# "Fallen Wilderness" Nine Months Later



## REDSTEVEO

Hi all,

Happy New Year and all that malarkey. I promised a week or two ago that I would post an update from my journal Fallen Wilderness. This scaping project was undertaken in May 2008. I can't believe nine months have flown by since then.

Like I said if you compare the original setup to what it looks like now you would not think that it was the same scape. I suppose in a way it isn't. I've sort of more or less let it do its own thing for some time now, let my artificial bit of nature take its course so to speak.

Any way I have posted some photos. First the good news, as some of you will notice the Crypts in the left and right hand corners, especially the left side have gone ballistic. There are new shoots popping up all over the tank so I guess the root system has spread more or less right through the Tropica Substrate. That's the good news. (I think)

The bad news is, and I am ashamed to admit it  I have got the dreaded Blue Green Algae growing on top of my Riccia mountain in the middle. It is a real pain in the Â£$%E. I swear I can vacuum it off as part of the water change, then sit there and literally watch it grow back in front of my eyes. I did a water change (one third of the tank) on Sunday and vacuumed all the Blue Green Algae off the Riccia and by the time I came home from work on the Monday it was back twice as much.

It grows faster than I've ever seen anything grow. It is really frustrating considering everything else is doing so well.  

Someone out there is bound to start talking about dissolved solids and all kinds of scientific stuff. Try and keep it simple guys. If Clive, George or anyone for that matter can recommend something please let me know.

A picture of the whole tank.






A close up of the Crypts.





Another one of the Crypts.






The dreaded Blue Green Algae. Uuuurgh!!






A closer shot of the lurgy.









I am probably not going to do any more rescaping until I've moved house. In the mean time Happy Scaping and feel free to make any recomendations re the Blue Green Algae.

Cheers,

Steve.


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## Themuleous

Woo, really nice.  Plants look really healthy 

Sam


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## Tom

Could you try getting a bit more flow over the Riccia? I know I had some BGA in a dead spot of my last few tanks.


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## jay

How are those angels with the embers?


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## REDSTEVEO

Themuleous said:
			
		

> Woo, really nice.  Plants look really healthy
> 
> Sam



Yeah, strange isn't it how one environment can produce healthy looking plants and algae at the same time.

Steve.


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## REDSTEVEO

Tom said:
			
		

> Could you try getting a bit more flow over the Riccia? I know I had some BGA in a dead spot of my last few tanks.



Possibly, although before I go for that I have read just about every article in the algae section about BGA. I am going to give it the "Blackout" treatment this weekend. 50% water change, switch off the CO2, no food, (no peeking) :? no nutrients whatsoever, unless someone screams loud enough telling me to get the Nitrates through the roof. How can you double dose each day for 72 hours without peeking?  

Cheers.

Steve.


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## mr. luke

Shrimps do i fine job on bga, you may get away with amanos with the angels, although any really dwarf shrimp would be consumed


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## REDSTEVEO

jay said:
			
		

> How are those angels with the embers?



Hi Jay,

Funny you should ask that. Because I'm trying to sell my house I sold all my discus, but now almost a year later still no joy. So I wanted to put something else in the tank which would not cost too much so I bought the four angels (dead cheap) swapped them actually at my local PFK for 10 lemon Tetras, 4 large red Serpae Tetras, and a couple of flying foxes which grew massive and far too boisterous for my liking. Any way they have been in there with the shoal of about 30 Ember Tetras and I have not experienced any problems.

The Embers do tend to stick together a bit more now and shoal around more, which is nice.

Why? Have you had experience of Angels eating Embers?

Cheers.

Steve.

PS

If this post should be moved to the Algae section can someone let me know how you do it. Ta!!


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## jay

No not personally. Heard too many horror stories to risk it. I'll bet they shoal like sardines with those angels swimming about


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## flygja

Tom said:
			
		

> Could you try getting a bit more flow over the Riccia? I know I had some BGA in a dead spot of my last few tanks.



I second that. I've had BGA in my tank twice now, and it completely went away when I improved the flow. First time by trimming the plants. Second time by adding a smaller canister filter.


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## The Green Machine

Hi Steve,

What GH is your water?


