# 700l labour of love



## KirstyF (28 Nov 2021)

This tank has been a long time in the dreaming, but here and planted this weekend (mostly) so figured it was time to Journal.

Lots of firsts in this tank (was tempted to title this ‘the learning curve’ as I suspect this may be apt)
First Time for:
High Tec
Gyres for flow
DIY ferts
EI
At least 50% of the plants
Most of the kit I’m using
A tank big enough to have a bath in😂

So brace yourselves guys, I’m expecting to be posting lots of questions. 😊

Anyway, here’s the spec:
L84”, W24”, H22”
Optiwhite front and sides
Steel frame fully lidded cabinet
OA aquaria in Kidderminster did a fantastic job and their service is second to none.
2x Oase Biomaster Thermo 850’s (1550lph)
No issues with sucking air, burping or     excessive noise, just a bit of a hum….so far 🤞
2x Maxspect Gyre FX330’s (9000lph) set up to create flow along the long axis of the tank.
Tested the filters with spraybars but couldn’t achieve a good circular flow so plumped for the gyres. Currently running both at 40% so I don’t blow the plants out of the soil. Got a little sway at the furthest point so we’ll see how they get on.
Co2Art pro elite regulator with additional manifold
2x Yidao in-line reactors - no mods (yet!) 
1x59W and 1x46W Fluval Plant3 LED’s
These only make up a single strip so front to back coverage is currently not great but I blew my cash on the gyres so it’ll have to wait.

GH 12.6 (according to water report)
KH no idea - not on water report. An ancient dip test says about 6ish so….still no idea!!
PH - off gassed -7.2
Will be aiming at ph drop of 1unit by lights on. Co2 profiles in progress. 3hrs to get a 0.5 drop on this first attempt so a fair bit of tweaking still to do.
Tropica Aquasoil, sand, and bucket loads of lava rock underneath for height
DIY ferts - EI with an APFUK clone for micro’s
IFC calculator highly recommended, made DIY ferts so easy! 😊
Lights at 40% currently - 6hr photo period.
All plants are ‘low or medium’ light bar one and I’ve a fair few slow growers. Waiting on some more fast growers and floaters from lovely UKAPS folks and for AG to get some Albida Brown back in again. Need a little more moss and some more wood detailing too! 

Any comments or suggestions on the above welcome.

And now the pics
Please ignore:
The plumbing debacle on the right (will get some more appropriate fittings once I’ve decided I’m happy with flow set-up)
The obvious gaps (they will get filled) 
The lack of lid (I’ll put it on when the above is complete) 
The appalling glueing in places (no excuse for that one😂)


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## Geoffrey Rea (28 Nov 2021)

Simply wow @KirstyF 😍

Your rock work alone is excellent and in such a large scape! Following 😉


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## KirstyF (28 Nov 2021)

Geoffrey Rea said:


> Simply wow @KirstyF 😍
> 
> Your rock work alone is excellent and in such a large scape! Following 😉


Thank you so much.😊 My back may forgive me….eventually! 😂


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## John q (28 Nov 2021)

Not bad for a first attempt, but I bet you can't put a fruit pastel in your mouth without chewing it...

Only joking, tank looks fab.


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## bazz (29 Nov 2021)

KirstyF said:


> Thank you so much.😊 My back may forgive me….eventually! 😂


Worth the pain, looks great!


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## foxfish (29 Nov 2021)

Great start, well done and good luck with your PH profiling.


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## dw1305 (29 Nov 2021)

Hi all, 


KirstyF said:


> GH 12.6 (according to water report)
> KH no idea - not on water report.


Carbonate hardness (dKH) will probably be about 12 - 13 as well for <"geological reasons">


John q said:


> Only joking, tank looks fab.


Certainly does.

cheers Darrel


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## KirstyF (29 Nov 2021)

Hi Darrel
Thanks for that. Always so helpful to have a science buff chip in. 😊
So….as mentioned above, new to Co2 injection but my understanding is that whilst a higher KH will buffer PH, the relationship between Co2 and PH sits outside of that so the 1 unit drop would indicate 30ppm of Co2 (or thereabouts) regardless. Is that correct?
Also, I believe most plants will still grow at this level of KH without issue? Anything in particular to avoid/think about?
And lastly, anything else I should be aware of or be considering based on this KH level? 
Broad question I know but let’s run with it and see what comes up! 😊

Many thanks for your response.


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## dw1305 (29 Nov 2021)

Hi all,


KirstyF said:


> but my understanding is that whilst a higher KH will buffer PH, the relationship between Co2 and PH sits outside of that so the 1 unit drop would indicate 30ppm of Co2 (or thereabouts) regardless. Is that correct?


<"I think it is">. 


KirstyF said:


> science buff chip in


I don't really understand <"all the CO2 bits">.


KirstyF said:


> Also, I believe most plants will still grow at this level of KH without issue? Anything in particular to avoid/think about?
> And lastly, anything else I should be aware of or be considering based on this KH level?


I think most plants should be fine. @Geoffrey Rea or @Zeus. should be able to give you some "_plants to grow_" pointers. I might try @Roland as well as he uses low dKH water and may be able tell you plants that didn't do well in more carbonate rich water. _Rotala rotundifolia _looks a <"pretty good "canary"> for the iron (Fe) deficiencies etc. that are more likely to occur in harder water.

cheers Darrel


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## KirstyF (29 Nov 2021)

Also a ferts question. 
It was my first micro dose today and when making up the solution I realised that I have (NH4)6Mo7024x4H20 rather than NaMo04,2H20. Not sure if I’ve been sent the wrong one or my ordering mistake. Ive left it out of the solution for now.
Any issue with using this and, if ok to use, any change in dosing quantity? or should I just leave and order the correct salt? 

Many thanks


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## KirstyF (29 Nov 2021)

dw1305 said:


> Hi all,
> 
> <"I think it is">.
> 
> ...


Cheers Darrel
I’m using Fe 8% DTPA which I understand works better in harder water but I could certainly find a spot for that rotala. 👍


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## Laoshan (29 Nov 2021)

KirstyF said:


> So….as mentioned above, new to Co2 injection but my understanding is that whilst a higher KH will buffer PH, the relationship between Co2 and PH sits outside of that so the 1 unit drop would indicate 30ppm of Co2 (or thereabouts) regardless.


I would say there is a relation between KH, pH and CO2 level, as per the classic table. Perhaps this is a good reference article?









						The wrong way to read the pH/KH chart.
					

The pH/KH chart is often used to get a reading of CO2 levels in the tank. However, many folks go about this the wrong way. If you are estimating CO2 levels using only 1 pH reading - then chances are you are getting an incorrect estimation of CO2 levels. Read on to find out how to read pH/KH...




					www.2hraquarist.com
				




Amazing scape BTW!


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## KirstyF (29 Nov 2021)

Laoshan said:


> I would say there is a relation between KH, pH and CO2 level, as per the classic table. Perhaps this is a good reference article?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Thank you @Laoshan 😊
I think this article almost answers the query. 
I understand that if you have a low KH, PH can move more easily (in layman’s terms) and with a higher KH, PH can move less easily due to the buffering capacity of that KH (I’m not great on the science behind this) I was therefore not 100% sure whether having a high KH would impact the PH drop that is induced specifically by Co2 injection.
This article states (in short) that, with a KH between 1 and 10, you should just aim for the 1PH drop from your ‘normal’ level (de-gassed) in order to achieve the approximate 30ppm of Co2 as the charts don’t account for all variables. 
I am therefore assuming that the 1 unit drop will result in approx 30ppm of Co2 regardless of what you start with, although interestingly it doesn’t mention whether a different method should be used if over 10KH, so I guess the question remains - is there a level of KH that would ‘interfere’ with achieving IRO 30ppm Co2 via a 1unit PH drop. i.e Can buffering capacity change this at some point? 
I think ultimately the 1ph drop works (at least as a starting point) for most folks so I’m good with that. Just my head ticking over! 😊
Hope that makes sense!


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## Laoshan (29 Nov 2021)

It does make sense. I am not an expert here, just thinking along with you.

However, as KH represents the buffering capacity with regards to acidity, a higher KH means more acid is needed to lower pH a given amount. Therefore, much more than 30 ppm of CO2, acting as carbonic acid in the water, may be needed to lower pH by 1 at a KH of say 15, as is shown in the CO2 table. So you might be adding a bit too much CO2 when aiming for a 1 unit pH drop in water with a very high KH. Chemistry aside, it is always important to keep monitoring the fish and other critters while adjusting CO2, as I have learned the hard way…


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## KirstyF (30 Nov 2021)

Re-tested de-gassed water after 2 point calibration of PH pen and actual PH is 7.4.
Second attempt at Co2 and got to 6.5 at lights on but with gas on 4hrs before lights. 
PH then stayed at 6.5 with just a couple of dips to 6.4 throughout photoperiod, so fairly stable.👍

4hrs seems a long time and I’m pumping a ton of gas to achieve this. A constant stream of bubbles through each of the two reactors (too many to count), so not very efficient at the mo. Might play with the inlet positions later but stable is good so happy for now. 

I also noticed that as soon as the regulator kicked in, the working pressure dropped from its setting of 45psi to about 20psi and I  had to adjust to get it back up. Anyone experienced a similar issue? Don’t want to have to be adjusting daily!


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## dw1305 (30 Nov 2021)

Hi all,


KirstyF said:


> I realised that I have (NH4)6Mo7024x4H20 rather than NaMo04,2H20. Not sure if I’ve been sent the wrong one or my ordering mistake. Ive left it out of the solution for now.
> Any issue with using this and, if ok to use, any change in dosing quantity?


