Double the amount of your water sample. Then 1 drop = 0.5KH, although colour change may be difficult to see.
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Seachem Purigen Head Scratcher
- Thread starter Musicmanryann
- Start date
Musicmanryann
Member
Thanks all for this perspective. I guess I am more than a little confused? Getting back to why I am measuring pH in the first place as I am monitoring the pH drop from CO2 as I continue to get it "locked in" as per @Zeus' methodology. It was observed that my drop checker might be a little yellow a few days before my livestock arrived, so I was slowly making adjustments to dial it down. My CO2 ran that morning, and I knew I needed to drip acclimate the shrimp for several hours anyway. So I turned the CO2 off early and ran my aerator to quickly dissipate a good amount of CO2 whilst the shrimp were drip acclimating, monitoring the dissipation with my ph meter. Again, my main concerns here were primarily excess CO2 causing increased stress, and secondarily I am worried about acidic water dissolving the snail shells. Also, it is my understanding shrimp can handle loads of different water, but they do not like sudden drastic changes. Well, the pH dropped 1.5 in a matter of twenty minutes. That bowl of water with the bag of purigen in it is reading 4.03 pH this morning. That number may be meaningless, but if I compare it to my tap water or RO water that have pH of 6.5 and 5.95, respectively, their relative difference doesn't seem meaningless to me. But I don't really know, is it meaningless or not? Also, it it is my understanding stability of water parameters in general is paramount to overall "success", or finding a balance with everything. So I guess I feel like I I was well intended here, but may have missed the mark in the application of my concern? I guess I don't really understand what I am supposed to be doing with pH then, if anything. I mean, am I supposed to measure pH and modify how I take care of my flora and fauna or not, lol? Just trying to learn where and when to focus my attention I guess, while wading through a lot of incomplete information, misinformation and/or noise, especially outside the walls of this forum.
Overall, everybody in the tank seems to be doing fine. I am likely making a mountain out of a molehill, as they say, which is admittedly an tendency of mine. I do agree with with @_Maq_ that taking some matrix out of the biomaster wouldn't hurt. I am going to open it up this evening after the photoperiod ends, give the matrix a good sniff and remove some. Working on starting a nano tank anyways so I'll give that guy a headstart on cycling with the martix from the 60P. I will report back my findings. Thanks everyone!
Musicmanryann
Member
OMG why didn't I think of that...
Thank you!!
If I could make a suggestion? I’d increase the KH slightly to say, 2 or 3. This serves two purposes - it’ll make you pH readings more reliable and your pH more stable. It’s easier that way as a beginner.
LightingBamboozled
Member
That's about 510-550 litres per hour which is pretty good for a stocked filter rated at 800. Unless something has changed significantly low flow cannot be the issue.
Sorry, missed them. No issues there.
Detritus worms are not harmful, many fish will happily snack on them and they perform a similar job to snails like Malaysian Trumpet Snails in terms of feeding on leftovers in the substrate. They can be vacuumed out or left alone.
MichaelJ
Member
I strongly agree! Zero KH is really an anomaly, best entertained by the expertly skilled plant grower - not even sure if @Happi, @plantnoobdude et al. are doing that.
Cheers,
Michael
plantnoobdude
Member
I am... With soil. In my experience it works fine, and doesn't complicate stuff really. However, pH profiles can be a bit easier with some kh
Does it even occur in nature?
_Maq_
Member
Within the limits 4.5 < pH < 8.3, part of CO2, which is always present, turns into HCO3-, which is alkalinity.
You're wrong in this, Darrel, I'm afraid.
MichaelJ
Member
Not really. There always appears to be some CO3 - even in highly nutrient poor water.
Cheers,
Michael
_Maq_
Member
2 or 3 °dKH ... increased slightly?
I can't afford even 1 °dKH because such a high alkalinity would push my pH well above 7.
Compared to some folk on here who grow great plants in very hard water yes, 2 or 3 is slightly and would still be classed as soft water. Given the OP injects CO2 as well, they should be fine.
John q
Member
We don't need a lot of Alkalinity, whomever suggested this is... way off the mark. Suspect they are old time fish~ keepers, old habits die hard. Why do we need Kh???
I did. I know we don’t need it, but for a beginner it makes life easier to have some alkalinity as it increases stability when injecting CO2.
MichaelJ
Member
Sorry John, No one is talking about adding a lot of alkalinity… @hypnogogia and myself (running my tanks at ~0.5 KH) only suggested having above zero KH - like perhaps 2-3 KH as @hypnogogia suggested. Now, I never ever had issues keeping my pH in the sweet zone 6 to <7 pH with botanicals while keeping my KH at ~2.0 (or even slightly higher) so I’m not reading too much into @_Maq_ ’s comment above without more specifics about his “unique” circumstances… 😉 In any event we shouldn’t go overboard here and calling each other old timers
(I know I’m old and so are my fish) for suggesting a bit of pH buffering capacity 🙂Cheers,
Michael
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John q
Member
Fair point. I could and probably should have chosen my words more carefully.
Lol, I'm an old fart... as above my word choice wasn't the best.In any event we shouldn’t go overboard here and calling each other old timers
Regards the op and my comment about Kh.
Having some kh ~1 is plenty to keep the ph stable when injecting co2. I've no idea why your ph is dropping like it is but it might be wise to back the gas off a bit until you figure it out.
Also worth remembering that ada amazonia will drop your ph, that's what it does.
Hi all,
cheers Darrel
Why? I'm not a chemist so it is quite likely. I know theoretically that if you add a grain of "sugar" to either pan it tips, but in practice the greater weight acts as a buffer.
cheers Darrel
Me too! 😂
From my reading, I’d say he’s spot on.
The pH scale is logarithmic and inversely indicates the activity of hydrogen ions in the solution.
![{\displaystyle {\ce {pH}}=-\log(a_{{\ce {H+}}})\thickapprox -\log([{\ce {H+}}])}](https://wikimedia.org/api/rest_v1/media/math/render/svg/5cee635c4839a5a266cfa10c541a8c7e21d2707e "{\displaystyle {\ce {pH}}=-\log(a_{{\ce {H+}}})\thickapprox -\log([{\ce {H+}}])}")
where [H+] is the equilibrium molar concentration (mol/L) of H+
_Maq_
Member
Maybe I've poorly understood. But pH always means the amount (activity) of hydrogen ions. Besides, [H+]*[OH-] is constant, which means that if we know [H+], we also know [OH-].
