# Cichlids



## mrhoyo (29 May 2021)

Since we were first looking at fish a year ago my mrs has expressed an interest in cichlids (bright fish with big lips is the draw, I blame Nemo). I'm thinking of getting a 3 or 4ft aquarium in the near future. Any suggestions as to what cichlids might be worth looking at?
Our water is very soft.

Criteria:
Bright colours
Ideally won't destroy every plant
Peaceful enough that I don't have to keep them alone or put a billion of them in a tank to stop them maiming each other
I'm open to other bright coloured freshwater fish ideas. I don't want all the hassle of marine just so she can have so bright fish!


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## PARAGUAY (29 May 2021)

Got a good start with soft water Consider Rams espically if its a planted tank.


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## shangman (29 May 2021)

Your wife has excellent taste, cichlids are amazing fish - not only beautiful, but with bags of personality. Your water being soft is perfect too, as South American cichlids thrive in this type of water. I think your best option would be dwarf cichlids, which don't get too large, and also don't eat plants. The options are these, all of them are great options, so if I were you I'd go to your LFS and see what they have (all except the last option are commonly available) and see what really takes your fancy. Ideally you would keep these fish in a pair for the least agravation, or maybe a harem. In a 4-foot tank you could keep some more, as long as it's nicely planted so they can have defined territories.

German Rams - these come in 3 colours - regular (which is multicoloured and very pretty), electric blue and gold. The only annoying thing about them is that they really prefer a higher tempurature of 28, which other fish will be uncomfortable with, so you have to stock the tank around their tempurature. 




 

 


Bolivian Rams - these only come in one "colour", which is less colourful than german rams, but they are happy at more "normal" aquarium tempuratures, and you can keep them in a group. I used to want german rams due to the colour, but there is something in the eyes of the bolivians that makes them so beautiful and intelligent. 




Apistogramma - these come in all sorts of colours, they're my favourite fish and are very funny as well as beautiful. The most colourful + not hard to find are: A. Macmasteri, A. Borellii, A. Cacatoides, A. Agassizii. Most of these types have amazing variants which are extremely colourful (check out agassizii tefe or double red). They will definitely breed in your water, which makes them more aggressive, but if you read up about it and don't get too many (a pair or a harem of 1 male 2 females works great), and research good tank mates for them, you will be fine. The females are less colourful, except when spawning where they go bright yellow (and in your water they'll be constantly spawning and constantly yellow I think).



 

 

 


Be aware that all of the above require an area of fine sand to clean their gills/eat from (for best health), and ideally build some caves into the hardscape, or get some seedpods/coconuts or piles of dried leaves to spawn in & create a territory around. They're all territorial, but with a nicely planted tank that's fine because what we think is beautiful is usually what the cichlids like too.



Lastly, Dicrossus Maculatus or D. Filamentosus - these are rarer small cichlids which require really soft water. They are smaller than all of the above and a few can (probably, if you get a good-sized tank) live with a pair of the above cichlids (they live in the wild with some apistogrammas). They've got a lovely pattern, and the males have extraudinary tails and a beautiful irridescence. The females are more black and white checkerboard-y, which is lovely too. If you keep them alone, you could keep them in a group of 6 with 2 males in a 3/4 foot tank.


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## John q (29 May 2021)

Excellent reply from shangman.

I keep German rams and Electric blue rams and they seem to do well in water at 25.5⁰C.

Another one to look at but a tad bigger than the rams is Anomalochromis thomasi, lovely colours and sparkle like jewels when the light catches them.









						Anomalochromis thomasi (African Butterfly Cichlid) — Seriously Fish
					






					www.seriouslyfish.com


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## mrhoyo (29 May 2021)

Some good replies here, thanks.
Rams were one she initially liked, we were put off by reports of general ill health. Is there anything to look out for when shopping for them?
Apistogramma are another group she liked although their breeding aggression put a downer on things. Can't have fish getting killed!


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## Conort2 (29 May 2021)

I’d say go for dicrossus then. Probably the most mild mannered out of the dwarf cichlids you could go for. Their behaviour is fascinating in a mixed sex group.

cheers


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## shangman (30 May 2021)

mrhoyo said:


> Some good replies here, thanks.
> Rams were one she initially liked, we were put off by reports of general ill health. Is there anything to look out for when shopping for them?
> Apistogramma are another group she liked although their breeding aggression put a downer on things. Can't have fish getting killed!


I think with soft water you could definitely try rams, they will probably be fine with you. I think there are two problems with them - 1. they've been badly inbred/bred with too many hormones, and 2. they're quite fussy.
With your soft water, and a good tempurature they should be fine, people like to take a punt on keeping fish when their water isn't quite right for them, and rams aren't particularly tolerant of that. Also, it's best to avoid feeding bloodworms, dwarf cichlids are prone to die randomly from bloat from too many rich worms in their diet. Better to feed them with daphnia, brine shrimp and other tiny insects for their diet (live and frozen), and something like Bug Bites for dry food.
The second thing is finding a good place to source them from, you want to go somewhere where all the fish have bright eyes, good colour and are very active and watch you from their tank. You might have to research it a little bit to find a great LFS that sources good quality fish. Maybe some other users near you can suggest some good shops? A good option for buying dwarf cichlids also is Peter Clarke of Apisto Aquatics, who has a facebook page and ships around the UK. He has a great reputation if you can't find a local shop.

