# surface film



## Samjpikey (14 Dec 2013)

I've got the dreaded surface film on my tank , but it's multicolored like a rainbow, 

It's been happening for the past month or so and is at it's worse now :/.  

I've done 75 % water changes quite frequently and it comes back with a vengeance a day later.
I have no algae in the tank and co2 saturation is optimal  ( well I think so).

I have a spray bar mounted the full length of the tank right at the surface making a nice steady ripple but not breaking it.  

Tank is 120 litres , I dose Ei and 2ml of liquid carbon a day. 
It's not over stocked and fed every 2-3 days .  

I have tried to eliminate it but I'm having no luck so I need a little help  
Is a surface skimmer the only way to stop this problem or even running an air stone at night ??

Whats your thoughts of why i have it and your ways around it  ? It really looks awful  

Thanks 


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## Westyggx (14 Dec 2013)

EHEIM skim350

Best thing i have ever bought for my tank


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## GHNelson (14 Dec 2013)

Try more surface agitation.
hoggie


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## steveno (14 Dec 2013)

Interested to heard how others have dealt with this... I have similar issue, thou it's not as bad as it was...  I managed to reduce alot by increasing airation by lifting lilly pipe up at night, but haven't so for awhile as I got a bit lazy... So surface scum is starting to get thicker again. I've seen a glass intake with a glass surface skimmer, so am considering to buy.


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## Samjpikey (14 Dec 2013)

Westyggx said:


> EHEIM skim350
> 
> Best thing i have ever bought for my tank




I have looked at these even before I had the film ,  just still debating on it but the reviews on here about it seem pretty good and not bad for the price . What's the dimensions of it ? 

I've never had a surface film before on my tanks and this is the first time I've used Ada Amazonia , - is this a common symptom with Ada ?? 





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## Westyggx (14 Dec 2013)

Not sure on dimensions but it's not big. I don't use ADA so can't comment. It's apparently down to poor plant health but my plants have been fine for the last year, so I don't think it's that. Could just be a build up of nutrients, co2 and anything else.


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## Samjpikey (14 Dec 2013)

What do you think ?? 


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## Samjpikey (14 Dec 2013)

This is my plant health 


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## GHNelson (14 Dec 2013)

Try more agitation first.
If this doesn't solve the problem get a Eheim skimmer.
There about 6 inches high.

hoggie


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## GHNelson (14 Dec 2013)

Ehiem micro skimmer 350 review. | UK Aquatic Plant Society


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## Yo-han (14 Dec 2013)

Samjpikey said:


> What do you think?



I think your filter isn't working properly! Perhaps with all the CO2, you pH is too low for bacteria to break down those lipids. An air pump works really well for 3 reasons: 1. Extra surface movement, so the lipids get into the water and into the filter. 2. Extra oxygen, so bacteria can work better at night. 3. It blows CO2 out, so pH raises and bacteria work more efficiënt.

That being said, an Eheim works a charm! Still you'll always keep getting it back unless you solve the bacteria part IMO...


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## Samjpikey (14 Dec 2013)

Yo-han said:


> I think your filter isn't working properly! Perhaps with all the CO2, you pH is too low for bacteria to break down those lipids. An air pump works really well for 3 reasons: 1. Extra surface movement, so the lipids get into the water and into the filter. 2. Extra oxygen, so bacteria can work better at night. 3. It blows CO2 out, so pH raises and bacteria work more efficiënt.
> 
> That being said, an Eheim works a charm! Still you'll always keep getting it back unless you solve the bacteria part IMO...


O


Ok thanks for that  
Why don't you think my filter is working correctly ?? 


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## kirk (14 Dec 2013)

I get a skin on ours mate. Only when I lower the Lilly pipe when we are watching a film to stop me going for toilet breaks back on subject your plants look great can't quite tell but the surface looks like it is moving well?  I'd have a go at just raising one end of your spray bar little to just break the surface for an evening to see if it helps mate.  nice tank by the way. You must have a good routine.


