# Tropica root tabs and surface film



## Ghettofarmulous (12 Dec 2021)

Hi all, I added root tabs yesterday evening during my weekly routine. Tropica type. After I got home today I noted a hazy hue in my tank, drop checker more yellow than normal and I’ll my Oto catfish were stationary. When I angled my spray bar up to create more gas exchange I noted bubbles forming and an obvious surface tension but not typical film I have experienced. My skimmer going 24/7 didn’t clear it. Anyone else experience same after adding tropica root tabs.


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## Ghettofarmulous (12 Dec 2021)

See this trail of pearling bubbles hitting the surface as it goes to the skimmer but not to atmosphere


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## Ghettofarmulous (12 Dec 2021)

During water change just now..


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## Ghettofarmulous (12 Dec 2021)

Of course I had picked up some shrimp on my way home.

I’ll update over next few days. No time to google what the casing around tropica tabs are but maybe it’s gelatine or something. Definitely something on the surface, no oily sheen, doesn’t break when touched, almost a more viscous layer but no visual presence if that makes sense


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## Ghettofarmulous (12 Dec 2021)

I did a test with tap water vs same water with dissolved root tab.




Before adding tab after a good splash mix.





After adding root tab with a good splash mix.

It appears I have found the cause. As all my equipment is isolated from the rest of the household I could only put it down to the one change I observed. Addition of root tabs.

Perhaps I have misused them in some way but I followed the advise of many YouTube vids. Bury deep, none floated. After a 70% water change the surface tension still exists albeit reduced however, it acts like a weak polymer solution. I will have to observe closely tomorrow.

Thankfully I run my Co2 at a lime green, not so close to yellow so I hadn’t completely gassed them out. With the surface tension at a higher rating the oxygen wasn’t getting in as quick, and the Co2 wasn’t escaping as quick. I think my surface skimmer whilst not removing the offending element it provided some aeration. I got lucky.

I’d appreciate anyone’s input here. I would assume it will break down naturally.


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## Ghettofarmulous (12 Dec 2021)

Well I just did an ammonia test with this one (in date). I don’t know what’s going on. It was 0 the day before.


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## Ghettofarmulous (12 Dec 2021)

Full incident response mode now. Drain and fill same time. Aeration ongoing. Any tips or advise would be appreciated.


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## Aqua360 (12 Dec 2021)

Ghettofarmulous said:


> Hi all, I added root tabs yesterday evening during my weekly routine. Tropica type. After I got home today I noted a hazy hue in my tank, drop checker more yellow than normal and I’ll my Oto catfish were stationary. When I angled my spray bar up to create more gas exchange I noted bubbles forming and an obvious surface tension but not typical film I have experienced. My skimmer going 24/7 didn’t clear it. Anyone else experience same after adding tropica root tabs. View attachment 178353
> View attachment 178354
> View attachment 178355
> View attachment 178356



When I used them, they floated up and caused an ammonia spike which killed my shrimps. Then tropica said it was my fault. 

Thanks Tropica!

P.S people may have different experiences, mine was terrible though; I would recommend against these root tabs strongly.


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## Konsa (12 Dec 2021)

Hi
Tropica and many other similar products are more or less Osmocote in gelatine capsule.Really can't get my head around how people pay those prices for the branded ones.50 -100 capsules cost less then £2 and jar of Osmocote is like £3.
Those slow release fertilizers dump nutrients rapidly in water and often their Nitrogen is Ammonia based so very easy to over do it.
I do use Osmocote in base layer if not using nutrient rich substrate without the gelatine casing just a light sprinkle on bottom before adding substrate. Also insert individual grains here and there sometimes but in very limited amount and as deep as possible.
In past used to make holes with a needle in the gelatine casing to aid the water going in and reduce the chance of them floating on me but as said above changed my application metod.

Regards Konstantin


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## Ghettofarmulous (12 Dec 2021)

So I texted in duplicate to be sure, at the surface and using a new pipette at the substrate. Both came out as indicator for high ammonia, tested tap water and zero. 



