# Melosira algae or similar :/



## Fred13 (13 Jul 2016)

Hello,

My tank

80 x 30 x 40 (centimeters)
Lightning: 2 x 24 t5 ho daylight 6500k plants bulb 4000k
co2: pressurized via ceramic diffuser
Substrate: Prodibio aquagrowth soil
Plants: Hemianthus cuba, rotala walichi, pogostemon helferi,alternanthera mini, alternanthera red ruby,eleocharis pussila,fissidens, pogostemon stellatus broad leaf
Tanks life: 9 cardinal tetra, 5 amano, 5 otocinclus
Fertilization: I started EI this week

So..i have this slimy hair brown algae for about 3 weeks now..
The steps i did:
Reduced my lightning. I was running 3 t5 ho bulbs now i am changed to a 2x24w T5.
Huge water changes with cleaning. I am cleaning it even with the air pump hose..I am doing at least 2 w/c 50-60% per week maybe more.
Some normal dose excel in the tank

Nothing helps.. I am so tired of this. It is really aggresive. It grows on substrate,plants i found even on heater 

Aquariums life is about 2 months .
Help me please by giving me some tips  

Thank you in advance


----------



## Aqua360 (13 Jul 2016)

try reducing the photoperiod?


----------



## Fred13 (13 Jul 2016)

Aqua360 said:


> try reducing the photoperiod?


I have 7 hours photoperiod..
And already removed the 1 bulb. I dont think its much affected by lights.. Now with 2 bulbs i just see a little bit but only little slower growth.


----------



## Greenfinger2 (13 Jul 2016)

Hi Fred, Try a 3--4 day total black out. This should kill it back. Then do a large clean up and a 50% water change and clean the filter


----------



## Fred13 (13 Jul 2016)

Greenfinger2 said:


> Hi Fred, Try a 3--4 day total black out. This should kill it back. Then do a large clean up and a 50% water change and clean the filter


Hello!
Yes.. This is something i was thinking about. I am a little bit afraid about my plants especially hemianthus and this is why i haven't done this already..
Now i will..no other choices left anyway..I hope it works.. 

I will post few photos from the tank a little bit later. 

Thank you


----------



## Greenfinger2 (13 Jul 2016)

Hi Fred, The HC will be fine  Good luck hope all go's well.


----------



## Fred13 (13 Jul 2016)

And few photos from my tank...

One full of this brown algae and one a little bit cleaner..

I am still making changes but i am trying not to put my hands a lot in it. I already put my hands a lot in order to clean 

http://i1074.photobucket.com/albums/w401/Light0r/IMG_1658_zpss4ijweaf.jpg


----------



## Greenfinger2 (13 Jul 2016)

Hi Fred, In the first photo the Algae is not to bad a black out will sort that out. I like the scape   Nice scape and planting in the second photo too


----------



## Fred13 (13 Jul 2016)

Thank you for your comments Roy, i really appreciate this 

I am new to the hobby , for about 8 months old so i am learning. But i am reading a lot and i have some basic knowledge Sometimes like now i am getting confused..

I should increase my nitrates also. I have very low readings because of too many water changes..i removed and 1 bulb so those 2 in combination =low- stunned growth.. So as i understand my plants now cannot compete this algae hard. I should probably lower my water changes and fix my ferts.

I will update as soon as i have news !


----------



## alto (13 Jul 2016)

I don't think too much water change is your problem 
- many people will move to daily 50 - 70% water changes when combatting algae, removing as much algae as possible during each water change - sounds like this stuff can be syphoned off plants (at least to some degree) so that is what I'd be doing, you can also gently "comb" plants with a soft (tooth) brush to help lift algae for syphoning - turn off filter during this time.

Also remove algae daily from any hardscape, glass etc

Clean filter if you've not done so within the last week - there may be loads of algae bits in the filter so also keep this as "clean" as possible - gently rinse all media in treated tap water & use a brush on hoses & inlet/outlet

Re plant photoperiod, this can often be reduced to 5-6 hours/day, I'd decrease from 7 to 6 & see how that goes.

If you think plants were doing better with the 3rd fluorescent, then add that back in - as long as CO2 & nutrients are available for the amount of light, additional light is not a bad thing.
Be sure to dose any fertlizers & Excel daily with the water changes, even if you don't water change every day, Excel is best dosed daily (I believe Seachem has daily as well as weekly dosing instructions) 

If you've just begun EI, what was your previous fertilizer?  


Tank looks very nice in the photo


----------



## Fred13 (14 Jul 2016)

alto said:


> I don't think too much water change is your problem
> - many people will move to daily 50 - 70% water changes when combatting algae, removing as much algae as possible during each water change - sounds like this stuff can be syphoned off plants (at least to some degree) so that is what I'd be doing, you can also gently "comb" plants with a soft (tooth) brush to help lift algae for syphoning - turn off filter during this time.
> 
> Also remove algae daily from any hardscape, glass etc
> ...



Thank your for your answer Alto!

The problem with my water changes is that i cant reach a sufficient nitrate level. I aim for 10 to 15 nitrates but i cant. So plants dont grow somehow fast to compete this algae.Maybe the answer for this is to increase my nitrogen dosing until i stop doing many water changes.
On the other hand , water changes and siphoning helped me so much to control the tank . As you can see at the photo in the link i was losing the game hard till i decided to start a hard fight with it. Siphoning with the air pump hose even for 2 and 3 hours..

The biggest problem of this diatom algae is the aggressiveness. 48 hours are enough to control my substrate and plants..
And this is why i removed my third bulb. I tried to slower down things and i did but not that much. It is not that aggressive but remains a hard enemy.

