# Mechanical Filtration or Biological ?



## Aquaholic (17 Feb 2016)

Hello guys. I am new. My name is Peter.
And I would like to get yours advices about filtration my planted tank. First of all I will describe my tank:
Tank is after restarted, and works about 2 weeks. I add regularly bacteries to the filter after 20% changing of water weekly. 

Size: 45l     50x30x30

Lighting: Power LED 2 parts:
1st: 10x leds 6500K-8500K ; 1x Deep Reed ; 1x Royal Blue
2nd: 10x leds 6500K-8500K ; 1x Deep Reed ; 1x Royal Blue (on this time it is turned off)

Base:
Tropica plant growth substrate 1l
JBL Manado about 12l (front 5cm, rear 8-9cm)

Flora:
Alternanthera Rosaefolia
Cabomba caroliniana
valisneria maericana 'natans'
riccia flutains
Hydrocotyle sp Japan
anubias var nana

I have Dry Salts: K2SO4, KNO3, KH2PO4, Easy Carbo, Tropica premium, Tropica specialised.
What do i use?
K2SO4 20ppm weekly (about)
KH2PO4 2ppm weekly (about)
Easy Carbo 1ml daily
Tropica premium - I haven't started use this yet. 
Tropica specialised I don't use this.  

Actually I have problem with a green, brown dust on my glasses. 

Fauna:
6x cardinal tetras
6x Neon tetras
2x anetome helena
1 pair of platy (_Xiphophorus maculatus) orange_
1x neocaridina heteroporoda orange

CO2:
Colombo Flora-Grow CO2 Nano 150
diffusser: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Aquarium-...For-planted-aquarium-plant-tank-/331734663920

Filtration:
JBL e 701 - and now I have standard media included with this filter.

Now I would like to get any advice about filter media. Because I was reading that biological media don't have to be in planted tanks, because NH4 doesn't have to be convert into NO2 then NO3.
The plants better absorbs NH4 than NO3. So now my question is.
What type of filtration should I have?
Mechanical or biological?


And by this JBL e701 in 45l tank I set flow water to minimum. I think about concentrate on only fine sponge in my filter. Why? because I think JBL Manado base is good habitat and enough biological bacteries.

What are yours opinion guys ?

Regards 

Ps. Tomorrow I will try to do a photos of my tank.
Thank You for any helping


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## darren636 (17 Feb 2016)

Stick with what you have and don't think about it. Ever again.


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## parotet (17 Feb 2016)

Hi Peter

I have to JBL greenline filters: a e401 for my 25 liters and a e901 for my 60 liters. I also like over dimensioned filters, I can pack them with media and still keep a good flow. In one of them I have kept the original media. In the other one I left the sponges in the highest part and changed all for ADA Bio Rio (which is supposed to be a very good filtering media and surprisingly for an ADA item, it is on the same price range than the rest). To be honest I have found no difference between the two filter setups and no difference between ADA Bio Rio and the biological filtering media provided by JBL. It is true that a dense planted tank is already a very good biological filter but more the biological filter media won't do any harm to your tank. The question is: do you have a good flow in your tank? (I guess the answer for this tank and this filter should be YES). My advice is that if you are happy with the flow you have, just keep it as you have it.

Jordi


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## dw1305 (17 Feb 2016)

Hi all, 





Aquaholic said:


> Because I was reading that biological media don't have to be in planted tanks, because NH4 doesn't have to be convert into NO2 then NO3.
> The plants better absorbs NH4 than NO3.


It doesn't really matter whether it is the microbes that are in your filter, in the substrate and attached to plant surfaces, or the plants, that directly take up NH4+ ions. It isn't really one or the other. All plant based biological filtration systems are really "plant and microbe"  based.

The real advantage of plants is that they also convert NO3- into plant matter (plants may <"preferentially take up NH4+ or NO3-">, dependent upon species). In "microbe only" systems you are reliant on anaerobic denitrification of NO3 (and out-gassing as N2 gas) and/or water changes to dilute NO3 levels. 

If you have a planted tank you are likely to have some zones where anaerobic denitrification may occur in the substrate, but you don't need to use plenums, or denitrification coils, or try and combine aerobic nitrification and anaerobic denitrification in the filter. I think this last option is a recipe for disaster (unless you have an HMF, Dr Stephan Tanner's article on <"aquarium biofiltration">, it is good accessible read.). I'm like "Jordi", I just aim to keep all the filter material aerobic at all times. Plants helps with this because they are net oxygen producers. This is also why planted wet and dry trickle filters are the most efficient filters for biological filtration, they have a huge gas exchange surface area. 

