# Soil for low tech?



## Aristotelis (31 Mar 2015)

Hello, another soil question. 
I'm aware there are different threads about soil but there are some points that are not clear to me so I hope I'm not altering the forum order by making a new thread for it.

I'm starting to prepare for a 100x60x35height low tech tank. Although limited in the amount of space I have, I'm trying to make a tank with "lot's of surface" to help gas exchange, as I understand this is a good thing to have in any aquarium and especially in low tech ones.

I'm aware that many use "normal" garden soil for their low tech tanks. Where I live though we do not have the same soil names so I'm a bit hesitant on what to choose. I'd like to ask if I can use a proper aquarium fertilized soil, like ada, JBL, Oliver-knott and similar. Do you have any preferences about those in low tech? 

Can I use a fertilizing soil without making different levels? I mean just one soil for all the aquarium. Should I better use some kind of bigger granulometry at the bottom and then the fertilized soil on top? Again I'm aware of the "traditional" method but I have also seen members of this forum going with just the normal ADA aquasoil for the whole tank, so that's why I'm asking.

Can I use lot's of soil to create a big slope in a low tech tank, or this is a "dangerous" situation because of anaerobic zones in the soil? The tank will be "only" 35cm height. 

Thank you in advance for any help, I appreciate it. Sorry if all of this is already answered and wasn't able to find it.


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## faizal (1 Apr 2015)

Hi Aristotelis,,,. Welcome to the forum mate. I  think if you are planning on using proper aquarium soils ...my first choice would be aquasoil amazonia by ADA. It is supposed to have lots of peat in it and it is pretty hard to crumble ...so you don't really have to worry about your anaerobic zones in the soil...plus you can use it as a single substrate without making different levels.

I would plant straight away and fill up the tank with water and run it with a filter. I will do a 90% large water change everyday AFTER lights out for the first 3-5 days. Then i would do about 20-25% small water changes during lights ON time EVERY OTHER DAY for the first one month and then 20% water change twice a week from then on. I would not dose any nutrients during the first month at least because i would suspect the water column might be totally enriched with diluted nutrients anyways from the aqua soil..

You can actually use any kind of soil based premium aquarium substrates that you have mentioned above,...i chose ADA for its nutrient packed composition. A bit of caution if you choose JBL aqua basis plus because i feel you might need to put a "garden tidy" (a plastic mesh) over it and then layer with another layer of inert or sandy type of substrate because i fear it might cloud the water if you use it straight. I am sure you have checked out Troi's topic thread in the tutorials section. You can see the picture of the garden tidy there.

Have a good one.


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## faizal (1 Apr 2015)

I think you can use lots of soil for your tank since its not that tall anyways....


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## EnderUK (1 Apr 2015)

You don't need a name soil. Just get topsoil and sieve out all the large pieces or not. Put down a 5mm-10mm layer of soil and then cap with 10-20mm of sand. Keep it simple, keep it cheap.
You can use whatever you want, I enjoyed a dirted tank, it does work but to messy for me. Now both my low techs have silver or course sand with some broken up cheap fert tabs spread on the bottom to fertilise until general fish waste kicks in and have noticed no difference.


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## Aristotelis (1 Apr 2015)

Thank you guys for your fast replies.
One specific question on the water changes when I start the tank. Can I use the hard tap water for the first month or so and then (slowly of course) move on to the osmosis water?


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## faizal (2 Apr 2015)

Hey....i dont think you need to switch to to osmosis at all....i just use regular tap water....you can use a bit of peat moss in a filter media bag and just place it into your filter if you want to soften the water.


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## sciencefiction (2 Apr 2015)

Aristotelis said:


> I'd like to ask if I can use a proper aquarium fertilized soil, like ada, JBL, Oliver-knott and similar.


 
You can. However, these are not exactly soil as in your garden. They are made up of clay particles induced with nutrients, so although it may look like soil, it's not soil. From that list, I would avoid the JBL kind. I've tried it and it's not good at all, not compared to cheap real soil.

