# 1300 litre chocolate lake



## Alastair

I thought id get under way with starting my newest journal as its only a few weeks away until its here. 
I cant think of a name as yet but im sure it will be something with 'chocolate' in .. 

I was originally going to have it acrylic and bigger in size but I would seriously have lost all my dining room space leaving a very tight space so no room for photo shots etc. 

Tank: custom build 180cm x 110cm x 70cm height approx 1400 litres. 

Cabinet: edited - now to a powder coated steel frame with adjustable feet, and cladded with mdf wrapped in white matt vinyl

Lighting: TMC 1500 nd's with multi controller

Filtration: eheim 2180's with tmc glass lily pipes and a new fluval FX6 with custom acrylic outlet 

Media: Seachem Matrix with alfagrog, and purigen 

Substrate: Tropica plant growth substrate capped with lots of Unipac Samoa fine and TMC Nutrasoil for helping with ph..

I also have 2 huge bags of alfa grog so might smash them up and use like the ada power sand special at the base and to add height. 


Heating 2 x eheim jagers hidden out of view

Hard scape: 
One enormous 5ft long by 3 foot high piece of driftwood and some smaller pieces. 

Petrified wood from unipac to accent the wood and add moss

Ferts: aquarium plant food ei salts 

Plants: 

Anubias bonsai 
Anubias nana petite and coffefolia cryptocoryne becketti petchi
C . willisii
C.wendtii green and tropica
C.parva 
Echinodorus aquartica
Fontinalis sp willow
Taxiphylum spiky
Xmas mosw 
Microsorum pteropus trident and narrow 

Cladophorales or marimo moss ball torn up and attached to the wood.  I saw this on the big pets at home tank and it looked really nice and imagine it wont need trimming either

Also maiden hair fern attached to the emmersed wood. 

Fauna: 
150 -200 chocolate gouramis 
20 licorice gourami 
 a few cherries
30 to 40 corydoras habrosus 

20 ish ottocinclus 

Ive kind of got in my head how I want this to look and have done a few drawings which ill take a snap of at some point

Thats all I can think of for now thanks for looking everyone


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## John S

Sounds a monster. Hope you are not on a water meter?


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## Tim Harrison

Holy moly sounds like you've got your very own Pets @ Home project planned...you'll be roping us all in to help next


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## Lindy

Can't wait!


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## island lad

I'm going to follow this with great interest Alastair so keep us updated with loads of detail. What's your biggest tank to date compared to this one ?


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## George Farmer

I'm watching this bad boy.

Pity you live so far away mate - I'd love to help out.


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## Gary Nelson

Blimey, that's a biggy!!! Sounds great and your plans for it sound like a good solid foundation, I will be looking forward to following this mate and seeing some pics once you get started - Those 'chocs' will be in heaven


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## George Farmer

It should be called "Amazing Alastair's Chocolate Factory".


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## Edvet

Finally, a decent sized tank....

Please think about automated waterchanges, and hook it up to drain, makes life easier.
Pm me if you want to spar about it.


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## Jason Stanford

very interested in this, I have 500 litres, and my next tank is 900 litres, so will be interesting reading your setup and seeing how it all works out


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## George Farmer

Hi Alastair

Why do you intend to add CO2 eventually? Are you going for more demanding plants and higher lighting?

Personally I feel that part of the magic associated with your previous setups is that high impact can be created with lower energy.  The breeding of delicate animals is testament to that.

Just curious.


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## justin85

Will be watching this!  looking forward to seeing the cabinet you build to.


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## Alastair

John S said:


> Sounds a monster. Hope you are not on a water meter?



Ha ha nope just an annual whopper of a water bill but given the water I use I dont mind paying all that lol...
Id be reduced to little nanos if I were on a meter. 



Troi said:


> Holy moly sounds like you've got your very own Pets @ Home project planned...you'll be roping us all in to help next


It was the pets at home tank that's spurred me on to get this one up and running as looking at the shear size of p@h tank and the look on all the guys faces when theyd done was priceless. 
Plus I want to get in my own tank 



ldcgroomer said:


> Can't wait!



Hiya, me neither im getting stupidly excited with this one now. I shoulf be fighting fit by then too so full of energy. 



island lad said:


> I'm going to follow this with great interest Alastair so keep us updated with loads of detail. What's your biggest tank to date compared to this one ?



Thanks island lad ill definitely keep you all updated with any news or pictures or bits of hard scape that comes or bags of substrate ill have stacked up in the outhouse/garage. 
Other than this my biggest is my currently running journal 'a box of chocolates licorice n allsorts' which is 4ftx4ft and around 550 lites. 



Gary Nelson said:


> Blimey, that's a biggy!!! Sounds great and your plans for it sound like a good solid foundation, I will be looking forward to following this mate and seeing some pics once you get started - Those 'chocs' will be in heaven



I know mate ha, I really have pushed my space limits on this one, I was ever so tempted to go 130 cm front to back but that really would be asking for knocks from taking my bikes past. Or SQUEEZING should I say. 
Its quite a basic layout but one I hope will have lots of impact and all blend nicely. Probably be the hardest one ive ever done. 
Chocolate heaven sounds like a possible title name thanks mate. 
My quest is to have a tidy under cabinet too but doubt that. 



Edvet said:


> Finally, a decent sized tank....
> 
> Please think about automated waterchanges, and hook it up to drain, makes life easier.
> Pm me if you want to spar about it.



Hi edvet, I do my water changes by siphoning via hose straight to thr garden by suction alone and on this tank ill just fill back up with the hose from the mixer tap..



