# British summer time



## Tim Harrison

Well it's British summer time again. Thanks to an EU directive it could be one of the last times the clocks change. Member states get to decide whether they change their clocks for the last time in October or March. The UK is no longer in the EU but it's still likely to follow suit.

Would you vote for permanent British winter time (lighter mornings and darker evenings) or permanent British summer time (darker mornings and lighter evenings)?


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## Geoffrey Rea

Under the current circumstances, personal concern only extends to “should I get changed now?” Time is irrelevant. Flaunting the hobo look...


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## Matt @ ScapeEasy

Suspect darker mornings and lighter evenings would get my vote... can’t deal with the mind bending question of which way this would mean I would need to vote....


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## Tim Harrison

Matt @ ScapeEasy said:


> Suspect darker mornings and lighter evenings would get my vote... can’t deal with the mind bending question of which way this would mean I would need to vote....


For British summer time Matt


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## Matt @ ScapeEasy

Thanks!!! I always overthink the does this mean I get more or less sleep question...


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## Onoma1

Can I vote for European Summer time? It sounds so much warmer


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## Tim Harrison

Yes you can, British summer time is a proxy vote for European summer time


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## Aqua sobriquet

I voted summertime but I actually don’t care, I just wish they’d stop messing about with my body clock twice a year. Beggars belief that any civilised society would do this. Just put the clocks forward 30 mins in summer or 30 minutes back in winter and leave it like it!


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## Zeus.

Summer time gets my vote


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## igirisujin

Lighter mornings, every time. I don’t function past lunchtime, so an earlier start makes all the difference.


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## Aqua sobriquet

igirisujin said:


> Lighter mornings, every time. I don’t function past lunchtime, so an earlier start makes all the difference.



I’m actually the opposite. Being retired I like to get up about 09:30 and don’t get going till about 11:00!


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## SRP3006

I'm up before 4am weekdays and always look forward to this time of year, into the summer, where I can see light early on in my shift. The idea of it getting light at 9am in the winter is quite depressing. Guess I like it how it is,


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## dw1305

Hi all,
I'll be honest I hate getting up at any time of the day, and the first half an hour of any day is spent drinking a black coffee and contemplating the pointlessness of existence (and often it is all down hill from there for the rest of the day). 

So for me "Double Summer Time" in the summer (GMT +2) and "British Summer Time" in the winter (GMT+1)  for me. I need all the daylight I can get. 

We had "Double Summer Time" in the 1970's (which I remember) and before that in the second world war (which I don't).

Some people might describe this (accurately) as European time, but I'm going to call it "Glorious Empire Time" to tap into the zeitgeist of the times.

cheers Darrel


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## Aqua sobriquet

I’m not going to bother trying to find a link but I read an article some years back saying studies had shown it was not healthy to get up early in the morning. The earliest suggested time for most people to rise in the morning being 08:30. I know lots of people who out of habit still get up at 07:00 like I used to have to, even though they no longer work.


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## Geoffrey Rea

dw1305 said:


> the first half an hour of any day is spent drinking a black coffee and contemplating the pointlessness of existence (and often it is all down hill from there for the rest of the day).



It’s not all black holes and stray photons lost across the universe yet.


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## Geoffrey Rea

Geoffrey Rea said:


> It’s not all black holes and stray photons lost across the universe yet.



We’re saving that for 2021


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## PARAGUAY

Have the EU told Boris?


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## lazybones51

I'd vote for lighter evenings (British summer time) that way I can do more outside after work. Mornings are wasted on school runs and driving to work, which can be done in the dark haha.


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## Andy Taylor

Summer time gets my vote
Stay safe all!!


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## Onoma1

PARAGUAY said:


> Have the EU told Boris?



No he wasn't told, no sorry he lost the email, no it's a problem with communication, and anyway we are out of Europe. We won't be disadvantaged by not collaborating with those Europeans. We will go it alone and great British Companies will build a Great British Summertime. The fact that Dyson currently build vacuum cleaners and don't manufacture in the UK is irrelevant...we will win the war. Can't have any of that defeatist talk. Anyway, it's all the fault of the Chinese, they didn't give us enough notice on the change in time. Damm foreigners...can't be trusted.