I have replaced the water x2 and I will aerate. Co2 will remain off until I’m happy system has stabilised. 




I have always planned for such an event so I grabbed my incident bag containing pumps, hoses etc and was able to respond quickly. I’m happy I did. 

I use tropica plants substrate and products were I can. Living in Ireland it is not always freely available without travelling far or paying delivery. I’m disappointed that for all the research I did I didn’t come across significant warnings. 

I’ll update tomorrow


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## Djoko Sauza (12 Dec 2021)

What a nightmare... Also very strange that there are no more reports of this happening. 

Have you thought about fishing the root tabs out? I would dose Seachem Prime or a similar product in the meantime. Best of luck!


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## Ghettofarmulous (12 Dec 2021)

Djoko Sauza said:


> What a nightmare... Also very strange that there are no more reports of this happening.
> 
> Have you thought about fishing the root tabs out? I would dose Seachem Prime or a similar product in the meantime. Best of luck!


I will dose a cap of Prime to the tank in addition to the dosage I gave when dechlorinating. I don’t know the ration to ammonia vs prime but I doubt I needed to dose prime for chlorine as ammonia-N will eat 10mg/l of chlorine for every 1 mg/l of ammonia-N. 

I didn’t go digging the tabs up. I’m more hoping the system will stabilise instead. 

This is the current levels of ammonia as per the test below. I’ll monitor for the night and if levels climb I’ll change out water again. 





Man what a night, so far. 

And thanks for all your reply’s. nice to know someone is watching, a crises is always easier when your not alone😎


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## erwin123 (13 Dec 2021)

I have been discussing my experiments with an Osmocote clone (Starxcote) in the following thread: Root tabs and/or liquid ferts

Given the release pattern of Osmocote in water, it is better to insert a little bit weekly rather than all at once as this will smooth out the release curve (as shown in the diagram below Osmocote dumps more NH4-N in the first 2 weeks compared to other slow-release ferts like Nutricote)

I'm not sure how many Tropica Tabs you added and how many osmocote balls were in those Tabs, but I'm guessing it was probably too many at one go?









I also referred to the advice from 2hr aquarist. Do note that his recommendation is to insert after the aquasoil is exhausted, which implies this will be in a heavily planted tank with extensive root systems which presumably be able to use some of the NH4-N before it leaks out into the water column.  But if it is in relatively new tank, then spreading out the insertion of Osmocote to smoothen the release curve seems ideal.



> Spiking the substrate with ammonia rich root fertilizers such as osmocote is an easy way to  boost plant growth in planted aquarium. Ammonia in the water column is toxic to both fish (and plants too at higher levels). However, providing it in the substrate is very effective. The key point about osmocote is *to not to use too much (such as in gel caps).* It provides great bang for the buck if used correctly. I prefer inserting *individual balls (one ball every inch square)*, once every 3 months, in heavily planted areas. Insert them deep, and use them sparsely. If the balls are are not inserted deeply enough, the result ammonia spikes in the water column often give rise to heavy green dust algae.











						How to use osmocote for substrate in planted aquarium
					

Fresh aquasoil such as ADA aquasoil contain high amounts of ammonia. This is very effective for plant growth, however, it does deplete over time. Spiking the substrate with root fertilizers such as osmocote is an easy way to enrich aquasoil with nutrients.




					www.2hraquarist.com
				




p.s. you can add Seachem Prime as well.


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## Ghettofarmulous (13 Dec 2021)

erwin123 said:


> I have been discussing my experiments with an Osmocote clone (Starxcote) in the following thread: Root tabs and/or liquid ferts
> 
> Given the release pattern of Osmocote in water, it is better to insert a little bit weekly rather than all at once as this will smooth out the release curve (as shown in the diagram below Osmocote dumps more NH4-N in the first 2 weeks compared to other slow-release ferts like Nutricote)
> 
> ...


This is excellent information from the quick scan I did. It seems I have a very big problem. I added 1 root tab per 2square inches. About 20 tabs in all maybe. How the F do I get them out now, won’t they be dissolved?

