# Lights and Movement - Jewel Vision 180 from pre-set up :)



## Petra R (12 Apr 2018)

*Background:*

Not had a tank for a while, but a tank-sized space in my kitchen (main living area in most Italian houses) combined with a super duper deal (think barely over half price) led to me getting this tank which is currently in transit.

*The Idea: 
*
I have "a thing" about technology, and a thing about lighting. My place is all rigged up with Philips Hue lights, even the TV is plugged into that.
For those who aren't familiar with it - watch this: (please bear with me, we'll come to the tank part shortly)



OK, so what I want to create is a tank that is (obviously) first and foremost a healthy home for plants and fishies, but also ties in with my lighting, especially in the evening.

I want to create movement and a play of light and shade and colour (the movement will come from backlighting the tank and the movement of the plants against the back glass pane, and of course the fish.)

*The Aquarium:

Juwel Vision 180:




 

Lights:
*
Initially the two Multilux LED tubes that come with the tank, plus 2 reflectors.





2 x Philips Hue White & Colour Lightstrips, all connectors sealed with aquarium silicon.
1 x to be glued into the back flap / cover of the tank, pointing down (obviously)
1 x fixed to a reflector inserted in the narrow gap behind the the tank, just below substrate level to uplight the wall





They are completely sealed in thick clear plastic, I silconed the hell out of everything that could be an issue,(the end and all connections) so should be fine (famous last words....)

The possibilities with that kind of light are endless. You can simulate sunrises / sunset / cloudy skies, moonlight, change through pre-set light sequences, all controlled from the app (even voice controlled via Siri)

*Filter:
*
Initially the one that comes with the tank, Bioflow Filter M – Filter System with Juwel ECCOFLOW 600 l/h Int pump*, *but will probably get an external one.
*
Plants:
*
Starting with not very demanding ones such as Anubias and Echinodorus bleheri - want to see how it all pans out.

*Fish:*

Undecided. Want to see what the parameters are after cycling. Then I decide on fish that will suit the water, rather than trying to make the water suit the fish.

*Landscape:*

Undecided, I have some thick roots and bits of driftwood from a friend who is giving up, so will see what I can do with those first. 
The bow front and the relative height will make for interesting options I think...



 

*Other:
*
The back glass and the left side will have a "privacy" type foil / film attached to it to diffuse the backlighting and hide cables and the wall. I bought something called Rabbitgoo - it is glue free and should work great.




*
Space:
*
To the left of "The Cat Unit" ... Hopefully that also explains why an open top tank is a "no-no!"





So.... That's the plan at least. Just hoping the tank arrives really soon


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## alto (12 Apr 2018)

You might look at Tropica & Juwel for some inspiration layouts

Tropica (input Juwel as the brand search option)

Juwel YouTube Vison 180  

While some find the filter limiting, replacement is definitely optional, depending upon chosen hardscape 
Must admit I'm not a fan of those siliconed in backings


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## CryptKeeper (13 Apr 2018)

Good luck with this project! Since I have a Vision 180, too, I thought I'd make a couple of comments:

if you're into lighting, consider the Helialux LED bar as a replacement for the Multilux tubes. The major advantage for me is that it can be controlled via the Day+Night controller. The other major advantage is that it gets out of the way. With Multilux, when you open the lid you're looking at a tube. With Helialux you're looking at nothing but water  This also makes maintenance much easier, as you can move the bar much further back or forward. If you stick with the Multilux tubes, I don't think they need reflectors, since they only shine downwards, unlike T5 tubes.
I've substituted the 600l/h pump with a 1000l/h one, which is a straight drop-in replacement. It seems to provide excellent flow AFAICT, especially with the OxyFlow venturi attachment.
If you're planning to frost one of the side walls, why not the one of the right, where the filter is?
Bear in mind that I'm a complete noob at planted tanks, and have been running the Vision 180 for just over 4 weeks. So far so good 

And yes, I've got a cat, too, so no open tanks for me


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## doylecolmdoyle (13 Apr 2018)

CryptKeeper said:


> especially with the OxyFlow venturi attachment.



Any chance you can measure the inside and outside diameter of the OxyFlow attachment or if you know the size of the outlet from the juwel filters let me know!


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## MattW (13 Apr 2018)

Hi there,

Looks good - definitely look forward to seeing your project taking shape. The Rabbitgoo privacy foil is great as well, a little annoying to get on but once its on it stays put. On a note because it's held by static it really is annoying to put on *without* using the suggested water and soap mix, one tank I did without and it took me a good 30 mins just to position it, I used the suggestions the next tank and had it done in 5-10 mins. Given your tank isn't running yet i'd recommend using the water and soap mix obviously being careful not to get any soap into the tank, this also helps with getting rid of water/air bubbles under the film as well.


