# What to do here, worried!



## Parablennius (21 May 2018)

Right people,
Recently the house next door to me ( corner plot ) was bought by gypsies. They knocked down a 2 metre high flat roof garage and built one with a ridged roof which is about 3 metres at the ridge, it is only 2 feet from my boundary on the south side. It is built from breezeblock, the wood you see is only cladding from the eaves upwards. They are breeding noisy jack russel's in there. Just to keep it interesting they've  installed a woodburner, the flue of which exits into my garden space, about 8 foot high, through the gable-end of the new-build. Our prevailing wind will see us smoked out in no time! And it will smoke out my mature Hawthorn that I planted when the kids were little.
Now I've looked on the reg's etc so I know that,
1/  The building is too tall for the proximity to the boundary.
2/  It should not be used for keeping animals in.
3/  The flue is in no way legal, there are strict reg's re height, proximity to combustibles etc.
Problem.
Only I can see the flue so if I report it I'm in the mire. (windows smashed etc)
Only 2 other properties can see the new building. So if I report it it's simply a matter of elimination.
So, do I ring the council or not??  Att. a pic of the flue
Thanks for reading and any advice.
As a footnote, we'll never be able to sell now, either, except perhaps for bugger-all to another gypsy!!


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## Gill (21 May 2018)

I would not want to be in your shoes dealing with that lot. 
Although as they have purchased a property they would now be subject to council law. 
And also the RSPCA may want to check on the welfare of the Breeding Facility for the Jack Russells. 
The council may even be reluctant to get involved with this issue. Seeing as they are Gypos. 

All in all, its on you how you want to deal with this issue and what repercussions that would entail. Maybe message your council rep and see what they would advise on how to go froward with this.


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## Edvet (21 May 2018)

Usually the police will take "aninymous" complaints if you have a talk with them,  While checking the shed, they could notice it isn't up to code. Might be worth to go have a chat with them, maybe even mention a heavy smell of "weed".


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## Tim Harrison (21 May 2018)

Yes ring the council...you'll need the planning department, the law is very stringent when it comes to planning issues and building regs. 
It's also more stringent than it's ever been when dealing with disturbance, so you may want to get Environmental Health involved in the meantime.
Further, there should be a neighbourhood officer, they should be able to help too.
If you're worried about reprisals let the council know and they should inform the police and at least involve the PCSO. 
If you're really worried instal CCTV. That way if anything untoward does happen chances are you'll have the evidence to prove it.


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## Parablennius (21 May 2018)

Thanks for the replies and advice, guys.
I remember when we extended our house upwards we had to jump through all kinds of hoops re. structure, outline, fire escapes, stairs, alarms, size of windows etc and I know that our neighbours were told of our plans, which how I know this was never submitted. I did send 3 identical anonymous letters to dog warden, environmental health and planning, all for nought. When I asked had they received them, the stock response was "we don't act on anonymous letters". The dog warden did pay us a visit and she was sympathetic, but as you might guess, the dogs were quiet. It comes in waves as they breed them.
This is the issue, I've spoken, by 'phone, to the relevant offices but unless I'm prepared to stick my neck on the block, no-one will act!! I have CCTV system which is currently redundant so I'm considering getting it up and running. What pisses me off is that I've lived here 31 yrs, never a cross word with a neighbour, and end up in this predicament. As you say, my hope was this; The dogs get inspected, leading to the building being outside of planning, use, etc, leading to the woodburner flue being a joke, which it clearly is. Also correct that the authorities are reluctant. There's a daughter of secondary school age that never goes to school. Anyone else would get nailed! I forgot to mention the poultry on the front lawn which has now, thankfully, disappeared.
Cheers


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## tam (21 May 2018)

If they are puppy farming you could find you'll local animal activist group - there is bound to be one and tip them off and let them do the reporting. Particularly if the dogs are ending up on local selling sites etc.


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## Tim Harrison (21 May 2018)

I guess you've really got no choice but to be upfront about it. There is always the possibility that if you don't resolve the situation sooner than later it could deteriorate further. If the council and police aren't proactive enough you can always leverage the situation using the local media. They hate bad publicity.
Also, don't waste time with minions, write to the CEO of the council, and if you're not satisfied with any police responses write to the Chief Constable. 
Further, get your local councillors involved too. Many councils are councillor led so they have a lot of power and sway with the police. 
And if it really becomes a problem, go and see your MP. I see he's a conservative, that should be in your favour politically. Even if they are too busy to personally oversee events their Senior Caseworkers are usually on the ball.