Jason Stanford said:


> very interested in this, I have 500 litres, and my next tank is 900 litres, so will be interesting reading your setup and seeing how it all works out



Cheers jason... my first tank was a 450 few years back then went down slightly then back up in size then to this. But this is the last time now. Unless I move to a bigger house in a few years.


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## Alastair

George Farmer said:


> I'm watching this bad boy.
> 
> Pity you live so far away mate - I'd love to help out.


" scratches head whilst thinking how much it would cost me to get you up here and back home" ha ha  that's the only downside to where I live all the great scapers are below me or above



George Farmer said:


> Hi Alastair
> 
> Why do you intend to add CO2 eventually? Are you going for more demanding plants and higher lighting?
> 
> Personally I feel that part of the magic associated with your previous setups is that high impact can be created with lower energy.  The breeding of delicate animals is testament to that.
> 
> Just curious.



Very very valid point George and one I am toying with and stuck in two minds about. 
Obviously it's less demanding low light plant species ill be using and running the leds isnt over kill in the light department. 
Yout right ive had great success with my two previous lower energy set ups and with the breeding happening was one of the reasons I thought to postpone the co2 also. 
I think ill go back and edit it and just put a note to say not going down that route now.  

Your curiosity curbed my curiosity too mate and think youve helped me answer me own debate. Ill stick with low energy thanks George. 

Ill just plant extremely heavy from the start so it looks grown in... 

How far away do you live again??? Ha ha 


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## Jason Stanford

im really inexperienced so this maybe a stupid question, but can you not use co2, wait until they are grown in, then turn the co2 off? or do they die? melt or whatever.


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## tim

Massive, can't wait, you do know you could fit your current tank inside the cabinet for this one and have a double decker to keep the chocolate theme going  congrats on the babies mate top stuff al will be following this one for sure.


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## kirk

You going to loose yourself in that set up one you sit down infront of it when you Finnish . Sounds like hour upon hour of messing a tweeking things. I've just down sized our tank. but it is now 80cm wide instead of 60 and notice the fish sort of shoaling which they didn't before.  I bet the fish pack into  shoals nicely in the size your planning.  Liking this journal.


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## nanocube

Go on any pictures plz?


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## Michael W

Definitely looking forward for your new project, I'm sure it won't disappoint!




Jason Stanford said:


> im really inexperienced so this maybe a stupid question, but can you not use co2, wait until they are grown in, then turn the co2 off? or do they die? melt or whatever.


 
Yes you can but the process in which you remove the CO2 must be very gradual or else the plants will melt or die. Giving plants CO2 is like giving them drugs, they won't go off the drugs as soon as you take it from them. Also, when you have CO2 its likely that you'll be keeping the more advanced plants which requires CO2 so there shouldn't be any reasons to remove it.


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## Alastair

Jason Stanford said:


> im really inexperienced so this maybe a stupid question, but can you not use co2, wait until they are grown in, then turn the co2 off? or do they die? melt or whatever.


Hiya jason, 
The thing with doing that is the plants will then be used to their fix of co2 and once its stopped theyll melt off for example the crypts will just totally melt away. Like george said my previous scapes have grown very quick, algae free pretty much and inhabitants have flourished.  I dont think choccos like co2 much from past experience and hate lots of flow, they just sit in slow spots and dont come out. 
Low energy means also less trouble with algae etc or ive found out anyway. Any signs of nutrient deficiency is also very slow and you have lots of time to correct it where as the co2 tank things can go wrong quite quickly.  



tim said:


> Massive, can't wait, you do know you could fit your current tank inside the cabinet for this one and have a double decker to keep the chocolate theme going  congrats on the babies mate top stuff al will be following this one for sure.



Ha ha it would almosy fit yes mate lol. I think the chocolate theme is with me for life ive really fallen in love with them and to see a huge group of them thriving and hopefully breeding again too will be even more rewarding.  This will be done to look both appealing but also for the conditions the inhabitants prefer so a happy medium. 
Thanks for the congrats tim they are stunning little things.  I need to try and video them at some point everyone whos been to see them have had that total look of shock and amazement.  They true miniatures of the parents.


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## Jason Stanford

so you had quick growth in previous setups without any co2 alastair?


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## Michael W

Now you need to breed those Licorice  after that I'm crowning you "Gourami King". Typing this and thinking about the possibilities is making me even more hyper to see this up coming tank.


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## Alastair

Jason Stanford said:


> so you had quick growth in previous setups without any co2 alastair?



Yes mate very surprising I know. The carpet plant in my current set up took off like it was on massive co2 addiction  its slowed down now. 
Also look at toms bucket of mud that shows just how vibrant and lush low techs can get. Tom's Bucket O' Mud - new vid page 28 | Page 27 | UK Aquatic Plant Society



Michael W said:


> Now you need to breed those Licorice  after that I'm crowning you "Gourami King". Typing this and thinking about the possibilities is making me even more hyper to see this up coming tank.


 
Id love them to breed I really would. That would be phenomenal.  They have shown beautiful breeding behaviour recently with males flashing off to females with almost purple like fins so hoping conditions will be good for those too.


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## BigTom

I demand photos of the piece of wood!


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## NanoJames

You should start charging the public to come into your house and look at the tank. You could sell chocolate gourami related merchandise!


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## Aron_Dip

Alastair said:


> Cabinet will be a ridiculously over engineered ada type cabinet with whopping timber frame inside helped out by mr Aron dip next weekend when he comes up. In two minds of what colour to paint it yet.


 
Subscribed!

Cant wait mate  .. ill send them drawings over before i forget haha

"Las cosas claras y el chocolate espeso"


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## Alastair

BigTom said:


> I demand photos of the piece of wood!


Ill take some photos on saturday of it Tom. Just need that illusive piece to go with it..



