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Fluval Stratum & Caribsea Eco-Complete?

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FISHnLAB said:
What's the issue? Too large? Too irregular? Too sharp?
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Too sharp indeed, wont be very nice for fish to sift.
I see some long rod like "grains" on the picture, and it makes me wonder if the sand is made from some sort of industrial slag, that would explain why the grains have those very telltale crushed and sharp edges.
 
Hi all,
FISHnLAB said:
I too have very quickly become jaded with manufacturers and definitely don't take their word for anything. There is just so much snake oil and misinformation in this hobby/industry. Far more then others I have participated in.
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Unfortunately that has been a long running theme on this forum, various vendors who are <"economical with the truth"> and seek to obscure what their product contains and how it "works".
FISHnLAB said:
Too sharp?
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Hufsa said:
Too sharp indeed, wont be very nice for fish to sift.
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Same for me, I like rounded grains.

cheers Darrel
 
I use just Caribsea Eco-Complete gravel in both my tanks. If I had to start a brand new tanks today I likely would put a thin (1-2cm) layer of substrate (such as Tropica) below the gravel just to help give the plants a bit of a head-start. Long term it won't matter though.

Cheers,
Michael
 
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Hey guys, sorry I got away to other threads for a bit😊. Yes, I see that Diamond Black is quite sharp. I am uncertain what to think on this one as I hear of people successfully keep corys and the like in all types of substrate including sharp ones but, I tend to air on the side of caution so I am going to stick with proven safe products if I plan to run bottom feeders.

So, now I am uncertain what to do. I read of many people having troubles with Fluval's Stratum and its smaller grain size and benefitial bacteria infused BioStratum cousin. Apparently it is super light and crumbles easily compared to other aquasoils? Also a bit large in the case of regular Stratum?

So, I am still going to do coarse mesh bags filled with Eco-Complete as filler in the back, but now, I am thinking of sourcing some ADA, Tropica, or UNS(or anything else recommend really) to use as a main soil with no topper(decorative patch aside maybe). It isn't cheap or easy to find here in samml town Canada but, I am not sure I want to try and rock a Walstad as my first big and first high tech setup. What do you think? I am aware of all the different conditions(Ammonia release more or less with different products, different grain sizes, etc.) but, what should I shoot for. What are your experiences? What is the... ULTIMATE AQUASOIL? Sorry😂...
 
FISHnLAB said:
I am thinking of sourcing some ADA, Tropica, or UNS(or anything else recommend really) to use as a main soil with no topper(decorative patch aside maybe). It isn't cheap or easy to find here in samml town Canada but, I am not sure I want to try and rock a Walstad as my first big and first high tech setup. What do you think? I am aware of all the different conditions(Ammonia release more or less with different products, different grain sizes, etc.) but, what should I shoot for. What are your experiences? What is the... ULTIMATE AQUASOIL? Sorry😂...
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Hello 👁️👄👁️
Its me again

Kinda relieved to hear you wont be going with the Fluval Stratum. Ive just never heard anyone rave about it you know, nor does it seem to be very popular in repeat situations (not the kind of soil you get on your second round of doing things). ADA carries the price tag just because it says ADA on the bag, im not a huge fan of their products, although I hear from a credible source that their tools are genuinely the best on the market. So I would personally steer clear of the ADA soil just because I dont like paying for a name, and I know youre not interested in the soil for its rocket fuel capabilities like some are.
Tropica is a very safe choice, its very commonly used and just a solid product, a "known quantity". Some of the other brands are probably just fine too, they will be cheaper in many cases because they dont have the widespread use to lean on that Tropica does. If you can get Tropica for a fair price locally I would get that, if you get another brand locally that is still fairly common but a fair bit cheaper then you can probably go for that, in the end I bet most of the soils will be fairly similar in composition.
 
Hufsa said:
Hello 👁️👄👁️
Its me again
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Bahaha, you watchin me ain't ya lol. I totally appreciate all of the help👍.
Hufsa said:
Kinda relieved to hear you wont be going with the Fluval Stratum. Ive just never heard anyone rave about it you know, nor does it seem to be very popular in repeat situations (not the kind of soil you get on your second round of doing things).
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Yeah, the Stratum is just so much easier to get here then most other products. And, it is much cheaper too but, maybe for a reason as it really doesn't seam to get great reviews nor repeat use much like you say. The fish keeping scene is just so much smaller here from what I see and the aquascaping scene is really small. I mean some is because I live in a smaller town(sometimes I wonder if I will be the only one in the city with a quality rimless tank and thickly planted aquascape lol). But, aquascaping in particular doesn't seam to be very big at all in Canada. Part of it may be our government's assault on common meds for fish keeping, not sure really(things always tend to be smaller and more expensive in Canada really unfortunately). Anyway, that's part of the reason for considering Stratum or Biostratum originally, I can get it right at the local pet stores and easily on Amazon. But, it's not worth having troubles and I want the best tank possible within reason. Sorry to ramble lol...
Hufsa said:
ADA carries the price tag just because it says ADA on the bag, im not a huge fan of their products, although I hear from a credible source that their tools are genuinely the best on the market. So I would personally steer clear of the ADA soil just because I dont like paying for a name, and I know youre not interested in the soil for its rocket fuel capabilities like some are.
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I haven't checked pricing and availability yet but yeah although I highly respect and admire the work of Takashi Amano, some of their stuff is just ridiculous. They wanted $207.99CAD(153.36EUR) for a set of ADA wave scissors at an online shop I was looking at😳. And, that is coming from a guy who has owned a number of quality tools from the likes of Snap-on, Hazet, Stahlwille, Knipex, etc.😂. Maybe if I had seen them in person/hand I would be more impressed though lol. That said, my options are limited so I might have to go with what I can get with free shipping.
Hufsa said:
Tropica is a very safe choice, its very commonly used and just a solid product, a "known quantity". Some of the other brands are probably just fine too, they will be cheaper in many cases because they dont have the widespread use to lean on that Tropica does. If you can get Tropica for a fair price locally I would get that,
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Yes, I have heard good things. It is at the top of my list I think. But, what variety? I'm thinking the finer stuff will hold small plants better? Be better overall or?
Hufsa said:
if you get another brand locally that is still fairly common but a fair bit cheaper then you can probably go for that, in the end I bet most of the soils will be fairly similar in composition.
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I'll let you know what's available once I do some research.

