# jbl proflora direct atomizer users



## Nigel95

Since a few days I am using the jbl proflora direct atomizer and I put the membrane before use 48 hours in water. So far I need more bps with my atomizer than I did before with my normal diffuser. I know the bubble counter is different but still the difference seems really big. Normally I needed 5-6 bps for a lime green drop checker now with my jbl proflora direct I have 8 bps and still having problems getting the drop checker lime green. The bubbles in tank don't seem really big so I have really no clue whats happening.I am using 2 bar which should be enough for this atomizer.

Any users did experience problems in the first weeks of using the jbl proflora direct?

I run an eheim skim 350 1 hour on/off could this be off gassing a lot of co2? So far I have read it doesn't but maybe other opinions about that.


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## Deansie

Hi Nigel, I've recently started using this instead of a bazooka, it definitely takes a few days to settle and my bubble count is a bit higher. I was a bit unsure initlly but it's a good product. Be sure to up your bubbles slow if your tank is stocked because mine went from blue/green to yellow quickly. I'm plant only at the minute so was not an issue.
There has beien a previous thread about it's use here.
I doubt your skimmer is the issue, only skims the surface.


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## Nigel95

Deansie said:


> Hi Nigel, I've recently started using this instead of a bazooka, it definitely takes a few days to settle and my bubble count is a bit higher. I was a bit unsure initlly but it's a good product. Be sure to up your bubbles slow if your tank is stocked because mine went from blue/green to yellow quickly. I'm plant only at the minute so was not an issue.
> There has beien a previous thread about it's use here.
> I doubt your skimmer is the issue, only skims the surface.



Is your bps 8+ in an ada 45p?


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## Deansie

I just counted my bubble count on my 45p and it's 12 bubbles over 10 seconds.
What are you at over 10 seconds? 
I'm assuming your count wasn't over a minute


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## Nigel95

Deansie said:


> I just counted my bubble count on my 45p and it's 12 bubbles over 10 seconds.
> What are you at?



8 bubbles per Second. So 80 per 10 seconds. This doesn't feel right… Did you experience at the start that you needed more bps to get the drop checker lime green? 


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## Zeus.

On my 500l tank with twin JBL inline atomisers the BBS is so fast you cant count it. Will do a little vid.

The bubbles are bigger but I have mine fitted to two  APS filter boosters with bio Balls DIY reactors and not a bubble in sight


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## Nigel95

Zeus. said:


> On my 500l tank with twin JBL inline atomisers the BBS is so fast you cant count it. Will do a little vid.
> 
> The bubbles are bigger but I have mine fitted to two  APS filter boosters with bio Balls DIY reactors and not a bubble in sight
> 
> View attachment 109946



I see tons of Tiny bubbles in my tank. But I only have a 128l tank so the system seems broken with such a high bps and barely lime green drop checker at the end of my photoperiod. 




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## Deansie

If you equate my 45 tank to your 128l your round about double my bubble rate, not massively excessive is it?
What I do notice with this diffuser is bubbles seem to rest just under the surface, never seen the like with in tank diffuser.


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## Nigel95

Deansie said:


> If you equate my 45 tank to your 128l your round about double my bubble rate, not massively excessive is it?
> What I do notice with this diffuser is bubbles seem to rest just under the surface, never seen the like with in tank diffuser.



Hmm I thought this atomizers were really efficient in co2 usage. Your right the bubbles seem to chill at the surface. 


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## Gonçalo Silva

Something is wrong with that... In my 90x45x45 I had 3 bobbles and drop was lime green. If I use 4 bobbles will turn yellow.
You sure your drop is right?


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## Nigel95

Gonçalo Silva said:


> Something is wrong with that... In my 90x45x45 I had 3 bobbles and drop was lime green. If I use 4 bobbles will turn yellow.
> You sure your drop is right?



Yeah I refreshed the liquid in drop check and still same.… what the heck could be wrong. I have no idea. 

Did your jbl did fine from day 1?


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## Zeus.

