# 10 Years Later..



## jimi (30 Aug 2019)

Hi All,

This is the start of my new project. Its been about 10 years since I built a tank, hence the name of it. This is the first time I am trying an iwugami tank. I have no idea if it will work in a Roma 200 but its all about experimenting isn't it!

It is also worth mentioning that it will be a high tech tank of sorts but done on a budget as I really cant afford some of the amazing rock etc. some of you guys have!

So a list of bits an pieces below:

*Tank *
Fluval Roma 200 and Cabinet - Gumtree -  *£70* (bargain)
Black background (stuck on nicely with rapeseed oil and a bit of gaffa tape (which someone mentioned doing on here, works a treat)

*Lights *
Swapped built in lid with T5's for an AquaSky LED that I bought for my older tank -  *£80
*
Lights are set for a very long dawn and a very long sunset over the course of 2 hours each. Full sunlight set for 6 hours at 70% intensity. This will be amended as I go on a need to basis.

*Heater*
Aqua Range LCD Smart Heater -* £32.99

Filter*
Fluval 305 - *Free *(long story)
Swapping out standard pipes for glossy black PVC 16mm ID. £11.04
Swapping out standard intake and outflow for lily pipes, not decided which ones yet.
*
Substrate *
JBL Manado - £20 roughly

*Wood *
Aqua One Azalea Root - £5

*Stones*
From back garden - Free

*Plants:*
Eleocharis Acicularis x 2 pots
Moss (cannot remember the name of x 1 pot - 3 pots for £12 offer at P@H.

*Co2*
Not got it yet (Need to sell an American fridge freezer I don't need to pay for co2 setup) which will be
Co2Art SE-Series with Inline Diffuser. - £143.62 (maybe less if I get a discount code)


So that's it so far. Some pics below of a very dirty messy tank in first stages. I will take a few more next Monday once its been running a week. Progress will be slow until I get the Co2 up and running and the lights turned up so sorry its is a tad boring!




 

 

 

 



Please criticize as much as possible as I find it very difficult to 'see' correct placement of stones, especially when I cant afford a nice range to choose from. 

So there we have it, updates to follow 

Jimi


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## tam (30 Aug 2019)

Might be a bit late now, but I'd suggest slopping the substate more dramatically. You see how when you take a photo looking down at an angle the tank looks much deeper front to back/you can see more of the planting? You can make that happen in reality by sloping the substrate so the back is quite high to adjust the angle you are looking at. Gravel in a filter bag/pair of tights under the substrate it a cheap way to add height without needing to buy more expensive substrate.


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## jimi (30 Aug 2019)

Thanks tam,  I purposefully sloped it down at the back, I thought that would give a rolling away effect. Obviously it doesn't work haha. 
At least I know for next time now, thank you very much 

Jimi


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## tam (30 Aug 2019)

jimi said:


> Thanks tam,  I purposefully sloped it down at the back, I thought that would give a rolling away effect. Obviously it doesn't work haha.
> At least I know for next time now, thank you very much



It's all a learning curve, it's good to experiment and work out for yourself what does and doesn't work. 

And by the way, I quite like your garden rocks - sometimes the fancy stuff looks a bit fake rock - they look like what I imagine if you say rock, if you follow


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## jimi (30 Aug 2019)

tam said:


> And by the way, I quite like your garden rocks - sometimes the fancy stuff looks a bit fake rock - they look like what I imagine if you say rock, if you follow



Yup totally follow you, thanks again 

Jimi


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## jimi (30 Aug 2019)

So this is it after I put the background on and set it up. Now the patient waiting game commences!


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## jimi (31 Aug 2019)

I was just thinking. Is this long sunrise and sunset a good thing on these lights. Everyone says 8 hours a day is enough light. Mine is longer in total as you can see but only 6 of them are bright and even then that’s only at 70% of full power. 

Also when I introduce c02 and start turning that on an hour before the lights go on and an hour before the lights go off that means the co2 will be on for 14 hours a day which can’t be good. 

Any thoughts on this. Shall I forego the fading in and out when I get the c02 and just have them come on at 100% for 7 or 8 hours a day as standard?

Thoughts please


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## jimi (2 Sep 2019)

Well the Co2 kit is on its way as is the new hosing and a soda stream bottle. Very excited to get that all up and running. I think I am going to get myself an extinguisher and use the soda stream bottle as a back up for when the extinguisher needs refilling. Week 2 pic coming tonight but there isn't much change!


