# Nano Tank 17l - Rescape update



## GreenGrow (19 Jul 2012)

Hey guys,

Thought I'd start another journal for my new tank that I am setting up!

Its going to be the tank which I take back to Uni with me, so I thought why not start up a Nano CRS Tank?!

Here are the specs:
Tank: 40x20x20cm = 17l
Lights: UP PRO-L 43cm 2x24w Twin Florescent. (only going to use one bulb)
Filter: Boyu - EF-05 = 150lph
CO2: UP Regulator with solenoid valve and JBL 500g Canister.
Ferts: EI
Substrate: ADA Amazonia Powder 3l
Hardscape: Mini Landscape Rock
Flora:Hemianthus Callitrichoides
Fauna: Crystal Red Shrimp

Had abit of time mucking around with the rocks when they came from Aqua Essentials:









And decided that this was my favourite:




I had a problem when I decided to attach the lights as the brackets came very low down into the tank which ruined the feel of it, so Emyr(also a UKAPS member) and myself decided to put together a mini stand, that would hold the filter, raise the tank, and also have a lighting bracket.


Emyr knocking it together:




Filter compartment and lighting bracket:




First undercoat on:




Finished product:




Close up of tank:




Not too sure about the colour of the lighting, so have ordered another bulb form Lampspec.

All in all everything has gone swimmingly well!

Massive thanks to Emyr who gave alot of his time to the construction of the stand   

Plants arrive shortly so will keep you guys updated.

As per usual, and thoughts, comments, and questions are welcome


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## Radik (19 Jul 2012)

*Re: Nano CRS Tank 17l*

This rock and CRS does not go together, they will push KH to sky high chose inert rock or neocaridinas instead.


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## mlgt (19 Jul 2012)

*Re: Nano CRS Tank 17l*

Looks really well made and well done for going th DIY route. 

I wonder if the flow might be quite strong and blow the substrate around?


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## GreenGrow (19 Jul 2012)

*Re: Nano CRS Tank 17l*

Thanks mate, I was worried but the flow is not very strong at all so should hopefully be ok!

I thought the rock was inert?!


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## ian_m (19 Jul 2012)

*Re: Nano CRS Tank 17l*



			
				edmills said:
			
		

> Thanks mate, I was worried but the flow is not very strong at all so should hopefully be ok!
> 
> I thought the rock was inert?!


Does the rock "fizz" if you put acid on it ?

Vinegar might do it, but I used Killrock descaler (formic acid) on one of my rocks and fizzed like mad, thus confirming it was limestone, thus would harden the water.


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## GreenGrow (19 Jul 2012)

*Re: Nano CRS Tank 17l*

I'll have a bash at that later. The substrate causes the water to become softer, so would it be possible for them to equal the other out? If not there is always the option on putting water softeners in the filter such as peat?


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## JenCliBee (19 Jul 2012)

*Re: Nano CRS Tank 17l*

Loving the stand, nice unique idea


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## Otto72 (19 Jul 2012)

*Re: Nano CRS Tank 17l*



			
				Radik said:
			
		

> This rock and CRS does not go together, they will push KH to sky high chose inert rock or neocaridinas instead.



I would tend to agree on this although your substrate should lower your parameters down to an acceptable level, the rock will probably up it to an unacceptable level for CRS. 
The thing you have to think about is it's a lot harder to maintain water parameters in such a small tank footprint.
I love the final scape you have chose but if it was me I would lower the substrate level down a bit.

What grade you going for btw?


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## GreenGrow (19 Jul 2012)

*Re: Nano CRS Tank 17l*

Thanks mate, the thing with the substrate is that I anticipate it to lower when the water is added ect. At the moment I would agree with you that it is very high.

I'm pretty sure that I'd just go with K4 grade as they look really nice.

Otto...With the soft substrate and the potential addition of water softeners into the filter, will it be able to keep CRS with in this set-up?


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## Otto72 (19 Jul 2012)

*Re: Nano CRS Tank 17l*



			
				edmills said:
			
		

> Otto...With the soft substrate and the potential addition of water softeners into the filter, will it be able to keep CRS with in this set-up?



What water softeners you using?