That is <"ammonium heptamolybdate tetrahydrate"> ((NH4)6Mo7O24.4H20), rather than (mono)sodium molybdate dihydrate (NaMoO4.2H2O).

You can use it, you are only interested in the molybdenum (Mo) content and it isn't actually <"that toxic to fish"> as a compound, even in doses many times higher than you are ever going to use.

To find out how much you would need to give you an equivalent dosing to the sodium molybdate you need to work out the Relative Molecular Mass (RMM) of each, and their percentage molybdenum, using the Relative Atomic Mass (RAM) of each element.

Because I do a bit of this sort of thing I have <"a spreadsheet with a periodic table embedded"> in it etc.

In this case there is quite a bit of adding up to do, but the RMM of ammonium molydate is 1236 and molybdenum has a RAM of 96. You have 7 molybdenum atoms which gives you 672 (7*96) and 672/1236 = 54% Mo for ammonium molybdate.

For sodium molybdate it is 44% molybdenum and 8.1 g of ammonium molybdate supplies as much Mo as 10 g of sodium molybdate.

cheers Darrel


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## KirstyF (30 Nov 2021)

dw1305 said:


> Hi all,
> 
> That is <"ammonium heptamolybdate tetrahydrate"> ((NH4)6Mo7O24.4H20), rather than sodium molybdate dihydrate (NaMoO4.2H2O).
> 
> ...



That’s fab and thank you for doing the math for me. Ur a star! 😊


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## dw1305 (30 Nov 2021)

Hi all,


KirstyF said:


> thank you for doing the math for me.


You are good, it doesn't take me long because I have a spreadsheet already set-up. If I had to start from scratch every time it would take a lot longer.

The <"Periodic table"> underlies all the <"nutrient calculators">, like our own <"IFC one"> etc. <"Microsoft have a template you can buy">, but there are plenty of free ones on the web (or you can type our own out).

In this case I had to look up the RAM for molybdenum (on the periodic table), because it isn't an element we use very frequently (it is used in the reagent for <"PO4--- testing">).

cheers Darrel


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## Wolf6 (30 Nov 2021)

KirstyF said:


> Re-tested de-gassed water after 2 point calibration of PH pen and actual PH is 7.4.
> Second attempt at Co2 and got to 6.5 at lights on but with gas on 4hrs before lights.
> PH then stayed at 6.5 with just a couple of dips to 6.4 throughout photoperiod, so fairly stable.👍
> 
> ...


My tank starts 4.5 hours before lights on and holds about 350liters. Only using a co2 bazooka under return pump inlet though so not the most efficiënt co2 diffusion, but anyways point is that it doesnt matter much if you have to start early provided you can keep it stable during lights on


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## John q (30 Nov 2021)

4hrs to reach a .9 drop probably isn't perfect Kirsty but that's how long it takes me to get a 1 point drop in a 240l tank. Like wolf points out getting it stable is the main thing, i can get it to drop quicker than 4hrs but then it continues to drop throughout the photo period.

@Zeus.  Or @ceg4048  would be the best people to advise on this as they both have experience with large volume tanks.


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## KirstyF (30 Nov 2021)

Wolf6 said:


> My tank starts 4.5 hours before lights on and holds about 350liters. Only using a co2 bazooka under return pump inlet though so not the most efficiënt co2 diffusion, but anyways point is that it doesnt matter much if you have to start early provided you can keep it stable during lights on





John q said:


> 4hrs to reach a .9 drop probably isn't perfect Kirsty but that's how long it takes me to get a 1 point drop in a 240l tank. Like wolf points out getting it stable is the main thing, i can get it to drop quicker than 4hrs but then it continues to drop throughout the photo period.
> 
> Thanks guys
> I’ve managed stable and have green drop checkers at both ends of the tank so I think I’ll just count my blessings for now. Re-assuring to know that it’s not just me! 😊
> ...


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## KirstyF (30 Nov 2021)

dw1305 said:


> Hi all,
> 
> You are good, it doesn't take me long because I have a spreadsheet already set-up. If I had to start from scratch every time it would take a lot longer.
> 
> ...



Working through your links and interesting to see these connections. Picking things up as I go along (albeit slowly 😂)
Thanks again, micro solution all sorted now. 👍


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## Zeus. (1 Dec 2021)

Great start 👍
Getting a 1.0pH drop on a 700l tank will take some doing an use quite a bit of CO2. I managed to get a 1.3pH drop on 500l tank in less than 30mins, but that was with twin injection/needle valves and solenoids then twin reactors. Plus had a duel stage regulator so can adjust the working PSI. I had one line with needle valve fully open, this was only on for pH drop. Other needle valve was open some ( how much I don't know). The second line was on for all the CO2 period. The second line held the pH stable from lights on till CO2 off. I adjusted the injection rate by increasing/decreasing working PSI. Once I got a stable pH on second line I just timed how long it took to drop pH with both on. Using twin injection like I did does carry big risks if you get the timings wrong- mass death of all fish shrimp and snails.
I found the gyres great also.
Great to hear you found the IFC calculator useful👍
Getting a 1.0pH drop with single injection will take longer and 4hrs plus to get it doesn't surprise me at all. My 6.5Kg clyinder lasted about a month


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## KirstyF (1 Dec 2021)

Zeus. said:


> Great start 👍
> Getting a 1.0pH drop on a 700l tank will take some doing an use quite a bit of CO2. I managed to get a 1.3pH drop on 500l tank in less than 30mins, but that was with twin injection/needle valves and solenoids then twin reactors. Plus had a duel stage regulator so can adjust the working PSI. I had one line with needle valve fully open, this was only on for pH drop. Other needle valve was open some ( how much I don't know). The second line was on for all the CO2 period. The second line held the pH stable from lights on till CO2 off. I adjusted the injection rate by increasing/decreasing working PSI. Once I got a stable pH on second line I just timed how long it took to drop pH with both on. Using twin injection like I did does carry big risks if you get the timings wrong- mass death of all fish shrimp and snails.
> I found the gyres great also.
> Great to hear you found the IFC calculator useful👍
> Getting a 1.0pH drop with single injection will take longer and 4hrs plus to get it doesn't surprise me at all. My 6.5Kg clyinder lasted about a month



I had a great evening reading your journal a wee while back (end to end it’s quite a read) and my consideration of using the gyres was in fact inspired by that. 👍
The IFC calculator is just fab. 😊
I’m not so brave to use your method for Co2 without ur control system though to be fair, although that rapid drop would be nice. 
I’ve got two reactors running from a dual stage regulator with twin manifolds as I had thought I might get away with sprinkler bars and wanted Co2 in both. That didn’t work out but still running both. I think I’m likely off-gassing quite a bit as the outlets are close to the surface and there’s a fair bit of agitation from the gyres. I may get better efficiency with some tweaking but happy with consistency for now. 

I am having a ‘mare however, with keeping the working pressure on the regulator. I’ve posted a query in the Co2 art section on this forum and also emailed them (no response so far) but each day when my solenoid kicks in, I lose my working pressure and have to manually re-set everything to get the Co2 running. 
I’m off work this week for the tank start up but this will be a problem come next week if I can’t sort it out quickly. 🙁 if you or anyone else has got any ideas on that, it would be really helpful.!


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## Zeus. (1 Dec 2021)

I use to run my working PSI at 50 to get the 1.3 pH drop, when I ran it at a lower pH drop I had it much lower even 20PSI or less. You could use twin meddle valves twin injection off one solenoid and use both reactors. Which isn't the same as twin solenoids. Which a larger tank you need more CO2 injection. Not sure how @Filip Krupa did his on his 2000 litre beast, would give link but on mobile. I am sure he didn't do it the same way as me 
CO2 used Database you may find useful


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## KirstyF (1 Dec 2021)

Zeus. said:


> I use to run my working PSI at 50 to get the 1.3 pH drop, when I ran it at a lower pH drop I had it much lower even 20PSI or less. You could use twin meddle valves twin injection off one solenoid and use both reactors. Which isn't the same as twin solenoids. Which a larger tank you need more CO2 injection. Not sure how @Filip Krupa did his on his 2000 litre beast, would give link but on mobile. I am sure he didn't do it the same way as me
> CO2 used Database you may find useful



My problem is I’m running at 45psi (which I think is the recommended for running 2 manifolds) and getting a really good stable ph level throughout photo period, the working pressure maintains at 45psi no problem at all and stays that way overnight after the Co2 is off. The next day, as soon as the solenoid switches itself on, the psi drops to about 15 and Co2 is next to nothing. I left it for 45mins today to see if it would come back up by itself but no joy, so manually re-set everything back to 45psi and am having another great day of stable PH. Can’t be here to re-set manually every day though so not sure what the issue is.
I wondered whether maybe, because the bubble count is so high, as soon as the solenoid starts letting the gas through, it creates this huge drop in pressure which then doesn’t re-build, but I’m no engineer. 

I’d assume that these things are designed to manage this somehow so not sure how to resolve! 🙁

I might try running a higher psi but close the needle valves off a little more which should effectively achieve the same bubble rate and maybe this will work better but that’s just random clutching at straws to be fair.

Such a pain when the stability is so good once it’s running. 😡


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## bazz (1 Dec 2021)

Hi,
Have you tried using a lower working pressure, most reactors that I know of only require around 1 bar pressure as there is no ceramic membrane requiring gas to be forced through.
I have exactly the same equipment but only running one outlet, a single Sera 1000 at 17psi, the other was for an inline diffuser which I needed to run in tandem a while back to supplement a very unsatisfactory AM 1000.
Have you tried shutting off the reg, opening both needle valves pretty much all the way and then opening/controlling gas with the reg? Might be worth a try as I find control with the reg easier and more accurate than twiddling with the needle valves.
You have a large aquarium which is going to require a lot of gas.
Cheers!