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## ian_m (13 Apr 2018)

Tried using the led strips in my tank, in the end failure..
- not very bright compared to the T5 tubes, despite sticking 3 rows in each hood.
- You will not be able to stick and keep the strips stuck to the hood.  The supplied 3M adhesive failed pretty quickly, contact adhesive also failed. Silicone does not actually stick to the hood plastic also not helped that virtually no glue sticks to the silicone led strips.
- you will not be able seal any cuts/joins in led tape anywhere near inside the hood. Despite using masses of non corrosive silicone (you cant use acetoxy silicone anywhere near copper ie wires, as it attacks it) eventually moisture leaked in via wires and corroded the internal led pcb.

People that have kept their leds in Juwel hoods have used the leds on aluminum strips and bolted it to the lid with special waterproof connectors, no silicone involved.


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## Petra R (13 Apr 2018)

alto said:


> You might look at Tropica & Juwel for some inspiration layouts
> 
> Tropica (input Juwel as the brand search option)
> 
> ...



Ooooh, thanks for the tip, that gave me plenty of food for thought!

I did look into those backgrounds, also (very briefly) considered one of those "poster" types. I wasn't convinced. I have seen some stunning tanks with those backgrounds, but also read a lot of very poor feedback of them fading and / or the colour coming off.

I've had a bigger (240 I think) Juwel and didn't actually find the filter too upsetting. Will see how it goes and what it looks like when it FINALLY gets here. Plants arrived all the way from Germany already, tank didn't from 100 miles away. 



CryptKeeper said:


> Good luck with this project! Since I have a Vision 180, too, I thought I'd make a couple of comments:
> 
> if you're into lighting, consider the Helialux LED bar as a replacement for the Multilux tubes. The major advantage for me is that it can be controlled via the Day+Night controller. The other major advantage is that it gets out of the way. With Multilux, when you open the lid you're looking at a tube. With Helialux you're looking at nothing but water  This also makes maintenance much easier, as you can move the bar much further back or forward. If you stick with the Multilux tubes, I don't think they need reflectors, since they only shine downwards, unlike T5 tubes.
> I've substituted the 600l/h pump with a 1000l/h one, which is a straight drop-in replacement. It seems to provide excellent flow AFAICT, especially with the OxyFlow venturi attachment.
> ...



I did consider the Helialux LED with the Day and Night controller. I still am, but it is expensive  so I need to save up some pennies first
GREAT to know about the pump, will look into that and then keep the 600 as a spare if the pump fails (had that happen in the 240 or whatever it was)
Reason why I don't want to frost the right side wall is because I want to see into the tank from where I come into the room rather than look at frosting. I am putting it on the left to hide the wall and diffise light leaking from the leds behind.

Cats will no doubt make aquaintance with water sooner or later. I don't think I ever had an aquarium + cats at the same time without someone falling in. Except the Fluval Edge which has a glass top.


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## Petra R (13 Apr 2018)

MattW said:


> Hi there,
> 
> Looks good - definitely look forward to seeing your project taking shape. The Rabbitgoo privacy foil is great as well, a little annoying to get on but once its on it stays put. On a note because it's held by static it really is annoying to put on *without* using the suggested water and soap mix, one tank I did without and it took me a good 30 mins just to position it, I used the suggestions the next tank and had it done in 5-10 mins. Given your tank isn't running yet i'd recommend using the water and soap mix obviously being careful not to get any soap into the tank, this also helps with getting rid of water/air bubbles under the film as well.



Hi Matt, yes, got the water spray bottle and swishing tool along with the film so that's the way I'm going to go!



ian_m said:


> Tried using the led strips in my tank, in the end failure..
> - not very bright compared to the T5 tubes, despite sticking 3 rows in each hood.
> - You will not be able to stick and keep the strips stuck to the hood.  The supplied 3M adhesive failed pretty quickly, contact adhesive also failed. Silicone does not actually stick to the hood plastic also not helped that virtually no glue sticks to the silicone led strips.
> - you will not be able seal any cuts/joins in led tape anywhere near inside the hood. Despite using masses of non corrosive silicone (you cant use acetoxy silicone anywhere near copper ie wires, as it attacks it) eventually moisture leaked in via wires and corroded the internal led pcb.
> ...



Hi Ian,

Great points! The LED strip I am using is 2 meters long so the connectors will not be inside the tank at all. (I am not planning on dividing them - just make a loop shape) The brightness of the Hue is pretty spectacular, nearly blinded myself trying it out yesterday, and I am using it (or rather am planning to use it) only for "accent lighting" - not for main lighting.)

I can easily fix it to the lid with small plastic brackets or go for waterproof aluminium led channels, they are cheap



 



If I do kill the Hue lightstrip it'll be an interesting (and expensive) lesson learned


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## CryptKeeper (13 Apr 2018)

doylecolmdoyle said:


> Any chance you can measure the inside and outside diameter of the OxyFlow attachment or if you know the size of the outlet from the juwel filters let me know!



The OxyPlus (sorry, not OxyFlow, got that wrong) Venturi attachment has an ID of 20mm and fits over the Juwel filter/pump outlet tube. The OD is about 23mm. Also included is a 45 degree elbow tube of thinner wall thickness which fits both _over_ the pump outlet and _into_ the Venturi attachment.

