# Which fish in hard water?



## zalun (4 Mar 2009)

Hi

I have pretty hard water in the tap (GH 300, KH 200), and it seems to grow a little (320/190) in the currently fishless aquarium. PH in the tap is 8.0 and in the aquarium changes from 7.5 to 8.0

I wanted to have 6 or 7 angelfishes, but it seems I'd have to change the water parameters to make them happy. Is there any other peaceful, not jumping fish which will like the parameters? Or should I not bother too much and go with angels?

Aquarium is 125l

Thanks


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## hellohefalump (4 Mar 2009)

rainbows like hard water, and they come in all sorts of colours and sizes.


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## zalun (5 Mar 2009)

It's endangered (http://www.iucnredlist.org/details/13058) but it was 10 years ago. From the other hand they do breed pretty easy ..., but according to http://www.fishkeeping.co.uk/modules/caresheets/caresheet.php?caresheetID=27 "Minimum Tank Volume: 240 litres, Minimum Tank Size: 4ft". Mine is too small.

I searched quite a lot for a main fish into hard water, but it came out - it's best to have cichlids...
I think I'll have to work on softening the water somehow. It would be great to have angelfish though.


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## hellohefalump (5 Mar 2009)

There are other types of rainbows that are smaller than bosmani.  'neon dwarf' and 'threadfin' spring to mind but I'm sure there are others.

Cichlids tend to eat plants (I'm assuming you're talking about Malawi and Tangenika (sp?) cichlids).


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## zalun (5 Mar 2009)

Yes I know the Africa cichlids are better with rocks instead of plants - that's why I'm thinking of softening the water somehow


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## hellohefalump (5 Mar 2009)

You could try stuff like putting peat in your filter, and using aquasoil.  Alternatively you could get an RO unit and mix the water half and half with your tap water.


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## gratts (5 Mar 2009)

Boesemani aren't overly endangered any more I don't think. Most stock you see in shops will be captive bred rather than wild caught. Your tank size is fine for a group - I now have 3 adults in my 96L and they're doing great - spawning regularly and always showing off. Managed to save some of the eggs from one spawn (not easy!) and now have 3 young uns growing rapidly with the adults. That 240L is a bit of tosh IMO!


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## Ed Seeley (5 Mar 2009)

hellohefalump said:
			
		

> Cichlids tend to eat plants (I'm assuming you're talking about Malawi and Tanganyikan cichlids).



This simply isn't true.  _Some_ cichlids eat plants but then so do lots of other fish.  There are some amazing pictures on APC of a guy's planted tank full of mbuna even which I would have thought would have treated a planted tank like an all-you-can-eat buffet!!!  Some cichlids will dig in the substrate, but most dwarf cichlids confine this to the area around their cave(s).  Every tank I have has cichlids in.

I think if you have clean, hard water and a big enough tank then you could have a large shoal of a Tanganyikan cichlid called _Cyprichromis leptosoma_.  The females are rather dull, but the mature males have electric blues, yellows and other colours depending on which morph you keep.  They are also open water shoaling mouthbreeders and will fill the centres of your tank.  Couple that with a pair of _Neolamprologus_, that will behave much like kribs or other dwarfs (and will need a cave or small pile of rocks), and you could have a really amazing hard-water Tanganyikan planted cichlid tank.


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## ceg4048 (5 Mar 2009)

While I agree with Ed, at the same time i always wonder what all the fuss is about with hard water. Once accustomed to it, the fish don't really have a problem with hard or alkaline water as long as the tank is kept clean and as long as one is not expecting them to breed. I see no reason at all to soften your water just to keep angels or tetras or even discus, really.

I post this image a lot as a typical example of a soft water fish in water conditions very similar to that described in the original post. Colors are fine, feeding and behavioral patterns are normal and this fish is completely unperturbed by the fact that it's living in high KH/GH water. This fish even bred in the same tank. Running a high tech tank is complicated enough without adding more restrictions than necessary. :idea: 






Cheers,


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## zalun (5 Mar 2009)

After I realised that I have so hard water in the tap I was a bit disappointed (good that I haven't checked it before deciding for a fishtank - I could resign). Thanks for the answers, they gave me some hope. 

I've read that angelfish as a softwater fish may accumulate the minerals in their organs and it will harm them in the long run. I want to avoid it so probably I'll try with Ed's suggestion. Mouth breeding looks great  Plants are fine - new leaves, the system is cycling. I hope it will finish soon and next weekend (14th) I'd be able to add some cleaning staff animals. Again - will ottos and some shrimps be fine in such chemical conditions or should I go with corys only? What algae eaters then...

Last readings: 
PH: 7.5 (down from 8.0) / Tetra
NO2: 1.6 (same) / Nutrafin
NO3-: 25 (down from 50) / Tetra
KH: 180 (down from 190)  / Nutrafin
GH: 320 (down from 340) / Nutrafin

NO2 and NO3 is a spike after adding ammonia.

I think for the main fish a look of the aquarium may help. There is place for the cave though...






Sorry for the low quality, it is just a "stage in the process" picture.


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## a1Matt (6 Mar 2009)

Ed Seeley said:
			
		

> ...a large shoal of a Tanganyikan cichlid called _Cyprichromis leptosoma_.  The females are rather dull, but the mature males have electric blues, yellows and other colours depending on which morph you keep.



I have seen these in one of my LFS and was captivated by them, truly beautiful fish.

Tank is looking nice by the way.


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## zalun (6 Mar 2009)

Any London shop with these species to look at before I'd decide? I liked the picturest on the web hough


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## Ed Seeley (6 Mar 2009)

I would imagine Wholesale Tropicals would have them.  Go on Tropical Fish Finder and do a search, you'll find some stockists there.


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## ricefish (8 Mar 2009)

nearly all the common livebearers like hard water  and love planted tanks


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## zalun (8 Mar 2009)

I know about livebearers loving the hard water. The problem is I'm not really into them... I had them when I was a child and it was fun, but (probably because of that) I feel they are like a toy - easy to . I liked the cichlids before as well (Malawi, Tanganika) and it was more interesting, but I want to have it planted, hence I listened to Ed's response very carefully.


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## zalun (10 Mar 2009)

I used peat (to prepare water which will be added to aquarium - not in the filter) - it's GW 220 ppm, KH 110, PH 7.0 - All before adding to the tank and certainly before adding CO2.

I think it will be good for angelfish.

I mean - the fish Ed advised to get are nice, but I think they belong to slightly different biotope, 
BTW - Maidenhead are selling Cyprichromis leptosoma for 29.90 (!) and Ed said I shall have a shoal ...

Thanks for all the answers.


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