# eheim classic



## limz_777 (4 Apr 2015)

after using eheim classic for a couple of years , just realised there is a cooling & greasing channel https://www.eheim.com/en_GB/products/technology/external-filters/classic#faq , does anyone cleans this ?

and what does it mean by greasing ?

if any tips and tricks , do share .


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## limz_777 (4 Apr 2015)

just to add , a quick fix for clattering noise https://www.eheim.com/en_GB/products/technology/external-filters/classic#faq


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## karla (4 Apr 2015)

limz_777 said:


> just to add , a quick fix for clattering noise https://www.eheim.com/en_GB/products/technology/external-filters/classic#faq


Great. I never knew this. My eheim sounds like my grandmas old washing machine. I'll try that.
I do not know what they mean by greasing either, maybe its a channel that directs some water towards the spindle to prevent overheating, and added lubrication. I guess, so do not quote me.

Thanks for the tip.


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## karla (4 Apr 2015)

I try to fix eheim today, followed instructions, all seems well. Still it sound like wonky washing machine.


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## limz_777 (4 Apr 2015)

what sort of sounds and how old is your eheim ? eheim impeller does has its lifespan due to wear and tear , sometimes you have to change new ones


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## karla (4 Apr 2015)

I think you are correct. I think the spindle thing may be worn. I will be forced to drink more before bedtime in order to sleep properly....


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## Jay1 (4 Apr 2015)

Top tip get some electrical tape wrap around the plastic wings when pushing the impellar blades it will be a tight fit and reduce the chopping water within the motor housing.
Making sure the lid is firmly down and bending the metal clips so there is an absolute tight seal helps as sometimes the o ring RED one can get worn and push against the edge of the canister.
Hope this helps. If you need pictures just ask!


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## limz_777 (5 Apr 2015)

karla said:


> I think you are correct. I think the spindle thing may be worn. I will be forced to drink more before bedtime in order to sleep properly....



that bad ? another tip is to vaseline the impeller shaft sometimes it helps



Jay1 said:


> Top tip get some electrical tape wrap around the plastic wings when pushing the impellar blades it will be a tight fit and reduce the chopping water within the motor housing.
> Making sure the lid is firmly down and bending the metal clips so there is an absolute tight seal helps as sometimes the o ring RED one can get worn and push against the edge of the canister.
> Hope this helps. If you need pictures just ask!




i get the lid part , sometimes the lid can be push up due to the pressure , what tape on plastic wing ? you meant if the wing is loose ?


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## Dantrasy (5 Apr 2015)

he is suggesting to make the impeller blades/wings thicker (wrap some tape around them).

I did the opposite, cut my blades shorter. it's 2213 on a 19L tank, so i wanted to reduce the flow.


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## Jay1 (5 Apr 2015)

Yes Dan understands how it works! 
The impeller blades are l(oose on the wings) to help with priming hence you you turn the blades 1/4 turns. This is to enure the magnet does not stick and get jammed up.(Design floor the wings get worn and become too loose)
I find that once the bushes and shaft have worn it moves about too much and hits the motor housing causing very choppy water noise, but so does trapped air bubbles flowing through the canister as the blades try and cut into the air it causes resistance. 
The electrical tap makes the blades not move at all, but you will have to wrap the tape a few times try it for size if not enough, wrap some more around the white wings on the impeller. 
Make sure afterwards everytime when you start the filter, you see water flow from the spray bar as you do not have loose wings anymore to help with prime. If you see no flow turn it off and inspect again.

My old 2217 has been runnning for 10years and I bought it second hand so not even sure how many years its been running the plastic motor housing is started to wear out so the magnet impeller vibrations has started to hum. 
No matter what I do improves this old unit, except sticking a can of fish food ontop of the canister to dampen the vibrations hums. TBF the cost of replacement parts I would rather buy a empty classic again and reuse the media as media is not cheap these days either LFS asking £60+ for 5litres of media!!! 

You can always reduce flow by a longer oulet pipe NEVER reduce flow from the intake sure way of burning out the motor causing restriction! 
Always check the intake hard pipe if any ceramics have fallen into that elbow you will be surprised the sh1t that gets trapped on the elbow bend.


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## limz_777 (5 Apr 2015)

after 10 year mark if the motor is running and not blown i find its good enough , i have use cheaper china brand motor which blown from inside around 3-5 years time, yes the replacement part i find is quite costly ,usually i just bite the bullet and buy it ,lol , just reuse the media , my medias should be maybe 8-9 years old now too, not eheim btw , you using eheim media?