I initially used the OxyPlus to inject CO2 into the tank (rather than air), but I found a ceramic atomiser to be more effective. I now use the OxyPlus only to improve the flow.


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## foxfish (13 Apr 2018)

I must say Petra, that your post are quite spectacular!
Are you some sort of IT guy or just young?


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## Petra R (13 Apr 2018)

foxfish said:


> I must say Petra, that your post are quite spectacular!
> Are you some sort of IT guy or just young?



HAHAHA 
I am neither a guy nor IT nor young

I'm female, English is not my native language, and I know where I was when Elvis died. I'm just a translator with a love for language(s) (English and German mainly, even though I'm in Italy)

I am also someone who thinks that for almost every problem / challenge there is a solution.


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## alto (13 Apr 2018)

Just an IT Girl 

(sorry IT Woman just doesn't have the same ring to it )


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## Petra R (13 Apr 2018)

alto said:


> Just an IT Girl
> 
> (sorry IT Woman just doesn't have the same ring to it )



I know where you're coming from.

Not an IT guy / girl / woman of any sort. Just someone with a vision and the stubborn determination to make it happen...


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## doylecolmdoyle (14 Apr 2018)

CryptKeeper said:


> The OxyPlus (sorry, not OxyFlow, got that wrong) Venturi attachment has an ID of 20mm and fits over the Juwel filter/pump outlet tube. The OD is about 23mm. Also included is a 45 degree elbow tube of thinner wall thickness which fits both _over_ the pump outlet and _into_ the Venturi attachment.
> 
> I initially used the OxyPlus to inject CO2 into the tank (rather than air), but I found a ceramic atomiser to be more effective. I now use the OxyPlus only to improve the flow.



Cheers I actually brought one today, works well, had to fit 16/22 tube inside the oxyplus then attach to my stainless pipes but it does the job!


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## Petra R (14 Apr 2018)

So it seems my tank is actually less than 5 miles away and has been since Thursday, but I missed the call from the courier company to arrange delivery yesterday. My Italian still sucks but _I think _what I agreed to is that they'll call again on Monday to arrange delivery for Tuesday.

Of course my workload on Tuesday is insane so this could hardly be less convenient but by then all the other stuff I've ordered should have arrived such as substrate etc. I see a really early morning Tuesday coming on so I can catch up with as much work as I can before the tank arrives.


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## Petra R (14 Apr 2018)

And.... it seems "someone" put in a large plant order on Amazon.de last night after wine o'clock, too. How many Anubias does a girl need?

Oh dear


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## alto (14 Apr 2018)

An inspiring video from Filipe Oliveira 

Algae too


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## Petra R (16 Apr 2018)

Tank arriving tomorrow morning!
I have the basic layout in my head which concentrates mainly on tall plants in the background and a "woody" hardscape (driftwood / "twigs") with anubias and lots of free swimming space in the foreground. I have some ideas to create depth with the curved front.
No rocks except small stones which will be used for anubia and fern and moss, which means I can "rescape" plant placement without digging them up.

The rest of the plants (those that "someone" drunk-ordered) should be here Wednesday / Thursday.

Here's a shot of my little Fluwal Edge from some years ago


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## Petra R (17 Apr 2018)

lesson one: FIRST read instructions, THEN build cabinet.
 lesson two: Two bags marked with HUGE letters A and B are unlikely to contain the same content, even if the hinges contained therein look roughly the same.
 lesson three: Cats are not useful while building things.

But I WILL have the tank up today. Going to undo all the screws now and put the right hinges on the right bits in the right order before carrying on building.


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## Petra R (17 Apr 2018)

I need shooting for actually wasting hours because I could not be bothered to read the instructions but the cupboard is (more or less correctly - need to fix the hinges on the doors, another "does not follow instructions - fail") built and the tank is on it (not easy for one of me and I had visions of it going quite terribly wrong)

May I repeat that multiple cats are not useful when building stuff?

Putting on the frosted film was a breeze actually but now it is up I am agreeing with @CryptKeeper that I need to frost the right side as well. Not loving the view of the internal filter from the side.

Tomorrow - the fun part


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## Petra R (18 Apr 2018)

Stressed.

beeping wood does not want to stay ´down and cats are being oh so "helpful"




 



 

I had forgotten how freaking stressful this part is and my back is killing me and...... and... and....


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## Edvet (19 Apr 2018)

Relax, it's supposed to be fun.
You can't reach perfection the first day, nor the 210th for that matter.


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## Petra R (19 Apr 2018)

Edvet said:


> Relax, it's supposed to be fun.
> You can't reach perfection the first day, nor the 210th for that matter.



I've relaxed   Leaving the root floating for now, it's not hurting anyone.
Found a couple of tiny snails that shipped in with the plants. German snails... Not killing them for now.
Plants in amazingly good shape considering they were in the box for 10 (!) days. I expected at least the swords to arrive as mush.

