# Increase flow by means of powerhead or wavemaker



## ScottW (16 Oct 2015)

Hi All,

So I think I'm in need of some addition circulation in my tank, it's 425 liters (60” x 18” x 24”) and currently I have 2 Fluval 406 external filters which equates to ~2900 litre/hour. I would imagine it's less than that also as with media, 2 external heaters and a diffuser inline will lower flow rates. I am also using two spray bars along the top, but i'm not at the 10x rule. I am noticing in the corners of the tank that there are dead spots and with CO2 only coming out of one half of the spray bar I need to better distribute the CO2 to the other side of the tank 

So my question is should I go for a wavemaker or a powerhead ?

I have seen that a few members on here use the Koralia Nano Evolution 900 Circulation Pump, so was thinking of perhaps getting a couple of these.

Or I also saw the Fluval Sea CP1 the other day in my LFS and that looks nice and compact.

As for the possible wavemaker option I'm looking at the Jebao RW4 which looks pretty neat and comes with a controller that you can link up to another wireless.

Am I correct in thinking that a powerhead delivers a more focused / direct  flow, where the wavemaker has a wider dispersion, and where would be best for placement ?

Cheers


----------



## Tim Harrison (17 Oct 2015)

Hi, it would help if we had a pic or two of your tank


----------



## Edvet (17 Oct 2015)

I've used koralia's in my big tank, but due to the shape of the flow i never realy liked them. I had two in the same circular direction in the tank (say back right going  left,,and one front left going right) and alternate them because the plants where laying almost horizontal if the current hit them.
If i would go hich tech again, thus needing a lot of flow, I would take a strong pump and add a spraybar, if you already heave a spraybar just add it above the one you are using


----------



## ScottW (17 Oct 2015)

Here's a picture and short video 









I actually went and brought the Fluval Sea 1600 lph one today. I thought it would be too powerful but it's not. I have placed it on the left hand glass pointing long ways down the tank being as my CO2 is coming out of the left most spray bar. I would say it pushes the CO2 a little further over now. 

I'm thinking that I may need two more, one on back left and back right maybe even just the 1000 lph to sort the dead spots on the corners and I need to probably add a second diffuser on to my second filter for best distribution of CO2. This is one expensive hobby lol.


----------



## Manuel Arias (18 Oct 2015)

Hi ScottW,

I do not intend to be controversial here and I might be well missing some point on it, so I am open to clarifications/corrections, but I do not understand really the biochemical and physical reason behind that 10x that some people seem to defend. I actually run a tank in 6x with no issues at all, and is heavily planted and high tech. Amano has been working even with lower rates for long time and no facing problems. I think you current setup is enough for this, so I really would not invest more money. Additionally, one point not always is recalled is that high flow rates can cause physical stress to the plants, reducing the growth and cutting the lifetime of the leaves, so as with for fishes, we need to consider the natural environment in what the plants grow: It is not possible to go for the same setup when you include plants growing in natural springs than plants in lakes, for example.

Just an example, ADA systems are using in aquariums in the ranges of 182 l, 324 l and 648 l of volumes, rates of 360 l/h, 1140 l/h and 1860 l/h (series 600, 1200 and 2400, respectively), which leads to cycles from 2x to 4x. The reason why this works is because the important point is not the flow rate but the combination of flow rate and filter media volume and type. If you filter system has room for low volume of media, then you are forced to have bigger rates to make sure the water is properly treated. But if you go for good media volumes, then you can afford reduced rates. The Fluval filter you use has a quite generous volume of media (8.5l) that multiplied by two goes to 17l of media. That matches with the smaller ADA filter of series 2400, thought for aquariums of 648 litres, and with a rate as indicated above, so you are far beyond what seems OK. EHEIM filters provide similar specifications than ADA in terms of rates but with less media volume, unless you use a filter oversized for the tank. I have even see a high-tech 90x45x45cm ADA tank working with an EHEIM Ecco Pro 300 with no problem at all, which I consider is risky also (too low rate and volume), but it reflects how relative this thing of the rate can be.

Edvet, It would be interesting to see which is the argument of having a 10x, but I do not see any scientific real reason to do it. Moreover, I would consider it even excessive for quite a lot of plants we can use in our tanks, and no talking about for the fishes. If someone is concerned about the CO2 distribution in the tank, then you have to aim for better diffusor, better collocation of the diffusor, or even for in-line CO2 injection or similar. It is quite probably that going to 10x warrants you that you have no problems coming from the flow rate, but thinking if that is really needed, I will say no and it is going to a very high margin of security that I would say even is not worth the investment. Considering the cost of the filters and media, I think that unless this 10x is really well explained is not worth, and many people running planted tanks with much less rate have been successful, so...can be lack of knowledge but I did not see how that supports itself.

Cheers,


----------



## Tim Harrison (18 Oct 2015)

Absolutely, I agree with you on this...but by the same measure as you mention it allows for a margin of error - which could conceivably make the difference between success and failure especially for a newbie, and them staying in, or leaving the hobby...lack of flow and distribution of CO2 and nutrients is often the cause of many a planted tank woe.

I think the real issue is flow dynamics...whether its directional or diffuse. Obviously the more directional it is the greater the chance of plants incurring mechanical damage and having to invest energy in physical repairs instead of growth.

However, most of us use lilly pipes or spray bars which generally produce a dispersed flow, which isn't damaging even at high flow, nor is it harmful to critters...

The 10x flow standard isn't written in stone nor is it scientific - it never could be really all our tanks are different with different obstacles to flow. 

George Farmer is one of the aquascapers often credited with introducing the suggestion, and certainly the subsequent experience of many would suggest further that it works well.

It means that generally speaking it creates a flow dynamic that can overcome these differences in our scapes and reach the far corners of even densely planted tanks and thus - most importantly as stated above - distribute CO2 and nutrients to all the plants relatively evenly...so they are bathed in a homogeneous solution.

But as you say it is infinitely possible to achieve success with less flow, especially the low-energy way. 

There are many routes to success and the 10x rule is just one component of many along a road which attempts to make success a little more likely...


----------



## Manuel Arias (18 Oct 2015)

Well spoken, Troi  I agree that the point is the dynamics in the tank, and it could be an issue if you create "shadows" in terms of flow, so you get the wastes accumulating in a given part of the tank, or lack of access to nutrients there. As usual, there are many factors to consider. Let´s say that 10x will work in the gunshot approach, but it is possible to go to reduced rates if you start to refine the technique and have further considerations like the disposition of the hardscape and plants, location of the diffuser, lilly pipe etc.
Under my experience these elements are, even so, important, as for example, I noticed that Cryptos growing under a larger flow rate they grow smaller leaves and the leaves get damage faster, so the rate of renovation of the leaves is bigger. However, under lower flows, they grow with lush if the other conditions for them are met.


----------



## ScottW (18 Oct 2015)

Thanks for the advice and a different spin on things, I'm still learning lots as I go along my journey with this new scape. There's just so many different views out there and like you all say every tank is different and it's what works for the tank. So I may just see how I get along now I have added a little more flow   


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## alto (18 Oct 2015)

I also run my tanks at much less than the 10X flow "rule" as does Tropica  ...
there are many reports on ukaps of tanks that seemingly improved (re algae limitations) with increased flow but I believe it's as a contributing factor rather than as a determining factor.

I don't believe that (m)any of the plants cultured/sold in the aquarium trade are actually riverine


----------

