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Journal Freds new pond build

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hi all a little update. photo of how patch is
coming along for you dog lovers
upload_2017-7-20_14-54-0.png

now some of my little tiddlers. they have grown about an inch from 4 inch to
5 inch
4 feeds a day now. keeping them in the quarantine grow on for a year.
upload_2017-7-20_14-57-15.png

bowled some up
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more to come
 
I've no pond experience but wonder why not add these to the larger water area with more potential for constant (wild) food supply (in the bottom debris & plants & biofilm & insects etc) - I m assuming they are in something more like an indoor? tank
 
I've no pond experience but wonder why not add these to the larger water area with more potential for constant (wild) food supply (in the bottom debris & plants & biofilm & insects etc) - I m assuming they are in something more like an indoor? tank

I'm sure Fred will correct me or add to this reply, but basically by having them in the grow out pond (an inside pond essentially) you can increase their growth considerably by keeping the water temperature higher and feeding more. Koi tend to be very expensive, especially if you like the rarer colours, and by getting them smaller and putting in the extra time, effort and patience of growing them you can save thousands in the long run.
You also need to consider that koi ponds are generally run more sterile than the average garden pond, so debris and plants aren't a massive feature of their ponds (think Fred has a cleverly designed bottom drain to keep it spotless). It also helps to keep bacterial and disease problems away growing them on as we all know increase temperature can increase the potential for these.

But please add your thoughts Fred and nice to see Patch is doing well, has he been in the pond yet?
 
Nice one mort. I could nt have worded it better. Yeah mate. I have had him in the pond. On his lead. He hated it mate. Staffys just do not like water. He can swim. Reason i put him in. My red staffy sank to bottom. Head was top heavy. She passed on 2 years ago.So i wanted to make sure he could swim. In case he got loose. And ended up in the park lake. On the fish aldo.
They have grown an inch already. In the main pond that would take 4 to 5 months. Heat with koi is the main thing here with growing. Come october. They will be getting the same as now. While the main pond fish will get none untill the spring. Unless mild winter. 10c temperatures minimum for koi in winter. In the grow on. 25c temps. Also good for ill fish to treat. The tank is 500 gallons. I have also saved 8 fish in the quarentine growon. I have a night and day light to keep there colours. London ian nelson mort alto good to see your ok.


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Also alto as mort pointed out. Hardly any plants. If you go earlier in the thread you can see i have upper pond with plants. No fish in there. As mort said i have a bottom drain with air. And 3 feet from bottom two pond returns that push a currant around. So basicly the skimmer on the surface. Takes top muck. And the air swirls near bottom and keeps everything moving. Like a currant. And the 4 inch suction takes it to the filter drum cleans it right down the drain.clean water to the pond. Nothing goes back unless it is smaller then 50 micron. Then i have k1 after that as a moving bed for bio. Then after the filter. Filter wool. I also have 70 micron on the surface skimmer. Hope this gives you an idea of system for cleaning. Also 2 reasons i do not have plants in main pond. One big koi destroy them.tried it. 2 plus to many dead spots for bacteria. Also would stop flow of cleaning process.
Hope this helps to put the ideas out there. All the best fred.

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here is a couple of more photo s of pond plant development one year on
can you see that dog statue on the top side. that dog it was made of won crufts first prize
toy dog. my wife s aunty. yorkshire terrier. about 12 years ago.
front on
upload_2017-7-21_11-38-58.png

left side on upper pond
upload_2017-7-21_11-40-52.png

right side on upper pond
upload_2017-7-21_11-43-10.png

growing great now. over the moon with one year on.
more to come
 
Koi tend to be very expensive, especially if you like the rarer colours, and by getting them smaller and putting in the extra time, effort and patience of growing them you can save thousands in the long run.
You also need to consider that koi ponds are generally run more sterile than the average garden pond, so debris and plants aren't a massive feature of their ponds (think Fred has a cleverly designed bottom drain to keep it spotless). It also helps to keep bacterial and disease problems away growing them on as we all know increase temperature can increase the potential for these.

The problem here is getting top quality Koi. A Koi colour & pattern continue to change so a beautiful yearling Tancho Kohaku could end up a poor Taisho Sanke or that beautiful Taisho Sanke could end up a Kohaku with black spots or just a Kohaku with little pattern.
In Japan the breeders go through many culls as the fish grow. This is what makes a breeder special his ability to see the potential of the fry & young fish as they grow.
all the culls are sold on, unfortunately many of these early culls end up here sold as Koi when to be honest they are not much more than just Carp.

