# New Roma 200 journal.



## richard brown (17 May 2018)

Hi everyone!

Today I order my new tank, the Roma 200.

I am keeping all the basic equipment as it is and keeping things as simple as possible.

The plan is to have 90% of the base covered in natural quartz sand with the exception of a small area in the back left corner and around the base area's of some wood I am going to use.
The wood will have microsorum tridents attached to it with some hair grass and maybe bacopa compact or some other easy grower planted sparsely around the parts where the wood goes into the sand, these small area's will have a little bit of plant growth substrate with soil powder on top covered lightly in gravel.

The back left area will have a small planted area but nothing too dense, a few crypts with hygro siamensis behind them to provide an area of cover for the future fish.

I will probably does a small amount of liquid carbon daily mainly as a deterrent to algae, with ferts I will be using tropica specialised but only dosing tiny amounts to start with and adjusting as needed.

Not a lot else for now, although later I will post a picture of the wood I will be using.

Thank you for reading.


----------



## richard brown (17 May 2018)

That is the wood I will be using.

One trident will go at the top of the big arch, the other on the top of the smaller stump on the right.


----------



## richard brown (18 May 2018)

The substrate has arrived, now to wait for fluval to call with a delivery date.


----------



## richard brown (20 May 2018)

Waiting is annoying, too much time to think.

Like the planting....

I am leaning towards all crypts now apart from the ferns, and all in and around the wood.

Some Balasae behind the wood ( a bit of a punt but I will learn something either way), Petchii just in front of the wood, and nevellii in and around the base of wood, maybe some parva too, not sure on that though.

Any thoughts?


----------



## alto (20 May 2018)

Imagine the tank if you should experience "crypt melt"


----------



## richard brown (20 May 2018)

alto said:


> Imagine the tank if you should experience "crypt melt"



well at least it will be limited to only the crypts


----------



## Zeus. (20 May 2018)

richard brown said:


> I will probably does a small amount of liquid carbon daily mainly as a deterrent to algae, with ferts I will be using tropica specialised but only dosing tiny amounts to start with and adjusting as needed.



Better to use the LC to improve plant health not deter algea, plus would be tempted to dose optimal ferts to start off with then when plants are healthy growing you could then try reducing. Plants love you for too much ferts but not enough ferts they suffer release toxins and then the algea starts. So better to aim at too much ferts than not enough.


----------



## richard brown (20 May 2018)

Zeus. said:


> Better to use the LC to improve plant health not deter algea, plus would be tempted to dose optimal ferts to start off with then when plants are healthy growing you could then try reducing. Plants love you for too much ferts but not enough ferts they suffer release toxins and then the algea starts. So better to aim at too much ferts than not enough.



Optimal as in EI or optimal as in what it says on the bottle?


----------



## Zeus. (20 May 2018)

richard brown said:


> Optimal as in EI or optimal as in what it says on the bottle?



Well depends on what ferts your using. If EI then STD EI dose if out of bottle I would dose slightly above what it advises for low tech. After all better to have ferts in excess and healthy plants.


----------



## richard brown (20 May 2018)

Zeus. said:


> Well depends on what ferts your using. If EI then STD EI dose if out of bottle I would dose slightly above what it advises for low tech. After all better to have ferts in excess and healthy plants.



Ok so 3 pumps a day instead of 2 (weekends off)


----------



## richard brown (23 May 2018)

Well the tank and cabinet are coming tomorrow, gonna be another week before I start to set it up though, kids off school for a few days and a bit of painting to do in the living room first.


----------



## richard brown (24 May 2018)

Considering how light the sand I am using is, would you use grey pebbles or darker pebbles?


