# Shy goldfish??



## GSDF&F (18 Sep 2013)

Hello all, newbie again here.

The property we've just bought has a 7'x7'x3' max depth pond. I've recently drained & cleaned out all the detritus, there were no fish in the pond.
I've now added a total of 8 goldfish, 3 to start with & a further 5 recently. With the first lot, after they had settled in their new environment, used to come to the surface when I approached with their feed. But since adding the other fish, all came to feed albeit very slowly. Now the situation is that, apart from seeing 1 or 2 lurking under the surface a few days ago, now I don't see any at all & the food is apparently untouched. When reinstating the pond, I added oxygenating plants & the plants that were already at the pond side are also still in situ. 
Also there were tadpoles aplenty & great care was taken to make sure most if not all went back in the pond as they were at a good stage of development. Since then they have also disappeared? I know some managed to transform into froglets & left the pond. 
So why the sudden shyness of the goldfish, predators can be ruled out, because of the location of the pond. I don't have a filter, as the local Koi dealer said I didn't need one, but I do have a very nice  fountain displacing a fair amount of water. Any advice appreciated.

Thanks
BeeJay


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## Michael W (18 Sep 2013)

I'm no pond expert but I'm pretty sure a filter is needed as goldfish will produce a lot of waste. You said you drained the pond recently, could that have had affect on the fish due to change in the parameters? Do you remove the excess food after noticing them not eating the food? If left in that could cause the water to be polluted especially if there are no filters which will then affect the fish's behavior and health.


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## squid102 (18 Sep 2013)

All your tadpoles will have been eaten by the goldfish. 

It could be something to do with the water parameters. If a couple of the new fish had died in there, along with the increased bio load of 5 new fish? Are you sure there are no predators? A heron will clear out a pond very quickly if not netted. Do you live near any rivers or lakes?


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## GSDF&F (18 Sep 2013)

Thanks for your replies. Regarding the filter, I can only reiterate the advice I had from the fish (no chips) shop. With regard to the tadpoles, they were in residency as spawn, before the fish were added, & had developed into tadpoles well before the fish arrived, & only disappeared since the extra fish were added. Of coarse the new comers could be piranha in disguise. The uneaten food swells a little & appears to either sink or it's being eaten & I'm not aware that they are coming for it. I'll need to get a water condition kit. But in a manual that I've since borrowed, it says that when the weather gets cold, fish will stay at the bottom, but it's hardly cold yet, though I wouldn't like to stand in there. Regarding the heron theory, the fountain will only stand upright in one spot, the slightest disturbance would quickly dislodge it.
BeeJay


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## martin-green (19 Sep 2013)

You need a biological filter.
Your koi dealer is not right, he should know better. Goldfish are part of the koi family, and produce a lot of waste.
Often people say you don't need filters as the pond is in balance,  and the fish will only grow to the size of the tank / pond. That is the biggest load of rubbish since snake oil
What happens is, yes a few plants will take up the fish waste and provide oxygen, but what is often not said is that at night plants take in oxygen and give out co2, it can work if there a a couple of small fish, but when you increase the quantity of fish it no longer works since, plants die or grow too slow or small, fish just keep getting bigger, so soon the plants can not cope.
If it was as easy as adding x number of plant Y and hey presto all is well the biological filter would never have been invented.
You need a biological filter or your fish will soon die.


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## GSDF&F (19 Sep 2013)

Thanks Martin, I'll pay the Koi people another visit. 5 or 6 fish were near the surface first thing this morning, so I went out to feed 'em, which resulted in them diving for cover. The pellets are still on the surface apparently untouched.


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## GSDF&F (19 Sep 2013)

Okay, took a water sample to be tested at the Koi store. All chemical tests came out as the colour should be & their comment was that there's no problem with the water, it's just cloudy. They suggested re-installing the Hozelock filter system that was already in situ, (Cyprio 5w Model 3891-0000, which they didn't realise I had) but not in working order, no sponge filters inside & the 5w UV lamp blown. So that's the next job after returning from holiday in 3 weeks time. They reckon the reason the fish are staying low could be that they have been spooked, possibly heron or owls, or it's simply warmer. In defence of the info they gave me last time, I must have misheard them. The Koi store's storage tanks for their koi are huge, with fish to the value of thousands. But they are perfectly happy to help a guy (me) who's trying to give 8 tiddly goldfish a chance.
Watch this space.


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## GSDF&F (24 Sep 2013)

A friend of mine who only lives app 5 miles away has just returned from a holiday to be told by the person who offered to feed them whilst he was away, that all his fish (19) had been taken by an enormous heron that had been seen in the area the day previous. He has a well constructed pond, waterfall, fountain etc & his fish, which he had added to over the years were a joy to watch. He then realised that he'd forgotten to place the netting over before going away.
Needless to say that was my first job on my pond when he'd told me what had happened.
My fish are losing their shyness now & don't dive for cover when I appear with their feed.
The filter etc will be re-instated when I get back from a holiday.


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