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## dw1305

Hi all, 





Aqua sobriquet said:


> I’m not going to bother trying to find a link but I read an article some years back saying studies had shown it was not healthy to get up early in the morning. The earliest suggested time for most people to rise in the morning being 08:30. I know lots of people who out of habit still get up at 07:00 like I used to have to, even though they no longer work.


New Scientist ? <"Changing clocks twice a year is bad for health and energy use Read more: https://www.newscientist.com/articl...-bad-for-health-and-energy-use/#ixzz6IAYheSHB">, there is also this one <"The biological reason why it’s so hard for teenagers to wake up early for school"> and <"I’m already on British Summer Time – and I can’t recommend it highly enough">.

cheers Darrel


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## Aqua sobriquet

Good article Darrel, thanks for that.


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## PARAGUAY

@Aqua sobriquet . Wish someone could explain this to my dog hes a Border Collie ,farm bred from working collies, one of the most intelligent of all breeds but he insists on barking at 5.30am for his early walk clock or no clock all seasons


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## Aqua sobriquet

PARAGUAY said:


> @Aqua sobriquet . Wish someone could explain this to my dog hes a Border Collie ,farm bred from working collies, one of the most intelligent of all breeds but he insists on barking at 5.30am for his early walk clock or no clock all seasons


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## zozo

I'm not British, but i never understood the silliness of scrambling with the clock back and forth from summer to wintertime... 

What was actually first?.. It was originally just summertime, wasn't it? If it was up to me, cut the crap and let it be...


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## dw1305

Hi all, 





zozo said:


> What was actually first?.. It was originally just summertime, wasn't it?


It was originally "GMT" <"Greenwich Mean Time">. 

Because the prime <"meridian for longitude"> could be anywhere on the globe and the British decided in was at the Royal Observatory in Greenwich. It sort of makes sense, because the International Date Line is in the middle of the Pacific, but I'm not sure that was the reason.  Under GMT (at Greenwich) when the sun is at its zenith it's 12 midday. 

Before we had trains we had local time, so <"Bristol Time" was ten minutes later than "London Time">.

One of the arguments that certain portion of our press have put forward against moving to permanent British Summer Time is that it would be "unpatriotic" to abandon GMT. This was Peter Hitchens in the <"Mail on Sunday">. 





> Now, the European Union, which has ruled our time since 2001, plans to give up doing so. Whether or not we leave the EU, we will soon be free to set our own clocks as we wish. We can at last go back to Greenwich Mean Time, real, organic, British time, the whole year round.



I'm going to start a campaign for the <"return of the Groat"> as "_real, organic British_" money. I'm predicting some success for this, and possibly backing from large Hedge Funds and Russian Oligarchs resident in London.

cheers Darrel


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## jaypeecee

dw1305 said:


> I'm going to start a campaign for the <"return of the Groat"> as "_real, organic British_" money. I'm predicting some success for this, and possibly backing from large Hedge Funds and Russian Oligarchs resident in London.





JPC


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## dw1305

Hi all, 





jaypeecee said:


> JPC


....and <"James Dyson">.

cheers Darrel


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## zozo

That would be ReGro after a BrExit...


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## dw1305

Hi all, 





zozo said:


> That would be ReGro after a BrExit...


"ReGro" I like it. I say <"_let's get it done__">, _it could prove popular and develop un-stoppable momentum. 

We've already got pestilence (probably followed by famine), so why not a <"return to feudalism"> and the groat to go with it? 

Slogan "_I maybe poor, but at least I'm British. True patriots support real British poverty, poverty you can rely on, it's built to last"_ 

cheers Darrel


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## dw1305

Hi all,


dw1305 said:


> Slogan "_I maybe poor, but at least I'm British. True patriots support real British poverty, poverty you can rely on, it's built to last"_


I've had a re-think, "_Make Britain Groat again_" is snappier.