I had to return the first as it leaked, the second also leaked so I sealed the leaky seal with cement , the third had a different seal and was fine. Worked fine pretty quick with a presoak 24-36 hours. I would turn the skimmer off during CO2 period. Also the JBL lowers the pH faster than the UP inline atomisers that I have and lower working pressure too, that my explain why you need a higher BBS with the JBL IMO,  so if it does have a lower internal pressure the bubbles will be less compressed.
The BBS is only a indication of the flow rate and helps fine adjustment I wouldn't advise comparing the BBS rate of one atomiser with another. Weighing the Gas bottles over time is a more reliable way to the actual gas used. Read somewhere that to use CO2 to its full advantage we should think the CO2 is free - only then will we use it to its full advantage, I have to agree


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## Gonçalo Silva

Nigel95 said:


> Yeah I refreshed the liquid in drop check and still same.… what the heck could be wrong. I have no idea.
> 
> Did your jbl did fine from day 1?
> 
> 
> Verzonden vanaf mijn iPhone met Tapatalk



I think so, i dont remember. If you can try do reduce the pressure to 1bar. And do a test, maybe theres a leek. Spray some dishwash detergent with water on it and see if you get bobbles. Maybe the co2 is leeking by the chamber. 

Atm I have this running and I must say that it has the smaller bobbles of all difusers I had (doaqua, jbl proflora direct, neo). Works perfectly and by a fraction of the price (11.78€ at my doorstep).



 

Link: http://www.ebay.com/itm/12mm-16mm-A...var=485208361656&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649


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## Zeus.

Another way to know if the JBL is leaking is does it fill with water during non CO2 period. Both mine do, esp if on the return line from the filter/pump. If it leaks water to seal is no good OFC. Did have it on the inlet to the filter then it was drawing air and getting bubbles in the return tubing and the JBL chambers had no water in them.

But testing with soap water during CO2 injection is always a good idea IMO


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## Nigel95

Zeus. said:


> Another way to know if the JBL is leaking is does it fill with water during non CO2 period. Both mine do, esp if on the return line from the filter/pump. If it leaks water to seal is no good OFC. Did have it on the inlet to the filter then it was drawing air and getting bubbles in the return tubing and the JBL chambers had no water in them.
> 
> But testing with soap water during CO2 injection is always a good idea IMO



What chamber do you mean exactly. Above the bubble counter? How much bar do you run it ? 


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## Zeus.

It all fills with water when no CO2 is on, about 50PSI for my input rate.


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## Nigel95

Zeus. said:


> It all fills with water when no CO2 is on, about 50PSI for my input rate.



Mine is running at ~30 psi. Will check with soap soon. 


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## Nigel95

No leaks hmm....


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## Zeus.

Had to increase the PSI on mine to get enough CO2 in one of my needle valves is fully opened - but bigger bubbles OFC - hence the reactors


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## Deansie

I have no clue what yous are talking about lol


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## ian_m

Deansie said:


> I have no clue what yous are talking about lol



See Zeus's post of use of reactors to remove the fine CO2 bubbles.
https://www.ukaps.org/forum/threads...-co2-reactors-fitted.43046/page-5#post-496893


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## Deansie

Thanks!


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## 4trykkeren

Zeus. said:


> It all fills with water when no CO2 is on, about 50PSI for my input rate.


I found out that the bottom chamber has a design fault and needs to be fitted with an extra seal to make a tight connection.If you do this.then this inline diffuser will produce tiny bubbles like a CHAMP .the cheramic champer must NOT fill with water when co2 is off!

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## Diddymen

4trykkeren said:


> I found out that the bottom chamber has a design fault and needs to be fitted with an extra seal to make a tight connection.If you do this.then this inline diffuser will produce tiny bubbles like a CHAMP .the cheramic champer must NOT fill with water when co2 is off!
> 
> Sendt fra min EVA-L09 med Tapatalk



can you elaborate? which seal do you need extra, do you have any pics?


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## 4trykkeren

Diddymen said:


> can you elaborate? which seal do you need extra, do you have any pics?


I brought an extra ceramic and used one of the two seals it came with.you have to twist the top cap real hard/tight

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## aquacoen

I'm currently testing the Proflora 12/16 and placed the extra sealing ring. It diffuses the CO2 very well. 
But when I turn the CO2 off over night, the CO2 tube underneath the Proflora fills up with water.
When I turn on the CO2 again it pushes out the water and starts diffusing the CO2 again..
I use an extra check valve so it's not very harmful I think? Should I adjust something?