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## KirstyF (1 Dec 2021)

bazz said:


> Hi,
> Have you tried using a lower working pressure, most reactors that I know of only require around 1 bar pressure as there is no ceramic membrane requiring gas to be forced through.
> I have exactly the same equipment but only running one outlet, a single Sera 1000 at 17psi, the other was for an inline diffuser which I needed to run in tandem a while back to supplement a very unsatisfactory AM 1000.
> Have you tried shutting off the reg, opening both needle valves pretty much all the way and then opening/controlling gas with the reg? Might be worth a try as I find control with the reg easier and more accurate than twiddling with the needle valves.
> ...



Happy to give that a whirl. 

I was using 45psi as, with multiple manifolds, the recommendation on the Co2 Art website is 40-60psi. As you probably know, you can have up to 5 and I have 2 so figured the lower end of that range made sense.

I Will certainly give this a try though and see if it helps.

Many thanks 😊


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## KirstyF (2 Dec 2021)

Well I didn’t get to try your suggestion @bazz. I had already re-set working pressure yesterday after photoperiod to 57psi (top end of advised range, tolerance on this model is Max 80psi) still got the same issue this morning with it dropping back to 10-15 when solenoid kicked in. Did a manual re-set but then it dropped again. Tried another manual re-set and now can’t get any working pressure at all. 🙁 guessing my regulator is knackered! I’ve had a response on the Co2 art section on this forum so let’s see how that goes. Hopefully a new regulator a bit quick! 

I am now blessed with a low tech, high tech tank!! 🙄

Lights are only at 40%, dosing full EI, and doing daily 50% water changes until Monday when I go back to work and water changes will then, by necessity, move to twice per week. 

Hoping the plants won’t freak out over the loss of Co2 but any other suggestions/advice on mitigating that issue are welcome.


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## bazz (2 Dec 2021)

Ok, well good luck, it's not ideal but everything will alright with low light. I set up a 40cm cube 3 months ago with new soil and only slow growers, lit by an AI Prime running at 10% and no CO2 and there has been no algae whatsoever.


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## KirstyF (6 Dec 2021)

10 days in and back to work tomorrow so time for an update.

Finally got the Co2 working again so first day of Co2 back in tank 👍 now running profile again to get levels back steady. 

Have completed a 50% water change daily so getting to be an expert at rolling that pipe out 😂

Had some stems and floaters from the lovely @John q and @aec34 on Friday so they are all settling in.

Got a little growth showing here and there on some of the faster growing plants and the moss is starting to fluff up, but lighting is still low so not expecting things to go rampant on me. The only plant that has really suffered is the Monte Carlo. Not doing so bad where planted in soil though not fabulous, but completely melted on the rocks and has now been removed. 

Might try again though once the tank settles a bit and Co2 is consistent. 







Little bit of melt on a couple of the crypt parva but the wendtii tropica are still looking good. 

No algae as yet, just some white fungus on the wood, which is to be expected.

I’ve upped the lighting on the left hand side to 50% from 40% as the substrate level over that side is so much lower down and I thought it might help the planted Monte Carlo out a little, but will hold at this level now for a while and let things stabilise.

All round fairly happy with things and thanks again to John and Amy for their generous plant parcels. 😊


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## KirstyF (10 Dec 2021)

So…..BBA has arrived 🙄

It seems to be primarily on wood at the moment and the worst patch (image below) is in an area of quite high flow. I’ve not spotted any on plants as yet. 

I’m currently assuming this is down to an increase in organic waste as I’ve had alot of Monte Carlo melt, as mentioned before, and I’ve got a bit of melt on some dwarf hair grass too, plus the Co2 issues with my regulator failing probably haven’t helped. 

I’ve increased Co2 slightly and doing another PH profile profile today (in between Work emails 😂) It’s 6.3 and holding (half way through photo period at the moment) which is a 1.1 drop, but no fishes yet so I don’t think that will do any harm. 

Lights are still 40% 50%. 

Will do a good clean up tonight and a large water change and I’ll be doing another water change on Sunday.

I’ve ordered some APT fix, which should arrive tomorrow so can do some spot dosing with the WC on Sunday.

Any other suggestions and I’m all ears. Just trying to remember it’s a new tank and not to get too twitchy. 😳 It’s hard!! 😂


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## Wolf6 (10 Dec 2021)

Its hard to tell from the pic but it could also just be the black type of fungus on wood. If that is the case it's easy to remove with a toothbrush.


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## KirstyF (10 Dec 2021)

I didn’t know that wood got black fungus. I thought it was all white. I’ve got a good bit of the white stuff in places and am just scraping that off as you say. It’ll pass in time. 

This black stuff does look like tufts though so I figured BBA may be the culprit. If it’s just wood fungus that would be a result. 

White fungus




Second photo of suspect BBA. Not sure if this is any better!


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## KirstyF (10 Dec 2021)

Toothbrush will be out with the WC later either way. 😊


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## Wolf6 (10 Dec 2021)

I've seen various fungus types on wood: fuzzy white, slimey white, fuzzy black and jelly like red with white fungus. Black one doesn't get eaten like the other colours in my tank but also disappears after a few weeks/months.


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## KirstyF (10 Dec 2021)

Well I’ll give it a scrub later, see how easy it comes off, and keep my fingers crossed for it not being BBA.🤞


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## KirstyF (10 Dec 2021)

You could be right @Wolf6 . Came off really easy under gentle rubbing and I understand that BBA is generally a bit tougher?

I’m glad to say that I’ve never had BBA so my identification skills may be somewhat lacking. 😏😊


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## KirstyF (19 Dec 2021)

3 week update (4wks running including 1 week dark start)

Got some melt on my Buce but new leaves too so just adapting to being submersed I believe. 






The new Buce from @GHNelson have been in a week. In perfect condition despite my very slow local post and settling in beautifully. 😊 Thanks Hoggie! 

Some of the older leaves on the pinnifitada are a little sad too but new growth is romping away.





I have an amazing collection of wood fungus. 😂 This is less than a weeks growth. Quite fascinating stuff tbf though I won’t be too heartbroken when it decides enough is enough. 😊














Also got a tiny amount of diatoms on a couple of sandy areas; whipped out with the gravel cleaner during WC. Still at 2x50% WC’s pw. 

Also some new inhabitants making themselves at home as of yesterday. 😊




Regulator has been behaving itself, Co2 tweaked to a 1unit drop and holding steady. 👍 

Looks like the BBA was a false alarm as @Wolf6 said so (touch wood) no algae as yet.

Got another small batch of plants coming from AG this week, including the Albida Brown I wanted, so can fill in a couple of bare patches and will post some 1month progress pics next week.

Now if only I could get these little balls of aquasoil to stop running off to places they are not meant to be. 😂


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## Tankless (19 Dec 2021)

The amanos will carry the balls of soil onto the sand. I've witnessed them do it multiple times back in my first scape.


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## KirstyF (19 Dec 2021)

Tankless said:


> The amanos will carry the balls of soil onto the sand. I've witnessed them do it multiple times back in my first scape.


😂😂 it’s like having kids…training them to take it back could be a challenge! 😂 There could be a niche market for that I reckon! 😉


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## KirstyF (24 Dec 2021)

So….4 weeks in. 

Co2 regulator packed up again so a 5 day wait for a replacement now. Hoping the plants will forgive me. 

All this on again, off again is far from ideal but keeping lights low and hoping things don’t suffer too much. 

Popped my Albida browns and a few more AR mini in, along with a Crypt flamingo and have some more weeping moss to add on next WC. 

Wood fluff seems to be slowly reducing, and the diatoms are even less now. Could be time passing or maybe busy amano’s 

Pretty much all the melting Buce are producing new leaves and things are growing so generally i think we are looking good.

Keeping up with WC’s twice per week and thinking I’ll continue that until the Buce are all clean. 

Lights still at 40/50% and still no algae 🤞

















Still haven’t put the lid on. 😂

Merry Xmas to all. 🎄 😊


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## heliophyte (24 Dec 2021)

Looks very promising.
Merry Xmas to you as well!


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## KirstyF (8 Jan 2022)

6 weeks in now and there have been a few changes.

Finally got the replacement regulator a week ago and pleased to say it is doing everything it is supposed to, so that’s a relief. Now dialling in (again) albeit it very carefully, as I now have some fishes. 

Re-tested off-gassed water and found tap to be at 7.4ph as expected but tank was 7.5ph. Samples were both floated in open top bottles so tested at tank temperature. With aquasoil and wood in the tank, if anything, I would have expected tank ph to be lower than tap. Rock maybe having an impact?? 

Either way this now gives a ph target of 6.5ph at lights on. I currently have a steady 6.7ph throughout photo period and drop checkers are a fairly good green. Tweaked up very slightly today and will continue to monitor. 

I have increased photo period from 6hrs (plus 30 min ramp up/ramp down) to 7hrs, mainly for the benefit of fishes as the room gets very little light otherwise. Still at 40-50% lighting and not planning to play with this until that Co2 has been stable for a while.

I have, however, added a little aquasky LED that I had knocking around, at the front middle of the tank to get a little more light across the front of the wood centrepiece. Much more pleasing to the eye now. 

I’ve also re-plumbed. Having previously had all the flow running right to left across the tank, this resulted in pretty strong flow at one end to get some gentle sway at the other. Had good drop checker colour (on the occasions the Co2 was working) and plants seemed to be ok with this but the new fishes, not so much. A couple of buffetings in that strong flow and they all took up residence up the quiet end! 