Even later edit: I've had another rethink and "_Support the Groat, it's the GOAT_" is my latest offering.

cheers Darrel


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## LondonDragon

Summer offcourse! who needs darker evennings??


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## Onoma1

dw1305 said:


> Hi all,I've had a re-think, "_Make Britain Groat_" is snappier.
> 
> cheers Darrel



Ah but do you have an oven ready Groat? That's the clincher for me. Unless it's oven ready I am just not interested.

Summer time, it has to be summer time (hastily mentioning the topic of the thread).


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## Tim Harrison

Thanks guys that's pretty conclusive. Permanent British summer time it is then.
I'll write to Boris and tell him we've made our minds up


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## Zeus.

Well to be honest Tim as soon as he sees your 'moderator' status he will have little choice


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## dw1305

Hi all,





Tim Harrison said:


> Thanks guys that's pretty conclusive. Permanent British summer time it is then.
> I'll write to Boris and tell him we've made our minds up





Zeus. said:


> Tim as soon as he sees your 'moderator' status


.....but that is a sane and sensible suggestion, and "super moderator" sounds suspiciously like an expert...........

Also just remember the <"Badger cull">, that could actually be a win for GMT.

cheers Darrel


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## Tim Harrison

dw1305 said:


> Hi all,.....but that is a sane and sensible suggestion, and "super moderator" sounds suspiciously like an expert...........
> 
> Also just remember the <"Badger cull">, that could actually be a win for GMT.
> 
> cheers Darrel


How so Darrel? Not sure I understand what you mean


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## dw1305

Hi all,


Tim Harrison said:


> How so Darrel? Not sure I understand what you mean


If the badgers have <"_moved the goal-posts__">? _How can you be sure that 17 - 2 is a conclusive victory for BST?

It might be that it looks like a conclusive win, but following some careful analysis of the figures it maybe that "BST 17 - GMT 2" is actually a vote for GMT.

As an example a couple of years ago we had a <"local referendum in Corsham"> which asked us if we would mind having "_a thousand new houses built if the railway station was re-opened and infrastructure improved?_" We had already been promised the railway and infrastructure changes when the <"MOD built Basil Hill>.

The result was a truly overwhelming win for "_No new houses_" and the outcome was............ 1200 new houses, no new infrastructure and no re-opening of the railway station.

cheers Darrel


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## Tim Harrison

Is it a comment on how cynical and undemocratic local government is? 
And how they manipulate questionnaire bias and data?
I have firsthand experience of both...


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## Witcher

dw1305 said:


> The result was a truly overwhelming win for "_No new houses_" and the outcome was............ 1200 new houses, no new infrastructure and no re-opening of the railway station.


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## dw1305

Hi all, 





Tim Harrison said:


> Is it a comment on how cynical and undemocratic local government is? And how they manipulate questionnaire bias and data? I have firsthand experience of both...


I suppose it is, but we all have the right to vote and choose our representatives, possibly the issue is that the criteria that we choose those representatives on aren't always the right ones. 

cheers Darrel


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## Onoma1

dw1305 said:


> Hi all,.....but that is a sane and sensible suggestion, and "super moderator" sounds suspiciously like an expert



The expert opinion will of course be filtered through a political understanding of the situation and Tim will then be asked to present the response as unbiased representative of all experts.

I am sure Tim can explain to Boris that we have proved a fact, not a hypothesis, our approach to  modelling this problem is not a construct and the data is (cough cough) comprehensive and accurate to allow generalizability.


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## Onoma1

Onoma1 said:


> The expert opinion will of course be filtered through a political understanding of the situation and Tim will then be asked to present the response as unbiased representative of all experts.
> 
> I am sure Tim can explain to Boris that we have proved a fact, not a hypothesis, our approach to  modelling this problem is not a construct and the data is (cough cough) comprehensive and accurate enough to allow generalizability.


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## Siege

@Tim Harrison I think the meeting will go really well, if you liken Boris to Winston Churchill, just don’t ask him how many kids his got!


