# Possibly a dumb question... How the heck do you count your fish?



## Petra R (21 May 2018)

Because I have a recently cycled tank with little delicate rainbows in it I am somewhat paranoid and endlessly try to count all swimmers to make sure everyone is alive and floating the right way up.

Unfortunately they don't nicely and calmly line up to be counted so I spend a lot of time trying to count everything that still swims to make sure there aren't any that no longer do so.

They are crazy lively and I keep counting them until I count the numbers I think I should have but this like happens every time I put the kettle on and is driving me crazy. 9 miniscule fork tail raibowfish and 11 threadfin rainbows and 2 otos. Counting them over and over.

Is there some clever trick?


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## Konsa (21 May 2018)

Hi
Take a photo when(if) they all out and then count away.
Regards Konsa


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## zozo (21 May 2018)

Konsa said:


> Hi
> Take a photo when(if) they all out and then count away.
> Regards Konsa



Than you have to count first to know if they are all out... 

I know the problem with my Trichopsis pumilla, they are constantly all over the place and rarely 3 seconds at the same place and or realy like to hang out in dense vegitation under the leaves.. In the end i gave up on it.. Same as the Hara jerdoni, took me 4 months to finaly count all 5 moving at the same time.

I guess that's the best strategy, just keep watching your tank there comes a lucky moment, this you can't force without frustrations..


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## Petra R (21 May 2018)

So essentially just assume they are all there and still breathing unless something obviously no longer is? And relax? 
I suppose if one's dead it won't get any more dead if I miss it?


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## Angus (21 May 2018)

Count in 2's and count fast, try to get an average over 5-10 counts, that is what zoo staff usually do if it's a hard animal to count.


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## jameson_uk (21 May 2018)

The corys tend to be a pain as they never all want to come out and stay there long enough to be counted.  The 14 tetras are countable at feeding time as they tend to bunch up.

The otos however I can't count.  I can only ever see one at a time.  I am worried how many are actually there as before when you managed to spot one you could normally see another close by and once in a blue moon I would see four of them.

I know I have lost a guppy when I was away the other weekend but I have never found a carcass despite checking every where.

Always wondered if there was a thermal camera you could get to help


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## Majsa (21 May 2018)

Petra R said:


> Counting them over and over.


I know exactly what you mean, I keep on counting them, even after months  Just like counting children on our sons birthday parties.
I can count otos only when I switch off everything that causes flow (at least once a week during WC), for some reason they then all come together.


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## Angus (21 May 2018)

jameson_uk said:


> The otos however I can't count.  I can only ever see one at a time.  I am worried how many are actually there as before when you managed to spot one you could normally see another close by and once in a blue moon I would see four of them.


Weird that, mine are always together, how many have you got?


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## jameson_uk (21 May 2018)

Angus said:


> Weird that, mine are always together, how many have you got?


No idea!  I added six and I know one died a few days later.  I have been able to count four on occasions but the issue is they are now always in / on a really thick crypt at the back of the tank so even if they are together they are very hard to spot.  Spotting then when the lights are low is even harder


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## Angus (21 May 2018)

In the past i have had otos slowly disappear when i wasn't feeding them something specifically, even though the tank had lots of diatoms and green dust algae, are you feeding any wafers at all? mine love the hikari algae wafers, i get all of them in one spot pretty religiously with those which makes them easy enough to count, i have one that is an odd colour more sandy than the rest, i assume it's probably a different sp. but if anyone knows about colour variations in otos that is reading this i would be intrigued to know.


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## jameson_uk (21 May 2018)

Angus said:


> In the past i have had otos slowly disappear when i wasn't feeding them something specifically, even though the tank had lots of diatoms and green dust algae, are you feeding any wafers at all? mine love the hikari algae wafers, i get all of them in one spot pretty religiously with those which makes them easy enough to count, i have one that is an odd colour more sandy than the rest, i assume it's probably a different sp. but if anyone knows about colour variations in otos that is reading this i would be intrigued to know.


They have never shown any interest in algae wafers but I do add them for the nerites and others and there is plenty of algae and film to munch on.  They have only ever shown a passing interest in that (and peas, spinach...). There are also some oak leaves in there near where they spend most of their time but I have never seen them on these leaves.  Just odd that if they have died that I have never found any remains.  I know the amanos would do a decent job of cleaning up but being armoured catfish I would have expected to find skeletons.  Need to pull everything put and check again this weekend I think


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## Petra R (21 May 2018)

Phew, I feel much less dumb knowing I am not alone


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## tam (21 May 2018)

I'm currently sitting here counting my Otos. Just put a cube of rapashy in and they have gathered, but not 100% sure I got to five or one did a swim around.


