# Urgent help required



## Kanewickson (30 Jul 2019)

Hi guys

Sorry I’m new here but I’m posting in the hope someone can urgently help me. 

I recently have had a full garden revamp. Part of that was a 1.5m deep pond by around 2.4m wide. 

It was built using new oak sleepers and these sleepers sat on top of the liner that is in the pond. 

Here comes the big issue. 

The sleepers were all around the garden, and stupidly I have used creocote substitute to paint the sleepers. Today (a day after introducing my new koi I noticed the rain water has now caused the creocote substitute oil to drop into my pond and create a film. 

The pond is rectangular and is surrounded by the sleepers which have been concreted in, has anyone got any possible way they can think that I can resolve this situation urgently (tomorrow) to make sure I don’t cause any harm to the fish? 

I have just bought some water based pond paint (hindsight is a wonderful thing) and thought I could paint over the sleepers but any other suggestions would be very much appreciated. 

Thanks


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## alto (31 Jul 2019)

Sorry I’m not going to be much help but
- contact the product manufacturer for ingredients
(was the product thoroughly dry before using sleepers near pond?)
- remove koi to temporary quarters until you sort this out 
(perhaps a local retailer (or neighbour) will be able to hold the fish)


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## martin-green (31 Jul 2019)

The only answer has to be get the fish out and rebuild the pond.

Anything you "put on top" of the creosote substitute will have to be compatibe with the creosote substitute and be durable, in that if / when it  becomes exposed you don't want rain taking the (old) creosote substitute into the pond. 

Koi ponds are usually built with concrete and the coated with either G4 (a selaer) or fibreglass Or they are built with a liner and bricks (and G4) 

Koi are are not the easiest fish to keep and in order to survive need evrything to be 100%  a lot of thinking should be made before a koi pond is built, such as removing fish waste, during construction it is a good idea to add a bottom drain for this very purpose. There is also the filtration to consider, most koi pond owners build their own as it is better and cheaper than buying something "off the shelf"


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## martin-green (31 Jul 2019)

You may want to read about Fred and his koi pond build  Click here


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## Kanewickson (31 Jul 2019)

Thanks for the advice. I’ve attached the product that had been put on the sleepers. 

So I assume I will need to pump the water into a new housing for the pond, move the coy into the new housing and then potentially sand down and retreat the wood. 

I’ve ordered g4 and epoxy pond paint as well
hoping to cover it. Will this method not work? 

Another idea is for me to put some render onto the wood let it go off and then paint it with g4

Thoughts? 

If the pond has now already been built and the liner is in, is it impossible to put a bottom drain in?


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## martin-green (31 Jul 2019)

You have "contaimated the water" so why pump it elsewhere other than the drain?

You should remove all traces of the "creosote substitute" 
I do not know if g4 or expoxy paint is suitable for timber, I suggest you do your own research and find out, one thing I will say, a mate of mine painted his concrete pond with "expoxy pond paint" and within 4 days all the fish were dead, it was a pond paint, but not suitable for fish pond paint.
What ever you plan to paint with make sure it is suitable before you even buy it. 

You can't add a bottom drain if the liner is already in place, you would have to take the liner out  then install the bottom drain then reinstall the liner.

Others my not agree with what I am going to say but.............. 
I really believe you should do lots of reserach about koi, and koi ponds before you do anything else, you should only build a koi pond once, and you should always buy the best products you can afford, if you can't afford something, wait untill you can afford it, never try to cut corners.


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## john dory (31 Jul 2019)

Old railway sleepers will be saturated with diesel.


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## alto (31 Jul 2019)

The point of this type of product is that it penetrates the wood - sanding the surface may not be sufficient


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## martin-green (31 Jul 2019)

john dory said:


> Old railway sleepers will be saturated with diesel.



I believe that when new, a railway sleeper was left to soak in creosote and old engine oil for 2 weeks, to allow it to penetrate. However, what you and I would call a sleeper has now been replaced with an SSO* 
An SSO is usualy not treated with anything. 

*SSO = sleeper shaped object


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## sparkyweasel (31 Jul 2019)

I don't know about a solution, but I would cover the sleepers with plastic sheets or something similar, to keep the rain off, preventing more of the Creocote getting washed in if it rains again.


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## dean (1 Aug 2019)

You can try the paint 
It may stick to the wood or it may not you will have to test it 

The only other options are to remove the sleepers or cover then with something such as the paint or if that doesn’t stick then the only other thing I can think of is to use cement and render the sleepers then paint them 



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Kalum (1 Aug 2019)

That product is bitumen based which means it has petroleum in it and if you look at the data sheet on the same website you put a photo of above it actually mentions 'acute fish toxicity'

Unless you completely seal it then it will still leach so just painting it wont work

Stopping any run off either by sealing it or covering it or replacing are the only solutions in my eyes


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## Edvet (1 Aug 2019)

Replacing is the only viable solution in my eyes, sad but the hard truth.


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## sparkyweasel (1 Aug 2019)

I'm told 'Bedec Barn Paint' will paint over and seal creosote, but don't know if it's fish safe. Apparently the makers are helpful if you contact them for advice, so it could be worth asking them.
hth


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## martin-green (1 Aug 2019)

Bedec Barn Paint, doesn't look good for this use. For my money it has too many  "be careful ofs" 
As I said, if you can't afford to do something for a pond, then wait untill you can afford it, trying this and that only to have them fail later means money has been wasted twice, better off starting again, but with lots of planning before anything is done


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## frederick thompson (2 Aug 2019)

Kanewickson said:


> Hi guys
> 
> Sorry I’m new here but I’m posting in the hope someone can urgently help me.
> 
> ...


hi mate can t you buy another liner to go on top of the liner you already have. covering the contaminated sleepers. then put another new sleeper on top acting as a coping stone or use coping stones as your top holding point. then if it leeches it will go underneath and not in the ponds new liner. 
I agree with martin green you have to pump the old water away and use new water. in a holding tank. as the water will be contaminated. using dechlorinator for the water. also your filters will need a good clean out.
if you use all the different paints they may chemicaly  react. not a good idea in my opinion. and most paints in a pond don t last that long. so in a couple of years you would be back to square one. photo s would help to get a better idea.
fred


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## Franks (9 Aug 2019)

Frederick speaking sense here mate.

Good luck with it. Could you post some pics?


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## martin-green (10 Aug 2019)

I can not help but wonder if we will ever find out anymore. He asked for "Urgent help" to which he got several replies the next day, but in short the replies were "you have built the pond wrong" (Sorry but its a fact, he has made too many errors) I hope he has not "given up" or worse still for the Koi, I wonder is he "making do with what he has"

I believe it is fair to say we all want to help, but you can't help further unless we receive feedback/more information/progress report.


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