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## pepedopolous (14 Dec 2013)

Westyggx said:


> EHEIM skim350 Best thing i have ever bought for my tank


 
I've been running this for one day and I have to agree. No dirt, film or bubbles on the surface.

Before I had a Koralia Nano tilted towards the surface. It blew my stem plants sideways but it wasn't enough to eliminate surface scum.


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## Gary Nelson (14 Dec 2013)

Go for the Ehiem skim pal, you won't ever look back - it will have that surface clear in less than 2 minutes!


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## Samjpikey (14 Dec 2013)

Cheers  

To be honest the plant health cant be better but I'm always on the hunt for things to fix or change , I'm not happy with sitting back and letting everything tic over  , I'm itching to completely re scape but it's always a mission . 

I do have another power head connected up into a spray bar which runs below my main filter spray bar so maybe I will change them over and have the secondary spray bar a lot higher for more agitation . 

Cheers 


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## ian_m (14 Dec 2013)

I put air pump on for couple if hours near light off time, removes any film.


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## Samjpikey (14 Dec 2013)

Gary Nelson said:


> Go for the Ehiem skim pal, you won't ever look back - it will have that surface clear in less than 2 minutes!




Yea I may actually end up getting one after Christmas ,  




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## Samjpikey (14 Dec 2013)

I have also thought about the airstone method , it's a decision between the two methods although the skimmer sounds the better option for me . 

The funny thing is I normally have a glass lid , I've removed it since the last water change (yesterday) to see if that made a difference and it actually came back quicker ...... And worse ! 
It holds off for about 2 days with the glass lid , but the condensation puts me off keeping it but my attempt at stopping this would be to get self cleaning glass  
Cheers 


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## Jimmy Dale (14 Dec 2013)

I agree with all those who have recommended the skim 350. Yes you need to address the cause of your film but in truth, we all get it form time to time, I've even seen it in the immaculate displays at The Green Machine once or twice so it does happen to the best of us. 
I did use the skim 350 for a few weeks but I felt it intruded on the clear appearance of the tank, I also like my high brow glassware and ADA style fancy pants gear (without paying through the nose) so I have just got one of these instead  Nag 12 16 Glass Inflow Surface Skimmer | eBay  I've had a very good experience with mine and really rate it. 
if you're not bothered about glassware there are also these which are an even cheaper option:  Excel Water Protein Skimmer Crystal Clear Surface 1500 L H Flow Control ZZQU047 | eBay


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## Lindy (15 Dec 2013)

When its oily like that I think it has something to do with the fish food as that has oils and fats in it. When its white and clumps together when you touch it I think is when it is down to plant health. Just my observations but if I've fed my shrimp alot I get oily film too and thats on a low tech shrimp tank.


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## Samjpikey (15 Dec 2013)

Thanks for the replies guys , 

Just about to change the water , so will adjust the secondary spray bar so it breaks the surface a lot more , I won't feed my fish and see if that's makes a difference , this is now 





Cheers 


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## Wallace (15 Dec 2013)

I was under the impression that excess light caused this surface film? I'm sure I've read that in one of Clive's posts. 

The surface of my 60L tank in my lounge ( Ei and liquid carbon, no gas injection ) used to be like this a couple of days after water change, I increased plant mass and it has cleared up. I can now get away with only one 50% change a week. 

So I've drawn my own conclusion that it was excess nutrients causing the film, as lighting levels are the same as before. 


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## Samjpikey (15 Dec 2013)

Hmmm this could explain it as I have been raising my light and it is now higher then it's ever been , it's currently 700mm from the substrate , tank is 400mm high , could it be that as it's been raised the uptake of nutrients is less by the plants ?? 


