# A couple of CO2 system questions



## chrisjj (1 Jan 2012)

A couple of CO2 questions:

Full set up with ceamic diffuser bottom left under powerhead & spraybar.
Drop checker other side of tank reasonably high.
On 1.5 hours before lights, off 1hr before lights.  Tiny bubbles everywhere whilst on.
186ltr (150 water)

1 - even at 5bps, the drop checker indicator barely changes from blue whilst CO2 is on.  I can't count fast enough to increase the bps accuratley!! 

2 - whilst it is off, the pressure reduces so the next day it drops from around 5bps, to around 3 (I then open the valve or play with the adjustable pressure to get it back to around 5bps.  I can't find any leaks / poor seals.

Any tips?


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## GHNelson (1 Jan 2012)

Hi
What water are you using in the drop checker?
hoggie


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## Robbowal (1 Jan 2012)

a full list of hardware would help as well.


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## chrisjj (1 Jan 2012)

6kg co2 cylinder
UP adjustable pressure reg + solenoid on digital timer
co2 tubing
glass check valve
Fluval bubble counter
Gush glass diffuser
glass drop checker with bromo 4dkh water (from Aquaessential)


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## GHNelson (1 Jan 2012)

Hi Chris
You could probably benefit by using a UP in-line atomiser/diffuser in this size of aquarium.
Or you could set your Co2 to come on 2/3 hours before lights on.
Do you have a lot of turbulence on the surface?
hoggie


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## chrisjj (1 Jan 2012)

I've just got this for Xmas, so would like to try & get it sorted with what I've got, if you know what I mean!.

I did look at the inline diffusers, but opted againt as it reduced flow & wasn't keen on the "mist" look.

Surface turbulance has been reduced by lowering spraybar - surface ripples, but doesn't break.

There are some CO2 bubbles on the surface - guessing the ones that don't disolve.

I'll put CO2 on sooner.


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## GHNelson (1 Jan 2012)

I'll put CO2 on sooner
Yea try that...this planted game is not a exact science as every persons aquarium is unique.
If you know what i mean.  
Cheers
hoggie


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## ceg4048 (1 Jan 2012)

Hi Chris,
            Any chance of getting a photo of your setup? It would also be nice to know what filtration/pumps you are using.

Cheers,


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## chrisjj (1 Jan 2012)

I'll sort a recent pic, but one soon after set up is seen on thread - about 6 months ago:

37x 17 x 18 custom built.

spray bar now along back.

now has 2x tunze 6015 powerheads (1800lph each)

& more  fish.


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## Alastair (1 Jan 2012)

Inline diffuser may be more beneficial regarding distribution through spray bar mate. I'd have a thought it would give a better spread 


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## sussex_cichlids (2 Jan 2012)

ditch the spray bar that will be creating to much surface movment look at a glass lillypipe type pipe or push the spray bar well below surface reducing surface movment that should help give you higher co2

also do you have any air pumps running


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## chrisjj (3 Jan 2012)

Cheers guys, 

I'm playing around with spraybar position, diffuser options & increased bubble rate & I've noticed the dro-pchecker going green so I'm getting there with that one.

Anyone have any advice re question 2 - the reg pressure reducing over night?


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## GHNelson (3 Jan 2012)

Hi Chris
Where have you got your Non return/check valves placed :?: 
hoggie


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## chrisjj (3 Jan 2012)

Set up goes:

cylinder, reg & solenoid, 1m tube, valve, 1m tube, bubble counter, 50cm tube (into tank), diffuser.


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## GHNelson (3 Jan 2012)

Hi 
I would put a check valve before your diffuser this will help stop back flow of working pressure.
Also your diffuser will fire up quicker.
What are your readings on the gauges?
hoggie


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## chrisjj (3 Jan 2012)

I can get another valve so will try that.

Not too knowledgable about regs & I can't quite remember the guage readings so will check tonight but the cylinder one doesn't move and currently at around 70?

