# Betta Fish in Vase Idea



## Something Fishy (21 Mar 2017)

Hi guys

I know I could post on a Betta forum, but I feel people on this forum have a pretty good understanding of how I think and the planted angle, rather than churning out stats about Betta fish haha.

I've been keeping fish for years, marine and tropical on and off, so I'm pretty versed with how things are in that sense.  I have been thinking recently however about having a Betta fish in this 15.1l Ikea Vase http://www.ikea.com/gb/en/products/decoration/vases-bowls/beräkna-vase-clear-glass-art-40327949/

I know, controversial! I normally hate seeing things online about badly kept fish and wanging a Betta fish in a vase with no understanding of it's requirements or habitat, but this does possess a decent capacity as to keep one happy I understand, even though it's tall rather than wide.  I had it for a Wabi Kusa and still would like to heavily plant the top area really if possible.  I am just trying to consider if I can do without a filter as they don't like current and if I heavily plant it up it should have a fairly high nutrient requiremnt.

Now, I want to make it still very clean and not fussy ADA style, so I would pop a small flat heater at the bottom and hide the cable at the back for temp reasons, and I was thinking a thick java carpet, no substrate for purer water and less pollutants. Add some floating plants (Limnobium laevigatum), Anubias and some very tall leafed plants (maybe some American Val Natans).  Recommendations very welcome.  I read they like some soil/peat though for acidity reasons so perhaps this is a bad shout unless I simply supplement this into the water. 

Very much still in the thought phase for this at the moment, a hanging filter is an option but kinda defeats what I was trying to achieve. If it's really a no goer from most I'll just keep it as a Wabi, just from what I have read it seems possible if I could offset the fish food/waste/ammonia with the plants.

Minimum 50% change a week would go without saying.

I've seen many Japs floating Wabi balls too in the top of a Betta tank, but again the ball would need to be fairly lacking on the nutrient front otherwise it will seep. I can add cork and Riccia line with a sucker to keep it floating, I think that would be doable if feasible.  Again, not sure on this idea and would prefer a heavier planted tank for better circulation.

What does everybody think - could that work?  Thanks in advance.


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## dean (21 Mar 2017)

I wouldn't normally agree with this on a fish forum for various reason 
But it is definitely achievable without being at all cruel to the fish 
I would not fill it to the top as they do jump 

Maybe you could make a moss wall and take it up to the rim ?
Use some sturdy plastic so it's removable 

I'm positive 10l will be sufficient volume for the betta 
I keep some of mine in that size unfiltered and do 50% water changes every 3-5 days 




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## castle (22 Mar 2017)

It's a no from me, the vase is too small (narrow).


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## PARAGUAY (22 Mar 2017)

Myself I would give the jar idea a miss,most small examples of jars are for retail selling and breeding projects,much better less bother to house it in a small 18" to 24" tank with sand substrate and Java fern,moss


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## rebel (22 Mar 2017)

I reckon get a custom vase made out of low iron glass. 15cm radius.


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## Aqua360 (22 Mar 2017)

I wouldn't, I'm confident you'd end up with a sluggish, unhappy fish; imo


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## Ryan Young (22 Mar 2017)

I wouldn't advise it. Although it may be possible, I don't believe that the betta would be happy in a vase that small. Your betta would most likely be very stressed and not exhibit natural behaviours.

Take a look at the BBC documentary on Thailand: Earths Tropical Paradise and you will see them in their natural habitat. For reference I have mine in a 30L cube alongside a few RCS and he seems happy however due to it being a 30L setup I have tried to adjust the water quality to get it similar to the conditions they do well in. For the price you can find a small cube aquarium or even fishbowls I would say keep it as a wabi kusa and if you still want a betta, invest in a small aquarium. 
Ryan


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## kadoxu (22 Mar 2017)

With no filter, I say no fish, specially with such a small volume of water (it's like having a goldfish in a glass bowl, nowadays we all know it's just cruel). And with no water movement I believe the plants will also have a hard time when submersed. And I agree with @castle the vase is way too narrow for a fish.


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## mort (22 Mar 2017)

It's a no from me also. I don't think leaving a filter out is advisable and the best bettas I have seen have had more space.


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## Fiske (22 Mar 2017)

Nope. Do a Wabi-kusa in the vase and get a tank for your betta.


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## dean (22 Mar 2017)

It's a small version of the walstead method 

Any imported betta you buy will have spent its life so far in 200ml or less in either a plastic water bottle or a glass whiskey bottle 

10 litres is the recommended minimum for a permanent betta aquarium in the UK

Boredom is the thing that needs to be addressed 

Bettas in filtered 30l + often get bored and bite their tail or sit and sulk 

Feed live daphnia and use a small mirror to exercise him daily 




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## Something Fishy (23 Mar 2017)

Hi guys thanks so much for your opinions, all read and gladly taken.  I realise it's narrow myself but was unsure if a beta swam a great deal horizontally as the 12l capacity is adequate when leaving the top unfilled.

