# A 'little' box of chocolates, licorice n allsorts - baby chocco fry



## Alastair

Following on from my soon to be dismantled chocolate puddle A Chocolate Puddle - picture update | UK Aquatic Plant Society I thought id get my follow on journal started in the lead up to my tank arriving. 
This like my other journal won't have any specific planning as to scape etc but will try to keep it looking as nice as possible whilst still staying in the low tech category. 

Details are: 
Tank: 1200x1200x420(h) @12mm thick so roughly about 600 litres
DIY cabinet with design knocked up by aron off here ( thanks mate) 

Substrate:
 original pond aquasoil capped with used Columbo florabase/ Ada Amazonia new and 60 litres of tmc nutrasoil 
I've chosen the specific pond aqua soil as it doesn't contain the lime etc that John innes does so wont make my ph or gh sky high. 

Filtration: 
2 x eheim 2080s with mech rings and alfa grog

Lighting: 
20 x gu10 fixtures using 11w 4000k energy saving bulbs giving me about 1.3 Wpg so nice and low 

Ferts: ill be testing out a range of fetilisers and root tabs out that arent available in the uk yet. Will have more info when they arrive plus some equilibrium to add minerals. 

Fauna: 
my existing chocolate gouramis and licorice gouramis and will be looking to get another 20 chocolate gouramis to add to the group, possibly 30 to make it 40 in total. 
My trusty 3 year old otto 
S.Elegans goby 
Albino cories
7 amano shrimp, 11 crs, and however millions of cherries I find when I've stripped the puddle down. 

I'm aiming to keep ph around 6 so will be filtering through peat aswell which will or may give a slight tinge to the water but should bring out the fish colours much more and adding leaf litter and alder cones however ill see how the soils and leaf litter go at keeping the ph lower first. 

Flora: 
e.tennelus, C.Wendetti, C.wendetti tropica C.parva, cyperus helferi both submerged and emmersed. Bolbitus, microsorum needle Leaf and trident. Anubias and lots of moss. Possibly add E.ocelot red and red tiger lotus for colour and will have some floating H. Luecocephela as the choccos love to hang out under them. 
I'm still unsure about an emmersed section, other than cyperus helferi tucked behind one of the pieces of wood and some trailing pothos I'm not quite sure what or if I'm adding yet. 

There's two very large pieces of bogwood going into it which will come out of the water so will be attempting to have emmersed moss attached to it. 

Ill pop up some pics of the wired and working light unit shortly and am still racking my brains as to how to suspend it as I can't find where the joists are in the ceiling with the floor above having a solid floor laid over it!! 

Thanks for looking so far  





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## Arana

Looking forward to another great journal


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## Nathaniel Whiteside

Yeaahhh boyyy!


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## LondonDragon

Looking forward to this one already  I am sure you going to top the other tank but will be no easy task!


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## Alastair

Arana said:


> Looking forward to another great journal


Thanks buddy  hope so 




LondonDragon said:


> Looking forward to this one already  I am sure you going to top the other tank but will be no easy task!



Thanks Paulo, no pressure then ha ha. 
I agree though I think it's going to be difficult to layout. I was considering placing it smack centre in the room so you can walk round it but I'd lose alot of space. 



Whitey89 said:


> Yeaahhh boyyy!



Said in true Sean of the dead style  


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## Aron_Dip

With the other tank being so good... We are all in for a treat! Will be good to see the steps and progress 


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## Gary Nelson

I will be watching this one, looking forward to some photos now


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## Iain Sutherland

Alastair said:


> I was considering placing it smack centre in the room so you can walk round it but I'd lose alot of space.


 
and big glass lid then youll have the coolest dining table in the world!!


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## martinmjr62

I'm sure it will be another stunner 


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## Danny

Look forward to this, where did you get it made mate, poseidons by any chance? Have you made the light unit yet?


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## Ian Holdich

Good luck with this one al! Can't wait to see it up and running. Hope the filter arrives in one peice!


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## Alastair

Aron_Dip said:


> With the other tank being so good... We are all in for a treat! Will be good to see the steps and progress
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Thanks mate, hope so and thanks for the help with the cabinet plans too mate  



Gary Nelson said:


> I will be watching this one, looking forward to some photos now



Thanks Gary...it's going to be a bit of a challenge but worth it i hope. I wonder if I could sneak a page spread in pfk huh???? I wish lol 



easerthegeezer said:


> and big glass lid then youll have the coolest dining table in the world!!


  don't go putting ideas in my head mate ha ha 



martinmjr62 said:


> I'm sure it will be another stunner
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Thanks Martin  



Danny said:


> Look forward to this, where did you get it made mate, poseidons by any chance? Have you made the light unit yet?



Hi Danny, yeah the tanks being made by Jez so a few weeks off of getting it yet so plenty of time to think and think and think and think about what I'm going to do with it. 
Light unit just needs the edging putting on but not fitting that until I've sorted hanging it from the ceiling so I know the cables are lined correctly etc but ill pop pics up of it in a minute. 



Ian Holdich said:


> Good luck with this one al! Can't wait to see it up and running. Hope the filter arrives in one peice!



Thanks a bunch Ian, me too mate it's just going to feel like forever until the tanks here and ill just have to admire my current fish through toy storage boxes on the dining table lol.


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## Danny

Cant wait mate, your last one was amazing!! I would love a tank that size and have thought about it but it would have to be placed at the top end of the room with enough space to walk around it and would take up quarter of the room lol

It will be good to see his recent work silicone wise  may of missed it but are you having it all optiwhite?


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## Alastair

Danny said:


> Cant wait mate, your last one was amazing!! I would love a tank that size and have thought about it but it would have to be placed at the top end of the room with enough space to walk around it and would take up quarter of the room lol
> 
> It will be good to see his recent work silicone wise  may of missed it but are you having it all optiwhite?



Thanks mate, I really don't want to tear this one down but I'm about to start it this evening....ill feel sick doing it as its just decided to start another mad growth spurt under water.
I know what you mean about taking up room and I was so tempted to go much bigger but I'd be sidestepping round the dining room if I had lol.

The silicone on my last one was really neat and spot on to be honest, so can report back when this new one arrives. 
I'm not bothering with opti white with this one as it bumps up the cost more but also the lighting is a Warmer colour and the added leaf litter would give a tan to the water so no point. Also an 8 year old and a dog walking past etc = scratched tank. 


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## Danny

Sounds like the right idea not having optiwhite then lol, get some pics up of your light unit and cabinet


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## Alastair

Will do shortly. Not of the cabinet as its not completed yet but will add some light pics 


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## Alastair

Well here's a couple of shots of the almost completed light unit, not too bright should give quite a nice effect 










Aaaaand voila the new tank - 




I did say it was a 'little' box of chocolates lol..., not really this will be there temporary home for the next 4 weeks or so along  with all the other shrimp and corys etc. 

I won't be doing this too often though. Dirt tanks are a pita to strip down. good job i have a carpet cleaner. 

Cabinet will be done tomorrow so will stick some pre varnished pics up once its finished 




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## BigTom

Mud castles!


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## Danny

The lights look great, have you tried hanging it from anything to get an idea of the coverage of the bulbs? Think I may have to give it a go myself with the gu10's lol


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## Aron_Dip

As for hanging I'll post them fixings tomorrow mate.. Like the new plant lodge lol


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## Alastair

BigTom said:


> Mud castles!



 I don't know how you had the enthusiasm to rescape yours 3 times Tom, with the amount of mess these make  





Danny said:


> The lights look great, have you tried hanging it from anything to get an idea of the coverage of the bulbs? Think I may have to give it a go myself with the gu10's lol



Not yet mate but will balance it out on 4 dining chairs this evening to see what the overall spread is like 





Aron_Dip said:


> As for hanging I'll post them fixings tomorrow mate.. Like the new plant lodge lol
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk



Cheers mate, ill give them a go once the builders have knocked away the ceiling and re plastered it lol...



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## Alastair

Here you go Danny, it's about 100cm off the floor, pitch black room and only just switched on. The low energy bulbs take about 3 or 4 minutes to reach full brightness and this was when just switched on so I think there pretty good. Enough spread and a nice colour too  




 


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## andyh

Great so far,looking forward to more updates!


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## Danny

That is brilliant mate!! Soooooooo tempted to do one myself..........


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## tim

That is looking good mate shame to see the puddle gone but I'm sure this will be another epic scape mate


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## Ady34

Poor lass, hope your not going to make her stand there permanently!......
Mind you, judging by the last tank, there could definitely be far worse things to have to do with your time


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## sanj

Lol. nice to see the daughter being put to work...

It is looking good, I am impressed. Are they going to have heat sinks of some kind behind them?


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## Westyggx

Ady34 said:


> Poor lass, hope your not going to make her stand there permanently!......
> Mind you, judging by the last tank, there could definitely be far worse things to have to do with your time


 
Haha he had her counting and documenting all the fauna in his puddle over the weekend she does a good job lol.


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## LondonDragon

That is one serious light unit, looking to see how you going to finish it off, why not go LED on the GU10, purchased some for my kitchen the other day and they are just awesome and strong! Purchased the 6W version, at the time they didn't have the 8W    5x GU10 20/38/60 LED 4W/6W High Power Bulbs Lamp Light | eBay


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## Alastair

Westyggx said:


> Haha he had her counting and documenting all the fauna in his puddle over the weekend she does a good job lol.



Ha ha she chose to count them all not me lol. Agreed she did a good job though mate. 



andyh said:


> Great so far,looking forward to more updates!



Thanks andy  will try an update as I progress 




Danny said:


> That is brilliant mate!! Soooooooo tempted to do one myself..........



Well worth it mate, well....I hope so anyway  




tim said:


> That is looking good mate shame to see the puddle gone but I'm sure this will be another epic scape mate



Cheers tim, it was a shame taking down the other tank, I was kind of regretting it but I'm sure the choccos etc will appreciate the wait. Still struggling on a layout for this new one but kind I have an idea 




Ady34 said:


> Poor lass, hope your not going to make her stand there permanently!......
> Mind you, judging by the last tank, there could definitely be far worse things to have to do with your time



Ha ha ha no....she stood as still as she could though as it was only balanced on a piece of 18mn wood and was terrified to let go. Bless. She's very into this new tank though. Wants to help out as much as possible. 





sanj said:


> Lol. nice to see the daughter being put to work...
> 
> It is looking good, I am impressed. Are they going to have heat sinks of some kind behind them?



Lol it didn't come with out a price though  sanj, she was mithering for sweets after. 

I'm pretty chuffed with the light unit so far, it should give a really nice spread and a nice warm glow to the tank. 
I'm not planning on putting any heat sinks behind them, they don't give off huge amounts of heat plus the unit will be left open top so plenty of ventilation. Should be ok shouldn't it?? 



LondonDragon said:


> That is one serious light unit, looking to see how you going to finish it off, why not go LED on the GU10, purchased some for my kitchen the other day and they are just awesome and strong! Purchased the 6W version, at the time they didn't have the 8W    5x GU10 20/38/60 LED 4W/6W High Power Bulbs Lamp Light | eBay



Thanks Paulo, I think it will look even better when suspended from the ceiling. 
Just got to add the frame for the sides and will give them the same finish as the cabinet so it doesn't look odd. 
A few people have mentioned to try LEDs in it, so will get a few to put in to mix up the colour a little and give the rippled effect under water but I got 25 11watt gu10 bulbs for 27 quid so couldn't grumble..... 

Built up the frame last night.....excuse the mess





Only to realise that as the shop didnt have the 3x3 timber, they'd done it in 2x2 so the frame was too small for the panels etc so have to pull it down and go back for 3x3 
Hopefully the cabinet will be built over the weekend. 






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## sanj

Hi,

I am not an expert on building frames, your looks very neat. I was just wondering though, is that the orientation it would be lying in? I am just looking at the top three horizontal panels. They are attached to the frame on their ends and not sitting over  the vertical panels coming up from the floor.  Thinking on the lines of weight bearing, will this be ok?


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## Gill

Looking forward to watching this grow, always a pleasure to watch your tanks.


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## Aron_Dip

sanj said:


> Hi,
> 
> I am not an expert on building frames, your looks very neat. I was just wondering though, is that the orientation it would be lying in? I am just looking at the top three horizontal panels. They are attached to the frame on their ends and not sitting over  the vertical panels coming up from the floor.  Thinking on the lines of weight bearing, will this be ok?



Hi sanj

I helped design the cupboard and it would be better with half lap or mortice  joints but was designed in such a way that a novice could put it together, as Al has little carpentry experience. Each corner will be supporting so will be ok




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## Alastair

sanj said:


> Hi,
> 
> I am not an expert on building frames, your looks very neat. I was just wondering though, is that the orientation it would be lying in? I am just looking at the top three horizontal panels. They are attached to the frame on their ends and not sitting over  the vertical panels coming up from the floor.  Thinking on the lines of weight bearing, will this be ok?



Hi sanj, 
Yes I had thought of that, I'll attach a pic of the initial drawings to show the sides with panels, as these will also be taking some of the weight of the tank not just the frame, but where you see the smaller piece of timber in the centre coming up from the horizontal piece on the bottom, this should add much more stability if I were to also add a piece on either side of the frame if you get me 





@gill, thanks mate. Always appreciate your comments on them too. Hope your well mate as not seen you on for a bit 


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## Danny

Great looking stand but would defo benefit from lap joints


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## sanj

Ah yes, I overlooked that middle piece.

Are you putting on plywood cladding? I can see some cut boards in the background. They look like they have been stained with some sort of varnish or maybe that is the lighting. Is it going to be painted or remain the wood colour?


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## Alastair

sanj said:


> Ah yes, I overlooked that middle piece.
> 
> Are you putting on plywood cladding? I can see some cut boards in the background. They look like they have been stained with some sort of varnish or maybe that is the lighting. Is it going to be painted or remain the wood colour?



Yes mate it's having the 18mm sheets you've spotted at the back, there's actually no stain on them at the moment but they do have some colour to them, I'm just going to use a single coat of varnish to darken it just a little but that's it. I don't want to paint them as would still like to see that grain effect  


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## Little-AL

In for this one, sure to be a stunner!


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## Alastair

Little-AL said:


> In for this one, sure to be a stunner!



Thanks mate, hope so. Cabinet should be done minus varnish tomorrow so it's getting there slowly ( too slow  ) 


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## Alastair

Just a little update on how bad the 2nd new cabinet build has gone, fixed all the frame together and found that the 75mmx75mm is actually 70x70 so bloody panels are too big so couldn't get any further than this as yet and feeling little deflated from it at the moment!! 



Gives an idea of how big the tank will be anyway 


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## Pelagio

Bummer about the setback but Im sure you will work it out.  Its gonna look awesome when its all done.  Do you have permission from the national grid to run that light ?!  You could bring aeroplanes in with that ! LOL


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## Alastair

Pelagio said:


> Bummer about the setback but Im sure you will work it out.  Its gonna look awesome when its all done.  Do you have permission from the national grid to run that light ?!  You could bring aeroplanes in with that ! LOL



Ha ha yeah it does look pretty bright but in person it's not excessive and is classed as low light so shouldn't have any problems. I can raise it anyway if too bright but plan on having lots of floaters. 

And yep cabinets finally together just needs staining now. Big thanks to aron for the advice on fixing the miscut problems. 





So nothing much to add, it's going to be a bit of a slow one this now as no tank for 4 weeks  
, 


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## nayr88

Great journal so far.

The lighting looks really neat, are just standard downlights? Will they be far above the tank? What is the ip rating?

The addition of a good few LED's would be a good shout. The ripple effect an colour would be good even if there not high power lamps.


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## Alastair

nayr88 said:


> Great journal so far.
> 
> The lighting looks really neat, are just standard downlights? Will they be far above the tank? What is the ip rating?
> 
> The addition of a good few LED's would be a good shout. The ripple effect an colour would be good even if there not high power lamps.



Thanks Nayr, I just need to add the frame to the lighting. They are low energy downlight units, and from what I remember as I don't have the boxes now they are only ip20 rated....  
Light unit will be a minimum of about 90cm above the water surface and if it needs raising it should be easy enough to do. 
Agreed on the LEDs I'm going to get a few next month and switch out a couple of the current ones for those. Should give a nice effect under water amongst the leaf litter and wood etc. 


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## Nathaniel Whiteside

Glad your sorted now mate, forgot I read that message the other night 

Cant wait to see it all in situ!


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## Alastair

Whitey89 said:


> Glad your sorted now mate, forgot I read that message the other night
> 
> Cant wait to see it all in situ!



It's ok I don't mind your ignorance mate  ha ha only kidding. 
Me too buddy me too. Just feels a drag, 4 weeks until the tank comes  


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## webworm

Sounds like a great tank. Don't think the floor could take it here.


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## Alastair

webworm said:


> Sounds like a great tank. Don't think the floor could take it here.



I'm quite lucky in that the floor in the dining room under the carpet is concrete  



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## krazypara3165

Can't wait for more updates!  Out of curiosity where do you get the hanging baskets from? And what substrate do you use in tyem as i am really interested in doing this in my discus aquaruim and could you reccomend some easy available plants to use?


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## Little-AL

Nice progress Al! We need the obligatory child on the stand shot for scale though...!


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## Alastair

krazypara3165 said:


> Can't wait for more updates!  Out of curiosity where do you get the hanging baskets from? And what substrate do you use in tyem as i am really interested in doing this in my discus aquaruim and could you reccomend some easy available plants to use?



Thanks mate. 
The hanging baskets are just suction shower caddies off eBay, clear plastic ones at about 2.90 per caddy and substrate wise I just used some hydrogen balls tipped with cat litter and some Ada Amazonia mixed in but found I needed to line the caddies with some plastic mesh as they have finger sized holes in. You can just use tesco cat litter on its own in them. I may have a few caddies spare once I sort the stack of emmersed plants that need to go and fish storage out. 
Easy plants are your typical peace Lilly's, antherium lillies, calathea prayer plant etc. 
not sure ill be having much emmersed in this new one 



Little-AL said:


> Nice progress Al! We need the obligatory child on the stand shot for scale though...!



Thanks AL (sounds strange saying that too lol) i was thinking that but will wait until the tanks on as she wants to site In it before I water test it ha ha 

have added a very light coating of wood stain to it to give it a bit of water protection too this week. 
Will pop up a pic or two of it and also one of the very large pieces of bogwood that's going in, which doesn't seem so big on the stand. Well in person it does I just find the iPhone makes things look smaller. 
Hoping I get lots of money in my birthday cards today to buy some small stones and smaller bits of wood too. 

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## foxfish

Happy birthday mate......


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## Arana

awesome build! great work


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## Little-AL

Is it done yet?


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## Alastair

foxfish said:


> Happy birthday mate......



Thanks mate  



Arana said:


> awesome build! great work



Quite chuffed with it myself really I almost gave up with the mis cutting from the DIY place but persevered in the end lol. 



Little-AL said:


> Is it done yet?



Lol not yet, tank arrives a week Sunday so looking forward to that. 
Here's a couple of pics using my iphone of the stained cabinet and one if the pieces of wood but unsure of which positions look best but will play around with that once the tanks down and substrate in. 










Just a comparison to show the size of the cabinet in relation to the light too 






I'm just hoping the stored plants I have hold out another two weeks if not then its going to be a slow one. 


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## whatok

exciting!


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## sarahtermite

It already looks really impressive - excellent work! And very nice piece of wood - what does it look like placed vertically?


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## malawistu

Is there any news on this yet if you ask me your taking too long  hahaha


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## Alastair

sarahtermite said:


> It already looks really impressive - excellent work! And very nice piece of wood - what does it look like placed vertically?


Thank you, I hope it looks as appealing once it's up and running. I have tried the wood in a few positions but until the substrate is in I can't make my mind up 



malawistu said:


> Is there any news on this yet if you ask me your taking too long  hahaha



 the only news I can give is the tank arrives a week tomorrow that's it lol. The plants I left in a storage tub are doing quite well given they have little if any light. There aren't many so that's on my to do list for plant shopping. Hoping to have as much plants along wiki leaf litter as I can and the fish
In quite quick. 

One question I was pondering on is once the tank has the original pre used substrate in, and filled up with fresh water along with the 100 litres I have stored and two fully cycled filters am I safe to pop in my fish straight away once tanks reached ideal temp. Or shall I slowly drip feed the water from the big tank into the storage to allow fish and shrimp to adjust over a few hours.


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## Iain Sutherland

Better safe than sorry mate, think id be more comfortable drip feeding the storage box.


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## Alastair

easerthegeezer said:


> Better safe than sorry mate, think id be more comfortable drip feeding the storage box.


Yup I was thinking the same too mate. Will do it over the course of a day or two slowly I think. 
The tanks going to look very bare for a while as I'll only be adding slowly to it. I did manage to scrounge some plastic pipework from the Plummer so I can cut that into small sections and put into the substrate at angles for shelter and breeding caves for the paras and shrimp. Might look odd until
 Plants have been added and grown in as the pipes white ha ha


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## malawistu

Id drip feed them too to be safe im quiet looking forward to seeing this develop have you sorted the mounts for the light out yet


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## Gfish

Over the course of a day or two seems excessive. I'd do it over an hour or two and feel very confident.

Things are looking great with the lighting and cabinet! Nice work mate!


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## Alastair

malawistu said:


> Id drip feed them too to be safe im quiet looking forward to seeing this develop have you sorted the mounts for the light out yet


Me too I'm beginning to get excited now I know the tanks here in a week. Lighting wise its being hung from the ceiling so there's no arms sticking up from the back of the cabinet 




Gfish said:


> Over the course of a day or two seems excessive. I'd do it over an hour or two and feel very confident.
> 
> Things are looking great with the lighting and cabinet! Nice work mate!



I was only thinking a day as the new tank will have been set up the same day that's all. I'll do it over a couple of hours then it's just with the fish being as sensitive as they are. Over the course of this week though I will keep replacing some of the storage tub water with treated tap so it brings it up or as close to what the big tank will be once filled


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## Alastair

well the excitement of getting my tank has subsided for Now as its not coming for another week now 

but on a positive note since the crs have been moved to storsge theyve clearly had some barry white evenings as few are buried now as are a few cherrys aswell. just means the toy tub will have to be left running a while to see if any shrimplets appear a few weeks later after the fish have been moved over. 
the light unit will hopefully be suspended from the ceiling later today also. once that is up ok I can then attach the edging to it to hide the wires etc.


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## malawistu

Well that's it think we should all write a letter of complaint  

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## Alastair

just a couple of pictures showing my finished lighting unit, hung and have just finished attaching the frame around the edge. all in all I'm really happy with how it looks. would have prefered the joists to be where I needed them but after a bit of fiddling it's done. 

Untitled by Mr-T-, on Flickr


Untitled by Mr-T-, on Flickr

I like the colour rendition too from the bulbs. not as yellow as I thought they'd be. 
just a week to go now until my tank comes


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## Danny

Looking really good mate, great job on the light unit!


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## Westyggx

What an absolute beast of a tank lol, cant wait to see it next week pal!


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## jack-rythm

MASSIVE! this will look class


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## Ian Holdich

Can't wait to see the tank! Is it coming this weekend?


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## Gary Nelson

What a great build! The light unit looks the business! Looking forward to seeing this come together


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## Iain Sutherland

Very nice build al, it's Going to look great with some glass under it.  
Any ideas on the planting yet? Looks like that wood could hold a few patches of substrate and offer some interesting options.
Some lucky chocos.


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## Alastair

Danny said:


> Looking really good mate, great job on the light unit!


thanks Danny. pretty chuffed with how the light looks now it's finished. 



Westyggx said:


> What an absolute beast of a tank lol, cant wait to see it next week pal!


 i know mate we are going to have some fun carrying it in lol. hope your feeling strong on saturday ha ha 



Ian Holdich said:


> Can't wait to see the tank! Is it coming this weekend?



me neither mate, its next weekend its coming.  this week is going to go very slow lol so I'm spending the time getting all the last bits in, few tubs of tmc nutra soil to top off the old and sort what plants etc.




Gary Nelson said:


> What a great build! The light unit looks the business! Looking forward to seeing this come together



thanks Gary hopefully it will appeal to most lol. can't wait to start. 



jack-rythm said:


> MASSIVE! this will look class



lol thanks jack. wishing I'd gone a little higher tank wise though. 




Iain Sutherland said:


> Very nice build al, it's Going to look great with some glass under it.
> Any ideas on the planting yet? Looks like that wood could hold a few patches of substrate and offer some interesting options.
> Some lucky chocos.



cheers mate. what you mean will look great with glass under it. is already their just has super clarity haha 
plant wise mainly trident, needle leaf, anubias nana, weeding moss and a big carpet of tennelus and M.hirsuta. oh and some crypts around the various bits of wood that will be in


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## AndyFJ

Nice build so far! Even more satisfying when you've got stuck in by designing and constructing it yourself. Arondip showed me this thread, I'm gonna keep an eye on it.looking forward to seeing it up and running.