I therefore now have a canister at each end with inlet and outlet in the back corners. Outlets are running through a short spray bar ( in-line reactor on each) on the back of the tank and I have placed a gyre on the back next to each spray bar directed to front of tank and reduced their outputs. I would have expected this to leave me a dead spot in the middle but am still seeing some gentle movement there, so hoping the distribution is ok. Not aesthetically pleasing as the gyres are now horribly obvious but I’m just looking at the happy fish and trying to un-see them. 😏





I’ll monitor my Co2 tweak for the next couple of days and then plan to move the drop checkers to front middle and back middle to see what that tells me. Probably still have room to tweak the gyres up a little if needed. 

The fishes, however, are now merrily using the whole of the tank so they are pleased with the change at least. 

I’ve also noticed the algae below on one of my anubias. Any help to ID would be good, as I’m not great at it, but it doesn’t wipe off under gentle finger pressure. Could be early staghorn maybe? Considering the flow changes and regulator issues, this is probably not too much of a surprise, but I’ve just added some SAE’s which I hope will tidy things up whilst the tank re-settles. 





Lastly, I’ve noted that my PH just before gas on is sitting at 7.2ph, which would imply that the tank is not fully off-gassing overnight. Is this more usual when using reactors as Co2 is more dissolved or would this indicate that I would benefit from more surface agitation? I’ve got a good strong ripple over 2/3rds of the surface but the middle 1/3rd is pretty much flat.

Growth is not super fast compared to some (probably due to the lower light) but things are starting to fill out. 

Fauna now consists of 22 cardinal tetra, 12 otto’s, 3 SAE and 10 Amano’s.


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## KirstyF (8 Jan 2022)

Please ignore the repeat photo’s at the bottom. Phone was getting hinky and I didn’t think these had attached. 😂


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## ScapingScotsman (12 Jan 2022)

How are you finding the gyres in terms of flow coverage kirsty. I've been looking at one myself as I only have two central outlets from my sump.


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## KirstyF (12 Jan 2022)

Hi There

Is this for your L150 L’aquarium by chance?

I did a quick search and found some picci’s on your journal (haven’t read it through yet but your hardscaping was lovely 😊) so, i’m assuming this is the one. 

It looks like you may be pretty much committed to a forward flow.

I believe for a 5ft tank the gyre would certainly give you adequate flow if set up across the long axis of the tank but the forward flow from your central pipes would then interrupt this and cause disruption that you would probably want to avoid. If set up on the back of the tank, facing forward, a gyre would complement your existing flow pattern but with only one gyre you would need to pick one side or the other and flow would be uneven. 2 gyres (one each side) would give you the ideal flow pattern but they will then be hugely overpowered for what you need. 

You can dial them down of course, so the world is your oyster really, but it’s a fair bit of money to spend. You would likely not exceed 10 - 20% max before the flow would become too turbulent. 

I’ve just re-configured my flow from long axis to ‘front to back’ and I don’t expect to use more than 20%, even with the tank being a little higher and deeper than yours. (They basically act like spray bar replacements as my canisters are not powerful enough to operate longer spray bars effectively)

If your flow isn’t giving you enough spread, is there any way you could turn your outlets 90 degrees sideways and attach a spray bar to each one? (Guessing this may be tricky on those outlets) 

If this is feasible and your sump pump can deliver enough flow, you would effectively be creating something similar to the front to back gyre flow pattern but at a fraction of the cost. Failing all else (even if you can cobble something together cheaply that’s not very pretty) it would allow you to asses how that pattern works in your tank and you could then decide whether to upgrade to a prettier version (possibly even with a stronger pump if you needed it) or to invest in the gyres (or similar) as a tidier solution. 

Just my thoughts! 😊


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## KirstyF (15 Jan 2022)

Update, mostly just for my own reference. 7 weeks in. Co2 still stable. 

Spots on Anubias and Alternanthera. Advised by @John q its likely GSA. Upping  P to 6ppm from 3ppm from tomorrow (Water change today) and will monitor.

Distorted leaves on Alternanthera trimmed off as per advice from @GHNelson. 











Suspected Staghorn on Anubias pretty much clear. No sign of any new. 

New crypts from @aec34 have been in for a week, all settling down, no sign of melt so far. New Salvinia also still nice and green. 

30 Celestial Pearl Danio added today. Surprised at how ‘out and about’ they were straight away (they could teach the, still very shy, comparatively huge, SAE’s a thing or two 😂) Live baby brine shrimp ready to feed tomorrow. Let’s hope they like ‘em.


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## John q (15 Jan 2022)

KirstyF said:


> Distorted leaves on Alternanthera trimmed off as per advice from @GHNelson.


Don't forget to give @Geoffrey Rea  a shout out lol. 🤩


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## KirstyF (15 Jan 2022)

John q said:


> Don't forget to give @Geoffrey Rea a shout out lol. 🤩



Massive apologies @Geoffrey Rea . Always good to blank a moderator I feel. @KirstyF , your UKAPS page is no longer working, can’t imagine why!! 😂



KirstyF said:


> Distorted leaves on Alternanthera trimmed off as per advice from @GHNelson.



Edit
Distorted leaves on Alternanthera trimmed off as per advice from @Geoffrey Rea.
🤪


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## KirstyF (15 Jan 2022)

Thanks @John q 👍


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## ScapingScotsman (16 Jan 2022)

KirstyF said:


> Hi There
> 
> Is this for your L150 L’aquarium by chance?
> 
> ...


Hiya Kirsty, 

Thanks ya for your reply. I didn't get a notification for this, odd. But, yes it's for the l'aquarium 720.

My thinking was to attach the wavemaker attachments onto the outlets, which would drastically soften flow, the pump in a 10,000 lph but fully controllable, and was thinking to maybe knock it down a fair wee bit, as its effectively just feeding the water flowing from my co2 reactor. It's torrid flow otherwise and I don't think fauna would fair well being blown around that much. 

I did actually give spray bar ideas a thought, would be something I could knock up once I'd worked out how many holes per bar I'd need. However I do like the options that come with the gyres, and my main idea was purely for very long spaced timing of a nice pulse so it would give the lower hard to reach areas a waft and be off later in the evening and night. 

Will see how it goes but thank you so much


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## ScapingScotsman (16 Jan 2022)

KirstyF said:


> Update, mostly just for my own reference. 7 weeks in. Co2 still stable.
> 
> Spots on Anubias and Alternanthera. Advised by @John q its likely GSA. Upping  P to 6ppm from 3ppm from tomorrow (Water change today) and will monitor.
> 
> ...


Such beautfil fish these are, must look magnificent as a shoal


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## KirstyF (16 Jan 2022)

ScapingScotsman said:


> Hiya Kirsty,
> 
> Thanks ya for your reply. I didn't get a notification for this, odd. But, yes it's for the l'aquarium 720.
> 
> ...



I might be misunderstanding your explanation here as the gyres are fully independent and don’t ‘attach’ to anything (other than the power cable and the control box) 

You would, however be able to use them to increase circulation/distribution in the tank and reduce the output of your sump pump if it’s a bit wild.

I only have 3000lt ph (rated) going through my canisters for the purpose of filtration etc (4 - 4.5 x water volume) and we all know that rated isn’t actual, so it will be less than that. The remaining in-tank ‘flow’ is just water being moved around by gyres. 

Note: I am a believer, however, that, in a planted tank, less biofiltration is needed (as the whole system effectively does this) and the lower turnover still provides adequate mechanical filtration as long as maintenance is good. 

The gyres would, however, definitely give you flexibility in your flow rates so you can get that Co2 into the tough to reach places and use neat little tricks like increasing flow for a while after a good clean up, to keep detritus suspended whilst your sump clears it out etc. 😊


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## KirstyF (16 Jan 2022)

ScapingScotsman said:


> Such beautfil fish these are, must look magnificent as a shoal



They are little stunners.😊
At the moment shoaling is definitely a bit of a misnomer though. I’ve got a fair few hanging out amongst my central stems but can see individuals literally from one end of the tank to the other so they are more independent than I was expecting.

First feeding time shortly so hoping they will all swim in for snacks.


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## ScapingScotsman (16 Jan 2022)

KirstyF said:


> I might be misunderstanding your explanation here as the gyres are fully independent and don’t ‘attach’ to anything (other than the power cable and the control box)
> 
> You would, however be able to use them to increase circulation/distribution in the tank and reduce the output of your sump pump if it’s a bit wild.
> 
> ...


Oh sorry, I was referring to attachments that came with the tank itself. Little impellors inside them that act like a mini wavemaker haha 😊


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## bazz (16 Jan 2022)

ScapingScotsman said:


> However I do like the options that come with the gyres, and my main idea was purely for very long spaced timing of a nice pulse so it would give the lower hard to reach areas a waft and be off later in the evening and night.


Hi,
I don't know how much you know about the Gyres but they can be disassembled and reconstructed to give a multitude of configurations, along with the power options I'm sure with a bit of experimentation you will be able find an ideal flow pattern.
Cheers!