(on the JBL website they suggest soaking the ceramic in water for 24h first.. I didn't do that but it's running for two days now..)
(I filled up the bubble counter with water in the beginning but now it's completely filled, is this normal?)


!! I just realize that my Proflora is at the same height as my CO2 output.. should I place it 20cm higher?


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## Franks

I’ve had one of these JBL pro flora for a while now and while it did a decent job of enfusing the water with co2, it did seem like there were lots of big bubbles coming out of the filter outlet. I’d see them popping at the surface so I knew there was gas being wasted. I found mine was also leaking so bought 140 washers from Toolstation for £2 and popped one in to take up the slack between the ceramic defuser. The result is much, much better as I’m now getting tiny bubbles and no popping at the surface! I’ll need to keep an eye on the drop as I’m sure I’ve just improved efficiency by a good amount. 

Not to mention I also cleaned my filter and pipe work and while there found the impeller was filthy. I cleaned it and then realised the open/close valve was faulty too so I used a screwdriver to open up the filter inlet fully and reinstalled. The result was about a 50% increase in flow! I think my SunSun canister has also been like this and I’ve just accepted it was a little weak. So glad I spotted it as I now have so much flow that I’ve removed my wave maker!

Quite a productive cleaning session


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## Zeus.

aquacoen said:


> I'm currently testing the Proflora 12/16 and placed the extra sealing ring. It diffuses the CO2 very well.
> But when I turn the CO2 off over night, the CO2 tube underneath the Proflora fills up with water.
> When I turn on the CO2 again it pushes out the water and starts diffusing the CO2 again..
> I use an extra check valve so it's not very harmful I think? Should I adjust something?
> 
> (on the JBL website they suggest soaking the ceramic in water for 24h first.. I didn't do that but it's running for two days now..)
> (I filled up the bubble counter with water in the beginning but now it's completely filled, is this normal?)
> 
> 
> !! I just realize that my Proflora is at the same height as my CO2 output.. should I place it 20cm higher?
> 
> View attachment 114609



The water in the pipe is the non return valve not working as it should, but you have another one fitted inline (as Zozo advises) so not an issue. Might be worth cleaning valve next cleaning but may just be faulty from new.

Get big bubbles from mine too, but running at 50psi and a very high injection rate. Having reactors sort of sorts the issue as no go to the tank.
I am planning doing reactor mods to my APS EF2 reactors which should help but only at the alpha planning stage ATM
The intail plan is a self contained Venturi system with the APS filter with a cone and hopefully a water spinning vortex. First job is to place a window in the APS EF2 so I can see what's happening to the bubbles. Got a spare APS EF2 ready for moding already.


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## Nigel95

Cleaning the membrane with a hose brush does miracles in making the mist finer..... And you could also bleach it.


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## Zeus.

Nigel95 said:


> Cleaning the membrane with a hose brush does miracles in making the mist finer..... And you could also bleach it.


Soaked mine in Citric acid then bleach and bottle brushed it still big bubbles, put it down to the high psi and injection rate I use.


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## Nigel95

Zeus. said:


> Soaked mine in Citric acid then bleach and bottle brushed it still big bubbles, put it down to the high psi and injection rate I use.



How old is it? Maybe time for new one?


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## Zeus.

Nigel95 said:


> How old is it? Maybe time for new one?



Thought they was getting a bit old so with using two JBL pro directs on one tank, I bought a new direct membrane soaked it fitted to one, then cleaned/soaked bleach etc the old membrane before changing the second one. No difference in bubble size.

Old vid of BPS rate


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## heavenkid

4trykkeren said:


> I found out that the bottom chamber has a design fault and needs to be fitted with an extra seal to make a tight connection.If you do this.then this inline diffuser will produce tiny bubbles like a CHAMP .the cheramic champer must NOT fill with water when co2 is off!
> 
> Sendt fra min EVA-L09 med Tapatalk



Hii, care to share where did u add the additional seal? I just bought the jbl direct and encountered its diffusing bigger bubbles compared to UP inline diffuser.

I saw other forums mentioned jbl diffuser cant produce the same mist like bubbles size like UP


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## heavenkid

I have attached the pic. Can advise add additional o ring to which position? 1 , 2 or 3?