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## Aron_Dip

Awesome buddy thumbs up to you and who ever designed it ...... lol

But on a serious note I can't wait too see the tank full of life it will be a master peace mate nice one


----------



## Derek Tweedie

That's gonna some size of a tank. Looking forward to this.


----------



## Gfish

That edging on the light unit really transforms it into such a pro job! Well done mate, I love it! 
Don't get carried away whilst waiting for the tank and start varnishing that bit of bogwood though! LoL


----------



## Alastair

AndyFJ said:


> Nice build so far! Even more satisfying when you've got stuck in by designing and constructing it yourself. Arondip showed me this thread, I'm gonna keep an eye on it.looking forward to seeing it up and running.



Thanks Andy, im really pleased with how its coming along.  cant wait to have it running either. its going to be slow though.



Aron_Dip said:


> Awesome buddy thumbs up to you and who ever designed it ...... lol
> 
> But on a serious note I can't wait too see the tank full of life it will be a master peace mate nice one



cheers mate, not sure about masterpiece but the fish should or better be happy lol. Had a night mare levelling the cabinet out today though. dam uneven floor 
just wish I'd gone higher to say 45 cm and not 40 on the tank size.  ah well food for thought when I go bigger next year Lol 



Derek Tweedie said:


> That's gonna some size of a tank. Looking forward to this.



thanks Derek, me too. only 5 days to go 



Gfish said:


> That edging on the light unit really transforms it into such a pro job! Well done mate, I love it!
> Don't get carried away whilst waiting for the tank and start varnishing that bit of bogwood though! LoL



ha ha I won't lol. I'm concentrating on 're soaking the wood again as its dried out again and don't want any floaters.....

I'm liking the light too. the camera doesn't show the true scale of it all. it looks small on the pics. 

also the tank will have to go a week or two with no fish in as I'm adding some fresh tmc nutra soil which will release ammonia spikes so probably better to let that pass don't you think??


----------



## foxfish

Looking fantastic mate although I feel adding a few different spectrum LEDs into the light mix would make a huge, dramatic & contrasting improvement to your present bulbs.


----------



## andyh

Good handy work! The light looks cool. 

Be interesting to see how it performs for you.

Andy


----------



## Alastair

foxfish said:


> Looking fantastic mate although I feel adding a few different spectrum LEDs into the light mix would make a huge, dramatic & contrasting improvement to your present bulbs.



I know mate. I'm still in two minds whether to add in the led bulbs but until the tank is planted and filled I'll not be able to have an idea.


----------



## Alastair

andyh said:


> Good handy work! The light looks cool.
> 
> Be interesting to see how it performs for you.
> 
> Andy



thanks andy. 4 days left and ill soon see how it looks


----------



## George Farmer

Hi Alastair

Brilliant journal so far - five pages and there's still no tank! It's all about the delayed gratification isn't it mate!? 

The light unit looks absolutely great, and a real credit to your skills. 

I'm really excited about the aquascape. Your emergent beauty was incredible, and I'm sure this will be as equally or more impressive still. No pressure. 

I'm going to enjoying watching this journal, for sure.  Keep up the great work!


----------



## Alastair

George Farmer said:


> Hi Alastair
> 
> Brilliant journal so far - five pages and there's still no tank! It's all about the delayed gratification isn't it mate!?
> 
> The light unit looks absolutely great, and a real credit to your skills.
> 
> I'm really excited about the aquascape. Your emergent beauty was incredible, and I'm sure this will be as equally or more impressive still. No pressure.
> 
> I'm going to enjoying watching this journal, for sure.  Keep up the great work!



Hi George thanks mate I'm chuffed it's Had that effect on you so far and it's not even here yet. 

it will be a challenge I know that especially the size but will give me plenty of exoerience for when I go even bigger next year. 

I haven't a clue how I'm going to plant this but will try to keep it open and base the focus on the wood which has now been 're arranged. Not sure about as impressive but can but try.

 I'm trying to get or achieve a balance between having a relatively nice planted layout that looks appealing to people whilst also trying to keep conditions as near as possible to what the fish species I'm keeping will thrive in and hopefully have breeding chocolates and paros.  

still can't decide on if or what I'll do regarding emerged plants either. they May come in a few months down the line. 
ha ha definitely is pressure now lol.


----------



## malawistu

is the tank here yet


----------



## Alastair

malawistu said:


> is the tank here yet



 today around 1 ish 

hope westy's feeling strong ha ha


----------



## dw1305

Hi all,


Alastair said:


> keep conditions as near as possible to what the fish species I'm keeping will thrive in and hopefully have breeding chocolates and paros.


I think breeding is quite important, if you have a look on the "_Parosphromenus Project"_ pages you can see that the situation is fairly desperate in the wild in Sumatra and Borneo:

_Parosphromenus Project: _<Home>.

Cheers Darrel


----------



## BigTom

Hi Alastair,

Just popping in to wish you best of luck as I'll probably be ignoring this thread from now on for fear of overwhelming jealousy


----------



## Ian Holdich

Has it arrived? Has it has it!


----------



## George Farmer

Ian Holdich said:


> Has it arrived? Has it has it!


Of course it has. Why do you think Alastair isn't on the forum?!


----------



## BigTom

He's probably just found out it won't fit through the door and is busy removing a window.


----------



## Ian Holdich

Or a wall.


----------



## Westyggx

Tanks on its way!


----------



## BigTom

Oooooo


----------



## Danny

I think there should be a pic of you in the tank mate to show its size lol


----------



## webworm

Ah, it's the new Ultima Opti White product. So clear you can't even see the joints.


----------



## LondonDragon

webworm said:


> Ah, it's the new Ultima Opti White product. So clear you can't even see the joints.


Great silicone job! Come on photos please!


----------



## Alastair

sorry for not replying sooner. have literally just sat down. will add lots of pics hopefully tonight and tomorrow as I plod on with it.  just want to thank mike for the extra muscle as it was ermm a tad awkward to get in. 

here's a couple of shots of it in place and mike scraping off some silicone and my little girl and friend laying the pond soil base....


Untitled by Mr-T-, on Flickr


Untitled by Mr-T-, on Flickr  

sorry I took so long lol


----------



## Ian Holdich

That thang is massive! You could cultivate a crop of corn in there and feed the family for 6 months...

Can't wait for you to get it filled up!


----------



## BigTom

Hnnng. 

40cm was definitely the right choice.


----------



## Aron_Dip

Awesome buddy looks impressive mate.. Look forward to some more pics and progress


----------



## Westyggx




----------



## Iain Sutherland

good times.


----------



## RynoParsons

That is seriously big. Followig this one for sure. I thought my tank was big at 90x90x40


----------



## Alastair

Ian Holdich said:


> That thang is massive! You could cultivate a crop of corn in there and feed the family for 6 months...
> 
> Can't wait for you to get it filled up!



ha ha I know mate. I'm struggling with planting all this lileaopsis. didntrealise actually how much substrate area there Is to cover. 
have filled the tank up which took a while as I didnt want to blast up the substrate. 
will upload latest pics once I'm home. was shocked before though as I was looking at a piece of floating fissedens which I don't have any of and when I pulled it out a tiny bright white shrimp swam off it. can't find it now but chances of it surviving with the imminent ammonia spike probably aren't big 


BigTom said:


> Hnnng.
> 
> 40cm was definitely the right choice.



definitely agree mate. I think I'd struggle with something deeper. 
ps I know you said your avoiding my journal now through jealousy lol but its all your fault anyway as it was your journal that started me off on this road


----------



## BigTom

More pics now!

PS, what thickness glass did you go for in the end?


----------



## Alastair

BigTom said:


> More pics now!
> 
> PS, what thickness glass did you go for in the end?



ok ill upload the ones from my phone to flickr of the current progress and pop those up. 

i went for 12mm mate. just for piece of mind


----------



## BigTom

Sturdy.

Those braceless aquarium glass thickness calculators always reckon 6 or 8 mm glass is enough for tanks this depth, but I'd be pretty scared below 10mm I think.


----------



## Nathaniel Whiteside

Fantastic Al mate. Bet your well happy with that! Its Huge.


----------



## Derek Tweedie

Just add a heater and a few Hydors and an air pump then you have a hot tub for the kids.


----------



## webworm

Alastair said:


> Details are: Tank: 1200x1200x400(h) @12mm thick so roughly about 570 litres DIY cabinet with design knocked up by aron off here ( thanks mate)


 
Awesome dimensions. Makes me wish we'd gone for a new build not our 1930's semi with suspended wooden floors.


----------



## Alastair

BigTom said:


> Sturdy.
> 
> Those braceless aquarium glass thickness calculators always reckon 6 or 8 mm glass is enough for tanks this depth, but I'd be pretty scared below 10mm I think.



id be terrified of glass that thin on this if it was braceless too. id be making sure my home insurance payments were never missed thats for sure  



Nathaniel Whiteside said:


> Fantastic Al mate. Bet your well happy with that! Its Huge.



totally mate I'm really really happy. I'm glad I didnt go for a 5ftx 5ft or it would have overpowered the room. this is just perfect for the room size. I will go bigger but when I move next year. it is massive in person and a pain having to stand on a chair and stretch across to plant or 're arrange and end up front of t shirt totally soaked. 






Derek Tweedie said:


> Just add a heater and a few Hydors and an air pump then you have a hot tub for the kids.



ha ha my little girl was really heart broken she never got to get in before it got planted. I've promised her some goggles and when its growing in and fish are added she can bob her head under when she feels like it lol.


webworm said:


> Awesome dimensions. Makes me wish we'd gone for a new build not our 1930's semi with suspended wooden floors.



I know the feeling, any other room and I couldn't do it, I was lucky that the kitchen was moved to an extension and the original kitchen and dining room was concreted.


----------



## webworm

Alastair said:


> I know the feeling, any other room and I couldn't do it, I was lucky that the kitchen was moved to an extension and the original kitchen and dining room was concreted.


 
Kitchen / lounge extension when we get that far will have a solid floor. Wouldn't fancy filling the 18" void under the lounge.

Looking forward to the pictures of this progressing.


----------



## Alastair

here's a few pics of the tank and as it stands now. the anubias placement was pretty much mikes work as he enjoyed gluing it on but enjoyed seeing the young lad josh glue his own finger in the most unusual position ever. lucky we had a debond liquid ha ha 

wood with anubias and trident.  still have yet to attach some weeping moss and add more trident 




front view empty 




and how it currently looks now. still have a fair few plantelts of marsilea, lileaopsis and tennelus to add but my back has given up for now. moss still to go in and crypts have been added all around the wood so it will hopefully look good from all sides when they get going.


final bit of planting done today 
Untitled by Mr-T-, on Flickr




I know it doesn't look much at the moment but will hopefully look much more appealing as the weeks go on. I also need to add an edging around the base of the tank.
I will try to get a shot of the teeny little shrimplet when or if I can.


----------



## George Farmer

Looks great, Alastair. Really excited about following this beauty!


----------



## Ady34

Hi Alastair,
looking great, love the way the wood emerges in the centre.
What we need now is photos from each viewable side .... tomorrow will do though, looks like its been a busy day  lol
Cheerio,
Ady.


----------



## hydrophyte

Wow that looks fantastic. I had missed before that this is such a big tank. I really like those proportions.


----------



## Bufo Bill

This is awesome. Love the set up and the planting and bogwood are making me wide-eyed and green with envy.

Your tank looks bigger than my living room.

You are an utter, glorious Cad, and I am insane with jealousy.

All the best from Bill. 


Sent from my iPod touch using Tapatalk


----------



## malawistu




----------



## LondonDragon

Awesome indoor pond  ducks?


----------



## dw1305

Hi all,
Like the Fig (_Ficus __ lyrata_) in the planted/flooded photo, very snazzy. Have you had it long?

cheers Darrel


----------



## BigTom

dw1305 said:


> Hi all,
> Like the Fig (_Ficus __ lyrata_) in the planted/flooded photo, very snazzy. Have you had it long?
> 
> cheers Darrel


 
And will it grow with its feet in water?!


----------



## dw1305

Hi all,


BigTom said:


> And will it grow with its feet in water?!


I think it is a Strangler Fig, so possibly yes. I used to have a large _Ficus benjamina_ (also a "Strangler"), that produced aerial roots into an open-topped galvanised water tank. It had originally been in a very small pot, but as it grew the basal roots were mainly embedded in the concrete floor of the glasshouse, and it it did really well even though it wasn't actually in any potting compost at all.

cheers Darrel


----------



## BigTom

I was out walking last weekend and found a massive old bit of Scots pine in the river which I'm tempted to go back and collect. Definitely sturdy enough to take a big climber of some sort. Bit tempting, but I should really be thesis writing and not messing about in fishtanks.


----------



## Alastair

Bufo Bill said:


> This is awesome. Love the set up and the planting and bogwood are making me wide-eyed and green with envy.
> 
> Your tank looks bigger than my living room.
> 
> You are an utter, glorious Cad, and I am insane with jealousy.
> 
> All the best from Bill.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPod touch using Tapatalk



Thanks bill,  happy you like it. I know it's not much at present but I have an image in my head of what I want it to look like when it all starts to grow in and fill out. 
I really wasn't sure about the wood at first but looks great now and think it will look better with more java trident on it. Thank you for your kind comments.







Ady34 said:


> Hi Alastair,
> looking great, love the way the wood emerges in the centre.
> What we need now is photos from each viewable side .... tomorrow will do though, looks like its been a busy day  lol
> Cheerio,
> Ady.



Cheers Ady,  I will take some shots of all viewable sides but unfortunately can't for about 2 weeks. You'll see why in a minute..




dw1305 said:


> Hi all,
> Like the Fig (_Ficus __ lyrata_) in the planted/flooded photo, very snazzy. Have you had it long?
> 
> cheers Darrel



thanks Darrell.
It's my favourite house plant, I've had it about 6 months now. It loves the sun it gets as the door next to it is south facing and gets refreshed with tank water once a week. Not the fastest grower though but Im hoping as it gets taller it will blend in really nicely with the tank.



BigTom said:


> And will it grow with its feet in water?!



 I did think that when I first saw it but its a wee bit too tall now ha ha. I had a feeling you would ask that lol 



LondonDragon said:


> Awesome indoor pond  ducks?


Paulo i promise that i will go out and buy some plastic ducks and take a photo of them for you. That can be my little girls task however.......

BIG PROBLEM  








And 




I'm gutted. Its got to be stripped down and picked up on Saturday to be taken apart and put back together. I nearly cried but am jot going to take a chance to wait and See if the silicone holds out or not. 

Deflated to say the least


----------



## BigTom

Oh man, that's a bugger. Not long enough curing d'ya think?


----------



## Ady34

Crushing news Alastair.....gutted for you mate. Better safe than sorry though.


----------



## Danny

Really sorry to see that mate, I think it is either the silicone bond is too thin or it was not cured enough. Possibly a combination of the two, I would defo strip it now just in case it does give as that would be even more gutting than just stripping it.


----------



## Alastair

BigTom said:


> Oh man, that's a bugger. Not long enough curing d'ya think?



Not sure mate, the tank had been made over a week before I got it delivered..... :/ 



Ady34 said:


> Crushing news Alastair.....gutted for you mate. Better safe than sorry though.



Yeah that would describe how i feel exactly mate. I'm devastated... I only noticed it looking as bad when the sun was shining on it which is when I took the pictures. You can hardly notice it under normal light. 
I've now got to try and recover 20 litres of brand new tmc nutra soil which was sprinkled on the very top of 70 litres of 12 month old Colombo flora base which has cat litter mixed in with it, and then under all that is 20 litres of pond aqua soil. Havent the foggiest how I'll do that successfully  





Danny said:


> Really sorry to see that mate, I think it is either the silicone bond is too thin or it was not cured enough. Possibly a combination of the two, I would defo strip it now just in case it does give as that would be even more gutting than just stripping it.



Sounds like you know a bit about it. Do you definitely think it would give if left??? Not that I'm taking thatbchance as I'm tearing it all down on Thursday.....


----------



## Danny

Not from aquarium experience but silicone overall mate, I must of done thousands of meters of the stuff lol Although never on an aquarium other than baffles in a sump, that is just what it seems to be.

Cracks like that can only be caused by one of the two ( or both together ) things I said as it is pressure/strain related so just a general statement rather than experience ( aquarium any way ). The guy that made it ( Jev/Jed? ) or what ever his name is will know the cause anyway and be able to stop it happening again next time


----------



## Danny

One thing, I presume the tank was 100% level when full and not happening to have any reason for excess pressure on the side that got the problem?


----------



## tim

I feel your disappointment mate, try to syphon off the nutrasoil even if you have to keep refilling till you get most of it out, real shame buddy


----------



## Alastair

Danny said:


> One thing, I presume the tank was 100% level when full and not happening to have any reason for exces pressure on the side that got the problem?


The water level is only ever so slightly uneven and you would really have to look to notice it plus its not actually on the side where the water level is highest. 
It's on two sides, front left side and rear right side that these splits/ tears appeared. 
He wasn't sure if it was caused possibly by the twisting of the tank getting it in but I really can't see it being that at all plus 4 of us brought it in. That wouldn't cause this. 
But looks like it will be gone two weeks :'(


----------



## Alastair

tim said:


> I feel your disappointment mate, try to syphon off the nutrasoil even if you have to keep refilling till you get most of it out, real shame buddy



Ahh didn't think of that. I'll do that for each separate layer then 
Thanks Tim


----------



## Danny

Even if it was caused by twist it could only happen if the silicone was not cured 100% or was too thin. Better it happened now than when it had all settled in anyway so something to be be kind of happy about ( if that is possible ).


----------



## Alastair

Danny said:


> Even if it was caused by twist it could only happen if the silicone was not cured 100% or was too thin. Better it happened now than when it had all settled in anyway so something to be be kind of happy about ( if that is possible ).



Yeah kind of makes sense that. I'm glad it's happened now though like you say and not two months in when it's all growing in and all fish/shrimp etc are in. I'd have crumbled. 
So in a sense yes mate I'm happy. Sort of lol ( see I'm loling so must be)


----------



## foxfish

That looks quite unusual!
It is difficult to see exactly what is happening, is that water ingressing into voids in the silicone or is the pressure pushing the panes of glass apart & deforming the silicone?


----------



## LondonDragon

Thats sucks mate, but better safe than sorry, you don't want to wake up to a flooded living room! Big job also to sort out all that soil, maybe fill it up next time and leave it for a couple weeks before adding the soil!!


----------



## Alastair

foxfish said:


> That looks quite unusual!
> It is difficult to see exactly what is happening, is that water ingressing into voids in the silicone or is the pressure pushing the panes of glass apart & deforming the silicone?



Hi mate.
When i first saw it i thought it was water in the first shot but when you look closer it appears to look like thebsilicone has come away at those particular spots like it isnt adhering to the edge of the front panel and the same on the second picture but much narrower and they appear almost crack like. 
I could leave it but with the amount of pressure that is being put one the glass how long would before the inevitable happen


----------



## Nathaniel Whiteside

What a Damn shame


----------



## Alastair

LondonDragon said:


> Thats sucks mate, but better safe than sorry, you don't want to wake up to a flooded living room! Big job also to sort out all that soil, maybe fill it up next time and leave it for a couple weeks before adding the soil!!



I know Paulo, I'm truly gutted but also glad. Had the sun not been shining through I might not even have noticed. I was going to fill with nothing else in it but got a little impatient. 
I won't be as eager once it comes back and will leave it a week or so flooded to check then drain and start again. 
The ducks will have to wait mate


----------



## foxfish

Hmm perhaps the glass was not sufficiently de greased... either way it is very bad news for you mate, i really feel for you - God dane!!!


----------



## andyh

Feel for you Alastair. Bad Luck

it did look really cool and i am sure you will have it back up and running very soon. I find each time i do a new scape its better than the last, so just think of this as a practice run.

Andyh


----------



## Alastair

Nathaniel Whiteside said:


> What a Damn shame


Thanks mate.... a blessing in a sense but seriously deflating...i got a nice shot of it tonight before i take it down tomorrow...



foxfish said:


> Hmm perhaps the glass was not sufficiently de greased... either way it is very bad news for you mate, i really feel for you - God dane!!!



My thoughts too. They weren't there when it came as westy was scraping off the bits of excess silicone and he nor I saw it so it's happened as its had the full force of water against it. 
I'm not as down about it now as I know it will be spot on when it comes back....


andyh said:


> Feel for you Alastair. Bad Luck
> 
> it did look really cool and i am sure you will have it back up and running very soon. I find each time i do a new scape its better than the last, so just think of this as a practice run.
> 
> Andyh



Cheers Andy. Glad you liked it. I hope it's not too long before its planted up again but will do the two week empty fill first. 
Yep your right your scapes do get better each time but you have been blessed with green fingers lol.
Unfortunately I don't think all my lileaopsis will survive in the storage tub which I'm gutted about. Got lots cheap off here but to buy that much elsewhere will be bloody expensive


----------



## Nathaniel Whiteside

I blame Westy.


----------



## BigTom

Alastair said:


> Unfortunately I don't think all my lileaopsis will survive in the storage tub which I'm gutted about. Got lots cheap off here but to buy that much elsewhere will be bloody expensive


 
Lileaopsis is pretty tough in my experience. As long as its got some light and a few nutrients I'd expect it be OK floating for a week or two.


----------



## Bufo Bill

I should trust my Jedi instincts more. I felt a great disturbance in the force . . . but I just put it down to the guy infront of me on the bus guffing.

Soz from Bill. 


Sent from my iPod touch using Tapatalk


----------



## George Farmer

Sorry dude.


----------



## Ian Holdich

Don't loose faith mate, it's only gonna be a few more weeks and you can get it going again. You'll be able to get the soil out, it's just a pain. There's A LOT of people waiting for this...don't give up.


----------



## Alastair

Nathaniel Whiteside said:


> I blame Westy.



Ha ha ha  he was articulate with that blade. Very neat. 





BigTom said:


> Lileaopsis is pretty tough in my experience. As long as its got some light and a few nutrients I'd expect it be OK floating for a week or two.



Great thanks tom. Thats a relief then. Was about to look for an alteenative. Ive been lucky too in that the local fish shop can house my big lump of wood in his big tank so i wont needto pull off all the anubias etc. 



Bufo Bill said:


> I should trust my Jedi instincts more. I felt a great disturbance in the force . . . but I just put it down to the guy infront of me on the bus guffing.
> 
> Soz from Bill.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPod touch using Tapatalk



Lol tell me if you feel that again lol. 




George Farmer said:


> Sorry dude.



Thanks mate. Will just have to hog your journal for the next two weeks George


----------



## Alastair

Ian Holdich said:


> Don't loose faith mate, it's only gonna be a few more weeks and you can get it going again. You'll be able to get the soil out, it's just a pain. There's A LOT of people waiting for this...don't give up.



Im holding on mate i really am. Thanks so much matey. I wont give up im just very very deflated and the next 3 weeks will feel like an eternity. 
Won't be giving up, those poor fish have been made to stare at their new home since Saturday that would be cruel lol


----------



## Iain Sutherland

Bad times! 

I foresee good ones to follow soon....


----------



## jack-rythm

Umm very sorry to see   I have had a couple of these problems and I can safely say it's stress/twisting pressure on the overall tank. Maybe the silicone was not left long enough, maybe it hit a bump in transit and budged, maybe it got lifted by the side pane and not the bottom, maybe it twisted from bring carried with water still in the bottom.. I'm assuming the builder did a 48 hour water test.. Really sorry to hear your struggling mate, when it's all set up again drop Me a message and I'll donate u some plants and what ever I have laying around   I think the general reasoning is when glass panes suddenly twist or feel stress when being carried, the weight shifts and the tank fast and precisly twists causing the silicone to tear. I bet the silicon is fine on the inner corners right? It's just torn inbetween the glass joints? It would take a long long long time for it to eventually leak, that's if it ever did (depending on the overall size) I know yours is pretty big so u have done the right thing not continuing. I had this happen on a 300mm cube about a year ago and I still use it in my office today. But that's a very small scale. I wouldn't like to advise you keep it. U have done the right thing mate. It will be back in no time!

Sent from my GT-I9100 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## ian_m

My mate had a similar issue to what you are seeing. He got a tiny leak from the top 1/3 of the silicone on the front of his 3 foot tank. Fixed by applying aquatic silicone from the inside, but a year or two later leaked again same edge but higher up.

Whilst talking to a glazier, he went to a glass shop to see if they could take apart and reseal his tank (they could), the guy explained that this type of failure is due to the bottom of the tank being bowed and placing a shearing force on the top edges of the tank corners. In fact his tank had a leak on one of the back edges as well, but he hadn't noticed. His was front left & back right corner.

