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Water meadow gardening

I wouldn't worry about fertilising the elodea. I think you are right and the roots are only really for anchoring.

The algae is likely due to plant mass in a new "ish" pond. My wildlife pond took a couple of years to get going to a point where no algae was visible throughout the year. This winter I had a plant clear out as it was really overgrown and it's upset the balance and there is alot of algae growth for the first time in years. I know it will go when the plants catch up but it's been quite bright here but no that warm, so algae has had a foothold.

Jealous of the newts. We had some when I was a kid but not seen any since then. Did they just find the pond this quickly or did you already have them in the area?
 
I wouldn't worry about fertilising the elodea. I think you are right and the roots are only really for anchoring.
Thanks Mort, I won't bother fertilising the Elodea baskets then.

The algae is likely due to plant mass in a new "ish" pond. My wildlife pond took a couple of years to get going to a point where no algae was visible throughout the year. This winter I had a plant clear out as it was really overgrown and it's upset the balance and there is alot of algae growth for the first time in years. I know it will go when the plants catch up but it's been quite bright here but no that warm, so algae has had a foothold.
That is what I was thinking also - not enough active plant mass. So in my case, I did have plenty of plants in there (masses of Elodea), so either the Elodea is not actively growing this time of the year or they are not performing well (lack of nutrients?) which was causing the blanket week to flourish?

Jealous of the newts. We had some when I was a kid but not seen any since then. Did they just find the pond this quickly or did you already have them in the area?
They were already in the garden. I set up a mini pond (maybe 300L or so) which always had lots of baby newts in it. I am a bit surprised to see the newts appearing in all ponds as I was expecting them to avoid the ponds with fish in it (3 out of 5 have fish). The frog spawn was a gift from one of my neighbours. I have not seen any frogs in the garden for years and none have appeared in the ponds so far.
 
Hi all,

I think even variegated Phragmites might be too vigorous?

A sedge might be better, something like <"Carex riparia">, <"C. elata"> or <"C. pseudocyperus">. Carex riparia is also a rampant grower. Cyperus longus would be another "Sedge" option.

cheers Darrel
Thanks Darrel for the suggestions. I grow variegated Phragmites in tubs on my patio (you may be able to see them in a pic earlier in the thread) and they do not grow much larger than this when in pond baskets. probably because they did not get any extra feed and they were not in a pond with many fish. Anyway, inside the tubs set in the border behind the ponds, I hope they will grow more vigorous than they did when planted in baskets because I want them to be noticed and stick out above the surrounding plants. The purpose of these tubs is just to accommodate the reeds, so there is nothing for them to outcompete.

Carex elata is on my list. I could not find the species for sale anywhere, only the 'aurea' variety.
 
Hi all,
Can’t wait to see how it all develops over the spring and summer
Same for me, I think it is just brilliant.
I could not find the species for sale anywhere, only the 'aurea' variety.
Carex acuta is very similar to C. elata and Devon Pond plants sell <"C. acuta">. Carex acuta, C. elata, C. riparia and C. acutiformis are all pretty similar in look. <"C. pseudocyperus"> is distinct in leaf colour (paler yellow green) and in fruit.

cheers Darrel
 
That is what I was thinking also - not enough active plant mass. So in my case, I did have plenty of plants in there (masses of Elodea), so either the Elodea is not actively growing this time of the year or they are not performing well (lack of nutrients?) which was causing the blanket week to flourish?

Hopefully Darrel will correct me if I'm wrong but I'm assuming its more where the plant is than the nutrients this time of year. The marginals aren't in fast active growth yet so algae can take advantage of the light in the upper layers of the pond to out compete any plants in the bottom layers. The elodea might help if it was floating or near the surface but lower down its slower to get going. I personally don't fertilise my plants and have never seen any known signs of growth inhibition but I am going to start with my lillies. It will be interesting to see how you get on with your fertiliser regime as my pond is much more modest than yours are, so would be nice to improve it.
Water hawthorn is a nice plant that covers the surface this time of year and I'm sure you probably already have it but it's a favourite of mine. My issue was with fools water cress, which had blocked the whole surface of my pond because it's so rampant, and I wanted to remove it to see the hawthorn. I think I've mentioned on here before but be very wary of fools water cress, it's a lovely plant but possibly the most invasive species of plant I've ever kept. It just swamps everything and covers the surface.
 
@killi69 great to see you taking up the thread again and updating us on progress. Can’t wait to see how it all develops over the spring and summer 😎
Same for me, I think it is just brilliant.
Thanks Tim and Darrel! I am really excited after being out around the ponds this afternoon. I can see the fish much better than last year when they were in the tub. I did release them into the ponds at the end of last summer but it might have taken them a while to gain confidence but today with the sun shining on the pond, they were out to be seen, which was great. I saw loads of newts later in the afternoon as well.