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## Jay1 (5 Apr 2015)

I've always used the Eheim media over the years usually because it came with it back in the day.
I'am slowly changing the media to Matrix there was a paper written about the surface area of Bio media against the slinted glass balls Eheim used. 
The Matrix looks like pumice stones, but trust me its not, more efficient biofiltration for the removal of nitrogenous waste.
I tend to mix it with ceramic noodles as the design of ceramic noodles are great. I find the holes hold the waste much better for Denitrification purposes.
Some people are anal about cleaning the water for bacteria colonisation and some are filter floss mad with clear water? 
I tend to stick to the usual bio media at the bottom and a corse sponges(X2) Matrix sandwich then floss right at the top. 
I never have clarity water issues, but goldfishes create alot off Nitrates good for plants, but not so much for goldies. 
Tropics is fine the bio waste never reaches any serious levels unless vastly over stocked or really dirty filters that never get maintance.
I usually get someone pipe in and tell me Nitrates is all okay, but with high Nitrates I get high Nitrites like I said for my use I have only coldwater goldfishes as they produce the most waste so mechinical and bio is really important over flow for me. If I need more flow, power heads are fine to help.


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## Jay1 (5 Apr 2015)

http://www.seachem.com/support/SpecificSurface.pdf



> BET surface area measurements indicate that Matrix™ contains nearly 10 times the





> specific surface area of Substrat Pro



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BET_theory
Even though sechem has endorsed the research the science behind BET absorbtion theory is sound.


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## dw1305 (5 Apr 2015)

Hi all,





Jay1 said:


> Even though sechem has endorsed the research the science behind BET absorbtion theory is sound.


I'm a bit of a sceptic about all this. I don't think BET is very relevant to biological filtration. 

All the companies that try to sell you their "special" media will use some scientific justification, but they all unravel pretty quickly once you start looking at them more closely. If you want to polish drinking water in a <"slow sand filter bed">, pumice might be quite a good media, and this might also be why Seachem decided to mention BET in their promotional literature.   

The only real thing in common with all these "wonder" media is that they take a cheap base material, and then sell it for a large mark-up. There is more in this thread <"http://www.ukaps.org/forum/threads/biological-media-please-help.28346/">. 

*Why pore space is irrelevant*
From my point of view, I think that the concept of having both aerobic and anaerobic filtration occurring simultaneously in the filter media is a flawed concept. This is especially true of canister filters. The problem is that to achieve aerobic and anaerobic filtration in the filter, you are dependent upon the balance between flow through the filter and how often you clean the filter media. 

The idea with a very micro-porous media is that the inner pores are anaerobic and within these de-nitrification of NO3 to N2 gas occurs, in the larger macro-pores aerobic bacteria convert NH3 - NO2 - NO3 (which is an oxygen intensive process) But, how are you meant to get the flow at a level where you get the mix of aerobic/anaerobic? 

If all your filter material becomes anaerobic, you lose all your biological filtration and toxic ammonia levels build up. You also have the problem that you don't have any rapid response to increased NH3 load. If a fish dies, or you inadvertently add chloramine treated water during a water change, you are into a positive feedback loop where the tank water becomes increasingly de-oxygenated, leading to further fish death, more ammonia, greater de-oxygenation, further fish death etc.

*Why oxygen (O16) is the magic number* 
In a planted system all you need to do is ensure that, in the filter, the oxygen supply always exceeds the oxygen demand. That way any NH3/NH4+ and NO2- are converted to NO3-, and the plants mop this up. It really is that simple.

When you export the plants, you export the nitrogen. De-nitrification may still occur in the substrate, and I like a substrate partially for this reason.

If you take de-nitrification out of the equation, the requirements for the filter media become much simpler, you just need a media that doesn't impede flow too greatly and become de-oxygenated. If you keep away from floss and fine sponge, you are pretty safe.

I like Eheim Substrat Pro ("coco-pops"), but I wouldn't buy them specially. If I had to buy filter media, I'd buy generic K1 type biocell floating media or "alfagrog". 

cheers Darrel


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## Jay1 (5 Apr 2015)

I mix the pro, Mech and Matrix and found a good balance.
To be fair Aerobic and Anaerobic is irrelavant to me aswell.
I see whats going on in my enviroment make tweaks and check again later on.
I have sponges and bio media mixing both covers the basics.
Forums love them when you try and Macronise everything to satisfy your own knowledge and usually means absolutely nothing in the real world bacteria?
I only trust whats in front of my eyes.
Its like sat nav people rely so much what the computer tells them, it usually takes longer to get to a destination when using common sense like asking someone on the road for directions is proberly quicker!