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## KirstyF (16 Jan 2022)

ScapingScotsman said:


> Oh sorry, I was referring to attachments that came with the tank itself. Little impellors inside them that act like a mini wavemaker haha 😊



Aha, got it, that makes much more sense. 😊


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## Hufsa (16 Jan 2022)

Ive been meaning to comment on this journal and your skills, you almost seem to have sprouted out of the ground a fully formed expert aquarist which is very impressive and also very unfair to some of us who have been sucking at this for a long time 😂😁 
Love your tank and everything you bring to the forum, looking forward to the next full tank shot especially 😄


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## KirstyF (16 Jan 2022)

Hufsa said:


> Ive been meaning to comment on this journal and your skills, you almost seem to have sprouted out of the ground a fully formed expert aquarist which is very impressive and also very unfair to some of us who have been sucking at this for a long time 😂😁
> Love your tank and everything you bring to the forum, looking forward to the next full tank shot especially 😄



Wow, thank you so much, that’s a lovely thing to say, although IMO I have a looong way to go.

My first words on the journal were ‘it’s been a long time in the dreaming’, There’s been lots of reading, lots of research and a couple of historic low light, low tech, didn’t really know what I was doing tanks. So if I’ve picked up anything, it is no small part down to the all the lovely folks on this forum. I’ve been reading on and off for near two years before joining, whilst I was without a tank, but planning this one.

My journey of practical experience has, I think, just begun. 😊


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## Antix8989 (17 Jan 2022)

oh dang. I currently have "I want a bigger one-itus" and this isn't helping.


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## Planted_Box (17 Jan 2022)

very nice wish i had the space.


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## KirstyF (17 Jan 2022)

Stan510 said:


> For the Alternanthera ,they seem to really like Potassium just as much if not more than Iron glutamate.



Let’s hope so 👍😊



Stan510 said:


> Good looking aquarium with the red stand and boo shades is it an Asian theme? I don't see many fishes but the Algae eaters.



Nah, I just like the colour. It’s kinda orangey red and I have a very old beaten up, orange Chesterfield style sofa, so it works for me.

Fish are SAE’s and Ottos (clean up) cardinal tetra and CPD’s ‘cos they’re pretty (CPD’s are proving to be fun little characters too) not completely decided on what else yet. 



Stan510 said:


> Good luck you have so much room to work with too.





Antix8989 said:


> oh dang. I currently have "I want a bigger one-itus" and this isn't helping.





Planted_Box said:


> very nice wish i had the space.



The trick is you buy a house to fit ur aquarium rather than an aquarium to fit your house!!😂

Bit of a family joke - I had very specific ‘must be able to fit a 7ft aquarium’ criteria when I bought the house 2yrs ago. (Nothing like getting your priorities right eh!! 👍)

Then I just had to save for a couple more years to buy the aquarium to go in it. 😂


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## KirstyF (21 Jan 2022)

8 weeks, nearly! Early post as I’m away for a couple of days.

Alternanthera new leaves seem to be doing ok and I’ll continue to nip off the older damaged ones a little at a time I think. 






Existing GSA is not showing signs of improvement although it’s only been 5 days since increasing Po4 to 8ppm.





Having had a really good nose around, the GSA does seem to be effecting old Althernanthera growth and Anubias pretty much exclusively and is worse where exposed to higher light. (Albeit only at 40/50%) 

The Anubias in the image is far and away the worst, and in the brightest location, so I think I will find it a new shadier home, drop the light just a smidge on that side, keep nipping away at the Alternanthera, and we’ll see how the Po4 deals with the remaining spots I have here and there. 

I believe a Po4 ‘bath’ can also help with stubborn areas so that’s in the toolkit, but will see how we get on for a couple of weeks first. 

Good growth on the stems so I’ve topped and re-planted a few. Will let the bottoms branch/re-grow for now. The fish are happy playing in them and I’d rather keep the biomass, so I’ll wait til I’ve ‘doubled down’ a little more before pulling any out. 

The tank is definitely filling out now (the pinnifitada is going bonkers) and I’m pretty happy with how the right 2/3rds is coming along. 

The left is still a little ‘bare’. Need to get round to having another go at that Monte Carlo on some of the rocks (epiphyte) as well as some more moss on the lighter stones. I think this will help to bring it together better. The Vals will help once they get going too.

Loving the colour coming through on this little flamingo. 😊





The CPD’s are just a joy. Still virtually no shoaling behaviour but little groups darting about all over and fascinating to watch. 

A few tank shots to finish off.


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## KirstyF (6 Feb 2022)

10 weeks. 
AR’s are definitely doing better.







3 weeks now of Po4 at 8ppm. GSA is not increasing and nothing showing on new leaves. All old affected leaves now pinched off. 
The Anubias now has a shadier spot and I’ve left the GSA affected leaves in place as I was curious as to whether it would clear. As you can see below….not so far….but it’s not spreading to the clean leaves either so  just keeping an eye on it at the moment. 





Still have some on rocks….





…..but not unhappy with how this looks, so don’t really mind if it stays, as long as plants remain clear. Will keep up with the extra Po4 and monitor this too for a while I think. 

Done a bit more topping and re-planting of my central stems and removed a few that were previously topped. Left the giant hygrophila difformis as both myself and the fish are quite enjoying it. Not sure it looks entirely appropriate but it makes me smile so hey ho! It’s kinda like having a big old redwood back there!! 





Added some leaf litter today. Pre-soaked for 24hrs but still needed a bit of holding down with (rather unsightly) pebbles. Hoping the fishies will enjoy these little piles though. Might add some more next week. 










Note to self- Co2 tank on red though not fully empty - 5 weeks use. (replaced as I’m away for next 3 days) 

Also added some new fishies last week. 😊
Finally decided on glowlight danios for my 3rd larger group. Beautiful, active, really fun to watch and they interact readily with my other groups. Like the CPD’s they hang out and dance in little gangs when they choose but are otherwise spread far and wide…..and nigh on impossible to photograph! 😂

Also decided on Peacock Gudgeon for my ‘centrepiece’ fish. Went round and round regarding dwarf cichlids but ultimately decided against for now. Maybe another time, another tank!  

So 8 Gudgeons in. Taking a little longer to settle but starting to hang out at the tank front and show a bit of curiosity about what’s going on in the room. 

Having to do a bit of target feeding with frozen but they are already starting to come up with the others at dinner time so that bodes well. 😊

Able to photograph these….albeit badly! 🙄







Other than that, things are growing and ticking along nicely.  Feel like I’m getting on top of the GSA issue, so maybe some new plantings in the next week or two. 

Oh, and I finally put the lid on. 😂


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## KirstyF (20 Feb 2022)

12 Weeks.
3 weeks in for the new fishies. Had some horrible losses with the glowlight danios. Following some input from forum folks, established that they were jumping (down the back of the tank of course, where I couldn’t see them, but a search with a flashlight told the tale) 🙁 Have now netted off all possible exit points and have today replaced the losses and increased the group size so hopefully this will help them settle. Kind offer from @Wookii of some additional floaters will give some extra cover too when they arrive. 😊 

Also added 15 gorgeous gold cloud mountain minnows, and will likely increase that group size in a couple of weeks. I think the schools will all benefit and feel more secure with more fish in tank.










Po4 increase has been in for 5 weeks now.

GSA on the Anubias that was moved to a shady spot has all but disappeared. 👍





Still a little GSA on Anubias in other slightly brighter locations but only on older leaves. Will leave this as is. With the extra floaters I can develop a few more shady spots and or/move some things around depending on how that works out. 

I slowed the flow down slightly for a couple of weeks to help the peacock gudgeons settle and noticed some very slight fuzziness on the edges of a few foreground leaves which I think may be connected. (Barely noticeable so nothing I can identify yet) The peacocks are doing great and flow has been back to normal for a week now so monitoring to see if the ‘fuzzy’ disappears or turns into something I can photograph for comment. 

Added some Rotala Rotundifolia and some Monte Carlo (as an epiphyte) last week.

The RR original leaves are looking a little sad but new tips are growing. Will be interesting to watch this transform into submersed state and experiment a little with light impact on colour. 




The Monte Carlo is still looking ok. a week in, which is better than the last lot did so 🤞.




Also added moss to some of the paler foreground rocks as they were too stark, and have a scapers pad of fissidens that still needs a home 🤔

The Ottos haven’t shown masses of interest in the new leaves that have been added but in fairness they don’t seem to show much interest in anything that’s added. Their little tummies are still podgy though so I’m guessing they must be getting most of what they need from the tank. The CPD’s however seem to like having a little ferret about in them now and then, so someone’s enjoying them at least. 😊

Note for reference - Full filter clean completed this week.


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## Wookii (20 Feb 2022)

KirstyF said:


> Kind offer from @Wookii of some additional floaters will give some extra cover too when they arrive. 😊



As much as I can squeeze in a C5 box will be in the post to you tonight @KirstyF  👍🏻


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## KirstyF (20 Feb 2022)

Wookii said:


> As much as I can squeeze in a C5 box will be in the post to you tonight @KirstyF  👍🏻


Ur a star. 😊
 £5.00 forum donation. Done 👍


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## hypnogogia (20 Feb 2022)

This is  my favourite tank on here right now.


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## KirstyF (6 Mar 2022)

14 Weeks.

I’ve managed to keep my hands out of the tank for the last two weeks (other than a bit of cleaning and WC’s) and the new group of glowlight danio seem to have settled in well with the ‘old’ group. They also all hang out quite a bit with the new Gold Cloud Mountain Minnows so I think adding them at the same time was probably a good call.

