# Green Ravine



## TOO (28 Jan 2014)

New scape in preparation. Nothing concrete yet, but two bits of info to go on: No soil and lots of Tropica plants...I hope to have something up over the next couple of days.

Thomas


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## TOO (5 Feb 2014)

Finally, the journal can start. With some great help from Tropica: Thanks guys!

Basic specs are are as in my previous journal, Alpine Gardens: 75x45x25 optiwhite, Natural Aquario cabinet, ADA Solar 2x36w, Cascade glassware, pressurized CO2.

The basic idea from the outset was to create a scape without soil, i.e. a scape made up only of epiphytic plants and mosses. I had wanted to try this for a while, partly as an experiment to see if it could be done in an attractive way (jury is still out…), and partly to create a less work heavy scape (a nice thing is definitely not having to change 80% of the water every day for three weeks because of ammonia leeching from the soil).

The main challenge was: if not soil, then what? After many half sleepless nights and half good ideas I ended up with lava stone in pieces of aprrox. 1-2x1-2 cm. This is a product that is normally used for filters in garden ponds. It has the advantage of being porous and easy to shape. Porosity is a key as it creates a good surface for bacteria as well as a opportunities for mosses and epiphytes to attach. Overall I found it real easy to work with. Because of the rather large size of the stones and their rough surface it is possible to build relatively steep slopes, which was especially useful at the front where I was looking for this effect.

Drawback of the lava is that it makes the water rather cloudy, even after washing it several times. As you can see, though, after a week it is becoming decently clear, so not a big issue. It also creates a bit of a dusty film on the surface, but this should go away in some weeks.

In terms of plants I have been fortunate enough to have them sponsored by Tropica. I had an initial plant list, but this was kind of blown to bits after two hours in the greenhouses at Tropica. I got what I came for and lots more, hard not be inspired when you are surrounded by gorgeous plants on all sides. This has allowed me to plant the aquarium rather heavily from the outset, a nice thing given that most of the plants are slow growers. In there now: Microsorum ”trident”, Anubias ”petite”, Hygrophila pinnatifida, various kinds of Bucephalandra, mix of mosses (christmas, willow, weeping), and Lomariopsis.

The mosses and Loma provided a challenge in terms of planting. I went for a technique were I placed the mosses on the hillside and then covered them with a single layer of lava stone. The vision is that over time the moss will grow out and up and slowly green the hill. This is a bit of patience project for me as this is not going to happen any time soon...

At the outset I am having full blast on CO2 and fertilizers and light reduced to one bulb for the first weeks.

The pictures should give you an idea of the construction and plant placement. I thought this would be an easy set-up as it was all clear in my head to begin with. But ideas and structures I thought would work did not. Day one was pure frustration and disappointment and kicking of cats and kids (not wife, too risky), the second day, with a clearer mind, was a bit better and ended up with the result you see below. Aquascapes may be pure zen, but getting there is everything but…Well, I know this all looks quite unattractive at the moment, but I hope you can envision it some months from now. I am still in the tweaking and twisting phase, so all thoughts are welcome.

Thomas


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## aliclarke86 (5 Feb 2014)

Well congrats on the sponsor and also on the very unique layout. I am quite excited for you as this is something I have considered in the past, well not this exactly more an anubias only tank. Anyway good luck and keep us posted  

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## Ian Holdich (5 Feb 2014)

Really nice Thomas! Good photography as well.


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## flygja (6 Feb 2014)

That looks pretty cool.


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## Alexander Belchenko (6 Feb 2014)

Poor Tom's cat! 

That layout looks very promising for me, I just wonder if you can add a small bit of wood at left 1/3 of tank on the slope in addition to existing big branch, maybe that increases perspective...


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## Alexander Belchenko (6 Feb 2014)

by "ravine" do you mean that kind of landscape? Ravine - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


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## zanguli-ya-zamba (6 Feb 2014)

Very nice Thomas !! 
I really like the idea of the moss under a layer of lava rocks. It will take long time for the moss to cover that hill, but I am sure that when it will cover it, it will be stunning !! 

I keep an eye on this thread !

Cheers mate


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## TOO (6 Feb 2014)

aliclarke86 said:


> Well congrats on the sponsor and also on the very unique layout. I am quite excited for you as this is something I have considered in the past, well not this exactly more an anubias only tank. Anyway good luck and keep us posted


 
Thanks, yeah Anubias are lovely plants and quite dominate this scape, although they are mainly in the back part.



Ian Holdich said:


> Really nice Thomas! Good photography as well.


 
Thanks, Ian. Especially for the comment on the photography .



flygja said:


> That looks pretty cool.


 
Thanks mate.



Alexander Belchenko said:


> Poor Tom's cat!