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## sciencefiction (21 May 2018)

I know someone that was in a similar situation, noise, rubbish thrown around the place, arguments.., etc..Same neighbors had a dog that was bound to a leash and left to almost starve in the back yard.  My friend brought them to court for animal cruelty. One thing led to another and it turns out they were not working, claiming welfare under 2 different names, con artists etc...etc...So it worked out fine in the end after some horrible years my friend had to endure.....


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## Petra R (21 May 2018)

Have you tried talking to them neighbour to neighbour? I know there is probably animosity on both sides but I remember many years ago friends of mine ended up with people from that ethnic background buying a very grand place in rural Berkshire and everyone was up in arms... they also had mini goats who'd attack us when we rode down the bridlepath on our horses and had rather aggressive dogs, chickens and kids.

After a while two of us met one of them out riding and one of (our) horses got hurt and he helped, went to get a vet (days before mobiles) and got a trailer to take horse to the vets. Once we got talking much of the mutual animosity vanished and bit by bit it sort of all got sorted, the mini goats contained, dogs introduced and chickens brought under control.  They were actually really nice people once we got to know them.

Remember they have been subjected to generations of discrimination (like any ethnic group there are bad eggs and good eggs) and often they are better on your side than not?


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## PARAGUAY (22 May 2018)

Just to add everyone here as good advice, but as Tim says get your local councillors details, if possible see them at a surgery, what you have here is a couple of things going on and it’s classed as distress but try to stay calm. Some local authority’s are very slow to initially react ,so get names log calls of anyone you contact and try to get email proof and I would definetly get a couple of written letters to your council leader so you have something in writing. If your local authority is slow to act a letter to your MP. Report anything to the RSPCA can be confidential too. Above all else as said try to get on with these people at the end of the day as Petra says even though it’s stressful at the moment. Speak to friendly neighbour even though they might not be directly affected as a witness to how it develops just in case it escalates in the wrong way. If thePolice get involved it’s a last resort in my opinion, hope it all works out for you


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## zozo (22 May 2018)

Parablennius said:


> As a footnote, we'll never be able to sell now, either, except perhaps for bugger-all to another gypsy!!View attachment 115467



Gypsy or not, but what they did as shown in the picture is a major fire hazard. They are playing with your lives..  Call the fire department explain and ask what you need to do.. This gets the ball roling..
Employees at the fire department all are macho's very keen on their job.. They are selected beeing macho's, selected on character, to follow command without questions asked when there's no time for discussion. That's why they never ask for a key and always break down doors immediately. They love that, that's a piece of the action didn't bring the aks to ask a key!?.  Fire hazard gets alarm bels ringing, even tho they are macho's, still don't like to put their lives on the line to save yours if it can be prevented.. You just might be lucky with the question "What do i need to do?" That the fire department comes looking and informes the proper authorities and than the rest of the illegal building method comes roling out on itself.

That flue is your trump card..


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## mort (22 May 2018)

I'm surprised that the council wasn't interested in the planning permission as myself and 3 neighbours have had them turn up to inspect our builds. We know who complained only because she has form for it and we're told it's confidential by the inspector. 3 had planning permission already and we didn't need it as it's classed as a temporary structure and within limits. They certainly are hot on it here so I would get onto them again. The flue should come under building regs which they have clearly broken and will strengthen your argument.


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## Parablennius (22 May 2018)

Morning all
Thanks for your constructive comments,some of which I'd already considered.
I did speak to him once about the dogs, but instead of complaining, I went down the "concerned" route and asked if his dog was OK as it had woke me up, whining. He just said "it's got pups". No apology. End of conversation.
There has been no animosity either way. I go out of my way to be polite, but this has worked against me in this case and I feel that my easy going nature has been exploited.
I'm sure the Council will investigate, but only if I make a formal written complaint and I'm imagining the spin-off if he has to demolish the building. It took just a couple of minutes on Google to confirm my fears about the building and the woodburner flue. It's a balance now between the risk factor of reporting, only I can see the flue, or maybe, waiting 'till he burns his own building down. That flue will surely melt the plastic capping to the tiles. I'll give it more thought.
cheers


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## mort (22 May 2018)

From time to time we get firemen  walk up the road offering checks on our houses. You could maybe contact the local brigade and explain the situation. I wouldn't be surprised if they didn't mind pretending they were checking your house when they saw the flue.