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## Wallace (15 Dec 2013)

Samjpikey said:


> Hmmm this could explain it as I have been raising my light and it is now higher then it's ever been , it's currently 700mm from the substrate , tank is 400mm high , could it be that as it's been raised the uptake of nutrients is less by the plants ??
> 
> 
> Sent from my mobile telecommunications device



Could well be, as your light is now higher than previously the intensity of light at the plants is less. Maybe lower it little by little and see what the effect is, just keep an eye on algae growth etc


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## Samjpikey (15 Dec 2013)

I'm not going to lower it , I think extending the photoperiod a little will be more beneficial to me , I've taken away the glass lid which did reduce the intensity a little anyways 






Here is how the spray bars are set up now , the higher one from the power head was a temporary measure but I'm getting better health so a clear tube is on order here along with clear suckers. . 

You can see my surface agitation which I think is good , also the fish seem more active during the co2 injection period now I have more surface movement . 

Cheers 


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## Samjpikey (16 Dec 2013)

This is now (1day after water change ) 

There is good surface agitation but the film is there but not 'as' bad , I also have two floating bubble islands . 

So do I just accept it and go with the ehiem skim ??
What is the LPH ? 

Or do I source the problem ?

Cheers 



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## steveno (16 Dec 2013)

If it's bothering you I suggest getting a skimmer, like you I rasised my outlet which created a lot of surface agitation, but also created splash marked against the wall, which also bothered me. My tank is up against stair and stringer is blacker, so water stains really stand out.

Also my tank is set quite low so I also look over it, when I made my stand should have made higher lol...

I got my self one of those glass intakes and skimmer from eBay that jimmey suggested...


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## Yo-han (16 Dec 2013)

Again, a skimmer like Eheims or ADA vuppa, or a DIY from a soda bottle, they all work like a charm. BUT, it all masks the true cause. Like when someone is banging on your head with a hammer, you just take a shot of morphine to reduce the pain! Perhaps a Twinstar to compliment it?

First ask yourself, what is this layer composed off? After that, where does that stuff come from? If you can answer those two questions, you can take action at the root cause.

Unfortunate I don't know 100% sure because it isn't made out of one type of material. This scum layer contains lipids (the oily stuff) and proteins (the white stuff that makes the bubbles). The composition differs from aquarium to aquarium, thus the layer being more white, or more oily. Besides these two substances, it contains bacteria. To be more precise heterotropic bacteria. They use the proteins and lipids as a food source.

So assume this is it, where do these proteins and lipids come from. From food, like mentioned before, fish feces off course, and the main sources in our planted tanks -> unhealthy plants and bacteria that are living in suboptimal conditions.

So how to solve this besides the obvious reduced feeding: during the day, make sure your plants have everything they need, so they won't break down their old leaves to produce new ones. This results in organic waste. But more important, at night, provide optimal circumstances for your bacteria! Bacteria do best in alkaline water (high pH), so during the day they are waaay less active than they can be, because the pH is quite low due to all the CO2 we inject. No problem, they can be dormant for a while, but make sure that during the night (when we don't need all that CO2 and low pH for our plants) there is plenty of oxygen for the bacteria and pH is higher.

Off course why listen to me? So I'll make it a little more convincing. Amano! Now I've got your attention, don't I. Why do you think he doesn't run CO2 day and night? And why does he mention he aerates his aquaria at night? You think it is a coincidence the old man has the optimum pH that plants can use nutrients during the day and the optimum pH for bacteria at night...?


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## Samjpikey (16 Dec 2013)

Thanks yo- Han,   I  appreciate that . 
I think your theory is correct , maybe aerating the tank at night is a good solution. (And simple) 

But what puzzles me is the plant health throughout looks great , I've never in my life had healthier looking plants (With little or no algae).
I also barely feed my livestock as it is , maybe every 2-3 days. 
I perform regular maintenance of all equipment without fail along with good wc 's . 
Co2 is hitting  The 1ph drop , lighting on for no longer then 6 hrs . 