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## Edvet (2 Sep 2019)

Be carefull to start with to much light especially without CO2.
I would start with 6 hours without rampup/ramp down and maybe on 50 or 60%. If all is well you can start gradually to increase strength and later time.


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## jimi (2 Sep 2019)

Edvet said:


> Be carefull to start with to much light especially without CO2.
> I would start with 6 hours without rampup/ramp down and maybe on 50 or 60%. If all is well you can start gradually to increase strength and later time.



Thanks Edvet that's great 

Its a week in and they seem to be doing OK so far so I thought it might be OK to leave it, not only that but wouldn't that intensity be too low for this particular grass? 

But if you reckon it would be better to remove the dawn and dusk and change the intensity then I will give it a go 

Although saying that, I will be adding Co2 this week so I will need to change it all anyway. Need to find someone with this light and my tank and get a rough idea of lighting regime. 

Cheers again
Jimi


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## Edvet (2 Sep 2019)

Even with CO2 start with the 6 hours, if everything is growing well you can add intensity and time gradually ( i would make a change and watch for two weeks, then make another)


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## jimi (2 Sep 2019)

I have now just read that the aquasky 2.0 is crap for growing plants that need med-high light....bugger. I spent £80 on that..

Anyways I cant afford a Fluval Plant 2.0 or 3.0 so I will have to make do.

So 6 hours starting from today, no ramp up/down and 60% intensity. Then add the Co2 but still keep it the same for a couple of weeks.The adjust as needed.

Thanks for your help Edvet.


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## jimi (3 Sep 2019)

Hi all, just a quick week update. Tank looks the same but I just had my co2 kit through. Just waiting for the new hosing now


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## jimi (3 Sep 2019)

Which has just come through the door! Which is a bonus as Royal Mail always take it back if you’re not in and I just got in


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## jimi (3 Sep 2019)

And in true jimi style I have ordered the wrong size diffuser, doh!


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## jimi (3 Sep 2019)

Well I sent a message to co2art, within about 30 minutes they got back to me and have arranged to send a new one first thing tomorrow, what amazing customer service!


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## jimi (7 Sep 2019)

So I changed the lighting under guidance and it’s now on 6 hours and I have dropped the amount of fert dosing as well as I was getting a bit of algae on the wood. I have also put in a second heater as for some reason the one I bought was struggling.

I have moved all the grass to the front and decided against iwugami. This tank is too big for me to try that on first go.

So I have gently piled up some more sub to the back and will probably get some Ada soil or something to bank up the back and get some tall plants and some medium for the middle and keep the carpet at the front. I have also put some live stock in and am going to do a 50 water change weekly just for a bit. Tested my parameters again today and they are all at 0 currently.

No co2 yet as the diffuser is still in the post... I had already put the DC in there and thought I may as well leave it in. Oh and sorry for the quality of the pics, it’s an iPad and I’m not David Bailey.

Jimi


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## Edvet (7 Sep 2019)

If possible add some cheap fast growing plants in the beginning, this will addd stability to your tank (can be pondplants like Elodea (waterweed), watersprite (ceratopteris), Egeria densa (brazilian waterweed) aka oxygenating plants).


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## jimi (8 Sep 2019)

Ok thank you Edvet, I will look into that ASAP.

Unfortunately I came downstairs this morning to find two of the barbs belly up. They looked like they had been chewed. I’m guessing they got into some pretty serious fights last night and that was that.

Can’t really think of any other reason why they would have died and looked as bad as they did

Sad times


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## Janci (9 Sep 2019)

jimi said:


> Ok thank you Edvet, I will look into that ASAP.
> 
> Unfortunately I came downstairs this morning to find two of the barbs belly up. They looked like they had been chewed. I’m guessing they got into some pretty serious fights last night and that was that.
> 
> ...



Sad to read this news.
How are the other fish doing?


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## dw1305 (9 Sep 2019)

Hi all,





jimi said:


> I have also put some live stock in and am going to do a 50 water change weekly just for a bit. Tested my parameters again today and they are all at 0 currently.


Was the nitrate (NO3) 0 ppm? 





jimi said:


> Unfortunately I came downstairs this morning to find two of the barbs belly up. They looked like they had been chewed. I’m guessing they got into some pretty serious fights last night and that was that.
> 
> Can’t really think of any other reason why they would have died and looked as bad as they did


You are never going to know. Were they Tiger Barbs? 