NanoJames said:


> You should start charging the public to come into your house and look at the tank. You could sell chocolate gourami related merchandise!



Im too soft id not charge mate but my obsession with these fish has had me wanting canvas paintings of them.  
Check this guy's painting out its amazing... shame he lives in the states


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## NanoJames

Alastair said:


> Im too soft id not charge mate but my obsession with these fish has had me wanting canvas paintings of them. Check this guy's painting out its amazing... shame he lives in the states


 Haha, you'll just have to settle for selling off 3 tonnes of plant clippings every week... That canvas looks really great, you should try your own!


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## Alastair

NanoJames said:


> Haha, you'll just have to settle for selling off 3 tonnes of plant clippings every week... That canvas looks really great, you should try your own!



Lol theyll probably be that many that goes in on intial planting. The weight alone is a few tonnes 

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## Martin in Holland

that's not a fish tank...that's a kiddy pool...
I wonder how you are going to do your water changes....


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## Jason Stanford

just seen your other setups, that one with the two tree stumps is my favourite amazing


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## Tomfish

Just gonna add to the abundance of wows. Wow sounds amazing!  Good luck with those water changes


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## Alastair

Martin in China said:


> that's not a fish tank...that's a kiddy pool...
> I wonder how you are going to do your water changes....


Literally will be a kiddie pool when its test filled as little one is going paddling in it  

Water changes will be really simple, just a length of hose pipe sucked on to cause a syphon into the garden then either top back up with buckets as two ten percents is only ten full buckets a time as my buckets 15 litres. Keeps me fit and stops the tds rising too much through treating a full tank volume with prime if I filled back up from the hose so happier fish and shrimp. 




Tomfish said:


> Just gonna add to the abundance of wows. Wow sounds amazing!  Good luck with those water changes



cheers tom. I enjoy them. If it was high tech id not be enjoying them. 700 litres a time. No ta


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## Ady34

Really looking forward to this mate I like your take on water changes.....


Alastair said:


> top back up with buckets as two ten percents is only ten full buckets a time as my buckets 15 litres. Keeps me fit and stops the tds rising too much through treating a full tank volume with prime if I filled back up from the hose so happier fish and shrimp.


......only 10 buckets!! I'd definitely be using the hose and splashing a little on prime 

Cheerio
Ady


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## Alastair

Ady34 said:


> Really looking forward to this mate I like your take on water changes.....
> 
> ......only 10 buckets!! I'd definitely be using the hose and splashing a little on prime
> 
> Cheerio
> Ady



Thanks mate.  5 buckets filling only takes me just over ten minutes so 20 or 30 tops 

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## Alastair

First piece of wood is here. .... its rather big  5ft by 3ft 


driftwood by Mr-T-, on Flickr

Untitled by Mr-T-, on Flickr



huge driftood by Mr-T-, on Flickr

huge driftood by Mr-T-, on Flickr


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## Lindy

Stunning bit of wood, just hope the staffie doesn't cock his leg!


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## squid102

ldcgroomer said:


> Stunning bit of wood, just hope the staffie doesn't cock his leg!


It would help to cycle the tank!


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## George Farmer

You have proper wood.

Where from mate?


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## foxfish

When you get bored with it I could make a nice didgeridoo out of that


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## Alastair

foxfish said:


> When you get bored with it I could make a nice didgeridoo out of that



Ive seen your didgeridoos are you sire its big enough  




George Farmer said:


> You have proper wood.
> 
> Where from mate?


Yeah Just hope I can find some smaller pieces to go with what I have planned. 

It was an ebay steal mate... youd never guess how much?????


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## BigTom

Looks much better than in the seller pics, slightly wish I;d put a bit on it now


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## foxfish

Alastair said:


> When you get bored with it I could make a nice didgeridoo out of that Ive seen your didgeridoos are you sire its big enough


 I have  little didgeridoos too.. no honestly that piece of wood has got me thinking just how cool a piece of petrified wood didge would be.


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## George Farmer

Alastair said:


> It was an ebay steal mate... youd never guess how much?????


Please say £0.99.


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## Ian Holdich

Yep, I agree with George! You need a crew on this one! 


In all seriousness, this will be awesome mate...next time I'm up your way, I'll have to pop in.


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## Aron_Dip

Looks wicked mate more detailed than the other pic you sent ...... Nice!

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## Martin in Holland

can't wait to see that wood in your tank....hurry up mate


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## Christian Walker

I wonder... has anyone's tank ever been "wood burgled" before !?  Its a cracking bit of wood and the fact you got it cheap makes it even more sweet


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## sanj

Why not just call it "Alistair's Big One"  

Just being a bit nerdy, but I dont get close enough to 1400 with the dimensions you posted, do you actually mean it is meant to be 200 cm long and not 180, 20cm makes quite a volume difference at these size of aquariums.

BTW what happened to the blue eyes?


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## sanj

Alistair's Big Chocolatey One! .. erm, eww, no maybe not.


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## sanj

​

George Farmer said:


> It should be called "Amazing Alastair's Chocolate Factory".


​Yeah much more wholesome... although come to think of it...​​Will there be any golden tickets?​​​


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## sanj

Alastair said:


> Filtration: 3 eheim 2080s with tmc glass lily pipes and possibly a powerhead.


 
If you have not already got these, keep an eye out on Ebay, I got a 2180 for £200 unused. BTW are you looking at three for turnover, filtration wise two is easily enough, but I understand if it is for flow and you want to minimise on Powerheads.


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## Alastair

sanj said:


> Why not just call it "Alistair's Big One"
> 
> Just being a bit nerdy, but I dont get close enough to 1400 with the dimensions you posted, do you actually mean it is meant to be 200 cm long and not 180, 20cm makes quite a volume difference at these size of aquariums.
> 
> BTW what happened to the blue eyes?


