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4 weeks in - is this normal die off or do I have a problem?

Hannah

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29 Mar 2021
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Oxfordshire
I planted up my 310L about 4 weeks ago, temp is 27c, running 1 x Fluval Plant 3.0 59w at 60cm tank depth for 9hrs/day with CO2 injection. Substrate is Flora Pro Base, pH is around 6.8 - 7 ish. Most days I've been dosing with 7 pumps Tropica Premium and 2 pumps Tropica Specialised, but there have been a few days I forgot!

My issue is that my anubias leaves are becoming almost skeletonised and slimy then melting away, and my java ferns are turning brown/greyish and dying off. They are attached to the hardscape mainly with flourish glue.

Can someone tell me if this is part of the normal die off process as the plants adjust to the water / submerged growth, or do I have a more serious problem here?

Thanks for reading - all input very welcome!

EDIT: Sorry for duplicated photos, am posting from my phone and can't seem to un-attach them! 😆
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ceg4048

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Can someone tell me if this is part of the normal die off process as the plants adjust to the water / submerged growth, or do I have a more serious problem here?

Hello,
No, this is not normal, yet it's a common occurrence when CO2/flow/distribution are poor. High temperatures (27 C) and bright lights exacerbate the problem.

Cheers,
 

Hannah

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Hello,
No, this is not normal, yet it's a common occurrence when CO2/flow/distribution are poor. High temperatures (27 C) and bright lights exacerbate the problem.

Cheers,
Hi,

Thanks for the insight - my CO2 diffuser is positioned directly below a powerhead and filter (biomaster 850) spray bar so I thought this would be sufficient to circulate the CO2. Do you think adding a second powerhead at the other end of the tank would help with CO2 distribution?

I can turn the lighting down a bit, that's no problem. When I bought the plants I selected them based on research I'd done that indicated they would be tolerant of warm temperatures as I'm eventually hoping to add discus to the tank. Should I plan to change them for something else instead? The amzon swords and vallis seem to be doing pretty well. Interestingly the java fern 'windelov' seems to be less affected than the 'narrow' and 'trident' varieties which are really looking grotty.
 

Mooner

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Temp down to 23-24c
Lighting down to 80% for 6-7 hrs
How are you measuring CO2? Drop checker/Ph pen
Pumps/output parallel to water surface hitting opposite glass then down towards substrate. Plants slightly swaying

Not sure about your Frets, put you specs into Rotala Butterfly and follow EI recommendations.

Go back and read through the CO2 part of this forum, this has been discussed many times.
Good luck
 

John q

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Both of these plants can survive at 27c, there's really no need to lower the temperature if its going to compromise the fish you intend to keep. By keeping the temperature at that level you need need an old fashioned trade off, either increase the amount of available co2, or reduce the amount of light intensity.
 

dw1305

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Hi all,
My issue is that my anubias leaves are becoming almost skeletonised and slimy then melting away, and my java ferns are turning brown/greyish and dying off.
I can't really tell what ill fate has befallen the Anubias. Are they the older leaves (furthest away from the growing point?) or the <"newer leaves nearest the growing point?">.

The Java Fern (Microsorum pteropus) has suffered from drying, it could be they've <"actually dried out during planting">, or it could be <"fertiliser burn">.

cheers Darrel
 

ceg4048

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Thanks for the insight - my CO2 diffuser is positioned directly below a powerhead and filter (biomaster 850) spray bar so I thought this would be sufficient to circulate the CO2. Do you think adding a second powerhead at the other end of the tank would help with CO2 distribution?
Hello,
Many people assume that having the bubbles below the pump outlets automatically achieve the intent, but this is not true unless the tank is pint sized. The problem with this reasoning is that CO2 bubbles is not really what we want. The goal is to dissolve the gas. When the gas is dissolved they will no longer be bubbles. Think about when you put sugar in your coffee or tea. Is the goal accomplished if the sugar grains remain at the bottom of the cup? No, the idea is to dissolve the solid grains and when that is achieved the sugar then is part of the liquid and you will then be able to taste it's properties. The same goes for CO2. The problem is that gases don't dissolve as easily as sugar. Gases need more time, so one of the better ways to dissolve the gas is to place the diffuser under the filter inlet pipe so that the bubbles are sucked up into the filter. The longer travel time allows a better opportunity for the gas to dissolve. When the water emerges from the spraybar more of the gas will be in solution and the bubbles will not be fighting the powerhead escaping out the top of the tank. The dissolved gas will travel where the water goes.
When I bought the plants I selected them based on research I'd done that indicated they would be tolerant of warm temperatures as I'm eventually hoping to add discus to the tank
That's all fine and well, but before you add these fish it is imperative that you study and understand CO2. This is not a button that you press. It's a skill that requires practice. I believe someone else mentioned whether you have a method of measuring the CO2 concentration level. That is a primary requirement, whether it's by using a dropchecker or by measuring the pH difference from gas off to gas on. This is critical otherwise you run the risk of poisoning your fish.
Both of these plants can survive at 27c, there's really no need to lower the temperature if its going to compromise the fish you intend to keep. By keeping the temperature at that level you need need an old fashioned trade off, either increase the amount of available co2, or reduce the amount of light intensity.
Yes, these plants can survive even higher temperatures, but this is not the point. The point is that CO2 is more soluble at lower temperatures. The temperature can be temporarily turned down until the problems are solved and raised again when the OPs CO2 technique has improved. Simply increasing the injection rate without any reliable way of measuring the CO2 is not the best path for keeping expensive fish.

Cheers,
 
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