So I'm not convinced the plant health is the cause :/ of coarse I could be wrong , 
Maybe my fish just poop a lot and eat their poop then poop a lot more who knows :/ 

A standard air pump could be the next input forbme. 
If an air pump runs during the day does this upset co2 saturation or is all well ?? 
Cheers 


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## Nutty (16 Dec 2013)

do you use an aerosol (likes Air fresheners, deodorant) near the tank? without the lid, loads of airborne things will fall onto the surface and create the film, as well as things being produced inside the tank.


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## Samjpikey (16 Dec 2013)

Nutty said:


> do you use an aerosol (likes Air fresheners, deodorant) near the tank? without the lid, loads of airborne things will fall onto the surface and create the film, as well as things being produced inside the tank.





No air freshness etc in the room and I only use an aerosol in the bathroom , 
I have a HUGE front room and the tank is not in 
a place where you walk past all the time either . 

Cheers



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## Nutty (16 Dec 2013)

hhmmm, at least it makes it 95% sure its the tank generating the film!


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## Samjpikey (18 Dec 2013)

Increasing surface agitation hasn't stopped it , just delayed build up time , eheim skim ordered 
£21.95, not bad I thought .

I suppose it's a good excuse to buy one as it seems to be a nice little bit of kit  


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## Iain Sutherland (18 Dec 2013)

awesome bits of kit the skims, just be sure to wash the sponge out every other day!  Scum is very unpredictable and can appear out of the blue on a mature healthy tank.  Strangely enough it seems to disappear on mine when im lazy and dont WC, clean filters etc...  im not advocating that as a solution in any way though!!!
I got bored trying to figure it out so bought skims for all tanks that dont have dwarf shrimp (as it eats them)
i also believe that it can contribute to BBA by messing with gas exchange, everytime scum appeared on mine BBA would pop up a week or two later.... of course i can hear clive telling me something about  cause and effect with this statement


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## Yo-han (18 Dec 2013)

Iain Sutherland said:


> awesome bits of kit the skims, just be sure to wash the sponge out every other day!  Scum is very unpredictable and can appear out of the blue on a mature healthy tank.  Strangely enough it seems to disappear on mine when im lazy and dont WC, clean filters etc...  im not advocating that as a solution in any way though!!!
> I got bored trying to figure it out so bought skims for all tanks that dont have dwarf shrimp (as it eats them)
> i also believe that it can contribute to BBA by messing with gas exchange, everytime scum appeared on mine BBA would pop up a week or two later.... of course i can hear clive telling me something about  cause and effect with this statement



Both (BBA and surface scum) have something to do with organics IME. Perhaps when you forget to clean your filter, your heterotrophic bacteria population grows better and breaks down more of the organics that cause BBA and surface scum.

Clive would probably relate both to CO2 but except the fact that with good CO2 your plants produce less organics, there are lots of other sources for organic waste like fish food. Throw in triple the amount of food and I bet you get surface scum and BBA too.


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## tim (19 Dec 2013)

I've had surface film reappear since the wife's had the central heating on, the only tank it's not on is in the kitchen where there is no radiator so I'm blaming the central heating and buying a skimmer


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## Samjpikey (19 Dec 2013)

Where is Obi-wan-Clive-kanobi anyway ? 

Is input in this thread is missed :/  


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## tim (19 Dec 2013)

All The Gear, "No Idear" | Page 3 | UK Aquatic Plant Society post number 51 would sum up Clive's input


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## Samjpikey (19 Dec 2013)

The only difference to that comment is my  tanks been flooded for 4 months  


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## tim (19 Dec 2013)

This thread is worth a read if you haven't already Sam.
Surface Film | UK Aquatic Plant Society


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## Iain Sutherland (19 Dec 2013)

loads of threads on scum before now with clives input....

"I think you might be mixing up cause and effect. As mentioned before there is a relationship between the metabolic rate and the production of organic waste. If you feed the plants more CO2 then they will eject more waste products. So it's not surprising that more fats, oils and carbohydrates are ejected with increase metabolism due to increased consumption of CO2. The next step though is that with an increase in CO2 consumption there is a demand for more nutrients. The nutrient loading must match the CO2 loading. If the higher CO2 consumption is not matched by higher nutrient consumption, then the waste ejection is higher than normal.