I thought of that but sounds a bit wrong or inappropriate ha ha 

I worked the volume out to be 1360 litres?? Or have I worked that out wrong? Its definitely 180cm long. 
The little blue eye had gotten spooked at night and I couldnt find him for a day or two and spotted him down the back of the tank. That's the only diwnside to braceless. Since ive put acrylic over the corners ive had zero jumpers and with the new tank being braced too that will hopefully stop any too. If you ever have any spare sanj ill buy some once the big tanks established??????



sanj said:


> Alistair's Big Chocolatey One! .. erm, eww, no maybe not.


 lol maybe not. 



sanj said:


> If you have not already got these, keep an eye out on Ebay, I got a 2180 for £200 unused. BTW are you looking at three for turnover, filtration wise two is easily enough, but I understand if it is for flow and you want to minimise on Powerheads.



The 3rd was more for flow mate.  I agree 2 would easily be enough but I dont want powerheads in the tank. Ive been looking for a 2180 but havent found one at anywhere near that price and buying the heated version second hand can be a bit of a risk if its not from anyone I know. I read your journal and saw you had been using 2 hydor externals, are these gone now with you using the thermo heater????

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## foxfish

Maybe look at Grunfoss central heating pumps with the plastic aquarium conversion kits = the three speed versions are great & absolutely silent.
 Aqua-Turn 3 speed Grundfos Pump conversion for DIY Koi Ponds and water features | eBay


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## ghostsword

I so envy you.. so the tank is acrylic right?  

One day, when I am big, I would like to have a tank like this..


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## sanj

I do use the Hydors, but one on the big tank and the other heater being the 500w in the 2180, house is on thermostat at 21 the tank 22, but the actual temp in the house is usually sufficient except in winter. I think your tank needs to be significantly warmer than that for the gouramis?

I have the other Hydor on a TMC tank, which is really a rainbowfish overflow tank... just not enough room!

I lost all my adult blue eyes over summer, I have young ones growing, so I need to seperate and breed from them when older.


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## sanj

The way I calculate gross volume: L(cm)xW(cm)xH(cm)/1000 = gross volume in litres. So I get 1,260 litres. Mine is 1,588 litres but I just rounded.


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## Gary Nelson

I can't wait to see this bad boy get going... I just know it's going to be one to watch... Maybe you should get PFK to do a feature? Also I've been thinking Alastair... I really think you should do a tank warming party for us UKAPS folk once it's up and running  I'd really like to see this.


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## Alastair

foxfish said:


> Maybe look at Grunfoss central heating pumps with the plastic aquarium conversion kits = the three speed versions are great & absolutely silent.
> Aqua-Turn 3 speed Grundfos Pump conversion for DIY Koi Ponds and water features | eBay


Cheers mate im looking into the possibility of rigging one of those up.  Going to have a look at total cost etc over the weekend. 



ghostsword said:


> I so envy you.. so the tank is acrylic right?
> 
> One day, when I am big, I would like to have a tank like this..



Ha ha cheers luis.  Nothing stopping you now your out there mate. You could have one in your back garden as big as you wanted. 
Its not in acrylic this one. Ill save acrylic until I go huge in a few years. 



sanj said:


> I do use the Hydors, but one on the big tank and the other heater being the 500w in the 2180, house is on thermostat at 21 the tank 22, but the actual temp in the house is usually sufficient except in winter. I think your tank needs to be significantly warmer than that for the gouramis?
> 
> I have the other Hydor on a TMC tank, which is really a rainbowfish overflow tank... just not enough room!
> 
> I lost all my adult blue eyes over summer, I have young ones growing, so I need to seperate and breed from them when older.


Yes mate im keeping my tank at 24.5 to 25 at the moment. I dont know how much that will change over winter especially with such a big tank. I currently have a few eiheim jagers 300w spare which are huge and rated for big tanks so ill use those until ive looked at foxfish idea. 



sanj said:


> The way I calculate gross volume: L(cm)xW(cm)xH(cm)/1000 = gross volume in litres. So I get 1,260 litres. Mine is 1,588 litres but I just rounded.



I worked it out at 1380 litres mate using that method. 180x110x70. Im sure its that size ive ordered or maybe its 100 front to back. Ill have to check the invoice.  If its 1260 ill change my title to 1300 litre.  

When youve grown some of the blue eyes up will you let me know??? What happened to the adults??? 

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## Alastair

Gary Nelson said:


> I can't wait to see this bad boy get going... I just know it's going to be one to watch... Maybe you should get PFK to do a feature? Also I've been thinking Alastair... I really think you should do a tank warming party for us UKAPS folk once it's up and running  I'd really like to see this.



Hope I can make it look half as good as what everyones expecting mate.  Got some pressure on now lol. Although ill have a bit of help scaping it up and planting  

Perfect idea mate ill gladly invite some of the ukaps possy over for a tank warming party. Thats a definite Gary.  Im sure I can squeeze a few in along with the tank  

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## foxfish

Fish tank volume calculators 1386l 304g but allowing for glass thickness slightly less.


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## foxfish

I feel you would really benefit from a sump on this size tank, it would not need to be particularly big or high flow but it would make a surface skimmer, heater compartment plus auto top up & extend the choice of pump to submersible pond pumps etc.


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## ghostsword

> Ha ha cheers luis. Nothing stopping you now your out there mate. You could have one in your back garden as big as you wanted.
> Its not in acrylic this one. Ill save acrylic until I go huge in a few years.


 
Yeah, I know..  I have the place in the yard ready already..  just need to figure out a way for the criminals not jumping the fence and stealing the kit.. LOL

With a tank that big, aren't  you worried about the bowing? Or does it have braces?


