# Growing moss on pond liner?



## chinwag (22 Aug 2017)

Hi,

I have a small wildlife pond in my garden, first time I've setup a pond and it's very basic, just a few plants and some sleepers with helixine and some very small ferns starting to take on them.

The sides are sloped rather than more vertical because I wanted wildife to be able to get in and out, but the problem is the liner is way too visible.

One of the things I was hoping to do was disguise the visible liner using hessian, in the hope of encouraging moss, the hessian looks fine but rots out pretty fast.

Has anyone got any tips for growing moss on the exposed liner?

Would something like hygrolon work (although I think to expensive for this!) or could I key the liner with some sandpaper and apply some sort of moss mix?

Thanks.


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## zozo (23 Aug 2017)

What you could do is take a coarse sandpaper and sand the exposed liner, obviously without damaging it, just rough it up a bit. Than take a tube TEC7 polymer kit and a rubber glove. TEC7 does addhere beter to PE liner than silicone does and the advantage is, it is completely non toxic and even cures under water.

Anyway smear the kit over the exposed liner with you fingers after that threw some dirt, sand peat and leaf litter or fine gravel over and in the kit, just make sure it is dry what you throw in. Let the kit cure for 24 hours and gently brush off the excess dirt with a soft brush.

I creates a rough film of substrate layer on the liner for mosses to attach. 

If it is cheaper i dunno, i  actualy have no idea how much surface you can cover with 1 tube of kit.. I oly did that in small projects, like little waterfalls etc.

And note PE is nasty stuff it is inert but also very hard to get anything t stick to it. So even this wont be long term permanent at some point maybe 2 or 3 seasons you might see patches letting lose again you need to fix and or redo. In your case i would start with a small patch and see how it works out and holds.

Still not a guarantee mosses will grow to it, Growing mosses is as easy as it is difficult.. I see it come and go, grow and die all year round. Moss likes climate to be constant and it can die as fast as it can grow if climate changes uncontroled through out the year. That's why there are no moss nurseries growing mosses for the trade.. Moss is something you have to take for granted.

For using cloth than maybe coconut fibre would be longer lasting than hessian..


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## mort (23 Aug 2017)

Another alternative is to plant above the liner to let plants overhang down. I have used ajuga and creeping jenny to do this.


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## dw1305 (23 Aug 2017)

Hi all, 





chinwag said:


> The sides are sloped rather than more vertical because I wanted wildife to be able to get in and out, but the problem is the liner is way too visible.


Can you put stones on it? You want something that isn't too shiny or hard. 

I dug a lot of limestone rubble up when I dug our pond and I just used them to cover <"over the liner">, and they grew moss really well.



 

cheers Darrel


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## chinwag (23 Aug 2017)

Thanks so much for all the replies - I grabbed a photo of the pond today to demonstrate the liner problem, and how sloping the sides are.

If I was tackling this again I'd just go with vertical sides and slopes within the pond, plus the wood you can see for things like hedgehogs and birds etc to get to and from the water.

I'm going to bookmark the TEC7 as something to come back to I think, purely because if it's something I'll have to redo I'm not sure it will work for this but it does sound like an interesting idea.

I think the only thing I can do really, short of reworking the liner is to plant it with overhanging plants and lay stones or maybe sleepers as you guys have suggested.

I think I might have planted some creeping jenny already (I'm really new to this!) - just waiting for it to take off, it's growing along rather than down at the moment.

It's a real pain because the hessian looked suprisingly good and things were starting to grow on, it just biodegraded too quickly!

Thanks again for all the replies though.

And, lovely pond @dw1305 - that's really my cup of tea!


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## zozo (24 Aug 2017)

This guy has a few very nice videos on his channel about pond restoration / pimping old ponds. You might find some inspiration there..
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCMK3tSLPaPHQH-wCm-e2Z8Q


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## LondonDragon (24 Aug 2017)

chinwag said:


> And, lovely pond @dw1305 - that's really my cup of tea!


Stunning indeed, reminds me of the ponds at London Wetland Centre


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## dw1305 (24 Aug 2017)

Hi all,





LondonDragon said:


> Stunning indeed, reminds me of the ponds at London Wetland Centre


The idea was that it was a wildlife pond, but unfortunately I planted a lot of plants that would have been suitable for a large pond, but were very unsuitable for a small pond, and rapidly went from that to no visible water. 

cheers Darrel


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## zozo (24 Aug 2017)

dw1305 said:


> Hi all,The idea was that it was a wildlife pond, but unfortunately I planted a lot of plants that would have been suitable for a large pond, but were very unsuitable for a small pond, and rapidly went from that to no visible water.
> 
> cheers Darrel


Ideal boggy place for a group of carnivores.. Never thought of the idea to put some winter hardy North american Sarracenias and flytraps in there?


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## mort (24 Aug 2017)

Another option I've done, although it's so overgrown you can't see it, is find an old fallen tree and used stripped bark. That might also provide a suitable home for moss.


