# Garden Soil



## HustleRussell (8 Mar 2021)

Good evening all, first post here!

Inspired by YouTube videos, I’m having a crack at a low tech planted bowl.

I’m I think the soil in my area should be quite suitable and I fancy the idea of it so I’m approaching it as a bit of an experiment (but one which I hope will have a reasonable chance of success).

I am going to cap it with Tropica soil powder. I realise this is designed to be a stand-alone substrate but what I am hoping is that garden soil used in moderation will make my bowl nutrient rich from the start and will reduce the emphasis on supplementary fertilisation (which I want to reduce as far as possible).

I have washed a batch of topsoil in aquarium water, screening out large organics, and left the soil out to ‘dry’. Originally this was stage 1 of the ‘mineralisation’ process which I read on Aquarium Plant Central, but UK March weather is not conducive to several cycles of wetting and drying so I am thinking of leaving it at that- more of a ‘clean’ and ‘coarse screen’.

My query is that the resulting mud, before drying, was a silty slurry with a very close texture, and while plant roots will probably love it, I am concerned that;
-without organics or a ‘filler’ material it may be too close for the circulation of metabolic products
and
-the tiny particle size may make excessive clouding a big problem despite a 20-30mm cap?

I will set up a journal to show everybody how I get on but before I actually put it together I’d like to welcome opinions on the above?

cheers


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## PARAGUAY (8 Mar 2021)

Why not cap with fine gravel


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## HustleRussell (8 Mar 2021)

To be honest I just liked the colour and grain size and thought the plants might benefit in some way compared to inert even if it is diminishing returns. The cost isn’t that big a deal when you’ve only got a square foot to think about!


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## alto (9 Mar 2021)

HustleRussell said:


> but UK March weather is not conducive to several cycles of wetting and drying so I am thinking of leaving it at that


You just need to follow @Tim Harrison method of oven drying 

I suspect you’ll want a cap layer of minimum 3-4cm to limit clouding should you disturb the substrate layers (but then this is easily cleared with a series of water changes, so 2-3cm is also fine)

To improve “circulation” within that garden soil layer, you can add peat or sand etc


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## HustleRussell (9 Mar 2021)

Thanks. It’s going to rain tomorrow so I think it will get finished off in the oven!

I am influenced by the MDaquatics channel on YouTube where the guy advocates a couple of handfuls of soil rather than a 1/2” - 1” layer as recommended by ms. Walstad. 

I have noticed other people who have attempted bowls saying that they used ‘too much soil’ but unfortunately they don’t explain what that is euphemistic of. Not enough cap? Excessive anaerobic bacteria activity in the soil level? Excessive nutrients in the water column? 

I think you’re onto something with mixing in some inert to make the improve the texture and make the small amount of soil go further. Coincidentally, after starting this thread, I saw MDaquatics’ latest video in which he recommends a mix of three equal parts soil / sand / gravel. I am now leaning towards this.

A bulked out soil layer plus a cap of 4cm rather than 3cm is actually good news for me as due to the bowl shape this will increase my available area for planting


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## HustleRussell (9 Mar 2021)

I have just noticed that there is a lot of discussion on bowls in the EI natural / low tech sub-forum. That’s my morning sorted.

I would still love to hear any more pointers on my substrate before I start setting the thing up towards the end of the week.


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## Tim Harrison (9 Mar 2021)

Maybe you'd want to reconsider using Tropica AS as a cap. It's comparatively light and will disturb easily. If you're not very careful you could end up with a muddy puddle. Better to use it on its own.

I wouldn't necessarily advocate using your garden soil either. Not saying it won't work but why take the risk when there are tried and tested composts on the market. What you need is a soil that has good structure (relatively high organic matter) so it'll stay put and offer a revolving nutrient fund, but will not release excess ammonia. I tend to use a 1:1 mix of aquatic compost and moss peat.

Alternatively mix your garden soil with moss peat. 1 - 2 cms in the bottom of your bowl should be fine but I would cap with coarse sand or fine gravel. If you're still worried about disturbance use a gravel tidy as a membrane between the two layers. More info below...