CO2 metabolism is a much more complicated issue than nutrient consumption because of the Rubisco transport mechanism. You can lower the CO2, keep the same lighting and then you can observe an increase in the scum. If the CO2 was lowered only a small amount the scum may last only a few weeks as the plant adapts to the lowered CO2 level. If the new CO2 level is within the tolerance range for that lighting level then the plant can adapt. If the Lower CO2 level is too drastic for the lighting level then the plants continue to leach waste products into the water column. This then becomes a chronic issue and can lead to other CO2 deficiency symptoms.

If lighting level and nutrient levels are held constant, but if CO2 is increased, then this could lead to a demand for higher nutrient uptake. If this is not met then the excess ejection is caused by nutrient deficiency. Again, depending on how much more CO2 is being consumed, this determines the severity of the nutrient deficiency. If the increase in CO2 is mild to middling, then after a few weeks the plant has the ability to adapt by becoming more efficient at nutrient uptake. If the CO2 increase is significant then this may fall outside the range of the adaptability.

So it's very difficult to predict exactly how many ppm of this or that will result in excessive or normal ejection because of the range of adaptability and the degree of movement in all the associated variables. Not only are the environmental variables changing, but the plant themselves are changing. They increase in mass by growing, or decrease in mass by trimming or by loss of weight due to deficiency. So the same conditions may be present in two tanks but the symptoms may only appear in one tank due to lower bio-mass in one tank versus the other. Their energy reserves may be high or low which affects the speed and duration at which the symptoms appear or disappear. In order to get to the root of the problem one has to be able to control all variables in the equation, and that simply doesn't happen. People become impatient because we all want a quick fix. And that's why we draw these premature conclusions.

I use tons of CO2 and I don't have any of these issues. I can add more CO2 and the only thing that happens is more health, clearer water and more pearling. In my case I don't have to make any adjustments to nutrient levels because they are already unlimited.

This problem also has been reported in non-CO2 tanks. So the conclusion that this is caused strictly by CO2 can't be true unilaterally. This is an illusion and we simply haven't figured out the magicians trick.

In this shot I turned the filters off for a few hours to see how much oily film was actually present. There was very little, although you could see a thin film.

So generally, it really depends on where you are in terms of plant health and nutrition, not just "did I add more CO2", even though it might appear so at face value. Health and nutrition are always going to be linked to lighting intensity, flow/distribution, nutrient levels, bio-mass and so forth.


Surface film does not always deprive the tank of Oxygen. The film block gas transport across the air/water interface. Therefore, if the plants are producing Oxygen during the photoperiod, then less oxygen escapes to atmosphere. If the Oxygen level falls below atmospheric levels during the night then yes, the film does lower Oxygen ingress into the tank. The same goes for CO2.

It wouldn't be surprising at all that algal blooms in the tank are either accompanied by, or preceded by surface scum, because these are both health and nutrition related. In fact, typically one gets the film and then the algae. The film is a harbinger of doom because it's telling you that you have health issues.

Cheers,"


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## Samjpikey (19 Dec 2013)

Ok guys , 

Got some great news . Last night I dropped the temp of the tank down from 25c to 21c (co2 saturates the water better in cooler temp), I'm always trying to find ways of getting the most out of the co2 supply ( ain't we all?) 

Just got home to find almost NO surface skum, 
No bubbles/foam at all , it has almost completely cleared up. 

So could it be the warmer water played its part?
I'm also getting a better reading of a ph drop In relation to the co2 injection- By .2 - could it have been a sign of co2 deficiency ? 

??cheers 


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## Samjpikey (19 Dec 2013)

Or just coincidence?  


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## Yo-han (19 Dec 2013)

Samjpikey said:


> Ok guys ,
> 
> Got some great news . Last night I dropped the temp of the tank down from 25c to 21c (co2 saturates the water better in cooler temp), I'm always trying to find ways of getting the most out of the co2 supply ( ain't we all?)
> 
> ...