How is UNS Controsoil?

Thanks again for all of the help👍.
 
John q said:
Gravel or sand, that would be my suggestion
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Like inert you mean(or maybe root Tab infused) or Walstad style?
John q said:
Fools and there money are easily parted, I'll leave that thought there. 😉
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Not to be too harsh but, that's a little bit of an ignorant thing to say. You have no idea what my conditions are and live on the other side of the planet from me by the looks of it.

I have too much on my plate to learn how to mix my own ferts right now and quality Root Tabs are very hard to find where I live. I can get APT J easily, and yes definitely expensively lol, off of Amazon with free shipping in 2 days. I'm pretty sure though, although they are expensive, they are amongst the highest quality on the market, Dennis seams like a pretty smart dude. But, I haven't bought them yet so am definitely open to suggestions if you have one that is of equal quality and easily available in Canada at a better value.
 
MichaelJ said:
I use just Caribsea Eco-Complete gravel in both my tanks. If I had to start a brand new tanks today I likely would put a thin (1-2cm) layer of substrate (such as Tropica) below the gravel just to help give the plants a bit of a head-start. Long term it won't matter though.

Cheers,
Michael
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Good information to know, thank you👍.
 
dw1305 said:
Hi all,
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Hi, nice to meet you.
dw1305 said:
Unfortunately that has been a long running theme on this forum, various vendors who are <"economical with the truth"> and seek to obscure what their product contains and how it "works".
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Yes, definite a major problem in this industry/hobby.
dw1305 said:
Same for me, I like rounded grains.

cheers Darrel
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Yes, I think I will stick to smoother products for any tanks that I plant to put bottom feeders in.
 
sparkyweasel said:
And made of quartz, a vaiety of silica.
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Yes, it's written on the bag. However, if it's silica, then there's no need to use a sharp-edged one, and - more importantly - the statement on large colonization surface does not make sense. Even shattered, sharp-edged silica does not feature surface area we could call 'large'.
Beside that, I've read carefully the instruction and it suggests to use as many kilograms as liters required. That leads me to assume that the technical density of this thing is close to that of water (one kilo per liter). In other words, the substrate is very light. That is why I've suggested it might be anthracite. It looks like that very much and the density fits. Also the surface area.
 
FISHnLAB said:
Not to be too harsh but, that's a little bit of an ignorant thing to say. You have no idea what my conditions are and live on the other side of the planet from me by the looks of it.
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Fair enough. I've no idea how difficult it is to buy generic osmocote over in Canada.

I don't doubt for a second APT jazz isn't a good product, I just find it a bit of mickey take that it costs $20 for 18 tabs.
 
Hi all,
John q said:
I don't doubt for a second APT jazz isn't a good product, I just find it a bit of mickey take that it costs $20 for 18 tabs.
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That is the thing I struggle with, you need some <"pretty inventive advertising"> to persuade people that is a feasible price, and you need to be entirely amoral to actually try it. I'm going to be very wary of any company that does this, they have basically lost my trust and I'm pretty sure <"they aren't helping themselves">, or our hobby, in the long term. You can <"sell a product"> without trying to rip-off everybody in sight.
FISHnLAB said:
I haven't checked pricing and availability yet but yeah although I highly respect and admire the work of Takashi Amano, some of their stuff is just ridiculous. They wanted $207.99CAD(153.36EUR) for a set of ADA wave scissors at an online shop I was looking at Aand, that is coming from a guy who has owned a number of quality tools from the likes of Snap-on, Hazet, Stahlwille, Knipex, etc.
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@FISHnLAB this is another really good point, <"you can apply what you know"> (sceptical thinking) from <"other parts of your life to aquarium products">. That is all I do, I say "does the bit I understand make sense?" and if it doesn't? I assume the rest of it is all snake oil as well.
FISHnLAB said:
Like inert you mean(or maybe root Tab infused) or Walstad style?
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You can use an <"inert medium"> and <"just feed the water column">, a lot of members do this successfully. <Water issues and nitrate removal">
FISHnLAB said:
I have too much on my plate to learn how to mix my own ferts right now and quality Root Tabs are very hard to find where I live.
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I'd recommend a horticultural fertiliser, I'm not sure what you can get in Canada, but there will be one. Have a look at <"Solufeed 2 : 1 : 4">.

cheers Darrel
 
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