In fact the anubias are still pearling (despite no added CO2) this morning.

Expecting a little melting but hopefully nothing too serious.

I love the effect from the backlighting, very very pleased with that aspect. Created some over the top colour sequences for fun last night, but promise to stick to nice natural backlighting in general. Once the background plants take off the backlighting will become less "intrusive" and hopefully achieve what I meant to achieve: Hint at a lot more tank beyond the plants.
Not loving the lump of wood on the right (present from friend so can't kick it out (yet  )

Even though I deliberately ignored the rules of thirds based on what I had available and where I view the tank from most of the time and the bowed front, I actually really quite like the layout (or did before the root that was on the left went for a float.


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## Edvet (19 Apr 2018)

And now:
waterchange
waterchange
waterchange


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## Petra R (19 Apr 2018)

Edvet said:


> And now:
> waterchange
> waterchange
> waterchange



Yep, I know! So much easier with the tank in the kitchen and not miles away or, god forbid, up or down any stairs, and with a tiled floor so splashes don't matter!


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## Petra R (19 Apr 2018)

Day 2 evening.

Done a big waterchange.
Fell over cat with bucket.
Naughty root still floating, leaving it alone.
Bacteria bloom (or whatever it was) clearing.
Quite a bit of tannines from the wood, to be expected. Waiting for the horrible white fungus to appear, got toothbrush ready...

Been researching Rainbow fish - would suit my hard water!

plants looking happy enough so far. 

Shot main lights off, backlights going through their sunset routine


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## alto (19 Apr 2018)

Well done on the build  & tank design 
(I've finally come to agree with IKEA that their directions are more efficient than my intuitive decisions)


That "present" wood will look rather nice covered in moss & epiphyte plants  (& perhaps less upright)
- though you may find it's so impervious that moss will need to be tied firmly & kept trimmed to avoid "liftoff"
Or you might open those cladophora balls & glue into place, slower growing than mosses but rather interesting & minimal maintenance

Jurijs mit JS technique c/o George Farmer video


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## Petra R (20 Apr 2018)

alto said:


> Well done on the build  & tank design
> (I've finally come to agree with IKEA that their directions are more efficient than my intuitive decisions)
> That "present" wood will look rather nice covered in moss & epiphyte plants  (& perhaps less upright)
> - though you may find it's so impervious that moss will need to be tied firmly & kept trimmed to avoid "liftoff"
> ...



Ha, I hear you with the Ikea stuff. Swedes, it seems, do not do "intuition" very well !
I heard about opening the balls and "doing stuff with them." They were another "present!" - I wish people would not give me (unasked for) presents for the tank. Someone will come with a goldfish next, no doubt 

Talking of fish... I think I would like to go for Rainbows. They should be happy with the water we have here, I've never kept them, and I like the shimmering 

Dropping some ideas in here to come back to when tank's cycled.

Iriatherina werneri 








Pseudomugil sp. red neon







Popondetta furcata






I'd love some Melanotaenia boesemani, but I am not sure the tank is big (long) enough unless I can rehome them suitably when fully grown





Thoughts?


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## Petra R (20 Apr 2018)

I just realised that the drain and, for that matter, the water outlet for the washing machine are only a meter away from the left side of the tank!!!!! 

That could be fiddled about with for a waterchange thingie, surely, no? some fittings and a little pump?


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## Tim Harrison (20 Apr 2018)

Could be possible, be careful your washing machine doesn't exhaust in to your tank


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## Edvet (20 Apr 2018)

About the balls: some people flatten them out or even tie them to the hardscape like regular moss.


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## Petra R (20 Apr 2018)

Tim Harrison said:


> Could be possible, be careful your washing machine doesn't exhaust in to your tank




No, I wasn't going to do anything permanently fixed (there is a doorway and a wall between the tank and the washing machine.) I was thinking of putting a "splitter" on the tap that feeds the washing machine and attaching a piece of hosepipe to one of the outlets and the washing machine "tap" on the other. 
The hosepipe could just be a 2 meter length of something soft and flexible to refil tankwater.

This could do the trick:



 

and a similar thing for the drain.

Then a tiny powerhead and store those on the washing machine (which is in an alcove in the hallway) and just use them at waterchange time. First pump whatever amount out of the tank, then stick other hose in tank, open tap, refill tank....


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## alto (20 Apr 2018)

Rainbows - I love your first 3 

Pseudomugil sp red neon are still relatively costly, though prices have dropped substantially even since last year
You should be able to do a decent size shoal of all 3 types (8-10 of each species)

_Melanotaenia _are a lesser favourite, a little too big & boisterous & they really deserve a big tank, though I've seen them kept in 90cm tanks, they really shine in 1.5 - 2 meter tanks


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## Petra R (20 Apr 2018)

alto said:


> Rainbows - I love your first 3
> 
> Pseudomugil sp red neon are still relatively costly, though prices have dropped substantially even since last year
> You should be able to do a decent size shoal of all 3 types (8-10 of each species)
> ...



