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I wonder if the BBC

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As of the time of writing the petition stands at 2,926,626
I suspect the majority of people signing the petition voted Labour in the 2024 GE and who feel betrayed.
Either way I'm sure we'll find out for sure when it's debated on January 6 2025
Conversely I would argue that most of the people signing the petition don't like the Labour Party, didn't vote Labour and are just trying to build an anti-Labour narrative. A lot more than 2.9 million people voted for parties other than Labour in the recent election, so I don't see why it is a surprise that 2.9 million people are not happy with the Labour government. And the 2.9 million figure may even include some foreign bots who evaded detection.

"People who don't like Labour still don't like Labour" is about all that can be concluded from this petition, and the debate in January will not add any new insight.
 
Posts promoting anti vaccination, climate change denial, immigration conjecture, stereotyping people with autism etc… (examples based on the last couple of weeks posts) may harm the perception of the site as a whole as well as the relationships of its members.
I’m not trying to dispute anyone’s views. I just feel social media platforms are the appropriate places for polarising debates and niche hobby forums like ours should strive to stay out of things like politics and religion etc…
Just my two cents.
Good answer. 👍🏻
 
Posts promoting anti vaccination, climate change denial, immigration conjecture, stereotyping people with autism etc… (examples based on the last couple of weeks posts) may harm the perception of the site as a whole as well as the relationships of its members.
I’m not trying to dispute anyone’s views. I just feel social media platforms are the appropriate places for polarising debates and niche hobby forums like ours should strive to stay out of things like politics and religion etc…
Just my two cents.

I don't think it's quite that straightforward. Those are absolute opinions on subjects that are not black and white. I don't think anyone here is anti-vaccination, nor denying climate change.

And from what I remember, no one stereotyped neurally divergent folk, at least not in an intentionally cruel way. Not sure what the etc is for. What else is there that specifically upsets you?

I think, most polarisation comes from folk with well established and strongly held beliefs. I think certain social media platforms haven't helped, they've become echo chambers. It's easy to connect with others that share similar opinions, and avoid those who don't.

It's part of a phenomenon called the "filter bubble" effect. Consequently it can become increasingly difficult for some folk to understand and empathize with those that hold different views, which can lead to polarization.

The universe is not black and white, it is various shades of grey, and I'm not talking about the recent weather. It's also very fluid, changes rapidly and is shrinking. As the world gets smaller there seems to be an increasing list of things that divide us, It's almost as though folk have been deliberately set against one another.

All of it sensationalised, communicated in divisive. inflammatory, and often defamatory language, and nearly always absolute. It's very sad because we all of us have so much in common on a fundamental level, which is just as well because we are all we have.

I don't think there is any harm indulging in contentious "off topic" conversations, so long as folk understand that's all they are. There really is no need to get upset so long as folk are being polite and respectful and not calling each other names.

If it gets to the point where that becomes difficult to do maybe it's time to take a step back and consider why that is. Rather than displacing those feeling on others in an attempt to control the narrative to suit certain sensibilities. And alter the way a forum is run to create yet another echo chamber, and enhance the filter bubble effect.
 
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My personal view is that these polarising off topic discussions will be the death of the forum.

The survival of a website run by an aquatic plant society likely hinges on it being a safe haven from the typical social media platforms and their culture.
Including the culture that allows a vocal minority of extremely sensitive individuals to shut down discussion of topics that are triggering for them in order to create an echo chamber. I agree that toxicity and insulting behaviour shouldn't be tolerated here but nor should anyone trying to dictate what others can and can't discuss in an off topic forum just because they don't like the opinions being expressed but aren't capable of refuting them. That would also amount to importing a problem from social media.
niche hobby forums like ours should strive to stay out of things like politics and religion etc…
Just my two cents.

What Little said. These threads are damaging and cause offence. They are also unnecessary and irrelevant. If anyone needs to vent they have social media to do so.
It's lucky it's in the off topic / chit chat forum rather than any off the niche hobby ones isn't it but genuine question - wouldn't it just be easier for YOU to avoid things like "politics and religion etc"?
When you see a thread in the off topic chit chat forum with a title that relates to a topic where you find it upsetting to see people respectfully express a dissenting opinion, instead of clicking on it and reading it, then contributing to it, have you ever tried simply not clicking on it, reading it and then contributing to it?
If anyone is sincerely offended by @Guest posts in this thread that's very much a you problem. He's always respectful and they fall WELL within the bounds acceptable civil discourse.
 
As a responsible leader RFK has every right to be concerned about the efficacy and side effects of Covid vaccines.


There are many more papers online that draw similar conclusions.
I was hospitalised and diagnosed with myocarditis following the moderna and pfizer mrna injections. In the early stages of my diagnosis they couldn't even reassure me that I was definitely going to survive. I would often read articles about the "conspiracy theory" that the vaccines caused myocarditis while I was waiting for my MRI scans. I would often read about how reports to the yellow card reporting scheme weren't valid "because it's based on self reporting" despite the one relating to my case being submitted by a cardiologist with no input from me whatsoever. I have a permanent cardiac arrhythmia from the covid mrna injections and they didn't prevent me from contracting or transmitting covid.
That acknowledging any of this today still get's you branded an "anti vaxxer" by some pretty much says it all.
 
