# The Dream...planning for a massive Wabi...



## bigmatt (16 Mar 2011)

So, after seeing a few amazing Wabi Kusa tank in Garuf's lovely "Get Excited..." thread (i highly recommend having a browse - great body of ever expanding work!) which sadly i'm too stupid to copy here, i'm thinking about building a massive Wabi Kusa setup over the next few months, just to see what i can make of it.
THe root for this is a tank i acquired for free a while back.  It's no beauty - used t be a shop tank with all the wear and tear that implies - but the dimensions are perfect fr this kind of thing - 5ft x 2ft wide x 18in deep (or so).  I have most of the hardware - couple of spare external filters set in the garage, and thinking about setting up a couple of cheap B&Q floodlights for the lighting...
So, this is the idea... The tank is to be set up in my unheated garage, meaning i can heat the water but not the emersed parts.  It also means i can go BIG!!!!    and this is a list of things i'm thinking and could do with some help with as i've never done emersed before

1) I'm thinking about two rock piles emerging from the water, perhap with a waterfall (filter outlet) running down one of them.  I'd like to build a couple of small pools in these rock piles.  Becaise of the projected size of the project normal landscape rock is prohibitively expensive - does anyone have any ideas as to what rock i could use?  Must be cheap!  I was thinking about grafting rock onto a foam base to make it easier to "build"  - probably using filler foam that i'll then shape

2) Because the garage is unheated i need to know what plants can grow emersed in UK conditions

3) It will get no natural light - will this prohibit moss growth?

4) Please point out everything else i've missed!

Thanks, as always, for looking and for your help

Matt


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## Anonymous (16 Mar 2011)

1) Rocks can be also collected, you don't have to buy them, for moss growth I'd also recommend lava rock, it's lighter than most stones and you can build massive structures.
2) Generally mosses do fine at lower temperatures, other plants I don't know .. check them before buying.
3) Why don't you install one Solar Tube in your garage?

Cheers,
Mike


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## Bobtastic (16 Mar 2011)

I've got no advise or help to offer. Tho, I'm really interested to see how this project pans out! Hope you can keep a detailed journal.


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## Piper (16 Mar 2011)

What temp do you need to keep the water at? You will need a big heater if you are going much above say 15oc.


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## ghostsword (16 Mar 2011)

Hi, I had hygros growing outside on the garden, from March to October, hydrocotyle also grows very well, as long with hairgrasses and lileaopsis. 

The issue is that plants will grow slower if the weather is too cold and they will die if the soil freezes.

Look on my flickr pages for my garden plants.. 

Hydrocotyle and hairgrass growing in the garden:




http://www.flickr.com/photos/ghostsword/4713292492/

Mixed hygros on the garden:



http://www.flickr.com/photos/ghostsword/4812496638/


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## Garuf (16 Mar 2011)

http://ukaps.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f= ... =wabi+kusa
Something like this? I'll be watching, your plans sound amazing!


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## bigmatt (17 Mar 2011)

ghostsword said:
			
		

> Hydrocotyle and hairgrass growing in the garden:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Hydrocotyle looks fabulous emersed - i'll be 'avin some o' that!  

Cheers Luis!



			
				Piper said:
			
		

> What temp do you need to keep the water at? You will need a big heater if you are going much above say 15oc.


Not sure - might not go heated if i can avoid it, as that might be a bit of a money hole.  Less heating would also mean less evaporation and maintenance.  Think this may be a fish free setup due to the location, unless anyone knows any small fish i could reasonably keep in an unheated tank?



			
				Bobtastic said:
			
		

> I've got no advise or help to offer. Tho, I'm really interested to see how this project pans out! Hope you can keep a detailed journal.


Thanks Bobtastic!  I'll be taking rubbish pics with my point and shoot camera!



			
				clonitza said:
			
		

> 1) Rocks can be also collected, you don't have to buy them, for moss growth I'd also recommend lava rock, it's lighter than most stones and you can build massive structures.
> 2) Generally mosses do fine at lower temperatures, other plants I don't know .. check them before buying.
> 3) Why don't you install one Solar Tube in your garage?
> 
> ...



Mosses - YES!!!!  Lava Rock - MASSIVE YES!!!!!!!!!  Thinking i might go for a Lava ROck/Massive bogwood arrangement
Solar tube is a great idea but will ramp up the cost compared to a £10 floodlight!
THanks Mike!



			
				Garuf said:
			
		

> http://ukaps.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=11893&hilit=wabi+kusa
> Something like this? I'll be watching, your plans sound amazing!



