# Stocking sdvice for fish for mid-water/ bottom of the tank



## Onoma1 (10 Aug 2020)

I have a 70cm by 60cm base tank which is 45cms high. It's currently stocked with 10 Royal Blue Emperor Tetra and 7 Rummy Nose Tetra. These tend to spend most of their time in the top section of the tank.   I wondered if anyone had any recommendations for fish for the bottom  section?

Royal Blue Emperor Tetra have a reputation as being fin nippers, however, the ones I have are in a large enough shoal and leave other fish alone. 

It's fairly heavily planted and doesn't have any sand in its so although I would love some Corydoras I know these are are out,   I thought of a pair of Rams, however, haven't kept these before.

I will buy some Otocinclus, however, recognise that they will be mainly nocturnal.


----------



## Melll (10 Aug 2020)

How about Glowlight Tetra, about 20  of them and increase the number of Rummynoses so you have about 20 of those. 😃


----------



## Wookii (10 Aug 2020)

What substrate do you have? Though I understand Cory's like a fine sand substrate, they also appear to be fine with the typical soil substrates found in planted tanks.

I have a shoal of Pygmy Cory's in my tank, and they seem to be fine with my Tropica Soil Powder substrate, though they do spend as much time hanging mid-water as they do on the deck. In my next tank I plan to go with Salt and Pepper Cory's as they apparently stay at the bottom of the tank in more typical Cory behaviour, whilst still being a dwarf species.


----------



## Onoma1 (10 Aug 2020)

Melll said:


> How about Glowlight Tetra, about 20  of them and increase the number of Rummynoses so you have about 20 of those. 😃



Thanks for the rapid response Mell. 

I love Growlights, they were the first fish that I bought.  Brill suggestion! I will need to think through the colour scheme as in this tank the planting leans towards red and orange so I was looking for a bit of a contrast. 

I found the Rummy Noses tended just to swim back and forth next to the front  glass (perhaps confused by the reflection). They have calmed down a bit but are still not particularly relaxing to watch.  Does their behaviour change in a bigger group?


----------



## Onoma1 (10 Aug 2020)

Wookii said:


> What substrate do you have? Though I understand Cory's like a fine sand substrate, they also appear to be fine with the typical soil substrates found in planted tanks.
> 
> I have a shoal of Pygmy Cory's in my tank, and they seem to be fine with my Tropica Soil Powder substrate, though they do spend as much time hanging mid-water as they do on the deck. In my next tank I plan to go with Salt and Pepper Cory's as they apparently stay at the bottom of the tank in more typical Cory behaviour, whilst still being a dwarf species.




I would love some. The soil is ADA Africa as a cap for Velda Lelite Pond Water Lily Soil ( bought on sale at 5 pounds for 10 litres).  I have a soil retainer between the ADA Lelite.  @zozo (I think) used it on an outside tub and it worked well for him so I thought I would give it a go inside. 

Would they be OK in this kind of substrate?


----------



## Melll (10 Aug 2020)

Onoma1 said:


> Does their behaviour change in a bigger group?




I would assume so, I had seven of them and the Discus ate 5  so now I have 2 lonely souls in a tank with my Amano Shrimp who did not get eaten by the Discus


----------



## Wookii (10 Aug 2020)

Onoma1 said:


> I would love some. The soil is ADA Africa as a cap for Velda Lelite Pond Water Lily Soil ( bought on sale at 5 pounds for 10 litres).  I have a soil retainer between the ADA Lelite.  @zozo (I think) used it on an outside tub and it worked well for him so I thought I would give it a go inside.
> 
> Would they be OK in this kind of substrate?



I would have thought they would be fine. @dw1305 is a catfish fan, and should be able to confirm. As I understand it, only coarse/sharp substrates are an issue as they can damage the barbels, Amazonia, like most aquatic soils appears to be fairly round and smooth.


----------



## dw1305 (10 Aug 2020)

Hi all, 





Wookii said:


> I would have thought they would be fine. @dw1305 is a catfish fan, and should be able to confirm. As I understand it, only coarse/sharp substrates are an issue as they can damage the barbels, Amazonia, like most aquatic soils appears to be fairly round and smooth.


I think it should be fine.  A lot of SE Asian fish-keepers keep _Corydoras_ and _Apistogramma_ spp. <"over aquasoils">.

cheers Darrel


----------



## Conort2 (10 Aug 2020)

Wookii said:


> I would have thought they would be fine. @dw1305 is a catfish fan, and should be able to confirm. As I understand it, only coarse/sharp substrates are an issue as they can damage the barbels, Amazonia, like most aquatic soils appears to be fairly round and smooth.


They will be fine, currently keeping my corydoras on it and they still dig around with no issues. However I would still say sand is the best substrate you can give corydoras.

Cheers

Conor


----------



## MirandaB (10 Aug 2020)

Rosy Loaches would be one to consider


----------



## alto (11 Aug 2020)

Onoma1 said:


> I found the Rummy Noses tended just to swim back and forth next to the front glass (perhaps confused by the reflection). They have calmed down a bit but are still not particularly relaxing to watch. Does their behaviour change in a bigger group?