The tank had been placed on a small solid wood cupboard unit in his lounge and was originally flat and should have been no problem. However over the years a floor board under one of the cupboard front legs had bowed, as well as the cupboard distorting (side wall bowing out) due to the tank weight. This had caused one corner of the cupboard top to be slightly lower (maybe 0.5cm) than the other corners and it was this bowing that had caused his leak.

Spurred on by this, he built a rather over engineered cupboard (out of 2x4's I think) with a completely flat top. He resealed the leaking tank and that was 12 years ago. I am guessing, as I haven't heard any leaky tank horror stories since then, the tank was fixed.

May I suggest, in the nicest sense, you check you have a flat bottom ? 




Of course your tank could also have been assembled "bowed" and when you placed the tank correctly you are shearing the silicone.


----------



## Deano3

sorry to see mate, looking forward to following this one, dont let it put you down and just get it sorted ASAP, love the size of the tank and cannot wait to see grown in. hate set backs like this 

Dean


----------



## abloomer

Sorry to hear about your problems.....OI the plus side your daughter can now have her picture sat in it when it returns!!!!


----------



## Alastair

Jack that's really kind of you to offer some plants when I get it back thank you mate.....



ian_m said:


> My mate had a similar issue to what you are seeing. He got a tiny leak from the top 1/3 of the silicone on the front of his 3 foot tank. Fixed by applying aquatic silicone from the inside, but a year or two later leaked again same edge but higher up.
> 
> Whilst talking to a glazier, he went to a glass shop to see if they could take apart and reseal his tank (they could), the guy explained that this type of failure is due to the bottom of the tank being bowed and placing a shearing force on the top edges of the tank corners. In fact his tank had a leak on one of the back edges as well, but he hadn't noticed. His was front left & back right corner.
> 
> The tank had been placed on a small solid wood cupboard unit in his lounge and was originally flat and should have been no problem. However over the years a floor board under one of the cupboard front legs had bowed, as well as the cupboard distorting (side wall bowing out) due to the tank weight. This had caused one corner of the cupboard top to be slightly lower (maybe 0.5cm) than the other corners and it was this bowing that had caused his leak.
> 
> Spurred on by this, he built a rather over engineered cupboard (out of 2x4's I think) with a completely flat top. He resealed the leaking tank and that was 12 years ago. I am guessing, as I haven't heard any leaky tank horror stories since then, the tank was fixed.
> 
> May I suggest, in the nicest sense, you check you have a flat bottom ?
> 
> 
> 
> Of course your tank could also have been assembled "bowed" and when you placed the tank correctly you are shearing the silicone.



Could be the latter mate as the cabinet was levelled perfectly flat on all sides when made and I massively over engineered the cabinet ans frame lok but there is an ever so slight gradient to the floor which gives the 3mil water level difference along the front but not enough to cause this I dont think. Some very useful info though thank you 




Deano3 said:


> sorry to see mate, looking forward to following this one, dont let it put you down and just get it sorted ASAP, love the size of the tank and cannot wait to see grown in. hate set backs like this
> 
> Dean



Thanks Dean, me too. I hope it's just the week it's away but if two then so be it. Better safe than sorry.
This is where I feel like getting back into co2 to get things growing faster once its back but I'm being good and staying low tech. 




abloomer said:


> Sorry to hear about your problems.....OI the plus side your daughter can now have her picture sat in it when it returns!!!!



Ha ha yeah she can do. She wants to paddle in it so might let her..... 
Taking it all down tonight and tomorrow for collection Saturday morning


----------



## Alastair

Just an update, tank should be back a week Saturday so will be busy getting it back up and running. However nearly all the substrate was ruined in the stripping process. It ended up a mass of pond soil, Colombo and tmc nutra soil all blended together so looks like I'm going to have to bite the bullet and get 80 litres of fresh tmc soil (cries) and fresh pond soil.
This is what it turned into. Although I might try to  use some of this as a base.


Untitled by Mr-T-, on Flickr

I think if I use this capped the tank will be a tub of brown water though..


----------



## Palm Tree

So could you not use the tmc and pond soil mixture as a base layer then just cap with a tub of tmc, I don't think there would be any problem with that.
If you have the gear for CO2 then why not, surely if you used it for the first couple of months just to get the plants going and bulked up a bit then it would be beneficial.


----------



## BigTom

Definitely worth trying as a base. Could you test some in a tub or something while waiting on the tank to come back?


----------



## Alastair

Palm Tree said:


> So could you not use the tmc and pond soil mixture as a base layer then just cap with a tub of tmc, I don't think there would be any problem with that.
> If you have the gear for CO2 then why not, surely if you used it for the first couple of months just to get the plants going and bulked up a bit then it would be beneficial.



I may use some of this as a base layer yes, but it would take more than one tub to cap an area that's 4ft by 4ft. If I used too little then the soil would seep out into the water. 

Either way I'll be using it all up even if it's only for the house plants


----------



## Alastair

BigTom said:


> Definitely worth trying as a base. Could you test some in a tub or something while waiting on the tank to come back?



Was thinking of that just before mate. I'm not letting it go to waste anyway. I'm wondering if I were to put about 2 centimeters of it down then fill with a little water just enough to cover it then the pond soil would drop down with it being a finer grain. Might get the jug out tomorrow


----------



## sanj

I have missed your thread for a little while. I can imagine that sinking feeling on seeing those silicone marks. At least it will be rectified and only a few days to go. Ditto on re-using some of that subrate as the base. I have done that on some of my tanks before. Shame to waste it, not to mention the £s.


----------



## RynoParsons

Ahw that sucks. Substrate must cost an arm and a leg with that tank. My 3x3ft tank has 9bags of flourite and its not enough to make nice slopes.


----------



## Alastair

sanj said:


> I have missed your thread for a little while. I can imagine that sinking feeling on seeing those silicone marks. At least it will be rectified and only a few days to go. Ditto on re-using some of that subrate as the base. I have done that on some of my tanks before. Shame to waste it, not to mention the £s.


 
Hiya Sanj, yeah massive sinking feeling, even more when i was draining and scooping it all out, on the plus side the hose adapter attached to the carpet cleaner is a bloody good way to suck up every last drop of water from the tank 
just a week and 2 days to go and it will be back. have made some modifications to the cabinet too for peace of mind.
ive decided i will re use as much of the removed substrate as possible, although when u took a scoop out of the holding tub im sure you can imagine what my first words were when i saw the state of it when i took the lid off lol..... two words holy and sssssssugar 

on its own in a glass of water it just wasnt settling, the water was very dirty but a second glass with the same amount in, then topped with an equal amount of cat litter for testing and its kept it down although the water is slightly cloudy so atleast i wont need all new anyway. might just get 5 fresh tubs of tmc nutrasoil and use 30 litre of the previous substrate.



RynoParsons said:


> Ahw that sucks. Substrate must cost an arm and a leg with that tank. My 3x3ft tank has 9bags of flourite and its not enough to make nice slopes.


 
Hiya Ryno, yeah it did suck and still does but im more cheerful as ive had other good news regarding bith this tank and previous tank so concentrating on that now.

But yes, it would work out roughly £240 to re do the substrate again


----------



## RynoParsons

Well atleast something good. Ive also spent about £300 (R3500) on substrate but its not enough. Any way atleast your tank gets repaired.


----------



## Alastair

Thought I'd get updating my journal. Tank has arrived back all fine. Will allow 24 hours for it to adjust to my house temperature before I do a 48 hour fill test. Then will get it all set up again Tuesday evening or Wednesday. 


Untitled by Mr-T-, on Flickr

Kind of went a bit ott on new filtration for this too and just purchased two beastly eheim 2080 filters....OOF!! 
. May have to sell one depending on how much flow I get. Two via spray bars may be overkill but with lily outlets might be ok. 
They should be here Tuesday and all will be ready.


----------



## BigTom

Hurrah! Going to be a long weekend staring at an empty tank...


----------



## Iain Sutherland

BigTom said:


> Hurrah! Going to be a long weekend staring at an empty tank...


soo true lol


----------



## charlie

Looking forward to seeing this develop ...... Again. Good luck.


----------



## Alastair

BigTom said:


> Hurrah! Going to be a long weekend staring at an empty tank...


Going to be a bit longer than a weekend mate, sad news is that the structural seal on one edge just won't keep it's seal. Absolutely gutted. Tank is going back and a new tank has been ordered from AML but will be a 9 week wait :'(  will be couple of centimetres higher too

Nothing against jez work as his tanks have always been great but this tank just didn't want to stay together no matter what. So he offered a full refund. 



charlie said:


> Looking forward to seeing this develop ...... Again. Good luck.



Thanks Charlie. So will I when I eventually get set up....... 
Staring at a cabinet and filters is just pure torture.


----------



## tim

sad news mate  ease your pain setup a high tech nano on the cabinet you could have it grown in in 9 weeks


----------



## Alastair

tim said:


> sad news mate  ease your pain setup a high tech nano on the cabinet you could have it grown in in 9 weeks



Lol thanks tim. Funny you should say that. Im contemplating getting a little nano and putting it in the alcove at the side of the big tank and try to catch all my various shrimp which are akways buried with eggs but think the fish are eating the babies. Will make catching the fish easier too when they go over to the big tank.


----------



## tim

you should go for it al, shrimp tanks are cool


----------



## Alastair

tim said:


> you should go for it al, shrimp tanks are cool



Will keep me occupied until i get a replacement for this


----------



## malawistu

get a little aqua nano 30 or 40 cool little tanks i have a 40 as a marine nano


----------



## BigTom

Ballbags! Come up and have a play with mine if you want, could really use a trim and I'm being neglectful


----------



## Alastair

BigTom said:


> Ballbags! Come up and have a play with mine if you want, could really use a trim and I'm being neglectful



Beg your pardon lol???? Ha ha. If i could get up there mate youd struggle to pull me away from your bucket


----------



## Ady34

Crippling  
Gutted for you mate, as im sure the whole forum will be......
"All good things come to those who wait"
Keep smiling 
Cheerio,
Ady.


----------



## Palm Tree

Alastair said:


> Beg your pardon lol???? Ha ha. If i could get up there mate youd struggle to pull me away from your bucket


Is it just me but does ' If I could get up there mate youd struggle to pull me away from your bucket' sound a bit odd if heard out of context lol. My girlfriend just read it and is in hysterics 
Shame about the tank though


----------



## Aron_Dip

I was looking at these the weekend there pretty cool tbh mate go for it  ..

also gutted to here about your tank mate.. but 2 wrongs will make a right


----------



## BigTom

Haha, oops - I really should have read that back before posting.


----------



## Alastair

Palm Tree said:


> Is it just me but does ' If I could get up there mate youd struggle to pull me away from your bucket' sound a bit odd if heard out of context lol. My girlfriend just read it and is in hysterics
> Shame about the tank though



Haha yeah when you look at what tom put then what I did it looks very off topic ha. Oops. 
And I know. Really bad shame. I'm actually very down but will be ok checking out my other bits that are arriving this week. 



Aron_Dip said:


> I was looking at these the weekend there pretty cool tbh mate go for it  ..
> 
> also gutted to here about your tank mate.. but 2 wrongs will make a right



Definitely mate. Couldn't have said better myself. Just hope it's not longer than 9 weeks to wait


----------



## Alastair

Ady34 said:


> Crippling
> Gutted for you mate, as im sure the whole forum will be......
> "All good things come to those who wait"
> Keep smiling
> Cheerio,
> Ady.



Thanks mate. Encouraging words. I'll keep smiling as I know it Will turn out good in the end...


----------



## Aron_Dip

Alastair said:


> Thanks mate. Encouraging words. I'll keep smiling as I know it Will turn out good in the end...



Or as misses tea pot in beauty and the beast says to bell " it will be alright in the end you'll see "


----------



## Nathaniel Whiteside

Arggh. Sad news mate. Sounds like some sadistic torture! 

Definitely agree with a nano.


----------



## Alastair

Nathaniel Whiteside said:


> Arggh. Sad news mate. Sounds like some sadistic torture!
> 
> Definitely agree with a nano.



Cheers mate. Definitely torture mate i totally agree. Only 9 weeks to go  

On a positive note i can stare at 2 new eheim 2080's for that time and two tmc curved glass outlets from tmc im getting this afternoon. 
Also some good news on the chocolate puddle front but will pop that in that journal to finish it off


----------



## Ady34

Alastair said:


> Also some good news on the chocolate puddle front but will pop that in that journal to finish it off


youve alluded to this a couple of times now.....im intrigued.....an article/feature somewhere perhaps? Give us a clue.....


----------



## Nathaniel Whiteside

Ady34 said:


> youve alluded to this a couple of times now.....im intrigued.....an article/feature somewhere perhaps? Give us a clue.....



True, make it snappy


----------



## charlie

Ady34 said:


> youve alluded to this a couple of times now.....im intrigued.....an article/feature somewhere perhaps? Give us a clue.....


I think Alastair is refering to his other journal , chocolate puddle. I've just checked for updates but none yet.
Charlie


----------



## Ady34

charlie said:


> I think Alastair is refering to his other journal , chocolate puddle. I've just checked for updates but none yet.
> Charlie


yeah, i cant find where he first mentioned something, so thought id ask here


----------



## BigTom

Al you're such an attention seeker; this thread is at 10 pages already with zero content and you're still bumping it


----------



## Alastair

Ady34 said:


> youve alluded to this a couple of times now.....im intrigued.....an article/feature somewhere perhaps? Give us a clue.....



Spot on Ady sorry for the delay replying. Was actually setting up a nano Lol but not mine...
Here's what I was going to put on here but thought it best it stays on the right journal 
A Chocolate Puddle - | Page 15 | UK Aquatic Plant Society



BigTom said:


> Al you're such an attention seeker; this thread is at 10 pages already with zero content and you're still bumping it



Ha ha  it's not intentional honest mate lol. If my tank had decided it was holding water I'd be up and running lol but I do have a bit of content to stick on until 9 weeks time when the new tank arrives... well it's kind of content  

Eye candy 

Untitled by Mr-T-, on Flickr


----------



## Nathaniel Whiteside

MONEYBAGS!


----------



## Alastair

Nathaniel Whiteside said:


> MONEYBAGS!


Lol i wish mate


----------



## brrr

Wow!

I will follow this thread as i'm attempting the same.

Do u have copyright on it? Or can i use a lot of your setup in my tank?


----------



## brrr

What is the hardware running this tank?


----------



## Iain Sutherland

brrr said:


> What is the hardware running this tank?


running it? he wishes  the man is tankless


----------



## brrr

And i answered my own question by looking at the first post of this thread lol!

So what is that thing u filter through to loser pH?


----------



## Alastair

brrr said:


> And i answered my own question by looking at the first post of this thread lol!
> 
> So what is that thing u filter through to loser pH?


You can get the jbl peat pellets that go in your filter that have both a fast acting and long term effect on ph but you can also buy peat balls on ebay but they just sit in the tank. It will tint you water though and can't really use carbon to clear the colour as it counterracts the peat benefits
Most of the specialist plant substrates actively lower ph to a degree but dpends how low you want it


----------



## tim

how much longer you gotta wait now al, gotta be torture, did you get round to setting a nano up mate ?


----------



## Alastair

tim said:


> how much longer you gotta wait now al, gotta be torture, did you get round to setting a nano up mate ?


Too long mate ha ha. No I think about 5 weeks hopefully then 4 weeks when set up before I add my fauna. It is torture though. 
I set a nano up but not at my place it was for a friend. I'm just going to wait until this is up and running before I think of another tank. I'm dreading what an even bigger tank will be like next year.


----------



## BigTom

Alastair said:


> I'm dreading what an even bigger tank will be like next year.


 
My flat just got HMO (Houses of Multiple Occupancy) inspected today... apparently there's now legislation in Edinburgh that shared properties are no longer allowed to have bare solid wood flooring because too much noise travels between flats. So some time in the next month I'm going to have to tear the Bucket down in order to move the tank out of the room for a couple of hours while the lovely wood floor gets covered in what will inevitably be cheap horrible carpet. Ballache.

Just thought that might make you look on the bright side for a bit


----------



## Alastair

BigTom said:


> My flat just got HMO (Houses of Multiple Occupancy) inspected today... apparently there's now legislation in Edinburgh that shared properties are no longer allowed to have bare solid wood flooring because too much noise travels between flats. So some time in the next month I'm going to have to tear the Bucket down in order to move the tank out of the room for a couple of hours while the lovely wood floor gets covered in what will inevitably be cheap horrible carpet. Ballache.
> 
> Just thought that might make you look on the bright side for a bit



That's a joke that is. I don't know how you would have the patience to pull it all down and put it back together again. What a stupid rule. I know local housing associations don't allow wooden flooring in flats above ground floor here in manchester but to have to enforce that where you are just now would pee me right off. Carpet around it? Lol


----------



## BigTom

Yeah sounds like the same rule. All the noise pollution in our tenement comes through the walls anyway, wonder if they're going to carpet them as well.


----------



## Alastair

Just updating,  tank is due in two weeks time which im really looking forward to. Also the female chocolate gourami has eggs in her mouth which is hopefully a good sign. I noticed her dropping one or two last night. 
 The only downside is this long wait has had me spending my tank funds on a new dirt bike/freestyle as I got restless lol.
Oops.


----------



## Steve Smith

Can't wait for the new set up.

On a side note, we linked to this journal from the UKAPS Facebook page the other day, it's had a great response


----------



## Alastair

SteveUK said:


> Can't wait for the new set up.
> 
> On a side note, we linked to this journal from the UKAPS Facebook page the other day, it's had a great response


 

Thanks Steve. i saw the link on facebook but thibk it was to my other journal


----------



## Alastair

just a little update, have just put in my order for replacement plants as the tank is here this week sometime, 
so on the way are
 20 pots of E. Tennelus, 
8 pots of C.Wendtii Green
2 pots C. Wendtii Tropica
Marsilea quadrifolia
Microsorum peteropus trident from tom when i give him the nod thanks mate 
a fair amount of Anubia Nana

and have just got all my replacement Tmc Nutrasoil too as the last lot was totally ruined from the strip down, so 80 litres of substrate plus the pond soil for base layer. 

itchy feet now 




oh and empty pockets boo hoo


----------



## RynoParsons

know the feeling of empty pockets! glad things are progressing.


----------



## Aron_Dip

Alastair said:


> and have just got all my replacement Tmc Nutrasoil too as the last lot was totally ruined from the strip down, so 80 litres of substrate plus the pond soil for base layer.


Do you still want that soil mate??

O and if you have any Trident left ill take first dibs lol


----------



## Alastair

RynoParsons said:


> know the feeling of empty pockets! glad things are progressing.


 
Thanks Ryno. ill be glad when it comes thankfully 



Aron_Dip said:


> Do you still want that soil mate??
> 
> O and if you have any Trident left ill take first dibs lol


 
yeah buddy, drop me a text let me know when to sort it


----------



## Alastair

Tonight (or this morning) ive not been able to sleep much with being a little ill again, so popped down stairs to check on all the new cherry shrimp ive just got as all my others in the main storage tub have vanished for some reason, and noticed a buried female dead on the bottom of the shrimp tub with snails starting supper on her. 
Now id read a while ago about people removing the eggs very carefully from a dead shrimp and trying to hatch them so thought id give it a go. 
Got a small storage tub and placed the female in, and while holding her head with tweezers I gently scraped her sack towards her tail with a spoon to pull the eggs off her. I never realised how well glued the eggs are. 


pic showing the first scrape 





The little bundle of eggs are just below her with a few scattered around.  Not sure if you can see but the eggs all have little black eyes so I assume it will be a matter of days they should hatch if alls well. 
Ive just finished removing all her others and have around 30 plus now. Ive made sure theyre not all around the same spot should any go furry so I can remove affected ones. Ill do daily teeny water changes with tank water using a syringe and hope for the best. Have popped in some moss too. 

Should I transfer any little shrimplets I might see straight into the shrimp tub as soon as possible?  

Sent from my GT-I9305 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## Steve Smith

That's interesting to see Al. Hope they hatch for you


----------



## Alastair

Steve Smith said:


> That's interesting to see Al. Hope they hatch for you



Thanks steve. I hope so too. Keep going back to check on them and all seems well

Sent from my GT-I9305 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## Steve Smith

Mother hen


----------



## Alastair

Steve Smith said:


> Mother hen



 theyll feel like my own if they survive


----------



## MirandaB

Hi Alistair,
Is there any way to rig up a small air pump to move the water around them a bit as when shrimp are carrying eggs they are always fanning their legs to ensure this?
Yours are quite well advanced so you might be in with a chance of hatching these,good luck


----------



## Alastair

MirandaB said:


> Hi Alistair,
> Is there any way to rig up a small air pump to move the water around them a bit as when shrimp are carrying eggs they are always fanning their legs to ensure this?
> Yours are quite well advanced so you might be in with a chance of hatching these,good luck



Hi Miranda 
The tub ive got the eggs in is only tiny so if I popped an air pump in it would become a whirlpool  but I do use the syringe and squirt the water over them gently which turns the eggs. 

Hope im in with a good chance though 

Sent from my GT-I9305 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## tim

Hi al, I had a white pearl shrimp drop some eggs and 2 weeks later babies so you do have a chance of survival, think as you said daily water changes would be the way to go, moss in the container would also be good biofilm for the little ones to graze on in case they aren't visible when first hatched. Good luck with it mate. Looking forward to seeing you with tank  I may have some crypts goin spare if you want them when tanks up n running.


----------



## Alastair

tim said:


> Hi al, I had a white pearl shrimp drop some eggs and 2 weeks later babies so you do have a chance of survival, think as you said daily water changes would be the way to go, moss in the container would also be good biofilm for the little ones to graze on in case they aren't visible when first hatched. Good luck with it mate. Looking forward to seeing you with tank  I may have some crypts goin spare if you want them when tanks up n running.



Hiya mate, thanks for the reassurance. Sounds like im in with a chance of some home reared shrimplets then ha ha. Have got moss in with them and keep checking on them.  Theyre in a warm room too. 

And thank you for the crypts offer that would be great. Its here Wednesday cant wait


----------



## tim

Soon as your ready for them drop me a pm with your address I'll get them in the post mate.


----------



## MirandaB

I bought an egg tumbler after a couple of shrimps ditched their eggs...but then it never happened again so haven't had a chance to try it out


----------



## Alastair

MirandaB said:


> I bought an egg tumbler after a couple of shrimps ditched their eggs...but then it never happened again so haven't had a chance to try it out



I imagine it would save a lot of hassle with the egg tumblr. Ive checked the eggs today and a few have gone white whilst the rest are still yellow. Not sure if the white eggs are going moldy or hatching but have separated them away from the yellow ones for now and still changing some water each day. 

Sent from my GT-I9305 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## Alastair

Tanks not coming till sunday now 
(Bashing my head on the table ) 
Sent from my GT-I9305 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## malawistu

All good things come to those who wait 

Sent from my S lll suing Tapatalk 2


----------



## Alastair

Just a quick question,  im not planning on putting any fish or shrimp in the tank for a while ( a good 4 weeks atleast) but even though the various soils will leech out ammonia, my filters on the tank will have cycled media added to them and I will also squeeze out some media into the tank from my other filters that are running on my storage tubs. 
What are peoples thoughts on how much earlier I could add fauna??? 


Sent from my GT-I9305 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## foxfish

You might be interested to read through this Should I fishless cycle a new planted tank? | UK Aquatic Plant Society there are some radical views in that thread though!!!!!


----------



## BigTom

Alastair said:


> Just a quick question, im not planning on putting any fish or shrimp in the tank for a while ( a good 4 weeks atleast) but even though the various soils will leech out ammonia, my filters on the tank will have cycled media added to them and I will also squeeze out some media into the tank from my other filters that are running on my storage tubs.
> What are peoples thoughts on how much earlier I could add fauna???
> 
> Sent from my GT-I9305 using Tapatalk 2


 
It'll depend on plant biomass and growth and filter efficiency versus how much ammonia is being leached. My gut feeling is that if you plant heavily and chuck a load of floaters in to start up then you should be OK to add livestock quite soon. Have you still got the riparium houseplants in water?


----------



## Alastair

foxfish said:


> You might be interested to read through this Should I fishless cycle a new planted tank? | UK Aquatic Plant Society there are some radical views in that thread though!!!!!


Thanks mate. I was having a read through that before I just saw your post ha ha... 



BigTom said:


> It'll depend on plant biomass and growth and filter efficiency versus how much ammonia is being leached. My gut feeling is that if you plant heavily and chuck a load of floaters in to start up then you should be OK to add livestock quite soon. Have you still got the riparium houseplants in water?



That's what I thought too mate. I started stocking the puddle quite early on but had all the riparium plants in to help mop up any excess ammonia etc. 
Ill be planting as heavy as possible on sunday, with some floaters too along with some Maiden hair fern on the wood with its roots in the water and two whopping filters both with some mature media added to both from the offset. Im not planning on adding anything fauna wise from the offset that's for sure and wont be using test kits but will have a seneye device running on it mainly for temp and ph monitoring but which also shows ammonia.  