I agree on all counts. I do love the Melanotaenia but with the others being so shy and easily scared maybe I'll just have those and be done with it. I actually prefer more smaller fish than fewer bigger ones.

The Pseudomugil sp red neon I am looking at are 8 Euro each. The Popondetta furcata 5 Euro, thinking 12 of those, and the Iriatherina werneri are 4 Euro (also 12) 

Not all at once, obviously.


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## alto (20 Apr 2018)

Yes definitely choose either the smaller rainbows OR the larger more robust species (you might make it work in a 2-3meter tank but I'd not try in anything smaller, the delicate "littles" seem to just fade away when kept in non-ideal situations)

As for fish #'s - they're like flowers, more aesthetically (to human perception) in odds  
Choose 9,11,13 etc

You've skipped my favourite 
Pseudomugil paskai

If the fish are stocked regularly, why not begin with 7-9 of each & then add more of your favourites 
though if going this route, I'd add 2 groups of 7 at the start just to provide sufficient numbers   

Of course, then repeat additions of new fish brings up the issue of quarantine (regardless of shop excellence)- can you fit an All In One Kit tank inside your cabinet? as hospital & quarantine & fry tank 

Something in 35-50 litres (thinking of the Dennerle Scaper kits as they seem fairly economic, just confirm the lid as stressed rainbows are decided jumpers); a Spec 19 would work, low water volume but decent swimming length for these sized fish & the filter capacity is astounding (but would need to cover the cover re that long slit for light - I just use a plastic bin lid with rock or stymie the Cat Monster)
(Edge series tanks are much lower oxygen, not sure I'd use with stressed rainbows despite better closed top)


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## Petra R (20 Apr 2018)

Hi @alto - I do adore the Pseudomugil paskai as well, but the place I get my fish from does not stock them at the moment. The only suitable ones they have which will live happily together AND want to live in my water AND are little are the first 3 on my list. Of course by the time the tank has cycled this may be different anyway

You're right about the odd numbers, of course, so starting with two groups of 7. GREAT idea.

Which two of the three would you consider to be hardier (I know they're all a bit delicate, but I think my tank will suit them (I added the rest of the plants today and tied slate to the pesky floating root because it irritated the hell out of me,) so there will be plenty of hiding places, the back is quite densely planted (or will be when the amazons start to take off, if they do) and I read they appreciate hanging out under driftwood "bridges".

I actually had a place for a nano tank planned in when I designed my kitchen, so I guess I could use that as a quarantine tank. I LOVED my Edge to look at but it was such a Pita to do anything with.

You only fully appreciate getting your whole arm into the tank and being able to move things about when you had to do everything through a tiny opening for a while...

Thanks for the great advice! I've learned more in the week I've been here than in the last 5 years...


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## alto (20 Apr 2018)

I consider 1 & 3 to be reasonably "sturdy" as long as healthy stock is imported & they are kept suitably (especially at the shop) - pale is fine as long as fish are reasonably active & strong food response

P sp red neon & paskai seem less resilient, no idea how many are wild caught now vs tank raised

You might ask if shop is able to hold fish (expect to prepay) 

I have impulse bought rarely attainable (wild caught) fish from shop tanks (especially when unsuited to the fish in question) & brought them home despite also needing to set up a tank at the same time  

Between plants (newly bought as well, pots not 1-2-Grow type as plant mass is important) & daily water changes, the fish seemed to manage just fine - appearing far "happier" in my uncycled tank than they'd been at the shop

I used a Seachem Ammonia Alert  (& pH Alert) & would immediately water change as needed, fed lightly but more frequently (fish were very thin)


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## Petra R (20 Apr 2018)

Great to know! I need to wait until the rest of the substrate arrives. of course I picked something that is hard to get and they "lost" half my order and now they ran out.
This means it has to come from France which was the only place I could get another bag.
It is darker than in the picture and a beautiful mix of colours so don't want to compromise on that.


Then I hope the floater has decided to stay where it is so I can remove the slate and place it where it needs to be. Then add a bit more of the substrate so the beeping Tetra Complete does not come up every time I move something.

I will get the Seachem Ammonia Alert - good idea. I am a great fan of Seachem, eagerly awaiting my Purigen, it's just so hard to get hold of here in Italy.



Added the rest of the anubia (and temporary slate) to the floater and just let it sink. It will find it's final place once it learns to behave.
Water a bit cloudy as had been messing about stirring things up, hopefully for the last time for a few days. I decided to probably remove the silly column on the right after friend who gave it to me visits, put the anubia elsewhere and hope next time he comes everything is so grown in he won't have the faintest idea which bit of wood is what anyway... 

Or I take it out, slam off the "foot" it stands on, and lay it from the front right corner towards the back


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## alto (20 Apr 2018)

Definitely ditch the "foot" 

With Anubias so close to light may want to add floating plants or interplant with Microsorum pteropus "petite" (or "trident") as this should shade it 

Looks much better with wood down 

What substrate?


