sciencefiction
Member
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Why not do it in your own tank and tell us the results.
It's hard to expect fablau deliberately harming his plants after months of efforts to do the opposite.
I'd say Zak is our hope now 🙂
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What exactly causes BBA?
- Thread starter Zak Rafik
- Start date
Why not do it in your own tank and tell us the results.
It's hard to expect fablau deliberately harming his plants after months of efforts to do the opposite.
I'd say Zak is our hope now 🙂
I dont expect him to. I was just wondering. I would do it if I had the personal interest, i.e not being convinced that its a co2 issue.
zozo
Member
I also did to manny changes in a to short periode of time and i guess since it happend in that periode gave the algea a chance to outbreak on me. 🙂 And once it is growing it's growing and spreading rapidly, you realy have to stay on top and watch your plants realy closely and you'll see it grow.
Sometimes i have to look at the same plant plant 4 times over again to find it, this stuff is so nasty, that when you see it at first sight with your nacked eye, there allready is a lot in the tank you've havent seen or looked at for a long time..
Here is an expample with that Myriophyllum Brasiliensis.. At first look, nothing wrong, healthy steady growing plant. 🙂
Then i go digging and look realy closly, run the tweezers trough and inspect every inch of every stem. 🙂
Bang!! Headshot! AAArghhh!!! Healty steady growing.. Hanibal Rising🙁
IMHO this is a lot and will grow an let loose float around, catch another nice plant, attach and bingo, nest number 2 is rising.
I did put it under the microscope and in fact this a combination of 3 different spiecies of algae. I found Cladophora and the other 2 i didn't realy got fully identified by now. I guess the 2nd one i believe is strains of BBA. It looks like a branching black worm under the micro and at 40x there comes a very dark green/blue color trough. It looks like it grows something like sea urchin like flowers at some places. The 3th just bright green and and almost square looking cells stacking.
These first 2 are realy nasty, especialy the Cladophora, this one is so well addapted and plant like, you'll see it make oxygen bubbles on top of the leaves where it attaches, that's a hard one to fight. It seems to like the same conditions the plants like. It's hard to find the balance where the plant likes to grow faster than the vampire, so you finaly just can cut it out. This takes some time, you can't make it disapair over night.. Change one thing at a time and let it ballance out to see the effect, mean while find nests and use sciccors and h2o2 spot treatment. 🙂
Sometimes i have to look at the same plant plant 4 times over again to find it, this stuff is so nasty, that when you see it at first sight with your nacked eye, there allready is a lot in the tank you've havent seen or looked at for a long time..
Here is an expample with that Myriophyllum Brasiliensis.. At first look, nothing wrong, healthy steady growing plant. 🙂
Then i go digging and look realy closly, run the tweezers trough and inspect every inch of every stem. 🙂
Bang!! Headshot! AAArghhh!!! Healty steady growing.. Hanibal Rising🙁
IMHO this is a lot and will grow an let loose float around, catch another nice plant, attach and bingo, nest number 2 is rising.
I did put it under the microscope and in fact this a combination of 3 different spiecies of algae. I found Cladophora and the other 2 i didn't realy got fully identified by now. I guess the 2nd one i believe is strains of BBA. It looks like a branching black worm under the micro and at 40x there comes a very dark green/blue color trough. It looks like it grows something like sea urchin like flowers at some places. The 3th just bright green and and almost square looking cells stacking.
These first 2 are realy nasty, especialy the Cladophora, this one is so well addapted and plant like, you'll see it make oxygen bubbles on top of the leaves where it attaches, that's a hard one to fight. It seems to like the same conditions the plants like. It's hard to find the balance where the plant likes to grow faster than the vampire, so you finaly just can cut it out. This takes some time, you can't make it disapair over night.. Change one thing at a time and let it ballance out to see the effect, mean while find nests and use sciccors and h2o2 spot treatment. 🙂
zozo
Member
Just for the fun of it, at least i find it interesting 🙂 to look at the matter from another perspective. Growing it, instead. Maybe can give you an other insight on the matter..
http://www.wageningenur.nl/upload_mm/3/6/b/32cb2aa6-5357-40d2-a598-999fe964cb41_groeimedium PWS.pdf
This is a data sheet from a Dutch University where they study with growing sertain spieces of for us beneficial algae. This is a datasheet for creating the perfect grow medium for it.
Never mind the dutch language, the numbers and abbriviations are international.
http://www.wageningenur.nl/upload_mm/3/6/b/32cb2aa6-5357-40d2-a598-999fe964cb41_groeimedium PWS.pdf
This is a data sheet from a Dutch University where they study with growing sertain spieces of for us beneficial algae. This is a datasheet for creating the perfect grow medium for it.
Never mind the dutch language, the numbers and abbriviations are international.
sciencefiction
Member
- Joined
- 26 Feb 2013
- Messages
- 3,406
Ok, so here is my progress in pictures:
4.5 weeks ago I posted this picture showing the BBA on my anubias
Exact same anubias and leaves picture taken today. The BBA is like frozen in time....Non-growing....See the healthy new leaves..