----------



## alto (24 May 2018)

I'd not looked at the sand photo closely - just be aware that fish can be uncomfortable with such pale substrate & be less active over sand areas, they will also often fade color intensity, so it's important to choose (more) confident fish species

If you watch George Farmer's Shop Aquascape & Tour video there's an aquascape @3.20 with similarly light sand
 - the degree of hardscape & plants offset the lightness of the sand area very nicely
Note how the stone echos the sand shade with lighter cream colours mixed in the grey (for a more natural look)
If you choose darker or unrelated stone (colours), the sharp contrast will be more dramatic with less "flow"


----------



## richard brown (24 May 2018)

alto said:


> I'd not looked at the sand photo closely - just be aware that fish can be uncomfortable with such pale substrate & be less active over sand areas, they will also often fade color intensity, so it's important to choose (more) confident fish species
> 
> If you watch George Farmer's Shop Aquascape & Tour video there's an aquascape @3.20 with similarly light sand
> - the degree of hardscape & plants offset the lightness of the sand area very nicely
> ...



So like this a bit?  https://www.completeaquatics.co.uk/...-for-aquariums/marina-beach-pebbl-2kg-12-18mm

This is the gravel I have: https://www.fishkeeper.co.uk/product/aqua-range-aqua-substrate-gravel-natural-lakeland


----------



## richard brown (25 May 2018)

A few shots of the substrate and hardscape so far.


----------



## alto (25 May 2018)

Looks good so far

I'd add in some larger pieces of rock such as this mixed slate
you can likely find (cheaper) slate at various garden/landscape etc places - the linked stone just has good colors 

All the white sand areas will be a lovely showpiece for algae (ie it will be so much more visible on that sand than other darker coloured areas) so be sure to include some sort of sand sifters; give it a stir at every water change/maintenance - & save extra (sand) for replacing old discolored sand 
You only need a very thin layer of sand unless planted


----------



## richard brown (26 May 2018)

https://www.completeaquatics.co.uk/...-for-aquariums/marina-beach-pebbl-2kg-12-18mm
I have 2 bags of those on order already, the idea is that they are similar in color to the gravel so will hopefully add more detail with larger grains.


----------



## richard brown (26 May 2018)

What is the best way to algae off old stones? I have some pieces of mini landscape rock and tried power washing them but it did not work.


----------



## alto (26 May 2018)

Thin bleach (ie no additives) - I use maybe 250ml/10litres water 
Just soak overnight, rinse thoroughly, then air dry (or treat with Prime etc)


----------



## richard brown (26 May 2018)

With new pebbles


----------



## alto (26 May 2018)

richard brown said:


> https://www.completeaquatics.co.uk/...-for-aquariums/marina-beach-pebbl-2kg-12-18mm
> I have 2 bags of those on order already, the idea is that they are similar in color to the gravel so will hopefully add more detail with larger grains.


As you're going minimal planting, I'd add more height & interest with big stones (rather than small pebbles) or big driftwood


----------



## alto (26 May 2018)

The stone mix looks much better


----------



## richard brown (27 May 2018)

alto said:


> Thin bleach (ie no additives) - I use maybe 250ml/10litres water
> Just soak overnight, rinse thoroughly, then air dry (or treat with Prime etc)



Thank you for that alto, stones are soaking now.


----------



## tam (27 May 2018)

The stones around the wood look great, and good call on the the mix of sizes, but... the larger stones in the sand area look a bit evenly placed and unnatural. It looks like you've spread them out neatly with 2" between each stone  I would tend to keep the bigger ones closer to the centre and let it fade out into the smaller ones. To make them more random, have few in a group, a few scattered - be less even with the spacing - have a few smaller stones near a big one. At the moment none of the scattered stones touch another stone - which makes them look deliberately placed.

Here's a quick photoshop - it's quite a subtle difference but I think makes it look more natural:


----------



## richard brown (28 May 2018)

Plants ordered for Wednesday.

Crypt Petchii x2
Crypt Wendtii Green x2
Crypt Balansae x2
Crypt Nevellii x1
Crypt Lucens x1
Microsorum Trident x2

Also ordered some aquascaper plant food and root capsules.


----------



## richard brown (28 May 2018)

Play time...


----------



## richard brown (28 May 2018)

thoughts?


----------



## richard brown (28 May 2018)

I had a play with it.


