# which potting compost ?



## peter senior

Hi All
I want to put potting compost under my substrate, i am going to use the Tesco,s cat litter
the two compost,s that seem to be popular are john innes no3 or miracle grow, problem ive got is it doesn,t seem to be available at any of the local garden centre,s, can i use any potting compost or does it have to be one of the above mentioned
thanks Pete


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## NanoJames

I'm afraid I can't tell you what the names are here, but I know that you can't use all types of compost. I did a little experimental tank with Levington's Multi-Purpose compost and, for a few weeks, I got incredibly high nitrates. Sometimes it was reading up to 50 mg/ litre! So definetely don't use multi purpose composts!


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## BigTom

Hi Pete,

Pretty much all composts will grow plants well. You need to be a little bit aware of how they'll effect your water chemistry though, in order to pick the right sort for your livestock.

Most commercial mixes like John Innes (John Innes Composts explained) contain limestone and a lot of fertilisers which can really bump up your pH and hardness; not good if you're keeping delicate soft water fish species. If going for a JI mix, I'd recommend using 1 or 2; same basic formula as 3 but a bit leaner.

This stuff ( Original & genuine AQUA SOIL formulated for your pond plants (20 Litres) | eBay) should have much less impact on your water stats, so go for that if you want to keep the water in your tank at similar levels to whats in your tap.

Also be aware that most soils will leach ammonia for some weeks after being submerged. The more organic matter in the soil, the longer and greater the leaching. If you want to add livestock quite quickly, then go for something like Westland's Aquatic Compost (WESTLAND AQUATIC COMPOST 20L - 3 BAGS FOR 10 99)which supposedly is formulated to reduce ammonia leaching. It will have a similar effect on your pH and hardness to John Innes.

If you're going to have quite a deep bed then I'd also mix in a good amount of well washed grit or gravel to improve aeration a bit.


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## peter senior

Hi Tom
thanks for info, i,m not in any rush to add livestock so if it takes a while to settle that,s ok
Pete


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## foxfish

Nice post Tom...


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## BigTom

peter senior said:


> Hi Tom
> thanks for info, i,m not in any rush to add livestock so if it takes a while to settle that,s ok
> Pete


 
OK great, patience is very much a virtue with soil based tanks.



foxfish said:


> Nice post Tom...


 
Cheers. Just what me and Alastair figured out between us really.


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## andy

Just to add on from Tom's post above, John Innes also do an ericaceous compost without the lime.  Not tried it but might be worth thinking of.


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## BigTom

andy said:


> Just to add on from Tom's post above, John Innes also do an ericaceous compost without the lime. Not tried it but might be worth thinking of.


 
Yeah I trialled this as well. You end up quite odd parameters where you have an acidic pH but very high TDS from the ferts. So still not good for soft water fish but you might find some use for it.


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## peter senior

Hi Tom
managed to get some John Innes no 3 today, then went to tesco,s and got the cat litter
before i go ahead and put the compost, and cat litter on top is there anything else beside,s mixing some gravel with the compost i need to add ?
once i get everything up and running what fert,s do i need to get and i do i work out the dosage,s ?
thanks Pete


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## BigTom

Not much more to it really Pete. Have always capped mine with sand, I'm assuming that cat litter will hold it down OK, no experience with it though.

You might find that there are bits of bark and wood in the compost which will try and float, but you can just scoop these out once the tank is filled. I've never bothered supplementing the soil with anything, so I wouldn't worry about that (some people do add laterite and all sorts of other things but I don't really see the need).

As for fert dosing, I have some TNC all in one mix but I hardly ever use it. I bought 500ml 3 years ago and still have about a quarter of it left. Can't hurt to dose a little trace now and again I suppose but I'm almost completely ignorant about fertilisers. If the plants start looking sad somewhere down the line then I guess you'll know its time to start dosing, but I'd expect a soil base to keep releasing a good balance of nutrients for months/years.


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## peter senior

cheers Tom
i,l go with that and see how it goes and as you say i can dose at a later date if needed
Pete


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## kevin1962

may I ask what's the reasoning behind putting the compost under the cat litter? is it for added nutrition as i have read that slow release granules i.e osmocote or similar can be used or is there another reason for adding compost first, wouldn't aquatic compost be the best option. I only ask as I'm still at the planning stage myself so the more info I get the better ...cheers

p.s I work in a garden centre and get staff discount so have access to all the stuff mentioned except for the cat litter, I'll be checking out the bonsai department on my next shift to see if they have any moler clay

pps I think it's miracle gro organic that has been used in the past rather than the plain miracle gro compost


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## biffster

peter senior said:


> Hi All
> I want to put potting compost under my substrate, i am going to use the Tesco,s cat litter
> the two compost,s that seem to be popular are john innes no3 or miracle grow, problem ive got is it doesn,t seem to be available at any of the local garden centre,s, can i use any potting compost or does it have to be one of the above mentioned
> thanks Pete


 
i use j arthur bowers aquatic compost i find it works well


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## Alastair

kevin1962 said:


> may I ask what's the reasoning behind putting the compost under the cat litter? is it for added nutrition as i have read that slow release granules i.e osmocote or similar can be used or is there another reason for adding compost first, wouldn't aquatic compost be the best option. I only ask as I'm still at the planning stage myself so the more info I get the better ...cheers
> 
> p.s I work in a garden centre and get staff discount so have access to all the stuff mentioned except for the cat litter, I'll be checking out the bonsai department on my next shift to see if they have any moler clay
> 
> pps I think it's miracle gro organic that has been used in the past rather than the plain miracle gro compost



Hi kevin 
It has the benefit or slowly releasing ferts for the plants but also during decomposing etc it creates carbon for the plants. Its great if your wanting a low maintenance non co2 injected tank 

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## faizal

Tom, what about ADA amazonia mixed with some grit & some coral sand? I live in the paddy field area and our tap water is very soft. This capped with some sand. The only problem is that it leeches a lot of NH4 . How do i dealers with that?


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## Alastair

faizal said:


> Tom, what about ADA amazonia mixed with some grit & some coral sand? I live in the paddy field area and our tap water is very soft. This capped with some sand. The only problem is that it leeches a lot of NH4 . How do i dealers with that?



Hi faizal
Wont the coral sand act as a buffer increasing your ph gh etc?? If you were going to use ada amazonia would this not suffice??

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## faizal

Thanks Al. 
So just some amazonia mixed with 50% grit & capped with sand then. But then any idea how i should deal with the ammonia spike that comes with amazonia during the initial stages? 100 % Water changes during lights off period for the first one month? or should i just do 10 - 15 %  water changes 3 times a week like you are doing now?


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## BigTom

faizal said:


> Thanks Al.
> So just some amazonia mixed with 50% grit & capped with sand then. But then any idea how i should deal with the ammonia spike that comes with amazonia during the initial stages? 100 % Water changes during lights off period for the first one month? or should i just do 10 - 15 % water changes 3 times a week like you are doing now?


 

There's no need to use grit or a sand cap with Amazonia if you don't want to. It's nice hard balls of stuff, not really soil at all. Just checking you knew that - if you want to cap it for aesthetic reasons then obviously fire away!

If you don't have livestock in the tank immediately then I wouldn't worry much about the ammonia leaching and just start with whatever your normal water change regime will be. If you can wait a few weeks before adding livestock then most of the leaching should have happened and your plants should be established enough to mop up any that's still occuring. Adding a few floating plants will also help.


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## faizal

Cheers Tom. 
I will definetely plan on  waiting for about 3-4 weeks before adding fishes. Just confirming this though but i keep hearing about large water changes  like around 50% or so in a non co2 set up causing fluctuations of co2 levels. So this actually applies to water changes during the lights on period? If so, water changes during lights out is ok then? Sorry but i've always been unclear on this. Thank you for your help.


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## BigTom

faizal said:


> Cheers Tom.
> I will definetely plan on waiting for about 3-4 weeks before adding fishes. Just confirming this though but i keep hearing about large water changes like around 50% or so in a non co2 set up causing fluctuations of co2 levels. So this actually applies to water changes during the lights on period? If so, water changes during lights out is ok then? Sorry but i've always been unclear on this. Thank you for your help.


 

We talked about this a little bit towards the end of this thread - Starting up on the fresher side of fishkeeping. | Page 2 | UK Aquatic Plant Society

To be honest, I'm not convinced about the whole fear of water changes in low tech. If you've got reasonable surface movement it shouldn't be an issue. You could always play it safe by changing little and often, rather than large amounts at once.


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## Dan walton

I myself am starting a planted tank and intend to use the John Innings 3 mixed with some dark grit topped with fluval stratum this is my first attempt and have started a journal myself for it Rio 125 Planted tank first attempt will see how it goes I'm also in no rush to start adding livestock to the tank and will be planting most of the foreground while the tank is empty just kept moist with a daily misting 


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## Pinkmummy79

Right I can't wait any longer, I'm digging out our 30 litre tank and setting up a small dirt tank think I'll mineralize the soil 3-4 weeks until I have planned my scape and flora etc.
I'm joint the dark side

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## Davy gravy

Hi, resurrection of an old thread. I'm soon to be setting up a simple moss and rock tank. Will there be any gains to be had for putting John Innes 3 under my tesco cat litter? Thanks in advance


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## humdingerx

Davy gravy said:


> Hi, resurrection of an old thread. I'm soon to be setting up a simple moss and rock tank. Will there be any gains to be had for putting John Innes 3 under my tesco cat litter? Thanks in advance



I'm still learning too but if you've only moss I don't think it will help (no roots/won't go that far down) better off just adding some ferts into the water, if you even need that..


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