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## Alastair

ghostsword said:


> Yeah, I know..  I have the place in the yard ready already..  just need to figure out a way for the criminals not jumping the fence and stealing the kit.. LOL
> 
> With a tank that big, aren't  you worried about the bowing? Or does it have braces?



Electric fences luis lol ......

Yes I did think about the bowing so opted for minimalistic bracing which ive seen pics of and its not unsightly at all. Ill sleep better at night too knowing its braced. I can always make a small plinth if need be but I prefer it with out. 



foxfish said:


> I feel you would really benefit from a sump on this size tank, it would not need to be particularly big or high flow but it would make a surface skimmer, heater compartment plus auto top up & extend the choice of pump to submersible pond pumps etc.



I know I know youve almost tempted me before on a sump and  with not using co2 its not too much of a concern. Id have to look at what options as no weir is being put in etc. Id have to use pumps in the tank for flow though  and dont really want any in 

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## webworm

Saw this on youtube and instantly though of you


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## Alastair

That will be my ideal size but much taller. Could have had that size in here but will wait to see where im living in couple of years time. I want to see this tank fully grow in first

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## hydrophyte

I can't wait to see pictures! Do you know when you might have the enclosure?


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## David Shanahan

I like the wood. Cant wait to see the tank too.


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## Alastair

hydrophyte said:


> I can't wait to see pictures! Do you know when you might have the enclosure?


Thanks mate hope your ok. Not seen you on for a bit. 
The tank will hopefully be here in the next fortnight to 3 weeks and then set up a week or so after that  



Planty said:


> I like the wood. Cant wait to see the tank too.



Thanks planty. Ive just found a very good supplier of scottish driftwood too at really really cheap prices so im picking some up this weekend


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## sanj

I keep posting messages and then they dont seem to appear.... anyway, yes I made a mistake I thought the dimension was 100cm width not 110cm...that would explain it.


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## Samuran

Not sure if this has been mentioned but I've had nothing but issues with hydor inline heaters had two 300w ones fail and over heat the water... not many fish like going from 28 to 38+ over night... 

Ben


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## Deano3

very nice and interesting piece of wood, will look amazing in tank its HUGE lol

Dean


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## Alastair

Just picking me wood...........


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## Ady34

Id get that piece there, just to the left a bit, no not that one, left, up, a bit more, right a fraction.....yeah that one


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## Aron_Dip

Just get the lot..... 

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## sa80mark

Wow what a find


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## tim

Blardy hell  I now have serious wood envy


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## LondonDragon

Alastair said:


> Just picking me wood...........


You visiting Dan's garage again?


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## Samuran

Alastair said:


> Just picking me wood...........


 

Hate you 

Ben


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## Nathaniel Whiteside

Wow! Alistair another one! You must be knackered!  

Hope your well buddy,
N


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## Ian_lawton

Where is all this wood!!!?


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## flygja

Simply awesome! Huge tank, huge wood, a dream for many! This is definitely one to watch. You should write some UKAPS articles about low tech tanks.


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## Deano3

Wow that's a nice selection of wood I payed £15 for a tiny rubbish bit, more like a twig, I need to know somewhere like that for larger pieces, spoilt for choice there mate

Dean


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## Alastair

Ady34 said:


> Id get that piece there, just to the left a bit, no not that one, left, up, a bit more, right a fraction.....yeah that one



Ha ha I went for the peace up to the centre then right then right a bit more behind the twisty piece and to the left of that......

I did actually find a stunning piece that actually has bits of granite rock wrapped up in its roots where theyve gripped it over time. 
Im going on saturday again.......oops



Aron_Dip said:


> Just get the lot.....
> 
> Sent from my HTC Desire C using Tapatalk 4



Shhhh dont tempt me mate. At such a good price too its extremely hard to resist



sa80mark said:


> Wow what a find


Purely by chance mate. 



tim said:


> Blardy hell  I now have serious wood envy


It was heaven tim..... couldn't get out where its all from other than Scotland 



LondonDragon said:


> You visiting Dan's garage again?


Ha ha is his garage like that too.... think ill have to harrass his phone in that case. 



Samuran said:


> Hate you
> 
> Ben






Nathaniel Whiteside said:


> Wow! Alistair another one! You must be knackered!
> 
> Hope your well buddy,
> N



Yeah pretty knackered mate especially with non stop illness but this makes me feel tons better. 
Well that's my excuse anyway. Great to see you back on pal. 



Ian_lawton said:


> Where is all this wood!!!?



Its in a very nice ladies garage. She is off to top up her garage soon. Apparently it was that full at first you couldn't move 



flygja said:


> Simply awesome! Huge tank, huge wood, a dream for many! This is definitely one to watch. You should write some UKAPS articles about low tech tanks.



Thanks flygja. 
The new piece of wood is equally as stunning too. Will get a picture of it this afternoon. 
Low tech is the way to go for me now. I love it. Although I may do a small high tech at some point.  



Deano3 said:


> Wow that's a nice selection of wood I payed £15 for a tiny rubbish bit, more like a twig, I need to know somewhere like that for larger pieces, spoilt for choice there mate
> 
> Dean



Cheers dean.  There's actually more than that in there its just not all in shot. Her prices are fantastic.

The piece I put up a few pages back which is huge id only paid 39 pound for off another lady and got 2 free stunning orchids too. It would set you back a good 200 id have said. 



Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## flygja

I'm actually quite tempted to turn my 60L into a low tech experiment. So far I've done 2 low techs and failed miserably.


----------



## Samuran

flygja said:


> I'm actually quite tempted to turn my 60L into a low tech experiment. So far I've done 2 low techs and failed miserably.