Corners have few issues because of lightning change. Hemianthus cuba continues to grow like nothing changed (lots of pearling and nice color) but plants at the corners and rotala wallichi dont appreciate that change a lot  I think 2 bulbs provide enough energy to keep my difficult plants alive (maybe not the best colors) until i win this algae and increase my lightning again if i want. Now i am on 0,6 to 0,7/l. I know its an old rule and does not count a lot for t5 especially high output.

Co2 as you mentioned is very important. And this is something i believe i am not well. I am a little bit unstable. Ceramic diffuser gets dirt easily and makes co2 spread bad..
I ordered and waiting for an inline diffuser and i hope for better spread.

As for excel yes! I started dosing this week! I am also thinking about overdosing , not much, just x2 to see if this works.

My fertilization was potassium and flourish comprehensive. Because of the new substrate and immature tank i didn't want to bomb it with ferts so i was very careful..I started EI in combination with the decrease of lightning in order to keep ferts high to enhance plant growth. 

Last but not least, i hope this is also a waiting game and this algae doing a cycle like other types of diatoms.

And thank you very much for the compliment  I am waiting for some plants and doing small changes so i will update soon with new photos


----------



## herezor (14 Jul 2016)

Hi.

I would try the one-two punch method. Search on the web with this: One-two punch for algae. Do it exactly as it is indicated for 3-4 weeks. Clean hardscape with bleach. Increase CO2, EI, flow and oxygenation. Decrease light intensity and photoperiod and give it 3-4 weeks (yes, patience is the hardest part of this hobby but also what works better). I would be very surprised if you had any algae by the end of the process.

After that, keep your CO2 high, your light low and water changes and EI as always. Simple advice, hard to keep up...


----------



## Fred13 (15 Jul 2016)

herezor said:


> Hi.
> 
> I would try the one-two punch method. Search on the web with this: One-two punch for algae. Do it exactly as it is indicated for 3-4 weeks. Clean hardscape with bleach. Increase CO2, EI, flow and oxygenation. Decrease light intensity and photoperiod and give it 3-4 weeks (yes, patience is the hardest part of this hobby but also what works better). I would be very surprised if you had any algae by the end of the process.
> 
> After that, keep your CO2 high, your light low and water changes and EI as always. Simple advice, hard to keep up...



Thank you for advice!

I ll search information about 1-2 punch method to understand how it works.

I increased co2 and today i put a small pump to increase surface agitation and flow to oxygenate the water more. This flow disturbs life inside a little bit but.. i have to as you are also suggesting me..
Keep dosing EI everyday yes!  No issues so far with ferts (like other algae or anything)
I also removed a rock that i have which is not from a fish store and i suspect it..  Silicates maybe; I don't know..but i don't believe  its the reason for this algae.
Yes! i ll clean my hardscape with bleach (this is something i haven't done so far)
My photoperiod is now 6 hours with 2 bulbs only. 
Next week i will plant more and few fast growers.

Patience...and patience...and patience...and water changes  ! I am doing water changes even small everyday to siphon it. 

Worst part is hemianthus cuba. This is something really difficult to clean. Stem plants are so easy and i can clean them 100%. Today i removed a big part of cuba which was totally mess. I believe that i have to sacrifice few plants and plant them again.
After cleaning alternanthera red ruby for about 10 times (even more) , melosira stopped growing there. It surprises me because it goes everywhere else but not there anymore. 

I ll read about 1-2 punch and i will update soon.

Thank you again


----------



## herezor (15 Jul 2016)

The one-two punch is done only on water change days. And be advised that the proportion of H2O2 indicated in the thread, although it is said to be 4 tbsp, it is later corrected by the method developer to 2 tbsp.

Then, do everything as it is indicated in the thread. Most important is *FLOW*. Remove filter media from filter and add any powerhead you have around. If you do it correctly for 3-4 weeks (always on water change day), I would be surprised if you have any algae left by the end of the process. During it, you must follow the other part of my advice. High CO2, low light and EI.

As for cuba, do not waste your time in cleaning it. If it is well rooted, just trim it. Trim every patch you see algae in.


----------



## Fred13 (17 Jul 2016)

Hello,

I am afraid to do 1-2 punch method.. It is an intense method and i believe i am close to solve the problem. 
If i could clean hemianthus 100% it would probably be a huge victory  I trimmed as you told me herezor but unfortunately this algae is even in lower layers so i cannot totally clean it.

I am thinking about spot treatment with H2O2 with closed filters and water change. Can you suggest me a safe dosage per liter;

I also attach 1 photo from my tank. This photo is after cleaning so you cannot see any signs of those filamentous diatoms.. I am still doing some small changes and waiting for some plants to plant and increase my biomass.

Thank you


----------



## herezor (17 Jul 2016)

Spot treatment is much more dangerous and ineficient than 1-2 punch. I do not do spotctreatment anymore so I have forgotten the dose. Maybe someonevelse around can help you there. Sorry.


----------



## Fred13 (17 Jul 2016)

Why is it more dangerous; For burning a plant or for fish and bacteria;


----------



## herezor (18 Jul 2016)

For fish and bacteria and if you do spot treatment with H2O2 on some plants, you´ll burn them (Micranthemum Monte Carlo for example).

What I normally do and it is just for prevention, it is to clean the tank on water change days. Clean hardscape, glass, etc, and then do the 1-2 punch. I do it every 2 months or so. The key is flow, flow, flow, flow...and flow. Never had a loss. When I did the spot treatment I lost 2 corydoras and a good patch of Monte Carlo as I mentioned...

Other may have other experiences. I give you mine. Now, it is all up to you.


----------