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## REDSTEVEO

Hi Mark & Jim,

Thanks for the reply and the question about the GH. it has been that long since I last tested for anything I had to re-read the destructions on all my redundant test kits.

Water parameters are: Shocked and amazed  

GH 0 Degrees
KH 6 Degrees
PH 6.0
NO3 Pink on the test kit about 5ppm I think
Phosphate dark blue on the test kit (off the scale I think) probably because I have mixed too much ? PO4 ?  with my EI dosing mix.
Iron FE very low surprisingly enough.
Temp 25 degrees.
CO2 2 Bubbles per second on for 8 hours coming on 2 hours before lights.

Lights cycle rotate over 10 hour period.

Tonight I have vacuumed all the BGA out as part of 50% water change. I have turned the CO2 off and completely blacked out the tank with black plastic bin bags and a huge blanket. Planning to leave it like that until I come home from work on Monday and the see what is going on. Incidentally for the past few months I have been doing all my water changes with matured tap water and not RO water. 

So what do you reckon?

I might try some Purigen in my filter, do you sell Purigen by any chance?

Cheers, speak soon.

Best regards,


Steve.


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## Ray

Looking good Steve and glad to hear you are still around.  BGA is easy to get rid of.  You already know the answer - blackout, get you Nitrates up and boost flow.

I think you are doing EI, so start double dosing nitrates.  When I was dosing tiny amounts of TPN+ I got BGA in my sand.  I switched to EI, blacked out and added an extra 400lph powerhead.  Blackout killed it but it kept coming back for the first few days, but 2 weeks of double dosing nitrates and it was gone for good.

Do a big w/c, quad dose nitrates up to 20ppm, dose during blackout, big w/c, dose up to 20ppm and keep double dosing until you are sure they are gone.  Remember your target is 20ppm Nitrates for optimum absorption, but to get rid of the BGA you will need to go higher.  Once it is gone you can go back to normal dosing and remove the powerhead you pointed at the riccia (I never had the guts to do that bit - its still there   )


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## REDSTEVEO

Cheers Ray,

Tank blacked out. Nitrate mix ready to roll. I've left a gap which is covered but can easily be lifted to pour them in. Might give the Powerhead a miss for the moment, I'll have to remove all the blackout to put the pump in. 

I'll post an update as soon as I remove the blackout on Monday and then again in a few days.

Thanks for the advice.

Steve.


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## JohnC

hi,

hardluck on the cyno bacteria, i hated that stuff. just to say i tried the backouts a couple of times to beat mine but it didnt work. so i was bad an managed to get some aquarium erthromycn through customs off e-bay. A five day course and the cyno is gone and never come back in any trace. of course i have addressed the underlaying issue of the low nitrates. obviously i did this as a last resort but it worked damn well.

is this a corner tank? it looks like it.

Best Regards,

john


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## REDSTEVEO

Hi John,

Yes it is a TRIGON 190 corner tank with a bowed front. I removed the blackout on Monday night  The tank was and still is clean as a whistle, so far so good. I'm keeping my fingers crossed at the moment. I have reduced the lighting period right down and turned off the CO2 so I don't have to whack the Nitrates up through the roof. I've also cut down on the feeding regime slightly. 

What amazed me was that everything, stem plants, hair grass, Crypts, Echinodrus Tenellus were standing straight as soldiers and sproggets have sprouted everywhere, obviously sending out runners in search of areas with more light. The tank is looking a lot better for the 3 day blackout. Lets hope I am not talking too soon. I will take a photograph and post it up this weekend.

Thanks for the tip about the erythomycin, if I get desperate I might give that ago, but only as a last resort.

Cheers.

Steve.


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## Ray

REDSTEVEO said:
			
		

> I have reduced the lighting period right down and turned off the CO2 so I don't have to whack the Nitrates up through the roof. I've also cut down on the feeding regime slightly.


Don't be a sceptic, have faith    Just keep the nitrates at 20ppm and it won't come back - BGA is 100% low nitrates induced, see James algae guide - he's never wrong in my experience: http://www.theplantedtank.co.uk/algae.htm

Theoretically I think you should keep the CO2 on and ease the lighting levels up gradually, killing the CO2 at this stage risks invoking a whole new set of low CO2 induced algae.