Carex acuta is very similar to C. elata and Devon Pond plants sell <"C. acuta">. Carex acuta, C. elata, C. riparia and C. acutiformis are all pretty similar in look. <"C. pseudocyperus"> is distinct in leaf colour (paler yellow green) and in fruit.
Cheers for that Darrel, I will check it out.
 
Hopefully Darrel will correct me if I'm wrong but I'm assuming its more where the plant is than the nutrients this time of year. The marginals aren't in fast active growth yet so algae can take advantage of the light in the upper layers of the pond to out compete any plants in the bottom layers. The elodea might help if it was floating or near the surface but lower down its slower to get going. I personally don't fertilise my plants and have never seen any known signs of growth inhibition but I am going to start with my lillies. It will be interesting to see how you get on with your fertiliser regime as my pond is much more modest than yours are, so would be nice to improve it.

Some of the Elodea growing near the surface looks super healthy with a dark, almost purplish colour whereas a lot of the Elodea elsewhere is pale, thin and all covered with blanket weed. I have a few bowls in the back ponds planted up with Nuphar lutea. I had planted Elodea around the edges of the bowls, away from the tubers but the Elodea here had really taken off;

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Planting them in the same bowl as the Nuphar was clearly a mistake and I removed them this afternoon. These Elodea seem thicker and healthier than the others and not covered in blanket weed either. So I wonder whether maybe the fertiliser I had put in the bowls with the Nuphar last August might have boosted the Elodea's growth after all. They also seemed to have a decent root system. I potted some tops of these Elodea into new baskets and stuck some tabs in there, just to see if I can notice any difference in a few months' time.

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I also discovered that underneath all that blanket weed, I had 12 baskets of Potamogeton crispus which are starting to emerge. I gave them a good clean and added some tabs to their baskets. They disappeared last summer. I think I read that P. crispus does die back in the summer, so hopefully they might do OK after all.

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Water hawthorn is a nice plant that covers the surface this time of year and I'm sure you probably already have it but it's a favourite of mine. My issue was with fools water cress, which had blocked the whole surface of my pond because it's so rampant, and I wanted to remove it to see the hawthorn. I think I've mentioned on here before but be very wary of fools water cress, it's a lovely plant but possibly the most invasive species of plant I've ever kept. It just swamps everything and covers the surface.
Great to know that water hawthorn covers the surface in spring. I will certainly be getting some then. Thanks for the warning about fools water cress. That plant I found has still not re-emerged but I will keep an eye on it!
 

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Lovely project, looking forwaed to seeing it once fully grown in.

Agree that water hawthorn is a good floating leaf option, iirc from when I used to grow it, it does best with about 30 cm or slightly more of water above the soil level. Good for putting in areas that are too cramped for water lillies like small bays etc.

One note of caution - the Nuphar Lutea may be too large growing and invasive. By all means give it a go but you will probably find yourself having to remove it sooner or later.
 
Thank you Maf.

I am keen to try Nuphar lutea for their submersed leaves, which are larger and more wavy than the floating ones. They are quite a common sight in canals in many old Dutch city centres where the underwater leaves make a great display, resembling crops of lettuce. Here are some pics I found of the submersed leaves on Google;

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I have never grown them before but would like to try to see if I can have a group growing submersed together, with perhaps some baskets of Vallisneria in between. I found a few references on Dutch websites to needing to remove the floating leaves regularly in order to maintain the submersed form. Below left is an old picture from Ada Hofman's book, showing her with the submersed lutea in a pond. On the right you can see a couple of bowls containing the plant in my pond with the first leaves emerging (spot the newt:)). Fingers crossed they might be submersed leaves... If not I will remove the leaves and see what happens next. Will keep you updated.

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Interesting @killi69, I never imagined you were growing them for the submerged leaves but that makes perfect sense - I too like the effect in nature of the submerged leaves (and find the flowers and floating leaves a bit meh).

Keeping the leaves submerged would also help to keep root and rhizome growth in check by limiting the access to carbon dioxide and sunlight, smart move. Looking forward to seeing how you get on with it - I see much pruning involved!

And again, great project, absolutely love what you are doing there.
 