As you can see the BBA has not grown one bit. I haven't removed the old leaves on purpose. I haven't tried nuking it with Excel or adding any CO2.
I did clean the air stone which was covered in BBA and none have regrown on it yet. I used boiling water to clean it.
All the changes I did for the last two months or more is 60-70% water changes twice a week, planted my trickle filter and put clay pebbles as media in it to counteract my iron deficiency issues. Last week I removed all my livebearers from the tank too..
4.5 weeks ago I posted this picture showing the BBA on my anubias
Exact same anubias and leaves picture taken today. The BBA is like frozen in time....Non-growing....See the healthy new leaves..
As you can see the BBA has not grown one bit. I haven't removed the old leaves on purpose. I haven't tried nuking it with Excel or adding any CO2.
I did clean the air stone which was covered in BBA and none have regrown on it yet. I used boiling water to clean it.
All the changes I did for the last two months or more is 60-70% water changes twice a week, planted my trickle filter and put clay pebbles as media in it to counteract my iron deficiency issues. Last week I removed all my livebearers from the tank too..
sciencefiction
Member
- Joined
- 26 Feb 2013
- Messages
- 3,406
Of course it could be a CO2 issue, but not in every tank. If the plants in someone's tank demand an "X" amount of co2, they won't be healthy with any less. Unhealthy plants in a high tech full of plants as you know yourself leads to even higher organic build up....So see where I am going with that? Fablau improved the health of his plants(fixed his Althernantera Reinikii issue for example) and started maintaining a regime that keeps organics low(sludge remover)...
zozo
Member
As what i've red in some anti algae articals and i believe its logical in my case. They stated that fluctuating co2 levels hold up the plants, they can not addapt that fast and will there for algae will be in favor because of their fatser adaptebility to changes. Water Changes are a cause of fluctuating co2 level in the tank. I did lot's of water changes in a few weeks old not fully matured tank, because of a parasite infection. And i was quite in control of all algae before that, during those water changes i triggerd the algae bloom i guess. Or it most be just a coincidence these things adding up and i saw it bloom and boom during that time.. I was still freaking with my bubble count and doing lots of water changes at the same time.
fablau
Member
Jose, I am not sure to have already written this, but I tried several times to raise Co2 to combat BBA, without success. I tried to pump it up to 140ml per minute (insane, isn't it?!?!), but I saw no benefits! And some of my plants were anyway struggling (Alternathera first). That's why I strongly think most of my success in fighting BBA has been the increase of micros and, in some measure, of macros as well, coupled with high, constant Co2, of course. Sludge removers and cleaning pipes was also something I already tried before, and that alone didn't cause any clear positive change. Maybe all these things together have helped plants and the environment to spur more plants growth and less algae spread. Does this make sense?
pepedopolous
Member
<In my aquarium> too much light relative to CO2 = BBA. If I increase light intensity I get BBA within a week or two. If I reduce the light it remains but doesn't grow. </In my aquarium>
P
P
Algae and specifically BBA is a pain in the ass. The thing to remember is that all types of algae are in your tank at all times, they are in the air around you, in new substrate, on new plants and even in your tap water. You cant get rid of algae, fact!
So the key is to manage the algae when it shows up, first and best line of defence is a good clean up crew. Very rarely will BBA take hold if you have SAE's in the tank from the start, same with most other algae with adequate amano shrimp.
When BBA does appear just blitz it with direct dose of liquid carbon, clean your filter, impeller and pipes to ensure you have optimum water movement and good organics removal, Purigen certainly helps while fighting algae. Have a bloody good trim of the tank, most people experience BBA with mature tanks as the plant growth has effected water movement. Continue dosing liquid carbon daily and check your co2 isnt running low.
Being vigilant at checking your tank daily will mean you never let algae get a foot hold, the reality is that we all have lives though and life gets in the way.
The success of algae is reliant on your inability to dedicate the time and energy to keep it in check.
So stop fiddling, make a plan, be religious with that plan, keep liquid carbon on hand at all times and go kick some algae ass!!
So the key is to manage the algae when it shows up, first and best line of defence is a good clean up crew. Very rarely will BBA take hold if you have SAE's in the tank from the start, same with most other algae with adequate amano shrimp.
When BBA does appear just blitz it with direct dose of liquid carbon, clean your filter, impeller and pipes to ensure you have optimum water movement and good organics removal, Purigen certainly helps while fighting algae. Have a bloody good trim of the tank, most people experience BBA with mature tanks as the plant growth has effected water movement. Continue dosing liquid carbon daily and check your co2 isnt running low.
Being vigilant at checking your tank daily will mean you never let algae get a foot hold, the reality is that we all have lives though and life gets in the way.
The success of algae is reliant on your inability to dedicate the time and energy to keep it in check.
So stop fiddling, make a plan, be religious with that plan, keep liquid carbon on hand at all times and go kick some algae ass!!
M
Marcel G
Guest
The branched algae on the picture is definitely not BBA (lat. Audouinella), but rather Staghorn (lat. Compsopogon).Here is an expample with that Myriophyllum Brasiliensis..