The tank however had got a bit wild so had a good going over yesterday, with some plant moves, trimming and whatnot. The GLD’s were a bit zippy but kept under close obs for a couple of hrs….and no escape attempts. 👍

Main changes are the pinnatifida, which had been going great guns, but suddenly decided they wanted to drop most of their lower leaves and start melting 😡 Co2 levels have been stable, no deficiency signs on any other plants and floating salvinia is looking great so I’m discounting ferts as an issue, but I wonder if things got a little congested resulting in poor flow and also lost a lot of the light to the lower leaves….so drastic measures….start again!!  I’ve pulled all of the old plants out and re-attached a number of plantlets back to the same position, so will be interesting to see if these now take off and whether it again reaches a ‘critical mass’ at some point in the future. Maybe a bit more trimming is in order this time around.😊
I think this is the ‘husbandry by trial and error’ approach. 😂

I’ve also split and spread out my floating hydrocotyle (which seems to be thriving) to a couple of new spots, and thinned out the hygrophila difformis behind the central log on the right. Popped a few hygrophila polysperma cuttings in and also some AR stems, from the shady far right hand side of the tank, to see how they do there with a bit more light. They are currently growing but not thriving in the shady spot, with long internodes and not much colour so think they may do better in that locale, assuming they forgive me for moving them of course. 🤞

Left most of the ‘giant Difformis tree’ to the left of the log so the fishes still get that cover that they like but would ultimately like to try some other stems back there. 

The new floaters from @Wookii are settling and providing some extra cover on the more exposed surface on the left of the tank. Developed a bit of yellowing on some leaves but seeing nice new green leaves sprouting. I also got this little one as an added extra, which I am quite pleased about. I’ve made an executive decision that she is identifying as a girl and called her Gloria 😊 




The Monte Carlo is showing some melt but also seeing some teeny bright new leaves so 🤞




The RR are starting to show some more submersed growth. They got a little crowded out by some manic tripartita, which has now had a good trim so will see how they go on.




Also, finally figured out the food that Otto’s will go bonkers for….2 day old courgette slime. 🤢 Having forgotten to remove at the usual 24hr point, it was mostly mush, at which point, the otto’s couldn’t get enough of it. They are eating the nice expensive Repashy now but not with quite so much enthusiasm. Kids and junk food huh! 🙄

I’ve also added 22 Vietnamese Mountain Minnows. Fell in love and couldn’t resist them. They are beautiful and currently looking pretty happy cruising their new space 😍….I’m also totally blaming @Wookii for telling me I could have more fish in my tank. 😉😂 




I Still feel like the tank needs a fair bit of tweaking to get to where my head wants it to be aesthetically, but it’s getting there. Clearly I need to get a couple of plant hunting trips under my belt…..well that’s my excuse and I’m sticking to it. 😇


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## SpencerBurge (6 Mar 2022)

My counting wasn't too bad then! If you have need of some Water Lettuce as a good floating plant I have plenty. It stops my Sparkling Gourami from jumping out. 

Very nice to see the tank in detail, you've showed me a few photos and it's really nice to see it develop over the months as a journal. 

How is the Oase filter doing?


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## KirstyF (6 Mar 2022)

Hi There Spencer. 

Yep, it was close. 😂

Just for everybody else’s benefit. This is the lovely chap who I bought my 20 (22 😉) VMM’s from yesterday (and my previous CPD’s)…….and he got me a discount too. Superstar! 😊

I’ve found the filters to be great. I get a very occasional light purge that you can hear but other than that nothing more than a quiet hum, and the pre-filter is just a dream, makes maintenance so much easier. Probably not the strongest flow but I have fairly long pipe runs to make access easier, which probably slow things down a little. With my gyres it’s less of an issue for me. I would recommend them for sure.

Nice to see you here and looking forward to your first journal. Marine or planted!!??……now there’s a question. 😉

Oh and…. good luck with the new job! 👍


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## KirstyF (6 Mar 2022)

SpencerBurge said:


> If you have need of some Water Lettuce as a good floating plant I have plenty. It stops my Sparkling Gourami from jumping out.



Thanks Spencer, appreciate it.  I’m good for now but I’ll let you know if that changes. 😊


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## Karmicnull (6 Mar 2022)

I love the way you've used your space to have different dioramas as you move from one end to the other - it's like having several tanks in one. Feeling envious!


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## SpencerBurge (6 Mar 2022)

Thank-you! We only recently started to stock the Oase externals alongside the fluval range and honestly the build quality on the 600 was great.

I had been warned about the heat output not being enough to disperse fully throughout the tank, but I'm not sure how reliable that information was. A colleague said he cichlid tank clogged the pre filter sponges that came with the filter but he has since switched to a coarse sponge. But he had a tank of large cichlids which I think may be an edge case.

I shall miss the shop, the guys were great as were a lot of the customers. But I need those weekends off!

So what's next for this tank? You've got some great stock in there and the scape is excellent. Certainly large enough for a group of chocolate gourami (if you can find some good ones).


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## KirstyF (6 Mar 2022)

Thank you @Karmicnull 😊

As I work away often, I’m limited to just the one tank so I wanted to create a place that would make me want to keep coming back to wander through it. 

I’m glad you like it.😊


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## KirstyF (6 Mar 2022)

SpencerBurge said:


> I had been warned about the heat output not being enough to disperse fully throughout the tank, but I'm not sure how reliable that information was. A colleague said he cichlid tank clogged the pre filter sponges that came with the filter but he has since switched to a coarse sponge. But he had a tank of large cichlids which I think may be an edge case.



I’ve certainly had no issues with temps and have found them to be both accurate and stable, although in fairness, the tank is in a heated room so the heaters aren’t working too hard. 

I think quite a few people opt for coarser sponge (mostly to increase flow) but I’ve never really had an issue with the standard sponges. I do clean the pre-filters every week however and they always need it. 



SpencerBurge said:


> So what's next for this tank? You've got some great stock in there and the scape is excellent. Certainly large enough for a group of chocolate gourami (if you can find some good ones).



Well, I threw in a bunch of fast growers in that mid section for biomass when I started so that’s the area I’d like to work on next. Will probably swap most of it out once I find the ‘right’ plants. 

As for fishies, I do like chocolate (and sparkling and honey) gourami but my flow might be more than they would be happy with. 

I’ll probably let all my recent additions settle in for a while and then…..🤔


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## Karmicnull (6 Mar 2022)

KirstyF said:


> As I work away often


Do you have a designated fish feeder for when you're away? I can't work out whether the opportunity to overfeed increases or diminishes as the tank gets bigger!


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## KirstyF (7 Mar 2022)

Karmicnull said:


> Do you have a designated fish feeder for when you're away? I can't work out whether the opportunity to overfeed increases or diminishes as the tank gets bigger!



My old folks live in part of my house so, yes, built in tank sitters. Mum is well ‘trained’ and doses my pre-mixed ferts as well as feeding the fish daily. I give her a list of what to feed each day and update quantities as fish numbers increase etc. 

I think it can be either! With a lot of mouths to feed, the worry is that everybody gets a share so it needs to be enough but it’s easy to add too much, just to make sure. (Definitely did this when my peacocks first arrived as they started out a bit shy) 

I feed however, almost exclusively in the water column, so smaller frozen foods or micro granules etc and I break down larger grains, like bug bites for example (and anything else I might feed) so that even the smallest fish can eat them. I then feed with the pumps running. The vast majority will remain suspended and swirling around all over so everybody gets some, and I watch them eat to make sure that’s working out. They get a couple of mins back to clear water, twice per day…done! 
Knowing that everybody is getting to the food gives more confidence to feed more sparingly I think. 

I feed a couple of wafers or courgette or Repashy 3xpw, nominally for the SAE’s and otto’s, who mostly ignore it or eat it at night when I’m not looking, but they have round tummies so I’m guessing they’re ok.

A bigger tank may at least be more forgiving of overfeeding I guess but lots of different types of fish with different feeding habits/needs, now that would be a tougher nut to crack!!


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## Hufsa (7 Mar 2022)

Beautiful! And so much room for activities 😍


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## KirstyF (7 Mar 2022)

Hufsa said:


> Beautiful! And so much room for activities 😍



Thanks Hufsa 😊

I can just imagine what you and @shangman would do with this tank….think of all the preciousness’s 🤪
I should invite you guys to a planting party but I’m not sure there are enough species to cover it. 😉😂


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## DeepMetropolis (21 Mar 2022)

Looks nice. Always a sucker for large planted tanks! Wish I could have an bigger one.


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## KirstyF (3 Apr 2022)

18 Weeks

Been a while since my last update so lots happening.

The Vietnamese Mountain Minnows have settled in beautifully. They really are gorgeous little fish. Tend to break into smaller groups and very active all over the tank.

Happy to say no further glowlight losses either so the netting to prevent jumping and the larger fish numbers seems to have worked.

I’ve also added a few Cherry shrimp, that have unsurprisingly disappeared off into the tank and rarely seen since, but I get a glimpse of the odd one occasionally so I’m assuming they are in there somewhere. Hopefully making babies that are good at hiding from my fish.🤞 

The AR is still a problem child. New leaves are coming through fairly nicely but GSA on the older leaves is persistent. 😡






The Stems that I moved from a shady spot to a brighter area are showing better colour and internodes are shortening (as expected) Rotala Rotundifolia are also starting to show signs of un-stunting though not entirely happy yet. 





This is the RR that grew up inside the Pinitifida but now has access to light and flow. Not much growth in 4 weeks but the perfect example of going from stunted, with algae to un-stunted and improved growth now it has better conditions.





These will be trimmed and re-planted in due course.

New Mayaca Red has been in a couple of weeks. The red tips faded out initially but are just starting to pink up again so a work in progress.





The Pinitifida plantlets are growing a little, though not thriving yet, and I have now placed a brand new in-vitro plant in pretty much the same location. Curious to compare results!

The Wallichii experiment has also commenced. Can I grow these ‘soft water’ plants in my hard water tank? I’ve planted a group in their planned position behind my central log but also potted up a few and put them somewhere that I can both see and photograph them more easily. I will post progress in my ‘Wallichii alternative’ thread. 