The rock you have chose people do use in CRS setups but they are usually much bigger tanks.
If you want your CRS to thrive in my opinion I would take the rock out completely and just have moss and maybe some other plants. Sounds pants I know but I think you will have better results without it. 
Lots of plants will suck up ammonia and other bad stuff very quickly while your cycling the tank.
Btw your using CO2 as well right? well that will help bring down the ph, just make sure its consistent and be carefull not to have the CO2 too high cause you will kill your CRS! (lower CO2 levels for shrimp than fish)
Personally I wouldn't use CO2 but there's no reason why you can't use it with shrimp as long as your careful and monitor it.

Temperature should be between 21-23 and the pH should range from 6.2 to 6.8, gH should be between 4-6 and kH should be between 1-2. Although it's debatable as you will see that some other people have used very different parametres and succeeded.
I have kept CRS in the past and they died one by one after a few months and I had the parametres perfect, they are very sensitive especially the higher grades. I think my failure was down to the tank not being fully mature. I plan on trying again in the very near future but I would probably leave the tank to mature for at least 12 weeks this time. 
This may be overkill waiting time as others are successful after only 4 weeks.
Check out Ady34's journal his A grade CRS are doing great 

Once you have steady parameters and a well established tank, CRS (apparently) are as easy to keep as cherry shrimp.

Subscribed to your thread as I think this will turn out to be an interesting project


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## LancsRick (19 Jul 2012)

*Re: Nano CRS Tank 17l*

Lovely sized tank, where was it from please?


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## Otto72 (19 Jul 2012)

*Re: Nano CRS Tank 17l*

I also forgot to mention you need a pre-filter over that glass intake or any baby shrimp will get sucked up!

The fluval edge sponge pre-filter will be perfect for this but if you think its unsightly you could get a steel one.

http://www.seapets.co.uk/products/aquar ... ponge.html



			
				Aquaessentials said:
			
		

> Mini Landscape Aquarium Rock has become very popular with Iwagumi aquariums where the main focus is on the rocks and the plants complement the over all set up. World famous Aquascaper Takashi Amano uses these rocks with great effect in many of his set ups - the only difference is he calls the rocks Seiryu Stone.





			
				TGM said:
			
		

> ADA Seiryu Stone - Please note that this rock may raise pH and hardness slightly. Using ADA Aqua Soil will resolve this.



If your you really really want to use rock I would go for an inert rock like Manten Stone.


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## GreenGrow (19 Jul 2012)

*Re: Nano CRS Tank 17l*



			
				LancsRick said:
			
		

> Lovely sized tank, where was it from please?



It was just a Clearasel tank I found on offer for £10! Think you can find them at Pets at Home.

The tank will be running for a couple of months before I add some critters, so will measure the parameters and adjust if necessary.


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## Radik (19 Jul 2012)

*Re: Nano CRS Tank 17l*

Does not matter what TGM wrote about Seiryru stone with that amount of stone will push KH sky high.

As Ceg would say there is no way out of the matrix 

I had similar size tank similar amount of stone KH was 12 and soil been useless in 2 months. It is calcium carbonate rock all that carbonate will be sucked in to soil (soil high CEC) untill it is saturated later when you remove those rocks soil will dump this carbonate back to water. And I was using RO Water with mineral 0KH.

With Co2 this effect is even more boosted as co2 is acid and will help dissolve caco3 in rock in to water level.

Another undesirable effect is pushing TDS too high.. you may start at ideal 100 for CRS and will be pushed to 200 then you do water changes and you get unstable TDS jumping low/high.

Manten stone is out of reach for normal people you can get Dragon stone that one is 100% inert and pretty nice.

Maturing tank for so long is overrated it just make no sense. 

We do push shrimp to tank after one week. We tested even on second day with berried C. Breviatas. And guess what... full of babies now and all strong growing well. Yes all active soil.

There are products to kick start you, use Mosura BT-9 to seed with bacteria, Genchem Biozymes will on other hand help populate tank with microorganism.

The key is not to overfeed which will cause you shrimp death and to keep on water changes, no rotting plants etc.


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## Ady34 (19 Jul 2012)

*Re: Nano CRS Tank 17l*

Hi,
Id tend to agree with what has been said and the if the stone will effect your water (i believe anything veined typically does) then fluctuations are inevitable if your trying to work against the natural actions which wont be great for the shrimp. I would say maybe think about different shrimp more suited to the set up and water...maybe if your looking at red and white go for rilli shrimp which still look pretty cool but have a higher range of acceptable TDS (up to 500 i think from what i remember).
Maybe get things set up and as you suggested check out the perameters....but i suspect that large amounts of that rock in a relitively small volume of water will raise TDS, KH, GH etc.
Cheerio,
Ady.