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## Franks

I retro fitted additional o rings to 1 and 2. Essentially it doesn’t matter as these just compress the ceramic diffuser in the chamber so the gas can’t just take the easiest route which in the case of a standard off the shelf unit would be passing by the existing o rings at these positions. 

Mine is working great now and produces a misty look similar to that of using an in tank diffuser. Without the o rings added, large bubbles of gas are emitted so this proves most units are still shipping as faulty which isn’t really German quality imo. 


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## heavenkid

Franks said:


> I retro fitted additional o rings to 1 and 2. Essentially it doesn’t matter as these just compress the ceramic diffuser in the chamber so the gas can’t just take the easiest route which in the case of a standard off the shelf unit would be passing by the existing o rings at these positions.
> 
> Mine is working great now and produces a misty look similar to that of using an in tank diffuser. Without the o rings added, large bubbles of gas are emitted so this proves most units are still shipping as faulty which isn’t really German quality imo.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk



Thanks for your reply Franks. Will try add the o rings to 1 and 2 position to see whether can i get the misty look.


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## heavenkid

Franks said:


> I retro fitted additional o rings to 1 and 2. Essentially it doesn’t matter as these just compress the ceramic diffuser in the chamber so the gas can’t just take the easiest route which in the case of a standard off the shelf unit would be passing by the existing o rings at these positions.
> 
> Mine is working great now and produces a misty look similar to that of using an in tank diffuser. Without the o rings added, large bubbles of gas are emitted so this proves most units are still shipping as faulty which isn’t really German quality imo.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Hi franks, 

Just to confirm about retro fitting additional o ring to position 1 and 2 which u mentioned, are you refering to the seals for the ceramic diaphragm? How about the seal for housing lid? Did you add additional seal to it?

I realised that the o ring jbl using is flat liked washer type. Not those typical rounded o ring.


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## heavenkid

I manage to get some genetic flat rubber washer. Cut it to similar size and slice it coz its too thick.

Pop it in between the ceramic diffuser and test run it. Hmm, nw i can see micro bubbles being diffused out from my outlet. Guess its work. Bubbles are very tiny but still cant achieve those misty liked bubbles like from the UP inline diffuser. =)


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## Zeus.

heavenkid said:


> I manage to get some genetic flat rubber washer. Cut it to similar size and slice it coz its too thick.
> 
> Pop it in between the ceramic diffuser and test run it. Hmm, nw i can see micro bubbles being diffused out from my outlet. Guess its work. Bubbles are very tiny but still cant achieve those misty liked bubbles like from the UP inline diffuser. =)



Changing the bubble size/seal will affect the working pressure and the amount of CO2 used and uptake by the water. 
Doing a new pH profile or at least keep a close eye on the DC colour change to see if any change in the [CO2] would be wise  just to confirm your your tank is safe for livestock and [CO2] is enough.


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## Franks

Oh yeah certainly worth mentioning. You’ve effectively fixed an internal gas leak and made the diffuser more efficient so treat this modification as a new Co2 install and monitor hourly until dialled in.


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## Christopher Cook

Hi, I'm new to the whole CO2 thing so I'm not sure if this is a really simple issue or not. I've bought a JBL inline diffuser and it fills up with water when the CO2 is off, when it turns back on again the bubbles just don't come through unless I turn the CO2 on full blast, I've tried waiting for pressure to build for an hour or two, I've checked for leaks too. Could it be that my CO2 system just doesn't produce enough pressure? Any help would be greatly appreciated.


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## DutchMuch

do you have a check valve ?


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## Christopher Cook

Yes I have one connected between the JBL and the regulator. I've test to see if the check valve is stopping the CO2 by immersing it in a cup of water but it's not. Doesn't the JBL diffuser also have a check valve at its base? By regulator is the nano regulator from Co2 supermarket:

https://www.co2supermarket.co.uk/co2-regulators-nano-co2-regulators-gsc96.html

I have the pressure at 3... But I'm not sure what this means or does.


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## Christopher Cook

So I tried to leave it on for about three hours to see if the pressure could build up enough to force through the CO2, still nothing so I tried again to see if there were any leaks, and I found one on the return valve! So it's working now. I have noticed as mentioned by others that the bubbles aren't that small but imI happy for now that at least it's working.


