# CRS and PH



## NeilW (23 Jul 2009)

Finally my tank has matured, sorted my algae issue and have got lovely clear water.  

I intend to get hold of some CRS (any of you guys know the best place online?..) and I know they prefer slightly acidic-neutral water. My local Winchester water however is alkali at PH 8 - 8.5 due to the limestone around here. I knew this before I set up the tank and used ADA Aquasoil Amazonia to compensate but currently this isn't making a difference. 

Two questions; does Aquasoil take a while to work (the PH initially crashed to 6 when it was first set up but currently isn't touching fresh water from a WC), and also if this doesn't work what is the most practical (e.g. cost, how easy, stability) way of lowering PH?

Thanks,
Neil


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## mattyc (24 Jul 2009)

do you run CO2 injection because this will pull the PH down, bog wood also helps bring the ph down,a bit more info on your set up will help you get an answer. 

i have to use an RO filter because i have verry soft acidic water about 4-5 ph which means there are a lot of heavy metals in the water so i filter it to remove the metals. and then i re add minarals to bring the water to my desired ph gh and kh levels

Thanks Matt


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## NeilW (24 Jul 2009)

> do you run CO2 injection because this will pull the PH down, bog wood also helps bring the ph down,a bit more info on your set up will help you get an answer.



Size - 12"x8"x8"/ 12 litre nano
Lighting - single 11w Arcpod currently set to 6 hour photoperiod 
CO2 - 0.5ml EasyCarbo daily 
Filtration - eden 501, 300lph
Fertilisation - 0.25ml TPN+ after every WC (twice weekly)
Substrate - ADA Aquasoil Amazonia, Tropica plant substrate 
Hardscape - Slate, mini landscape rock
Plants - HC cuba, Pogostemon Helferi, Java Moss, Heteranthera zosterifolia
Fish/Inverts - none yet.

Sorry I have also realised I am not telling the full story...

Several weeks ago I added a product called Cuprisorb by Seachem to the filter to remove any traces of copper from the tank, but after this was installed I found out somewhere that it could adversely higher PH which proved to be true after a water test.  The Cuprisorb has been taken out after 2 - 3 weeks of running and I have since done three 50% water changes.  Despite this the PH has remained between 8 - 8.5 (the same as Winchester tap water).

I also put a post on the board at the PFK site and people think that the Cuprisorb has reacted chemically with the Aquasoil, nullifying its PH lowering quality.

As a solution I propose removing 1/3 of the old aquasoil so I don't have to completely rip out my entire aquascape, then replacing with Aquasoil Amazonia II (instead of Amazonia I) which is meant to have an exaggerated effect of lowering PH.  Do you think this will work?

I want to try to avoid having to buy PH buffering liquids, RO water or an RO filter due to cost.


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## Liam (25 Jul 2009)

The Amazonia 2 can be a real pain lots of people including me have had milky water and filter pads full of the broken soil. For a tank that small you could do bottled drinking water most of it has an almost neutral ph, a 5 litre supermarket own brand doesn't cost much, you could mix it with some tap. The other thing is water with a very high KH would take the soil  ages to reach the desired ph.


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## NeilW (25 Jul 2009)

Liam said:
			
		

> For a tank that small you could do bottled drinking water most of it has an almost neutral ph, a 5 litre supermarket own brand doesn't cost much, you could mix it with some tap. The other thing is water with a very high KH would take the soil  ages to reach the desired ph.



This sounds like a great idea, thanks for that!
Sainsbury's (our local supermarket) Caledonian Natural Still Mineral Water 5L - 93p; PH 7.4

Magnesium	6.9mg	-
Potassium	< 1.0mg	-
Sodium	6.60mg	-
Bicarbonate	103.0mg	-
Sulphate	10.6mg	-
Nitrate	< 2.5mg	-
Fluoride	< 0.1mg	-
Chloride	6.4mg	-
Silicate	7.6mg

I think I'll do a water change with that and a touch of tap water (what ratio do you think I should use to tap?)

thanks again,
Neil


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## Liam (26 Jul 2009)

The consensus seems to be that crs like a little KH 1 or 2 and a GH of about 6, I use Hagen African Cichlid Conditioner to get enough GH, it will not raise the pH. You would need to do some testing to get the amounts right. The bottled water is likely not to have enough minerals in it on its own. They can be kept outside these paramaters but they don't do so well with very high pH


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## NeilW (26 Jul 2009)

I did a WC today using the bottled water and got the PH down to 7 - 7.5 .  Ill invest in A KH/GH test kit and I'll look into the conditioner.  Can it be used on its own or does it need another product (in the same way as the alkali/acid buffers?


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## Liam (28 Jul 2009)

It can be used on its own but it won't raise KH so some tap would do that, i.e. if the bottled water does not have enough KH


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