The only riparium house plants currently still in water is the pothos which is in with the fish and has gone mental, the others I had to plant up in soil in pots as had no where to keep them in terms of roots in water etc.

Sent from my GT-I9305 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## Bandersnatch

Well was always dropping in and checking your choc puddle before, so I'm going to be following this thread.
Nightmare though its been, I think you're going to have a great tank when its up and running.


----------



## Alastair

Bandersnatch said:


> Well was always dropping in and checking your choc puddle before, so I'm going to be following this thread.
> Nightmare though its been, I think you're going to have a great tank when its up and running.



Hi bandersnatch, 
Glad you liked the puddle and really appreciate your interest in this one too thank you. 

Its been a huge nightmare and ended up a massive drain in funds but ive got a good feeling its on and upwards this time round. .... or up and onwards which ever the saying is. Tomorrow is going to be a fun day.  Over 200+ plantlets of tennelus to plant amongst other plants. 

Sent from my GT-I9305 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## MirandaB

Are we going to get pics Alastair and are you drafting the kids in to help


----------



## Alastair

MirandaB said:


> Are we going to get pics Alastair and are you drafting the kids in to help



Ha ha yeah ill be sticking up pics through the day and not sure who im getting to help. Might just be me  
Got plenty of muscle to help with the bringing in etc though but thats the down side of living alone. No extra hands. Depends if the little one is feeling helpful lol 

Sent from my GT-I9305 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## tim

Hope all goes well for you today mate


----------



## Aron_Dip

Looking forward to it again mate, hope all goes well


----------



## Claire

Hope everything goes smoothly this time! Will be stunning once it's up and running.


----------



## BigTom

Don't drop it!


----------



## Alastair

tim said:


> Hope all goes well for you today mate


 Thanks mate. Me too.  


Aron_Dip said:


> Looking forward to it again mate, hope all goes well


 lol emphasize the 'again' bit lol. 


Claire said:


> Hope everything goes smoothly this time! Will be stunning once it's up and running.


 aww thanks claire. Hopefully ill have it looking semi decent bu the end of the day.
 Its here now just doing a fill test courtesy of my little helper

Tanks really good quality. Pic makes it look very blue though :/ 




Sent from my GT-I9305 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## faizal

Hi Alastair I'm sure you are going to be very busy today. Have a great time with it mate !!! Looking forward to this planted.


----------



## Iain Sutherland

paddling pools in, now wheres the aquarium 
have fun with it pal, we wait months/years (longer for some  ) to get our hands dirty with a new tank and rescape so be sure to pop open a beer and embrace every leaking pipe, floating wood and wobbly stone.


----------



## DrRob

Here's to a fresh start and a clean run this time.

Well, I say clean. I mean muddy.


----------



## Alastair

faizal said:


> Hi Alastair I'm sure you are going to be very busy today. Have a great time with it mate !!! Looking forward to this planted.



Thanks faizal.  Ten hours straight with out sitting down. My back had had enough after so long.  Very enjoyable though im happy as it is at present. Planted up as much as can do today. 


Iain Sutherland said:


> paddling pools in, now wheres the aquarium
> have fun with it pal, we wait months/years (longer for some  ) to get our hands dirty with a new tank and rescape so be sure to pop open a beer and embrace every leaking pipe, floating wood and wobbly stone.


.ha ha thanks mate. I really wanted to run to the pound shopband get some plastic ducks to float on it just for a comical shot but didnt want to get distracted.  It does seem huge compared to the last one.  . Im going to enjoy a very nice freezing cold beer when its finished mate. Sticking up a couple of pics tonight and the rest tomorrow when I charge the decent camera  



DrRob said:


> Here's to a fresh start and a clean run this time.
> 
> Well, I say clean. I mean muddy.



Touch wood no muddy mess  

Putting down the base soil with a small cap and lots of free ada additives I was given... 


Untitled by Mr-T-, on Flickr


Untitled by Mr-T-, on Flickr my helper giving a pose


Untitled by Mr-T-, on Flickr

Topping off 


Untitled by Mr-T-, on Flickr

And a little planted section on the wood with invitro hygro pinnatifida just to see how it works.


Untitled by Mr-T-, on Flickr

I did do most of the stuff but just happened to be behind the camera on these shots lol 

Ive got all the wood planted up and all the copies amounts of tennelus are in too. Hopefully will be able to get some better pics tomorrow when its all done. 

I Also will have a full new range of fertilisers and root tabs ive been sent out to test that arent available over here yet so will pop pics up and give the lowdown on those too. They look very promising. Quite excited to try them. Might have fair bit spare too if anyone's interested as was sent lots.

Thanks for the encouraging comments everyone


----------



## livewire

Looking great so far.

If you do end up with any spare root tabs/ferts I would love to give them a go


----------



## Lee Starkie

I've just read your journals, the chocolate puddle was brilliant, really liked that, sorry for your troubles with this current one but things looking up now!, ill be following this closely


----------



## Monk d'Wally de Honk

Very nice.


----------



## Nutty

bet you thought the day would never come!!

was the "new" ferts a  pack of digestive biscuits?


----------



## MirandaB

Looking superb already Alistair  don't make your public wait to long for update pics!  
Good to see the digestive biscuits took a hammering,got to keep your strength up


----------



## Alastair

livewire said:


> Looking great so far.
> 
> If you do end up with any spare root tabs/ferts I would love to give them a go


Absolutely mate, ill send you some if you like.....


Lee Starkie said:


> I've just read your journals, the chocolate puddle was brilliant, really liked that, sorry for your troubles with this current one but things looking up now!, ill be following this closely


 
Thanks Lee, fingers crossed this will allllllll be trouble free 


Monk d'Wally de Honk said:


> Very nice.


Thanks monk 



Nutty said:


> bet you thought the day would never come!!
> 
> was the "new" ferts a pack of digestive biscuits?


 well it seemed that way mate, its been a very long few months ill be glad when the fish finally get their reward for being cooped up in the tubs. 3 times theyve seen their prospective new home ha ha. the biscuits were definitely my source of food for the whole day, and i never eat them normally. i owe my little girl a pack of biscuits...oops



MirandaB said:


> Looking superb already Alistair  don't make your public wait to long for update pics!
> Good to see the digestive biscuits took a hammering,got to keep your strength up


 
Glad you think so miranda, i certainly wont ill be throwing up some pics right about ............now!!


----------



## Alastair

heres a few pictures i took today with my camera. i need to work out all the settings on it so it doesnt look dark etc so looks like i need to have a read through the photography section to work it all out.

looks a bit untidy at present but need to trim off the roots of the anubias..

and i also need to put some beading around the base to hide the unsightly polystyrene i had to put undr for guarantee purposes.



DSC00739 by Mr-T-, on Flickr


DSC00750 by Mr-T-, on Flickr






DSC00751 by Mr-T-, on Flickr
DSC00749 by Mr-T-, on Flickr

and the hygro pinnitifida in a planted section on the wood


DSC00758 by Mr-T-, on Flickr


----------



## Steve Smith

Great Work Alastair!


----------



## BigTom

Lovely. Is that all _E. tenellus_ around the edges? Hope it stays small for you, mine got to about 40cm long


----------



## RynoParsons

bliksem. love that. wish i cpild have scaped my cube like that


----------



## Nutty

looks great! will look brilliant when its grown in!

the fish will thinking they're going back into a lake not a tank!


----------



## MirandaB

I'm gobsmacked it looks great now but will be stunning when it's grown in.....and that's a cracking bit of wood!!!!
Is that a maidenhair fern on it?#
Why can't we have a "love it" icon because "like" does not do this justice


----------



## Ady34

Bet your chuffed to bits to have it all up and running mate....and dare I say a touch relieved!
Looks great and will be an incredible new home for your fish.
Really looking forward to following this journey now and I'm sure your patience will be rewarded.
Cheerio,
Ady.


----------



## faizal

Yeah and the tank looks so huge. The sense of depth is amazing. Nice one Alastair. The emmersed growth at the centre of the tank adds an attractive touch to the whole scape too.


----------



## faizal

How long is your photoperiod?


----------



## Ian Holdich

This will be yet another stunner when grown in! Well done mate.


----------



## tim

Stunning mate really well executed, been such a long wait for you, glad all has gone well, do you still plan to go even bigger next year ? Looking forward to livestock pics once they've settled in.


----------



## Alastair

Steve Smith said:


> Great Work Alastair!


 Cheers steve 


BigTom said:


> Lovely. Is that all _E. tenellus_ around the edges? Hope it stays small for you, mine got to about 40cm long


Yes mate. Its the invitro tennelus from freshwater shrimp.  There was heaps of it I was shocked. Its only small at the minute mate so might double in size. There's some fully grown in their too. 



RynoParsons said:


> bliksem. love that. wish i cpild have scaped my cube like that


Thanks ryno. Im hoping it will grow into what i envisage so looks a little untidy at present though. Much clearer today after a nice 50 percent water change which I did not enjoy ha ha. 


Nutty said:


> looks great! will look brilliant when its grown in!
> 
> the fish will thinking they're going back into a lake not a tank!



Thanks nutty. This is why I miss co2 and the increased growth but im settled with the slower growth for now. 
.I think the fish have been seriously punished having to stare at this lol 



MirandaB said:


> I'm gobsmacked it looks great now but will be stunning when it's grown in.....and that's a cracking bit of wood!!!!
> Is that a maidenhair fern on it?#
> Why can't we have a "love it" icon because "like" does not do this justice


Wow thanks miranda. Certainly makes it very rewarding if that's the reaction it has. 


It certainly is maidenhair fern. Got it from sanj on here. Some of the roots are in the water so im hoping it takes well. Should do. 




Ady34 said:


> Bet your chuffed to bits to have it all up and running mate....and dare I say a touch relieved!
> Looks great and will be an incredible new home for your fish.
> Really looking forward to following this journey now and I'm sure your patience will be rewarded.
> Cheerio,
> Ady.



Oh yeah definitely mate. I feel much much happier now it's here. Looks even better now its clear.  The lights are getting brighter too. They never had more than 3 hours continuous use. 
Thanks mate. Who'd have thought a delayed tank can depress you so much ha. Hope it continues to improve and go how I see it looking in 3 or 4 months. Im itching to put shrimp in but must resist lol 



faizal said:


> Yeah and the tank looks so huge. The sense of depth is amazing. Nice one Alastair. The emmersed growth at the centre of the tank adds an attractive touch to the whole scape too.



Hiya faizal. That's one thing I was worried about was that I'd lose the depth but its turned out quite well. The first time with the initial tank didn't look as well but ive raised the substrate slightly higher where the wood is too. 
The emmersed shot has to be my favourite part at the moment.  



faizal said:


> How long is your photoperiod?


Im just running 5 hours a day at the minute, then will up it to 6 after 2 weeks then up to 7 and a half to 8 after 2 months when its taking off. 



Ian Holdich said:


> This will be yet another stunner when grown in! Well done mate.



Cheers ian. Thanks for that. Feel like a bit of pressure is on me now lol .



tim said:


> Stunning mate really well executed, been such a long wait for you, glad all has gone well, do you still plan to go even bigger next year ? Looking forward to livestock pics once they've settled in.



Hiya tim. A very long wait yes lol.  Glad its finally here. Does it seem wrong im spending hours staring at an empty ish tank each evening???? There's no fish in it yet.  
Thats going to be my favourite bit.  Adding the fish and shrimp over a couple of weeks. Im tempted to slowly add shrimp around 3 weeks time.  

Yes im planning or will should I say be going bigger next year.  6ft all round and 50 or 60 cm high but think it will possibly need bracing which I dont fancy.  

Thanks everyone for your comments so far


----------



## MirandaB

What temperature do you have this at Alistair,could only see one heater and just wondered how you heat something like this?


----------



## Alastair

MirandaB said:


> What temperature do you have this at Alistair,could only see one heater and just wondered how you heat something like this?



Hiya.
Its kept at a consistent 26 degrees Celsius.  Your right its only got the one 300w heater but its one of the eheim jagers which are rated to heat tanks significantly bigger than other 300watts.  This can heat tanks up to 1000 litres.  I have a spare fluval e300 on hand in case it struggles during winter but the temp hasnt dropped since it reached its setting. Its a big heater too.


----------



## MirandaB

Alastair said:


> Hiya.
> Its kept at a consistent 26 degrees Celsius. Your right its only got the one 300w heater but its one of the eheim jagers which are rated to heat tanks significantly bigger than other 300watts. This can heat tanks up to 1000 litres. I have a spare fluval e300 on hand in case it struggles during winter but the temp hasnt dropped since it reached its setting. Its a big heater too.


That's a big heater lol your electric company's going to be rubbing their hands


----------



## Bandersnatch

Always like the pictures of tanks when it has its test fill and its just a expanse of blue seems like it has so many possibilities.
Looks like its going to be a great tank nows its pplanted as well though, going to be fun seeing something like this grow in.


----------



## hydrophyte

This is top notch! It will look fantastic as it grows in.



Alastair said:


> DSC00750 by Mr-T-, on Flickr


----------



## Alastair

MirandaB said:


> That's a big heater lol your electric company's going to be rubbing their hands


Lol to be honest it doesnt kick in that much really but imagine when the room temp drops it will start too. 



Bandersnatch said:


> Always like the pictures of tanks when it has its test fill and its just a expanse of blue seems like it has so many possibilities.
> Looks like its going to be a great tank nows its pplanted as well though, going to be fun seeing something like this grow in.



Thanks mate. Only down side is low tech - slow growth. I need the tennelus to root in before I go adding my corys. 



hydrophyte said:


> This is top notch! It will look fantastic as it grows in.



Hey hydro thanks mate. That's one of my favourite shots yet. 
.just to add, I stained and fitted some edging to hide the double glass base and the unsightly polystyrene base yesterday. Im quite happy with how it looks. Also the tank has beem cycling really quickly.  

Quick phone pic with edging on


----------



## faizal

Sorry Alastair but I remember you saying that the e. tennellus were invitro ones. Does that mean their leaves are of emmersed form? I wish you had access to a PAR meter so that you could share the substrate PAR levels in this tank. I am loving the progress. I like the edging work that you've done on it. It looks very neat. The tank also looks like it's getting a lot of the outdoor light from this picture.

How long do you think it will take before the rooting of the e. tennellus occurs?


----------



## Aron_Dip

Looking awesome mate, trim sets it of a treat. Really looking forward to this in a few months time and happy you've finally got back on track


----------



## Alastair

faizal said:


> Sorry Alastair but I remember you saying that the e. tennellus were invitro ones. Does that mean their leaves are of emmersed form? I wish you had access to a PAR meter so that you could share the substrate PAR levels in this tank. I am loving the progress. I like the edging work that you've done on it. It looks very neat. The tank also looks like it's getting a lot of the outdoor light from this picture.
> 
> How long do you think it will take before the rooting of the e. tennellus occurs?



Umm yes mate the leaves are emmersed and pretty small but you get such a massive amount in one pot. Ive also got some submersed tennelus which is throwing out runners but the invitro I reckon would take a couple of weeks so my corys will be last to go in. The nutra soil seems lighter than amazonia so dont want to risk plants floating uo from them scouring the substrate as I feed banana worms ane the corys dig for those

The tank is next to a south facing door so does get some light in but it only seems that bright as the back door and net curtain were open

Ive also got a seneye device which I need to set up and its the one that also measures par readings so once my desktop comes back from dell I can pop up some readings if you like 



Aron_Dip said:


> Looking awesome mate, trim sets it of a treat. Really looking forward to this in a few months time and happy you've finally got back on track



Cheers mate. Its looking good now just having a problem with a little film appearing an hour or so after each water change so may invest in one of the water skimmers fron eheim which attaches to the intake. 

Just got some beading for the base board too 

Sent from my GT-I9305 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## George Farmer

Top set up, top scape, all done by a top bloke. Well done mate.


----------



## faizal

Cheers Alastair  . It would be great to get an idea on the substrate PAR levels. But please no hurries mate. Take your own time.I am just curious about your lighting levels. I loved the growth you had in " A Chocolate Puddle". I hope you get the same thing out of this tank too. Keeping up with your tank closely,...always.


----------



## aliclarke86

i'm curious about the original aqua soil used as a base layer, does this work as a slow release for nutrients? i ask because you are also using a few other planted aquarium specific substrates as well and these also have nutrients in them do they not?


----------



## Iain Sutherland

Alastair said:


> Cheers mate. Its looking good now just having a problem with a little film appearing an hour or so after each water change so may invest in one of the water skimmers fron eheim which attaches to the intake.
> 
> Sent from my GT-I9305 using Tapatalk 2



The little skimmers are great al but you do need to wrap a little stainless mesh around the intake or it will gobble up CRS


----------



## Alastair

George Farmer said:


> Top set up, top scape, all done by a top bloke. Well done mate.



Cheers george thats some pretty big encouragement their for me to try my best with this one then. Really appreciate that thanks mate



faizal said:


> Cheers Alastair  . It would be great to get an idea on the substrate PAR levels. But please no hurries mate. Take your own time.I am just curious about your lighting levels. I loved the growth you had in " A Chocolate Puddle". I hope you get the same thing out of this tank too. Keeping up with your tank closely,...always.



Not a problem faizel. As soon as i can link it up ill let you know the readings. Theyll be no where near the readings from the puddle as I used a ati sun power on that one but this self build seems pretty good from apoearance but im curious myself too esoecially with only using low energy gu10 bulbs.  




aliclarke86 said:


> i'm curious about the original aqua soil used as a base layer, does this work as a slow release for nutrients? i ask because you are also using a few other planted aquarium specific substrates as well and these also have nutrients in them do they not?



Hiya,  .
Yes it works partly as a slow release for nutrients that's one of the reasons but also it goes through a process where it decomposes and produces carbon which is taken up by the roots of the plants. Also the pond soil doesnt contain the same level of nutrients as john innes etc. Its less. 
 The other specific plant substrate does provide nutrients whilst helping to keep ph low but is l mainly aesthetic. I prefer the small round grains compared to sand etc.. 



Iain Sutherland said:


> The little skimmers are great al but you do need to wrap a little stainless mesh around the intake or it will gobble up CRS



Cheers mate. I was also looking at the powered eheim skimmers too but will wait and see how it goes as it doesn't look too bad today. I've raised the lily pipe outlet a little today too to see if that helps.  

Sent from my GT-I9305 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## Alastair

Just been doing a water change today and noticed this little guy. Im boggled as to how it's in their 





Hope it survives though just so I can see what it is 

Sent from my GT-I9305 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## Andy Thurston

Where? Under leaf? Or up and right of heater? Its hard to see on phone
Nice tank by the way


----------



## Alastair

Big clown said:


> Where? Under leaf? Or up and right of heater? Its hard to see on phone
> Nice tank by the way



Thanks mate.  Up and right of the heater. Clueless how it got there 

Sent from my GT-I9305 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## Andy Thurston

Itll be fine as long as it steers clear of filter and water change pipe. It probably hitch hiked on one of the plants. If youve got a mature filter spare stick it in to help with any ammonia. Id be much more worried if you had john ines or similar in there. I dont think aqua soil will be as bad for ammonia. 
Youll have to call it something daft like 'freddy fry' of 'billy the fish'


----------



## Alastair

Big clown said:


> Itll be fine as long as it steers clear of filter and water change pipe. It probably hitch hiked on one of the plants. If youve got a mature filter spare stick it in to help with any ammonia. Id be much more worried if you had john ines or similar in there. I dont think aqua soil will be as bad for ammonia.
> Youll have to call it something daft like 'freddy fry' of 'billy the fish'



It seems ok anyway.  Ive knocked the flow down on the filter a little. Its full of mature media from other filters anyway and I have tested the water for ammonia and the filter is mopping it all up well. I never test water for ammonia etc but have with this and 3 days ago I had no ammonia a little nitrite and nitrate and today no nitrite and some nitrate so big water change again and In went all my shrimp  

Sent from my GT-I9305 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## Nutty

well that's just tiny! have you managed to figure out how it go in there?


----------



## sanj

Alastair said:


> ust been doing a water change today and noticed this little guy. Im boggled as to how it's in their  Hope it survives though just so I can see what it is


 
Oops sorry Alistair, I just got your mail and yes I believe the fry are rainbowfish from the plants I sent you.

I think it is most likely either; Melanotaenia inornata "Coomalie Crator" or Pseudomugil sp. Aru II

They were in the breeding tank where I was holding your plants. However if it is from the main tank where the plants originally came from then it could be any of half a dozen rainbow species or even a hybrid.

The tank looks really good, the maidenhair should start to throw up new fronds soon if it hasnt already started. I cut my main plant back like yours and new fronds are growing up already.


----------



## DanMac

Alastair said:


> Just been doing a water change today and noticed this little guy. Im boggled as to how it's in their
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hope it survives though just so I can see what it is
> 
> Sent from my GT-I9305 using Tapatalk 2


 


haha, I looked in my tank yesterday and saw a tiny brown thing moving with the current then it sank to the bottom, when i went to take it out a few hours later it moved slightly and i thought "did that thing just move?"

turns out i have 2 tiny baby snails lol, no idea how they got there, maybe they were on one of the pieces of moss I bought..maybe as eggs.

gonna leave them for now then get rid of them when they get bigger.


----------



## faizal

God,..I love low tech tanks.  Don't worry Alastair,...you've just given that little fella an awesome home. He/She is gonna love living in it to bits.


----------



## foxfish

Looks great, I would still be tempted to change a couple of your bulbs to LEDs though!
Perhaps a couple of blue ones to give a nice blue shimmer effect.


----------



## Alastair

sanj said:


> Oops sorry Alistair, I just got your mail and yes I believe the fry are rainbowfish from the plants I sent you.
> 
> I think it is most likely either; Melanotaenia inornata "Coomalie Crator" or Pseudomugil sp. Aru II
> 
> They were in the breeding tank where I was holding your plants. However if it is from the main tank where the plants originally came from then it could be any of half a dozen rainbow species or even a hybrid.
> 
> The tank looks really good, the maidenhair should start to throw up new fronds soon if it hasnt already started. I cut my main plant back like yours and new fronds are growing up already.



Awesome mate. Ive added shrimp in the tank but find myself just constantly watching the fry and nothing else lol. 

Cant wait to see what it turns out to be.  Ill update you with pics as it gets bigger. Shame theres no others as its going to be pretty lonely 

Im sure youll be able to identify it. I best watch it doesnt take a liking to my shrimp or ill be posting it to you hs ha.  

The maidenhair has infact been throwing up new shoots pretty quick since about day 5 of set up. Its doing well mate. 



faizal said:


> God,..I love low tech tanks.  Don't worry Alastair,...you've just given that little fella an awesome home. He/She is gonna love living in it to bits.



Hope so faizel.  Water quality must be ok too if its happily swimming around all day.  Im hoping its ok in soft water though but most rainbow fish like it harder so to speak I think.  



foxfish said:


> Looks great, I would still be tempted to change a couple of your bulbs to LEDs though!
> Perhaps a couple of blue ones to give a nice blue shimmer effect.



Thanks mate. What bulbs would you suggest mate. And ones that I can just pop straight in rather than have to use transformers.  The one thing is that the actual units are specifically low energy units and only take up to 11w in the energy bulbs.  

Sent from my GT-I9305 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## foxfish

Well if they are main powered & gu10 fitting, any gu10 LED will fit.


----------



## Alastair

foxfish said:


> Well if they are main powered & gu10 fitting, any gu10 LED will fit.



Ordered 4 off ebay so looking forward to seeing how they look. I like the ripple effect they give. 

Just been playing around with my ikea led light too which gives off a lovely glow. 





The invitro tennelus is throwing out runners rapidly which is great but the trident plant s are melting which I think is the cause of the rapidly returning film on the surface. Looks like ill definitely be using a skimmer. 
I cant raise the lily pipe any higher as the water splashes over the edge of the tank.  

Water evaporation though.... 7 litres a day


----------



## Andy Thurston

7l !!! Thats nearly a bucket full.. When are you turning it into a glass dining table then?


----------



## Simanas

Maybe you should consider using a sump? Crystal clear surface and evaporation will be only visible in the sump, also you could install auto top off system....


----------



## foxfish

Simanas said:


> Maybe you should consider using a sump? Crystal clear surface and evaporation will be only visible in the sump, also you could install auto top off system....


 That might not be a great idea as the overflow will drive off the little C02 available in a low tech tank!


----------



## Steve Smith

It can be done if the sump is covered to help keep CO2 levels up but it can be a problem.


----------



## foxfish

Water pouring down the overflow is the issue, Alistair has in fact considered a sump before, they work ok on injected tanks if you are prepared to use loads of gas! (like me)


----------



## Nathaniel Whiteside

Wow Alistair, Nice work! Its Humongous.


