# PFK - Heater Cables....Em what?



## Adam Chambers (13 Dec 2016)

So I am just looking through articles whilst I wait for my rock to arrive and soaking up all the extra info I can and make sure I am all up to date. I used to read PFK years back which I always thought had some solid info but as I read on certain forums (such as this one) they seem to be very hit and miss with their articles and accuracy. No surprise since it is journalism to a point, however it is often on about the welfare of living animals. 

I clicked on this link http://www.practicalfishkeeping.co....-set-up-a-planted-tropical-community-aquarium for a quick peruse through to manage to catch the part about heater cables and water convection currents, which I thought was debunked 6-7 years ago now that they are not required for planted aquariums. 

So I google quickly to confirm my thoughts and this is the first link that comes up:
http://www.practicalfishkeeping.co.uk/features/articles/10-planted-tank-myths

Now get to point two and yep they have said themselves it is not needed. So now I go maybe one of the articles are old and some new info has been either way since I last read about this stuff. And nope, check the article dates and June 13 is stated on both articles so not only do they contradict each other they manage to publish on the same day. No wonder so many people have issues with bad setup, maintenance etc with things like this happening. 


Thoughts people and what can we do to improve our hobby?


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## Adam Chambers (13 Dec 2016)

Further to that; I have just read through the myth debunk article and points 5 & 7 contradict one another, one states you can grow anything in what is effectively low tech and the other says don't be silly to do those plants you have to have high tech. Em OK then. 

In fact the whole of point 7 is just rubbish tbh. The title to the point is correct, it is not necessary however it can make certain plants much easier to grow etc. My understanding is almost anything will grow in lower light setups because of requirements however the growth can be painfully slow and that is where the low, medium, high requirements stem from.


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## sanj (13 Dec 2016)

Some people still use heater cables, unless someone can say otherwise I think Dennerle still use them. The WaterZoo in Peterborough has been running a planted aquarium for over 20 years that was at least set up using the Denerle system.

I don't think they are essential and that is key. What benefit or edge they give is probably more questionable. Few people set up planted aquariums that exist for many years, so whether there is a long term benefit maybe a question when perhaps some of the granular clay substrate break down into more soil like consistency? I don't know.

I have a few tanks that have been running for some years, the oldest being on the go since August 2011 after a house move. None have heater cables. I have used them in the past, but I cannot say even anecdotally that they are a benefit. Maybe if I had set up two tanks one with and one without and run them for several years. Even then no two tanks are the same even when setup the same way, there are so many variables at play.

I personally do not agree with this statement: "Not everyone uses heating cables but most successful planted aquariums do". I don't know where that comes from or what evidence backs it up. To my knowledge (which is not perfect ), most of the aquariums on this forum have not used heater cables. Maybe the UKAPS community are not considered successful. Perhaps the wider world do use them, but that is not my impression. I think they are more popular on mainland Europe.

There are recommendations and general advice that have been put out there over the years, but not all of it means that if you don't do x , you wont be successful.

The "10x rated flow rule" is not a must. But it is good general advice for newcomers. People have successful planted tanks with much less flow.


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## zozo (13 Dec 2016)

No filter no flow, at least no mechanical, it has a heater set to 20°C for the winter time and plant respiration creating some water circulation, 7 watts of led light burning 18 hours. No ferts at all. Completely self sustaining little experimental jungle already running for over one year.. Plants and shrimps that's it, even the shrimps do not get fed by me they feed on whatever the tank gives them.  Only input is weekly waterchange to skim the biofilm off and so it doesn't get stinky. Till now perfectly healthy and it even doesn't grow any algae but some diatoms on the glass and at the glass in the substrate. Plants and mosses are healthy and clean.





I regularly throw BBA infested palnts in and come out clean 2 weeks later.


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## zozo (13 Dec 2016)

sanj said:


> I think they are more popular on mainland Europe.



They where back in the 80's.. But nowadays rarely used, most are still used in terrariums.. Some oldtimers still use them..  Some say substrate feeders like crypts grow faster and more robust with it. The thing you could run into if tank is getting older and you like to switch around some plants, you might pull up the cables with the plant roots and this can be problematic. If they stop working you still need to revert to other heating equipment..

So very poppular in the 80's probably some rage because it was someting new, but never realy got a proper foothold.. Now why is that? Obviously..