It is a tank with nothing to break up line of sight and you can get scraps for dominance that end up with fatalities if the loser has know-where to hide.

The other option is a water quality one,  because you don't have many plants, you tank is nearer to a non-planted tank and still possibly not "cycled", if you didn't have cycled filter media initially? 

I'm not an advocate of cycling using ammonia, but I like tanks with lots of plants, including some with the <"aerial advantage">.  An air stone might help at night. 





Edvet said:


> If possible add some cheap fast growing plants in the beginning, this will addd stability to your tank (can be pondplants like Elodea (waterweed), watersprite (ceratopteris), Egeria densa (brazilian waterweed) aka oxygenating plants).


 and @Edvet's  suggestion.

cheers Darrel


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## jimi (9 Sep 2019)

Janci said:


> Sad to read this news.
> How are the other fish doing?



They are all good thanks. Parameters are all still at 0 Daryl. 

I have added more plants now as well.


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## dw1305 (9 Sep 2019)

Hi all, 





jimi said:


> Parameters are all still at 0


You definitely will have some nitrate, try giving the two reagents in the nitrate test a really good shake.

cheers Darrel


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## jimi (9 Sep 2019)

I shook it for about 30 seconds like it said but it still came back 0 from what my eyes could make out. If there was a hint of pink I didn’t see it


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## jimi (10 Sep 2019)

How long roughly should it take for a drop checker to turn lime green? It’s been running for 24 hours now (not constantly) and it’s still blue. 

It’s at 1bps in a 200 litre tank. 

Thanks
James


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## Edvet (10 Sep 2019)

jimi said:


> It’s at 1bps in a 200 litre tank.


That's very low, you could go 1 bps more per day ( so 2 bps second day, 3 bps third day etc etc).
DC will be slow anyway but 2-3 hours at least.


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## jimi (10 Sep 2019)

Edvet said:


> DC will be slow anyway but 2-3 hours at least.



Could you explain what you mean in the above? 

Also the co2 is on for 6 hours a day at the moment, same as the lights but comes on an hour earlier.


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## jimi (10 Sep 2019)

Oh also, is it better to have the drop checker at the opposite end of the tank to the outflow?


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## Edvet (10 Sep 2019)

The CO2 has to make it's way to the indicator fluid that always takes a few hours.
It's best to have the DC in the 'toughest' spot not to overestimate CO2 availlability.
https://www.ukaps.org/index.php?page=co2-measurement-using-a-drop-checker


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## Jayefc1 (10 Sep 2019)

In my 140ltr the co2 is on about 5 bubbles per second for 2 hours before to turn the drop checker green at lights on mine is a lot heavier planted than yours though  so I think you just need to up the bubble rate but as said before I'd do it little by little as you have live stock


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## jimi (11 Sep 2019)

Thank you jay and Ed


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## jimi (11 Sep 2019)

Well it’s looking ok so far. I had some soft brown fluffy type algae on the tree wood but I saw the barbs eat all that in the first day I put them in Didn’t realise they ate algae! 

I’m up to 3 bps now and I have upped the lights to 65% intensity. Still 6 hours a day for lights and co2. The drop checker has gone slightly more green so little by little...

Feeding the plants twice a week currently. Didn’t know if too much nutrient would bring on an algae attack. I’m feeding them the eco aqua complete stuff. 2 ml each time.

Oh by the way, does anyone know how to get the pics after the text rather than before?!

Cheers
Jimi


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## Edvet (11 Sep 2019)

type text , then upload a file or add url in image button


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## jimi (12 Sep 2019)

Edvet said:


> type text , then upload a file or add url in image button



That's what I do but it still sticks it at the top


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## Edvet (12 Sep 2019)

Regular computer or Tapatalk?


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## jimi (13 Sep 2019)

Just using my safari browser on my phone. 

DC is lime green at last


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## jimi (21 Sep 2019)

Just a quick update. Things seems to be ticking along nicely. Nothing else to report really!


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## jimi (9 Oct 2019)

Yay!


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## jimi (10 Oct 2019)

Well I had a bit of a change around today. I’m still not feeling it though but I’m done for today. Got rid of the tree as it looked out of place and the large bit of bogwood.

I’m going to put some swords in the back right and then just leave it alone for a while to see what happens. I’m not very good at envisioning what things will look like!

Any critique would be most welcome.


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## jimi (10 Oct 2019)

Oh and I measured the cut outs in the back that the guy that had the tank before me did and they look to be deep enough to take the lily pipes. I also measured the width of the rim and it’s under 4cm so I’m gonna order them tonight. 

