# New to EI dosing, algae questions



## drjack (30 Aug 2011)

Hi, I am new to EI dosing, started about 3 weeks ago. I had algae problems I thought would be corrected by EI. First here are the details of my tank:

Tank:	Juwel Vision 180 with 125 litres/33 US gallons water. 
Lighting:	Medium - 2x35W iQuatics T5 tubes 8 hours/day = 0.6 watts/litre or 2.2 watts/US gal
Substrate:	Caribsea Eco-Complete
Filtration: 	Juwel supplied Bioflow 3 internal plus Eheim Ecco pro 200 external both 600lph
CO2: 	D-D Pressurised CO2, Bubbles/Min = 120, Drop Checkers both light green using 4dKh bromoblue.
Plants	~125
Fish	27: 1xCory , 2xOtocinclus , 2xChain loaches , 6xRasboras , 10xCardinals , 3xWidows , 3xShrimp

Using the info on this site I calculated my EI dosing as follows for my 33 gal tank:
		               KNO3	KH2PO4	MgSO4	Trace
Monthly 20gal (tsp)		2.4	0.8	6	0.4
Monthly 33 gal (tsp)		3.6	1.2	10	0.8

My problems are these:
Before I started EI dosing I had red beard algae covering moss on two pieces of wood, what looked like BBA on echinodorous leaves and some fuzz algae on stem plants.

After 3 weeks of EI dosing,and installing a small tunze pump to improve circulation I still have red beard algae covering the moss on the wood and I still get some fuzz algae on the leaves of my Ludwigia repens Rubin. I am also getting what looks like green beard algae on some of the slower growing leaves.

I was hoping that EI would ensure the plants had what they needed so avoiding most aglae types. My questions are:

1. Do my calculations look right for EI, or have I made a boo-boo somewhere and the plants are still not getting enough?
2. Should I discard the moss which is now heavily coated in red beard algae and start again or will it disappear if I can fix whatever is wrong in the tank?
3. From what I have read BBA (red and black) seems to be caused by a lack of CO2. But I think my CO2 is okay at 120 bpm. I have 2 drop checkers at each end of the tank filled with bromoblue and they are both light green. So should this be okay?
4. My small Tunze pump (nanostream 6015) is very strong, too strong, it really blasts the plants near it. Does anyone know of something more gentle that would give me circulation without Hurricane Irene ?

All help and views greatly appreciated.
Kind Regards, David


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## m_attt (30 Aug 2011)

have you not filled you tank up? as I thought your tank is a 180 litres.

if 180litres, here's a link to EI dose calcs for that size tank.
viewtopic.php?f=11&t=15287


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## drjack (31 Aug 2011)

Yes, it is a 180 litres empty, but I measured it as I filled it up after adding substrate and rocks etc and it contains 125 litres (approx) of water. So I based all calculations on 125 - hope this is correct.


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## Burnleygaz (31 Aug 2011)

You should really base it on tank volume unfilled to start with.


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## drjack (1 Sep 2011)

Thanks for the feedback, I will adjust the dosage to 180l and see how we go.


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## ceg4048 (3 Sep 2011)

drjack said:
			
		

> Hi, I am new to EI dosing, started about 3 weeks ago. I had algae problems I thought would be corrected by EI....
> 
> I was hoping that EI would ensure the plants had what they needed so avoiding most aglae types.


Hi,
   This is one of the more misunderstood aspects of EI and requires a bit of clarification:
At the most fundamental level, EI has nothing to do with algae directly. The purpose of EI is to ensure availability of nutrients in order optimize plant health. Therefore, there is a direct connection between nutrient availability and plant health. As nutrient availability increases so does the probability of plant health.

In our tank systems we observe that the probability of algal attacks increase as the health of the plants decrease.

Therefore, there is only an indirect  inverse relationship between nutrient availability and algal attacks.

On face value it appears as if we're skirting the issue or are playing with semantics, but it's actually a very important distinction between direct versus indirect relationships. The reason is because plant health can fail or decline independently of nutrient availability. So for example, plant health can fail due to poor CO2 uptake, which has little to do with nutrient availability. When this happens algal blooms appear which are related to poor CO2.

That's why, when we encounter an algal bloom, we should consider that we are fighting a PLANT HEALTH issue. The next logical step is to identify the cause of ill health, which may be nutrient related or CO2 related. The algae described in your original post are generally CO2 related.

Hope this clarifies.


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## drjack (5 Sep 2011)

Thanks for the clarification, very useful. I agree. I decided to go the EI route to at least try to ensure I have enough of the right nutrients to elimate that possibility. I can't really do much more with the lights short of a major investment so that left CO2 as the last variable. I have a D-D CO2 system which operates at the specified 1 bar pressure maximum. To my cost I have found out that an atomiser I bought won't work unless the pressure is a lot higher (I tried it) so now I place the diffuser directly under my Eheim inflow pipe. A problem (?) I think I have is that the maximum bubble rate I can get is ~ 120/140 bpm, yet I still have some fuzz and beard algae some rust/red on the moss and some green on a few leaves.I also dose 5ml of Flourish Excel every day. My lIghts run from 2pm to 10pm. My CO2 was set to come on at midday and go off at 8pm.  However, I have now set the CO2 to come on at 10 am and off at 8pm. Is this a valid way to increase CO2 if I can't up the bubble rate?

Kind Regards, David


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## donnorris (11 Nov 2011)

Burnleygaz said:
			
		

> You should really base it on tank volume unfilled to start with.


WHY ?


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## spyder (11 Nov 2011)

donnorris said:
			
		

> Burnleygaz said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



EI works on principle that there is never any deficiencies in nutrients. Trying to cut back to allow for hardscape can introduce deficiencies. Keep it simple and dose to the tanks capacity.

To sum it all up. It's better to have excess than not enough otherwise you risk health issues in your plants and related algae.


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