 
Why don't you pity the kids? They can't hide under the sofa. About the extra wood, it is something that I am thinking about. Can't decide. Want to keep it simple, but also add some extra dynamism (like life...)...unsolvable.



Alexander Belchenko said:


> by "ravine" do you mean that kind of landscape? Ravine - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


 
Actually, the title more reflects my original idea than the current scape. But I think I will maintain it. After all, for me, a ravine is about sloping sides with rocks and plants that lead to a river or dry riverbed. A far stretch? Anyway I like the ring and rhyme of it.



zanguli-ya-zamba said:


> Very nice Thomas !! I really like the idea of the moss under a layer of lava rocks. It will take long time for the moss to cover that hill, but I am sure that when it will cover it, it will be stunning !! I keep an eye on this thread !


 
Thanks mate, I am glad you can follow the vision. Good to see you back in action.

Thomas


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## tim (6 Feb 2014)

Superb Thomas, how long do you think you'll let this run for ? I see this looking outstanding in 12 months or so, I've been looking at longer term low tech setups a lot recently and this fits the bill nicely, good job mate.


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## TOO (6 Feb 2014)

Thanks a lot, Tim. It makes me happy when people can follow the basic vision. I hope this is for the long term (but I only have one tank, so let's see how far my patience goes...). But you are absolutely right, this is a scape that will take a long time to peak. Perhaps not 12 months, but at least 6...I run it high tech so growth should be fairly fast.

Thomas


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## aliclarke86 (6 Feb 2014)

51 Facebook likes in 3 hours..... Not bad 

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## Alexander Belchenko (7 Feb 2014)




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## TOO (7 Feb 2014)

aliclarke86 said:


> 51 Facebook likes in 3 hours..... Not bad


 
Wow, didn't realize it was on there. Thanks for pointing it out, Ali . Looks like the UKAPS Facebook has become very active lately.

Thomas


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## TOO (10 Mar 2014)

Time for an update . I have been less active on this, which reflects its slooow progress. Should have named the scape PATIENCE. Anyway, I always knew this was going to require just that, so quit whining...But, finally, more than one month into the scape, I am beginning to see some progress, especially with regards to the mosses growing in the lava stone. Hygrophila p. is doing quite well and has already been pruned a few times. Microsorum trident is just beginning to shoot regularly. Buces are doing nicely, in fact added a few more. The idea is for the left corner to fill out to the height of the tank and then try and keep the gradual slope towards the sand. Light is still running at one bulb (36w) and co2 high. I envision that it will take at least 3-5 months more before the area in the front is fully covered. I am considering adding a few more thin branches to create some more dynamism. Not visible here, but the celestial pearl danios are a wonder to behold. Any comments appreciated.

Thomas


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## Alexander Belchenko (10 Mar 2014)

Nice picture, I like slow scapes ATM. I wonder what's the plant with egg-shaped bright green leaves at the right back - is it anubias or some sort of buce? 
IMO, would be nice to add more wood (couple of pieces) on central slope towards front glass to increase perspective and dynamism. 
That left branch went straight to left side glass and does not play well for me, but that's what I see from picture, real view maybe different.
Also, I think top-front view is much more interesting for this scape, it should be very nice to look at it from the height of man standing in front of the tank.


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## Mark Green (10 Mar 2014)

Great concept.

This will look fab when it's filled in. The Hygrophila pinnatifida looks great wish I could get mine looking like that. The black background really makes the green pop. Really nice work


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## Ady34 (11 Mar 2014)

Really love the clean lines you create in your scapes Thomas, this one being no exception 
Undoubtedly this will be a game of pinnatifida trimming and fern thinning whilst waiting for the moss to carpet. The anubias added in numbers like you have wont change much and the buces add a splash of colour variation which compliments both the wood, rubble and pinnatifida. 
Id definitely try to look at the long term and keep lighting low and steady as too much light on exposed slow growers like the anubias may end in gsa...shrimp and ottos will help keep them looking spick and span 
I like the additional piece of wood also, maybe a fraction upright but it helps create a little tension.
Cheerio,
Ady.


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## TOO (11 Mar 2014)

Alexander Belchenko said:


> Nice picture, I like slow scapes ATM. I wonder what's the plant with egg-shaped bright green leaves at the right back - is it anubias or some sort of buce?
> IMO, would be nice to add more wood (couple of pieces) on central slope towards front glass to increase perspective and dynamism.
> That left branch went straight to left side glass and does not play well for me, but that's what I see from picture, real view maybe different.
> Also, I think top-front view is much more interesting for this scape, it should be very nice to look at it from the height of man standing in front of the tank.