You can compare it with my microscopic pictures here: http://www.prirodni-akvarium.cz/en/rasyAtlas
zozo
Member
Thanks Marcel, that was what i was looking for could't find anything like with discriptions what the foto was showing. You seem to know them well 🙂
It indeed could be this one it looks very simular, but have to find me a new fresh piece to compare, the sample from the above picture is to old now, dry and dying can t make up anything decent anymore.
Looked for staghorn before bud couldn't find the right microscopic picture..
Nice collection you got there..
Hi guys
Just an update. Here we are talking great lengths about BBA this and BBA that but sometimes, it all boils down to the very basic.
Make sure your equipments are working right.
This morning, I did the good old soapy water test on my solenoid, Co2 tank connects, bubble counters, hose connects, diffuser connection, check valves.......humm did I miss anything else?
AND I found NOT ONE BUT TWO major leaks on the Co2 hose connection with the check valves. The soapy water was hissing like mad.
Now I ask myself, since when has this been happening? A week, a month or months.......?😱
Here I was counting the bubbles per second, fixated with the DC colour change, flow in the tank, surface agitation and tearing my hair off about EI dosing.....etc BUT I was simply losing the very basic of ingredients for a nice planted tank into the air!
I vividly remember a senior member here once telling me to do this test on all the connections but did I listen? Oh no!
Just an update. Here we are talking great lengths about BBA this and BBA that but sometimes, it all boils down to the very basic.
Make sure your equipments are working right.
This morning, I did the good old soapy water test on my solenoid, Co2 tank connects, bubble counters, hose connects, diffuser connection, check valves.......humm did I miss anything else?
AND I found NOT ONE BUT TWO major leaks on the Co2 hose connection with the check valves. The soapy water was hissing like mad.
Now I ask myself, since when has this been happening? A week, a month or months.......?😱
Here I was counting the bubbles per second, fixated with the DC colour change, flow in the tank, surface agitation and tearing my hair off about EI dosing.....etc BUT I was simply losing the very basic of ingredients for a nice planted tank into the air!
I vividly remember a senior member here once telling me to do this test on all the connections but did I listen? Oh no!
Hi all,
I've had a reply from Juliet at the NHM. It doesn't get us any further on.
cheers Darrel
zozo
Member
Batrachospermum 🙂 those forms are the urchin like flowers i saw im my sample under the micro whit that piece in the photo above. Looked very simular. So i saw 4 different species of algae in that sample. Definitily saw some little tuffs of BBA on a rock in my tank. Interesting to see they kinda cling togheter, like teaming up against the plant.
http://195.113.57.24/algo/praktika/13.html
Also found a cladophora wiki listing 1045 different species of it.. Amazing!!
Hi guys
Just an update. Here we are talking great lengths about BBA this and BBA that but sometimes, it all boils down to the very basic.
Make sure your equipments are working right.
This morning, I did the good old soapy water test on my solenoid, Co2 tank connects, bubble counters, hose connects, diffuser connection, check valves.......humm did I miss anything else?
AND I found NOT ONE BUT TWO major leaks on the Co2 hose connection with the check valves. The soapy water was hissing like mad.
Now I ask myself, since when has this been happening? A week, a month or months.......?😱
Here I was counting the bubbles per second, fixated with the DC colour change, flow in the tank, surface agitation and tearing my hair off about EI dosing.....etc BUT I was simply losing the very basic of ingredients for a nice planted tank into the air!
I vividly remember a senior member here once telling me to do this test on all the connections but did I listen? Oh no!
This is why I use only this tupe of connection in my co2 setup:
http://www.co2art.co.uk/collections...ucts/push-on-tubing-fitting-with-1-8-npt-male
This and also polyurathane tubing. Im very happy for now. Remember your co2 system is just as secure as your weakest point.
zozo
Member
That's why you always should keep an eye out to find a PH controller to control the co2 flow.. 🙂 Just patiently keep in mind the Milwaukee SMS serie and put some money a side for it over time.. They are known to be very good quality, already very long time in production. I found one lately for a rather very cheap price, the old owner discarted his hobby years ago and had the thing still laying around, lost the power supply and had no more electrode. So he even couldn't check if the thing still was working, so i took the chance bought it for €15. Still had an electrode of an older Hannah (non smart) controler. And a 12 volt power supply is easy. Thing works like a charme. It gets your Co2 on top level with in an hour and keeps it rock steady. As long as you keep checking the calibration on time you can't go wrong.. Still around for sale "new" and cost around € 180. But sometimes they come around maybe 10 to 15 years old even older, the old ones are almost unbreakable..
I guess the older models will even be better then the new ones. because doesnt matter what you buy new these days. An equivalent quality of the same product from 20 years ago is never comming back again. Now all you can buy are time bombs made to last 4 maybe 5 years and the rest of it is share luck and it can say poof any given day after that! 🙂
Thanks for the tip. BTW co2art make some fine products. Luv their range of products.
All co2 equipment I have is from them. Im normally very happy with them. The only thing is theyr needle valves are sometimes hard to tune in or a bit unstable. But theyve also got a solution for that which I´ll be trying out this week.
http://www.co2art.co.uk/collections/splitters-manifolds-valves/products/advance-co2-flow-controller
Anyone using these atm