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## chinwag (24 Aug 2017)

Thanks for the link @zozo, I'm gonna have a look through those - that guy has a lot of videos!

@mort - I hadn't thought about bark, I need to head out for some leaf litter so I might have a poke around and see what I can find, thanks.

I've been staring at the pond like a zombie today - I'm seriously considering shifting the liner or pulling the whole thing up and reworking it a bit deeper, digging some nutrients into the bank at the same time.

Thanks again for all the advice - I'll update once I've expored a few of your suggestions.


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## foxfish (24 Aug 2017)

Standard greenhouse shading is very similar to hessian sacking but it is made of nylon plastic type stuff & will last for many years outside.
Where I live, it is available "off the roll" in most garden centres & often comes in different weaves ie 20% shading 30% etc.


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## chinwag (25 Aug 2017)

That sounds worth a look @foxfish, thanks. I need to go to a garden centre this weekend anyway so perfect timing!

I took a look at the pond today with a view to stripping it back and there's a large frog living under the wood pile, so I'm please that it's at least it's working as a wildlife pond, even if it does look a bit rubbish!


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## chinwag (26 Aug 2017)

The frog had moved on after yesterday's disturbance so I've set him up something temporary in case he returns and stripped the whole thing out.

There's now a sunken tub pond, two sunken container bog gardens, and a smaller, deeper and hopefully less ugly version of the wildlife pond going back in.

It's going to look awful for some time, but hopefully less so once things are growing.

I'll post some photo's once there's something to post!


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## chinwag (10 Sep 2017)

Doesn't like like much but the new wildlife pond is more or less dug in - the container full of water is another, deep ish pond which the frog has already moved into!



 

We're going to plant that up - and the other two containers are going to be bog gardens so we can put it some longer, bog loving plants to provide cover around the pond.

Hoping the steps will allow us to plant enough that any liner will be well obscured this time around, ad we still have a gentle slope on one side which should lead from one of the boggy parts into the pond.

We'll also be sticking some wood across it here and there to provide cover and a way out for anything unfortunate enough to fall in.

Also, here's a photo of one of my favourite parts of the garden, which is right near the pond.

Sad but true! I've been nurturing this sleeper for ages trying to get moss and helixine to take and it's finally starting to work.





All we need now is liner - anyone have any advice, I'm assuming we need something thick like butyl? Sadly the old liner is too small due to an abundance of depth and a total lack of forethought!


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## martin-green (10 Sep 2017)

Doesn't have to be butyl. Butyl used to have a 20 year g'tee. You can now get non butyl liners that have a 30 year g'tee. (But you do have to use the specific underlay to get the g'tee)


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## chinwag (14 Sep 2017)

Thanks @martin-green - I've been looking at HDPE but I'm seeing very mixed reviews, Butyl and EPDM look more suitable and are thicker but the cost goes way up.

Does anyone have any recommendations or thoughts on those liners?

Thanks.


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## chinwag (15 Sep 2017)

Aaagh! my GF just found this;

https://www.amazon.co.uk/River-Emba...id=1505474312&sr=1-1&refinements=p_4:Aquagart

So maybe that would have sorted the original problem. lol.

Still, I think the new pond will be nicer.


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## chinwag (18 Sep 2017)

We managed to get a new liner, went for a reduced offcut of quite a thick rubber liner in the end.

Went to fit it at the weekend though and there were so many creases we've pulled it back out and are going to simplify the shape a little!

We had a tiny pool at one end, just way too small for the liner to cope with so we're going to make it one big pool and go from there.

We also had a sloping bank for wildlife that we'll need to rethink as well.

I'll post photo's once it's in a postable condition!


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## dw1305 (29 Jun 2020)

Hi all, 





zozo said:


> Ideal boggy place for a group of carnivores.. Never thought of the idea to put some winter hardy North american Sarracenias and flytraps in there?


No very limy water. I had _Pinguicula vulgaris_ for a bit. I've seen it in fens in Ireland and Wales, so I knew that it didn't have a problem lime rich water. The problem was that the sedges (_Carex_ spp.) over ran it.

cheers Darrel


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## louis_last (14 Mar 2021)

zozo said:


> What you could do is take a coarse sandpaper and sand the exposed liner, obviously without damaging it, just rough it up a bit. Than take a tube TEC7 polymer kit and a rubber glove. TEC7 does addhere beter to PE liner than silicone does and the advantage is, it is completely non toxic and even cures under water.
> 
> Anyway smear the kit over the exposed liner with you fingers after that threw some dirt, sand peat and leaf litter or fine gravel over and in the kit, just make sure it is dry what you throw in. Let the kit cure for 24 hours and gently brush off the excess dirt with a soft brush.
> 
> ...


I built a raised bed with wildlife pond for a charity some time ago and what we did was use horticulrtural capilliary matting to cover the exposed liner around the edges. It wicks very well so remains moist and grows moss but the problem then becomes that water evaporates from the pond much faster and you constantly have to top it up. Helxine soleirolli is a great groundcover plants to grow around the edges for covering the liner instead.


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