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## AverageWhiteBloke (22 May 2018)

Ime with Gypsies and I know quite a few they know the law inside and out better than most. I'm guessing regarding the wood burner they are going to go down the route of the building is not residential. If no one is living in it then technically it doesn't come under building Reg's for residential properties. It's the equivalent of you having a fire in your back garden, nothing to stop you doing that as long as you don't annoy the neighbours or burn certain things. If it's on all the time you could argue  you can't open your windows on hot nights because your house fills with smoke and come under nuisance law. 

Regarding the dogs, commercial breeder need registered with their local authority, obviously they are going to say they aren't selling them and just breed for friends, they aren't stupid. I think your lead in is council planning, as far as I'm aware you can't have a structure over 2.5m high within 2m of your boundary line. How do you get on with your other neighbours, are they having issues with them? Sometimes its best to join forces if possible and if you do have to stick your neck on the line just do what they do and lie through your teeth. Just say the council turned up randomly for another reason and just happened to spot it. 

The council will let you stay anonymous as long as the case is between them and the council. Its not like you're filing a personal complaint, you are just pointing it out and it's up to the council whether or not they proceed and follow up. As such they have no need to name you as you're not complaining but you will get more joy if you do speak to someone rather than sending anonymous letters. I'm sure if you explain the circumstances and knowing how these things tend to pan with gypsies I'm sure they will understand your fears and tell you whether or not they would have to name you.

Having said all that, I know a lot of travellers who are hard working fair men. In the main they tend not to blahblahblahblah in their own nests so I'll be surprised if they want to take on their neighbours when they've settled on premises. They don't need the heat as it prevents them doing "other things" to make money. Fair enough when they're in a temporary camp, they just cause mayhem and move to another camp when it gets spooky but in permanent residence they tend to stay off the radar if possible.


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## Parablennius (23 May 2018)

Yes, this is the issue with the building. It aint temporary, it's over two and half metres tall and just a couple of feet from the boundary. Correct, it's not residential, YET!  He tried to sell my son a pup for £300.00, but dog warden says he's not licensed. The flue from the woodburner is clearly miles from the stipulated regs, easily found on the net, and a fire risk. I did speak to planning over the 'phone but as I say they wont act until a make complaint myself!
cheers


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## PARAGUAY (23 May 2018)

Good news for you ,pretty soon or maybe now woodburners are to  be banned or illegal because of fumes and health hazard,saw it on news yesterday  Could be a good thing to pursue


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## AverageWhiteBloke (23 May 2018)

Parablennius said:


> Yes, this is the issue with the building. It aint temporary, it's over two and half metres tall and just a couple of feet from the boundary. Correct, it's not residential, YET!  He tried to sell my son a pup for £300.00, but dog warden says he's not licensed. The flue from the woodburner is clearly miles from the stipulated regs, easily found on the net, and a fire risk. I did speak to planning over the 'phone but as I say they wont act until a make complaint myself!
> cheers


Take it higher then mate. Speak to someone higher up and tell them that you have pointed it out to planning and no one has bothered to follow up. Insist that due to fear of repercussions you want to remain anonymous. If the council are aware of it it's their responsibility to d something about it due to duty of care to the public. The argument is between them and the gypsies and no need for you to be named. If you see a dangerous thing on a public roads once reported it's not up to you to follow that up its the duty of the county council. 

Sent from my STH100-2 using Tapatalk


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## PARAGUAY (23 May 2018)

Planning departments are not what they were, I  have seen superb porches in the past built and because correct prochedure ignored made to be taken down.These days because of PC over the top attitudes anything goes with these depts and you get tangled up in red tape.Thats were a councillor comes in to sort it out  and it can still be confidential, I would write to your MP with the issue if nothing seems to happen Has dog warden said what he or she can do?


