# Dry Start Method Tips?



## Julian (23 Mar 2015)

I've been running this set up for about 4 days now and it seems to be going well, just wanted to see if anyone could offer me any tips and check that I'm doing things right.

Plants are HC, Staurogyne Repens, Eleocharis Parvula, Hydrocotyle sp Japan and some Rotala Rotundifolia. There's also some mystery moss that I've blended together and applied to the hardscape using the yoghurt method.

Water level is a few millimeters below the substrate, lights are 2x TMC Mini 400's set at 50% for 9 hours a day. It's not in any of the pictures, but to create humidity, there's a bowl of water with a heater in it that sits in the front right corner. This keeps the ADA soil nice and wet, even at the top of the slope, it never has that dried out look to it and most of the hard scape looks fairly moist too. The majority of the plants have moisture on the leafs, a few of them don't and the leafs have started to curl ever so slightly so I'm wondering if it's worth upping the humidity a bit more. Currently it's at 22C / 90% Humidity. I'm thinking I could leave things how they are and just mist them twice a day, but I want to try and get away without misting at all, it's been 4 days so I think if things were really bad the plants would be doing a lot worse.

Thoughts please! Thanks!


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## Crossocheilus (23 Mar 2015)

First of all can I say that that is a great looking scape, although you may want to add more wood as once the plants have grown it will disappear.

As to the dry start. I have a couple of emersed propagators and what I have decided is that lots of different approaches seem fine. One thing is that you can probably up the lights to 100%, if I am right when emersed, CO2 is effectively unlimited. As long as everything seems fairly damp and nothing goes brown or shrivelled, you may not need to mist. If the plants start to look dry you may need to spray once a day.


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## Scapefu (23 Mar 2015)

Hi Julian,

Great set up. We just did a podcast on this: http://www.scapefu.com/dry-start-method-7-tips-for-success/


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## Rasbo (24 Mar 2015)

I currently have a tank on dry start with no heating (even the house heating is broken) (as low as 12C) and full light 12 hours a day and all is OK with only irregular misting. Weeping moss, xmas moss, HC, eleocharis mini, hygrophila araguaia, pogostemon helferi, micranthemum micromoides, cryptocoryne and java fern. I read somewhere that staurogyne does not like a dry start so am holding that immersed to plant after flooding.


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## foxfish (24 Mar 2015)

That is definitely not the  easiest scape to dry start as the upper layers might become to dry and the lower to wet.
If it were a small tank it might of been possible to prop it up to level out the soil! 
However it sounds like you are doing the best you can.


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## Julian (24 Mar 2015)

Crossocheilus said:


> First of all can I say that that is a great looking scape, although you may want to add more wood as once the plants have grown it will disappear.
> 
> As to the dry start. I have a couple of emersed propagators and what I have decided is that lots of different approaches seem fine. One thing is that you can probably up the lights to 100%, if I am right when emersed, CO2 is effectively unlimited. As long as everything seems fairly damp and nothing goes brown or shrivelled, you may not need to mist. If the plants start to look dry you may need to spray once a day.



Thanks for the kind words and advice. It's very hard to source hard scape materials in South East London. There are only 3 LFS near me, I managed to grab a few rocks from each of them and a few bits of wood. I think I've done the best with what I had, but I'd still like to bring it all forward a bit more and make everything less even to give it a more natural look. But this is only really my second attempt so I think it's a good place to start.



Scapefu said:


> Hi Julian,
> 
> Great set up. We just did a podcast on this: http://www.scapefu.com/dry-start-method-7-tips-for-success/



Thanks, I'll be sure to have a listen and subscribe!




foxfish said:


> That is definitely not the  easiest scape to dry start as the upper layers might become to dry and the lower to wet.
> If it were a small tank it might of been possible to prop it up to level out the soil!
> However it sounds like you are doing the best you can.



Thanks for the advice. I think it should be OK, if I look through the tank from the left hand side, I can see the water level beneath the soil and then lots of condensation built up in all the upper layers. I'll take a picture later so you can see what I mean.


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## Julian (29 Mar 2015)

So I thought my plants were doing OK, but had a closer look today. Some of the HC had to be removed as it had turned into a dark green mush, there was a thin layer of slime covering it and around the substrate where it was planted. Other patches are doing absolutely fine.

I believe the heater in a bowl of water was the cause of this, but can't say for sure. The clumps of HC that were closest to heater and at the top of the slope appear to be the worst affected, the clumps further away are absolutely fine. I think the heat may have been a catalyst for the slime to take over, and as heat rises, I think this is why the HC at the top also died.

I've flooded the tank and immediately did a 90% water change. I haven't had any plants floating to the surface so far so I think I'll just carry on submersed. 

I think the lesson learnt for next time is to create the humidity without the heat by misting at least twice every day.


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## foxfish (29 Mar 2015)

If you ever try this again I would suggest a heat mat under the tank & no misting, just a small vent hole.
Good luck with your tank...


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## Julian (29 Mar 2015)

Are there any precautions one should take when adding 'in vitro' plants to a submersed set up - specifically HC? I was wondering if letting it float for a couple of weeks would be a good idea, or should I plant it straight into the substrate?


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## Andy Thurston (29 Mar 2015)

Julian said:


> I was wondering if letting it float for a couple of weeks would be a good idea


 this is a good Idea for most plants that have been grown emmersed.


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## Julian (1 Apr 2015)

All my HC had to be removed. The white slimey stuff turned out to be cyanobacteria. Bought some more and replanted last night. Reshaped things a little too. More HC on the way, going to cover the substrate completely and get some more hair grass along the back wall. Frosted background and glass spray bar should arrive tomorrow.


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