A lower temp will make your plants metabolism slower and thus producing less organic waste


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## greenink (20 Dec 2013)

Yo-han said:


> Off course why listen to me? /quote]
> 
> Best post on this topic I've seen. Thank you. Really helpful.


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## Rob P (20 Dec 2013)

I've had really minor scum recently, it's only appeared in the last week and is very minor. The only things that have changed are a significant increase in plant growth since putting on a bigger filter and inline diffuser 2 weeks ago. Also put a couple of new plants in that are adapting to life under water.

Ironically, I ordered an Eheim 350 skim yesterday but last night I tweaked my spray bar to provide a little more surface agitation (was already a fair bit) and surface looks crystal this morning, doh!


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## Samjpikey (20 Dec 2013)

Just see it as a good excuse to buy another piece of kit ....... I did  

And if it ever returns with a vengeance then you've got the gear.


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## Rob P (20 Dec 2013)

Samjpikey said:


> Just see it as a good excuse to buy another piece of kit ....... I did


 
Yes I kind of look at it that way, but i'm also expecting a <cough> twinstar <cough> at some point and i'm sure i've read these help keep the suface clear as well. Perhaps a bit too impulsive!


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## Samjpikey (20 Dec 2013)

My eheim came today , was waiting patiently at my next door neighbors house , 
The surface film was bk as well since I've fed the fish this morning so the food I'm using is definitely contributing to the film . 

I must say the eheim skim is a BLODDY wonderful peice of kit  wow ....very small and Cleared the tanks surface within minutes  
Money well spent and just finished work for 16 days  happy happy joy joy  


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## steveno (20 Dec 2013)

Rob P said:


> Yes I kind of look at it that way, but i'm also expecting a <cough> twinstar <cough> at some point and i'm sure i've read these help keep the suface clear as well. Perhaps a bit too impulsive!



Sorry to break to you rob, twinstar installed still have surface scum, I recently purchase a glass inlet that also has skimmer. To deal with oily film from fish food.


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## steveno (20 Dec 2013)

Happy to hear that you've sort your surface scum...sam


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## Samjpikey (20 Dec 2013)

It probably was a number of things , 
Funny how it cleared up after dropping the temp but came bk within 12 hours of adding some food (probably out of date ) 
Nevertheless the ehiem skim is awesome 

The surface is the cleanest it been for a long time  
Now I know I can get rid of it I can do some tests to see what brings back the film etc  


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## Rob P (20 Dec 2013)

steveno said:


> Sorry to break to you rob, twinstar installed still have surface scum, I recently purchase a glass inlet that also has skimmer. To deal with oily film from fish food.



Nope this is good news, means I've not wasted my money lol


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## Yo-han (21 Dec 2013)

Samjpikey said:


> It probably was a number of things ,
> Funny how it cleared up after dropping the temp but came bk within 12 hours of adding some food (probably out of date )



Or not out of date, but you simple inserted more organics in your tank


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## Samjpikey (21 Dec 2013)

Your probably right  but the food is over 6 years old , crushed up pellets ....


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## Rob P (21 Dec 2013)

My skimmer is in and doing its thing


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## Rob P (22 Dec 2013)

Found two dead blue eyed rainbows in my skimmer this morning. Gutted. They weren't tiny fish, 2.5cm or so. Won't be turning it back on until found a way to mesh the top of the unit. Not a good start to the day


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## Samjpikey (22 Dec 2013)

Ouch , that's terrible , I never even gave that a thought :/ 
I can still account for all my Fishies , id be interested to know what you come up with as a solution.
Cheers 


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## Samjpikey (22 Dec 2013)

Shouldn't have said nothing , I found a small red cherry shrimp in mine this morning  


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## Wallace (22 Dec 2013)

Rob P said:


> Won't be turning it back on until found a way to mesh the top of the unit.



Tights and an elastic band?