----------



## LondonDragon

Haven't been around much lately and glad to see this back on track, its looking great planted  looking forward to future updates, congrats and well done


----------



## Alastair

Simanas said:


> Maybe you should consider using a sump? Crystal clear surface and evaporation will be only visible in the sump, also you could install auto top off system....





foxfish said:


> That might not be a great idea as the overflow will drive off the little C02 available in a low tech tank!



I was considering this but have since raised the glass outlet just a little so its actually pulling down the water from the surface and has cleared the surface scum completely whilst not really disturbing the surface too much although from a thread by darrell a little surface movement wouldn't be too bad as it will also bring in co2 from the atmosphere. 
Im still planning on sumping but might wait until my bigger project next year 



Nathaniel Whiteside said:


> Wow Alistair, Nice work! Its Humongous.


Hey mate. Tis bit big lol. Hope your ok mate not seen you on here as of late. 



LondonDragon said:


> Haven't been around much lately and glad to see this back on track, its looking great planted  looking forward to future updates, congrats and well done



Thanks muchly Paulo.  Im glad its all up and running now. Will begin to add my fish from storage towards the end of the week when im back and feeling well....starting with the licorice gouramis.  

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## Alastair

Just thought id pop a few pics up of how the tank was last looking. The evaporation isnt as much now as id found out my jager heater had somehow recalibrated and the temp was 26 so was re adjusted and is comfortably at 25. 

Just a couple of photos id taken earlier this week.  The invitro tennelus is really taking off and throwing out runners quickly even though it's only been running a week and a half.  
The crypts all melted unfortunately but are showing new leaves. Looks a little bare since they did but hoping theyll bounce back soon.  

Here's a few shots first with the emmersed wood and the new shoots on the maiden hair fern




And the tank ealier this week










Looking forward to adding the gouramis etc  later this week.  
Think ill need more shrimp though as 100 in here seems more like ten 

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## DanMac

Stunning, and you could use that cabinet as a bomb shelter.

How do you deal with the evaporation? do you top it up and add conditioner when you please or wait for the weekly water change to add extra?


----------



## Rich Jackson

fantastic looking set up there. I like the idea of low tech. might go this way for my first set up. 
have read your thread from the beginning very helpful.


----------



## Nutty

Alastair said:


> Im still planning on sumping but might wait until my bigger project next year


 
you plan to go bigger than this :O

water looks crystal clear too! have you got/tried out those LED bulbs yet?


----------



## Gill

Simply Stunning Alastair


----------



## sanj

Alistair,

I had thought about this before in light of my own tank experiances. My tank surface area is 8ft by 3ft and over winter especially I was getting condensation issues on the windows of my living room. I have since had it covered with Acrylic sheets, the condensation stopped.

Just somthing to consider.


----------



## aliclarke86

Is the lighting rig mains powered?


----------



## Iain Sutherland

Plants look to be bedding in well al and gin clear too.  You running any purigen or carbon?

When i see this tank i cant help but think with its dimensions how sweet it would look as a coral reef crest  
or maybe mangroves, macro algae and seahorses  haha just day dreaming out loud.


----------



## faizal

Yeah,...just like Iain said there,..the water's so clear. Coming along nicely Alastair


----------



## Alastair

Nutty said:


> you plan to go bigger than this :O
> 
> water looks crystal clear too! have you got/tried out those LED bulbs yet?



Yep I plan to go 5 or 6ft all round by 60 or 70 cm height once this has grown in and I need more room for the choccos. 

Still haven't gotten round to trying the led lights yet. Its on my to do list. 



Gill said:


> Simply Stunning Alastair



Hiya Gill thanks mate. Hope your well 



sanj said:


> Alistair,
> 
> I had thought about this before in light of my own tank experiances. My tank surface area is 8ft by 3ft and over winter especially I was getting condensation issues on the windows of my living room. I have since had it covered with Acrylic sheets, the condensation stopped.
> 
> Just somthing to consider.


Do you cover it all year round sanj or just winter time??



aliclarke86 said:


> Is the lighting rig mains powered?



Yes mate all runs off the mains. 



Iain Sutherland said:


> Plants look to be bedding in well al and gin clear too.  You running any purigen or carbon?
> 
> When i see this tank i cant help but think with its dimensions how sweet it would look as a coral reef crest
> or maybe mangroves, macro algae and seahorses  haha just day dreaming out loud.


Ha ha im still day dreaming now mate as to the possibilities.  
Not too happy with the wood planting yet but will be patient.  

Funny you mention the purigen iain as ive got no carbon or purigen running in it. 
It does have a very slight tint to the water from the alder cones but isnt noticeable on the photos.  

I was going to put up a thread though, I know purigen removes organic compounds tannins etc, so if this was the case does this then mean it would remove all the beneficial anti fungal and humic acid properties of the alder cones almond leaves and peat etc?????? 




faizal said:


> Yeah,...just like Iain said there,..the water's so clear. Coming along nicely Alastair



Thanks faizal. Im only sticking to 3 10 percent water changes a week currently and dropping to 1 eventually.  


Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## sanj

Alastair said:


> Do you cover it all year round sanj or just winter time??


 
I only just got these covere made in January/February time this year. I have left them on, but looking back it was only in the colder months that i noticed the issue.


----------



## BigTom

Hi Al. Sorry for not replying to your pm; been in Greece. Flying home tonight will get in touch in a day or so.


----------



## Alastair

sanj said:


> I only just got these covere made in January/February time this year. I have left them on, but looking back it was only in the colder months that i noticed the issue.



I noticed that too on my last tank Sanj.  Condensation on the back door was shocking.  Ive got this under control with adjusting the heater so much less water evaporation but still more than most. Im going to look at buying a 4ft square acrylic or plastic sheet and cutting it to fit over during the winter.  



BigTom said:


> Hi Al. Sorry for not replying to your pm; been in Greece. Flying home tonight will get in touch in a day or so.



Hiya mate. No worries hope you've had a nice holiday mate. Look forward to your reply......
Oh and an update on your journal


----------



## frothhelmet

When you add the Chocolates it should be goodbye Mr. Fry. They are good hunters.


----------



## Alastair

frothhelmet said:


> When you add the Chocolates it should be goodbye Mr. Fry. They are good hunters.



Lol believe it or not theyve not battered an eye lid so to speak.  Theyve all gone in and arent the slightest bit interested. 
There are two of the rainbow fry now and sanj has identified them. Both doing well and greedily eating banana worm. 

Ive just added 5 small ottos as I thought my single otto should have friends after being in the last 3 tanks with out but its more interested in swimming around with the corys than its own kind. 

Ive took a few photos today of mainly the licorice gouramis as they are showing some really deep intense colour which I didn't see before.  
Ive also jusy started testing these new fertilisers and plant colour is really nice. Its only been the second week of dosing so will see how they perform but reading other reviews they are awesome ferts. 
Will get a few pictures up when I can. Must say though that the plant growth is fantastic for 3 weeks old. 

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## Ady34

Pleased its going so well Alastair, you and the fish deserve a good run of it now given your patience during the early frustrations 
Will you keep the rainbowfish or move them on? Maybe a bit boisterous for the chocos?
Look forward to more pics.
Cheerio,
Ady.


----------



## sciencefiction

The tank looks great. Well done. It's nice to see it finally going.

How much surface movment are you running on this tank Alastair?


----------



## Alastair

Ady34 said:


> Pleased its going so well Alastair, you and the fish deserve a good run of it now given your patience during the early frustrations
> Will you keep the rainbowfish or move them on? Maybe a bit boisterous for the chocos?
> Look forward to more pics.
> Cheerio,
> Ady.


 

Thanks Ady thats nice of you to say. i feel like a massive weight has been lifted as i was beginning to get frustrated with staring at a cabinet after two tank fails and clutter in my dining room. Alls well though as i have a female chocloate gourami with eggs. must be very homely for them.

ill be keeping the rainbow fish mate as they dont grow big at all and arent boisterous. they like soft water and calm tank mates. if they do ok which they seem to be im going to try and get few more off Sanj as these are offspring from some heiko bleher brought over. Sanj went over to the netherlands to get them.... this is what theyll look like
 Pseudomugil gertrudae – Spotted Blue-eye — Seriously Fish


sciencefiction said:


> The tank looks great. Well done. It's nice to see it finally going.
> 
> How much surface movment are you running on this tank Alastair?


 

Hi mate, im not running too much surface movement, just enough for the lily pipe to be pulling down water and creating a gentle ripple on the surface like this

above and below shot









heres how the tank is looking as of this week, im pretty impresses with the growth rate for a low tech after 3 weeks, the tennelus is really taking off.












excuse the pic quality it was just a quick phone snap




The choccos seem to be in breeding mode as two have been actively following one another and doing mating behaviour









licorice gouramis colouring up really nicely now














heres the fertilisers im trialling. i seem to be getting some good results so far. i thought id test out the root tabs in the front left corner of the tank and can clearly see a big difference in the tennelus there to anywhere else in the tank.





im dosing at a quarter of the recommended levels with having a low tech tank which would mean each bottle of macro and micro would last me 62 weeks .

they look nice anyway

ive already promised someone a set but have one or two spare if anyone else wants to try if i can get time to send out.

oh i also got 5 ottos at the weekend which are very active


 

and 14 more choccos to add in later this week and 30 crystal red shrimp in a fortnight which should add a nice bit of colour.


----------



## Ady34

Looking great mate, the fish look very happy and its only gonna get better!
I was thinking thet would be huge rainbows like in Sanj's display tanks, those Gertrude's are lovely and perfect for a set up like yours.
Cheerio
Ady.


----------



## Aron_Dip

Tanks looking awesome buddy.. Think i might need a trip up too see in the flesh


----------



## tim

Looks superb mate considering not even a month old, licorice gouramis are stunning fish seriously considering trading in my high tech setup. Awesome


----------



## RynoParsons

love it love it. shesshhh cubes are difficult to scape well done. love those fish also


----------



## Iain Sutherland

Just turned my co2 up now Ive seen your pinna growth  

Few months from now it will be something else!
Like a lot.


----------



## sciencefiction

> Hi mate, im not running too much surface movement, just enough for the lily pipe to be pulling down water and creating a gentle ripple on the surface like this


 
Thanks Alastair. Your tank is looking ace, absolutely lovely.
I am still fiddling with mine and can't decide how much surface movement is enough. It's been very hot here and tank temps reached 28C, so I am afraid to experiment too much at the moment but I have way more than that. Watching out for algae like a hawk


----------



## Ian Holdich

Love it mate, top set up. That wood would look great with some emmersed moss on it!


----------



## aliclarke86

The emersed growth looks lush!


----------



## BigTom

I've had a maidenhair fern sat above the fireplace for about a year that I've been meaning to plant on my filter sponge, might actually have to get off my blahblahblahblah and do it, seeing as yours looks so good.


----------



## Alastair

Ady34 said:


> Looking great mate, the fish look very happy and its only gonna get better!
> I was thinking thet would be huge rainbows like in Sanj's display tanks, those Gertrude's are lovely and perfect for a set up like yours.
> Cheerio
> Ady.


Me too originally ha ha. I was expecting to have to rehome them but now I know what species they are im really happy keeping them.  



Aron_Dip said:


> Tanks looking awesome buddy.. Think i might need a trip up too see in the flesh



Cheers bud.  Definitely come up mate your welcome anytime if you can remortgage to fuel your rocket 



tim said:


> Looks superb mate considering not even a month old, licorice gouramis are stunning fish seriously considering trading in my high tech setup. Awesome


Thanks tim. Glad you think so. Its amazed me considering its only 3 and a half weeks old. Fully cycled and growing in well.  The licorice gouramis are beautiful fish just need the right parameters and only take live food although I watched one suck down a whole frozen bloodworm but took it about ten minutes.  Such an elegant fish and when they display to one another it looks fantastic.  Hard to pick out of the choccos and licorice which I favour more. 




RynoParsons said:


> love it love it. shesshhh cubes are difficult to scape well done. love those fish also



Thanks ryno. It was a little challenge to scape especially being viewable from 3 sides but hopefully when my table has gone next week I can show the tank all the way around.  



Iain Sutherland said:


> Just turned my co2 up now Ive seen your pinna growth
> 
> Few months from now it will be something else!
> Like a lot.


 is my pinna growing well then mate I have never tried it before. 
Oo that reminds me I need to send you something. 



sciencefiction said:


> Thanks Alastair. Your tank is looking ace, absolutely lovely.
> I am still fiddling with mine and can't decide how much surface movement is enough. It's been very hot here and tank temps reached 28C, so I am afraid to experiment too much at the moment but I have way more than that. Watching out for algae like a hawk



Thank you . Having so many positive comments early on gives me more determination to make sure it stays good. 
I wasnt sure how much surface movement to have but thought a gentle break but no splashing would suffice. The crs and cherries seem far more active and plants look great too. 
Your tanks 28?? Where do you live. ..



Ian Holdich said:


> Love it mate, top set up. That wood would look great with some emmersed moss on it!



Thanks mate. I really like how its going. Although not sure if im right in the head as im already planning what to do with a bigger one next year after this has grown in........ bigger and deeper. 

And absolutely.  Can't wait to get some weeping moss on the wood 



aliclarke86 said:


> The emersed growth looks lush!


Thanks ali. Hopefully another few weeks and it will look totally different. 



BigTom said:


> I've had a maidenhair fern sat above the fireplace for about a year that I've been meaning to plant on my filter sponge, might actually have to get off my blahblahblahblah and do it, seeing as yours looks so good.



Ha ha definitely mate do it. It will look fantastic in your tank. Look forward to seeing that if you do. I got the idea when I saw sanj's tank in pfk. Its took a hold of the wood really well. Could do with being a little greener though. 

Sad news though I came home tonight and couldnt find my pregnant chocco. I thought she was in hiding but spotted her on the carpet under the dining table very dry.  Felt awful. 
I think I need some bigger floaters


----------



## BigTom

Ah, that's a bugger. Never had a jumper (except the odd shrimp), even with 4 open top tanks.


----------



## sciencefiction

> Your tanks 28?? Where do you live. ..


 
Ireland, he, he...We do happen to get a heat wave every 50 years or so


----------



## Alastair

BigTom said:


> Ah, that's a bugger. Never had a jumper (except the odd shrimp), even with 4 open top tanks.



I had one in the puddle but was sat next to the tank when it jumped so popped it back but when the emmersed plants were added it didn't happen again. Plus there isnt much plant growth yet in this. Its very open. The salvinia I have is mini variety so need to get bigger. 



sciencefiction said:


> Ireland, he, he...We do happen to get a heat wave every 50 years or so



Lol. Never new that. The water agitation will help lots esoecially with that heat. I bet your heater didnt click on for a while ha ha. 

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----------



## sciencefiction

> Lol. Never new that. The water agitation will help lots esoecially with that heat. I bet your heater didnt click on for a while ha ha


 

What's a "heater" ?  lol.....
I had to dig out the T-shirt box from out the dungeon  and my fish swim naked around here these days


----------



## Alastair

Cheers to mr holdich
Looks the part now just hope it doesnt dry out as the wood is pretty high out of the water

Untitled by Mr-T-, on Flickr


----------



## matt

Looks great,can't wait till this ones fully grown in


----------



## aliclarke86

what moss is this? (only on phone so cant get a good look, we dont all have huge 5" screens mr gt i9505)


----------



## Alastair

just a random shot as i was coming in from the back garden earlier 


Untitled by Mr-T-, on Flickr


----------



## Alastair

matt said:


> Looks great,can't wait till this ones fully grown in


 
Thanks matt, shouldnt be too long the rate its taking off ha ha 



aliclarke86 said:


> what moss is this? (only on phone so cant get a good look, we dont all have huge 5" screens mr gt i9505)


 
lol @ the screen size comment. Its Weeping moss 1 - 2 gro if im correct. it came from Ian Holdich's tank. beautiful condtition and think it has some hc or something mixed in too


----------



## Ian Holdich

Looks great Al! Hope,it serves you well. 

The moss is (here we go again, always on about 1-2 grow), 1-2 grow weeping moss. It took really well in my tank. It also got mixed with a bit of HC...which adds to the look IMO.


----------



## Alastair

Ian Holdich said:


> Looks great Al! Hope,it serves you well.
> 
> The moss is (here we go again, always on about 1-2 grow), 1-2 grow weeping moss. It took really well in my tank. It also got mixed with a bit of HC...which adds to the look IMO.



Cheers buddy. Its staying nice and moist so looks like its a winner 

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## DanMac

I have always preferred big stones to bogwood but that is one epic centerpiece for a tank, Bet you cant wait to see all your fish swimming around it. how many are you planning on putting in?


----------



## Alastair

DanMac said:


> I have always preferred big stones to bogwood but that is one epic centerpiece for a tank, Bet you cant wait to see all your fish swimming around it. how many are you planning on putting in?


 

thanks mate, i originally thought to use stones in this set up but a few types can affect water chemistry which isnt ideal for the fish im keeping. Plus id need some pretty big bolders!!

i must admit i was very lucky with the wood and got it very very cheap for its size and shape. bloody heavy though. if i hadnt have gotten this then id have used huge pieces of redmoor roots but an island type layout suits this and i have an idea in mind of what this will turn out like.

Fish wise id already added a few choccos my licorice gouramis shrimp ottos and corys, but have now got another 20 chocolate gouramis that ive just added this evening which has made the others a bit more lively, they all seem to be swimming about together and the little ones come and take food from my hand which is awesome. ive also got another ten to come on monday.

just took a quick photo of them. too fast to get a good shot and the tanks too big to get them all together





and a very short video clip. best played in 720 or 1080


----------



## DanMac

That setup is another level,especially when it fills in more. have you entered competitions before mate and are you planning on entering this tank?

I dont know much about competitions, I have seen some stunning entries though. I heard you can enter some online, i might do it next time for a laugh just to see if i dont come last, it would be hilarious to show people and say "look i came in 5000th place!"


----------



## hydrophyte

Looking good Alastair!
I just added a couple of chocolates to one of my setups and I like them a lot.


----------



## BigTom

Extremely jealous of your _Sphaerichthys _Alastair, they look brilliant in those sort of numbers.


----------



## aliclarke86

They do look ace. Can I ask what you are feeding them?


----------



## Ian Holdich

There's some monies worth in there! 

As Tome says, they look amazing in large numbers. How many are in there?


----------



## Alastair

DanMac said:


> That setup is another level,especially when it fills in more. have you entered competitions before mate and are you planning on entering this tank?
> 
> I dont know much about competitions, I have seen some stunning entries though. I heard you can enter some online, i might do it next time for a laugh just to see if i dont come last, it would be hilarious to show people and say "look i came in 5000th place!"


Thanks dan. 
I cant wait to see what it looks like in another months time. 
Ive never entered any competition before mate as my low techs havent really been up on the same level as some of the high techs but ill give the aga a bash with this one if its grown in enough by then and may possibly enter my puddle too. 
I think with the aga comp if you don't come in the top 3 you dont get given a placing. 






hydrophyte said:


> Looking good Alastair!
> I just added a couple of chocolates to one of my setups and I like them a lot.



Hey mate.  Thanks buddy. They are standalone fish in my opinion.  I love them. Im really going to aim for 40 in this tank. 
They behave fantastic in bigger groups.  
Which one of your journals are the choccos in?? 



BigTom said:


> Extremely jealous of your _Sphaerichthys _Alastair, they look brilliant in those sort of numbers.



Thanks Tom. Kind of evens out my jealousy of your tank then lol. I think they'll act even better once the group gets even bigger next week.  

My adult cherries are kind of hiding away now the group size has increased though 

The crs arent even bothered though.  




aliclarke86 said:


> They do look ace. Can I ask what you are feeding them?



Totally agree mate. I feed them on banana/micro worm twice a day, frozen blood worm once a week and freeze dried tubifex cubes stuck to the glass once a week too. You'd be amazed at the size of bloodworm they can chomp down given how tiny there mouths are 

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----------



## Tim Harrison

Very much looking forward to seeing this fill out and evolve.


----------



## faizal

Oh wow !!!!! Alastair,...the tenellus are looking so healthy & green. Absolutely gorgeous. The sense of depth is amazing. Like everyone says,...it's going to look so good once it's completely filled in. And it's non co2!!!


----------



## Alastair

faizal said:


> Oh wow !!!!! Alastair,...the tenellus are looking so healthy & green. Absolutely gorgeous. The sense of depth is amazing. Like everyone says,...it's going to look so good once it's completely filled in. And it's non co2!!!



Hiya faizal. Thanks mate. I must admit im really really surprised at the growth rate and colour of the plants especially the tennelus. 
It is much broader but shorter than I thought it would grow and throwing runners everwhere. I think this time next month the whole substrate will be covered completely.  Ive seen co2 tanks (including my old high tech) with tennelus take longer to grow than this 


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----------



## DrRob

That's what surface area does for you.

My wife is going to hunt you lot down when I steal a spot in the corner of the dining room. Out of curiosity, how much of a pain would it be if a tank like this was in a corner? Would it make maintenance totally impossible?


----------



## BigTom

DrRob said:


> That's what surface area does for you.
> 
> My wife is going to hunt you lot down when I steal a spot in the corner of the dining room. Out of curiosity, how much of a pain would it be if a tank like this was in a corner? Would it make maintenance totally impossible?


 

Had my 3x3 in a corner originally. Far corner was a bit tricky  to do much with but otherwise okay. Doesn't quite make the most of the form factor but obviously saves a bit of space.


----------



## DrRob

The rooms in the cottage aren't the most generous, and all of them are corridors, so corner it may have to be. I'm still deciding if I should go with a long, shallow tank, or a square like you and Alistair.

I do still need to finish building the room it's going in though, as plaster dust has a nasty effect on the pH.


----------



## Alastair

DrRob said:


> The rooms in the cottage aren't the most generous, and all of them are corridors, so corner it may have to be. I'm still deciding if I should go with a long, shallow tank, or a square like you and Alistair.
> 
> I do still need to finish building the room it's going in though, as plaster dust has a nasty effect on the pH.



Agree with tom that in the corner youd have limited access to a degree but it depends on how big a square tank it would be. Mines 4 ft square and can only access it from two sides currently until tomorrow when my dining table goes and with the size I do get a soaked front trying to stretch across to the other side. I think also the way you scape tue tank has an impact on maintenance too but in a corner a square still looks good. Look at toms journal when he had it in the corner near his window. 

Long and shallow are easier to work with like in my puddle journal but you dont get the same viewing angles as a square tank. 
Hence me being addicted to square tanks and planning bigger for next year 
Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## Iain Sutherland

Alastair said:


> It is much broader but shorter than I thought it would grow and throwing runners everwhere.


 
It does look very broad which i havent seen before, in my high tech or no tech nano it was much narrower.  Wonder if its a 12grow transition stage and will narrow further down the line?



Alastair said:


> I think this time next month the whole substrate will be covered completely. Ive seen co2 tanks (including my old high tech) with tennelus take longer to grow than this


 
What are your thoughts on why this is?  
Any news on the seneye mate as i think more than a few of us would be curious about the par levels this runs at 
Once again you've awoken my MTS with this, gunna need a bigger house!


----------



## RynoParsons

square tanks are much harder to scape. also to photograph.


----------



## Alastair

Ian Holdich said:


> There's some monies worth in there!
> 
> As Tome says, they look amazing in large numbers. How many are in there?



Sorry mate I didn't see your post.. oops. Im not ignorant all the time 

There worth the investment I think. Especially seeing them in such a big group and the behaviour is so different in bigger numbers.  
I think theres roughly 25 so far with another group coming tonight 

Then ill be adding 25 cbs a week saturday 



Iain Sutherland said:


> It does look very broad which i havent seen before, in my high tech or no tech nano it was much narrower.  Wonder if its a 12grow transition stage and will narrow further down the line?
> 
> 
> 
> What are your thoughts on why this is?
> Any news on the seneye mate as i think more than a few of us would be curious about the par levels this runs at
> Once again you've awoken my MTS with this, gunna need a bigger house!



It might narrow down a bit more but to be honest it doesn't look bad at all. I actually prefer the broader leaved look this time round.  

As for the growth rate im not entirely sure mate. Like I said I didnt see such rapid growth in my old co2 tank or in my puddle.  
Im dosing very very minimal ferts, there's some of the wondergro root tabs dotted about but nearly all the plantlets are throwing out runners and the vibrancy of green in them is lovely.  
It could be the variety of things in the substrate but that doesnt explain the anubias or moss.  

As for par readings im borrowing a par meter from a friend next week so will be able to get some proper readings at substrate and surface level. Im curious myself too. 

Ha ha nothing wrong with one or two more tanks. 
Im already planning for bigger

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----------



## Alastair

Ps wondering if anyone can help, I had the usual faint film on the water surface which has pretty much gone since raising the glass outlet however the bubbles produced from the agitation arent dissolving/popping which to me would mean something is binding them together.  Ive attached a pic any ideas anyone save me having to pop up a separate thread




???? 

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----------



## BigTom

You could try positioning the outlet such that you get maximum rippling without actually breaking the surface and creating bubbles. I'd expect the film to clear up anyway in a few weeks. Can't believe how fast that tennelus is spreading! 