I have been considering a waterfall back with moss for circulation and low current with some pure balls in there for increased bio filtration, bamboo charcoal for purification and wood with lava rock to remove a filter need. With good WC maybe the balls and carbon are overkill as I need some nutrients for plants.  They would all be easy plants to ensure they take nutrients of course. 

I have a semi tech 22l nano setup well established and a 350l Jewel on the go at the mo I am going to make into an Amano style.

I wanted wabis purely for display in the lounge and this vase was bang on, there's an even bigger one too!

Would a rectangular one on a table be betta (ha) do you think?

@dean appreciate your support dude I think you're seeing my angle most. Keeping him active would be key in any tank, dunno how anybody can truely know if a fish is happy to be honest but I asked on here as I care so I will think carefully. 

I agree that the biggest issue is circumference as everything else adds up for me if I could create some form of filter with good WC.


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## Delapool (23 Mar 2017)

I'm afraid would be a no from me as well on dimensions and imo they are more suited to 20litre. If you did, I do find less issues with the short-fin varieties. 


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## Something Fishy (23 Mar 2017)

Thanks mate appreciate it. This could be a contender, 20l cylindrical vase and 24cm wide instead! http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Clear-Cylinder-Glass-Vase-H-45-cm-/122394757469

I might shrimp up the other vase instead - viable?


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## castle (23 Mar 2017)

Have you taken a look at https://www.reddit.com/r/Jarrariums/?

I'd say, just stick a snail in it. 

I've had a few attempts at jar tanks, my last one was http://imgur.com/gallery/A2e9s2O, but that forced me to move my fish into a permanent 150L tank. Might start something similar up again.


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## Something Fishy (24 Mar 2017)

Cheers castle. You still think that huge 20l Vase is a no go for a Betta? The other one is going to be a Wabi now I think.


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## three-fingers (24 Mar 2017)

Another "no" from me. What you plan could be perfectly fine water condition wise if done properly, and if you really care about the well-being of the fish, I guess you could spend time every day "entertaining" it to _reduce _"boredom" (more like fish mental-illness IMO)...but it's a terrible plan for the fish and I'm sure you will get bored of this fast, I would.  If you were interested enough in keeping a betta to keep the act up...then surely you are interested enough to set up a more appropriate tank in the first place?

Can anyone truly know if a fish is happy? No more than we can truly know if our fellow humans are happy! Some people are better at it than others, it takes experience and everyone will have different opinions - this goes for both fish and people. If your aren't sure enough yourself after researching, and asking opinions, don't try.  In this hobby it's quite easy for the average person to unknowingly torture an animal while convincing themselves they are being responsible because somebody else told them their methods were OK.  There's a good reason keeping bettas in vases  it a controversial subject .

Keep a betta in a proper dedicated set-up if you are interested in the fish species. Stick to plants and inverts for the vase .


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## Something Fishy (24 Mar 2017)

Except you can ask a human  Just makes me laugh when some people say their fish or pet is happy based on the fact it's not sulking or dead. Again not everyone I accept, not what I mean, but I read it a lot online thrown about to back up a point but it's 100% personal opinion 

Makes sense. The vase issue for me is with those that don't ask the questions, use a tiny vase, and are ignorant to the fish's needs. That would certainly not be me. Just from what I could tell a 20l tank wouldn't be at all upsetting to a Betta so I couldn't see how this referred to as a vase would be an issue? Unless still they only swim horizontally which having observed some in videos online doesn't seem the case. The shape is a little unusual I accept but it's larger than many tanks I've seen people having Bettas in. A dedicated setup I would use wouldn't be much more than 20l anyway if I did consider it as I already have a few setups so dominating the lounge could be an issue haha. This was a sort of attempt at doing something very wabi inspired and clean without adding yet another convential fish tank.

Thanks for the input and advice though.  Appreciated. For a 'beginner' fish they certainly require a fair amount more consideration than expected.


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## Aqua360 (27 Mar 2017)

Betta's typically inhabit shallow, wide expanses of water in the wild; i.e. entirely opposite to a vase. 

You will notice a big, big difference between a Betta in a vase, and one given room to explore, that's not me being negative or anything, just honest truth through experience. 

I've seen some awesome shallow ripariums style tanks for betta's, that make for superb centre pieces, they offer so much more in terms of design, ease of cleaning, and everything basically


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## Something Fishy (30 Mar 2017)

Aqua360 said:


> Betta's typically inhabit shallow, wide expanses of water in the wild; i.e. entirely opposite to a vase.
> 
> You will notice a big, big difference between a Betta in a vase, and one given room to explore, that's not me being negative or anything, just honest truth through experience.
> 
> I've seen some awesome shallow ripariums style tanks for betta's, that make for superb centre pieces, they offer so much more in terms of design, ease of cleaning, and everything basically



Will have a look for some cheers mate thanks 


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