Thanks, Alex, I really appreciate how you always have constructive criticism . The plant you mention is an Anubias "petite". The new leaves are quite bright green. Yes, I am planning to add some more thin branches, perhaps even some that go out of the water - what do you think? Even if I complain a bit, I am quite happy with the slow approach at the moment as things are quite busy otherwise - so nice lifestyle compatibility with this scape .



Mark Green said:


> Great concept.
> This will look fab when it's filled in. The Hygrophila pinnatifida looks great wish I could get mine looking like that. The black background really makes the green pop. Really nice work



Thanks, mate. I have been unsuccessful with pinna before, so quite surprised at how well it grows here with relatively limited light. CO2 is high, though, so seems to confirm the low-medium light and high CO2 theory. 



Ady34 said:


> Really love the clean lines you create in your scapes Thomas, this one being no exception
> Undoubtedly this will be a game of pinnatifida trimming and fern thinning whilst waiting for the moss to carpet. The anubias added in numbers like you have wont change much and the buces add a splash of colour variation which compliments both the wood, rubble and pinnatifida.
> Id definitely try to look at the long term and keep lighting low and steady as too much light on exposed slow growers like the anubias may end in gsa...shrimp and ottos will help keep them looking spick and span
> I like the additional piece of wood also, maybe a fraction upright but it helps create a little tension.
> ...



Thanks so much, Ady. Greatly appreciated. You are right about the light. In fact I am spotting some tiny algae on the rims of the Anubias, so probably need to cut a little more back on the light. 

Thomas


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## Thom_Hardy (12 Mar 2014)

Love this scape! As a reasonably new member to planted tanks I find this very inspiring!!! And can consolidate with you on the cats and children issue! Having 3 cats a pug and a 4 year old is a on going battle! 

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## TOO (12 Mar 2014)

Thom_Hardy said:


> Love this scape! As a reasonably new member to planted tanks I find this very inspiring!!! And can consolidate with you on the cats and children issue! Having 3 cats a pug and a 4 year old is a on going battle!



Thanks, mate. Glad if this can be an inspiration. Love my kids, just DON'T talk to me when I am cleaning glassware!!!

Thomas


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## TOO (4 May 2014)

An overdue update. Pic is a bit dark because I have raised the lights quite high to see if I can get rid of the bba that seems to haunt all my setups. Not that much has happened since the last update. Moss is gradually covering the lava stones and Buce, while gorgeous, really demand patience. Main change is probably the addition of a couple of extra branches at the front. It is not visible here, but rims of slow growers suffer a bit from bba. Currently trying to combat by lowering lights and doing heavy WC.


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## tim (5 May 2014)

Maturing really well Thomas, bba is so frustrating just when I think I have it beat it seems to pop it's little tuffty head back up again, sure this will look outstanding in a couple more months.


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## TOO (6 May 2014)

Thanks, Tim. Yeah, I estimate a month or two before it is "done".

Bba: Can't break the code on this. 

Thomas


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## TOO (7 May 2014)

This time not an overdue, but premature update. But I got so sick and tired of looking at the dark photo above, which does not represent the scape as it looks in real life, that I spent some hours playing with my new Nikon D5200 to find a way to take some decent shots. Going manual with shutter speed 1/50, aperture 5.6 and ISO 800 has made a big improvement. Overall lighting level is the same as above. A new plant is coming in to finalize the planting...who guesses it will get an immediate free "like" .


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## James D (8 May 2014)

Looking great Too!

My guess...... the background etc looks perfect so I'll say a bit of Fissidens for the wood.


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## TOO (8 May 2014)

Sorry, James, not correct . Something lighter green...

Thomas


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## Mick.Dk (8 May 2014)

Don't you DARE put Riccia in this .......


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## TOO (8 May 2014)

Mick.Dk said:


> Don't you DARE put Riccia in this .......



Don't worry, Mick! It will be just a discrete touch of lighter green to connect the dark green of the foreground with the lighter green of the Microsorum at the back. Not a moss, not a fern, not a buce, but something that can grow without soil.

Thomas


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## Mick.Dk (8 May 2014)

Good luck, if you're really goingvthe Utricularia-way, then..........


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## TOO (8 May 2014)

Nice try, but I am sure I would fail with this...also there is not really room for it...I need something that can delicately float over the mosses and between the branches...hint: needs a lot of mechanical retardation...should be easy now...


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## Mick.Dk (8 May 2014)

Ok - yep, too easy now.
Well, you'll have to get your long scissors out then. I'm maintaining tanks with Hyd. trip. these days,(thank you George and Adrie !!!) so I know..........
- I think that'll actually work, though. Nice idea !!


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## TOO (8 May 2014)

Tadaaaa...you have earned your free like despite a bit of help......really glad you can see the idea...it should not dominate at all, but just create some contrast...it is a lovely plant, used it in Alpine Gardens...hope it will grow despite the relatively low light...