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## Petra R (20 Apr 2018)

I was thinking about floating plants (much nicer than floating wood lol!) - probably a good idea. the rainbows will love them anyway, right?

I added 2 cm (ish) of Tetra complete substrate and then a fine gravel in what is quite a dark mix of warm browns. This one 

But.... not enough as the Tetra Complete keeps coming up so I want to add a bit more of this where it's a bit thin.

In hindsight it was borderline idiotic to add the Tetra Complete anywhere other than where the actual "in substrate" plants (the swords and the swirly things / something vesuvius - love botanical names) are growing but hindsight is always 20 / 20... It is mainly there but also in places it  didn't need to be.


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## Petra R (22 Apr 2018)

Sulking, because the plants are. Actually the anubia and the spirally thingies (something vesuvius - edited: Echinodorus augustifolia) look happy enough, the Amazon Swords are clearly sulking.
I know they do that when changing location and they WERE in transit a long time and some melting is expected and I need to be patient and all that but I want it all to be perfect NOW.
So there.

Also a lovely layer of fungus forming on the wood and tannins are leaking like teabags (Yes, I know, waterchanges, waterchanges, waterchanges. - ordered a Marina Aqua Vac Water Change Gravel Cleaner thing so carrying buckets will be a thing of the past after Tuesday. Good old Amazon lol.)

I'll laugh about it in a few weeks / months time but ...... not laughing right now.


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## Petra R (24 Apr 2018)

There is light at the end of the tunnel.
The anubia are recovering, in fact they seem to be thriving! New leaves growing, "flowers" opening! The tiny ones are simply gorgeous. Anubias "Bonsai" or "Petite" - really darling little leaves and dense as heck.

The Amazon Swords are still looking sad but haven't gotten any sadder, Echinodorus augustifolia looking great. Very curly!
Wood getting covered in slime, normal. Moss looking good, and funny little (TINY) plants coming out of it. Just a tiny stem and two tiny tiny tiny round leaves. Leaving them for now to see what they're doing
Couple of little snails. Saw a white wormy thing (hydra, I think?) on the glass and zapped it out at WC.

Tannins in water barely visible now, overal clarity "better."

Routine:

Running at 28 C, 

Juvel stock lights 5 hours a day, very low level coloured backlighting late evening, it goes well with wine 

30% ish WC every couple of days,
daily 5 ml Flourish Excel and Flourish 4ml every second day.
Am I doing anything horribly wrong at this stage?

Pictures in a couple of days


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## Petra R (26 Apr 2018)

Going in the right direction...

Water changes are a good thing ( who knew lol  ) - and plants seem to be coping. Anubia thriving! Amazons recovering. Tannins going down.

pics a week ago and today for comparison.

Side view




 

and front view



 

The stupid vertical foot on the right will be re-purposed once the root on the left decides to stay down by itself so I can remove the slate and put it it where it needs to be.

Parameters are good, I think using partially cycled filter media resulted in an uneventful cycle / self-cycle.

So far, so good.


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## Edvet (26 Apr 2018)




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## Petra R (16 May 2018)

Went through a short ugly stage with the swords doing some melting (but growing super healthy new leaves) then algae. Added floating plants which slowed the algae right down. 
It cycled super quickly (probably due to the used filter media I added) so I added the first fish a week ago. Made a mistake and added the ones I meant to add last, first. ( Pseudomugil furcatus x 11) - I lost 2 during the first 24 hours but one had what looked like a dislocated / broken lower jaw and one arrived deformed so maybe not entirely my fault. They were literally miniscule and they ARE delicate so I may be lucky I only lost two. 
The others are thriving.

Also added two little otos, I know they want to be in groups but I am having horrid trouble finding healthy ones. Those two actually seem quite happy, they are eating well, not skittish, lively and look plump. 
Today I took delivery of a shoal of threadfin rainbowfish (Iriatherina werneri)
Oh. My. GOD - how lovely are those fish? They settled right in and were starting to "display" almost immediately. The little ones (Pseudomugil furcatus) seem to feel really comfortable having them around (like bigger brothers and sisters, maybe) and they are all mingling super happily.

That's it for the minute. I want to see how it develops. Most problems I ever had with tanks were caused by greed ("Want that fish, want that fish now") or lack of patience.
Not going to do that this time.

Pictures soon


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## alto (16 May 2018)

Nice update 

Shame about the furcata's - supplier really should refund AND replace - absolutely no excuse to ship out deformed or injured fish (unlikely to occur in bag)

They do like a crowd & gain confidence from other fish behaving naturally 

How many in the thredafin shoal? 
(just curiosity )


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## Petra R (17 May 2018)

alto said:


> Nice update
> 
> How many in the threadafin shoal?
> (just curiosity )



11 - I had ordered 7 and 3 otos but they had no healthy otos (story of my life at the moment but at least they were good enough to call and say upon closer inspection their otos were not in a fit condition to ship) so offered me 3 more threadfins instead (as I'd already paid) and in the end there were 11 in the bags 

They make quite a display which is why I think this may be enough now. Either for good or at least for now.