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## Samjpikey (22 Dec 2013)

Thanks for all your input guys , very much appreciated , but you were right ( you know who you are  , just found some bba on 2 plants , not bad but they got the chop so I'm hoping it doesn't go on to colonize my tank !  


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## GHNelson (22 Dec 2013)

Wallace said:


> Tights and an elastic band?


Or a little piece of rigid lightweight plastic mesh.
Eheim should provide this to fit into the top of the floater...to stop fish/shrimp and larger pieces of plant getting in the chamber.
The sponge is not the great either should be round for a snug fit.
hoggie


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## Samjpikey (22 Dec 2013)

Yea I agree , it's a neat little skimmer but just
needs that extra bit of thought , obviously a lot of people are having the same issue .


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## GHNelson (22 Dec 2013)

A smaller version would be great the 350 is too powerful even on the low setting for smaller tanks.
hoggie


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## Rob P (22 Dec 2013)

hogan53 said:


> Or a little piece of rigid lightweight plastic mesh.
> Eheim should provide this to fit into the top of the floater...to stop fish/shrimp and larger pieces of plant getting in the chamber.
> The sponge is not the great either should be round for a snug fit.
> hoggie



^ this. Although I don't mind the foam shape don't really see it is a problem, but a mesh guard yes definitely. I did note Victor made mention of the problem earlier, should have heeded the warning.


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## Samjpikey (6 Jan 2014)

So today I have just found a black neon tetra dead in the ehiem along with my angle fish .... Yea I know he's about as big as a 50 pence peice , the angle fish was still alive . 

Ouch  
I do have a glass lid and the water level is very close to the lid so I really don't know how they got in there . 


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## Rob P (6 Jan 2014)

Sorry to hear  I've not put mine back in after my deaths.

I'm still thinking a coarse mesh guard is best bet, perhaps a piece of coarse foam stuffed in the top of the neck of the inlet would work? I tried meshing some tights over the top but it causes too much tension/obstruction and I assume water was then pulled in elsewhere rather than flowing in from the top as it didn't work properly after doing that.


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## tim (6 Jan 2014)

I run mine on a timer for a couple of hours during the photoperiod seems to have stopped it catching my cherry shrimp, I do check and clean sponge daily though.


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## Samjpikey (6 Jan 2014)

Well I'm out of timers right now so I have added the ehiem to my light timer  , hopefully this will do for now , during lights off I find that the fish are more curios . 
Cheers 


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## tim (6 Jan 2014)

Samjpikey said:


> Well I'm out of timers right now so I have added the ehiem to my light timer  , hopefully this will do for now , during lights off I find that the fish are more curios .
> Cheers
> 
> 
> Sent from my mobile telecommunications device


That should work out Sam, don't think my cherries could see in the dark so they got sucked in.


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## Samjpikey (6 Jan 2014)

It almost wants something like a microphone gauze wedged over or in the top ..


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## tim (6 Jan 2014)

I did try a bit of greenhouse shading mesh cut and rolled to fit, it worked ok but blocked easily if I'd done a trim and tbh if I run mine for an hour or so I don't seem to get the film anyway.


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## Andy Thurston (6 Jan 2014)

Do you want a bit of stainless mesh like this sam




Its got bigger holes than the shrimp guards so it might not stop baby shrimp


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## Samjpikey (6 Jan 2014)

That's the stuff  


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## Andy Thurston (6 Jan 2014)

I have a friendly wire worker that lets me have off cuts cheap. Last time i went i got a square foot for a quid


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## Rob P (7 Jan 2014)

STAINLESS STEEL WOVEN WIRE MESH (filter grading sheet) | eBay

15x15cm pieces various grades, for a couple of quid posted  Think i'll be trying some 8 or 10 grade stuff!


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## parotet (7 Jan 2014)

Sorry to post in that thread now but I was subscribed to learn a bit about this issue but yes... I have found a nasty surface film in my tank today.