That's the monkey Garuf!  Knew i'd seen an AMAZING tank somewhere that started this off for me, and that's it!  THis is probably one of my all time favourites.  I won't get within a sniff of this, but i'll be giving it a damn good go if this ever gets off the ground! (£150 car repair is already going to delay things a bit...  )

As always folks im lovin' your work - thanks for the assists - keep 'em comin'!
Matt


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## bigmatt (17 Mar 2011)

Just having a look round and think some hygrophila difformis and Myriophyllum Aquaticum with some mosses (any suggestions for coldwater mosses anyone) submerged may do a good job if mirrored by terrestrial ferns and mosses emersed...
M


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## a1Matt (18 Mar 2011)

bigmatt said:
			
		

> unless anyone knows any small fish i could reasonably keep in an unheated tank?



You could look at coldwater fish instead of tropical.
Wildwoods have some fantastic coldwater fish, some you could easily mistake for tropicals.


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## Garuf (18 Mar 2011)

Slate would be good, vivarium builders are the kings of faking it, look at the threads on dendro-board about it. 
This thread will tempt you further, What about a sump? They're cheaper than anything and you can put a heater or two in there to tide things over. 
Look at temparate fish, most will be fine in the summer, the winter it would be a matter of ensuring the water is never lower than 10c and they'll be super happy, cherry shrimp spring to mind instantly. 
These two blogs will inspire you further, I know they make me want to scape every single time I look at them.
http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/parts- ... -jrnl.html
&
http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/member ... arium.html
Also, think about natives, many plants will be perfectly suitable for this project.


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## bigmatt (20 Mar 2011)

Not really thought about using natives but it's a great idea!  Wonder where i can catch some signal crayfish locally?  A couple of them would look amazing!
Those vivariums are pretty special - the guy obvioulsy has a talent (and a very understanding wife!)
Thanks as always
Matt


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## bigmatt (31 Mar 2011)

So...after ideas posted here and in this thread

http://ukaps.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=15303

I think i might go down the "indoor pond" route - using native/pond plants to see what i can create.  Should save a fortune on heating, and teamed with some kind of auto top-up system should make it fairly maintenance free.  
This placehttp://www.wetlandplants.co.uk/acatalog/index.html seems to stock a pretty good range (including a fontalis species!) - does anyone know of any other pond plant suppliers out there?
Thanks as always guys,
Matt


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## Tom (31 Mar 2011)

Can't you go to a garden center/aquatic shop?


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## bigmatt (31 Mar 2011)

Lacking good pond suppliers round here (unless anyone knows different?)
Cheers
Matt


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## bigmatt (4 Apr 2011)

> Mosses - YES!!!!  Lava Rock - MASSIVE YES!!!!!!!!!


Or maybe not ... out for a walk at Temple Newsam yesterday (for anyone living around Leeds the walk down from Bulelrhtorpe Lane to the house - goes through some lovely mixed woodland) and had a major bit of inspiration.  Unfortunately my camera still isn't talking to my computer (and i can't face the ironcially titled "Customer Service Assisstants" at Currys...) but there was a fallen tree with moss all over it's uprooted root system - looked amazing and very much the kind of thing i'd like to aim for, so i need to keep an eye open for big lumps of wood i can use!
Matt


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## howanic (4 Apr 2011)

I might be wrong but I think it is illegal to catch and keep signal crayfish. I think you can fish for them but you need to apply for a special licence, but you still can't keep them.


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## bigmatt (7 Apr 2011)

You're right mate - especially in Yorkshire apparently!  I had a look at the Environment Agency website.  Pity - i was looking forward to a good feed when i'd grown them on!
Thanks for the heads up!
Matt


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## howanic (8 Apr 2011)

Before I realised that it was illegal, I purged some in a tank in the garage and bbq'd them. I have to say though, not really worth the effort. I also kept a really tiny one in a tank. It grew so quick. Really unbelievable.


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## bigmatt (8 Apr 2011)

That's why they're a problem, as well as the Crayfish Clap they carry.  had a look on a few websites for info and some of the (presumably inbred) idiots on UK "survival" forums were applauding them as a source of free food.  Wallys!
Matt


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## howanic (8 Apr 2011)

I think they are not encouraging people to eat them as they have found that removing the large ones just makes space for more young ones. I got them form a private fishing lake that is completely overun with them. They remove roughly two wheely bin sized traps worth daily and it just gets worse. 

Have you seen mitten crabs in the Thames? They too are spreading so fast. 

Ps Sorry to go off topic


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