Quite a few plants in transition but, all round,  I think some of my choices will benefit from additional light so I am now very slowly tweaking duration up to 8hrs (15 mins increase per week) and intensity is up by 2-3%per week. No resulting algae issues so far (touch wood 🤫) 





I’ve also just started front loading macro’s. I’ve been measuring TDS for a few weeks now, just to see what’s going on with the tank really, and front loading should make it easier to figure out impact of ferts on TDS measurements. Will also be interesting to see if there is any difference in plant health by comparison to spreading the ferts across the week. 

The tank is looking a bit scruffy at the moment. Waiting for new things to grow in and old things to come out (I also have aquasoil all over the place 🙄) but hey ho……obligatory full tank shot.  😊


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## KirstyF (3 Apr 2022)

Still don’t know why I keep getting random duplicate photo attachments at the end of the posts! User error I’m sure 🤪


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## The Miniaturist (3 Apr 2022)

Coming on beautifully, you have infinite patience waiting to see how things grow. I'd have kept putting extra plants in all over the place!
Nice to slump on the chesterfield & watch what you have created...
This probably won't mean much as my tank is 1/12th (!) the size of yours but I think lower light for a longer time can be beneficial to the plants. My photoperiod is 10hrs under dim little led lights, the plants just grow more slowly.


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## KirstyF (3 Apr 2022)

The Miniaturist said:


> Coming on beautifully, you have infinite patience waiting to see how things grow. I'd have kept putting extra plants in all over the place!
> Nice to slump on the chesterfield & watch what you have created...
> This probably won't mean much as my tank is 1/12th (!) the size of yours but I think lower light for a longer time can be beneficial to the plants. My photoperiod is 10hrs under dim little led lights, the plants just grow more slowly.



Thank you. It is getting there and yes, that end of the sofa is one of my favourite places in the house. 😊

I’ve been a keen gardener for a long time and in the garden it can easily take a year or more to establish a plant, confirm that it is happy in its spot and that I am happy with its placement so I’ve had lots of practice with being patient….although for some reason it is still so much harder to do this with the tank. 😂

Regarding the lights, they have been between 40 and 50% since starting out and I do think that keeping them low has been a large part of the reason why I have had virtually no algae issues, other than the bothersome AR GSA and even that is (I think) down to those particular plants not being entirely happy yet. 

I feel that I need to find the place where my light hungry plants are a bit happier but the tank isn’t running at super speed and I don’t think I’m quite there yet. Hopefully the very small increments of increase will help me find my sweet spot.

Out of curiosity, are you running Co2 and do you still increase Co2 period with the longer photoperiod? I’ve heard that the plants have basically had their fill of Co2 by the time you hit 5 or 6 hrs but the standard mantra is keep running up to 1hr before lights out. 

Just wondering how folks on longer photoperiods do it. 😊


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## foxfish (3 Apr 2022)

KirstyF said:


> Out of curiosity, are you running Co2 and do you still increase Co2 period with the longer photoperiod? I’ve heard that the plants have basically had their fill of Co2 by the time you hit 5 or 6 hrs but the standard mantra is keep running up to 1hr before lights out.
> 
> Just wondering how folks on longer photoperiods do it. 😊


You would use a less bright light.


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## The Miniaturist (3 Apr 2022)

I have always used low light, I like the shadowy effects it makes. LEDs are great now, they are so adjustable even the basic kind I use!
I've been given a sort of CO2 kit 😬 It's a plastic reservoir which goes in the tank & an airline runs to a disposable aerosol of CO2. Fill the reservoir in the morning & it dissolves through the day, very high tech!
I thought I might as well give it a try, even though the added CO2 would be minimal/negligible! Low light for 10 hours & ferts stayed the same.
Growth is no quicker but the plants seem more robust & healthier. I have some very shiny crypt leaves & the echinodorus ozelot grows leaves steadily.
It seems to work for my little 57l, I just want healthy plants & happy fish!


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## KirstyF (18 Apr 2022)

20 Weeks

Rotala Rotundifolia is bravely putting on a few more leaves and colouring up. Still needs a bit more growth before a trim an re-plant.




Mayaca Red not doing too much. Patience is perhaps a virtue with this one!




Pinitifida- The plantlet from the mother plant that melted is in the forefront of this pic (The V shaped pair of leaves and the longer green one) with the in-vitro’s behind. I’d say the in-vitro’s are winning this game, bushing up and showing new growth with no sign of melt. 👍
Let’s see if I can get this lot past 4months 🤞




Wallichii (if it is, in fact, Wallichii) is doing better than I expected (it hasn’t melted, stunted or died) so taking that as a win so far




The Monte Carlo epiphyte is still hanging on by its fingernails. Still not thriving but not given up on me yet.




The central log has had a few more additions and is starting to get the look that I’m after. A bit more time for this lot to grow in is required. These slow growers are just so slow! 🙄
















Altogether, just ticking along! 😊

Oh and, knocked up a couple of raised beds for the patio in my spare time too. 😂 Next job, clearing the darn blanket weed out of the pond. 😡


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## The Miniaturist (18 Apr 2022)

It's beautiful. Seeing a huge tank fill out & mature is great (especially when you have nano tanks!) 
You complain about slow growers being slow, bet you'll be moaning when the stem plants take off & you're trimming every week!! 😂


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## KirstyF (18 Apr 2022)

The Miniaturist said:


> It's beautiful. Seeing a huge tank fill out & mature is great (especially when you have nano tanks!)



Thank you. 🥰



The Miniaturist said:


> You complain about slow growers being slow, bet you'll be moaning when the stem plants take off & you're trimming every week!! 😂



You could be right. There may be armloads of them on the for sale/donation/please someone take these stems of me 🙏 page! 😂


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## KirstyF (15 May 2022)

24 Weeks……doesn’t time fly!!

The Rotala H’ra (which might not be H’ra ) is doing it’s thing. Mostly randomly flopping about now in a rather que sera sera kinda fashion, but the colour is rather lovely. 




Pinitifida is putting on some growth, the in vitro’s are still ahead of the game but even the plantlet from the mother plant is perking up. 







My collection of stems in pots is expanding so the Wallichii that’s not Wallichii (or at least not the type I was expecting) is ticking along and growing well enough but I’m not really loving it I’m afraid. 




The new Wallichii looks more like the right plant but it’s early days. Only been in a week or so, had a bit of melt on some stems and the others are not really showing much growth yet. Time will tell! 







And finally, some Cobomba, which is showing some new growth already and I like the form. 




I’ll give the new plants some growing time and then see if they make the cut for the ‘behind the log’ spot that I’m looking to fill.

The current Rotala variants that are in that spot are just a bit non-descript so won’t be staying. (Sorry guys, nothing personal!)




I’ve teased off a couple of plantlets from my Crypt flamingo without disturbing the main plant too much so hoping the ‘youngsters’ will settle in and do as well as the mother plant and also split a schismataglottis, though, as slow growers,  I’m expecting the new plantlets to take a while to bush up. 

Had a little bit of melt on a couple of the new epiphytes on the central log. An Anubias nana coin in particular is being a bit grumpy but I think it’ll recover.

The Vals are just randomly popping up all over the place, with lots of runners; even the smaller ones on the left are making a good effort at catching up with their big brothers now so will thin out and look to move a batch of these to the pond next weekend I think. 




Lights are up to around 60-65% now and I’ve finally placed a second light on the left to improve spread…….then found my spare timer is not working. Guess I’ll get that started up next weekend! 🙄

The Nurii Rosen Maiden have put on some new leaves and seem to be settling in really well. Just gorgeous colours. Thank you Hoggie for this lovely little plant. 😊




From a couple of quick checks, Co2 seems to have dropped back just a touch, could be additional plant mass but I’ll re-calibrate the pen, do a profile next weekend and tinker if needed.

Other than that just another Anubias to move to a shadier area. As the light increases, I’m definitely seeing algae pop up on some of these more exposed slow growers but working on the ‘right plant, right place’ theory, tweaking their position seems to do the trick! 
















😊


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## plantnoobdude (15 May 2022)

KirstyF said:


> 24 Weeks……doesn’t time fly!!
> 
> The Rotala H’ra (which might not be H’ra ) is doing it’s thing. Mostly randomly flopping about now in a rather que sera sera kinda fashion, but the colour is rather lovely.
> View attachment 188632
> ...


wallichii definitely seems right, please report back with how it grows in EI. tank looks nice!


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## KirstyF (5 Jun 2022)

27 Weeks

The Rotala (whatever) is throwing a mass of side shoots, so I’ve trimmed some tops and re-planted in another spot and am letting the side shoots grow on. 




I’m guessing a week or so before I can actually see the tops emerge from their hiding place but I think the colour will be nice in that position.




The Wallichii that’s not Walichii has been unceremoniously dumped into the new ‘hospital’ tank, which is low light and no Co2, so I’m not expecting much but we’ll see how long it takes to melt!!



plantnoobdude said:


> wallichii definitely seems right, please report back with how it grows in EI. tank looks nice!



The answer to this is, it doesn’t!! Total melt on the new batch, although I found a single stem floating this weekend that’s still alive. I’ve left it floating (let’s see if it gives me any roots) and am still tempted to try some in-vitro after I’m back from hols. Never say never eh! 😂

One of the flamingo plantlets that I split has popped me a new leaf and the rather depressed nana coin has perhaps decided it might stop sulking and has produced a couple of teeny new leaves too. Good little plant. 😊







The new light (a cheap as chips 75w aquarium eco) has been in for a couple of weeks on the left side of the tank. Using it on full throughout photoperiod and the plant 3 has been tweaked very slightly to 65%. No algae bloom 👍 and the extra spread  on that side looks much nicer I think. Hopefully the Alternanthera will continue to appreciate the extra par. The colour on these is much better now though I’m not sure if I will ever be able to grow this plant without getting some gsa on the lower leaves! 🙄

More Vals (12 of them 😳)  have been pulled out and donated to the hospital tank for now, along with various other trimmings. All grist to the mill for the cycling process and more for the pond at a later date, no doubt! 