For the apistos, don't be too put off by the breeding aggression, I have experienced it and I didn't find it too bad with Macmasteri. There has been no violence or injuries, just some chasing (and only a very short distance). If you got a pair or harem of 3 for a 3-foot tank, I think it would be completely fine. My apistos didn't hurt any other fish in the tank, just chased them away a little if they got very close. That was in a 60cm 60L tank, with a 3 foot I think it would work well. Just don't get corydoras with them, they are the fish that can clash the most (corydoras don't understand apisto warning aggression, and will happily eat eggs/fry, and can get their eyes eaten). Maybe research the Apistogramma Borellii to keep, these ones are known as the least agressive apisto, and they're still very beautiful.

If you're interested in dicrossus, I know that the Fish Barn sells them, and I think they ship fish, otherwise they're quite hard to find. Absolutely beautiful though, I'm setting up a tank to keep them and can't wait! You might need to make your water even more soft, by using a good amount of dried leaves in the tank, along with your plants. They live amongst lots of dead leaves in the wild, so you'll see more interesting natural behaviour too (they like to flip leaves to find food under it, and also lay their eggs on leaves and will carry that leaf around with them to protect them).


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## Courtneybst (30 May 2021)

Some amazing replies already! Just thought I'd add this one as I've kept them before; Electric Blue Acara. Very colourful, quite peaceful, doesn't destroy planted tanks and are not difficult to find or expensive. I had mine in a community tank.


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## tiger15 (30 May 2021)

I agree with the recommended dwarf cichlid selection which are plant friendly.  I have been a cichlid keeper for decades before adding plants.  I love cichlid for their color, diversity, and  interesting behavior, but some larger ones are not plant friendly.   However, with proper species selection and management strategy, I have no trouble keeping large cichlid with plants.


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## mrhoyo (1 Jun 2021)

Courtneybst said:


> View attachment 170052
> Some amazing replies already! Just thought I'd add this one as I've kept them before; Electric Blue Acara. Very colourful, quite peaceful, doesn't destroy planted tanks and are not difficult to find or expensive. I had mine in a community tank.


I've seen these in fish shops before, always assumed they were too big or aggressive. Looks like I was wrong so another option.


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## mort (2 Jun 2021)

Don't forget angelfish look fantastic in a deep planted tank and lots of people forget they are cichlids. They would be better for a 4ft as they can be big fish but they wouldn't exclude smaller cichlids like the apistogramma or rams.
Another couple of small species that are nice are laetacara and nannacara.


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## Conort2 (2 Jun 2021)

mort said:


> Don't forget angelfish look fantastic in a deep planted tank and lots of people forget they are cichlids. They would be better for a 4ft as they can be big fish but they wouldn't exclude smaller cichlids like the apistogramma or rams.
> Another couple of small species that are nice are laetacara and nannacara.



One that doesn’t get as big as a normal angelfish and will be perfect in your soft water is pterophyllum leopoldi. It’s a beautiful species but can be abit hard to find sometimes.


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## tiger15 (2 Jun 2021)

Courtneybst said:


> View attachment 170052
> Some amazing replies already! Just thought I'd add this one as I've kept them before; Electric Blue Acara. Very colourful, quite peaceful, doesn't destroy planted tanks and are not difficult to find or expensive. I had mine in a community tank.


 I have EBA in my planted cichlid tank, but keep males only.  They are medium size cichlid powerful enough to damage plants if allowed to pair up with females and make nest all day long.


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## Courtneybst (2 Jun 2021)

tiger15 said:


> I have EBA in my planted cichlid tank, but keep males only.  They are medium size cichlid powerful enough to damage plants if allowed to pair up with females and make nest all day long.


Oh yeah I'd imagine so, I didn't keep any females.


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## mrhoyo (2 Jun 2021)

Sounds like I'm spoilt for choice in terms of cichlids! I'll make a list of everything you've all written for when I eventually visit a shop.

Anyone got suggestions for bright non-cichlids? It's sometimes hard to imagine fish coloured up when in a shop.


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## mort (2 Jun 2021)

Depends on your definition of bright really. Some fish almost seem to glow in the dark (well some actually do but thankfully not here) but others are bright but more natural.  You can't go wrong with cardinals, ember tetra or harlequins in soft water but they make some of the larger cichlids more of a problem. If you get a bigger sized cichlid then Columbian blue tetras are bright and robust.


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## tiger15 (3 Jun 2021)

Courtneybst said:


> Oh yeah I'd imagine so, I didn't keep any females.


The trouble is that you can’t sex juvenile cichlid until they grow up and pair up, then you have to rehome females.  I only allow dwarf cichlid to pair up, which are not powerful enough to destroy plants.  I keep many large non cichlid such as Congo tetra, bleeding heart tetra, Diamond tetra, tiger barb and sailfin molly.


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