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## sciencefiction (22 May 2018)

It once took me 2 weeks to count my 9 denison barbs, ha, ha. Them fish swim non stop... Taking pictures didn't work either..I now have 34 halrequin rasboras, well, I think I have that many but no way I can count that


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## Keith GH (22 May 2018)

I often used the old photo trick at feeding time.   Take several and you will soon know how many you have.  If you have good breeding fish that is when the numbers go up or a death concern they go down very fast.

Keith


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## Petra R (22 May 2018)

Keith GH said:


> ... or a death concern they go down very fast.
> 
> Keith



That's what worries me so much


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## roadmaster (22 May 2018)

Petra R said:


> Because I have a recently cycled tank with little delicate rainbows in it I am somewhat paranoid and endlessly try to count all swimmers to make sure everyone is alive and floating the right way up.
> 
> Unfortunately they don't nicely and calmly line up to be counted so I spend a lot of time trying to count everything that still swims to make sure there aren't any that no longer do so.
> 
> ...



One fish,Two Fish,Red Fish,Blue Fish ? Ha! Ha!
I find it easier to count them when feeding while the majority are near the surface after the flake I offer.
I have some Plecos I rarely see unless I drop some sinking pellet near one end of the tank.
They are programmed to visit this area soon after I leave the front of the tank.
They know it's either food time,or water change coming.


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## nel.pogorzelska (22 May 2018)

I have no idea how to count fish when feeding, they're everywhere and crazy. I just try to sit a bit and count in threes a few times. I have to do this only with my congo tetras though, other fish are easy to count. (Hello Mr fish, you are the only betta in this tank, are you there?)


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## Petra R (22 May 2018)

nel.pogorzelska said:


> I have no idea how to count fish when feeding, they're everywhere and crazy. I just try to sit a bit and count in threes a few times. I have to do this only with my congo tetras though, other fish are easy to count. (Hello Mr fish, you are the only betta in this tank, are you there?)



Haha, yes, exactly.... I can just about cope with the forktails, but the threadfins are just too mobile. I keep counting until I arrive at the number I should have.... whether that's right or wrong.


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## Keith GH (23 May 2018)

Think yourself lucky you do not have a tank full of Shrimps

Keith


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## rebel (23 May 2018)

Just photograph em with a bright light .


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## Sakura83 (23 May 2018)

rebel said:


> Just photograph em with a bright light .


at meal time


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## jameson_uk (8 Jun 2018)

jameson_uk said:


> They have never shown any interest in algae wafers but I do add them for the nerites and others and there is plenty of algae and film to munch on.  They have only ever shown a passing interest in that (and peas, spinach...). There are also some oak leaves in there near where they spend most of their time but I have never seen them on these leaves.  Just odd that if they have died that I have never found any remains.  I know the amanos would do a decent job of cleaning up but being armoured catfish I would have expected to find skeletons.  Need to pull everything put and check again this weekend I think


Since this I have made it my mission to figure out how many Otos I actually have.   A pulled out all the driftwood and ornaments and gave all the plants a good swish with my hand (normally more than enough to get the Otos to show themselves) and had come to the conclusion I had lost three and there was only a single Oto left.   Tonight I came back and sat down next to the tank and noticed I could see two Oto tails poking out.   Had a quick look and found all four I thought were in there just chilling on the back glass behind a small ornament.   Was literally only sitting down for a minute before heading to LFS to buy six more.   Guess I only need three more then


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## papa_c (8 Jun 2018)

My Otto' s play hide and seek constantly. Strangely after a good water change they always hand out together on the front glass for an hour or so and then go back to hiding.


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## jameson_uk (8 Jun 2018)

papa_cee said:


> My Otto' s play hide and seek constantly. Strangely after a good water change they always hand out together on the front glass for an hour or so and then go back to hiding.


Mine used to which is why I got concerned.  They now seem happy to hide whether they hide even when I swish their favoured crypt leaves, move things around, do a water change.  I would however catch a glimpse of one every so often (particularly in the evening) and where there was one you would normally find another.

No idea why they have been better at hiding the last few months but they seem quite happy rather than cowering away so I guess it is just the thick plants make them impossible to see.   They don't seem to hang on the front or side glass any more but I think this is down to the Nerites doing such a good job of cleaning there is nothing left for them.  Today I found them in the gap between an ornament and the rear glass where I guess the Nerites can't get to.  They seemed pretty chilled and with decent size tummies so I don't think they are going hungry.  I will see if adding another three might bring them out a little more.


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## zozo (16 Jun 2018)

Just an idea that might just work pretty well.. Get those sticky tabs, for example Sera Spirulina, you can press them against the glas and they stick. Once the fish know what it is they all will gather around the tab in front of your nose..  Depends a bit on the sp. my Hara's don't and my T. pumila's also aren't all equaly interested, but the rasboras and boraras...


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## jameson_uk (16 Jun 2018)

I added 10 small Bloody Mary shrimp to my 22l tank the other day.  They are only 0.5 - 1cm and blend in quite well with the substrate.  Sure I counted six earlier


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