# How to... Big water changes?



## AndrewH (6 Jan 2013)

Just done my bi-weekly water change in my community tank - 180L no ferts, no CO2.
I change about 50L but this takes me about 5 or 6 buckets emptied out, then waiting for kettle to boil to heat the water up, and filling the tank up again... one splashing, spilling bucket at a time.

This may be a stupid question, but is there a better way?

Im in the planning stage to convert is tank this EI dosed Co2 tank and 50% water changes every week frankly scare me. That's 9 of my 10 litre buckets in and out, not to mention the cost of the 3kW kettle to heat up all that water.

Thanks guys.


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## mdhardy01 (6 Jan 2013)

Hose pipe from mixer tap straight into tank
Matt


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## LondonDragon (6 Jan 2013)

Have a look at this thread I created sometime ago: DIY Water Changer, No more buckets!! | UK Aquatic Plant Society


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## AndrewH (6 Jan 2013)

LondonDragon said:


> Have a look at this thread I created sometime ago: DIY Water Changer, No more buckets!! | UK Aquatic Plant Society


 
ArGh, sorry Dragon, I always do a search before starting a new thread, but didn't see this one.
Sorry about that...and thanks so much for the quick, excellent reply.

@Matt - my water contains both chlorine and chlorasamine so I would be really worried about just putting it straight into the tank...not to mention the cold temperature of the mains water vs my 25 C tank. What u think?


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## AndrewH (6 Jan 2013)

Wow, Im being stupid tonight...
I didn't look at that link before writing the above post.

@Matt - I see now how the temperature thing works using the hot tap for mixing. 

However, Im really worried about the copper in my hot water system affecting my shrimp badly. 
Should I be?


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## LondonDragon (6 Jan 2013)

AndrewH said:


> my water contains both chlorine and chlorasamine so I would be really worried about just putting it straight into the tank...not to mention the cold temperature of the mains water vs my 25 C tank. What u think?


If you pay attention to the diagram there is a cold and hot tap connected so that you can adjust the temp into the shower before pumping it back to the tank, just place a tank thermometer under the running water till you get it right  usually I don't bother with that too much. If you are worried you can mix the dechlorinator as you are pumping the water back into the tank.


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## Westyggx (6 Jan 2013)

A lot of people don't use declhorinator and have no problems. I use a 25litre tub I got from my LFS to remove water and the hose pipe on the mixer tap to fill back up.


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## AndrewH (6 Jan 2013)

Thanks so much guys, really helpful info... And thanks Paulo for the OP and excellent guide.
Im off to plan out my new super "Dragonsucker" as I shall christen it !!

@Mike - thanks m8, that's good to hear your experiences too. Im not so worried about the dechlorinator (although I will still add it but just into the tanks, not the individual buckets)
I think alot of fish keepers don't actually realise that these treatments don't instantly neutralise the chlorines etc, but actually take a pretty long time to work fully (30+ mins. I believe)!

and now because of the excellent guys on this forum, Im looking forward to saying goodbye to the buckets!!


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## mdhardy01 (7 Jan 2013)

AndrewH said:


> However, Im really worried about the copper in my hot water system affecting my shrimp badly.
> Should I be?


You'll probably find there more copper in your trace mix than you'll get from your hot water system

P.S I keep discus and have never had a problem in 2 years
Matt


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## AndrewH (7 Jan 2013)

mdhardy01 said:


> You'll probably find there more copper in your trace mix than you'll get from your hot water system


Wow, thats great to hear Matt - definitely makes me more at ease about this switch to the "hose" system.
Thanks m8.


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## Nathaniel Whiteside (7 Jan 2013)

If its low tech, large frequent water changes are actually worse for it. Causing co2 to be removed, which will have a negative impact on plants.

If your running a 'High tech' co2 injected setup, then frequent heavy water changes are a must, because of plant waste and the constant availability of co2.


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## mdhardy01 (7 Jan 2013)

AndrewH said:


> Im in the planning stage to convert is tank this EI dosed Co2 tank and 50% water changes every week frankly scare me. That's 9 of my 10 litre buckets in and out, not to mention the cost of the 3kW kettle to heat up all that water.
> 
> Thanks guys.



Think the op is going hi-tech 

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## Nathaniel Whiteside (7 Jan 2013)

mdhardy01 said:


> Think the op is going hi-tech
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD



Just mentioned it as a matter of interest  I knew he was going High tech.


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## sanj (9 Jan 2013)

I just put Seachem Safe mixed in a little water into the tank and then fill from hose via mixer tap.