I also saw when I took the pic that there is a gap and if I cut that bit at the front of the gap it will be even thinner but won’t harm the integrity of the rim so if the pipes don’t fit right away I can cut those bits out and they defiantly will.


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## Siege (10 Oct 2019)

If possible add some cheap fast growing plants in the beginning, this will addd stability to your tank (can be pondplants like Elodea (waterweed), watersprite (ceratopteris), Egeria densa (brazilian waterweed) aka oxygenating plants).

Ed’s post from earlier. 

I agree. Pack it with plants


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## jimi (11 Oct 2019)

Yeah good point but I always think they aren’t going to get enough light. Like for instance at the moment I’m looking at my tank and thinking “I need to move them further apart or they won’t grow” and it ends up looking really sparse like it does now.

It’s like a mental block or something lol


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## dw1305 (11 Oct 2019)

Hi all, 





jimi said:


> Like for instance at the moment I’m looking at my tank and thinking “I need to move them further apart or they won’t grow” and it ends up looking really sparse like it does now.


Honestly you could have at least x10 as much plant mass without there being any light issues.  

Plants naturally grow in layers (to intercept as much light as possible). This is true of the way an individual plant arranges its leaves, and also of the layering you would get in nature, where you might have a water lily with floating leaf pads and underneath that a stem plant and underneath that a moss etc. 

This is from Marcel's @zozo <"Journal - Mission Bathtub">.




 

This @Tim Harrison's from <"Windswept Eternity">. 



 

This is one of mine. (From <"Water Lettuce and its impact..">)



 

cheers Darrel


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## jimi (11 Oct 2019)

Thanks Darrel thats great 

I was worried about putting floating plants on top in case they blocked out too much light but yours seem to be doing ok underneath!

That's given me a bit more confidence, thanks again


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## dw1305 (11 Oct 2019)

Hi all,





jimi said:


> I was worried about putting floating plants on top in case they blocked out too much light but yours seem to be doing ok underneath!


It is a bit trial and error, until you can judge how much PAR you have. I just have as many plants as the light intensity supports, so if I have a really intense light <"I just have a lot more plant mass">, and a <"more complete layer of floating plants">. 

The bottom of all my tanks are <"dark and gloomy places">, with moss, structural leaf litter and the occasional <"_Cryptocoryne">, Anubias_ or <"_Bolbitis">. _It isn't to every-ones taste, but <"I'm not an aquascaper">, I'm never going to try an iwagumi etc. and <"it suits the fish I keep">. 

I always have floating plants, I use them for the <"Duckweed Index"> and because they have Diana Walstad's <"aerial advantage">, access to atmospheric CO2 which allows them to respond quickly to changes in nutrient level.

cheers Darrel


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## jimi (11 Oct 2019)

Ok cool thanks again


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## jimi (11 Oct 2019)

I think I am going to put in some red where I have put it in the pic and
take out the stones.

Once I can get some more plants I will remove the java ferns and try and getting it looking dutch. This is going to take a long time but the first step is to get those two lots of red in there and take it from there. I dont have the kind of free cash to be able to 100's of plants at once! lol


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## dw1305 (11 Oct 2019)

Hi all, 





jimi said:


> I dont have the kind of free cash to be able to 100's of plants at once!


That is often the issue. 

You can propagate your _Hygrophila _by pinching out the stem tops and replanting them. 

This is a _Fuchsia, _but you need the same method for the _Hygrophila. 



 _

You should then get two shoots from the existing stem, after a while you can do the same with these etc. and that way you can build up your plant numbers. 

With your Java Fern you can split those clumps into smaller bits, each clump could easily go into four bits of rhizome. 

cheers Darrel


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## Siege (11 Oct 2019)

Have a look at the Tropica 1-2 Grow range.
Good value for money. Crypts and stem plants.  At £5 - £6 a pot you’ll get loads of baby plants in a pot.

Also consider posting in the for sale section. - wanted cuttings for postage plus a small donation to ukaps. Every now and again it is common to have a massive pruning session. I know I’ve sent cuttings to people rather than throw them away, certainly enough to make a massive dent on your tank.


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## Siege (11 Oct 2019)

Ps. Mid ground red plants tend to be low in plant mass and that is what you need.

Instead pack it with the fastest growing stems you can find. Save the red midground for later?