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## REDSTEVEO

Ray said:
			
		

> REDSTEVEO said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have reduced the lighting period right down and turned off the CO2 so I don't have to whack the Nitrates up through the roof. I've also cut down on the feeding regime slightly.
> 
> 
> 
> Don't be a sceptic, have faith    Just keep the nitrates at 20ppm and it won't come back - BGA is 100% low nitrates induced, see James algae guide - he's never wrong in my experience: http://www.theplantedtank.co.uk/algae.htm
> 
> Theoretically I think you should keep the CO2 on and ease the lighting levels up gradually, killing the CO2 at this stage risks invoking a whole new set of low CO2 induced algae.
Click to expand...

  Just when you thought you knew everything!!

Will do Ray, I'll have another gander through James's article.

Thanks for the advice as always,

Cheers.

Steve.


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## JohnC

> REDSTEVEO said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hi John,
> 
> Yes it is a TRIGON 190 corner tank with a bowed front. I removed the blackout on Monday night  The tank was and still is clean as a whistle, so far so good. I'm keeping my fingers crossed at the moment. I have reduced the lighting period right down and turned off the CO2 so I don't have to whack the Nitrates up through the roof. I've also cut down on the feeding regime slightly.
> 
> What amazed me was that everything, stem plants, hair grass, Crypts, Echinodrus Tenellus were standing straight as soldiers and sproggets have sprouted everywhere, obviously sending out runners in search of areas with more light. The tank is looking a lot better for the 3 day blackout. Lets hope I am not talking too soon. I will take a photograph and post it up this weekend.
> 
> Thanks for the tip about the erythomycin, if I get desperate I might give that ago, but only as a last resort.
> 
> Cheers.
> 
> Steve.
Click to expand...


I have the Venezia 190 as you might have seen from my journal. I looked at the Trigon 190 when i first bought it and i think i was swayed by the cabinet in the end. Is the Trigon pre-drilled for the external filter? What are the lights like too? have you modified them at all for better plant growth?

I find my corner tank has darker spots in the front corners and the back so ended up adding an extra light on the back access panel.

Best Regards,

John

p.s we should start a corner tank club. not many tips on good layouts for them online.  8)


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## REDSTEVEO

John, its been a while, shall we dance   

I'm afraid I have now left the "Corner tank" club because I have sold my Trigon 190. I have just got to be nice to the domestic authorities until she lets me get a Juwel Rio 400 that I want plant up and put Discus fish in.

Re: your question about lighting, I have still got the old T8 central light unit bar that goes across the middle. I replaced it with a T5 unit instead.

Gyles Westcott at TMC showed me how to remove the ballast and prepare it for the TMC Aquabeam Tile and the 500 strip.

I decided that I was not going to throw any more money at it so sold the tank instead. If you know anyone who fancies going down the LED route they can have the strip for free, just the cost of the postage.

All the best,

Until the next time,

Steve


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## JohnC

REDSTEVEO said:
			
		

> John, its been a while, shall we dance
> 
> I'm afraid I have now left the "Corner tank" club because I have sold my Trigon 190. I have just got to be nice to the domestic authorities until she lets me get a Juwel Rio 400 that I want plant up and put Discus fish in.
> 
> Re: your question about lighting, I have still got the old T8 central light unit bar that goes across the middle. I replaced it with a T5 unit instead.
> 
> Gyles Westcott at TMC showed me how to remove the ballast and prepare it for the TMC Aquabeam Tile and the 500 strip.
> 
> I decided that I was not going to throw any more money at it so sold the tank instead. If you know anyone who fancies going down the LED route they can have the strip for free, just the cost of the postage.
> 
> All the best,
> 
> Until the next time,
> 
> Steve



I'll happily take the strip off your hands. I'm slowly moving more and more of my tanks onto LED, that would be awesome. Ill pm you. 

Do you have an eta on the discus tank? I love amano's classic ones. He really shows off the fish.


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## REDSTEVEO

John I sent you a PM today sorry if I confused you, it is the original central light unit bar / strip that held the T8 Tubes in on the original Trigon.

Cheers,

Steve


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## Dinesh

Hi Steve, 

Can you please let know the fish that is in this set up ??


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