That's not to say you can't get a good Koi from the young fish obviously some do slip through but again as the culls are often sold to "Growers" they are also culled & the best fish selected.

If you just want a pond of colourful fish they're ideal but it's little like asking you to look at my landscaped tank......... complete with a bubble blowing diver!

When I was heavily into Koi, who, Ahem! were actually bought as presents for my wife, I was often asked to "Come & look at my Koi" only to find a pit full of mongrels!!
 
Yes your right there mate. Unless you go out to japan yourself. And hand pick yourself. You would be looking at 7 grand upwards for a top top koi.
Myself i aint into showing. Or breeding. I just like fish in general. All fish. I have all types of fish in my pond. Tench grass carp rudd goldfish. And mutt koi. The little ones i have just bought are all bred in the uk. Israeli koi. I did think at one time of going into showing. But did nt have thr heart of getting rid of this lot. I get as much satisfaction of looking at the cheap rudd.
As far as colour goes.yeah they do change. But thats the fun of growing yourself. If you want a permanent colour buy big koi. And pay the price for it. But where is the fun in that.

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three new fish coming tomorrow that i have bought
7 inch sanke nice shape and deep red and black
upload_2017-7-25_10-12-1.png

· 8" Gin Rin Ochiba Shigure love the tail and long fins on this one
upload_2017-7-25_10-13-49.png

· 8" Goromo nice shape like the mix colour on the head red and purple typ
colour
upload_2017-7-25_10-16-20.png

hope you like them. love aquatics is in Blackpool. that will be my lot for this year.
with the other nine. these also will be going into quarantine and grow-on for a year
at 25 c tempreture. to bring them on twice as fast. also to watch them for any ailments
all the best fred
 
Nice looking fish Fred. I've got a friend with a koi pond and he only got a few a year and grew them up. He now only gets one special one a year as he's near capacity (think a lot of his are 15-20 years old). It seems a good way of getting a better quality mix (that and because his are so big and doesn't have anywhere for grow out, he needs to buy pretty big specimens) and spreads the excitement.
 
Understand that mort. If you remeber when i first started on my new pond build. I had about 12 that where all 2 feet in size. I lost them due to a couple of things. Pond leeching cement. And the dreaded black algi. I have saved a few. My oldest is 20 years old. That s about 27 inches
My chagoi is 18 years. 2 feet in length. So i am now replacing what i lost. Them little ones have grown an inch to inch and ahalf on about 7 weeks. At that rate come next spring they should be around the 12 to 14 inch mark. Nine where between 3 to 5 inch at start.

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I re-read what I wrote above and now don't think it's clear as to what I meant to say. It was supposed to be congratulating you on your restricted stocking, going for nicer specimens rather than chucking loads in all at once. Quite impressed with the growth rate. Can I ask what you feed?
 
I re-read what I wrote above and now don't think it's clear as to what I meant to say. It was supposed to be congratulating you on your restricted stocking, going for nicer specimens rather than chucking loads in all at once. Quite impressed with the growth rate. Can I ask what you feed?
Nice one mort all understood mate.
My two mates have done what your mate has done. They buy only real large Japanese koi. With the paper work. Huge beasts. Like me mate i like all types of fish. I feed them on
Queni koi jap mix pellets 2mm in size. And float and sink. High protein. Also this other cheap food that has no name i buy at top of our street. Its got like a honey on it. Also
Sugar puffs as treat in honey
Bread. Lettuce. Also i buy queni jap shrimp. Muscles as treat. Corn on the cob. Treats. The treats are once a week. Pond fish get three meals. Grow on 5 meals. You may ask why one lot 5. And the other lot 3. Reason water parameters readings.
Obviously the pond gets a lot more at once. Because there bigger fish.
All the best mort. Take care bud.

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the 3 new fish arrived this morning there in the qt grow on. acclimatised them with a mix of my
water and there bag water. left them in that for an hour. then netted them out of the bowl and put them into
grow on. there actually bigger then when i ordered them. the size and photos where put on two weeks before.
look great in the flesh. had them in my hands to see if they had any scrapes or what ever. they where in great nick.
that s why i buy my fish from there. always spot on.
 
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