# BGA causing havoc in low flow tank



## JamieB (31 Mar 2014)

Hi all

My Betta tank is having a real nightmare of it. It's a Fluval Spec V 19L planted tank with tropica substrate and then standard black gravel above and a Betta which prefer low flow tanks.
Plants are:
Limnophila sessiliflora
Eleocharis sp. 'mini'
Lilaeopsis brasiliensis (Which I now understand is also a carpeting plant and due to the BGA is thriving a LOT more than the sp mini which is what I wanted to carpet!)

I read on here that most cyanobacteria break outs are due to low flow, which I do have. I also read it could be low potassium nitrate but I do dose the standard Tropica liquid fert (I'll upgrade to EI once I've ran out). The plants get nothing else other than this but I have been considering soda stream Co2 if it would be required.

How can I fight against this bacteria in a low flow tank? I'm a bit stumped to be honest. One thing to note is that the fish tank is by a window but I'm not sure if moving it would solve the issue.

Any help would be appreciated. Pics can be provided if wanted.

Thanks


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## kirk (31 Mar 2014)

Hi, I think the window is your main problem, as I have high flow, co2, ei, and even with my blinds shut I get a smidging of morning sun through the the slots where the strings go through the blinds shining on the tank. I'm getting bga, not a lot but enough to anoy me.


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## Alastair (31 Mar 2014)

Hi jamie

Manual removal as much as possible will help along with possibly adjusting the outlet so that the flow is directed more towards the substrate.  
If you know anyone who has any pottassium nitrate then just sprinkling a teeny amount of powder onto the affected areas helps.


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## Aquadream (31 Mar 2014)

I had problems with BGA and some other types of algae because of some problems with the Amazonia substrate I use. Also nasty plant suppliers have send me plants with different kinds of goodies wormy things.  
In the end I took the most drastic step ever. I took all plants out and damped them in the bin. Took all fish and shrimp out too. Only water, substrate and hardscape was left.
Then I put a powerful water heater and raised the temperature up to 60 degrees Celsius and boiled the crap out of all pests in the tank including the filter, pipes etc for about un hour. After the boiling I left the water to cool down slowly to increase the heat time period and make sure nothing is alive. 

After that I cleaned all of the organic mess that was left and replanted with only immersed plants by using the parts that were not in contact with the media they were grown on to. I used also some in vitro plants.

There are no traces of any troubling algae anymore. I did get some GSA, because of over fertilising a bit at the start, but cleaned it easily and with a big water changes got it to disappear completely.

So the boiling of the tank just kill all crap forever, algae, cyanobacteria, worms, freshwater limpets etc. It's crazy, but it works.


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## FishBeast (1 Apr 2014)

The outbreaks I have had I fixed almost instantly by siphoning as much rotting stuff from the substrate as possible, removing as much dead stuff as possible and doing a large water change. I thought it was due to a excessive build up of organic waste in the substrate.... That's how I think of it and the above has always worked for me.... I think I got that information from plantbrain,. Tom Barr... It was a long time ago so please don't quote that.


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## EnderUK (1 Apr 2014)

If it's in direct sunlight that would probably be your problem, and as kirk says you need to move it. If it's around the corner and just getting diffused sunlight you might be better lowering your lighting period to 3 hours then up it slowly over a couple of months to 5 hours. Try a black out for a few days to get with of the algae. I don't think high flow is that critical in low tech aquariums tbh, you could put in a air pump to help improve turn over though.


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## EnderUK (1 Apr 2014)

Also when you say you have low flow what do you mean? You can have a flow of 100l/hr in the tank and the water hardly moves and you can have a flow of 25l/hr with the water turning over like a washing machine. People get fluid flow and fluid velcoity very mixed up. fluid flow is just how much volume or mass for fluid you have moving through a system. fluid velocity is how quickly the fluid moves. By changing the cross sectional area the fluid flows through you can change the velocity while keeping the fluid flow the same.

Think of it like putting your finger over a a running tap, you'll get _roughly_ the same amount of water coming out, however the jet will come out a lot faster.

When people say they want a flow of x10 flow of the volume of the tank they're just making sure that they get the co2 and nutrients around the tank and preventing dead spots of water, this is acutally more to do with fluid velocity then flow but they are both linked.


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## dw1305 (1 Apr 2014)

Hi all, 





Aquadream said:


> In the end I took the most drastic step ever. I took all plants out and damped them in the bin. Took all fish and shrimp out too. Only water, substrate and hardscape was left.
> Then I put a powerful water heater and raised the temperature up to 60 degrees Celsius and boiled the crap out of all pests in the tank including the filter, pipes etc for about un hour. After the boiling I left the water to cool down slowly to increase the heat time period and make sure nothing is alive.


 I don't think there is any point in trying to treat Cyanobacteria by sterilising etc.  The problem is that Cyanobacteria are absolutely everywhere, and if conditions are suitable they will re-appear.





Aquadream said:


> After that I cleaned all of the organic mess that was left


 My suspicion would be that is the more important point. I'd always associate BGA with some form of organic pollution, and only really in newly set-up tanks. 