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## tim (19 Jul 2012)

*Re: Nano CRS Tank 17l*

nice setup mate crs very fussy though as radik and ady stated your also going to dose ei which i think will push your tds higher im sure someone will correct if im wrong  shrimp ime really dont like large waterchanges either especially in small volumes of water cherries or rillis as ady sugested would be a better option for the setup your aiming for


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## 1stgolf (19 Jul 2012)

*Re: Nano CRS Tank 17l*

Love the look of this tank will look even better when filled with plants and water. I look forward to seeing the progress pictures


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## Nathaniel Whiteside (19 Jul 2012)

*Re: Nano CRS Tank 17l*

Hey mate, 

I don't want to be an echo, but what Ady said is spot on buddy.
The volume of water will make WCs and balancing parameters an absolute nightmare. 

Id recommend something like sakuras or again as Ady states Rilli shrimp. Both are very hardy and will if your fairly careful at water changes! Be okay.

Look into drip acclimatisation, using an airline and an airline tap. Will make WCs a lot easier on both you and the shrimp. Drip water in at 1 drop per second and you'll be fine.

Welcome to a major headache


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## GreenGrow (20 Jul 2012)

Thanks very much for the input guys! Looks like a will have to re evaluate the CRS. Luckily it wont be some time until i move some inhabitants in what with moving the tank down to uni. 

The main thing I want out of the shrimp is that they are small so they help create a sense of scale in the tank... Any suggestions for replacing the CRS that are similar size?

Cheers guys


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## Nathaniel Whiteside (20 Jul 2012)

*Re: Nano CRS Tank 17l*

Hey,

Go for Rilli shrimp I reckon, look very similar apart from where CRS are white, they are clear. And more tolerant by a stretch.


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## wazuck (21 Jul 2012)

*Re: Nano CRS Tank 17l*

I bought crs as my first shrimp. They did fine. Didn't know what I was doing or how to keep them but they survived numerous tank changes and everything but a bad choice of filter resulting in one being split into two :/ guess I was just lucky. Good luck


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## darren636 (21 Jul 2012)

*Re: Nano CRS Tank 17l*

why not have the shrimp you really want ? Just use a different stone.


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## Nathaniel Whiteside (30 Jul 2012)

*Re: Nano CRS Tank 17l*

How did this go matey?


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## GreenGrow (3 Aug 2012)

*Trouble in Paradise.*

Setting up a tank is a near magical moment. Putting together various parts of a puzzle which slip seamlessly together.

This, however, was hellish.   

So after filling up the tank and turning the filter on, I found that the flow was beyond weak. So I left it for several minutes and upon my return, there was a phenomenal amount of water everywhere. 

After a good solid hour of tinkering and leaks, I finally managed to get it water tight, but I'm not quite sure how.

Then went to attach the Reg and release the CO2 only to find that the Solenoid was broken and was adamant not to let any gas through.

Various other problems such as continuous flickering of the bulbs ect. But I will not continue to complain.

ALL of the issues are resolved now and the tank is running perfectly. Got another Reg from Philip which is perfect and its all going well.

Its become apparent that CRS is no longer a possibility with this setup, but that's ok because there are plenty of other shrimp that would be much more suited. Rili Shrimp are a definite possibility among others but the main thing I really want is a small shrimp to help give the scape as much scale as possible.











Was told afterwards that it is much easier to plant when the Aquasoil is wet......ah well!!





First filled up.





Pearling





And the Tank today..


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## HarryRobinson (3 Aug 2012)

*Re: Nano CRS Tank 17l*

Looks sweet, im sure you'll find that your substrate will flatten out soon with it being banked so high :S Now you have the wait for it all to fill in! Good work keep it up


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## Danny (3 Aug 2012)

*Re: Nano CRS Tank 17l*

Looks great and that is one hell of a slope lol


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## GreenGrow (4 Aug 2012)

*Re: Nano CRS Tank 17l*

It has got quite a gradient on it!!! It was something that I wanted to experiment with, and hopefully when the plants cover more of the substrate, there wont be so obvious, failing that it can always be lowered! I do expect it to sink some more though as there are gaps underneath the rocks where I don't think the substrate has filled into yet.


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## GreenGrow (21 Aug 2012)

Have just moved house, and unfortunately during the move, the slope did slip down. It was unrealistic to presume that the tank could be transported without any substrate movement, so I have completely changed it.

Pictures to follow shortly.