This may depend somewhat on which species of “rummy nose” tetra you have
(Seriously Fish profiles of course (though I think PFK May have also had an article with photos and some behavioural commentary - I’m not a subscriber so don’t know if it’s now a subscription only article or if it was lost in website updates))

Old but still interesting
https://www.seriouslyfish.com/forums/topic/hemigrammus-bleheri/

Note that Asian Farms often list H bleheri as “fire head tetra” rather than “rummy nose”
But it can be confusing as some Farms will ship whichever of the 3 species are on hand - or perhaps whichever the fish catcher bagged up that day  ... obviously once bagged, it’s much more difficult to identify which species

Rummy Nose tetras definitely show better in larger groups, but I also think they are better served in minimum 90cm tank length (though in one of his journals Mark Evans notes that furious un-relaxing activity in his 120cm tank ... they went back to the shop)
They aren’t my favourite fish (that restless activity) as they can be quite nippy as well - even in larger groups (though again this reportedly varies with species) - so be careful of tankmate selection

Any of the emporer tetra sp will be well able to coexist with the rummy’s

Is it the Kerri Blue tetra you have?
https://www.reef2rainforest.com/2020/01/27/blue-kerri-tetras-worth-another-look/


----------



## alto (11 Aug 2020)

Onoma1 said:


> The soil is ADA Africa as a cap for Velda Lelite Pond Water Lily Soil


Not sure I’d add any of the larger Corydoras- Habrosus might be a better choice (though they can be quite secretive)

ADA Africana is much “softer” than Amazonia and prone to “mudding” 


M ramirezi get my vote 
Just take the time to source a decent group 

There are other dwarf cichlids you could consider as well, depending upon water parameters - you may find some locally bred fish through the British Cichlid Association


----------



## JeffK (11 Aug 2020)

alto said:


> Rummy Nose tetras definitely show better in larger groups, but I also think they are better served in minimum 90cm tank length (though in one of his journals Mark Evans notes that furious un-relaxing activity in his 120cm tank ... they went back to the shop)
> They aren’t my favourite fish (that restless activity) as they can be quite nippy as well - even in larger groups (though again this reportedly varies with species) - so be careful of tankmate selection



The restless activity comes from feeling unsafe. They come from very tanned water; Rio Negro and Rio Uaupes. In tanned water, they are very calm, like most tetras.



alto said:


> M ramirezi get my vote
> Just take the time to source a decent group
> 
> There are other dwarf cichlids you could consider as well, depending upon water parameters - you may find some locally bred fish through the British Cichlid Association



I wouldn't recommend keeping Mikrogeophagus (eartheaters) or Apistogramma on anything but sand (or dirt). They need to sift in order to keep their mouths and gils healthy. It's like what toothbrushing is to us.

Same with Corydoras, really. The fish will survive, but probably not thrive.

Is it not possible to add sand as substrate? It really improves your possibilities.


----------



## Onoma1 (12 Aug 2020)

Thanks for all the helpful responses. In the end I went with 10 x Peppered Corydoras.  I understood that they do well in larger groups. If I am mistaken please do let me know and I will split them between two tanks.

After reading the links provided I think the consensus is that they will root around in the aquasoil and will be ok (thank you @Conort2 and Darrrel).  I realise that the tank could become quite dirty in the short term, however  hope that as the soil cap is about two years old and was thoroughly washed before I put it in the tank that this may be ok...keep your fingers crossed!

In the medium term, I am in the process if selling and then moving house and will rescape in a larger tank with sand areas for them.

I wonder if I see any mimetic behavior with the Otocinclus?

@alto they are Kerri Blue tetra. In my larger paludarium  I have successfully created a river bank environment with a dense back wall made of wood, stone and large epyphites. The green neon and embers love it...far too much. They spend most of their time lurking in the background! In this tank I wanted a more open, tank bred fish with a stronger blue colour. The Kerri blue are a delight to watch and are colouring up quite nicely.

@JK1991  and @alto thank you also for the advice on Rummy Nose. These are in soft water with Catappa Leaves and floating plants. The water is tinted, however, not dark. I ordered a larger shoal if fish, however, half were doa.  At the moment they seem to be shoaling with the Kerri blue tetra and seem to have 'relaxed'  slightly.  I can see that they are a fish for a much larger tank. Thanks for the link to the Seriously Fish Site. Its my 'go to' site for fish info after someone on the forum pointed me to it. I think I have Hemigrammus rhodostomus.

In the next larger tank I will go for M ramirezi, however, need to do some 'homework' before buying any. Any links or pointers to info would be appreciated.

Thank you for the advice and comments.


----------



## JeffK (12 Aug 2020)

I think apistogramma.com and the search bar would help you out heaps. Amazing source of info.


----------



## Onoma1 (12 Aug 2020)

Interesting biotope with Rummy Nose Tetras  (or something similar) and Corydorus from the Rio Negro. All I need now is a few hatchet fish and some discus...a larger tank and a lots of sand.


----------



## Melll (12 Aug 2020)

I have just watched that video


----------