I use normal cheap soil. It's a bit of a messy job but it would be a good idea to soak it, let is settle for a day or two, discard all the unsettled dirty water and floating particles and like that several times until what's left settles pretty fast and there are no floating bits. This will ensure the soil won't cloud the water much after it's disturbed in the tank and that even if it did, the particles will settle back fast.
There are some soils that contain particles that never really settle fast. You can make a test with a small amount of soil in a jar and see how fast it settles. The same will apply to your tank afterwards.




Aristotelis said:


> Should I better use some kind of bigger granulometry at the bottom and then the fertilized soil on top?


 
Some people mix the soil with a bit of larger particles like gravel or akadama clay. However, larger particles tend to find their way out and settle on top of the smaller particles.
I don't mix the soil with any large particles. I mix it with a bit powdered red clay which just provides more nutrients to the soil and some more nutrient retaining abilities, the clay being max 5-10% of the soil itself. Then I cap the soil with substrate of my choice.  It's best if the cap used it's not as fine as play sand. But not as large as big gravel. Anything of the sort of 1-2mm size of the particles of the cap would be suitable.  This will allow the soil to "breath" through the cap but not escape and cloud the water. And in turn oxygen and organics will reach the soil where they will be broken down and release CO2 and nutrient to the plants.
The maximum thickness of the soil beneath the cap recommended is 1.5 inch. More soil will not give more nutrient reserves but more trouble as you don't want the soil to become anoxic.  A thinner layer of soil of 1.5 inch max with a similar size cap will ensure the soil is re-fertilized naturally from fish waste and oxygen reaches the soil to break up that waste, but the soil stays intact and away from the water column. I used less than an inch of soil in my tanks and about an inch cap. I wouldn't slope using soil as it will inevitably become de-oxygenated in those areas.

The bacteria in the soil that breaks up organics and produces CO2 needs oxygen to do that. When there's no oxygen, other bacteria takes up the role of breaking down organics, but they don't produce CO2, they produce harmful substances instead which have no use in the tank and can harm plants and fish too.


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## sciencefiction (2 Apr 2015)

Aristotelis said:


> Thank you guys for your fast replies.
> One specific question on the water changes when I start the tank. Can I use the hard tap water for the first month or so and then (slowly of course) move on to the osmosis water?



Why do you want to use osmosis water? When using real soil you'll get better results using hard water and it's actually recommended.  You need the higher GH for natural magnesium and calcium for the plants as people normally don't dose these in a low tech(presuming it will be a low tech) and Kh to keep the nitrification going fast. I personally wouldn't bother with osmosis water unless your tap water is extremely hard and you want to soften it a bit.
In time in a soil tank the water becomes more and more acidic. You may notice the Kh drops quite fast if you don't do water changes. When the Kh drops, eventually the Ph drops. And you don't want the ph to plummet fast as it will affect nitrification, and affect the fish health too indirectly as they prefer it more stable.
Gh tests normally show the Gh increasing in time in low tech tanks with little water changes,  but they can't be relied upon because they measure total GH and not "unused one" and used one which actually has taken a different form unsuitable for plants and fish anymore, as it reacts with other chemicals in the tank as well.  So the water does not get harder though your GH test will measure in time higher Gh levels. On the contrary, it gets more acidic.

Unless you are intending to keep extreme species that can't live in moderate water, there's absolutely no need to bother with RO water and make your life and the fish's complicated.


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## Aristotelis (2 Apr 2015)

Well I live close to marble excavations and our water has out of the tap a GH of over 35, sometimes over 40...


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## sciencefiction (2 Apr 2015)

That's hard. I guess you may need a bit of fiddling with it then


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## Aristotelis (2 Apr 2015)

Yeah, as I said on my presentation post here: http://www.ukaps.org/forum/threads/hello-from-italy.36706/#post-395023
I had great success with a nano 35l low tech and osmosis water, where I dose 1/3 of EI dry salts once a week (or so). It's been running with no water changes and pretty stable values for 3 months. I tend to not measure much, once every month maybe and really not care much about values. I see no surface film, red cherries keep multiplying and a couple of ottocinclus been happy. That tank has a an old substrate with not much of fertilizer left if any at all. 

So because of this nano success, that's why I was thinking doing a bigger tank in a similar way but this time using a better substrate or soil. 

Again, big thanks for all your comments and advice


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