You could also try the old paper towel on the surface trick, in case you've got surfactants or something in there.


----------



## DrRob

Protein, oil, or surfactants as Tom suggests. Has someone been cleaning things in your house?


----------



## Alastair

BigTom said:


> You could try positioning the outlet such that you get maximum rippling without actually breaking the surface and creating bubbles. I'd expect the film to clear up anyway in a few weeks. Can't believe how fast that tennelus is spreading!
> 
> You could also try the old paper towel on the surface trick, in case you've got surfactants or something in there.



Ive lowered the outlet just a little so its kind of creating a tornado effect of water under the surface just above the outlet so its dragging water down from the surface. Alls good so far. 

If it comes back ill try paper towels.  I also noticed the eheim jager was letting an occasional bubble eacape from its seal so not sure if that had a part to play but ive replaced it. Might explain the peculiar odour id occasionally get from the tank. 

And tell me about it, the tennelus is really going for it. Every plant has adapted super fast and ive got runners all over. 



DrRob said:


> Protein, oil, or surfactants as Tom suggests. Has someone been cleaning things in your house?



Theres only myself that cleans and I dont use sprays air fresheners or anything.  Will see how the adjusted outlet and replaced heater go. Fauna weren't affected (touch wood) and the second group of choccos that have gone in last night are as happy as the others

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----------



## Bufo Bill

Congratulations with this, you are doing a Superb job. If this was mine, I would move the sofa into this room and get rid of the TV- I would no longer need it. You could coin the phrase "aquarium potato", it is so cool. 
All the best from Bill.


----------



## Matt Warner

Your tank is looking amazing Alastair, you've inspired me to go low tech now. When I move house in a week or so, I'm converting my juwel rio to low tech. When I do, would it be a good idea to remove the reflectors from the lights?


----------



## Alastair

Bufo Bill said:


> Congratulations with this, you are doing a Superb job. If this was mine, I would move the sofa into this room and get rid of the TV- I would no longer need it. You could coin the phrase "aquarium potato", it is so cool.
> All the best from Bill.


 

tv??? whats one of those ha ha.
thanks bill, my dining room has kind of become 'MY' room now, i sit in here most evenings just staring into the tank. definitely an aquarium potato. even my exercise has stopped because i get side tracked with it. i think il need to invest in a comfy cushion though so i dont get pressure sores 




Matty1983 said:


> Your tank is looking amazing Alastair, you've inspired me to go low tech now. When I move house in a week or so, I'm converting my juwel rio to low tech. When I do, would it be a good idea to remove the reflectors from the lights?


 

Hiya matty, cheers mate. its good to know ive inspired someone just like i was inspired myself last year from toms tank to do the puddle. well worth it even just to have a go. definitely remove the reflectors mate and add floaters


----------



## faizal

I just can't stop saying this but i love this tank. Alastair did any of your in vitro tenellus under go melting prior to throwing off runners? If so did you cut them out or just leave them there to disintegrate because i used to uproot the tenellus , remove the browned leaf & replant it. Just wondering if i was doing the right thing. 

It's looking lovely in there. Are you planning on adding stems at the back ?


----------



## Alastair

faizal said:


> I just can't stop saying this but i love this tank. Alastair did any of your in vitro tenellus under go melting prior to throwing off runners? If so did you cut them out or just leave them there to disintegrate because i used to uproot the tenellus , remove the browned leaf & replant it. Just wondering if i was doing the right thing.
> 
> It's looking lovely in there. Are you planning on adding stems at the back ?




Thanks Faizal I really appreciate that. I just cant wait to see how it grows in. 
The invitro tenellus never melted at all and ive not seen any die off or go brown.  Its just gone rampant.  

Even if you got a brown leaf theres no need to uproot to trim just cut it like a lawn. 

The only stems that are in it are hygrophila pinnifitada dotted around the wood which will grow in amongst the crypts but even yhe hygro is growing rapidly.  
My reason for not planting stems at the back is that the tank is viewable from 3 sides and ive tried to get it to look the same all the way around like an island so to speak.  Well my original idea was just of a large piece of wood that has sunk to the bottom of a river and vegetation grown around and on it if that makes sense??? 

Ill lose the depth if I stick stems in and its nice to see the choccos swimming around the wood too 

Just a quickie if the emmersed plants on the wood. Seems to be doing well 






Had to place some of the emmersed moss below water on the wood as it wasn't staying saturated enough. The shrimp forage all over it at night time


----------



## DrRob

As I said on Tom's thread, and yours is going the same way, the green is just amazing.

I'm not sure whether you're both good at adjusting cameras (Tom certainly is), or if it's to do with the light in the low techs, or the way the plants colour up in these conditions, but I'm in love with the green...


----------



## Alastair

DrRob said:


> As I said on Tom's thread, and yours is going the same way, the green is just amazing.
> 
> I'm not sure whether you're both good at adjusting cameras (Tom certainly is), or if it's to do with the light in the low techs, or the way the plants colour up in these conditions, but I'm in love with the green...



Thanks drRob

Its much greener in person. I dont think its anything to do with camera adjustment especially on my recent photos anyway as I just take them on my phone and upload straight to the forum. No enhancements etc. 

I think some plants in low techs look nicer. Crypts especially do im my opinion. 

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk 2


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## Aron_Dip

i need some of that moss in my life ... mines all dieing off  haha (Exel double dosing maybe?) ... any more pics for us?


----------



## Alastair

Aron_Dip said:


> i need some of that moss in my life ... mines all dieing off  haha (Exel double dosing maybe?) ... any more pics for us?


 

could be mate, i know some moss doesnt appreciate liquid carbon.


just a couple of pics taken on my phone today, not impressed with my camera on my s4 currently its not very sharp when you look closely which is unusual. cant understand it.

ive moved the wood slightly so its pretty much bang on in the centre of the tank as it was too close to the front of the tank.











im beginning to have a little problem with very tiny particles in the water that the filter doesnt seem to want to pick up so the tank has a slight haze to it which is annoying me, and have rewad that there can be bypass problems with the eheim 2080s. i cant stick in purigen either as i lose all the beneficial properties of my almond leaves and alder cones then. fresh filter wool in and its done nothing.

to add to this ive had 3 jumpers, two of which i found and one that did his carpet dive whilst luckily i was walking by and heard it hit the carpet so rescued him/her. unfortunately too i had to put one to sleep as it was getting thinner and thinner desoite eating then lost its ability to swim. couldnt watch it suffer anymore. on top of that ive got an itch outbreak which im beginning treatment on tomorrow so hopefully all will be in harmony soon.

i just need to try and resolve the teeny particle matter. 

the tennelus has and still is on one. at this rate it will have covered the whole substrate in a couple of weeks. its definitely a different variety than normal as i have some tennelus off Ady and they look way different. mines so much broader.


----------



## BigTom

Shame about the jumpers, but that tennelus really is mental.

Might be worth lower the water level a couple of inches to discourage them, just until the plants have grown in a bit more and they're a bit more settled.

Water clarity is an issue with these shape tanks, they're so deep that even the slightest haze is really obvious.


----------



## Alastair

BigTom said:


> Shame about the jumpers, but that tennelus really is mental.
> 
> Might be worth lower the water level a couple of inches to discourage them, just until the plants have grown in a bit more and they're a bit more settled.
> 
> Water clarity is an issue with these shape tanks, they're so deep that even the slightest haze is really obvious.


 
ithink the jumpers is partly down to the corys shooting up for air as they only seem to get spooked at night and jump. my new tank later this year will be euro braced so will help with this. i agree though i may lower the water level a little more, its only high in these pics as id done a water change this morning

and yeah the haze is obvious, a friend stopped by and said why is your tank cloudy and that's when it started to bug me. it could again be added to by the corys constantly sifting the substrate all the time too. . they may have to go at some point. i see the shrimp more when the corys are resting too.


----------



## Brian Murphy

Wow ! I never even realised that you had started again .... looking great and loving the growth


----------



## Monk d'Wally de Honk

Try some filter wool around your filter intake if you think it's bypassing somewhere in the canister.. I've used a small secondary internal before just with wool in purely for this problem and it worked. Removed it after problem was solved. 

Tank is looking fantastic though. I'd love one like that at home.


----------



## aliclarke86

I know what you mean about camera on s4 I was slightly let down with it. I think the iPhone 5 seems to have best camera in a phone but I can't buy apple I have too many bad feelings for that company. 

Tank is looking fantastic!!! 

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk 4 Beta


----------



## faizal

A very stupid doubt here but I suddenly had a thought,...what if they aren't tenellus. I swear they kinda look like saggitaria subulata now. Just a thought,...that's all. I mean,...there are a lot of submersed leaves there now,..new ones and like you say Alastair,...they do look much broader for submersed e. tenellus.


----------



## Bufo Bill

faizal said:


> A very stupid doubt here but I suddenly had a thought,...what if they aren't tenellus.


!!!!!!Dun Dun Deeeerrrrr!!!!!!


----------



## sciencefiction

> and yeah the haze is obvious, a friend stopped by and said why is your tank cloudy and that's when it started to bug me. it could again be added to by the corys constantly sifting the substrate all the time too. . they may have to go at some point. i see the shrimp more when the corys are resting too.


 
I've got around 25 corys in my soil tank and the only time they stir up stuff is when I feed them. It settles within an hour afterwards, but my soil is capped with 2.5cm of unipac sand. I also have a cory/shrimp tank and the shrimp don't hide one bit from the corys. The shrimp have taken over the tank lol.
It's possible there's other issues with the tank, maybe not properly mature yet, maybe some bacterial bloom going on. Or maybe the filter flow is not right. If the filter is in the corner, maybe the flow bounces of the the side glass and falls in the middle.


----------



## Alastair

Monk d'Wally de Honk said:


> Try some filter wool around your filter intake if you think it's bypassing somewhere in the canister.. I've used a small secondary internal before just with wool in purely for this problem and it worked. Removed it after problem was solved.
> 
> Tank is looking fantastic though. I'd love one like that at home.



Thanks mate.  I wouldn't put filter wool over the intakes as well as it would seriously reduce flow. Ive got sponges on the two intakes anyway but having read this thread

 Improving Eheim Pro 3 mech filtration - Page 7

I gave it ago but didnt fill the top tray full of floss. I just put my filter wool/floss around the outer edge of the top tray and pushed it down like in this pic from that link




 then placed my normal filter floss on top as normal. 

Its made a massive difference. Water is back to particle free which im really happy with now and crystal clear. 



aliclarke86 said:


> I know what you mean about camera on s4 I was slightly let down with it. I think the iPhone 5 seems to have best camera in a phone but I can't buy apple I have too many bad feelings for that company.
> 
> Tank is looking fantastic!!!
> 
> Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk 4 Beta



Agreed ali, the pics look great until you zoom into a shot you've taken. I know theyre set to 9.4mp but even changed to 13mp and you still get grainy pics when you zoom in. Its still an amazing camera. Outdoor shots are awesome.  I compared my s3 and s4 yesterday by taking the same shot and you can zoom in much more before you get the blur.  

Id only have another iPhone if the 6 is anything special.  Didnt like my 5. 



faizal said:


> A very stupid doubt here but I suddenly had a thought,...what if they aren't tenellus. I swear they kinda look like saggitaria subulata now. Just a thought,...that's all. I mean,...there are a lot of submersed leaves there now,..new ones and like you say Alastair,...they do look much broader for submersed e. tenellus.




I was thinking this too faizal, but saggitaria doesn't have the sword like tips on them. Its more rounded on saggitaria.  Ive looked at lots of google images and cant see saggitaria that resembles this.  WEIRD...

Might have to ask ed what he thinks. Iy could be a new variety huh??? 



sciencefiction said:


> I've got around 25 corys in my soil tank and the only time they stir up stuff is when I feed them. It settles within an hour afterwards, but my soil is capped with 2.5cm of unipac sand. I also have a cory/shrimp tank and the shrimp don't hide one bit from the corys. The shrimp have taken over the tank lol.
> It's possible there's other issues with the tank, maybe not properly mature yet, maybe some bacterial bloom going on. Or maybe the filter flow is not right. If the filter is in the corner, maybe the flow bounces of the the side glass and falls in the middle.



Filter flow is circular but after having read the link above ive put floss around the outside of the top tray and jobs a gooden no haze anymore. 

Ps my corys never stop digging lol. I feed live micro worms so they dig all day for any that have settled in the substrate. 

I think im going to by some thin plexiglass pieces to put around the edges of the tank at night as found another jumper again this morning.  Its only ever the new ones grrrrr 

Ive placed both intakes on the rear right too as one at either end of the rear with the heater inbetween was tricking the heater into thinking the tank was at the right temp as the water outlet blows across the heater and the inlet was right after the heater which would have been taking in the heated water and it was just being blown back out at the heater. 

Could explain why ive had jumpers too if the water was too cold maybe
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## Alastair

Its definitely an echonodorus as one of the plants is sending up a flower stem which ia odd as I only thought it was the big species that did this


Untitled by Mr-T-, on Flickr

And just a quick full tank snap


Untitled by Mr-T-, on Flickr


----------



## aliclarke86

Wow its practicly covered the ground! Its amazed me really I thought such growth couldnt happen without high co2 injection levels but this seems to be growing nearly as quick as a high tech 

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## faizal

The plants' health are next to none . Look at the speed at which they are covering the substrate area !!! Nice .


----------



## Iain Sutherland

Hey al, interesting about the filter, i may have to give that a go as i still have cloudy water too.  Fine looking from the front but end to end its very hazy even with 500ml purigen and 500g carbon.  Did you zip lock the floss around the basket?
Weird about the tennelus, does look more like dwarf sag, still it looks great so maybe a happy mistake 

Sorry to hear about the jumpers mate, while you wait to sort some acrylic to go round the top might be worth trying putting a book on each corner.  I found it stopped all my jumpers in barb island when i added acrylic triangles to the corners, seems thats where they jump most of the time... worth a shot .


----------



## Alastair

aliclarke86 said:


> Wow its practicly covered the ground! Its amazed me really I thought such growth couldnt happen without high co2 injection levels but this seems to be growing nearly as quick as a high tech
> 
> Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk 4 Beta


 
Ha ha I know Ali, im not going to take any other tank shots for two weeks to see how much substrate might be or not be visable ha ha. Even the mosses are looking great. Crypts are slow at taking off though




faizal said:


> The plants' health are next to none . Look at the speed at which they are covering the substrate area !!! Nice .


 
Thanks faizal. The greens are really vivid and not a spot of algae anywhere. Im really happy with it 




Iain Sutherland said:


> Hey al, interesting about the filter, i may have to give that a go as i still have cloudy water too. Fine looking from the front but end to end its very hazy even with 500ml purigen and 500g carbon. Did you zip lock the floss around the basket?
> Weird about the tennelus, does look more like dwarf sag, still it looks great so maybe a happy mistake
> 
> Sorry to hear about the jumpers mate, while you wait to sort some acrylic to go round the top might be worth trying putting a book on each corner. I found it stopped all my jumpers in barb island when i added acrylic triangles to the corners, seems thats where they jump most of the time... worth a shot .


 
Hiya mate.
Its well worth popping some floss round the edges of the top tray. I ordered a huge roll of 30mm thick filter wool from finest filters so I didnt have to keep forking out for eheim white pads so I just used some of this. I didnt zip lock it around mate I just lowered the water level just below the top tray then packed around the filter tray with an inch depth of the floss. Much easier to just pull out and replace instead of having to take out the tray each time 

I cant use the purigen as it will suck up my almond leaf and alder cone benefits.

Cut out 4 pieces to stick over the corners at night which is where they hang out but ordered a large sheet which ill cut out holes where the wood come up and inlets etc and ill stick this on at nights






And had to show this photo. I love it. My daughter took it whilst I was fiddling about under the tank.


----------



## Nutty

that is a lovely back-light shot, has she thought about a career in photography?

Hope your corner trick stops any more jumpers! must suck to find em


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## Michael W

Excellent looking tank. Very well done and its evident that a lot of hard work and effort was put into this, carry on the good work! It really goes to show the potential and possibilities of a low tech tank.


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## Alastair

Nutty said:


> that is a lovely back-light shot, has she thought about a career in photography?
> 
> Hope your corner trick stops any more jumpers! must suck to find em



I thought so too. I couldnt get a shot like that on a spur of the moment shot AND it was taken with my s4 phone.  I was very proud. 

Id love this on a big canvas opposite the tank. What you think?? Easy to get done??? Might start a thread in photography....

Although, I did have to remind her that she could have dropped my phone in the tank water lol.  Shes extremely artistic especially for her age. Loves photography.  She wants a dslr for xmas  



Michael W said:


> Excellent looking tank. Very well done and its evident that a lot of hard work and effort was put into this, carry on the good work! It really goes to show the potential and possibilities of a low tech tank.



Cheers michael. Definitely a lot of effort has gone into it that's for sure. 
I think low techs can look just as good as a high tech tank. 

I just need to cure the tank if ich now but unfortunately one chocco didn't respond well to the medication and I found it dead last night. Ill have none left at this rate. 
Ive also noticed a couple rocking back and forth recently with clamped fins and when ive searched on google I was gutted to find that it may possibly be gourami disease which is incurable. 
Apparently it can wipe out all other dwarf gouramis in the same tank. Id be devastated if that happened. Its not down to water quality problems apparently one can have it and when introduced to a new tank the stress starts it off. 
There have been cases where someone didnt lose all there small gouramis but the general consensus is once its started they all go. 
I will just have to see. It will be some expensive and upsetting loss if so. 


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## Nutty

Alastair said:


> Id love this on a big canvas opposite the tank. What you think?? Easy to get done??? Might start a thread in photography....


yer its pretty easy, the big supermarkets offer picture to canvas, not sure on their quality but there are plenty of website that offer it too! overall quality does depend on the the original image and if it can take being blown up to larger sizes, but reading some of your previous posts, it may have to be a smallish one 

Hope the remaining Gouramis pull through, the tank is made for them and it wouldn't be right without!!!


----------



## Alastair

Nutty said:


> yer its pretty easy, the big supermarkets offer picture to canvas, not sure on their quality but there are plenty of website that offer it too! overall quality does depend on the the original image and if it can take being blown up to larger sizes, but reading some of your previous posts, it may have to be a smallish one
> 
> Hope the remaining Gouramis pull through, the tank is made for them and it wouldn't be right without!!!



Are the pictures not great then on my journal lol. This one seems great when I zoom in on the pc. 
Im not sure if she or I could replicate that shot exactly using yhe digital. 
Surely with it being such a dark picture ot would be ok and taken at 13mp too?? 


Thanks mate. My friend at the lfs and someone else said it could just be the stress of the white spot and the treatment.  The dead fish today may already have been weak and the meds just brought about the inevitable. 
Ive turned flow down to half on the filter too which they all seem to like a bit more, even the shrimp are out and about alot. 

So im running a 2080 on HALF flow through a glass lily pipe on a tank thats best part of 600 litres lol. probably just over 1.5 times turnover ha ha 

Which reminds me does anyone have a link to a finer foam block for my intakes similar to my current ones as somehow shrimp havw managed to get through this and make home under the blue pre filter sponge inside it. 

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## Nutty

Alastair said:


> Are the pictures not great then on my journal lol. This one seems great when I zoom in on the pc. Im not sure if she or I could replicate that shot exactly using yhe digital. Surely with it being such a dark picture ot would be ok and taken at 13mp too??


 
there is nothing wrong with the pictures posted as seen they are all great from a phone, but meant when you zoom, it becomes grainy, which if you went big on canvas you'd see , but if this one works then brill!! i'd love to see this as big if not bigger than A1 size but would probably be better suited to A3ish, the pic just really draws me in and i sorta get mesmerized by it eheh


----------



## Alastair

Thanks nutty. Ive just paid a company to have it printed on to a canvas and have it opposite the tank. Its a really good picture and my little girl is very proud. 

On another positive note check this lot out for 20 pound delivered off ebay 





100 grada a leaves 10 inch in size free indian almond bark and even a seed to try to grow. 

oof!!!!


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## DrRob

Hope you've got a big garden, that's a 35m tree waiting to happen that is.


----------



## BigTom

And a packet of Hall's Soothers!


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## Alastair

DrRob said:


> Hope you've got a big garden, that's a 35m tree waiting to happen that is.



Im not sure it would grow in my garden the winters we get would kill it. Im going to try and grow it indoors for now next to my ficus lyrata tree which gets lots of light once ive drilled a little whole in the seed and placed in some water for a day or two or how ever long the instructions just said. 
Then ill pot it up and see what happens. 

Its worth a shot at least hey??? Smells nice though



BigTom said:


> And a packet of Hall's Soothers!



Ha ha I know mate. What are the chances. How did they know I had a sore throat


----------



## Alastair

Just recieved my crystal black shrimp delivered from the gent who bred them, here they are whilst they are drip acclimatising. 


Untitled by Mr-T-, on Flickr

Lovely colours considering they have faded during transportm cant wait to see how they look once settled in the tank. 

A mix of s grades I think. 

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk 2


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## aliclarke86

Awesome. How many are in there?? Looks to be a fair few!

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## Alastair

aliclarke86 said:


> Awesome. How many are in there?? Looks to be a fair few!
> 
> Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk 4 Beta



Quite a few. 25 give or take plus a teeny baby snuck in somehow. Really small but fully coloured. Should be ready to go into the tank soon theyve been dripped for a while now and only had to bring their water up by 11 tds and ph wasnt much different

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## Alastair

heres a few of the little ones immediately after being introduced, i think they are really well coloured considering theyve just gone in. Guesses on grades???








need to learn how to take good macro shots with the digital too lol. you can see how thick the tennelus is in that last shot. its mental.

and 2 of the tank. im going to play around with the camera this weekend and get the settings right. 









im really please with the growth and think in a months time ill not see much of the substrate or the wood.


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## Ady34

Looking stunning Alastair.
Things really taking off now, the substrate is almost carpeted, but it definitely does not look like tenellus, which may actually be a good thing in a shallow tank as yours looks shorter.
The shrimp look really nice too.

The maidenhair fern, is it just a houseplant that doesn't mind it's roots in water? Quite fancying some emersed growth in my new set up and this may fit the bill nicely 

Cheerio,
Ady.


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## Gary Nelson

The new additions look great mate and what a bargain from ebay too! im loving the immersed moss shot


----------



## Alastair

Ady34 said:


> Looking stunning Alastair.
> Things really taking off now, the substrate is almost carpeted, but it definitely does not look like tenellus, which may actually be a good thing in a shallow tank as yours looks shorter.
> The shrimp look really nice too.
> 
> The maidenhair fern, is it just a houseplant that doesn't mind it's roots in water? Quite fancying some emersed growth in my new set up and this may fit the bill nicely
> 
> Cheerio,
> Ady.



Hey ady thanks mate. Im liking how well its growing with such little input. Just water changes and a teeny amount if ferts.  

Ive looked all over the net and it has to be a tennelus of some sort as if you look at the runners a saggitaria plant throws off one plantlet where as these have a trail of plantlets coming off each one. Growth is phenomenal!
The shrimp look much more settled today and are happily chilling out in all the various crevices in the wood and on the moss.  

Yes mate the maidenhair is just a house plant. Its doing really well. Growing towards my door though which I wasnt hoping for ha ha. 



Gary Nelson said:


> The new additions look great mate and what a bargain from ebay too! im loving the immersed moss shot



Thanks gary, if I didn't have fish id fill this tank with shrimp only and have it as a huge shrimp breeding ground. I will be adding some more cbs though as they dont seem as sought after as the crs infact I prefer the cbs now.  
I was chuffed with my ebay buy. Will last me ages  

One thing ive noticed today again after I have just started dosing is the slight haze on the surface again and the bubbles from surface aggitation not bursting. It cleared when id stopped dosing or doing water changes for a week and now its back again. Strange


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## Henry

Can't wait to see what this looks like when it's all filled in. You and BigTom have this natural tank business down to a 'T' 

Were the Katapa leaves from Amy Lim, by any chance?


----------



## zanguli-ya-zamba

Nice work Al !!!
I love the dimension of you tank ! 
The carpet is almost done  !

cheers


----------



## Alastair

Henry said:


> Can't wait to see what this looks like when it's all filled in. You and BigTom have this natural tank business down to a 'T'
> 
> Were the Katapa leaves from Amy Lim, by any chance?



Thanks henry. Im a total low techy convert now I don't think id ever go back to a co2 set up again. 
Its grown in even more this past week especially with the warmer weather.  Ill leave it another week and update with some shots. 
If you get the balance right regarding water changes plant mass and fish they really do look after themselves.  
Ive tried to plan this around the fish, to create a natural equilibrium that looks nice but suits the specific water parameters of where the fish come from.  

Seems to be working well.