----------



## Zeus. (28 May 2018)

Need a pic showing the font ideally straight on so camera/phone is about level with a point central to the length and height plus showing the boundary of the glass tank


----------



## richard brown (28 May 2018)

there ya go, was trying with another big rock on the left.


----------



## richard brown (28 May 2018)

without the big rock

edit: sorry for reflection.


----------



## tam (28 May 2018)

I would say they currently look like something separate/added on circling your main area of interest. You'd want at least one big rock mixed in with the main wood/gravel area, and the gravel to extend out and around any outlying rocks. Branches caught in on rocky area of river makes more natural sense than separate rocks in sand circling branches.


----------



## richard brown (28 May 2018)

How is that?


----------



## Angus (28 May 2018)

A couple nice larger rounded river rocks would top the scape off, looks nice either way.  @richard brown


----------



## tam (28 May 2018)

That's much better - looks great!


----------



## richard brown (29 May 2018)

Thanks for the feedback


----------



## richard brown (29 May 2018)

Question  I was considering flooding the tank today so I can get the equipment sorted and get the temp stable before the plants come tomorrow.

If I wanted to start the cycle too would I need to add a source of ammonia today also or would using water from my current tank and seeding the filter too be ok?


----------



## tam (29 May 2018)

It depends. You can fish-less cycle, which is adding ammonia daily until sufficient bacteria develop to use it up, or you can plant heavily and stock lightly (with seeding the filter from an existing tank big a bonus). The bacteria need something to feed on so also factor in when you plan on adding the fish in. Another option is to run the new filter in your existing tank.


----------



## richard brown (29 May 2018)

tam said:


> It depends. You can fish-less cycle, which is adding ammonia daily until sufficient bacteria develop to use it up, or you can plant heavily and stock lightly (with seeding the filter from an existing tank big a bonus). The bacteria need something to feed on so also factor in when you plan on adding the fish in. Another option is to run the new filter in your existing tank.



So there is no other way apart from either adding ammonia or adding a few fish.


----------



## dw1305 (29 May 2018)

Hi all,





richard brown said:


> If I wanted to start the cycle too would I need to add a source of ammonia today also or would using water from my current tank and seeding the filter too be ok?





richard brown said:


> So there is no other way apart from either adding ammonia or adding a few fish.


You don't ever need to add ammonia, you can just plant the tank. Have a look through <"Bacteria/biological starters">, if you have time the whole thread (and linked threads) are worth reading.   

There aren't many micro-organisms actually in the tank water, but it you take some filter media from your other tank, and squeeze it out (or rinse it if it is sintered glass etc.) and then put your new filter sponge into the mulmy water and swirl it around and you will have effectively seeded the new sponge.  You can also transfer a small amount of substrate from the old tank to the new tank. 

cheers Darrel


----------



## richard brown (29 May 2018)

Thanks Darrel.

Tank filled for now, new sponges and media swirled and left to soak for 2 minutes in water with mulm from old media.

heater sorted, everyhing setup for now till tomorrow.


----------



## richard brown (29 May 2018)

Now to look forward to tomorrow.


----------



## richard brown (30 May 2018)

A bit cloudy this morning.





I am assuming it is because of sand getting shifted from this area by the flow.


----------



## richard brown (30 May 2018)

Planting in progress


----------



## richard brown (30 May 2018)

Now to wait for the fog to clear...


----------



## richard brown (31 May 2018)

Todays weather forecast is slightly less foggy

edit: any tips for getting rid of reflections?


----------



## tam (31 May 2018)

Looks like there might be something nice lurking in the mist!

Wait until night time to take photos and turn all lights off other than the tank.


----------



## alto (31 May 2018)

richard brown said:


> edit: any tips for getting rid of reflections?