Im just about to go to bed after another swing of water changes but I suspect I have fallen ill of the “requirement to have a fertile substrate” even though I dose to the water column. My tropica media is 2.5 years old and looking the same as day 1 but I considered it exhausted. I have a lot more to learn.


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## Ghettofarmulous (13 Dec 2021)

I tried to see if I can remove one tab as an experiment and the casing has dissolved so I see two options. 

1. Tear down tank and start again
2. Manage the incident until water parameters become stable. 

I complete a tear down and relocation of the tank 1 week ago today. So this isn’t really an option because I have no new soil or time to dedicate to this. I am also working in the same room and coming up to Christmas I just can’t do this. 

I will do my best to do water changes continually. My main concern is the live stock as I don’t want them to suffer. Should I relocate these to a bucket with an air pump and allow the plants to do the work?

Tank is relatively “new” but filter and media are mature. I basically did a rescape but retained the biological treatment. This I counted as a success when I moved the tank which took a few days between tear down and build up.


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## Aqua360 (13 Dec 2021)

Ghettofarmulous said:


> I tried to see if I can remove one tab as an experiment and the casing has dissolved so I see two options.
> 
> 1. Tear down tank and start again
> 2. Manage the incident until water parameters become stable.
> ...



I would just do increased water changes, and keep testing


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## Ghettofarmulous (13 Dec 2021)

after 6 rounds of ~90% water changes ammonia has gone to more or less zero. At least until leaching occurs again. I’ll check first thing, in about 3 hours 🥱. 

Live stock are much calmer, ottos relaxed, shrimp moving about again. Amano still in hiding but that’s to be expected as I find them skittish after any change. Thanks all.


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## MichaelJ (13 Dec 2021)

Ghettofarmulous said:


> Anyone else experience same after adding tropica root tabs.


I haven't, but I never used Aqua soil with the Tropica tabs either. As this is a new tank, I am probably more inclined to believe the enriched substrate might be the culprit or some other reaction.  No reason to tear down the tank just keep up the large WCs as @Aqua360 suggests.

Cheers,
Michael


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## Ghettofarmulous (13 Dec 2021)

This morning at approx 07:30 ammonia was back up. Test indicates between 0.25 and 1 mg/l. I estimate water changes every four hours until leaching levels can dealt with by biological treatment. It will take number of weeks for bugs to increase in numbers but I have plenty of media installed for fixed growth. 

Another two water changes today. Surface tension still exists to the point it is retaining a foam but it is reduced with every water change. Livestock are stressed, but Alive. Shrimp I added yesterday are present but impossible to tell if I have had due off. Galaxy rasboras are very stressed. I suspect they may not make it. Lethargic and resting on the bottom/wedged in plants.


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## dw1305 (13 Dec 2021)

Hi all,


Ghettofarmulous said:


> Test indicates between 0.25 and 1 mg/l. I estimate water changes every four hours until leaching levels can dealt with by biological treatment. It will take number of weeks for bugs to increase in numbers but I have plenty of media installed for fixed growth.


Unfortunately you will have to keep <"changing water">.  "Prime" might help, as it will <"complex some of the ammonia (NH3)">.

I'm very wary of <"controlled release fertilisers">, because "controlled" can easily <"become "uncontrolled">.  I've had my <"own experience of this">.

If you have them? <"floating plants will help">, they aren't CO2 limited, so can make use of the extra ammonia.

cheers Darrel


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## Ghettofarmulous (13 Dec 2021)

dw1305 said:


> Hi all,
> 
> Unfortunately you will have to keep <"changing water">.  "Prime" might help, as it will <"complex some of the ammonia (NH3)">.
> 
> ...


Thanks for the link Darrel.

I don't have floating plants but I do have Limnophila _sessiliflora which grows quickly as you probably know. I will trim the stems and allow them to float. This will a. expose them to more light and b. as you say remove Co2 limit. 