My situation is a bit special as it is only the 5th day since planting (60 liters, 48w T5, CO2 pressurized and EI ferts from day one) so my substrate is leaching nutrients and some plants that are adapting to the new environment (so, some leaves melting, etc.). I have an additional problem: a white mold/fungus is growing in my redmoor. I used to remove it in other tanks when I had it, but this new tank has two pieces plenty of branches and I'm doing a mess each time I try to clean it all. Moreover I have noticed that even after a 50% WC (done during this first week daily), plenty of white little pieces of the fungus are everywhere in the water... and finally float to the surface.

My worry is not right now the surface film itself but to be able to pass this first month without an algae bloom...but as far as I have read this surface film is organic matter. Will the surface film increase the probability of an algae outbreak during the cycling?
Will you remove the white fungus from the redmoor or would you leave it alone? (I've read that it vanishes in a week or so... but I don't want this to be the feedstuff for algae)


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## Samjpikey (7 Jan 2014)

I had the The white fungus on my manzi wood but it's disappeared over a few weeks , 
Soon after I had the surface film problem I did have a few plants that had some bba as mentioned earlier on this thread , I was told it nearly always follows and they we're right because it did  , nothing major but it was there.

I got the ehiem skim , kept a good maintenance regime and now a few weeks later - no film and no bba .  



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## Rob P (7 Jan 2014)

Don't worry about the fungus, appears on most new wood. Pick of what you can if unsightly.


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## Andy Thurston (8 Jan 2014)

Apparently if you rub salt into the wood before you put it into the tank it stops it appearing


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## Samjpikey (10 Jan 2014)

To all you ehiem friendly people .... 

Do you place your ehiem where it doesn't have a conflict in flow ? 




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## Gary Nelson (10 Jan 2014)

Think of it as a power head, I know the flow is not that much from it, but try to position it to enhance your current flow


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## Rob P (13 Jan 2014)

Bit of an update from me, looks crude I know (but i'm just testing the waters before I commit to a permanent change - excuse the pun...)



Bought the stainless mesh off ebay (£3) and cut a strip to fold round the head of the skim unit. Held in place with laggy band for test purposes. Did think it would affect the buoyancy of the floating head (which it does) so I have got the placement right by sliding the body of the unit up and down rear of tank until desired effect reached. I've a hooded tank ATM so evap not a consideration. Anyway, it works prefectly and i'd say completely safe for fish & shrimp 

I think to fix permanently i'll get some black rigid plastic mesh of same guage and cut 4 small squares and superglue these directly over the opening slots of the head. That should have no or minimal impact on bouyancy. Anyway, here's to no more dead fish!


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## Wallace (13 Jan 2014)

Nice. 

If it does the job mate who cares if it ain't pretty. 


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## Rob P (13 Jan 2014)

My sentiments exactly


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## Andy Thurston (13 Jan 2014)

Perhaps people that own the skimmer should email ehiem and complain about dead shrimp in the skimmer, then maybe it will get redesigned


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## Samjpikey (24 Jan 2014)

I was just doing  a water change and found a nail in amongst the hairgrass completely rusted up ...... This may or may not have something to do with the surface film I've been getting , 
I don't know how the bleedy thing has gotten in there . I honestly think someone's been spiteful and dropped it in . 
No wonder I've lost a few fish and shrimp !!! Grrrr 


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## ivydree (30 Jan 2014)

Don't know if that is till of interest to anyone, but for some reason, I noticed that the surface film in my tank completely vanished once I started adding a pump at the bottom of the tank to add flow down there. Don't ask me why, but it worked for me!


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## parotet (30 Jan 2014)

Perhaps... more flow = better CO2 and nutrient availability for plants = healthy plants = less plant decay = plant decay/biofilm moved with the flow and filtered = less organic matter in the tank?


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## Samjpikey (8 Feb 2014)

After finding another tetra in this skimmer this morning I decided to end this slaughter haha  This is what I quickly mocked up , seems to work well and can easily be removed for cleaning 
Thanks for the mesh mr big clown  













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