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## Tim Harrison

dw1305 said:


> Hi all, I suppose it is, but we all have the right to vote and choose our representatives, possibly the issue is that the criteria that we choose those representatives on aren't always the right ones. cheers Darrel


Most folk are lazy when it comes to choosing representatives and just stick to what they know. They're probably never chosen on the basis of how they would perform under this or that situation.
But then I can understand why. Most politicians don't do anything unless it's in their interest; especially for the likes of us muggles; we don't have the benefit of a Hogwarts school tie 



Onoma1 said:


> The expert opinion will of course be filtered through a political understanding of the situation and Tim will then be asked to present the response as unbiased representative of all experts.
> 
> I am sure Tim can explain to Boris that we have proved a fact, not a hypothesis, our approach to  modelling this problem is not a construct and the data is (cough cough) comprehensive and accurate to allow generalizability.


And then they'll completely ignore the facts and do whatever it is they were planning on doing anyway 



Siege said:


> @Tim Harrison I think the meeting will go really well, if you liken Boris to Winston Churchill, just don’t ask him how many kids his got!


Frankly, that'd have a far greater chance of success 



Witcher said:


>


...what he said.


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## sparkyweasel

dw1305 said:


> we all have the right to vote and choose our representatives,


 . . . from a list of candidates who give the impression that you couldn't trust any of them to run a whelk stall.


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## dw1305

Hi all,





sparkyweasel said:


> . . . from a list of candidates who give the impression that you couldn't trust any of them to r*un a whelk stall.*


Ken Clarke about Boris Johnson, I claim my prize.

Cheers Darrel


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## dw1305

Hi all,





dw1305 said:


> It might be that it looks like a conclusive win, but following some careful analysis of the figures it maybe that "BST 17 - GMT 2" is actually a vote for GMT.


I see since I wrote this there has actually been a *stunning reversal in fortunes*, with the vote for GMT increasing by an impressive 50%, but only a worrying 6% rise for BST.

From a more appropriate, datum BST and GMT are now running neck and neck, and the *momentum is definitely with GMT.*





cheers Darrel


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## Tim Harrison

That's all just spin


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## dean

Summertime 
I’m not a morning person 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## dw1305

Hi all,


dw1305 said:


> I'm going to start a campaign for the <"return of the Groat"> as "_real, organic British_" money. I'm predicting some success for this, and possibly backing from large Hedge Funds and Russian Oligarchs resident in London.


It looks like make <"Britain Groat Again"> has moved a <"step closer">.

cheers Darrel


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## LondonDragon

dw1305 said:


> Hi all,
> 
> It looks like make <"Britain Groat Again"> has moved a <"step closer">.
> 
> cheers Darrel


imperial mesurements... blerrkkk


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## dw1305

Hi all,


LondonDragon said:


> imperial mesurements...


I'm 58 and when I was at primary school in the late 1960s / early 1970s even then we were all taught currency, weights and measures in decimal/metric.

Personally I can go from the old imperial measures to the "new" measures without too much difficulty. I can still remember that there are 22 yards in a chain, 8 chains in furlong, 8 furlongs in a mile, 240 d (old pennies) in a pound, 12d in a shilling and 20 shillings in a pound etc., but why would I possibly want to? And nobody much younger than me is going to have any familiarity with imperial measures.

cheers Darrel


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## Tim Harrison

Even ancient civilisations were metric...😬
1 cubit = (pi - phi ^ 2)m​


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## not called Bob

I am always working in UTC, so sticking to GMT would be easier for me, though here is less of an issue thane the countries with parts of an hour different Myanmar with 6:30 difference and some jet lag resulted in a few errors


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## dw1305

Hi all, 
In <"March 2020 I wrote">: 


dw1305 said:


> We've already got pestilence (probably followed by famine)


After successfully predicting empty supermarket shelves, I'd like to say that I'm now doing Tarot card reading and spiritualism as well.  

cheers Darrel


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## rebel

dw1305 said:


> contemplating the pointlessness of existence


HAHA! This is so true.


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