# Should I add MTS?? - Yeay or Nay?



## Mr Bee (22 Aug 2008)

I'm thinking of adding some MTS to my tank, and have read lots of mixed reviews about wether they are a pest or a benefit.

So I'm just posting this to try and get a broader and more specific sense of wether they are good or bad.

I have a 60L well mature tank, with 5 Neons, 6 Glowlights and ~6 RCS.  A bit of live planting (spiky moss and Java fern, but only added yesterday, and only young plants) and a gravel substrate.

Basically, I've read good things, that they aerate substrate, stop gas pockets, eat any dead plant matter or uneaten food that the fish or shrimp don't find.  I assume as they burrow in gravel they will eat any food bits that sink depper into it before it has a chance to rot?

I just don't want to be overrun by them to the point that the tank is full of them and I can't get rid of them.  What is everyones opinion on these little dudes?

Are they  8) or are they


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## JamesM (22 Aug 2008)

The only problem my MTS cause is with hairgrass - the buggers are forever uprooting it when they bury themselves, and when the entire foreground is covered, its hard to replant individual blades of grass.


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## a1Matt (22 Aug 2008)

Personally I don't like them.  I think Nerites are nice looking snails, but MTS are a bit ugly.  Here is my two penneth...

Yeay...
All th good things you have heard are true.
if you get too many of them, it is a good sign that you are overfeeding.  So you squish a few and feed less! 
They are nice to look at (in some peoples opinion!)

Nay....
They are ugly to look at! (in some peoples opinion!)
Once you have them in your tank it won't be easy to get rid of them (assuming you would want to at some stage).


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## Egmel (22 Aug 2008)

I would agree with a1matt, they do all the good things people say they do but once you've got them, they're there for good.

As for them looking ugly, I really think that's personal opinion, and also down to water type.  I've had 2 or 3 starter colonies over the years and they've all arrived with gnarled shells, once in my tank the new shells they grow start to look really impressive, but then I have a high Ph and hard water, ideal snail stuff really.

There are also different types, see the snail shop for some examples.

 I just end up replanting the uprooted hair grass along with my regular prune, once it's rooted better they soon have more difficulty freeing it 

Basically my opinion is that they're hard workers who can be kept in check by reducing how much you feed.  As with any animal they look better if they are kept in conditions which suit them, but unfortunately you can't undo the harm done, if they have a gnarled shell when you get them it will always be like that, only the new growth can be affected (like our hair and fingernails).  Not to worry though because the new generations will all have new shells   I wouldn't have my tank without them.


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## Wolfenrook (22 Aug 2008)

I agree with Egmel, they don't have to be ugly!  I am breeding mahogany trumpet snails and they are quite attractive, been a glossy mix of black and mahogany brown.

I'm a yay person myself, at the end of the day numbers don't become a problem unless you are overfeeding.

Ade


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## Egmel (22 Aug 2008)

I was watching one of mine this morning, he was shuffling through the sand and he really reminded me of a wild boar snuffling for truffles!  I find them really interesting to watch... but of course I could just be strange


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## Steve Smith (22 Aug 2008)

I started with 6, ended with hundreds after 6 or 8 months.  It was a realy problem as I had a parasite problem and couldn't treat my fish without killing the snails...  100 snails all dieing at the same time is not a good thing...


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## a1Matt (22 Aug 2008)

I have to say that Mahogany brown and glossy black sounds quite nice.  The only MTS I have ever had were in a tank that had been passed to me in really bad condition so they were pretty grotty.

If you do treat a tank to get rid of MTS I would imagine you would probably have to use a copper based solution, which would wave goodbye to any shrimp as well.


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## Egmel (22 Aug 2008)

a1Matt said:
			
		

> If you do treat a tank to get rid of MTS I would imagine you would probably have to use a copper based solution, which would wave goodbye to any shrimp as well.


Steve said it was a parasite problem so I'm guessing it was flubenzanol (sp?) which is shrimp safe but snail lethal.


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## a1Matt (22 Aug 2008)

Egmel said:
			
		

> a1Matt said:
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Oops.  Sorry All, my bad.  I misread it that he wanted to kill the snails!


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## Mr Bee (23 Aug 2008)

So the general feeling is yeay!

I'm seriously thinking of adding some then - but do they escape from the tank, or do they like to stay under water?


Just been looking at snailshop.co.uk and they have standard MTS, Mahogany, and Dominican MTS..... Are they basically all the same thing (regards to benefits/requirements/breeding etc.) just with different colours and textures on their shells?


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## Superman (23 Aug 2008)

I managed to acquire some a few months ago. They survived the move, although, I've only really seen one or two at a time on a night.

I would add them again to a newer tank and think them going through the gravel is a big plus when your keeping plants.


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## Wolfenrook (23 Aug 2008)

Mr Bee said:
			
		

> So the general feeling is yeay!
> 
> I'm seriously thinking of adding some then - but do they escape from the tank, or do they like to stay under water?
> 
> ...



Pretty much yes, although they are different species so wont hybridise (most of them are self fertile anyway, so wouldn't matter much).

I have had mahogany trumpet snails in a sand based tank for a couple of months now, feeding is fairly reduced in this tank and as such I have not had the population explosion that some folks get, each snail having about 1 baby each in this entire time.