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## Lofoaquascape

Franks said:


> I’ve had one of these JBL pro flora for a while now and while it did a decent job of enfusing the water with co2, it did seem like there were lots of big bubbles coming out of the filter outlet. I’d see them popping at the surface so I knew there was gas being wasted. I found mine was also leaking so bought 140 washers from Toolstation for £2 and popped one in to take up the slack between the ceramic defuser. The result is much, much better as I’m now getting tiny bubbles and no popping at the surface! I’ll need to keep an eye on the drop as I’m sure I’ve just improved efficiency by a good amount.
> 
> Not to mention I also cleaned my filter and pipe work and while there found the impeller was filthy. I cleaned it and then realised the open/close valve was faulty too so I used a screwdriver to open up the filter inlet fully and reinstalled. The result was about a 50% increase in flow! I think my SunSun canister has also been like this and I’ve just accepted it was a little weak. So glad I spotted it as I now have so much flow that I’ve removed my wave maker!
> 
> Quite a productive cleaning session


Hi Frank could you please share the size and type of the washers?thanks


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## Nikola

I see that this is an old topic,
Wanted to share my solution with this atomizer, just finished my struggle with it.

I have glued ceramic to the rubber seals with a super glue.
Don’t know why JBL didn’t glue this parts really, because ceramic is porous and u cannot just put the rubber on it and job done. Look bazooka intank atomizer for example, similar method.

Mine is now working perfect, fine mist in aquarium instead off those bubbles which just didn’t serve the purpose. 


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## Bent17

Old post revival!

So I have the JBL inline diffuser.. As mentioned above when the co2 goes on bubbles are either non existant or like one per minute.. What I end up doing is releasing a bit the white screw of the co2 pipe going into the diffuser. As soon as I open it a bit then the valve opens and millions of bubbles pass through.. I dont know if its damaged or its something that can be fixed. If not then Ill go buy a new one.. Any one who had this issue?


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## Bent17

heavenkid said:


> I have attached the pic. Can advise add additional o ring to which position? 1 , 2 or 3?


Have you managed to do this? I tried to add a second O ring and it doesnt close. If you managed do you have the thickness of the ring?


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## Bent17

4trykkeren said:


> I found out that the bottom chamber has a design fault and needs to be fitted with an extra seal to make a tight connection.If you do this.then this inline diffuser will produce tiny bubbles like a CHAMP .the cheramic champer must NOT fill with water when co2 is off!
> 
> Sendt fra min EVA-L09 med Tapatalk


Hi there so you added a seal on both ends? I did do yest and then the screw cap didnt close.. Do you have the size of the new O rings? Did you add an extra one on each side or just got a thicker one?


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## Nelson Marto

HI,

I have also a proflora direct 16/22. And 6 months later I figure how to have a good mist, and is just add an extra o-ring on bottom of the atomizer.
Before I had big bubbles coming out from outlet flow.
Water returning back, mine return a little bit  (4cm of air pipe) but after that I have 2 check valves, so no problem with that.

PS: With the extra o-ring on bottom of the atomizer produce a very fine CO2 mist, I didn't believe it was possible with this one, I was planning to buy another one. 

Regards


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## Vicky_29

Nikola said:


> I see that this is an old topic,
> Wanted to share my solution with this atomizer, just finished my struggle with it.
> 
> I have glued ceramic to the rubber seals with a super glue.
> Don’t know why JBL didn’t glue this parts really, because ceramic is porous and u cannot just put the rubber on it and job done. Look bazooka intank atomizer for example, similar method.
> 
> Mine is now working perfect, fine mist in aquarium instead off those bubbles which just didn’t serve the purpose.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Thanks for the tip Nikola, gluing the ceramic to the O- rings worked like a charm for me. Now I am able to get a good CO2 mist throughout my tank and the big bubbles had gone off completely.


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## Nikola

I'm glad that it helped you, I'm still using it with no problems at all 
Cheers 

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## Franks

I went one better and now use mine with an All Pond Solutions prefilter. Im running the outlet of my SunSun canister with inline Co2 atomiser to the top entrance so that the Co2 naturally rises against the flow. It's half filled with bio balls and a fine sponge before the bottom outflow. I get practically zero Co2 bubbles from my spray bar. The plants pearl like mad but I've not adjusted for the efficiency gain. Livestock seem fine so win/win. 4bps on the JBL counter on a 155L cube


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