trimmable I think its possible to have it both in the fore/midground but also possibly as a taller plant if left to grow for long enough?
Ludwigia inclinata var. verticillata 'Meta': Ok, ok, two colorful plants I meant to say. I needed to complete the trilogy!
This cup had about 80% wilted tissue when it arrived. I gently removed all of that, but I wasnt very optimistic about the outcome of the bits that were left behind.
But, I picked a likely looking little shoot from what was left and stuffed it in between some of the foreground plants. And look at it go 😃
Rotala ramosior "Florida": A little cutting that im keeping as backup for another plant enthusiast 😄
Messy out of focus fish pics:
I think the hastatus may be able to turn their black eyes on and off as they desire. It seems to be related to their overall coloration, if they want to look paler for some reason they fade out their black tail spot and the black eye goes away. When they are feeling bold and bushy tailed they seem to turn up the black pigment to max
Im seeing some females getting rounder which I am quite happy about. One can be seen in the right of this picture. The females are deeper bodied even when viewed from the side. Males tend to be noticeably smaller and slimmer even when fully grown.
A brave otto tries to edge into the crowd to get some of the spirulina stick.
A photo which doesnt depict anything in particular, other than that it gives me a warm fuzzy feeling. Chaos with wriggly cute fish eating up a storm, and the messiness of the plants in the background I quite like. I have wanted my tank to look more messy/wild for a long time. Maybe now is finally the time 😊
Other plants:
Pantanal growing pretty well, might be the best ive had, I cant remember? Its friend stunted while the power was out though 😂
The big one needs replanting, so lets see how badly it takes it 😈
Ludwigia polycarpa is tolerant of being kept low, but it sure can grow too if left to it 😃
Ive been letting all the plants grow out extra long because the power has been off.
Its a bit twisty, im still getting a few complaints from some of the plants (see following pictures)
Bacopa Colorata to the left is still green, im wondering if its planning to turn bronzy pink at all this time or not.
I got some more floaty friends because they are good to have if the tank needs some extra stability. There are a few nutrient issues yet to be solved, or that needs to be tweaked further.
This Salvinia came from an invitro cup, so its pretty safe to assume that the color of the existing plantmass was fairly correct. But as you can see the new shoots are coming out paler.
There seems to be something immobile that my plants arent getting quite enough of compared to what they want.
If you go back some pictures you can also see the pale straw colored center of the Blyxa japonica.
But there also appears to be a moderate issue with something mobile.
Look at this frogbit. The overall color is a paler green than it should be.
Its affecting the new growth (as you can see in the center of the plant and on the plantlet on the right), but since it has been sustained over time, its also on the mid to older growth too.
This indicates to me that there has probably been a relatively steady undersupply (most likely) of an immobile nutrient.
Immobile nutrient deficiency can be displayed in older growth, if the deficiency has been steady over time.
If the overall paleness is because of a mobile nutrient, adding it would green up the mid to older growth quite quickly.
But in addition to the pale new leaves, the frogbit is also decaying in the oldest leaves before they are normally due (compared to my observations of this plant over time).
So it might also be a bit hungry for something mobile. I think it might be very common to have two or more things going on at the same time.
This blurs the overall picture a bit, but its still possible to get to the bottom of it, I think its good to start with whatever seems to be worst first.
You can also see that the leaves are a nice round flat shape and dont have any distinct curling or bumps like it had a few months ago.
So whatever was causing that seems to have been solved.
I need to do some more reading but I already have a few nutrient tweaks in mind to try for next time
I really like observing the frogbit like this. I never thought I would be able to learn so much from it.
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Wookii
Member
_Maq_
Member
It was a lack of oxygen:
(1) The plants did not photosynthesize enough.
(2) Without filter the water stood very still and local suboxic zones spread where there normally was enough oxygen.
Btw. Seachem Stability hinders nitrification.
Yeah I had some faint memories of UKAPS posts about that swirling around somewhere in the back of my head.
Its that its the wrong kind of bacteria, isnt it?
I dont know the fancy words for it all. But they compete (outcompete?) the ones that we actually want, right?
I didnt add any more than that one dose to the kitchen tank. I think it was because I needed to feel like I had done -something- anything to help the fish, so that I could sleep.
...Maybe thats even a part of their marketing strategy 🤔
_Maq_
Member
Not exactly.
Seachem Stability is a blend of heterotrophic decomposing bacteria. We do need these, but the thing is that their metabolism is more effective than that of nitrifiers and they outcompete them for oxygen. As a result, nitrifying archaea and bacteria are hindered in their development.
Years ago, I performed experiments about cycling new tanks, and to my astonishment, Seachem and JBL bacterial inoculations made cycling slower. I couldn't understand it until I've read a scientific paper which explained the problem.
Based on this information, I came to a conclusion that to help cycling by fish food or any organic matter is counterproductive. The fastest way is to add solely minerals, including ammonium, and better still, i bit of nitrite.
The base line remains that the importance of nitrification is vastly exaggerated. Or rather, generalized. Fish breeders rightfully care to avoid ammonia spikes. But planted tanks, the more so those with injected CO2, are always kept in acidic territory, and plants are willing consumers of ammonium. There's really little worry about ammonia. Hindered decomposition is the real thing, I believe. To address that, potions like Seachem Stability may be useful. But it's very difficult to detect visible results which can be conclusively attributed to a given bacterial inoculation.
Wookii
Member