I guess I could / should have complained about the 2 furcata but frankly I could not be bothered... This is Italy. Everything gets more complicated when you don't speak the lingo fluently 

Instead I just changed suppliers.

I'd really much rather buy my fish from a trusted local shop but having looked at the ones in the area I'd rather not. VERY expensive (which I could live with because I understand their overheads) with very limited choice and not very knowledgable staff of the "Yes, that plec will be great in your 23 liter Edge and why not have some clown loaches to go with it?" sort...

Edited to add: OK, so AqAdvisor reckons I am just over 50% of my stocking limit based on adult size... Maybe I can go back to the original plan of adding a group of Pseudomugil sp. red neon - they are only tiny...

Not straight away, want to see how it all goes with what is in there now, but they are such pretty things.


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## Petra R (17 May 2018)

Bad shot (I really need a proper camera again  )
As you can see the Amazons did do some melting and maybe I should remove those leaves but they seem happy enough apart from the brown spots.
The root on the left is finally staying down (HURRAH)
I think I may have added too much floating plants as the whole tank seem to be green as "all" the light is filtered through floaters plus they stick to everything. I wanted "some" cover, not a whole ceiling but to be honest the fish seem to adore it!





Little oto cleaning up 





little otos again














*Link to video 




*


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## Petra R (18 May 2018)

How I adore my rainbows 
I spend ages watching them. The threadfins seem to have settled in so well, they are displaying and lively and seem happy.
What is surprising me is how the furcata have changed colour since the threadfins have moved in. They were pretty before, little shiny silvery fishies with blue eyes, but since their bigger friends arrived they have coloured up, their little chests are getting orange / red and the striking yellow edges are appearing on fins and tails. 
Very happy so far! Not adding anything for the moment.


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## alto (18 May 2018)

What is your floating plant?
- definitely keep it thinned out as it can easily shade your plants too much 

It's generally recommended to remove damaged leaves as they tend to cost the plant more in energy to maintain, than what they deliver to nutrient stores - especially when these are old emerse culture leafs which tend to be inefficient energy providers under water anyway ... I'd gradually remove the older leafs


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## sciencefiction (18 May 2018)

Dwarf rainbows are beautiful. I don't know why they are not so common considering how attractive and active they are.
I kept forktail rainbows and they get even prettier once they grow. They're actually not that small as adults. The males tend to constantly display to each other and they're very interesting to watch.  The less colourful ones are the females but they have the same personalities and are quite beautiful in their own right. Once they become adults they rival the males. They're hardy and easy to keep. They just need space because they're territorial and chase each other around.


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## alto (19 May 2018)

In case you missed this (awesome) site

Rainbowfish


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## Petra R (19 May 2018)

alto said:


> What is your floating plant?
> - definitely keep it thinned out as it can easily shade your plants too much



just frogbit, probably way too much of it. It also clings to everything. Maybe not the smartest choice I ever made 



alto said:


> It's generally recommended to remove damaged leaves as they tend to cost the plant more in energy to maintain, than what they deliver to nutrient stores - especially when these are old emerse culture leafs which tend to be inefficient energy providers under water anyway ... I'd gradually remove the older leafs



Yes, you're probably right and when my trimming tools arrive, I'll start taking the damaged leaves out. 



sciencefiction said:


> Dwarf rainbows are beautiful. I don't know why they are not so common considering how attractive and active they are.



Maybe with nano tanks becoming more popular they will, too (although observing them in mine I am not sure a nano would be the best environment for them.)
It could also be that in a shop they'll be very young (=pale) and in a very bare tank so won't catch the eye the way more immediately striking fish would.



alto said:


> In case you missed this (awesome) site
> 
> Rainbowfish



That is a great site!! Now I want some of these guys... _Pseudomugil cyanodorsalis



 _


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## sciencefiction (19 May 2018)

Petra R said:


> although observing them in mine I am not sure a nano would be the best environment for them



No, I don't think they'll do well in a nano. I


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## alto (19 May 2018)

_P gertrudae _

The smallest tank to be considered (Seriously Fish) would be 45cm x 30cm, (from reports) P gertrudae seems to do better in this as a species tank than in larger community tanks (where they often seem to just gradually disappear after several months)
They are such active little fish I'd want to put them in a 60cm x 30cm tank (at least) 

Note that several of these smaller species can vary significantly in size depending on location variant


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## sciencefiction (19 May 2018)

I honestly can't imagine those fish in either 45X30 nor 60X30. Even my harlequin rasboras didn't do that well in that size tank and the dwarf rainbows grow about twice as long as an harlequin rasbora....

They do fine in community tanks with bottom feeders. Mine fed exclusively from the surface.


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## Petra R (19 May 2018)

sciencefiction said:


> I honestly can't imagine those fish in either 45X30 nor 60X30. Even my harlequin rasboras didn't do that well in that size tank and the dwarf rainbows grow about twice as long as an harlequin rasbora....
> 
> They do fine in community tanks with bottom feeders. Mine fed exclusively from the surface.