 Yeah agreed I think me and tom are like two low tech gurus.  Ive only done 2 so far but although tom has got the one journal his tanks gone through a fair few changes all of which are inspirational.  
Plus low tech makes it much easier for tanks on a larger scale too I think. Less water to change etc. Im hooked anyway and am looking forward to my bigger project soon. 




zanguli-ya-zamba said:


> Nice work Al !!!
> I love the dimension of you tank !
> The carpet is almost done  !
> 
> cheers



Cheers mate. I wish id took sanjs advice and gone bigger originally but im exceptionally happy with how this is growing in and looking.  Fish seem to be showing breeding behaviour again and lots if shrimp are buried.  
People spend most of their time stood in my dining room looking at the tank if they visit. 

Oh and the carpet id say is about 90% covered already from the unusual tennelus. . Phenomenal growth


----------



## faizal

Alastair,..what's the purpose of using the indian almond bark & Katapa leaves? And I am sorry to bug you like this but any idea about the substrate level PAR in this tank please?


----------



## Michael W

faizal said:


> Alastair,..what's the purpose of using the indian almond bark & Katapa leaves? And I am sorry to bug you like this but any idea about the substrate level PAR in this tank please?


 

I believe he uses them for his Chocolate Gouramis and Liquorice Gouramis, they're very sensitive fish and require more of a soft and acidic condition compared to other fish, the bark and leaves should help in providing this plus anti bacteria properties. His shrimps could also graze on the leaves aswell.


----------



## faizal

Sorry for hogging this journal with doubts & questions but Al could you sum up the factors (in your opinion) that lead to the success of this non co2 tank?

Man I would love to see a carpet like that in my tank some day.


----------



## Tim Harrison

Alastair said:


> Its definitely an echonodorus as one of the plants is sending up a flower stem which ia odd as I only thought it was the big species that did this
> 
> 
> Untitled by Mr-T-, on Flickr
> 
> And just a quick full tank snap
> 
> 
> Untitled by Mr-T-, on Flickr


 

Wow...haven't checked in a while, it's all looking great. The teleportation device above the tank is genius...you can teleport the aquarium anywhere in the house and even take it on holiday with you and the fish will be none the wiser. It's definitely the future...


----------



## Alastair

faizal said:


> Alastair,..what's the purpose of using the indian almond bark & Katapa leaves? And I am sorry to bug you like this but any idea about the substrate level PAR in this tank please?


 


Michael W said:


> I believe he uses them for his Chocolate Gouramis and Liquorice Gouramis, they're very sensitive fish and require more of a soft and acidic condition compared to other fish, the bark and leaves should help in providing this plus anti bacteria properties. His shrimps could also graze on the leaves aswell.


 
Hiya Faizal sorry for the late reply mate ive been a bit busy this week. Michael is right thats what i mainly use them, to benefit the fish and also the crs and cbs love grazing on the leaves as do the ottos. not only that i think they give a very natural look to the tank. i prefer the look of oak leaves but dont have any left. i also use alder cones too which act faster and again look natural littered amongst the substrate. Par readings i havent got yet as im waiting for a par metere from a friend who has a really top notch one so i can give you some readings once ive done that if you like mate 




Troi said:


> Wow...haven't checked in a while, it's all looking great. The teleportation device above the tank is genius...you can teleport the aquarium anywhere in the house and even take it on holiday with you and the fish will be none the wiser. It's definitely the future..


 
Thanks Tim, im really pleased with the way its looking now. im finding it difficult to pull myself away from it. i have no dining table now so have had to revert to sitting on my bike tyre all evening staring at it. haha ha funny you mention the lighting my little girl said its like something from doctor who  ive been to brazil 3 times this week 




faizal said:


> Sorry for hogging this journal with doubts & questions but Al could you sum up the factors (in your opinion) that lead to the success of this non co2 tank?
> 
> Man I would love to see a carpet like that in my tank some day.


 
no need for apologies mate your comments and questions are always welcome. hmmm factors???

this is pretty much all i do with the tank in terms of maintenance etc, i do 2 ten percent water changes one on saturday the other on wednesday, i dose 1/10th of the recommended dosing on the fertilisers im using, macro after water change trace the day after then nothing until the next water change.
i have the glass lily pipe raised just a little so its pulling down water from the surface and agitating the surface only a small amount which is also bringing in atmospheric co2 as well as o2 which seems to make the shrimp much more active, i think i have the balance just right so im not creating too much surface movement but just 8 hours lighting a day now. other than the two mixes of substrates thats it mate.
i only had a little gsa on the wood which i worked out was where the ikea led light was ointed during the night so have angled it stright to the back wall instead to create a moonlight on the wall which reflects into the tank.

Regarding the carpet, growth is insane, ive no idea what this plant is but im sending it off to Ed at freshwater so he can try it in a co2 set up to see if it changes but its covered the tank barring a patch at the front right which has the least flow.

heres a couple of pics just taken quickly on my s4 so crap photos from faulty camera........its having the camera replaced.














 a quick night shot....which is when i spend most of my time watching 



 

and a couple of shrimp grazing on one of the ketappa leaves


----------



## aliclarke86

The shot in partial light is absolutely beautifull!!! I don't think I could drag myself away either!!!! 

Is that the little clip on light only?

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## Iain Sutherland

Growth is amazing al, really looking top draw.
Will be really interesting to see what happens to the 'tennelus' on a high tech.


----------



## faizal

Cheers Al  ,...sorry for bugging about the meter. Take your own time mate. I really appreciate your time & effort. The tank is phenomenal. A non co2 carpet !!! The scape is really taking its form now. Very natural. Have a great time admiring it Al,...you deserve every moment of it. A well paid reward for your patience, especially during its initial stages.


----------



## livewire

Nice bike, shame the wheels are so small


----------



## Alastair

aliclarke86 said:


> The shot in partial light is absolutely beautifull!!! I don't think I could drag myself away either!!!!
> 
> Is that the little clip on light only?
> 
> Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk 4 Beta



Hiya ali.  Night time is best to view this tank. The fish act totally different and more character I think because they can't see me. 
Yep its just the little clip on ikea light.  Its got some oomph for a 3w light.  If I raise it higher it covers the whole tank. 



Iain Sutherland said:


> Growth is amazing al, really looking top draw.
> Will be really interesting to see what happens to the 'tennelus' on a high tech.



Cheers mate.  Growth is amazing yeah im just not happy with anubias on the wood I may relocate that and get some moss growing up it or a smaller anubias nana petite maybe. 
Ill be curious too how the tennelus pans out when it gets fuel injected. 
Ive got other tennelus in amongst this but looks nothing like it



faizal said:


> Cheers Al  ,...sorry for bugging about the meter. Take your own time mate. I really appreciate your time & effort. The tank is phenomenal. A non co2 carpet !!! The scape is really taking its form now. Very natural. Have a great time admiring it Al,...you deserve every moment of it. A well paid reward for your patience, especially during its initial stages.



Faizel mate your words are really encouraging thanks. Bug all you want I dont mind as im curious about the readings myself and dont have my seneye anymore to try a rough estimate. As soon as I get it ill be testing straight away and posting up the results.


----------



## Alastair

livewire said:


> Nice bike, shame the wheels are so small



So small  its the forks theyre whoppers. 160mm travel. Are you a 29er then mate?? 

They dont look small on this pic 





Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## Gill

Alastair, next time you have some of the Dwarf Sagittaria. let me know, have not grown that in years.
Tempted to pop into Ikea for one of those lights. They do give alot of impact for the size.


----------



## Alastair

Gill said:


> Alastair, next time you have some of the Dwarf Sagittaria. let me know, have not grown that in years.
> Tempted to pop into Ikea for one of those lights. They do give alot of impact for the size.



Hiya gill, its not dwarf saggitaria believe it or not as its too pointed and short plus the runners arent just one or two plantlets its trailing growth is identical to tennelus with multiple runners across the substrate with about 20 or so plantlets on each runner. Can send you some in a few weeks as ill be pulling some up at this rate

And the ikea lights are fantastic. You could easily run a small moss shrimp tank with one of these low tech.  I bought the one with the clamp. 
Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## tim

That has filled in very quickly al, looks like a tennelus/ quadricostatus hybrid maybe with the broader leaves, tanks looking fabulous mate yourself and big Tom really are my low tech aquascaping heroes  keep the updates coming please and a vid maybe when you have time


----------



## Gill

Cheers, the Ikea lamps are great. have used them on a pico tank before


----------



## aliclarke86

that bike looks unused!


----------



## Alastair

tim said:


> That has filled in very quickly al, looks like a tennelus/ quadricostatus hybrid maybe with the broader leaves, tanks looking fabulous mate yourself and big Tom really are my low tech aquascaping heroes  keep the updates coming please and a vid maybe when you have time


 

just what i was thinking tim, im sending some off to ed today so will hopefully find out then. it looked like tennelus when in was in invitro form originally but much smaller obviously. ill jut have to wait and see but what ever it is its growth is amazing. will definitely keep the updates coming and as soon as my camera has been replaced ill do or try to make a vid like some of the pros do on here, just not as good ha ha.


----------



## Alastair

aliclarke86 said:


> that bike looks unused!


 

its brand new Ali, well a week old anyway. got it purely for free ride, jumps drops etc. i dont want to scratch it lol. ive had it out for a couple of hours but i do strip and clean my bikes after every ride anyway.


----------



## sanj

Alistair,

I would also be interested in some of that ground cover... tennelus/Sag...somthing else??

My breeding tanks use a lot of dwarf Sag and under low light (<10-15 PAR), the plant stays only a couple of inches, but you are saying yours is not that so another low tech rampant plant would be great.


----------



## DanMac

Sick bike alastair, do you do any dirt jumps or tricks?, I used to have this  Nice solid bmx.

Loved bmx'ing when i was younger, we used to do everything from grind rails and make big dirt jumps hollowed in the middle so you were screwed if you didnt make it lol, I got that bike 10 years ago when i was 15 i think, only had it for a few years until it got nicked out of my garage,and my brothers bike aswell !


----------



## Alastair

sanj said:


> Alistair,
> 
> I would also be interested in some of that ground cover... tennelus/Sag...somthing else??
> 
> My breeding tanks use a lot of dwarf Sag and under low light (<10-15 PAR), the plant stays only a couple of inches, but you are saying yours is not that so another low tech rampant plant would be great.



My pleasure mate pm me your addy with how much you want and ill send some over to you Sanj. 

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## Gary Nelson

Wow! Great pics and I love the shrimp pic of them grazing... Really nice mate


----------



## Alastair

DanMac said:


> Sick bike alastair, do you do any dirt jumps or tricks?, I used to have this  Nice solid bmx.
> 
> Loved bmx'ing when i was younger, we used to do everything from grind rails and make big dirt jumps hollowed in the middle so you were screwed if you didnt make it lol, I got that bike 10 years ago when i was 15 i think, only had it for a few years until it got nicked out of my garage,and my brothers bike aswell !



Cheers mate.  Yeah I do jumps and tricks, just getting used to the feel of this one first as its a heavier bike. Made from cromolloy so pretty indestructible.  Rare now too.  Not used to such big travel forks this time round though. 

One of the guys I ride with is a keen photographer so hoping he can get me in a few air shots. Its more a free ride so mainly big drops and jumps but it can easily handle some big dirt jumps

Ill not be getting this pinched.  It will only leave the house when its a group ride or car drive to a trail. I took it to the shop the other day and caught a few glancing eyes... 

Ive had a bike stolen years back and was devestated so know the feeling.


----------



## Alastair

Gary Nelson said:


> Wow! Great pics and I love the shrimp pic of them grazing... Really nice mate



Thanks gary. Glad you like it mate. Will be happier once samsung have replaced the camera so the quality of pictures are better. 

I over loaded the tank with kettapa leaves last night and love the tea stained look its given today. The fish seem happier too 

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## Deano3

tank looks great mate must be hard to drag ur self away

Dean


----------



## DanMac

Alastair said:


> Cheers mate. Yeah I do jumps and tricks, just getting used to the feel of this one first as its a heavier bike. Made from cromolloy so pretty indestructible. Rare now too. Not used to such big travel forks this time round though.
> 
> One of the guys I ride with is a keen photographer so hoping he can get me in a few air shots. Its more a free ride so mainly big drops and jumps but it can easily handle some big dirt jumps
> 
> Ill not be getting this pinched. It will only leave the house when its a group ride or car drive to a trail. I took it to the shop the other day and caught a few glancing eyes...
> 
> Ive had a bike stolen years back and was devestated so know the feeling.


 


I know what you mean, that Huffy i posted was heavier than any bmx i rode before but the quality was worth it , I got used to it pretty quick and I guess i got stronger because it felt like a tank when i first got it, cutting down the handle bar length helps with control and bunny hopping but i dont know if thats the case with downhill bikes ect. 

If your mate takes any good pictures post a few here, Would be interesting to see and we wont derail the thread lol


----------



## Westyggx

awesome mate! shame half the pics dont load though not sure if flkr is down or your links have broke?


----------



## Alastair

Westyggx said:


> awesome mate! shame half the pics dont load though not sure if flkr is down or your links have broke?


 

cheers mate.... i havent got a clue why all my photos or most are not showing.

 can anyone help as i havent removed them from flickr???

It would take me forever to work out what they are and re link them......


----------



## Alastair

my flickr photos on the forums ive posted are no longer showing yet are still on flickr. has anyone got any ideas whats happened???

Ive not been on for a while so heres a couple of pics for a quick update. 
the tank is doing fantastic, pretty much looks after itself i just do 2 ten percent changes a week and occasionally dose.
excuse the bare area to the right i removed a piece of wood from it so the carpet can grow through it

two licorice gourami flashing off to one another. the colours are amazing on them now. not sure if this is breeding behaviour byt ive never seen them like this in the two years ive had them.



[/url]

bumble bee shrimp


[/url]

a few tank shots


[/url]


[/url]


[/url]

and a quick vid shot on my phone. pardon the shaking the pooch was nudging me. best played in 720 or 1080.


----------



## BigTom

Looking brilliant Al - love how much empty space there is around the edges. Gourami shot looks like two males squaring off, the females pretty much never flare in my experience.


----------



## Gill

Your tank has inspired me to try chocos again, might get a mix a liquorice as well next month.


----------



## liamb2324

Absolutely stunning. I've currently just started a lowtech aquascape and had loads of help of bigtom and alot of info and help by reading both of your journals so thank you both for sharing, but i wish i didnt fill the tank full like i have as its going to be a pain to plant the carpet plants. How do all the fish get along as I'm thinking of having cardinals, panda Corys, fork tail rainbow fish, shrimps, ottos, and maybe a pair of gourami as you have similar fish.


----------



## Henry

Can't wait to see those crypts to spread in front of the wood. It'll make for a lovely transition between the carpet and the wood.


----------



## Tim Harrison

Awesome as usual...lovin' the open space.


----------



## Spartacus

Have just read through the Journal - Most impressive work Alistair.

Thank you for sharing!


----------



## aliclarke86

Any news?

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk 4


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## Alastair

aliclarke86 said:


> Any news?
> 
> Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk 4



Yep sorry ali ive not been too good for the last few weeks so havent updated and have been a little deflated from the problem with flickr and my loss of pics from all this journal and my chocolate puddle. 
Ill take some photos now and get them uploaded.  

Im also just in the process of setting up a tmc signature set for my cbs to improve the survival rate of babies 45x45x45cm and charcoal black cabinet 

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## aliclarke86

Ah good stuff. Shame about the shrimplets, are they getting eaten or what? I moved house on the 29th and am itching to set up my tmc, Rosie (the Mrs) is trying hard to convince me to have just shrimp in it. Her idea could work as I now have a converted garage that I can use as a fish room (pretty chuffed about that).

Looking forward to update photos and I hope its going well 

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk 4


----------



## Alastair

aliclarke86 said:


> Ah good stuff. Shame about the shrimplets, are they getting eaten or what? I moved house on the 29th and am itching to set up my tmc, Rosie (the Mrs) is trying hard to convince me to have just shrimp in it. Her idea could work as I now have a converted garage that I can use as a fish room (pretty chuffed about that).
> 
> Looking forward to update photos and I hope its going well
> 
> Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk 4



Cheers mate.  A few shrimplets from the crs cbs and cherries survive but not to the degree id like them too. Ive got very greedy choccos.... so ill be leaving in a fair few of each and transferring the rest over to the tmc sig when it comes to allow a bigger success rate then I can pop some of the bigger ones back in the big tank as they grow.  
I want to add more gouramis to the tank so they're all settled and used to the water for when I go SUPER sized next year but more choccos = less baby shrimp so the bigger colony of shrimps I have for next year the better the tank will look. The gouramis dont bother with the bigger shrimp its just shrimplets.


----------



## BigTom

I took the shrimp guard off my filter and now I just empty it every week and pour the water through two nets; big shrimp get caught by the coarse net and go back in, baby shrimp get caught in the fine net and get moved to a nano for growing on.


----------



## Alastair

BigTom said:


> I took the shrimp guard off my filter and now I just empty it every week and pour the water through two nets; big shrimp get caught by the coarse net and go back in, baby shrimp get caught in the fine net and get moved to a nano for growing on.



I used to do that in my puddle too mate plus there were the planters and a much bigger plant mass that shrimplets would hide in. 

I figure atleast if I transfer the majority of my crystals over to the other tank once babies get to a certain size they can go into the big tank. 

If I get started now then atleast when I come to getting the bigger set up in January I should have a fairly big group of shrimp ready to go in.


----------



## BigTom

Wow, going bigger again so soon? Are you going to keep the current tank?


----------



## Alastair

BigTom said:


> Wow, going bigger again so soon? Are you going to keep the current tank?



Around january time is when ill be ordering it and takes around 2 weeks to be made and delivered as its in acrylic so less waiting time. 
No I wont be keeping the current tank once the new one is ordered. I wont have room. Its yours if you want it mate. Stand too. 

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## BigTom

Alastair said:


> No I wont be keeping the current tank once the new one is ordered. I wont have room. Its yours if you want it mate. Stand too.


 

Oooooooooooo.

Can I say a very enthusiastic yes, with the proviso that I have no idea where I'll be living or what I'll be doing by then


----------



## Alastair

BigTom said:


> Oooooooooooo.
> 
> Can I say a very enthusiastic yes, with the proviso that I have no idea where I'll be living or what I'll be doing by then



Ha ha yes sure mate. Its yours. I know youll look after it


----------



## Alastair

Speaking of, ive not popped any recent updates up so here's just a few pics of how the tanks looking today. 
The carpet plants are starting to finally grow over the area where wood used to be. 

Emmersed wood 



Untitled by Mr-T-, on Flickr



Untitled by Mr-T-, on Flickr



Untitled by Mr-T-, on Flickr


Untitled by Mr-T-, on Flickr


Untitled by Mr-T-, on Flickr


Untitled by Mr-T-, on Flickr

And one of the newer additions added yesterday 


Untitled by Mr-T-, on Flickr

In the mean time im planning a small low tech scape for when I get my tmc signature cube


----------



## malawistu

Tanks looking good tried pm you back but would send 

Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## Gary Nelson

It looks stunning Alastair! A picture of health too, I love the last 2 pics, they look so natural... Keep the updates coming


----------



## aliclarke86

The maiden hair is looking awesome!

The carpet is looking really thick now but seems to be taking its time to fill in where you moved the wood. 

Did you ever get a positive ID on the plant ?

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk 4


----------



## Alastair

Gary Nelson said:


> It looks stunning Alastair! A picture of health too, I love the last 2 pics, they look so natural... Keep the updates coming



Thanks gary im loving the tank now, just a shame its having to come to an end but the end has been delayed which ill show why in a minute.... 



aliclarke86 said:


> The maiden hair is looking awesome!
> 
> The carpet is looking really thick now but seems to be taking its time to fill in where you moved the wood.
> 
> Did you ever get a positive ID on the plant ?
> 
> Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk 4



Thanks ali. . 
The maiden hair fern is awesome it will be going in the new tank too. Im hoping to split it up and attach it to the monstrous piece of wood ive got. 
Where the wood was its actually throwing runners out now. It was a little slow to start but its taking off. 

The plant never got a true id, it appears to be some form of hybrid between e tennelus and dwarf saggitaria. Its no higher than 3 cm. Itll be passed onto people free when this tank comes down

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## Alastair

On another note...... I had ordered my monster tank the other day and was told today that its actually going to be done in 4 weeks so thought best make a start taking this down and to my shock and amazement look what I found when I walked up to the tank...... 

Chocolate babies........ im very happy 

chocolate gourami breeding by Mr-T-, on Flickr


baby chocolate gourami by Mr-T-, on Flickr


baby chocolate gourami 2 by Mr-T-, on Flickr


baby chocolate gouramis by Mr-T-, on Flickr

Im over the moon. Theyre eating banana worms greedily and colours are beautiful... 

Crap pics the battery was dead on my digital


Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## Michael W

Absolutely amazing, what an achievement! I've heard many people complain about how hard it is to keep adult chocolates alive let alone breeding them.


----------



## Gary Nelson

Choc babies... great stuff and what a compliment to your tank health.... really nice to see


----------



## Alastair

Michael W said:


> Absolutely amazing, what an achievement! I've heard many people complain about how hard it is to keep adult chocolates alive let alone breeding them.



Thanks micheal, im just as amazed myself I really was not expecting it at all. 



Gary Nelson said:


> Choc babies... great stuff and what a compliment to your tank health.... really nice to see



Cheers mate, yes the tank must be perfect for them as theyve bred before but never been succesful. They must be really happy and im really really chuffed.  Tank bred chocolate gouramis are a rarity I think from reading online and these seem really healthy and active. There's loads of them. 
Its kind of made it difficult to set up the big tank now as I can't move these for a while.


----------



## Ady34

Congrats mate 
The best compliment of all paid to the tank by the inhabitants themselves!
Amazing stuff.....again, and the new monster tank to look forward to aswell. 
With these chocolates you are spoiling us 
Cheerio, 
Ady.


----------



## George Farmer

BOOM!! Free chocolate.


----------



## aliclarke86

That's fantastic mate especially with the problems you had to start with. When do you plan on starting the new mega tank up?

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk 4


----------



## George Farmer

Worthy of a move to "Featured Journals". Nice one Alastair.


----------



## aliclarke86

And a Facebook/twitter shout out?

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk 4


----------



## sa80mark

Wow well done alastair, I tried to breed them years ago and had absolutely no joy what so ever, youve got one hell of an achievement there

Mark


----------



## George Farmer

aliclarke86 said:


> And a Facebook/twitter shout out?
> 
> Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk 4


For sure. I'll let the relevant admin know.


----------



## foxfish

Congratulations mate, though of any names yet?


----------



## BigTom

Brilliant Al, you must be really chuffed. Any idea how many there are?

Also - 4 weeks?!


----------



## Ian Holdich

Facebook here we come! 


Well done mate, this makes you a gourami legend!


----------



## Aron_Dip

Better chocoLATE than never hey mate! They will BOOST your numbers up niceley... 

Sent from my HTC Desire C using Tapatalk 4


----------



## Tim Harrison

Nice going, they're obviously very happy in there...so yep - what Ady said.


----------



## Alastair

Ady34 said:


> Congrats mate
> The best compliment of all paid to the tank by the inhabitants themselves!
> Amazing stuff.....again, and the new monster tank to look forward to aswell.
> With these chocolates you are spoiling us
> Cheerio,
> Ady.



Thanks mate, im really made up and couldnt agree more that theyve rewarded me with lots of babies. They're fascinating to watch and actually look better as babies than adults 
Definitely got the next tank to look forward to and hopefully ill be honoured enough to be presented with yet more babies in the new tank. 
I could be wrong but under the impression that tank bred choccos should breed more easily or have a better survival rate of fry.  
I totally missed noticing any hiding female or protective male and I spend ages watching the tank




George Farmer said:


> BOOM!! Free chocolate.



Lots of it too George ha ha.  Plenty to go around by the look of it 



aliclarke86 said:


> That's fantastic mate especially with the problems you had to start with. When do you plan on starting the new mega tank up?
> 
> Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk 4



Thanks ali.  I think it may have been a culmination of the very warm weather we just had as my dining room gets full on sun during the day and I slightly overdosed on almond leaves and alder cones about 4 weeks ago to the point the water actually looked like chocolate.  

Ill be starting a new journal on the next tank today and start the tank up pretty much as soon as its come. Give or take a day or two.


----------



## Alastair

George Farmer said:


> Worthy of a move to "Featured Journals". Nice one Alastair.



Your spoiling me now mate thank you ha ha. Only down side to that now is ill have to fix all the broken links to all the earlier photos courtesy of flickr grrr. 
Thanks George really made my week this tank has. 



sa80mark said:


> Wow well done alastair, I tried to breed them years ago and had absolutely no joy what so ever, youve got one hell of an achievement there
> 
> Mark


Cheers mark, ive never had any joy, ive had 2 mums die from holding on too long and not eating and one ate her eggs when she dropped them through her gills. 
Im hoping this will be the first of many



BigTom said:


> Brilliant Al, you must be really chuffed. Any idea how many there are?
> 
> Also - 4 weeks?!