 
I was thinking exactly the same last night (in a 60L too), but I feel I need to do a fair bit more research into suitable slow growing plants etc first...

Ben


----------



## Alastair

flygja said:


> I'm actually quite tempted to turn my 60L into a low tech experiment. So far I've done 2 low techs and failed miserably.


Too much light etc??? 




Samuran said:


> I was thinking exactly the same last night (in a 60L too), but I feel I need to do a fair bit more research into suitable slow growing plants etc first...
> 
> Ben



Ive had higher light species in my previous set up which was super low tech and hardly ever had a water change.  
Rotala ritundafolia red: 

Untitled by Mr-T-, on Flickr

But plants such as crypts ferns mosses a fair few carpet plants some stems and echinodorus species all do really well. 


Very well worth it in the long run if your looking for a nice easy less input kind of tank and something you can leave to do its thing for a long time.


----------



## Samuran

Is that with a topsoil substrate Alastair? (is there a journal I can read through for that one)

Thanks
Ben


----------



## Alastair

Tanks arriving a week on Wednesday now too which is great news. 
Im having a powder coated steel frame with adjustable feet being built instead of the wooden frame. 
Im going to clad with mdf panels which will have been sealed and ill apply white matt vinyl over them and the frame of the light unit. 

Stand frame will be ready next week to pick up.

Picking some more wood up this weekend too. I just need to build up the lighting system and install dimmers


----------



## sanj

Exciting!

Sensible choice going for a steal frame.


----------



## Alastair

sanj said:


> Exciting!
> 
> Sensible choice going for a steal frame.



Thanks sanj, twas re reading your journal yesterday ( yet again) that swayed me. No chance of gradual movement in the frame then long term either and I struggle to get the 2080s out with thick timber frame.


----------



## Alastair

I got wood 





All for 89 pound. .. bargain


----------



## Aron_Dip

I WOODent mind that lot for my self... Nice!

Sent from my HTC Desire C using Tapatalk 4


----------



## Nathaniel Whiteside

You got JUNGLE!


----------



## Lee Sweeting

Nice wood.


----------



## Nathaniel Whiteside

Alastair said:


> I got wood



I like your Monkey


----------



## dw1305

Hi all,
Quality, looks like long dead conifer, with Scots Pine (_Pinus sylvestris_) my guess. From this page <Photos: loch morlich etive lx>.





cheers Darrel


----------



## Ian Holdich

I wouldn't go putting red lama's in your tank.


----------



## Tim Harrison

I'm reporting you to the RSPCA...for torturing your monkey - Reservoir Dogs Style - unless you can prove he's not sitting on a candle.


----------



## Alastair

dw1305 said:


> Hi all,
> Quality, looks like long dead conifer, with Scots Pine (Pinus sylvestris) my guess. From this page <Photos: loch morlich etive lx>.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> cheers Darrel


 
ahh cool thanks Darrel, i must admit some of the pieces have beuatiful patterns to the wood. all ok to go in the tank then i hope????




Ian Holdich said:


> I wouldn't go putting red lama's in your tank.


  dam, would make a great feature 




Troi said:


> I'm reporting you to the RSPCA...for torturing your monkey - Reservoir Dogs Style - unless you can prove he's not sitting on a candle.


 thats not the half of it tim, hes usually hanging from the fancy lights above the fire place day in day out, no food, no water.....


----------



## Aron_Dip

The large peace looks like it has a raptors head on it .....


----------



## Alastair

First attempt at arranging the wood. Its really difficult with such big pieces.... ive got to add rocks etc but wont have these until ive been down to the river near here. ..... whats everyones thoughts??????? 

1:





2: not added the rest of the wood yet


 

3:




Edit: not happy with any of these so will keep trying


----------



## BigTom

Nice pile. I'm getting a strong urge to jump into the photo and start chucking stuff about. How does the big bit look flipped 180 degrees with the roots angling upwards?


----------



## Alastair

BigTom said:


> Nice pile. I'm getting a strong urge to jump into the photo and start chucking stuff about. How does the big bit look flipped 180 degrees with the roots angling upwards?


You mean the main piece so its roots are over to the left with the other pieces???


----------



## BigTom

Yeah the main piece, but flipped 180 degrees vertically, not horizontally... so facing the same way, but with the flat bit along the ground and the roots angling upwards a bit.


----------



## Alastair

Hmmm must be crap ha ha


----------



## BigTom

Go get a big pile of rocks too Al. And chuck some sand down on the carpet. Then we'll have a better idea


----------



## sa80mark

I cant believe the size of that wood, judging by you other tanks this is going to be pretty special,  your a brave man taking on a tank that size im nervous about upgrading to an 80l, most importantly though come on let us all into the secret.... how do you get around your misses ? If mine walked in and saw all that wood on the floor im pretty sure id up in a box lol


----------



## Michael W

This is my theory, Al's missus had said no then Al got stressed and started doing side planks and push ups which charmed her and he got the green light.


----------



## Alastair

BigTom said:


> Go get a big pile of rocks too Al. And chuck some sand down on the carpet. Then we'll have a better idea



Im not liking any of it now ive had chance to look at the photos ive taken. It just looks like a pile of wood as you said lol. ... back to start from scratch 



sa80mark said:


> I cant believe the size of that wood, judging by you other tanks this is going to be pretty special,  your a brave man taking on a tank that size im nervous about upgrading to an 80l, most importantly though come on let us all into the secret.... how do you get around your misses ? If mine walked in and saw all that wood on the floor im pretty sure id up in a box lol


I hope it will be special mate. Not happy with any of those layout. I think its partly the supporting wood underneath.  