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## Danny (10 Jan 2013)

Hose pipe straight in, slower in the winter. Every single MA shop does their water changes straight off the mains other than the marine and soft water systems but will tell you that you need to use dechlorinator lol.

I have never used it in over 10 years of standard freshwater from general community to central and south american cichlids to malawi's and never had any problems because of it.


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## greenink (12 Jan 2013)

Whitey89 said:


> If its low tech, large frequent water changes are actually worse for it. Causing co2 to be removed, which will have a negative impact on plants.



I thought mains tap water actually has higher CO2 concentration than most aquariums, because it's under pressure. That's part of why an aquarium often pearls when you change the water - both O2 and CO2 are at saturation point as the water comes under lower pressure and so gasify. So effectively every war change turns a low tech tank into a high tech one for 45 mins... Which is great for plants. 

On dechlorinator, I stopped using it ages ago and haven't noticed a difference with London tap straight in. Imagine is better with a combi boiler than a house with a hot water storage tank though - some nasty stuff in those tanks.


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## Ian Holdich (12 Jan 2013)

It's also great for bba mike, if you don't let it 'gas off'. Best to do water changes with the lights off.


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## Greenview (12 Jan 2013)

mikeappleby said:


> Imagine is better with a combi boiler than a house with a hot water storage tank though - some nasty stuff in those tanks.


My thoughts too. I have an ancient hot water tank and dread to think what is in there so fill with mains cold and lots of boiled water.


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## greenink (28 Jan 2013)

Ian Holdich said:


> It's also great for bba mike, if you don't let it 'gas off'. Best to do water changes with the lights off.



Now that explains a lot! But it is so satisfying to watch...


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## REDSTEVEO (26 Sep 2014)

LondonDragon said:


> If you pay attention to the diagram there is a cold and hot tap connected so that you can adjust the temp into the shower before pumping it back to the tank, just place a tank thermometer under the running water till you get it right  usually I don't bother with that too much. If you are worried you can mix the dechlorinator as you are pumping the water back into the tank.



London Dragon,

Now that I have got my 400 liter tank up and running I have been reviewing threads on water changes, especially 50% water changes. 200 litres of new water is a lot, obviously just using the cold tap this is going to drop the temperature considerable causing all kinds of stress and hassle for the plants and the fish, and then me if the fish kark it.

Am I right in thinking it is okay if you have got a mixer tap in your kitchen you can adjust the water temperature with a mixture of hot and cold water so as not to cause the temperature in the tank to plummet; and the use of hot water will not harm the plants or fish. I have a combination boiler which heats the water instantly as opposed to being held in an immersion heater storage tank.

Thanks,

Steve


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## ian_m (26 Sep 2014)

REDSTEVEO said:


> Am I right in thinking it is okay if you have got a mixer tap in your kitchen you can adjust the water temperature with a mixture of hot and cold water so as not to cause the temperature in the tank to plummet; and the use of hot water will not harm the plants or fish. I have a combination boiler which heats the water instantly as opposed to being held in an immersion heater storage tank.


At a first pass yes.

However, some combi-boilers have pressure reducers on their water inlets (as generally not rated for more say more than 5 bar pressure), thus trying to mix 5 bar hot and say 8 bar mains cold a down a long pipe, can get a bit uncontrollable and hard to set the temperature as the 8bar cold overrides the hot and prevents it flowing. You may be lucky, and water board compliant, and have a suitable non return valves fitted to your mixer tap to prevent this back flow happening.

I think a "just try it and see" is in order. Most likely be Ok.


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## REDSTEVEO (26 Sep 2014)

Oh thanks, sorry by the way I just posted this question up as a new thread.

The combi boiler is from Vaillant and is four years old but as far as I know does have all kinds of fancy gadgets like pressure reducers, non return valves and other things I don't really understand.

I heard that hot water picks up more copper from the pipes than cold water, not sure if there is any truth in that or not, but copper is not good, yes?


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## ian_m (26 Sep 2014)

REDSTEVEO said:


> not sure if there is any truth in that or not, but copper is not good, yes?


Think about.....if water picked up copper in the pipes, we would all have water running about our houses after a couple of years....as the pipes dissolved away and poisoned us with copper 

However, acidic water sitting in pipes can attack copper over many years and cheap brass fitting that are not water board compliant, copper can dissolve from and shrimps are very susceptible to copper, poisoning leads to "old wives" tales about copper pipes being bad for aquariums.

I would just get on with it like everyone else dose.


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## REDSTEVEO (26 Sep 2014)

Sounds fair enough to me...

Thanks,

Steve.


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