The working pressure one I set at around 15psi, but it drops overnight to 5-10, then starts fluctuating up & down a bit when it comes on - does that make sense?


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## PeteA (3 Jan 2012)

I'm using an inline Up atomiser (new style) and don't think it alters the flow very much at all as it's all straight bore through.  My pressure is set to 2.5 bar off which drops to around 2.1 when it's on.  I would also say that on my 190 litre I've only every used the bubble counter as a rough guide that I'm increasing or decreasing the amount of CO2   Spray bar certainly should be underneath the water as it'll take the CO2 bubbles and push them around rather than popping a load as they hit the surface.


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## GHNelson (3 Jan 2012)

Hi
The working pressure will go down slightly when not in use....then it will rise to push the Co2 through the diffuser.
Ive found that these ceramic diffusers need a bit of time to fire up if you have a working pressure of 1.5 bar.
Is your working pressure adjustable on the regulator?
Is this the reg :arrow: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Up-CO2-regula ... 35b1b3ec2d
hoggie


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## sussex_cichlids (3 Jan 2012)

Also have you used PTFE (plumbers thread tape) on your threads i used this on every thread conection throw my whole systerm 

Try this you may find it helps you can get the PTFE from most place only few quid


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## chrisjj (3 Jan 2012)

I'm not up to speed with the pressure things yet, but the set up is as follows:

Yes - it is that one! except it is the A164 model - the same but has a key rather than a knob to change the pressure.

The cylinder pressure is at 1000psi / 70 kg/cm3.

The working pressure I set at 15psi / 1kg/cm3 (is that the same as 1 bar?)

When off this reduces (over night) to around 0.5kg.cm3, but doesn't go back up when it goes back on.

I've got some PTFE so will try it.


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## GHNelson (3 Jan 2012)

sussex_cichlids said:
			
		

> Also have you used PTFE (plumbers thread tape) on your threads i used this on every thread conection throw my whole systerm
> 
> Try this you may find it helps you can get the PTFE from most place only few quid


Hi
I don't think your supposed to use plumbers tape on regulators....there is a few reasons why.
I cant remember all of them though...I think its in-case a small piece of detached tape gets pushed into the regulator.
Maybe someone else can jog my memory.
hoggie


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## GHNelson (3 Jan 2012)

Sorry miss read your post


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## GHNelson (3 Jan 2012)

hogan53 said:
			
		

> Hi
> Turn the working pressure knob up to try and get it up 2 bar.
> hoggie


Sorry ballsed that up...If you have a key switch on the solenoid and use the key to increase the working pressure....to 2 bar.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Up-aqua-CO2-r ... 3cb2e96550
hoggie


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## chrisjj (3 Jan 2012)

hogan53 said:
			
		

> hogan53 said:
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The solenoid is plugged into a digital timer?

I assume you mean turn the working pressure on the reg up to 2bar - I take it that is the same as 2kg/cm3? - I'll do that & see.

I may be going for an inline diffuser, so guess I'll need to increase to at least that anyway.

I seem to remember re the PTFE tape, so will leave that for now.


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## GHNelson (3 Jan 2012)

chrisjj said:
			
		

> hogan53 said:
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Manually switch on your timer so the solenoid opens then increase the working pressure.


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## GHNelson (3 Jan 2012)

Chris
You are correct will need about 2 bar to run a UP in-line atomiser.
So best get this sorted first.
I like the look of that regulator...the working pressure shouldn't fall much when everything is running smoothly.
Keep us posted.  
hoggie


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## sussex_cichlids (3 Jan 2012)

hogan53 said:
			
		

> sussex_cichlids said:
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Ive been using PTFE tape on CO2 bottle thread for 6 years with no problem not sure how you can come to conclusion you shouldn't use it it designed for this use also if applied properly its trapped between two threads and cannot block the pipe never herd this or seen any problem with using PTFE tape


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## PeteA (4 Jan 2012)

Ive been using PTFE tape on CO2 bottle thread for 6 years with no problem not sure how you can come to conclusion you shouldn't use it it designed for this use also if applied properly its trapped between two threads and cannot block the pipe never herd this or seen any problem with using PTFE tape[/quote]

I've read that you're not meant to use it either - its designed for plumbing (i.e. water).  For any pressurised system the rubber/plastic o-rings provide the seal not the thread.  If gas is leaking from the thread then you need to replace your o-rings.