The only issues I have Darrel is that regardless of mark ups and papers both Seachem and Ehiem are just as bad as each other!
As for K1 media I've experimented with that also and my honest opinion there is not enough surface area as inner parts are way too smooth, plus the problem sticking into a canister the flow is not right works well in fluidised beds and sumps where aggitiation and oxygen can turn over the K1 well enough to make a difference, but in a canister I've done that and couldn't stablise spikes quick enough for me. I've tested the Matrix in my HOB and I was surprised as my Nitrates started falling much quicker, did the same tests with K1 slower.
From my own tests K1 in a canister 2217 failed not enough flow to make any differences.
In all my years I was told that no matter what you read or study unless its in front of your eyes and and you have a formular that works for you, stick to it.
I've said this to so many applications in life* "There are way too many parameters and variables to draw consistant conclusions, but limiting those variable will show what you want it to, and what you think you have been told to be true" LOL sound like Clive! *
Pumice is lighter than Matrix, but only thing made me laugh was the 2litre I was testing had inconsistant media some rocks were not from the same batch of rocks i.e colour differences which suggested it was _zeolite_ which actually begs the question is it bacteria or natural absorbtion to chemicals within the zeolite!


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## dw1305 (6 Apr 2015)

Hi all,





Jay1 said:


> The only issues I have Darrel is that regardless of mark ups and papers both Seachem and Ehiem are just as bad as each other!


I'm not going to argue with that one. As far as I'm concerned all the companies are "_economical with the truth_" 





Jay1 said:


> As for K1 media I've experimented with that also and my honest opinion there is not enough surface area as inner parts are way too smooth,


That is actually one of the features of <"Moving bed biofilm reactor"> media, they are designed to continually shed the excess growth of biofilm. They come from the waste water industry (developed in Norway) and I first became aware of them when we were working with landfill leachate.

I think this should be available to everybody <"Design and operations of the Kaldnes moving bed biofilm reactors">.


Jay1 said:


> I was surprised as my Nitrates started falling much quicker


 It is back to the problems of accurately testing for nitrate, the problem is that, even with laboratory scale equipment, it isn't easy to repeatable values. Even if you say 50% of the time you get a ball park figure (and I'd be absolutely amazed if it was 50% of the time), you aren't going to know which 50% of the time that is.

Plant growth is a much more sensitive indicator of nutrient status than any test kits, but there isn't any money in that.





Jay1 said:


> Pumice is lighter than Matrix, but only thing made me laugh was the 2litre I was testing had inconsistant media some rocks were not from the same batch of rocks i.e colour differences which suggested it was zeolite


Pumice is a generic geological term, the actual composition, and density, of the rock will depend upon the volcano that it originated from. Zeolites are a class of extremely porous alumino-silicate minerals (some natural, some man-made), they have very large CEC, which allow some of them to be used as chemical media (clinoptilolite will exchange NH4+ ions for Na+ ions). I'd be surprised if the other coloured mineral was a zeolite, but it certainly could be.

cheers Darrel


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## limz_777 (7 Apr 2015)

yes , k1 media is not meant to be in a canister , but usually i leave it stagnant for a few months before using it as a moving media (take ages to seed bb when moving ), now that you mention it, seachem matrix does remind me of zeolite , has the same chalky look to it


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## Jay1 (10 Apr 2015)

This was the inconsistant rocks you can see the colour difference wasnt loads but enough to say it was from a source like Zeolite


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## karla (11 Apr 2015)

Just wanted to thank you all for the advice you gave me about the noisy eheim, it now is reasonably quiet and allows sleep. No longer does it sound like a cement mixer. Tightening the rotor with tape and some silicon grease on the spindle has fixed it.


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## Jay1 (11 Apr 2015)

karla said:


> Just wanted to thank you all for the advice you gave me about the noisy eheim, it now is reasonably quiet and allows sleep. No longer does it sound like a cement mixer. Tightening the rotor with tape and some silicon grease on the spindle has fixed it.


*Good to hear might be good to have a few spare parts on hand Karla! *


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