I don't like any fine material in the filter, and I have a sponge block as a pre-filter on the intake of a canister filter. Inside the filter I have some biological media that doesn't clog and impede flow, but it doesn't really matter what it is. At the moment I have any combination of PPI10 sponge, ceramic/sintered glass rings, floating cell media and  Eheim Substrat Pro ("coco-pops"). I didn't buy any of the more expensive media they came with the filters. If some-one else is paying I'll have "coco-pops", if I am paying it is  floating cell media, hydroleca or alfagrog.

cheers Darrel


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## Aquaholic (18 Feb 2016)

Wow I did not expect so quockly answers.
But thank You for information and help it. 
Now about this water flow. It is hard to say  I am happy, it is fresh filter, so even if i set on 1/2 of its power I think it is to much like on this tank. 
I have set water flow on minimum. 

The problem is that the plants is going out from base when i increase water flow. 

Plants are in poor condition. I have problem with brown dust on glasses. But I know it is normally by restart tank.

I don't want to do offtopic. But if You are able guys to tell me about, what reason could be of green dust on glasses? 
Because till restart my tank i had all the time this problem. 
Could it be an over fertilised  of NO3? I was reading lots of about the green dust... And I can't find answer.  I just write quickly on break time at work. I work on nightshifts.

I really sorry for my english, but i am polish person. I am still learning of english.


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## parotet (18 Feb 2016)

Hi again 

Regarding the flow, you are the only one that can tell if it is too much or just ok. Of course, if your plants are blown it is no good sign, but is it due to the strong flow or to plants melting? If it is too much flow you can keep working with a restricted flow, you can try different kinds of outlets (I.e. Flat duckbill outlet, round pipe outlet, spraybar , etc.).

Regarding the green dust algae, I have them when I over feed my fish, when the sun hits directly my tank or when I over fertilize my tanks with macro nutrients (this last post is just my experience but it is quite controversial. Some people think that nutrients don't cause algae). In my opinion your tank is overstocked, and you mention your plants are in poor conditions. As mentioned by Darrel, this leaves you in a weak situation regarding the filtering conditions. EI fertilization in my experience only works with a very dense planted and healthy tank, otherwise you are filling the tank with nutrients than won't be used. If you add to this fish food, fish poo, etc. you have much more than needed. Personally I would not fertilize with macros having that fish stock.
My last advice is for maintenance. When my tanks have minimum signs of algae I increase water changes frequency and volume. In a normal situation I change 50% weekly but I do not hesitate to do it twice a week if needed. In small tanks like yours I have even changed 80% and all the tanks inhabitants seem very happy. Have a look to threads and videos on YouTube about planted tank maintenance and check if you are doing what is supposed to do (there is a very nice one from Viktor Lantos). This would be a good beginning for your green dust and brown algae... Hope it helps!

Jordi


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## Aquaholic (18 Feb 2016)

I feed fish only once a day, and one day it is sunday i don't feed fish.

Hm... My plants are not maybe in poor condition. But it could be definitely better. Now after restart i dose only k2so4 and kh2po4.

The sun not hitting directly in tank. possibly till restarting my tank i could over fertilisng with a macro. Because as i remember i put kno3 7ppm additionally weekly. So that could be a reason for a green dust.

I will check later on youtube this what You describe me .

I would like to start dosing tropica premium there are micros. But really i am affraid of effects. This tank after restart is not yet stabilized, the water is not clear.

I hope it will quicky stabilize.
Thanks for help.

Regarding this water flow, i will set this to keep it compromise between plants and fish


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## Aquaholic (21 Feb 2016)

Hello Guys again 
My tank is slowly stabilizing. The green dust disapeared. I have only brown dust. 
I woud not to do off topic again but i have question. 

I have background plants like cabomba, hygrophila polysperma, and in my opinion this tank is to low for them. It is only 30cm minus base 7-8cm. 

Could You write me please what plants on background i could use ? 
 I thought about Hemianthus micranthemoides to do from this green wall  
But I would like fast growing micro plants on the background. 

Could You help me ? 
Thank You.


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## dw1305 (21 Feb 2016)

Hi all, 





Aquaholic said:


> I thought about Hemianthus micranthemoides to do from this green wall
> But I would like fast growing micro plants on the background.


They aren't fast growing, but there are a range of _Cryptocoryne_ spp. that might be suitable. I like <"_C x willisii">, _but there are a range of possibilities.

cheers Darrel


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## Aquaholic (21 Feb 2016)

Yes but they are slow growing. I would like sth like fast growing and any kind of grass.
What about eleocharis vivipara? 
I had eleocharis parvula, and it was quite fast growing but it was on foreground.


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## PARAGUAY (23 Feb 2016)

You could pinch out tips of the Polysperma it will grow bushy and more suited to your tank,


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## Aquaholic (24 Feb 2016)

If You meaning hygrophila polysperma, i guess i have it


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