# A Little Help Part Two... The ReBuild...Discus Tank



## Franko44 (11 Nov 2010)

Well guys here we go with the full on rebuild...

Please foward your comments so, I can get it right this time..   

Equipment list:
Rena 300lt Corner Tank.
JBL 1500e Filters,  2 off.. water turn over about 3000LT per hour.
300 watt Rena Heater.
2 T5 39watt and 2 T5 24watt with reflectors separate timers 24watts on two hours before 39watt, and same on off time, total light time ten hours.
Home made inline CO2 Reactor (as per Rex Grigg website)
JBD AquaBase and JBL Manado and sharp Sand...
Under Gravel Heater Cable JBL 4 Meter
JBL CO2 Gas Bottle and Regulator.
Small power head to help water flow...



Plants:
1.	Amazon Broadleaf (Echinodorus Bleheri) (one off Specimen)
2.	Anubias barteri var. nana (10 pots)
3.	Aquafleur Java Moss (4 pots)
4.	Cryptocoryne undulata 'broad leaves' (3 pots)
5.	Cryptocoryne wendtii "brown" (ten pots)
6.	Cryptocoryne wendtii "Green" (ten pots)
7.	Microsorum pteropus "Petit" (six pots)
8.	Microsorum pteropus (two pots)
9.	Echinodorus tenellus (10 pots)
10.	Sagittaria Subulata (Narrow Leaf) (10 pots
11.	Echinodorus quadricostatus var. magdalenensis. (10 pots)

I will post photos, of the hole store, hoping to start on it this weekend... 

This is as far as I have got.. any input PLEASE...


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## Tony Swinney (12 Nov 2010)

Looks like a good starting plan Frank - it'd be nice to get some height in the back corner of the tank as its pretty deep front to back.

Look forward to the pics.

Tony


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## Anonymous (12 Nov 2010)

Aesthetically you could make some improvements.

*1. Amazon Broadleaf (Echinodorus Bleheri) (one off Specimen) *I'd use Cyperus Helferi if you have enough co2 or Vallis (nana looks better) and some Rotala rotundifolia or ludwigia brevipes/arcuata infront for some color trimmed 2/3 of the tank height.
*2. Anubias barteri var. nana (10 pots)* - I'd choose microsorum over this one for wood.
*3. Aquafleur Java Moss (4 pots)* - don't use mosses in a discus tank, they usually need smaller temp. to grow nice and really really clean water otherwise the get messy and browny
*4. Cryptocoryne undulata 'broad leaves' (3 pots)* grows too tall and covers the back. I'd buy only one pot and keep it if you like it.
*5. Cryptocoryne wendtii "brown" (ten pots)/6. Cryptocoryne wendtii "Green" (ten pots) *- they grows nice, not too high, and you can mix them, but I'd buy fewer pots (a pot usually contains 5 plants), you need like 10-20 cm between bushes, if co2 provided they grow quickly and cover a large area fast, I'd plant them in a zigzag wall infront of the wood.
*7. Microsorum pteropus "Petit" (six pots) / 8. Microsorum pteropus (two pots) *- buy them after the tank is established, fewer pots just to get some color on wood but don't cover it.
9. Echinodorus tenellus (10 pots) / 10. Sagittaria Subulata (Narrow Leaf) (10 pots) / 11. Echinodorus quadricostatus var. magdalenensis. (10 pots) - these are the worst "carpeting" plants IMHO, they grow uneven, over another, the distance between the shoots is to large, I'd choose others but, please, for the aesthetics choose one as main plant infront and the rest just to break the monotony here and there (lilaeopsis brasilensis, blyxa japonica, hemianthus micranthemoides, pogostemon helferi)

And that's about it, there are other plants but not that hardy for a discus tank given the high temp.
Don't forget give your discus a larger sand space infront of the tank to keep the tank tip top clean and they could find the food provided easily  and don't forget to rinse manado. 

Cheers,
Mike


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## Franko44 (12 Nov 2010)

Hi Mike and Tony,

Thank you for your input, I am now looking the plants up on the web you have listed, and am redrawing my planting plan.. I would like to grow some moss on the bogwood, which one do you guys think it best...

Thanks, for your help..  

I will be spening most of saturday washing the Manado...LOL


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## Tony Swinney (12 Nov 2010)

Hi Frank

I grew Peacock moss very successfully on redmoor roots in my discus tank at 27degrees.

Tony


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## Franko44 (13 Nov 2010)

Hi Guys,
Well have just finished washing all the Manado, sand, stone and pea stone...  

Time for a cup of tea, then tomorrow the big pull down and rebuild.. 

I think It will take most of the day, with a good clean with Formalin for the tank... the filters I will keep running with the fish in a big black bin...

So good bye to this:





Hello to My New Layout....  Must be mad...


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## Franko44 (13 Nov 2010)

New Planting list:
Plants:
1.	Ludwigia arcuata (one pot)
2.	Rotala rotundifolia (one pot)
3.	Cyperus helferi (two pots)
4.	Microsorum pteropus (10 pots)
5.	Taxiphyllum barbieri (4 pots)
6.	Cryptocoryne wendtii "brown" (five pots)
7.	Cryptocoryne wendtii "Green" (five pots)
8.	Microsorum pteropus "Petit" (four pots)
9.	Microsorum pteropus (two pots)
10.	Pogostemon helferi (five pots)
11.	Echinodorus tenellus (four pots)
12.	Sagittaria Subulata (Narrow Leaf) (1 pots)
13.	Hemianthus micranthemoides (five pots)
14.	Echinodorus quadricostatus  (1 pots)

Any feedback welcome...