A brief update. I am still seeing a lot of newts in all the ponds. A pair of crows have nested in a tree next door and they visit many times each day. They remind me a bit of what I used to do as a child with a net. They walk along the water side, tracing the contours of all the ponds and drag out tufts of thread algae hoping to catch what is within it. They also scoop up tadpoles swimming near the surface and leave some mess behind, but I do not mind.
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I was super excited to see a toad in one of my ponds. Quite plump, so I guess a female. She was always near the bottom and seeking out spots where the sun would reach her. After about a week, I could still not spot any other toads in any of the ponds. Then, one evening in the pond right at the back, I spotted another toad. It was smaller, so very possibly a male. I went to grab a net but it was gone by the time I returned. I left the net by the pond and the next day I spotted it again. I managed to catch it this time and introduced it to the pond with the female.
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The next morning, I had high hopes and went searching for strings of toad eggs. Instead, I found the female upside down, lying on the bottom, dead. I took some pictures and went online searching for possible causes of death. I had heard about infectious diseases killing large numbers of amphibians and I wanted to see whether any external symptoms might be visible. I came across the Garden Wildlife Health project which asks people to contact them if they find a dead amphibian, bird or hedgehog in their garden. I filled in a contact form and after 20 minutes someone from London Zoo called me and asked me to post them the dead toad for examination. A week later, I received a post mortem report! It appears the toad died of starvation because of a condition where its internal organs are displaced and block the digestive tract. They found a large amount of spawn inside her and said it was likely the fatal internal displacement could have occurred as a result of mating causing increased pressure. I do feel a bit sorry now for interfering and introducing the other toad to her pond. What an amazing project though, who would have thought you could obtain a cause of death examination report for a dead toad. One week later, I am now hearing toad calls in the pond at night, so maybe there still some hope for toad spawn this year

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I dug in some more tubs. The plan is to have a drift of plantings running diagonally across the garden and ponds with low marsh plants, such as juncus, carex, iris and Schizostylis. To either side of these, there will be low meadow plantings dominated by Lythrum, Molinia grasses and Sanguisorba species. Flanked on either side of these drifts will be a series of tubs with Phragmites on one side and Typha on the other. Below you can see a couple of tubs I dug in for the Typha sp.
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The builders are almost finished, finally. To tie in the decking paths in the garden with the house, I decided to replace the tiled patio with decking:
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I also decided to extend the boardwalk at the back by building another pond right alongside the other one and have support posts in either pond, so that the board walk will hide where both ponds meet. Hopefully, this will then create the illusion of walking across one large pond. I plan to sink tubs with tall Scirpus species on either side later on.
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With the building work complete, I hired a rotavator to prepare the soil for planting. I will update more about the planting soon.






 

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You are living the dream! When I moved into the current house I wanted to make the whole thing a water garden and just have walkways that led from the house to the garage but I was vetoed by the other half and then we had my daughter and then my son and the large-ish pond I had built had to be netted to make it safe for the little ones. My son is three now so it wont be too long til we can take the nets off. My pond was split into two, one half that had fish and another side the fish could not access. I was hoping for newts but I've never seen one just a crazy amount of frogs every year, always wondered what the newts would need that I didn't have? Anyway it looks wonderful well done!
 
How fantastic, and reassuring that we all run into the same problems with ponds, no matter the size. I think you have covered everything in great detail, I have learned quite a bit.
I had very similar problems with a smaller pond and blanket algae that I couldn’t fix until I put in a small 1 litre pot of water cress, after a month the water cress was growing madly and the water was crystal clear, have decided that in my new garden pond I am having all the filtration done by water cress in a separate container, with the added bonus of an edible crop.
 
Thanks all!
blanket algae that I couldn’t fix until I put in a small 1 litre pot of water cress, after a month the water cress was growing madly and the water was crystal clear
Sounds interesting, I should try some water cress. I still have a lot of thread algae. First I thought I would just leave it, in order to minimise losing newt eggs which would inevitably be included among the Elodea which would come out with the thread algae. I was also too busy preparing the garden for planting and for weeks did not have time for clearing the algae. After a while though, the thread algae was really taking over and I regretted not having taken action sooner. I find that removing it with a garden rake works quite well. I 'comb' the baskets with Elodea and Vallisneria and this way can separate the thread algae from the plants without too many problems. I did lose a huge mass of floating Elodea, which formed a significant proportion of the oxygenating plants in the ponds, but they were totally entangled. There are still hopefully enough baskets left for me to be able to get rid of the free floating oxygenators. I do try to save as much hornwort as I can.
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I was hoping for newts but I've never seen one just a crazy amount of frogs every year, always wondered what the newts would need that I didn't have?
I had actually read recently how frogs and newts can have a boom-bust relationship and bookmarked the articles, so here they are. "A complex predator-prey relationship between frogs and newts may develop over the years, with their numbers varying". I hear toads in my ponds every evening but so far I have not spotted any mating couples or eggs.

I wanted to make the whole thing a water garden and just have walkways that led from the house to the garage but I was vetoed by the other half and then we had my daughter and then my son and the large-ish pond I had built had to be netted to make it safe for the little ones.
As you say, now your children are getting a bit older, maybe you can start thinking about your water garden again? Could still be dangerous for them for a little while longer though.... There are advantages in doing things bit by bit and expanding your water garden one small pond at a time perhaps?