The cobomba, in pots, have now been moved behind the central log to see what I think of them when they gain some more height but, unless the in-vitro Wallichii decide to actually grow, I shall re-visit the suggestions for red fine leaves stems and trial some for that spot.

Co2 had dropped back by around 0.1 and I’ve also noticed some slight twisting on alternanthera leaves so a tiny tweak done last week and monitoring. 

Had a bit of tidy up this week and refreshed some sand, mostly to cover up some of the ever present wandering aquasoil, and then sat and smiled at fishes for a couple of hrs. A nice way to finish of the BH weekend! 😊


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## KirstyF (11 Sep 2022)

41 weeks.

Wow! It’s been a long time since I did an update, figured it was somewhat overdue.

So what’s been going on.

Holiday Co2 fail I July. lots of algae - mostly cleared up in a week or so. AR mini got completely smothered in GSA however and have now been replaced with new in vitro plants, which are doing ok as they only have a little GSA on lower leaves. 🙄




In vitro Wallichii sat in the tank and looked like this for weeks. 




For now I have given up! My tank is not this plants happy place it seems! 

I think I missed a few bits of the ‘other’ mystery Wallichii that I dumped however and have a couple of these that have popped up. They have really put on some spread and I’m starting to like them. They can stay. 😊




The weeping moss on the bridging branch has been replaced with riccardia graeffei which should need a lot less trimming and I really like the look.




That little rosen maiden is now this:




And the baby flamingo is doing nicely….slow but pretty! 




The H’ra is growing strongly now and I’ve just hacked it back to shape it up. I think it will recover. 🤞

I’m still pulling Vals out by the armload to keep them in check!

And I have a new collection of lovelies, including:

Anubias Pangolino
Bucephalandra 'Black Ventii'
Bucephalandra 'Brownie Blue'
Bucephalandra 'Blue Green'
Bucephalandra "Brownie Ghost" (Aquaflora invitro)
Bucephalandra "Lamandau Purple"
Bucephalandra "Deep Purple"
Cryptocoryne "Purpurea" 
Cryptocoryne 'Queen Vandom”
Riccardia sp. "graeffei"
Plagiochilaceae sp. "Cameroon Moss"
Hydropogonella gymnostoma (Queen Moss)
Hookeriaceae sp. (Rare Moss / Hooker Moss)
"Troll Moss" from Norway

Just a selection:

















They had a very long trip but are all doing ok considering. 

My heartfelt thanks go out to @Hufsa who on hearing the news that I had confirmed fish TB in the tank (we won’t dwell on that) sent me these beauties to cheer me up! What an absolute star. 😍

A few wide shots to finish up.


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## KirstyF (13 Nov 2022)

50 weeks.
Close approaching 1 year on this tank and overdue an update.

Have been doing a whole bunch of experimenting for a good while now, which has been interesting and a great learning curve.

I started out on full EI, and not too much light 
Kno3 - 30ppm
Po4 - 3ppm
K - 30ppm 
An APFUK clone for macros with Fe at 0.5ppm 
Good, stable Co2 and plenty of flow (unchanged)
50% weekly WC (unchanged)

Not too many issues with the tank, but GSA was a nagging issue that this regime wasn’t solving, and some of the stems weren’t performing as well as I would like them to. 

Dropped my Micros by up to 1/5 of their original dose, including taking Fe (8% DTPA) from 0.5 to 0.1ppm, and got myself some lovely chlorosis.




Tried 0.3 ppm of DTPA….still not happy, tried 0.3ppm of DTPA and EDDHA mix….still not happy. 🤔

Tried 0.15 DTPA plus 0.15 gluconate (total 0.3ppm) all whilst leaving the remaining micros low…and fixed the chlorosis. 😊 So, where 0.3ppm of DTPA didn’t work. The same level with a gluconate mix did the trick. 🤔 




Stems seemed to like this regime and I guess I didn’t need anywhere near the level of other micros that I had been dosing after all!! 

Current:
Fe 0.3 (DTPA and gluconate)
Mn 0.15
B 0.02
Mo 0.005
Zn 0.02
Cu 0.006
For those that might care! 😉

Had constant GSA issues on AR mini (pretty much since they were planted) So….also Increased the light (not generally recommended for algae issues, right!!) This gave better colour and form but still GSA. (Though no worse than before) No amount of removing infected leaves seemed to do the trick, it kept coming back. H’ra was also loving this extra light too, cobomba responding well and pretty sure my new Ludwigia white wouldn’t be doing so well without it. All in, higher light was a good thing….but….

also developed nagging issues with GSA on slow growers after light increase (Anubias primarily). Took Po4 up as far as 8ppm with no real change, so that common fix didn’t do it for me. (Still dosing full EI level N and K at that point)  

Reducing light again would perhaps solve this issue but would the stems be as happy. I think not! 

So…..slowly stopped dosing N completely (tap at 30ppm plus) and eventually reduced Po4 and K down to 2ppm and 7ppm respectively. No noticeable negative impact but no real positive impact either. 

Eventually, gave up on the original AR’s (which had been in-vitro) and replaced them with new in-vitro plants and they’ve not missed a beat. No GSA on the new plants in the very same conditions! 🙄😂




So, it seems conditions were better for this plant but the original plants still couldn’t overcome the GSA issue that was already there. AR mini grow very slowly in my tank and perhaps don’t  respond so well to the stress of topping and re-planting. In this instance, fresh plants did just fine. 

Still got GSA on Anubias though. 😡 Finally increased Po4 back up to 6ppm and K up to 15ppm (now without that additional N) and GSA started receding. 








Around 5 weeks into this regime and plants are the cleanest I’ve seen in a long while. 












So, with super high N levels (tap plus 30ppm) in addition to high Po4 and K levels I still had GSA and yet with no additional N being dosed and P&K at fairly high but still lower levels than before, GSA seems to have reduced. 🤷‍♂️

I’m still planning to remove the Fe gluconate and go back to 0.3ppm DTPA only, to establish whether chlorosis returns at that level, and at some point will reduce Po4 to see if I can induce GSA…..why? Because I can, and maybe I’ll learn something from it. 😂

Co2 levels were maintained at the 1ph drop, kept stable, and flow was good throughout these ‘experiments’ in order to remove these as a variable. 

(Other than those few days of no Co2, back in the summer whilst on holiday, which resulted in a stack of algae issues, but wasn’t too tough to recover from.) 

Changes were also made slowly and as much as possible, one thing at a time, so the above has been done over a period of months. 

I’ve also planted all sorts, including crypts and blyxa, in inert sand (where I thought they may struggle) and watched them thrive, and learned that I can’t seem to grow Wallichii no matter what I do. 😂 (though I’m not sure I’ve given up on this yet 😉) 

So what can I conclude from all of this?

Well…..there’s many roads to Rome!! 

Having good stable Co2 (in an injected system) and good flow doesn’t solve everything but without it…..you are probably in trouble. 

Playing with ferts and light might cause you problems, but watching your plants respond to these changes is fascinating. I’ve learned more about my plant preferences and responses than I ever would have done if just left to a standard regime. 

What works for MY tank, may not work for others, so the above is not a ‘recipe for success’  only observations on my particular tank. Trial and error, however, is a lot of fun and the ecosystems that we manage are certainly never dull. 

Is it all about ferts?…..no! Is it all about Co2?…..no! Are regular WC’s and good maintenance a pre-requisite?….for me, that’s a yes but…mileage may vary. 😏 How much of a factor is time….now there’s the one thing you can never really test. The tank matures and maybe responses change as a result, but hey, you can’t go back and test again!! 

So that’s me, one year in….and lastly…..I couldn’t have got this far without input from others on this forum so thanks, as always, to all you crazy folks out there, with all your diverse opinions, ideas and contributions. 😍

Heres looking forward to another year of evolution. 😊


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## plantnoobdude (13 Nov 2022)

KirstyF said:


> the remaining micros Low


Micros are well, just that. *MICROS. 😂*

Glad you’re seeing improvements while fiddling with ferts😃 sure is fun isn’t it?


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## KirstyF (13 Nov 2022)

plantnoobdude said:


> Micros are well, just that. *MICROS. 😂*
> 
> Glad you’re seeing improvements while fiddling with ferts😃 sure is fun isn’t it?



Yep, it’s not for everyone but I enjoy the tinkering! Even seeing the chlorosis arrive and disappear again was pretty cool! 😂


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## KirstyF (4 Dec 2022)

53 Weeks

GSA on slow growers may be beaten! 👍

Plants have stayed pretty clean for a good period now. Old GSA has needed to be removed by trimming old leaves but new growth is looking good. 












The old nemesis, AR mini, also remains nice n clean albeit a little dull in places and the odd wrinkled leaf (primarily from being swamped by tripitata I think) 






Am starting some more Fe trials this week. Removing gluconate and increasing DTPA to 0.3ppm to see if chlorosis kicks back in, and will try higher DTPA and gluconate only respectively thereafter, if it does.

Some gratuitous shots of the Repashy food queue 







They have much better manners than this hoard. 😂




Quick FTS for prosperity.


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## KirstyF (4 Dec 2022)

And it gets longer 😂


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