I have also had problems with the filter and it has completely broken now, and is streaming water from the electricity port!!!

Have ordered one of the Dennerle Nano External Skim Filter.


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## tim (21 Aug 2012)

bummer mate tank was looking good bad news about the filter just set one up on my 12 ltr nano did you make your mind up about shrimp yet ? think i should get a backup filter on standby get the pics up


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## GreenGrow (22 Aug 2012)

New filter is up and running! Is dead quiet and looks solid.

All Pond Solutions won't refund me for the old filter but have offered to replace it if anybody wants to get their hands on it?


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## HarryRobinson (22 Aug 2012)

Ill have it for free


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## Ben22 (11 Oct 2012)

Looks great. Decided on what shrimp to use?


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## GreenGrow (10 Feb 2013)

Hi guys,

Quite a lot has changed since the summer. Have been incredibly busy since getting back to uni and as a result I haven't been keeping up with UKAPS.

The tank layout went under change as that enormous slope was un-practical and just kept slipping so this is the new layout after I planted it back up.







I may have let it overgrow slightly...







But after a nice trimming session...







...It looks nice and tidy.



Had a chat with a few friends and decided to try out the CRS who went in a few weeks back and they are loving it! Very happy and pretty little shrimp. Only three of them at the moment, as it was a bit of a trial run but plan to put more in.

Sorry for the bad pictures as I'm without a decent camera at the moment, but will hopefully borrow a friends and take some with the shrimp soon!

I am also considering taking out the HC and planing some mini Hair Grass just to keep it fun. If anyone has experience with this plant; please let me know as I think it could be potentially quite fun.

Cheers,


Ed


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## nayr88 (10 Feb 2013)

That looks really smart 

Why not rescale completely and go for a all together different style? Tons of moss and a shrimo


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## GreenGrow (30 Apr 2013)

Quick update

Have replaced the HC with mini HG and added 6 Pheonix Rasboras. 

Pictures to follow!


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## GreenGrow (30 Apr 2013)

Just a few pictures 













Pheonix Rasboras being added!










Runners starting to show


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## GreenGrow (30 Apr 2013)

Also really like the idea of the moss paste but I wouldn't know how to do it. Can any one help me out with some instructions/directions?


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## Steve Smith (30 Apr 2013)

Looks like a clearseal.  Exactly the same as mine


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## tim (30 Apr 2013)

Hi ed have a read through George farmers latest journal he's used the yoghurt method to great effect and details it there.


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## GreenGrow (1 May 2013)

Thanks Tim but I think it's necessary to grow it out of water for a few weeks which unfortunately isn't an option 
 Bit of a technical update as well. 

 Had to drop the lighting as algae starting jumping up! Nightmare. I didn't think that the HG was growing well enough so I pulled a large clump out to split it and it there were stupid amounts if runners coming off it. This mini HG grows in different way than my experience with the dwarf variety. Seems to me that its runners tend to go over the surface of the substrate sometimes? Anyone had any experience with this plant and would like to throw some hints at me?? If so what methods did you use and how quickly did it carpet?? 

Many thanks


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## GreenGrow (16 Jul 2013)

Have made some changes to the tank but am suffering some difficulties and was wondering if I could get some help??

I'm cautious about the EI dosing and I think I have a tendency to put far too much in! The tank is only small and he guide lines on aquarium plant food say to put in 10ml per 50l. This would equate to me putting in roughly 2 ml?? I have been overdosing and could this be a potential reason for algae and such. I know many people say that too many ferts will not cause algae but I'm just wondering as I heard a different opinion from the staff at the green machine. 

My second point I was going to ask about is some of my mini hairgrass is yellowing and not the lush green colour some of the other strands are. Is this an iron deficiency?? 

I've also has several deaths of RCS which is baffling as I've been told that they are bomb proof?!? Any thoughts??

Here's the tank what it looks like now. I have swapped the lights with old LEDs (which had the tank pearling like mad) as I have just started up a new tank which has them on.  

Any help would be greatly appreciated!!!


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## GreenGrow (16 Jul 2013)




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## tim (17 Jul 2013)

Hi ed, excess ferts won't cause algae ime too much light is generally the cause due to the fact it can't be matched with adequate co2 without proving fatal to livestock, as for the cherries it may be down to the increase in temperatures lately causing the on set of bacterial infection.


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## GreenGrow (13 Mar 2015)

Hi there. Looking to sell this set up. Contact me if interested and we can chat. Cheers!!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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