# Can I does all EI in one go?



## All butter shortbread (21 Sep 2013)

Hello,

Just got my first batch of salts etc to start dosing Ei.

Problem is I'm going to uni, and don't want to leave someone to does specific things on specific days - so I was just wondering whether there was a problem with dosing everything in one go at the start of the week?

Only problem I can think of is I read somewhere on here that iron reacts with phosphates and then can't be used by plants (or something like that)? Is this only a problem with storing macros and micros together?

Thanks!


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## oldbloke (23 Sep 2013)

I'm no expert but I'm sure I have read that they need to be put on separately.


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## Yo-han (23 Sep 2013)

As you already said, iron and phosphate don't go well together. You can dose them on the same day (a minute apart is enough in my experience), but you can't mix them. So you always need at least two bottles, for example macro and micro, or phosphate and the rest if it pleases you.


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## All butter shortbread (24 Sep 2013)

Sweet, thanks. I've already added them so glad to hear I haven't screwed it up


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## foxfish (25 Sep 2013)

Do you mean to add one weeks supply in one go?


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## daizeUK (3 Oct 2013)

I was going to ask the same question.  Is there any reason (other than shock to livestock) why ferts can't be added once a week?


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## ceg4048 (4 Oct 2013)

There is no shock to livestock.

It is not generally a good idea to dose large amounts in one go followed by lack of dosing. The dynamics of nutrient uptake and usage are generally optimized around regular and cyclic dosing. This does not mean that it does not work however.

Cheers,


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## All butter shortbread (4 Oct 2013)

I see, well so far the plants don't seem to responding well at all (not growing and not looking particularly healthy) I've found someone who's willing to does once during the week but haven't decided whether to alternate between macro and micro (each once a week still) or does both at the same time twice a week?


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## ceg4048 (4 Oct 2013)

Well, this might not be a fault of your dosing program. There is a 95% probability that the problem is caused by poor CO2 and/or flow/distribution. You should always investigate that possibility first therefore.

Cheers,


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## All butter shortbread (4 Oct 2013)

Yeah, turnover is about 15X and CO2 read a constant bright green on drop checker. Also I have pretty much no algae problems. TBH i really have no idea why the plants aren't growing


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## ceg4048 (5 Oct 2013)

Well, maybe you need a constant bright yellow in that tank.
A bright green dropchecker is not an automatic pass to good CO2.
You should take a pH profile and see what's happening to the gas.
Review your distribution in order to determine if changes need to be made.

"Plants not doing well and not looking particularly healthy" is not usually a symptom of single dosing unless the single dosing is insufficient in the first place. If you suspect an Iron or PO4 deficiency then you need to look specifically for Iron shortage syndromes. Are new leaves yellow?Is there a general loss of color?

If PO4 shortage is suspected, then one must examine the tank for PO4 shortfall symptoms, such as GSA.

"Plants not doing well and not looking particularly healthy" must be more clearly defined for any deeper analysis. Photos would help tremendously.

So the dosing scheme may be a factor in a more general sense but we need to look at the details of the problem.

Cheers,


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## All butter shortbread (5 Oct 2013)

Thanks, Here are some pics:
When I first set up:




about 6 weeks later, was away or three weeks and most of the dying happened then. In the last couple weeks nothings really changed:



Looks like the Christmas moss is the only thing growing..
Close ups:



rotala died back to this and has pretty much stayed the same since starting ei about two weeks ago



I have a plant substrate below the sand as well as a good few root tabs so not sure why the eleocharis is doing so badly. I've never had much difficulty with it before


The diffuser is the only place where I can see much algae/ diatoms. I suppose I should probably give it a clean


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## ceg4048 (7 Oct 2013)

Yes, thank you for the additional data. The images confirm that it is a CO2 problem.

As always, the choice is yours, however, it is a really bad idea to run a CO2 injected tank remotely. CO2 is a very difficult skill to manage, and it's something that you need to be on top of constantly, especially if you're new at it.

If you are going to be M.I.A for a significant portion of the time, you would do well to convert the tank to a non-CO2 enriched, low light tank. That way you can leave the tank alone and it will just chug along. You wouldn't have to worry about dosing or maintenance or CO2.

If you want to keep this a carbon enriched tank then you'll need to use a much higher injection rate, possibly higher flow and probably less light. You also need to keep the ceramic disk spotlessly clean. I assume that's the diffuser disk on the lower left.

Did I mention that it's bad policy to be away from a CO2 tank for extended periods? If you raise the injection rate and fail to monitor, then you are in danger of killing your fish.

Cheers,


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## All butter shortbread (7 Oct 2013)

Thanks for all the advice,

Atm I see the tank every week to do water Atm I see the tank every week to do water changes etc. last time I raised CO2 was right before I took these photos, and I waited for a couple days to monitor the fish before I left. I assume if the people watching the tank know how to spot problems with the fish then this should be okay? They were fine when I left after 2 days with higher CO2 rate.

As for increasing the flow I'm not entirely sure how to do this. The filter I've got is rated at 1000 Litres per hour and it's only a 40 litre tank. Could it be that the impeller needs to be cleaned or something? I carefully clean the filter media every other week but the flow has dropped a lot since I got it.

Might the aquascape/ inlet & outlet positions be creating a bit of a dead spot? I could make a spray bar to run along the back of the tank instead if this would help. I also have a newave powerhead i could use but I would need to find a way to reduce the turnover on it as otherwise it might be a little too powerful for this size tank


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## ceg4048 (8 Oct 2013)

Hi,
	As time goes on filters media (the pores) get clogged with dirt. Because the internal pores get blocked it's very difficult to remove that type of blockage. This happens at a much faster rate if CO2 is injected. Also, you do not need to have the filter completely full of media. One of the advantages of sintered glass, activated carbon and other modern media is that they have a very high surface area per unit volume, so you don't need nearly as much media. Removing half of the media will ensure better flow.

There are a few things to try, including repositioning of the bar, most of which are discussed in the thread Melting Marsilea hirsuta & Staurogyne repens? | UK Aquatic Plant Society

Cheers,


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