Yeah Mate im well chuffed.  It was the shock when I saw them and then the excitement kicked in. I thought from a distance they were baby shrimp. 
Ive counted 21 so far and all look healthy and full if colour

I know...4 weeks. Im going to have to try and delay it a bit as I cant go moving these that soon.  If not ill have a very very full dining room 



Ian Holdich said:


> Facebook here we come!
> 
> 
> Well done mate, this makes you a gourami legend!



Saw the facebook post thanks mate.  Im famous ha ha ; ) 
I think your right mate, either a legend or just very lucky. Kind of feels lije theyve thanked me by giving me babies 



Aron_Dip said:


> Better chocoLATE than never hey mate! They will BOOST your numbers up niceley...
> 
> Sent from my HTC Desire C using Tapatalk 4


 thats a good one mate lol. Only just clocked the 'boost' comment ha ha. Massive cabinet session next week hey ??? 



Troi said:


> Nice going, they're obviously very happy in there...so yep - what Ady said.


Thanks Troi they look it indeed. I love there colours. Charged my camera up to get some half decent shots but I think its faulty as the macro mode cant focus  

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## Alastair

foxfish said:


> Congratulations mate, though of any names yet?



Cheers mate, ha ha I couldn't make up enough names but im thinking 
Simon snickers
Marky mars 
Toby twix 
Fiona fudge 
Davey drifter 
Belgian ben 
Ferrero freddy
Roberto roses 
Winona whirl 
Double decker derek

And any more I can think of


----------



## BigTom

Aero Al


----------



## Alastair

BigTom said:


> Aero Al



Ha ha spot on mate. Why didn't I think of that.....
 there is one which is bigger than the others I shall name he/ she that 

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----------



## Alastair

Just a quick passing couple of phone photos. Id added some kettappa leaves a few minutes ago and babies are already taking shelter on them. 


chocolate gourami breeding by Mr-T-, on Flickr


chocolate gourami breeding by Mr-T-, on Flickr


----------



## Aron_Dip

Alastair said:


> Just a quick passing couple of phone photos. Id added some kettappa leaves a few minutes ago and babies are already taking shelter on them.
> 
> 
> chocolate gourami breeding by Mr-T-, on Flickr
> 
> 
> chocolate gourami breeding by Mr-T-, on Flickr


Is that "Freddo Fry I see there !?" ........ O wait no it's Areo Al ...... What a Dime Bar! I must be going CoCo..... 

Sent from my HTC Desire C using Tapatalk 4


----------



## Alastair

Aron_Dip said:


> Is that "Freddo Fry I see there !?" ........ O wait no it's Areo Al ...... What a Dime Bar! I must be going CoCo.....
> 
> Sent from my HTC Desire C using Tapatalk 4



 I can see you having me crippled with laughter doing the cabinet build ha ha 

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## Alastair

just a short video of some of the fry grouped together eating. pardon the shaky hands i'm on the mend!!! select 720 for better quality


a close up of 8 fry hanging out above a leaf all seem to be doing really well

chocolate gourami fry by Mr-T-, on Flickr

and the crystals are it it too now.... think theyre trying to keep there home

Crystal Black Shrimp by Mr-T-, on Flickr


----------



## xtevo

Definitely worth to be in Featured Journals! Congrats.  Aaand can't wait to see that 1400 litre monster planted in.


----------



## Alastair

xtevo said:


> Definitely worth to be in Featured Journals! Congrats.  Aaand can't wait to see that 1400 litre monster planted in.



Cheers xtevo. Im going to spend the next day or two trying to re link all the missing pictures now George kindky moved it to the featured section. 
All babies are doing fantastic, nice stable temp of 25 degrees and greedily munching on banana worms. Think theyll do great now


----------



## sanj

I thought I had written this already, but I cant find it... what will be the dimensions of the new tank and are you going via Neptunes or have found someone else who can make Acrylic tanks that size?


----------



## Alastair

sanj said:


> I thought I had written this already, but I cant find it... what will be the dimensions of the new tank and are you going via Neptunes or have found someone else who can make Acrylic tanks that size?



Hiya Sanj, the dimensions of the new tank are 1800x1000x700 height mm. I opted for glass mate as I just couldn't quite stretch to the prices for acrylic unfortunately. Well I could but would have left myself short for other equipment plus ive just got a new bike too which cost me more than the tank


----------



## Alastair

On the subject of this tank, it appears I have ANOTHER to be group of babies on the way as ive spotted a very large mouthed female hiding away looking like shes chewing gum


----------



## Gary Nelson

More great news mate.... You will have too many soon at this rate and will be wanting to pass some on


----------



## Alastair

Gary Nelson said:


> More great news mate.... You will have too many soon at this rate and will be wanting to pass some on



Lol thanks mate. They must really love it in this current tank. Not sure if its also the increase in temp that's added to it as when id noticed the babies I brought the tank up to 26 and also added way more leaves and alder cones to help the fry along with dropping flow rate right down.  

Ive clocked the responsible or 'iresponsible' male should I say as hes trying it with the other females too. Hes got really really intense red on his fins currently and is trying his luck with one other female at present.  

If he keeps this up ill not need to buy anymore choccos for the big tank ha


----------



## sanj

Alastair said:


> Hiya Sanj, the dimensions of the new tank are 1800x1000x700 height mm. I opted for glass mate as I just couldn't quite stretch to the prices for acrylic unfortunately. Well I could but would have left myself short for other equipment plus ive just got a new bike too which cost me more than the tank


 
Acrylic prices seem to have gone up alot in the last few years, prohibitively so for most people I would imagine. The guy who builds them cheaper also has a size limit, so it does make it difficult.

I would imagine the glass tank would be built on site. Is this in a dining-living room or a dining room (the the table taken out)?


----------



## Alastair

sanj said:


> Acrylic prices seem to have gone up alot in the last few years, prohibitively so for most people I would imagine. The guy who builds them cheaper also has a size limit, so it does make it difficult.
> 
> I would imagine the glass tank would be built on site. Is this in a dining-living room or a dining room (the the table taken out)?



Massively so mate. Where you got yours fron was substantially higher but you get the added quality. 
I will be going acrylic in a couple of years when I have a bigger house, as id love to go to the size where I have to get In it to scape it.  and have found a great company who make acrylic tanks for zoos and medical tanks etc who gave me a very very competitive quote. 

Its going in the dining room sanj and I did what you said and sacrificed the dining table ha. Believe it or not its not build on site as it will just go through the door way side on. (I have no twists or turns to navigate just straight through  front door and straight through another into the dining room. 
It will be going through 2 moves though as it cant be but in its correct position until I take the other down

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## Mick.Dk

Hi Alastair
Been told, I HAD TO watch this..........congrats on the babies
On the subject of your "mystery" plant; have you checked Ranalisma rostrata? I haven't seen closeup from your pic.s but from your description it sounds likely to be the one.
Mick.


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## Alastair

Mick.Dk said:


> Hi Alastair
> Been told, I HAD TO watch this..........congrats on the babies
> On the subject of your "mystery" plant; have you checked Ranalisma rostrata? I haven't seen closeup from your pic.s but from your description it sounds likely to be the one.
> Mick.


Hi Mik, 
Thanks very much on congratulating the babies. They're doing fantastic.  
Who told you you had to watch it ha ha. 
Is it the new to be set up that you meant as this one will be coming down soon 
Currently unnamed 1400 litre biggie | UK Aquatic Plant Society ??? 

And I think your spot on with the plant id. Looking at google images it looks almost identical. Thanks its been racking my brain for ages


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## Mick.Dk

Nope, it was this one ........... I honestly don't usually have time, to check all tbe journals. But glad I got to watch your "kids".
- and yep, you seem to like to know, what inhabits your tank, so I just wanted to help on tbat 
Mick.


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## Westyggx

awesome mate just awesome!!


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## Alastair

Westyggx said:


> awesome mate just awesome!!



Cheers mike. Fingers crossed the next one can look half decent too.  
Ive noticed this morning the male showing off to another female again. Not sure what hes been taking but ill be watching for a 3rd batch of fry just incase 

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## Lindy

You are never going to get a chance to empty this one!


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## Alastair

ldcgroomer said:


> You are never going to get a chance to empty this one!



I know. 
My dining room is going to be a very tight squeeze with both tanks in. 

Im sure the male is doing it on purpose. Either that or he knows hes going in a much much bigger home and thought hed save me lots of pennies by kindly presenting me with lots of little ones


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## Aron_Dip

He is a PORN STARbar! He is working his minstrals ....... 

Sent from my HTC Desire C using Tapatalk 4


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## Lindy

Maybe he's thinking he'll have to work harder to woo the ladies when they have more space to avoid him so he's making the time count.


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## Alastair

ldcgroomer said:


> Maybe he's thinking he'll have to work harder to woo the ladies when they have more space to avoid him so he's making the time count.


Ha ha yeah sounds more like it lol... he seems to be the only male in there, or at least the only one I can sex. 
He can keep at it if he likes. Means less for me to buy to stock the big one up with 

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## Nathaniel Whiteside

Wow. I want to try the choco Gouramis now! Them babies are too cute.

Looks like a new tank purchase in the near future! 

Only looked through the last few pages mate and this is unreal now. I prefer this type of Bio aqua scape as oppose to the 'highly polished' look of the fancy neatly trimmed setups. 

Proper Nature aquarium.
 And your one of the best at it. Go big or go home.

Nice one


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## Westyggx

Is my female still around mate and is she preggars?


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## Nathaniel Whiteside

Westyggx said:


> Is my female still around mate and is she preggars?



Your lass gone to Ali's like?


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## Westyggx

haha!


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## aliclarke86

Leave me out of this ! 

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## Little-AL

These chocolate puns certainly don't get any better!

Finally had a catch up on your thread Al, tank looks phenomenal, a definite inspiration to go and do something with mine!
Just wish I had space for my own "puddle" !!


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## Alastair

This tanks rewarding me so much currently. 
 there is yet another batch of baby choccos that have just appeared which im totally over the moon with.  
I wasnt sure if they were just stunted babies but compared to the others these are teeny


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## tim

You have to change your user name to Charlie  your chocolate factory is awesome


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## Michael W

OMG Tim you beat me to it.


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## Alastair

tim said:


> You have to change your user name to Charlie  your chocolate factory is awesome



Thanks tim. I was hoping the female who I thought was holding the other day was going to release as she was desperately wanting to eat but wouldn't open her mouth. 

Here's a pic of the 4 week old and the 1 day newly released!! 

Untitled by Mr-T-, on Flickr

And my fave emmersed plant currently 

Untitled by Mr-T-, on Flickr


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## Michael W

You really have to give credit for mouthbrooders, imo they're the best parents out there.

i love that emersed growth Al, I seen some of the fern in my garden center, it was very tempting after watching your section of emersed growth but my current scpes does not allow room for emersed growth and the HOB is taken over by peace lilies.


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## Westyggx

Looking forward to a few cuttings of that pal! Love the babies!


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## sa80mark

Absolutely superb mate, very inspiring,  what is the emersed plant in the last pic ?


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## Ian Holdich

How many have you managed to raise? Can you manage to count them yet?


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## Michael W

sa80mark said:


> Absolutely superb mate, very inspiring, what is the emersed plant in the last pic ?


 
Maiden Hair Fern


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## Nathaniel Whiteside

I love them choccos mate. Must be really rewarding. Great Job as per!
Just on Aquariums Manufacturing Limited


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## Tiago Rocha

nice


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## Alastair

Ian Holdich said:


> How many have you managed to raise? Can you manage to count them yet?


Its hard to count all the little ones mate but I know ive got 11 of the older babies and just lots of new ones but they hide and blend in very well. The glass makes my sight go funny if I stare too long ha ha. 



Nathaniel Whiteside said:


> I love them choccos mate. Must be really rewarding. Great Job as per!
> Just on Aquariums Manufacturing Limited



Ive not done anything mate its the ma n pa that have obviously been having late night rendesvouz. 
I think with me fiddling with the temp too making it go up by 1 degree for a day or two and back down might well have helped.  
I wouldnt mind the paros breeding now though. 



Westyggx said:


> Looking forward to a few cuttings of that pal! Love the babies!


Cheers mike. Ill send you a cutting next week mate. Still got your work addy


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## Alastair

Just a little phone shot or two of one of the not so baby, baby choccos chilling amongst some of Georges fiddedens/riccia mix. 
Pardon the very tanned water but wanted to aid there growth and prevent any chance of fungal infections etc





 


 


 

Really need to get my new camera out to hand


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## Nathaniel Whiteside

\What you mean pal! them images are decent.

What phone you using? I use my iphone 5S to take photos but images are always sh*t Quality!


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## Alastair

Nathaniel Whiteside said:


> \What you mean pal! them images are decent.
> 
> What phone you using? I use my iphone 5S to take photos but images are always sh*t Quality!



Id imagine my dslr and new lens would smash it though. 

Im using the galaxy s4 which was always rubbish at taking decent shots but had the camera replaced last week and its great now. 
Shocked at the 5s being rubbish


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## Nathaniel Whiteside

Alastair said:


> Id imagine my dslr and new lens would smash it though.
> 
> Im using the galaxy s4 which was always rubbish at taking decent shots but had the camera replaced last week and its great now.
> Shocked at the 5s being rubbish


 
Probably just me


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## aliclarke86

Glad your camera is sorted. I'm really happy with mine even though it has features taken away from the previous incarnation

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## BigTom

They are outrageously cute.

What photo gear did you go with in the end?


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## Bufo Bill

Hi mate, just wondering how and what you're feeding the tiny fry? Or have I missed a post somewhere?

Great pics as always, phone camera pics all seem pretty much on par with basic compact results these days . . . Oops, that's another session of electroshock treatment to stop me needlessly upgrading my tech!

All the best from Bill.


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## sanj

And my fave emmersed plant currently



Untitled by Mr-T-, on Flickr[/quote]


And so it should be... mines grown back fully, it huge!


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## Alastair

BigTom said:


> They are outrageously cute.
> 
> What photo gear did you go with in the end?



Very cute mate. They're virtual miniatures of their parents now and growing really quick. Unfortunately a fair few seem to just vanish which I presume means they got eaten or just weren't tough enough but still got lots. 
I spotted another female with a mouth full again........ I was going to take the tank down this week grrrr. Might move her now before the adults are taken out and put lots of moss and ferns in the temporary holding tub. 
Ive clocked a much much smaller licorice gourami too. Only about 2cm in length which has me wondering if theyve bred at some point.  

Camera wise ive finally settled on a Nikon d3200, the nikkor 18-55 lens and a Sigma 17-70 macro lense with os recommended by George. Still rubbish at close ups though. 



Bufo Bill said:


> Hi mate, just wondering how and what you're feeding the tiny fry? Or have I missed a post somewhere?
> 
> Great pics as always, phone camera pics all seem pretty much on par with basic compact results these days . . . Oops, that's another session of electroshock treatment to stop me needlessly upgrading my tech!
> 
> All the best from Bill.



Hi mate. 
Theyre not so tiny anymore ha ha. Im just feeding banana worms 3 times daily to all fish. I usually just feed twice but the young need it more often. 
Theyre actually attempting to gobble down frozen mini blood worm. 


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## BigTom

Alastair said:


> Very cute mate. They're virtual miniatures of their parents now and growing really quick. Unfortunately a fair few seem to just vanish which I presume means they got eaten or just weren't tough enough but still got lots.
> Ive just spotted another female with a mouth full again........ I was going to take the tank down this week grrrr. Might move her now before the adults are taken out and put lots of moss and ferns in the temporary holding tub.
> Ive clocked a much much smaller licorice gourami too. Only about 2cm in length which has me wondering if theyve bred at some point.
> 
> Camera wise ive finally settled on a Nikon d3200, the nikkor 18-55 lens and a Sigma 17-70 macro lense with os recommended by George. Still rubbish at close ups though.


 

Awesome news on the licorice Alastiar. Given how secretive they are, if you've spotted one there may well be more. 

Sounds like a good choice of kit as well. Macro has probably the lowest keeper rate of any sort of photography so can be a bit frustrating at first, but stick with it.


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## Alastair

BigTom said:


> Awesome news on the licorice Alastiar. Given how secretive they are, if you've spotted one there may well be more.
> 
> Sounds like a good choice of kit as well. Macro has probably the lowest keeper rate of any sort of photography so can be a bit frustrating at first, but stick with it.



Thanks mate. Im hoping so too. Ill know when I come to catch them if theres more than I put in ha ha. The males are really dark and flashing deep blue at the females. I think I have 2 species of paros.

Im sticking with the kit. Just getting or trying to get used to manually adjusting settings.  
I just meant im rubbish at macro not the lense ha ha


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## sanj

Alistair,

can you remind me, do you use the water out of your tap or RO, RO/Tapwater mix? If it is tapwater could you tell me what the parameters? I imagine it must be soft, acidic?


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## Alastair

sanj said:


> Alistair,
> 
> can you remind me, do you use the water out of your tap or RO, RO/Tapwater mix? If it is tapwater could you tell me what the parameters? I imagine it must be soft, acidic?



Hi Sanj 
Yes of course mate.  I use water straight from the tap. My water is very soft and comes out about ph 6.8 gh4 and kh 2 I think from last time I tested it. 
And I do small regular water changes to not have a big impact coupled with nutrasoil which also brings down the ph and kh a little more. 
In tank I think its much lower than the tap now

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## tim

Now licorice babies too  superb mate


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## sanj

> Hi Sanj
> Yes of course mate. I use water straight from the tap. My water is very soft and comes out about ph 6.8 gh4 and kh 2 I think from last time I tested it.
> And I do small regular water changes to not have a big impact coupled with nutrasoil which also brings down the ph and kh a little more.
> In tank I think its much lower than the tap now


Thanks Alistair, I was just wondering because it would be quite a bit of water to use if it was RO. They are really nice fish to keep, you are lucky though with your tap water.


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## Alastair

Well ivr finally caught all the fish and feel quite sad that this journal is coming to an end. Especially given how the fish have rewarded me with plenty of babies. 

To add to that, I mentioned id seen a much much smaller licorice gourami which showed signs of breeding, ive come out with 6 more than went in and they are half the size of adults so im very very happy with that.  Very happy 

Just want to thank everyone for their kind and positive comments on this tank, wished it could have run longer to see it fully grown in but the new tank is underway from Friday. 

Thanks everyone


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## NanoJames

Nice one Alastair! It will be hard to top this one in your new tank!


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## sanj

Thats brilliant Alistair, exciting to find that your fish have successfully bred and multiplied.


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## Michael W

L..l...licorice juveniles!? Amazing, truly amazing, they're so hard to keep and monitor due to their shy behaviour let alone breed. It really shows that the environment you have created is fantastic and meets the need of the fish you are keeping, you didn't just focus on aquascapes but also the fishes' needs. You live stocks are not surviving but they are thriving. 

I am genuinely impressed, licorice and chocolate gouramis are 2 of my most favourite fish and since I don't keep them due to the lack of self confidence, it really makes me happy to see others have success with them. I truly aspire to be able to accomplish what you've done some day. 

Hats off to you sir!

Michael.


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## Aron_Dip

Alastair said:


> wished it could have run longer to see it fully grown in but the new tank is underway from Friday.


 
Looking forward to it mate  ... And this tank will make way to something special ................... i feel it in my bones!


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## Alastair

sanj said:


> Thats brilliant Alistair, exciting to find that your fish have successfully bred and multiplied.



Hi Sanj 
It sure is. Especially the licorice.  Seems a shame to have to have taken their home away from them as they were clearly very happy.  My paros seem bullet proof.



Michael W said:


> L..l...licorice juveniles!? Amazing, truly amazing, they're so hard to keep and monitor due to their shy behaviour let alone breed. It really shows that the environment you have created is fantastic and meets the need of the fish you are keeping, you didn't just focus on aquascapes but also the fishes' needs. You live stocks are not surviving but they are thriving.
> 
> I am genuinely impressed, licorice and chocolate gouramis are 2 of my most favourite fish and since I don't keep them due to the lack of self confidence, it really makes me happy to see others have success with them. I truly aspire to be able to accomplish what you've done some day.
> 
> Hats off to you sir!
> 
> Michael.



Thanks michael thats really really confidence enspiring and given me that extra to want to do as good in my next tank. I may set up a specific tank for the licorice for breeding so I can have the water really tannin stained and super soft and acidic. Something like a little 60 litre.  
I cant really have the new tank tea stained unfortunately.  Would spoil the image I have. 
I think that's why I missed them breed to due to their shyness. Although they would come out when I put my face to the glass as they knew it was feeding time. Do feel sad to have taken away there home though. 



Aron_Dip said:


> Looking forward to it mate  ... And this tank will make way to something special ................... i feel it in my bones!







Ha ha me too mate.  
This tank is just murky now.  I couldnt catch all the zillions of shrimp because of this 

The Maidenhair still looks as lovely.  Its roots have grown into the emmersed moss so it all came away as one. Much easier to attach to the new tank now






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## Aron_Dip

I spy a TMC tank in the way lol ....

That tank looks so small to the new 1 ... But its massive its self haha


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## Michael W

Al is going to start a new trend with that red net, I can see it having good contrast against the green of the plants as one swish and swirl it while catching the fish.


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## Alastair

Aron_Dip said:


> I spy a TMC tank in the way lol ....
> 
> That tank looks so small to the new 1 ... But its massive its self haha



Seems diddy in comparison to the new one mate. 



Michael W said:


> Al is going to start a new trend with that red net, I can see it having good contrast against the green of the plants as one swish and swirl it while catching the fish.




Still catching tank inhabitants. ... mainly teeny crystal blacks


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## Ady34

Hats off to you Alastair, a great achievement successfully breeding and rearing those gouramis.
Its a shame to see the tank closed down, but here's to the next intriguing instalment


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## Alastair

Ady34 said:


> Hats off to you Alastair, a great achievement successfully breeding and rearing those gouramis.
> Its a shame to see the tank closed down, but here's to the next intriguing instalment



Thanks Ady. Hopefully the next one will look half decent too. 
Speaking of breeding. ... look at this already.  
This is in the temporary holding tub.
Female on top with a chin full of fry (hence the balloon chin) and the male underneath guarding her 




No stopping these at the moment


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## sa80mark

Fantastic mate it looks like youve got this breeding lark nailed


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## Michael W

You really must praise mouthbrooders, they take parental care to the next level.


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## faizal

I know that I'm too late in commenting here but,..good gracious me Alastair !!!   My dream fish is the gourami. I would be happy enough just to keep them healthy,...but to have them breeding for you mate !!! Congratulations & I hope they bring you tonnes of fun. You have earned it !!! I am so happy for you.

I love Pearl Gouramis,...so magical. I know you need a big tank to keep them happy, low surface movements, clean water , lots of shade, ..but what else do you think would make them feel at home?

In your experience what are the factors that one should take into account in successfully keeping gourami fishes?


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## Michael W

Hi Faizal, I'm sure Al won't mind me giving some insight on keeping pearl gouramis. I think the factors you have mentioned is key to keeping pearls happy. I also, think keeping them in groups will help a lot! They will colour up and become less shy for sure as I believe they love socialising, this can be in a form of aggression just a peck here an there, not serious stuff. You can even see them use their pelvic fins feeling each other which I believe is also another social interaction/communication which goes to show a group is preferred. When I have kept them in pairs they would still do well, but if one passes away the other becomes shy until a replacement was found.

Michael.


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## scrud

bit late replying on this one but wow!


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## aliclarke86

I miss this tank 

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## Alastair

aliclarke86 said:


> I miss this tank
> 
> Sent from my GT-I9505G using Tapatalk



Me too ali. Seriously do. Its in the garage currently but keep wondering what it would have looked like now


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## Michael W

You might need a certain box for a grow out tank in the future once everything gets into full breeding swing


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## ourmanflint

Fantastic tank and pretty amazing that your Chocolates are breeding! Tried them years ago with no luck, so will be copying your setup next time! 
Cheers


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## Phil Edwards

Michael W said:


> You really must praise mouthbrooders, they take parental care to the next level.


 I tried that on my girlfriend and she told me that's not how it works…



Congrats on the babies Al!


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## Richardbunting

Alastair said:


> Thanks michael thats really really confidence enspiring and given me that extra to want to do as good in my next tank. I may set up a specific tank for the licorice for breeding so I can have the water really tannin stained and super soft and acidic. Something like a little 60 litre.
> I cant really have the new tank tea stained unfortunately.  Would spoil the
> 
> The Maidenhair still looks as lovely.  Its roots have grown into the emmersed moss so it all came away as one. Much easier to attach to the new tank now
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk 2



Hi alastair

I am intrigued to know how you did that moss covering on your immersed plant? And what species is it?

Ive got my amazon shower caddies and im waiting for some hydroton as we speak 

I love the low tech approach

Cheers richard.


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