Ha ha simple, I dont allow the missus to live with me. No on a serious note ive only been in this relationship just over a month but shes really supportive of it all 



Michael W said:


> This is my theory, Al's missus had said no then Al got stressed and started doing side planks and push ups which charmed her and he got the green light.


Lol..... its hit it off big time these press ups and planks. I did a few tricep dips whilst looking at the mess in the photos lol


----------



## David Shanahan

You would get a better idea once you get some rocks in. 

Is that 3 big pieces? you can always get a tree surgeon out if you need to cut them up a bit :-0

Maybe go with the bit on the right flat with the pitch fork bit sticking up, then overlay the othe two pieces.


----------



## Nathaniel Whiteside

I personally think number one is decent!! Moss on the 'roots' underneath the huge branch would look sick!


----------



## sa80mark

Thays where I went wrong I moved in with her before I got my tank  lol

For me number 3, I get the impression the highest bit of the wood would be above the water line ? Would look great with moss etc growing down it to the water


----------



## aliclarke86

This is just mental I can believe you got all that for under a ton!! 

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk 4


----------



## Brian Murphy

Wow! Loving the wood your man has got.  This is gonna be a beast of a scape .... will be keeping an eye on this one


----------



## flygja

Alastair said:


> Too much light etc???
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ive had higher light species in my previous set up which was super low tech and hardly ever had a water change.
> Rotala ritundafolia red:
> 
> Untitled by Mr-T-, on Flickr
> 
> But plants such as crypts ferns mosses a fair few carpet plants some stems and echinodorus species all do really well.
> 
> 
> Very well worth it in the long run if your looking for a nice easy less input kind of tank and something you can leave to do its thing for a long time.


 

I had a 24W fluorescent PL-L over a 60L only about 2/3rds filled with water and I still managed to kill almost all the Anubias nana I put in it. Crypt parva melted completely. Even H.tennellum melted! It was supposed to be a holding tank for my Anubias. I guess I negelcted it just a bit too much. 

I can't believe that thank you showed is low tech. Recently I've been having trouble growing stems in a high-tech tank even!


----------



## Deano3

amazing wood, I like 2 actually were a bit less going on but hard to say without seeing it in tank lol good luck deciding mate

Dean


----------



## Alastair

Deano3 said:


> amazing wood, I like 2 actually were a bit less going on but hard to say without seeing it in tank lol good luck deciding mate
> 
> Dean


Cheers dean im liking number 2 aswell.  If I get some petrified wood added in I think it will be good.  

Just been down to the welders and here's my cabinet frame just waiting to go off for powder coating. Its huge in person which kind of hit me in the face as to how big the tanks going to be  
The big welding cylinders next to it were taller than me 

cabinet frame by Mr-T-, on Flickr

Also may have some very posh very advanced geisseman lighting on its way too.


----------



## Gary Nelson

That frame looks the biz mate, very well engineered! This is my kinda journal...I Love to see all the parts like this as it all comes together, can't wait to see more


----------



## hydrophyte

This will be a helluva stand for your tank. You could hold up a car on that steel frame.


----------



## Mark Evans

After our talk, you know where I stand with this Alastair. As mentioned by someone previously, maybe turn the biggest piece the other way around/ upside down.

As I also said, there's no 'wrong' hardscape. When you told me about your ideas for the current positioning of the wood, they could work great, with paths and open areas leading the eye inwards.

Once you have the tank, get some gravel in there, and then start placing wood and stones. You'll get a better idea. I know from experience (P@H) layouts trying to come up with ideas with just the 'footprint' marked on the floor, is difficult. Also, your looking at it, at the wrong height. You need to be on your hands and knees to visualise it.

Your cabinet skeleton is certainly the dogs mate!

Also, as I mentioned, with this being oak, watch for acidic leak. Oak is known for it. I have experience with this from my old job. We were never allowed to put oak directly onto lead (Pb) as the oak's residual acid eats away at the metal. (and it does happen rapidly) so for anyone having oak window frames fitted, with a lead sill, make sure the lead is patinated, and the oak is primed. (off topic there, sorry)

All in all mate, the picture will become clearer once you have the physical tank in place and you can start to play about a bit. Also, don't let it 'consume' you. It's easy to get frustrated with layouts.

I can knock out a hardscape pretty rapidly now, but in the past, I'd look at it too hard. Maybe create something, leave it overnight, and look at it in the morning with fresh eyes...it will look different, I promise.


----------



## Mark Evans

you wont be disappointed with _Geissmann_! my Infinity is awesome. Heavy... but awesome.


----------



## Nathaniel Whiteside

Mark Evans said:


> After our talk, you know where I stand with this Alastair. As mentioned by someone previously, maybe turn the biggest piece the other way around/ upside down.
> 
> As I also said, there's no 'wrong' hardscape. When you told me about your ideas for the current positioning of the wood, they could work great, with paths and open areas leading the eye inwards.
> 
> Once you have the tank, get some gravel in there, and then start placing wood and stones. You'll get a better idea. I know from experience (P@H) layouts trying to come up with ideas with just the 'footprint' marked on the floor, is difficult. Also, your looking at it, at the wrong height. You need to be on your hands and knees to visualise it.
> 
> Your cabinet skeleton is certainly the dogs mate!
> 
> Also, as I mentioned, with this being oak, watch for acidic leak. Oak is known for it. I have experience with this from my old job. We were never allowed to put oak directly onto lead (Pb) as the oak's residual acid eats away at the metal. (and it does happen rapidly) so for anyone having oak window frames fitted, with a lead sill, make sure the lead is patinated, and the oak is primed. (off topic there, sorry)
> 
> All in all mate, the picture will become clearer once you have the physical tank in place and you can start to play about a bit. Also, don't let it 'consume' you. It's easy to get frustrated with layouts.
> 
> I can knock out a hardscape pretty rapidly now, but in the past, I'd look at it too hard. Maybe create something, leave it overnight, and look at it in the morning with fresh eyes...it will look different, I promise.