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## Mick.Dk (8 May 2014)

It'll grow - it's a weed, Thomas (and a nice one, ofcourse [DOUBLEPOST=1399585385][/DOUBLEPOST]A calm background (like your moss) will enhance the image of the lobed leaves, making them soooo much more refined. That's why I like the choice and the idea.


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## Martin in Holland (9 May 2014)

All plants we use are considered to be a weed ...
I tried to grow HT at lower lights before, it did OK-ish but not great....I guess it will do good in your tank


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## TOO (9 May 2014)

Mick.Dk said:


> It'll grow - it's a weed, Thomas (and a nice one, ofcourse [DOUBLEPOST=1399585385][/DOUBLEPOST]A calm background (like your moss) will enhance the image of the lobed leaves, making them soooo much more refined. That's why I like the choice and the idea.



Thanks, Mick.

Got the plants today, will plant them in this weekend.



Martin in China said:


> All plants we use are considered to be a weed ...



This scape is very unweedy, everything is slooow. Which is kind of nice, kind of frustrating...depends on your mood.

Had a nightmare the other day where I was forced to sit and watch a Buce grow.

Thomas


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## Martin in Holland (10 May 2014)

TOO said:


> Had a nightmare the other day where I was forced to sit and watch a Buce grow.



Weird dreams you have....I dream of totally different things


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## TOO (10 Jun 2014)

Slowly nearing completion. As discussed above I recently added some H. trip around the edges of the wood. I think it has a strong effect in softening the lines and creating some light in an otherwise dark scape. The moss hill is now also more or less covered. Sorry for the undercleaned glassware. I hope you like it.

Thomas


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## Martin in Holland (11 Jun 2014)

lotsa Buce...most have cost you a fortune.


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## zanguli-ya-zamba (11 Jun 2014)

Hi Thomas 
Very nice mate !! 
I really like the effect that Hid. Trip. Have added to this scape   Congrats for your hard work and patience   

Cheers


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## aliclarke86 (11 Jun 2014)

Fantastic! This has really become a beauty! Are you nearly ready to back to co2? 

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## Alastair (11 Jun 2014)

Brilliant Thomas. 
What a huge transformation from the original set up. Simple yet big impact. Very nice

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## Alexander Belchenko (11 Jun 2014)

Peaceful. Very nice and simple in good sense. Really like it.

The amount of moss on the edge with the sand and its shape pushed me to a thought: you might want to add some more moss at right side where buces grow on the edge with the sand, to smooth transition there as well. I'd say: several stones with moss. And 1-2 months more.  Well, you know, I suppose you're OK to know what other people see looking on your tank. It's already great, that's really small detail that for some reason catches my eye.


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## TOO (11 Jun 2014)

Thanks a lot for all your positive comments.

Martin: There are not that many Buce as you might think. Many of the low plants at the back are Anubias "petite". In total there are 8 species/variants of Buce.

Zanguli: Thanks, glad you see what I see regarding the trip. How is your own scape coming these days?

Ali: Thanks, not sure what you mean, this was always co2 injected .

Alastair: Thanks, yeah when I am only semi-happy with the scape it helps to go back and see how it looked at set-up .

Alex: I always appreciate people's comments . You learn something every time. I can see what you mean and this could surely work. On the other hand I have come to like the steep transition. And also I intend to complete the scape shortly.

Thomas


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## Robert H. Tavera (12 Jun 2014)

awesome concept congrats !! looks so peacefull and relaxing !


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## Alexander Belchenko (12 Jun 2014)

Thomas, do you have any fish in there? I can't see it on photo, but maybe I missed it.

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## TOO (12 Jun 2014)

Robert, thanks .

Alex, I have a small group of D. margaritatus, a wonderful fish that does well in my rather hard water (actually found some small fry the other day). I have lost a few to jumping so not an entirely open-top safe species. 

Thomas


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## TOO (19 Jun 2014)

Final pics from this journey. Not actually taking it down just yet, but since I will be away for most of the summer I expect the scape to fall apart, so decided to take the final pics now. Thanks for all the positive feedback and thanks again to Tropica for sponsoring the plants. What's next...? Too many ideas...More will follow in August. Hopefully I will get some inspiration when I visit Japan this summer.


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## Alexander Belchenko (20 Jun 2014)

Great scape! Now I understand why you like the right part, looking at photo #2. I bet this is position you watch the tank most often, doesn't you? Even though there is a wall (?). 

Wish you publish your photos somewhere like Flickr so we can see them in bigger resolution. 
I see the fish! as well now.

Happy vacation!


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## TOO (20 Jun 2014)

Thanks, Alex. No, actually the tank is squeezed in between the wall and the girls' clothes closet (it's big), so I view it more or less frontally.

Thomas


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