To be perfectly honest, I don't actually think any fish are designed to permanently live in a nano tank. I could probably keep a llama alive in my bathroom. That does not mean bathrooms are a suitable environment for llamas.



alto said:


> _P gertrudae _
> 
> The smallest tank to be considered (Seriously Fish) would be 45cm x 30cm, (from reports) P gertrudae seems to do better in this as a species tank than in larger community tanks (where they often seem to just gradually disappear after several months)
> They are such active little fish I'd want to put them in a 60cm x 30cm tank (at least)
> ...



I can't help but wonder if sometimes those poor darlings are chucked in a tank as part of a "picture" for aquascaping purposes, without any real regards for their longterm needs and happiness.

Once I take on a living being I also assume responsibility. That is as true for the feral cats I decide to feed as for the fish I put in my tank...


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## alto (19 May 2018)

sciencefiction said:


> Even my harlequin rasboras didn't do that well in that size tank and the dwarf rainbows grow about twice as long as an harlequin rasbora.


P gertrudae 30 - 35mm SL (& more slender)
T heteromorpha 35 - 45mm SL (note SF minimum 60cm tank)

A friend does a lot of nano tanks & small fish (including the P gertrudae & similar sized rainbows) - I'm always surprised how well they look/behave (& these are definitely not "aquascape" tanks  )

I use my 45P as a quarantine tank though I keep saying I'll keep fish in it one day ... 
my latest Fish Disaster - tiny S selatanensis that I kept in this tank too long, as I kept losing another fish & they were too thin and ... and ... 
Finally moved the last 4 to their intended home (60cm x 45cm x 55cm H) & they are seeming much better, despite the current & lots of distance needed to travel for food (& looking absurdly tiny)

Oddly I quarantined my juvenile S vaillanti in the same tank without issue ... (& S osphromenoides)


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## alto (19 May 2018)

Petra R said:


> I could probably keep a llama alive in my bathroom. That does not mean bathrooms are a suitable environment for llamas.


but is your bathroom spacious enough for the llama to have decent quality of movement, cleanliness, air quality 
I've watched field llamas that barely leave the gate area, instead they stand about waiting on the next (hay) meal, ignoring the grass that is beyond the invisible barrier 

General recommendation is that adult size fish can swim at least 10 body lengths
 - which is rather more decent than the stalls horse are kept in 
I have a horse who hates being in a stall - he'd rather live outside in a field in any weather ..... except busy folk will complain to Animal Cruelty Prevention officers - who rarely have much equine experience, especially with feral horses ... so in a stall he goes in "bad" weather
A friend's horse loves his stall, he endures outside & displays great distress if left out too long


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## sciencefiction (20 May 2018)

alto said:


> P gertrudae 30 - 35mm SL (& more slender)
> T heteromorpha 35 - 45mm SL (note SF minimum 60cm tank)



I kept forktail rainbows. Seriously Fish lists them as 40-60mm. They're definitely at least 60mm when fully grown and not any smaller. They're "large" nano fish and as active as danios, constant chasing and displaying. Mine were in a 100G and they utilized it fully. I had male guppies also display to the male forktail rainbows


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## Petra R (20 May 2018)

OFF TOPIC ALERT ON



alto said:


> I have a horse who hates being in a stall - he'd rather live outside in a field in any weather ..... except busy folk will complain to Animal Cruelty Prevention officers - who rarely have much equine experience, especially with feral horses ... so in a stall he goes in "bad" weather
> A friend's horse loves his stall, he endures outside & displays great distress if left out too long



My last horse loved being in the stable and initially hated being in the field. He could not be left alone as he'd just jump out and go back to his stable ( 1.45 wire fence, from trot)
Clearly having a loose stallion about near road, railwayline and mares is not ideal so I spent literally weeks hand-grazing him, first on a leadrope, then on the lunge. Then spent a fortune putting another strand of electric wire around his field to 1.60. He only jumped out once after that and decided being in the field was not that bad after all 

OFF TOPIC ALERT OFF


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## Petra R (4 Jul 2018)

Little snapshot of two of my rainbows - handheld with monster zoom so sorry for not so sharp...


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## Petra R (8 Aug 2018)

Month 4
After going through the usual teething problems I think the tank is finally approaching "maturity"
Had a bit of algae, reduced light drastically - it was also running too warm with the lights - had the amazon swords melt from lack of light and warmth, got a mobile aircon for the kitchen for the hottest hours and the last month everything recovered.
Still deeply in love with the fork tails, they are getting prettier and more colourful by the week. Just ordered some more as I had stocked very lightly originally.


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## ian_m (8 Aug 2018)

Your pictures haven't come through


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## Petra R (8 Aug 2018)

ian_m said:


> Your pictures haven't come through



Grrrrrr


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## Petra R (3 Sep 2018)

I so, so love my forktails - they're getting prettier by the week


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## Petra R (5 Sep 2018)




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## Petra R (8 Sep 2018)




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