# How to count bubbles?



## Achilles1 (11 Dec 2015)

Just a simple question. I've seen people talking here about using 5 or even 6 bubbles per second. But, even with a bubble counter, how do you count them if they're appearing so fast? With one bps I can manage to count them. But I lose count if they go faster than that...


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## parotet (12 Dec 2015)

When it goes to fast I use the phone camera in slow motion mode, so I can count much better the bubbles. I only run small tanks but I'm not sure if you will ever need 6 bps and/or if at that bubble rate there is a difference between 5 or 6

Jordi


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## Cor (12 Dec 2015)

When you don't have a slow motion option on your phone: you must upload it to your PC
Use the VLC media player and select the tab 'decrease speed' a couple of times. The more you select this option, the more the speed is decreasing.


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## Andy Thurston (12 Dec 2015)

I don't even try to count bubbles, instead I use my bubble counter as a visual indication so I can see the flow getting faster or slower, there's no need to count them. Unless you have a small tank most bubble rates would be uncountable anyway.


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## paulharris (12 Dec 2015)

How many bubbles per second are required for a 680 litre tanks?


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## Andy Thurston (12 Dec 2015)

paulharris said:


> How many bubbles per second are required for a 680 litre tanks?


Definitely uncountable


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## ahjoe0digi (12 Dec 2015)

my 60litre tank one bubble per second 





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## xim (12 Dec 2015)

paulharris said:


> How many bubbles per second are required for a 680 litre tanks?



I really wish it was that easy. But...

By which bubble counter? Because different bubble counters have different bubble sizes.

At what pressure? Because CO2 is very compressible gas. The same size of bubbles between different systems doesn't mean they deliver the same amount of CO2.


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## xim (12 Dec 2015)

Achilles1 said:


> Just a simple question. I've seen people talking here about using 5 or even 6 bubbles per second. But, even with a bubble counter, how do you count them if they're appearing so fast? With one bps I can manage to count them. But I lose count if they go faster than that...
> 
> 
> Verzonden vanaf mijn iPhone met behulp van Tapatalk



You can make it easier by getting a type of bubble counter that has the opening facing downward, then modify the opening to make it larger. This way, the bubbles will be larger and you can use a slower/countable bubble rate.

I make my own bubble counter using a soda bottle and standard airline tubes. My 1 BPS = 2.18 BPS of some bubble counter. I can make the bubbles even bigger by connecting a larger tube to the opening.


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## paulharris (12 Dec 2015)

xim said:


> I really wish it was that easy. But...
> 
> By which bubble counter? Because different bubble counters have different bubble sizes.
> 
> At what pressure? Because CO2 is very compressible gas. The same size of bubbles between different systems doesn't mean they deliver the same amount of CO2.



I thought you might say that, I have a bubble counter which produces many small bubbles but I can see fewer larger bubbles going through the reactor. The pH is 7 and KH 4 which is just about enough CO2? I have never been able to get the checker beyond mid green. Do I need more CO2? Attached pic of my tank


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## parotet (13 Dec 2015)

IME a bubble counter is a rough visual guide of the amount of co2 delivered to the tank. Once you have enough experience with different layouts in the same tank, using the same kind of water, light, etc. you pay less attention. I used to measure every few months my pH profile to adjust the bubbles, and now with 2 new setups I have not done it... And they are running for 6 months now. 
For me bubble counters are a way to have a fast assessment of basic things such as: there is enough co2 in the cylinder, it looks like the bubble rate is as it usually is, if I've been away for a few days I can see that everything is ok... This is why I have my bubbles counters always outside the cabinet. I can see them when I come home, when I'm on the coach, etc.
Unfortunately the co2 performance does not depend only on the bubbles per second, but on a few more things. Only working on each of them and keeping C enriched tanks will give enough experience.

Jordi


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## ahjoe0digi (13 Dec 2015)

parotet said:


> IME a bubble counter is a rough visual guide of the amount of co2 delivered to the tank. Once you have enough experience with different layouts in the same tank, using the same kind of water, light, etc. you pay less attention. I used to measure every few months my pH profile to adjust the bubbles, and now with 2 new setups I have not done it... And they are running for 6 months now.
> For me bubble counters are a way to have a fast assessment of basic things such as: there is enough co2 in the cylinder, it looks like the bubble rate is as it usually is, if I've been away for a few days I can see that everything is ok... This is why I have my bubbles counters always outside the cabinet. I can see them when I come home, when I'm on the coach, etc.
> Unfortunately the co2 performance does not depend only on the bubbles per second, but on a few more things. Only working on each of them and keeping C enriched tanks will give enough experience.
> 
> Jordi


yup, basic varibles that effect carbon dioxide。

Plant density effect the uptake rate
Temperature effect the solubility.
atomizer effect the surface area/volume ratio of bubble
water flow effect distribution in tank.
and many more i think.




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## James O (13 Dec 2015)

ahjoe0digi said:


> yup, basic varibles that effect carbon dioxide。
> 
> Plant density effect the uptake rate
> Temperature effect the solubility.
> ...



Drop checker?


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## zozo (13 Dec 2015)

KH4 and PH 7 is according the charts at the low side. But if you're happy with the plants, how they look and grow than it's enough. We have a member MarcelG he states never to go ever 15ppm if i'm correct with Co2 and grows plants like verybody else. And thats half the recomeded value.  I'n you're pic i can't say it looks bad, niice tank nice plant growth.


paulharris said:


> The pH is 7 and KH 4 which is just about enough CO2?



If i remeber correctly MargelG never goes over 15ppm with Co2 and he doesn't complain.. So its rather contradictive to say something conclusive with to little info.. Look at your plants and when happy, why change a thing?? If not happy find out why, co2 could be and probably the most obvious first answer you'll get with these parameters. I guess.

Me too i'm at  4dKh and tried everything from 7 to 6.4 and in between i setlled at the 6.4 as best results for my setup. I guess the lights above will play a role as well as fert regime and plant sp.

Sorry i guess a lot..


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## Andy Thurston (14 Dec 2015)

zozo said:


> Me too i'm at 4dKh and tried everything from 7 to 6.4


Me too but I guess I was pushing the limits heres my ph profile when i had 4kh water. this worked best for me 
1200 ph 7.3 blue
1400 Co2 on ph 7.3 blue
1800 Lights on ph 5.9 blue/green
1900 ph 5.9 green
2000 ph 5.9 lime green
2100 co2 off ph 5.9 lime green
2200 ph 6.2 lime green
2300 ph 6.4 lime green
2330 lights off ph 6.5 green
0000 ph 6.7 green
0030 ph 6.8 green
0600 ph 7.4


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## paulharris (14 Dec 2015)

Thanks all. I guess ideally I should up the CO2 . The plants are OK but I struggle with some species. Recently I had a problem with a build up of algae like stuff on the side of leaves which faced the flow, Blue green algae? On testing I found I had quite high nitrates so I have reduced the ferts. I also reduced the lighting period and the problem has decreased.


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