# Mikrogeophagus ramirezi in aquascape with hard water?



## Nigel95 (27 Feb 2018)

Tank is 80x40x40 cm plan is to keep a pair with my amanos, red cherries and 18 green neon tetra. I know this will ruin the scale a bit in the scape but for final shots I will temporary move them. I really love this fish!

GH 12 (in tank)
TDS 209 (in tank)
KH 9 and PH 7,5 out of tap.
Temperature around 25 celcius.
Adding co2 around 30 ppm? 
Strong lights but overhanging spiderwood / cave with stones. 

Possible or not wise?


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## Gill (13 Mar 2018)

I keep mine in moderately hard water and they do well.


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## Edvet (13 Mar 2018)

Captive bred ones are used to harder water, so it probably will function.
Me personally I,would not do it. I like to stay as close to natural values as possible.


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## Nigel95 (13 Mar 2018)

I got some from a local breeder. Doing really fine so far! Hope they will get old


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## Daneland (13 Mar 2018)

I tied, I am afraid did not work.But they are beautiful.


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## Killamanjaro (23 Mar 2018)

Edvet said:


> Captive bred ones are used to harder water, so it probably will function.
> Me personally I,would not do it. I like to stay as close to natural values as possible.



Agree with this. I tried it a couple of times a few years back and while they will live for a while, their colouration and lifespan wont be as impressive or as long.


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## ceg4048 (26 Mar 2018)

Captive bred Rams really do not care that much about hard water. The two main things to worry about is clean water and temperature. The temperature is the real problem because like Discus, Rams seemingly prefer the range 84degF/29degC to 86degF/30degC, which _can _be a problem for other fish - and is tough on plants as CO2/O2 solubility becomes a serious issue.

Some 10 years back I kept them in a tank located in the conservatory where the daytime  temperatures soared. 
They were quite OK. Here the male is in breeding colors and was fine at KH 15+ and GH 26+
Got eggs but never any survivors from the spawn.
As you can see, the ferns were not all that happy at the high temperatures, but the fish wasn't bothered at all.



 

Cheers,


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## Killamanjaro (26 Mar 2018)

@ceg4048 that ram looks awesome, my old ram looked anemic in comparison!


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## ceg4048 (26 Mar 2018)

Hi pal,
        Live foods fed almost exclusively, especially bloodworms, brine shrimp enhances colors as does spirulina based dried foods (or any food containing high levels of beta-carotene).

Cheers,


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## alto (26 Mar 2018)

I've not kept _M_ _ramirezi_  in harder water, but did keep them at the lower end of their recommended range 26C - 30C
(my tank ran 25-26)

I don't have any photos but my wild caught fish looked much as shown on 
Seriously Fish profile 
Food was Sera flake, frozen bloodworm & brineshrimp
At this temp, they lived ~3yr, bred but didn't raise fry (mixed community so fry usually disappeared after 2-3 weeks)

Looking at what ships into shops in recent years, it's difficult to find good quality (properly conformed) blue rams
Some of the newer color sports electric blue, platinum, gold platinum etc can ship in with decent (ie to breed standard) conformation but tend to be much less robust than "blue" rams of 10-15 years ago

A local shop occasionally brings in supposed "wild caught" blue rams (Columbia or Peru origin on the shipments) but these also lack decent color, & disappointing conformation - again looking as if they've been tank bred for generations with no attention to maintaining quality or bloodlines, & sometimes even "hormoned" for growth

Look for regional Cichlid association, fish clubs that may know of local breeders, or a shop that specializes in dwarf cichlids - this should improve your chance of finding decent quality fish


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