FishBeast said:


> The outbreaks I have had I fixed almost instantly by siphoning as much rotting stuff from the substrate as possible, removing as much dead stuff as possible and doing a large water change. I thought it was due to a excessive build up of organic waste in the substrate.


 That is the approach I'd take.

cheers Darrel


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## kirk (1 Apr 2014)

I've been using the thin end of a long algae scraper in one hand and the siphon in the other agitating the areas and hovering up. Works quite well in our set up.


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## JamieB (1 Apr 2014)

Wow, amazing responses here guys, I see why this is such a popular site. 

It appears then that I need to move my tank! I think I'll try to plan out a readjustment of my bedroom then, I really want to have this tank succeed as I put a lot of effort into it and still want to improve it. 

As an off topic question, I didn't leave a gap on the edges of my tank with the substrate so you can see the 2 layers of substrate that I have, it seems this was a bit of a school boy mistake as reading in the substrate tutorial this can, and has, caused algae to build on the edges of the tank about 3cm above the substrate, hopefully you understand what I mean! Is there anything I can do it fix this or just clean the glass as much as I can? Probably would need to redo the tank to fix it and that's not an option until I upgrade so I can live with it if need be!


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## Aquadream (2 Apr 2014)

dw1305 said:


> Hi all,  I don't think there is any point in trying to treat Cyanobacteria by sterilising etc.
> cheers Darrel


Im my case was not the Cyanobacteria that was the main problem. I got my tank infested by some kind of 2" long brown leaches from a plant supplier I'd rather not mention their name. There was no getting rid of them for months. Sterilising the tank was the last resort.


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## sanj (2 Apr 2014)

> Im my case was not the Cyanobacteria that was the main problem. I got my tank infested by some kind of 2" long brown leaches from a plant supplier I'd rather not mention their name. There was no getting rid of them for months. Sterilising the tank was the last resort.



I had what looked like leeches once when I first set up my large aquarium. Horrid things, but eventually they disappeared. I think, but not sure if they came in with plants I ordered from Malaysia.


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## BigTom (3 Apr 2014)

Yeah I've had leech infestations a couple of times. Luckily some baiting and manual removal has always been able to get rid of them.


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## Edvet (3 Apr 2014)

BigTom said:


> some baiting and manual removal has always been able to get rid of them


 You put your BigToe in it?


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## dw1305 (3 Apr 2014)

Hi all,





BigTom said:


> Yeah I've had leech infestations a couple of times.


 Same with me, I'd go as far to say that, like _Planaria,_ I always have some in the tanks. 





BigTom said:


> Luckily some baiting and manual removal has always been able to get rid of them.


 I use a prawn normally, but anything fairly meaty will do as bait.

Leeches are largely nocturnal, and during the day rest under flat rocks etc.  If you place bits of slate in suitable accessible places you can collect them in the morning. I just wash them off under the hot tap.  Long after you saw your last leech in the tank, you'll still be able to collect them from under the rocks. 





Edvet said:


> You put your BigToe in it?


 No the ones I've had aren't blood-sucking, even on the fish. They are probably UK native ones and  are opportunistic carnivores and scavengers of worms, fish eggs etc. They may be _Hellobdella stagnalis_, or an_  Erpobdella_ sp.

I have Black-worms in the substrate, and both these and Leeches are annelid worms, so chemical control isn't an option even if it is possible.

"Panacur" kills _Planaria_, but doesn't effect Leeches.

cheers Darrel


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## petn (3 Apr 2014)

I had problems with BGA WHEN started. The reasons were mainly not Nitrates in the tank and low water flow.started dosing nitrates 20ppm daily,increased flow and problem was over in two weeks. Good luck

Sent from my HTC One mini using Tapatalk


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## EnderUK (4 Apr 2014)

dw1305 said:


> s


I have Black-worms in the substrate, and both these and Leeches are annelid worms, so chemical control isn't an option even if it is possible.
[/quote]

Bit of a hijack but I think that's already happened...

How did you get a hold of them? I've tried looking around ebay and such for them no luck. Do they do a similar job to MTS? How are they in co2 injected tanks? Seems like they would be a tasty treat for foraging fish. I'm interested in getting more creepy crawls for my tanks.


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## Edvet (4 Apr 2014)

I could order them here in the Netherlands from a dealer, put some in both cubes and one in a breeding setup. Breeding went sour, overfed them, and i can't find them in the tanks i put them in, probably all eaten, I will order a larger portion and try the same setup again, just more in the tanks and less food in the breeding colony


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## dw1305 (5 Apr 2014)

Hi all, 


> How did you get a hold of them?


 I got them Gerard "frothhelmet", PM me your address and I'll send you some.

cheers Darrel


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## EnderUK (5 Apr 2014)

dw1305 said:


> Hi all,
> I got them Gerard "frothhelmet", PM me your address and I'll send you some.
> 
> cheers Darrel




I'll PM you when I get back from Ibiza, got my whistle and my glow sticks at the ready.


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