To me "off topic" and "chit chat" don't suggest what these threads sometimes involve. I don't imagine the 'off topic' topic was added so that people could post about politics. There are plenty off topic posts about music and mundane things that I ignore. They don't seem relevant, but they don't bother me at all personally. My impression is that some people who post sometimes make assumptions about what may or not be upsetting or offensive, which don't always match up to the broad-ranging membership and people's life experience. There's always a debate between shutting down discussion and things being irrelevant, but the issue to me is always twofold. First, I like not knowing people's politics here, as it makes it more conducive to their ideas about fish keeping, like how to keep a dirted tank. Secondly, we don't always know what is upsetting. As someone disabled permanently by Covid, I find the stuff about RFK annoying and it's really, really not what I want to encounter here. I support people with LC and I don't bring that stuff here. I don't mean it HAS to be banned, I mean I enjoy this forum because I won't have to encounter that kind of thing. Sometimes as with climate breakdown we feel we're reading something that does really affect us or upset us. I think there's an assumption by some people that we can all post anything and it's all reasonable debate, without them always being aware what they are posting means to other people – because we are such a diverse group. Rather than those of us who are suggesting a different approach being told we're censoring, maybe sometimes we're saying something different to that, more like, respectfully, could you take it elsewhere. I don't see how a forum as diverse as this could be an echo chamber, we're all too different, and all we share is a hobby. I'd never think of posting about other parts of my life, or my politics, it just seems a bit daft, and an imposition on others. Things that are upsetting aren't always "triggers". I appreciate the old threads about illness, depression and vulnerability, they seemed genuinely helpful.
 
I was hospitalised and diagnosed with myocarditis following the moderna and pfizer mrna injections. In the early stages of my diagnosis they couldn't even reassure me that I was definitely going to survive. I would often read articles about the "conspiracy theory" that the vaccines caused myocarditis while I was waiting for my MRI scans. I would often read about how reports to the yellow card reporting scheme weren't valid "because it's based on self reporting" despite the one relating to my case being submitted by a cardiologist with no input from me whatsoever. I have a permanent cardiac arrhythmia from the covid mrna injections and they didn't prevent me from contracting or transmitting covid.
That acknowledging any of this today still get's you branded an "anti vaxxer" by some pretty much says it all.
I’m so sorry to hear that Louis. I empathise completely. As a family we’ve also suffered our fair share of tragedy following Covid vaccination. One suffering exactly as you. All were perfectly healthy prior to that.

Unfortunately, it’s an all too frequent story. But folk don’t always attribute cause and effect and are reluctant to make a fuss, especially when they’ve been bought up to blindly respect authority. So along with your experience it’s highly likely adverse events are hugely under reported.
 
Rather than those of us who are suggesting a different approach being told we're censoring, maybe sometimes we're saying something different to that, more like, respectfully, could you take it elsewhere.
Right but don't you or anyone else that's particularly bothered by seeing people disagree with you have the option of just not reading or engaging with it?
It seems more like you're walking up to a closed door with a sign on it that says "people discussing political issues within" then turning the handle, entering the room, and saying to everyone inside "respectfully, could you take it elsewhere" instead of just walking past?
 
It's not about disagreement. Maybe if I was in the doorway of that room I might say, look, there are lots of really huge rooms to post that stuff, in this room we were chatting about fish and plants? I don't think there's a right or a wrong, and I explained myself as well as I could above. At the same time, every now and then there's a comment that really asks to be spoken back to, strongly, as with Darrel pushing back on the climate issue, and that was very heated. I do think it creates a hangover. Sometimes the forum could just do without those disputes. For every time someone says just ignore it, another person is thinking just go and post that stuff somewhere else. Sometimes some of us are holding back because a dispute will get heated if we say what we think. Personally I'd like the channel to be called chit chat and stick to that.
 
I saw an interview the other day and it was suggested that mRNA technology is a solution for a problem that doesn’t exist. Existing, well proven and tested vaccine production has been more than adequate up until now and is still used for other vaccines. I won’t be having any more Covid vaccinations but what worries me is that there is now talk of using the same mRNA production method for other vaccines like Influenza and Shingles. Two vaccines that I would normally accept. I’m most definitely not anti vaccine, but I am sceptical of mRNA until it’s proven safe.
 
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@Little you’re making some pretty strange assumptions based on what exactly?

As far as I can tell some limited and abstract experiences that specifically have nothing to do with this forum, and attempting to pass them off as legitimate concerns.

And then you state you have no wish to engage in debate of this nature. But yet you do so to the extent you yourself are one of the main protagonists.

Hasn’t it occurred that perhaps your comments might be the very thing that are actually causing harm?

But don’t worry, the site is healthy and thriving. Believe me I know. Ironically it’s discussions like this that keep it that way.
 
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