The new style UP in-line atomisers need a slightly higher pressure than 2 bar.  These are the ones that are perfectly cylindrical and you can unscrew the top to clean the inside.


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## chrisjj (4 Jan 2012)

I set the pressure to 2 bar (2 kg/cm3) last night - crazy amount of gas, so adjusted the needle.

Somewhere between 5 & 10 bps, but the dropchecker went green so all fine.

Will see what happens today when I get in from work......


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## GHNelson (4 Jan 2012)

Hi Chris
Nice one your on the road to success 
Can you give us a heads up on the accuracy of the needle valve is it stable.....will it do 1 bubble a second without any fluctuations. 
Cheers
hoggie


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## chrisjj (4 Jan 2012)

hogan53 said:
			
		

> Hi Chris
> Nice one your on the road to success
> Can you give us a heads up on the accuracy of the needle valve is it stable.....will it do 1 bubble a second without any fluctuations.
> Cheers
> hoggie



You're asking me to mess around with the needle when I'm trying to get it stable!!!   

Will do - I had it steady a 2bps when first set up.  Then steady at 3bps when drop checker wasn't changing, then 4 & then 5, so from my limited experience, I'm guessing it's pretty stable.  It stayed at what ever I set it whilst it was on - so several hours.  Just that the next day it dropped (eg from 5bps to 3bps) - but guessing that's the pressure issue rather than the needle.


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## GHNelson (4 Jan 2012)

Do us a favour  
 :silent:


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## chrisjj (5 Jan 2012)

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pic of set up for comment.


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## sussex_cichlids (5 Jan 2012)

Try editing your post 





You need to remove the two red bits ive marked in the code below your image will then work






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## chrisjj (7 Jan 2012)

Thanks susssex!

It's been a few days now & the pressure seems to be stable now it's set at 2 bar, bubble counter stable, drop checker going green - all good   

Got to start dealing with the algae now!


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## sussex_cichlids (7 Jan 2012)

Hi Chriss

Thats ok mate 

Sometime the easyest and only way to sort the algae out is to have a full 4 day blackout that should help knock it on the head some members may have few other tricks you can try


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## GHNelson (7 Jan 2012)

Hi Chris
Nice set-up.  
Lower your lighting levels and you will get shot of your algae now.
As long as you keep your Co2 levels stable in conjunction with feeding your plants .....and doing regular water changes. 
hoggie


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## Alastair (7 Jan 2012)

sussex_cichlids said:
			
		

> Try editing your post
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That powerhead looks like it will interfere with flow from the spray bar. Maybe try having the spray bar shorter and on the same side as the tank blowing across and right.


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## chrisjj (11 Jan 2012)

Tried that, but it left the bottom left of the tank dead.

The LHS powerhead is positioned just below the spraybar, angled towards the rear, so pushes water along the back of the tank, to the right.  The spraybar flow goes over the powerhead, so I still get good flow from it towards the front, so getting to the bottom left.

The powerhead on the RHS is angled slightly towards the front - this is only on for a few hours a day.

With this set up, I get good circular flow from the spraybar - rear the front (top), down the front & front to rear (bottom) and good clockwise "whirlpool" flow from the powerheads.

It appears to have good flow in all areas with this set up.

I haven't needed to touch the reg pressure or needle valve since my last post, so that's good.

(I set the bubble counter to 1 bps for a while, & it seemed to be pretty steady)


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