I was fortunate to have free reign in being able to convert the entire garden. Luckily because of lockdown I have been around to manage the project but trying to do it all in one go has been a bit of a nightmare at times, to be honest. At key stages in the project, a lot of work needed to be done all at once which has been super stressful. Recently, after the builders completed the walkways, the entire garden needed to be prepared for planting which was a lot of work and involved moving hundreds of pots backwards and forwards as I needed to work the soil underneath them. Right now, I am right in the middle of the most exciting phase, and most daunting at the same time - putting in the plants!

There are close to 2000 plants which need to go in, including the 800 I grew from seed last year. After a lot of research, I set myself up with DEFRA as an importer in order to be able to bring in plants from abroad and ordered a large consignment from a Dutch wholesaler which also offered a good selection of aquatic/ marginal plants. A heck of a lot of hassle and a lot more expense because of Brexit (phytosanitary inspection/ import duty/ custom clearing agent's fees) but on the whole it was worth it for me because of the numbers I needed. I also ordered some garden plants from other sources. Neighbours think I have totally lost the plot, which to be honest, I probably have. Hopefully before too long I can actually use my garden to relax in. In the meantime, I have some planting to do. This was taken the day they all arrived;



I had booked in the support of Hayley and Sam from Plantology (who helped me design the garden) for three days to lay out and plant as many as we could in that time. Unfortunately, in the end we only had one day and then our 2021 rain season began. I have not been able to do much planting since. Only a fraction of the plants are laid out/ planted but the results after day one of planting were transformational:



Since then, I have focussed on sorting out the aquatic plants. Out of all the plants, the most exciting species for me to obtain was Potamogeton lucens. In her pond books, Ada Hofman describes this as the most important oxygenating plant and recommends that it should make up 75% of oxygenators in any pond. Not surprising then, that in Holland, this plant is commonly available at garden centres and aquatic retailers. Hofman claims P. lucens produces biochemicals which inhibit the growth of algae (allelopathy). Stems are brittle and in the past I have bought P Lucens from Holland (pre Brexit) with mixed success and only a small proportion took hold after planting. The ones I bought this time don't look like much at the moment. I have left them in their pots for now and hopefully they will start to grow.
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Here is a picture I took of the plant at Ada Hofman's pond gardens a few years ago;
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For most marginal plants, I am using 8L pond baskets (24 x 24 x 14cm) lined with weed membrane, with John Innes No3 soil as substrate and capped with sharp sand. With cable ties I made handles so that I can use a rake to move the baskets in and around the ponds. First to be planted up are Persicaria amphibia. I have also ordered Persicaria affinis which I think looks very similar and will be planted in garden soil on the other side of the pond edge later on.
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Unfortunately, I did not wash the sand first. I should have known better and as you can see in some of the shots, all that rain we have been having washed out all the dirt from the sand and most of my ponds are now milky coloured. I really hope this will settle eventually.

I am also quite excited that I was able to buy a number of umbellifer flowering type marginal plants. Especially around the pond at the back, the planting in and around the pond will be dominated by umbellifers. Below are Oenanthe aquatica, Oenanthe fistulosa and Sium Latifolium. I also had Peucedanum palustre on the order list but unfortunately that one did not arrive.

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Towards the back, where one of the ponds is closest to the row of conifers, I am going to try try create a woodland type planting. I bought a few Marsh ferns, Thelypteris palustris, which I hope will grow nicely in the water. I spent an afternoon playing around with the stump of a conifer tree I dug up last year, and some of its roots, which I had kept for this purpose. It reminded me of moving pieces of redwood around in my planted tank. I think the ferns could look great around the stump.
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I also planted up two of tubs (45 / 65L) with Phragmites australis variegatus and placed both in the pond near the house. These were plants I already had growing in tubs, so they were used to growing submerged. I plan to sink the tubs a little deeper later on when they have grown a bit more.
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The weather is really frustrating and holding things back but at least I have now found some time to write this update. Hopefully, I will be back soon to write a bit more about the other plants.
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Wow, simply amazing. You're right planting is a transformational process. So many plants give instant impact. I'm sure they will fill out somewhat during this season and the following seasons will look increasingly spectacular.
 
It looks amazing already, you've done an incredible amount of work! Even though the weather is annoying, it's great for those new plants to get established quickly and look great even in this first year. A lot of plants have been looking pretty parched for most of the month, but the 2 weeks of rain has really perked everything up and had it looking lush again. Hoping for a UKAPS tour in years to come, it's going to be so so beautiful once the plants have really got going in a year or two. 😍
 
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