No
- they are my Armageddon
OK if you look at tank photo shoots, you'll see the answer  but definitely not practical on a daily basis for tank in a room with lots of ambient light  ..... you can try photos after dark with only light coming from tank

As for the fog in the tank, you can just water change to remove most of the fine particles - this works well IF that is dust from the sand (my guess)
But fog will return if it's bacterial bloom or "green water" ... in which case, ignore it & go about your planned maintenance schedule

You can "treat" bacterial bloom & green water with ultramicro-filtration (think diatomaceous earth filters, very fine particle filters will also assist, as will some UV filters) but it generally resolves over time anyway

Note that the sand etc in water will impact light to plants; bacterial bloom, green water will impact light & oxygen etc levels


----------



## richard brown (31 May 2018)

Thanks for the tips for the reflections.

The fog is slowly going away, I am thinking of rinsing the sponges from the filter in tank water during water change tomorrow incase there is any sand blocking it up at all.


----------



## alto (31 May 2018)

Definitely rinse the filter sponges, you can also add a temporary layer of fine filter floss - this is very cheap & you can just toss at each maintenance - you'll also be able to see if there is a green tint or if it's just sand color residue


----------



## richard brown (31 May 2018)

I will try and get a better picture before bed tonight.


----------



## richard brown (31 May 2018)

They are better pictures.


----------



## richard brown (1 Jun 2018)

Tank clearing up alot this morning, and the fungus on the wood has landed, no diatoms yet though.

I am going to leave updates for the next week and just continue daily water changes etc and let it all settle.

Edit: light is on for 6 hours a day for now, dosing 5ml of aquascaper food a day and 4ml of liquid carbon.


----------



## richard brown (4 Jun 2018)

Hey everyone.

Tank is doing ok.

I know the wood was going to get fungus but is it normal to get it on the glass too?


----------



## leetaylor (11 Jun 2018)

If that were my tank mate i would get a canister filter and external heater along with an inline Co2 reactor (if you are going to be dosing CO2)


----------



## tam (11 Jun 2018)

richard brown said:


> I know the wood was going to get fungus but is it normal to get it on the glass too?



Usually brown diatoms on the glass (and elsewhere) in a new set up - soft, brown fuzz. You can wipe it away and it will usually go by itself as the tank settles


----------



## richard brown (17 Jun 2018)

I added some media from my old tank and am still doing daily water changes.

1 wendtii and some petchii melted but I expected some melt and there is still enough of both left so not a disaster.

I have 1 cockatoo, 6 peppered Cory, 5 oto's, 2 amano shrimp and 9 neon tetra in the tank and all look very happy and active.

The plan is in a few weeks to add more neon tetra, then in a few months add a single angel fish.


----------



## richard brown (27 Jun 2018)

So I discovered that the sponges that come with the U4 are not very good at clearing particles from the water.

I replaced the standard sponges with some external filter pads cut in half on monday and they have been great, I think flow has increased too.

All the fish are doing great too.

Will try to get a picture later or maybe even a video.


----------



## richard brown (24 Mar 2019)

Hey everyone!

Wow, long time with no updates 

What an up and down journey, BBA is my nemesis still, slowly fighting it and holding it back for now.

Decided to do a bit of a rescape, well covered all the sand with gravel and threw root capsules in and planted up alot more of the tank.

A few images, sorry for the bad picture quality though, really bad budget tablet camera 



 

 



The Crypts underneath the big arch melted big time but are very slowly recovering, the tridents grew alot but also attracted alot of BBA, the Balansae is doing good, not growing too high yet but it is doing well with little melt.

The new plants are alot more small crypts, some more Balansae, Hygro polysperma and ludwigia palustris.


----------



## richard brown (4 Apr 2019)

A few more pictures.


----------



## richard brown (1 Jun 2019)

Hey, so the tank is just over a year old now!

Everything is growing really well now, I did remove the arch with the trident on top as it was blocking alot of flow and alot of debris was getting trapped in it despite me giving it a good brush with my hand every other day.

What has happened as a result is the Balansae growing taller and the crypts are recovering much faster, the new plants are all filling in very nicely, I am surprised how well the palustris is growing too.

Also added 2 angelfish last week and they seem very happy with the bushy polysperma and the tall Balansae and they love hunting among the crypts.

It has not all been happy though as I lost the cockatoo a few months ago but apart from that all livestock are very very happy.