						The Soil Substrate or Dirted Planted Tank - A How to Guide
					

The Soil Substrate Planted Tank - a How to Guide...  ...or Zen and an Introduction to the Art of Underwater Gardening with Soil or Dirt... ...or The Hybrid-Energy Approach.  Introduction In writing this I hope to illustrate that using soil substrate offers a range of possibilities and that it's...



					www.ukaps.org


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## ScareCrow (9 Mar 2021)

You could add some growmore fertiliser and cat litter to the mix to improve the structure, increase the cation exchange capacity and increase longevity of the substrate.


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## HustleRussell (9 Mar 2021)

Thanks for the input both.

Tim, I had actually read your thread along with many others but there are such a range of approaches...

I was a bit worried that the Tropica powder may be too light. I think I may now reconsider. I’ve bought 9L of the stuff but I don’t want to get this wrong. 

I will look for a dark, natural coloured coarse sand or micro gravel. I have had silver sand before and didn’t like it that much. 

I am pretty wedded to the idea of using my garden soil in some way. I just like the idea. My garden has had no fertilisers or pesticides in 14 years and the soil in my area is loamy, slightly acid and base rich. I do have some aquatic compost of exactly the type shown in your thread.

I am now thinking about mixing a cocktail for my nutrient layer, probably comprising garden soil, peat moss and maybe some kind of granular material to bulk it out.

Cat litter seemed such a strange idea when I first read it, but... maybe?

I will think about adding aquatic compost too, but being low tech I had initially ruled it out since it’s so nutrient rich?


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## HustleRussell (9 Mar 2021)

If I was feeling flush I could use the Tropica soil powder mixed into my nutrient layer instead of cat litter? Seems that it may be quite hard to find a suitable cat litter now the Tesco one has been discontinued? 

Could probably punt the rest of the Tropica soil on eBay by the litre to recoup some money


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## ScareCrow (9 Mar 2021)

HustleRussell said:


> Tesco one has been discontinued


Oh has it, that's really annoying. I'll have to hold on to what I have left! There were a few threads about using akadama, which is the same thing just in a larger size.


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## HustleRussell (9 Mar 2021)

I’ve not been to the shops myself but I read that it was NLA here. 

The Tropica soil powder must have CEC?


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## aec34 (9 Mar 2021)

HustleRussell said:


> will look for a dark, natural coloured coarse sand or micro gravel. I have had silver sand before and didn’t like it that much.


I bought a kilo of natural shrimp gravel off eBay for about £7 which did the job a treat for my low tech bowl. I’ve also used some larger grain building-type gravel which was lying around - which works, but with not much substrate under it somehow it’s harder to plant into.


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## HustleRussell (9 Mar 2021)

A fine soil drying day!


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## HustleRussell (9 Mar 2021)

aec34 said:


> I bought a kilo of natural shrimp gravel off eBay for about £7 which did the job a treat for my low tech bowl. I’ve also used some larger grain building-type gravel which was lying around - which works, but with not much substrate under it somehow it’s harder to plant into.



I ordered some Unipac sand this morning. So long as it’s dark coloured and coarser than silver sand I’ll be happy

now what to do with 9L of Tropica soil powder...


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## GHNelson (9 Mar 2021)

HustleRussell said:


> now what to do with 9L of Tropica soil powder...


Keep it....prices are increasing year by year!


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## Mr.Shenanagins (9 Mar 2021)

GHNelson said:


> Keep it....prices are increasing year by year!


Seriously. We may start to see more and more soil based substrates as a result. Not a bad thing, just requires more effort on the aquarists part. This hobby is just getting too expensive for the average aquarist and “dirt” should not be one of your more expensive items.


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## HustleRussell (10 Mar 2021)

Could anyone advise on mixing the Tropica soil into my garden soil mix in place of gravel / cat litter? Is it good for this purpose or would this be actually counter-productive?


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## PARAGUAY (10 Mar 2021)

I would probably keep it reserve for later but wouldnt be counterproductive IMO to mix it Prices for lighting ,soil anything aquatic as said are going in one direction and will balancing of the economy yet to arrive?


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## Franks (16 Mar 2021)

Tesco kitty litter is still widely available in the North West, I recently did my 155L cube in the stuff. Took 3 bags and cost me £12. It did smell like a room full of over 70's blokes on the kop down the local social club (Brut anyone?) but after 3-4 days with the canister filter running, the smell disappears. It is light though - If I could do it again, I'd use something else, perhaps Manado as the smaller grain size and much deeper red looks nicer imo.


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