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## Franko44 (14 Nov 2010)

Hi Guys,

Just a little up date on the tank and my back  


















Plants tomorrow...


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## Franko44 (18 Nov 2010)

Hi Guys..

A Little up date,

The fish are back in the tank and so are some of the plants.. still waiting for some due in to my local shop on Saturday...

Discus are spawing again...
















All input welcome...


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## Franko44 (15 Dec 2010)

Hi Guys,
The tank has now been up and running a few weeks now...
I am starting to get a few problems!
I am using dry dosing each day as follows: 
Trace 1 tsp ever over day for two day
1 tsp KH2PO4 1 tsp KNO3 and 1 tsp MGSO4 ever over day for three days
Rest for two days and then start again after a 80 LT water change...  
Lighting is two 39W T5 and two 24W T5 with reflectors.
Water turn over is about 3000L per hour.. Two JBL 1500e with JBL form and JBL  Clearmec Plus and SymecMicro I hope this is all ok...

I had a little Brown Algae form after about the first two weeks, now I have some green spot Algae forming and the plants are growing, but not that fast, I am happy with my CO2 level using a inline CO2 Diffuser, and flow looks good, with all the plants moving, But I have this white colour in the water and a film formed on top...

Any help welcome please, before I get it in a mess again!   





Tank Shoot...




CO2 Looks Good?




White Film On Top and Colour in Water?




Slow Groth and a Little Algae




Green Spot..

I have up thr KH2PO4 from 1/2 tsp to 1tsp this week to help with the Green spot, and have reduce light time form ten hours to nine?

ANY INPUT PLEASE....


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## Franko44 (16 Dec 2010)

Any Input PLEASE would Be Welcome...


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## ceg4048 (17 Dec 2010)

Hi,
    Firstly you should re-size your photographs because they take up so much room it becomes annoying trying to read the posts. It's very de-motivating having to scroll all the time.

It's likely that you haven't found the right gas injection rate. This contributes to the surface film, slow growth as well as the GSA. You should try to very carefully up the injection rate and/or ensure that the gas is turned on a few hours before the lights go on.

It's also likely that your distribution method is less than perfect. I can't see clearly how your filter output is arranged, whether it's a single point exit or whether you are using a spraybar. It would be better if you used a spraybar along the back wall.

Cheers,


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## Franko44 (17 Dec 2010)

Hi, Thank you for your input.. I will resize my photos if that makes life better for you guys when reading the posings...  

I have two Spraybar at the back of the tank set an angle to give a fan effect and the up takes are at the back as well...

I will try upping the CO2 Level a bit too... 

Have attached photos of the spraybar and uptakes so you can see what I have done...
And my CO2 unit... 

Thank you for your help, any more input is always welcome... THANK YOU


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## ceg4048 (17 Dec 2010)

Hi,
   Thanks very much for the resize. I went back to the previous page to read the details and it makes a world of difference in reading the thread! 

The Anubias are always getting GSA. The best thing to do is to prune the affected leaves. It seems your distribution method is as good as it can get in a triangle, and your flow rate is at the suggested 10X. Nutrient dosing seems fine to me, so the only thing left is CO2, which I hesitate to suggest a rate increase when there are those fantastic discus in there. Just be very careful with the rate increase to avoid stress.

Cheers,


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## Franko44 (17 Dec 2010)

Thanks Ceg, for the Help, I have incressed the CO2 flow a bit and will see how the Discus look with it, I also incressed the THe KH2PO4 from 1/2 tps to 1 tsp ever other day, for three days...

I incressed the CO2 This morning, after reading your reply and I think I can see some inprovment in the suface film already, Will keep you posted with the plants over the next few days...

Thank you again...  

So Much to learn...


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## foxfish (17 Dec 2010)

Those are beautiful fish!!
I wonder about your method of Co2 diffusion - I have tried so many methods of getting the gas to distribute evenly around the tank but, in the end decided that an in line diffuser worked best for me.
The actual method might not be any better than others but, if you can physically see the microbubbles in your tank then you have assurance of the effective distribution.
The negative side is actually seeing the mist in your tank however it allows fine adjustment of the spray bar to get the critical flow rate just right.


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## Franko44 (21 Dec 2010)

Hi Guys,

Can now see some improvement in the water colour and film on the suface of the water... is there a good way of testing my CO2 level apart from my JBL Bubble tester above... or is it a sucket and see think with just messing about with dry salts, CO2 and light till I get it right?


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## ceg4048 (21 Dec 2010)

Hi,
    A better mouse trap would cost you about a thousand quid so the homely little JBL dropchecker is as good as it gets. In any case there really is no magic number. You are not looking to achieve a certain value. The CO2 level in the tank is not homogeneous. It varies from location to location across the tank and it varies from day to day depending on flow, aquascape, temperature as well as plant health and size. The goal is to have unstressed fish, good plant health/growth, minimal algae and clear water without visible surface film.

As you already have discovered, the factors affecting this is a combination of good flow rate, good distribution, sensible lighting and injection rate and good maintenance. The plants practically have no limit to their appetite for CO2 so there is no way to say "here is an optimal level". The more CO2 you provide the more they will grow. The limit is really tied to fish health so you want to operate within the boundaries of the fishes physiological ability to adapt to the partial pressure of CO2 in the water column.

In this sense, CO2 application technique is both art and science.

Cheers,


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## mdhardy01 (26 Dec 2010)

In the last picture is that a ph controller ?


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## Franko44 (22 Jan 2011)

Sorry guys, Long time no talk.. yes that is a PH controler, It is in manual mode...


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## Franko44 (22 Jan 2011)

Hi Guys.

Thinking about setting the cornner unit up as Marine and having a new 5ft tank for the discus and plants...


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