As to treating parasites etc, touch wood I just don't get these.  The worst I have had was a platy that I observed to have an anchor worm upon getting it home a few years ago, I just mechanicaly removed it and the platy recovered quickly.

Ade


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## Egmel (23 Aug 2008)

Mr Bee said:
			
		

> do they escape from the tank, or do they like to stay under water?


They stay in the water 


> Just been looking at snailshop.co.uk and they have standard MTS, Mahogany, and Dominican MTS..... Are they basically all the same thing (regards to benefits/requirements/breeding etc.) just with different colours and textures on their shells?


Yup, though I'd say I see less of my mahogany ones than I do my standard MTS.  I think they're even more nocturnal!


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## spaldingaquatics (23 Aug 2008)

I have a tank just for MTS  

Nothing wrong with them, you can get a pretty fancy snail but the MTS is the solid trusted backbone of aquarium snails  

Free if you want some?


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## Mr Bee (24 Aug 2008)

spaldingaquatics said:
			
		

> Free if you want some?



Yes please, if you're offering!


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## Wolfenrook (24 Aug 2008)

Hard to believe that years ago when I started in the hobby aquarists tried everything to eliminate MTS (were referred to as Malaysian sand snails back then.) from their tanks as they were considered an absolute pest.   In fact back when I started most snails were considered a bad idea, mainly because it was felt that they too often acted as an intermediate host for too many types of parasite.

Ade


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## spaldingaquatics (24 Aug 2008)

You're fired from my snail sales team


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## Mr Bee (24 Aug 2008)

spaldingaquatics said:
			
		

> You're fired from my snail sales team



Shouldn't that be "Snales team"?


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## aaronnorth (24 Aug 2008)

Mr Bee said:
			
		

> spaldingaquatics said:
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## thebullit (24 Aug 2008)

its a big yayyyy from me, i have them in all my tanks but find it hard to keep them in with my crays. they will stay under water and wont escape. the only reason they would try and leave the water is if there was bad water.


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## LondonDragon (24 Aug 2008)

Bee tried to find some to send you but at the moment I can't find any LOL either they all died or burry themselves very well  :?  :?


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## thebullit (25 Aug 2008)

isnt it bee whos after them??


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## Mr Bee (25 Aug 2008)

Yeah I was after some, LD was trying to dig a few up for me.... No problem LD, Spalding has kindly offered to send me a few out, but thank you too for offering and looking for some  

Yours are obviously happy in there and don't want to leave.  Maybe they heard of your plans to send them away and all went into hiding, LOL  :?


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## LondonDragon (25 Aug 2008)

Mr Bee said:
			
		

> Yours are obviously happy in there and don't want to leave.  Maybe they heard of your plans to send them away and all went into hiding, LOL  :?


Gotta cut their internet access to UKAPS!!!


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## Mr Bee (27 Aug 2008)

LOL LD!    

OK, so I should have some MTS arriving in the post sometime today (our post is not very reliable for what time it will be!) but I've just thought of something......

Do you have to acclimatise them to the tank water as you do when adding fish?

Same kind of thing - Hang in a bag (or whatever) in the tank for temperature match, and add my tank water to theirs over a time period; say 10% of their original volume every 10 mins or something?


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## Wolfenrook (27 Aug 2008)

I didn't with my mahogany trumpet snails, or my apple snails, just put them straight in.  They don't usually come packed in water, so 3x the volume of nothing would be nothing.   Mine came wrapped in moist filter floss in an expanded styrene 'sauce' cup.

Ade


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## Egmel (27 Aug 2008)

Wolfenrook said:
			
		

> I didn't with my mahogany trumpet snails, or my apple snails, just put them straight in.  They don't usually come packed in water, so 3x the volume of nothing would be nothing.   Mine came wrapped in moist filter floss in an expanded styrene 'sauce' cup.
> 
> Ade


Ditto, mine have never been acclimatised, just dropped straight in.


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## thebullit (27 Aug 2008)

i just plopp them in aswell, as they have trapdoors and can acclimatise them selves if need be.


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## Mr Bee (27 Aug 2008)

Oh I see, didn't realise they survived out of water for transportation.  Well, my MTS didn't arrive today as I'd hoped, the post must be a little slow   

Out of interest, how long can they survive out of water during shipping?

They were due to be shipped on tuesday, but didn't come today, will they still be alive and well for another day if it takes til tomorrow or the day after?


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## Egmel (28 Aug 2008)

I've had MTS survive in the post for a few days, it does depend on how they are packaged but generally they are quite hardy little things and should be ok when you get them.


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## thebullit (28 Aug 2008)

they can survive months outa water. i had a bucket with a few in for over 1 month in the shed with no water either. when i filled it up with tank water, within 5-10 minutes they were crawling around. they have a trapdoor which will keep the moister in so dont worry mate.


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## a1Matt (28 Aug 2008)

I have an old tank stored in my garage.  It just has gravel and an inch of 'sludge' in it.
MTS have been alive in there for over a year now!


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## Egmel (28 Aug 2008)

Hmm, this seems to be suggesting that MTS could very easily survive in our waterways and we need to be really careful when disposing of those babies which get sucked up with the water during a water change...


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## thebullit (29 Aug 2008)

i empty my tank water on my plants in the garden after a wc. they love it, and that way nothing goes in to the loo and can populate else were.


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