I will try and get some decent pictures at some point in the near future.

Thanks for reading.


----------



## alto (1 Jun 2019)

Well if you've still got the trident (or future plants) maybe add some DIY aqua decor as shown by Jurijs mit JS in a recent video (technique applied to a Green Aqua tank - watch their video for that )




second “boosted” tank


----------



## richard brown (24 Jun 2019)

Some pictures from the new phone.


----------



## richard brown (24 Jun 2019)




----------



## Tim Harrison (24 Jun 2019)

Nice healthy looking growth


----------



## alto (25 Jun 2019)

As Tim says 

But I recommend feeding less (start with 20% reduction and see how it goes) - you have some very rotund fish in there 
I’d target an eventual ~50% reduction 
But 
it can be difficult with having more varied species as some are just much more voracious eaters 

 if this comes across as offensive


----------



## richard brown (25 Jun 2019)

I should probably cut back on portion size, I already feed once every 2-3 days.

They are all very greedy though, eat the food I put in for them and then they all tuck into the algae wafer I put in for the oto's.

Thanks for the encouraging comments about plant growth too.


----------



## alto (25 Jun 2019)

richard brown said:


> the algae wafer I put in for the oto's.


that’s probably it 

poor Otos - maybe try feeding them fresh veg instead (red pepper, kale type greens, zucchini etc) - straight up spirulina tabs might be less attractive to the rest (though your Otos might also complain )

You could also look at increasing flow in the tank - can’t recall what filters etc you’re using - as that increase their (fat fishes) exercise 

What are you feeding?


----------



## richard brown (25 Jun 2019)

alto said:


> that’s probably it
> 
> poor Otos - maybe try feeding them fresh veg instead (red pepper, kale type greens, zucchini etc) - straight up spirulina tabs might be less attractive to the rest (though your Otos might also complain )
> 
> ...



Currently feeding flake food supplemented with pellets every now and again.

Could I try feeding the wafer at night?


----------



## Matt @ ScapeEasy (26 Jun 2019)

Yes a night feed could help


----------



## richard brown (7 Jul 2019)

The two Angelfish I got are still actively swimming together, very very little aggression shown, could I assume I have got lucky and have a pair or is it too early to tell?


----------



## alto (7 Jul 2019)

How big are they?
Photo?


----------



## richard brown (10 Jul 2019)

Hard to get them both sideways because they always look at the phone haha


----------



## richard brown (10 Jul 2019)




----------



## richard brown (30 Aug 2019)

Ok so this tank has been stripped down to the substrate as I move to a new adventure.

All the livestock are ok, doing good.

I am planning on getting a pleco and decided to go all out to make the tank suitable for one (or maybe a few depending which one I choose).

Currently eradicating any BBA that I find, mainly on the substrate at the front where plants were not present and on the filter, going well so far I would say 80% of it is turning red so far due to spot dosing liquid carbon with the filter off, once I am happy it has gone I will start building up the hardscape etc.

Going to be going mainly hardscape only, maybe use a trident fern or 2 on some rocks I am making a cave out of, using floaters to diffusse as much light as possible, the 2 pieces of wood I had in the scape have been soaked in a bucket with liquid carbon and water and then given a good spray down to prepare them for reuse.

Thanks to all who read the journal and offered fantastic advice and idea's.


----------



## jonnysutton11 (15 Feb 2020)

Nice little read though this did you keep the original led lights that came with this tank? I'm thinking of buying roma 240 and planting but only mosses cryps vallis and anibias


----------



## richard brown (22 Jun 2020)

jonnysutton11 said:


> Nice little read though this did you keep the original led lights that came with this tank? I'm thinking of buying roma 240 and planting but only mosses cryps vallis and anibias



Sorry but I only just saw this reply  yes still using standard led that came with the tank, still using the u4 too.

The tank is a bit bare plant wise now though as I re-did it to house a pleco, now has a few crypts and nothing else.

The light did fine though as a low tech as you can see from the most recent pictures.


----------