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## Greenfinger2 (13 Dec 2016)

Hi Adam, I stopped using mine about 5 years ago. My plants still grow well without it and the biggest plus is saving on electric bill 

Not sure.. I don't think members on here use them anymore.


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## three-fingers (13 Dec 2016)

I can see why they _could _provide some limited benefit,  but I can equally see them potentially causing (probably negligible) harm to plants if the substrate was too warm for a particular species.  I was almost tempted to get one many times years ago, but further reading on both aquatic and terrestrial plants put me off the idea.

I've never tried sticking a thermometer probe in the substrate to see if it differs from the water column when using a standard heater, but I doubt it is much different.  I don't currently have digital thermometer with a probe that would reach the substrate, so I've actually just ordered another cheap one from eBay to test this, just  out of curiosity .

In nature, I somehow doubt the shaded substrate would be warmer than the main water column...  If I remember correctly, the main aim of substrate heating is to provide gentle circulation of water through the substrate, thus oxygenating it and helping the plant roots. Nowadays it is more widely known that plants oxygenate the substrate themselves and also have many other mechanisms to promote an optimum root environment without our help, such as symbiotic relationships with bacteria/fungi exchanging nutrients, exuding substances that attract/feed certain beneficial microbes, adding O2 and removing CO2 etc.

One of my tanks has been set up for 9 years now with the same substrate and is still great with no substrate heater, crypts have been in there for at least 8 years with no root issues either.

I imagine heater cables were developed to counter anaerobic substrates, which were probably far more common in the past due to a more common use of deep peat/soil/sand/gravel substrates in low-circulation tanks.  Now we have much more efficient equipment, water pumps are more common than air pumps for water circulation, the pumps themselves are more usually more powerful for a given size of tank and we even have "wavemakers" available that were developed for the marine side of the hobby.

If I had a substrate heater to hand, but no normal heater, I would probably use it. I would never ever recommend anyone buy one for a planted tank though, just get a cheap normal heater and spend the money saved on an extra or bigger water circulation pump.

I still get PFK occasionally, I used to subscribe and may again in the future.  I especially enjoy articles by George Farmer, John Rundle and Neale Monks to pick some names off the top of my head.  I also love the articles that show fish in their natural habitats. The website does seem to occasionally feature totally out-of-date recycled magazine articles sometimes though.  Generally the writers are well informed and keep up-to-date with the hobby from what I've seen.  Read a copy from 10 years ago and compare to today to see how fast opinions in this hobby can change!


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## AverageWhiteBloke (13 Dec 2016)

I think heater cables have some use for instance when people are doing dry starts to keep the substrate warm. In the 80's I had a full Dennerle setup at one point which came with quite an extensive book. I still have it today as it has good photos of plants which is handy for I.D'ing. I did say that the point of the heater cable was to cause convection currents through the gravel. It also said that "plants grow in slow moving bends where water meanders and only algae thrive in fast moving water, as can be seen if you look at a river." Now we're pushing 10x volume+ round our tanks  so I guess things and opinions change.
From what I can remember it was when I came across dry salts although at the time it was more PMDD than EI levels was all the rage. The Dennerle ferts were a bit of a joke. Yellow capsules on dya 7, this tablet on day 15, that tablet on day 30 and lots of other things in between. Enough to drive you round the bend  God knows what was in them and they cost a fortune.


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## Adam Chambers (14 Dec 2016)

Cheers for comments and feedback everyone. I am pretty sure as you are all saying it may well have been different 20 years ago. I certainly have books my parents brought that advice the heat cable but the filtration, the nutrition, the C02 systems, the lighting were also very different and maybe we have just moved on and it did back then resolve issues that we don't have so much now. 

zozo interesting tank that. 

I don't know much at all about Dennerle or their system tbh however looking their stuff up online looks very dated and really out of touch generally with the modern aquascaper so maybe they just holding onto their older beliefs?

In regards to more successful, I would also assume it's just there for impact with no substance because as from what George Farmer in 2007 stated "from what I am aware very few top planted aquarists using them including Tom Barr, Takashi Amano, the guys at Tropica, all previous ADA and AGA" and let's be fair we can include George in this list as well now 

And that quote was off the PFK forum just for reference haha.


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