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## ian_m (23 May 2018)

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-44218913


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## Parablennius (24 May 2018)

Thanks very much for all your sound advice and info, it's very much appreciated.
Strangely, the dogs have been quieter the last couple of days???
I now have to balance the risks of the outcome against the results. I'm considering all options now and it's already caused a bit of domestic friction!
Thanks Guys.
cheers


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## Parablennius (1 Dec 2018)

Now then troops
Something of an update for you here.
About 3 weeks ago, in the evening I went out onto my drive and the air was thick with smoke, ( no wind, heavy damp atmosphere)  A few minutes later the Fire Brigade rocked up, Someone's rung them! OH NO!!! They searched my garden and neighbour's on both sides. They found the burner in next-doors annexe, cottage, bungalow, man-cave, whatever you want to call it.
Two days later this appeared on said neighbour's front garden path, plonked in clear view from our lounge window. no doubt an intimidation tactic! Pic. att herein



What I didn't realise at the time, but do now, is that the burner is in fact a garden refuse incinerator that he was using indoors!! *KNOB.* Scorched all the wood around the flue on his newly built thing which they've attempted to scrub off!
By the way, the piece of T+G you can see is not my work, obviously, and the idiot's removed the cappings ( you can see one of four there ) off all the brick towers that finished them. WHY?
As you can imagine it's not much fun here now, so after 32 yrs of happily getting on with all our neighbour's and nurturing a thriving wildlife sanctuary/newt breeding garden which I'll have to abandon, I'm on the point of calling it a day and bailing out which will probably involve breaking into my so far untouched and cherished pension fund.
None of my letters to the council, ( dog warden, planning, environmental health ) have yielded a sodding thing, even a visit to the local nick, despite being sympathetic, said they could do nothing!
So I've got 50 odd kilo's of lava type reef rock and a 7' 6" 10mm float glass aquarium from my reef and native marine keeping days to shift. Too big for my possible new home. They're on Ebay now. Make a lovely planted tank for someone, just not me, my current 4' is plenty now.
Thanks for your advice previously and for taking the time to  read my (by now) somewhat calmer rant.
Cheers
Steve


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## Edvet (1 Dec 2018)




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## DutchMuch (1 Dec 2018)




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## PARAGUAY (2 Dec 2018)

32 years ?there must be neighbours who you know and trust,sign a letter together queitly send off to your MP, who will recognise this as ASB of the highest order and contact local authority for you aS health and safety issue.  A MP writing to council and police can work wonders and the fire brigade can help file a report for safety issues? Dont confront these idiots though


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## Parablennius (27 Feb 2019)

Evenin' Troops
Another update here.. They have now fitted a floodlight to the gable-end of the illegal annexe which is left on all night and which lights up all the lower half of our garden! Pic att. Following your earlier advice I mailed the council leader outlining my previous concerns and the mails to her various dept's with a threat to take LCC to small claims court to go towards my removal costs. Her response was from the Lancaster city council legal dept. saying that as I threatened court action, they would not consider complaints as they will form part of the case. I also went into the local nick and despite complete sympathy, they admitted there was nothing they could do. Also with regard to the changes in law for dog breeding, how will that affect them? Their actions so far dictate zip! I'm now resigned to leaving behind my beloved amphibian sanctuary and moving away. To move to where I think is worthwhile it's going to cost me IRO £30,000 from my pension pot!


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## X3NiTH (27 Feb 2019)

How frustrating, they show intent to do nothing and at the bare mention of legal action (compensatory costs) they reply that they are now able to legally do nothing. I think you're choices are limited, spend the £30k fighting the council or use it to move away from the problem, not the solution you want unfortunately. The intimidating garden light will likely ensure your Newts will be gone from your garden before you move.


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## Edvet (28 Feb 2019)

RSPCA?


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## Parablennius (28 Feb 2019)

Sorry Edvet, my experience with RSPCA has not been good. In any event these people know that as long as they attend to the dogs once in 24 hrs they're in the clear. I am not suggesting that they mistreat the dogs, just that they aren't kept under control. Dogs are just a part of the problem now, whippets rather than the earlier Jack russels. Either way, we're off. I'm so angry that they've done just as they please without regard for others. Should have known better, really. They are buying up the corner plots on here, I have one either side and one facing. Arrogant, selfish @rseholes. Deserting my pond is the biggest hit, it really upsets me, all that work, obtaining licenses, collecting eggs etc, whoever buys my place ( and that will be a miracle in itself ) will surely fill it in, watching others has taught me that!
cheers
Steve


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## mort (28 Feb 2019)

Sorry to hear this Steve. Unfortunately I see no way to help. In today's world common courtesy seems a thing of the past and everyone is so afraid of getting sued that they wont help. I hope things improve for you.


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## Edvet (28 Feb 2019)

Cr@p, wish you all the best with finding a new house.


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## Tim Harrison (28 Feb 2019)

That is a nightmare...good luck whatever you decide to do.


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## obsessed (9 Mar 2019)

I'm very new around here and I'm a bit shocked really.. no wounder its all going t up.. a tad racist


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