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## Kalum (11 Oct 2019)

Happy to send some rotala cuttings in a few weeks once mine is established to try and get you started if interested, just like many others on here have done in the past it's all about helping each other out one way or another


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## jimi (11 Oct 2019)

Thanks for your replies  

I have posted in the wanted section this morning and have had a reply already and will be getting some delivered next week. 

thanks for the advice Darrel and Seige I have found someone selling a load of stem plants on eBay for fairly cheap. I will wash them well...

Kalum that would be great, keep me in mind won’t you.

thank you all again


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## jimi (11 Oct 2019)

Siege said:


> Ps. Mid ground red plants tend to be low in plant mass and that is what you need.
> 
> Instead pack it with the fastest growing stems you can find. Save the red midground for later?



a couple of people have said pack it with loads of stems but the thing is I’m still  scratching my head on how to place all these plants I will be getting. As I said earlier, I’m terrible at seeing the end result and you kinda need that ability if you’re having a Dutch tank. Lol.


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## jimi (12 Oct 2019)

Did my level tests this morning. Looking good


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## dw1305 (12 Oct 2019)

Hi all,





jimi said:


> but the thing is I’m still scratching my head on how to place all these plants I will be getting.


Just plant them in groups, once they've grown in you can move them around, discard them etc. 

Over time I've swapped out most of my stem plants for Ferns, _Cryptocoryne_ spp. etc because they are slower growing and lower maintenance, but I always add fast growing plants if I start a tank.

As well as floating plants, I have <"Hornwort (_Ceratophyllum demersum_)"> a subsurface floater. The advantage of this is that you don't need to plant it (it doesn't actually have any roots even if you plant it).

It is the spiky plant (below) (From <"Congo Swamp Monster">)





cheers Darrel


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## jimi (12 Oct 2019)

Ok thanks Darrel.


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## chefski (12 Oct 2019)

looking good how have you found the Fluval plant LED? Was there an issue with the Aquasky?


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## jimi (12 Oct 2019)

chefski said:


> looking good how have you found the Fluval plant LED? Was there an issue with the Aquasky?



Hiya, seems good so far but I have only been using it a few days. I have noticed the java fern pearling though. I don't think it’s strong enough to make the hair grass Pearl in this tank as it’s quite a depth to the substrate but no complaints so far. Will know better once I get my batch of plants next week and give it a couple of weeks.

The AquaSky is a nice light but they are defo for low light plants that don't necessarily need Co2. They are low wattage and not very good spectrum. I have it on my gfs tank now who has moved from the (ass hat of a tank) Fluval Edge to my old Roma 125. She’s just growing Java ferns and low light plants so it’s perfect for that. Can’t remember the name of the other two.

I am tempted to get another Plant 3.0 tho to up the wattage but we will see. Or maybe just get another cheap AquaSky and double up with that and the Plant 3.0

pic of my gf 125 with the AquaSky





If anyone can tell me what the two plants are at the front cos I have forgotten lol

oh and ignore the rocks, they will be coming out once the wood stays down by itself.


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## jimi (12 Oct 2019)

Cherry red in the gfs tank


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## Kezzab (12 Oct 2019)

Hi, you seem to have some Bucephelandra on the left and right which youve planted into the substrate? These plants generally need to be attached to wood or rock rather than planted. They are likely to rot as you have them.

The other broadleaf plant is an echinodorous of some kind i thnk.
K


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## jimi (13 Oct 2019)

Kezzab said:


> Bucephelandra



Really? We planted it in the substrate when she set up her Edge in May and it’s been thriving. When I dug it all up to put it in her new tank yesterday it had fresh, clean looking roots on it so had  no idea it needed to go on wood.

thanks for the tip


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## Kezzab (13 Oct 2019)

Hi, i think they can do ok in the substrate, and if yours are then thats great, bash on! But general practice is to attach to hardscape. All good.


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## jimi (16 Oct 2019)

So I got 150 stems and got them all in the tank. I haven’t really put them in any semblance of order apart from the red ones. So it’s just a waiting game now!


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## jimi (12 Nov 2019)

Little update

2 cuts later. Lots of thread algae which I’m battling with everyday. Other than that it’s not too bad 












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## Costa (13 Nov 2019)

I'm also getting hair algae in my tank... Is it due to growth rate of plants being slower vs the light available?


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## jimi (13 Nov 2019)

It could be. Though I did add an extra light and have been a bit lax with the water changes so it’s probably too much phosphate. Gonna keep pulling it out and stay on top of the water changes and hopefully that will sort irZ


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