I don't want to run my own Co2 as I am aerating and it would be a waste. _


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## Ghettofarmulous (15 Dec 2021)

Just an update for myself really,

About every 8 hours a water change is required. Today I tested the tank and I did 100% water change over time making sure temperature was the same.






I’m testing water before and after change.

Today it seems that the level didn’t drop (significantly) despite the water change/ dilution.




Control left, before WC middle, After WC right.

Something I haven’t considered is when ammonia stabilises is when to start dosing ferts to water column. Should I bring Co2 on and use plant health to gauge when to start introducing ferts to water column again?

I strongly suspect an algae bloom at some point but I’ll manage that as it comes. No livestock loss yet

3 Otto
4 galaxy rasboras
3 amano
15 shrimp


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## BdubB (15 Dec 2021)

Hope this is getting better. Thanks for sharing! I occasionally use tropica root tabs but never in such high density.


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## eminor (15 Dec 2021)

how much time root tab last ?


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## Ghettofarmulous (15 Dec 2021)

Plan B. 

I have removed all livestock after one of my Otto’s died. I suspect his gills were damaged from consistent ammonia exposure. All in a bucket. 

Should I stop water changes, up Co2 and allow plants to kick in and filter to catch up on loading?

Thanks in advance


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## Konsa (15 Dec 2021)

Hi
Moving the live stock was wise.Make sure you cover the bucket as you may end up with jumpers.
I will carry on changing water daily or every other day.Dial your CO2 in and try to get some floating plants (Best)or fast growing stems as your plant mass is quite low and  seems unestablished.
Also keep the airstone on at night.You can set it up on a timer so does not overlap with your CO2 injection period. 

Regards Konstantin


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## erwin123 (17 Dec 2021)

eminor said:


> how much time root tab last ?







The NH4-N release is the highest in the first 2 weeks. After that it should stabilise.
Polyon seems to be the best behaved when it comes to NH4-N but it is not as readily available. When I search Amazon.com, Osmocote and Nutricote are available but not Polyon.


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## Happi (18 Dec 2021)

@Ghettofarmulous

if anything during this time, I wouldn't increase the PH of the water if you been doing so. maintain lower PH and let the NH4 stay in its ammonium form and it is quite harmless, I had fish in 8+ ppm NH4 at one point and it was similar incident with osmocote, but I wouldn't recommend keeping the fish in such a high level of NH4 in long term.

I eventually had to tear down the tank because I was getting 0.25 - 8 ppm reading within few days even with multiple water changes, so I would expect something similar in your case. this also indicate that you have added way too many root tabs and at this point I wouldn't blame Tropica but a user error.

I would strongly recommend floating plants at this point if you choose not to tear down your tank, I would estimate 1+ ppm drop in NH4 daily if your entire tank was covered with Floaters.


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## Ghettofarmulous (18 Dec 2021)

Hi Happi, all. 

Thanks for the message, I maintained the pH circa 6.8. This is a drop from an average morning pH of 7.66 and the degassed aquarium water (24hrs standing) recorded as 8.37. In still building a profile but at 6.8 my drop checker is lime green close to turning yellow. I’m still building the profile. 

I had removed all stock from the tank on Wednesday and tested the tank every 12 hours. Today it remained at indicated 0mg/l 

I did a big water change, allows to turn over and tested again. All good so I put everything back. Tomorrow I begin monitoring pH and building profile. 

I appreciate everyone’s input. I learned a lot. I don’t blame Tropica at all, I may have followed a few YouTube videos a bit literally. Next time I’ll be very careful and consult forum records. 

I lost one fish and pulled a muscle in my shoulder logging buckets about. 

Control- purified water 
Bucket - temporary fish hold
Tank




Saturday




Thursday both tank samples


New water change system


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## Ghettofarmulous (22 Jan 2022)

I thought I would close this thread out with a final update. 

After a week the tests indicated Ammonia levels had returned to 0 mg/l. Daily water changes were required and all live stock was kept in a bucket. In all I lost one Otto which is a shame. I really hate losing fish to my own mistakes.

Anyway I'm grateful for the help and support. All going well now.


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