Absolutely correct with the oak Mark. We sometimes make oak king post trusses in the shop. When it's green, it doesn't half blacken your tools. Seems to blunt them very quick as a result.

They also released a hell of a lot of tannins when it rained on them.

I've not seen a Geissman in the flesh, but. That Halo certainly looks like a serious bit of kit 

N


----------



## Alastair

Gary Nelson said:


> That frame looks the biz mate, very well engineered! This is my kinda journal...I Love to see all the parts like this as it all comes together, can't wait to see more



Thanks mate. Finally hit home that its going to be here this week and that ill have an almost sanj sized tank in my home. I think the telford experience has helped things along for me and given me that bit more confidence with being left on my own to do tanks and a good chin wag with Mark Evans on monday too really helped. He knows his stuff no wonder his tanks are as good as they are.  



hydrophyte said:


> This will be a helluva stand for your tank. You could hold up a car on that steel frame.



Thanks mate.  Ive ordered adjustable feet that can take a weight of 2000kg each too 
The steel frame has cost me pennies too.


----------



## Alastair

Mark Evans said:


> After our talk, you know where I stand with this Alastair. As mentioned by someone previously, maybe turn the biggest piece the other way around/ upside down.
> 
> As I also said, there's no 'wrong' hardscape. When you told me about your ideas for the current positioning of the wood, they could work great, with paths and open areas leading the eye inwards.
> 
> Once you have the tank, get some gravel in there, and then start placing wood and stones. You'll get a better idea. I know from experience (P@H) layouts trying to come up with ideas with just the 'footprint' marked on the floor, is difficult. Also, your looking at it, at the wrong height. You need to be on your hands and knees to visualise it.
> 
> Your cabinet skeleton is certainly the dogs mate!
> 
> Also, as I mentioned, with this being oak, watch for acidic leak. Oak is known for it. I have experience with this from my old job. We were never allowed to put oak directly onto lead (Pb) as the oak's residual acid eats away at the metal. (and it does happen rapidly) so for anyone having oak window frames fitted, with a lead sill, make sure the lead is patinated, and the oak is primed. (off topic there, sorry)
> 
> All in all mate, the picture will become clearer once you have the physical tank in place and you can start to play about a bit. Also, don't let it 'consume' you. It's easy to get frustrated with layouts.
> 
> I can knock out a hardscape pretty rapidly now, but in the past, I'd look at it too hard. Maybe create something, leave it overnight, and look at it in the morning with fresh eyes...it will look different, I promise.




I do indeed mate. I took in all we had talked about and havent been racking my brains over it every minute of the day now. 
Ive come back and chilled and got on with anything non fish related........almost. 

Hopefully the oak with being in a garden for so long will have been thoroughly soaked through so most of the acids etc will be gone but its all going in a good 2 week soak in bins with daily hot water changes. 

And as we said mate, and something I strongly agree with, the hardscape is very personal to the scaper. Its nice to get peoples opinions and ideas but at the end of the day its how I like it to look that counts. I was thinking what others would think of it when I should be thinking of what I think about how it looks and whats pleasing to me. 
Which after taking a few days out has allowed me to create a few layouts stress free and only took a few minutes to do each one. Here goes............


Oh and agree on the geisseman.  Its the futura 6 tropic unit. All programmed by your phone


----------



## Alastair

Im happy with all of these but 2 are my fave 

1:

Untitled by Mr-T-, on Flickr

2:

wood layout by Mr-T-, on Flickr

3:

wood layout by Mr-T-, on Flickr

4:

wood layout by Mr-T-, on Flickr

5:

wood layout by Mr-T-, on Flickr

6:

wood layout by Mr-T-, on Flickr

7: 

wood layout by Mr-T-, on Flickr

1 and 2 for me possibly 3 but it looks a little flat
Ill need to get some suitable screws to keep all the wood together. Is your bog standard stainless steel screws ok????


----------



## soton_dave

i like 3 and 7 personaly


----------



## malawistu

1 1 1 1 1 1 1 emmmm I like ONE 

Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## Alastair

malawistu said:


> 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 emmmm I like ONE
> 
> Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 2



My fave too mate. Plenty of scope for planting above and below water


----------



## George Farmer

I think they all have potential.

It's very easy to get obsessed with hardscape layout. Of course, it's very important; the backbone of an aquascape.  But depending on planting, especially if using lots of epiphytes, many aspects of the hardscape points of interest and focal points are either lost or moved.

So try to consider planting, and how this will affect the overall composition of the hardscape. Consider species, their growth characteristics, textures and intended size.

Whichever layout you choose, I'm very confident it will lead to a great result and potentially one of UKAPS's finest ever.


----------



## Aron_Dip

Humm I like 1 and 7 ... Number 7 I think would look better if the left hand woods were coming from the rear left corner into were the large branch comes to the center ... If that makes sense ??

Sent from my HTC Desire C using Tapatalk 4


----------



## Ian Holdich

They will all look good mate, the wood is great! 


No pressure with this one mate! Lol


----------



## Alastair

George Farmer said:


> I think they all have potential.
> 
> It's very easy to get obsessed with hardscape layout. Of course, it's very important; the backbone of an aquascape.  But depending on planting, especially if using lots of epiphytes, many aspects of the hardscape points of interest and focal points are either lost or moved.
> 
> So try to consider planting, and how this will affect the overall composition of the hardscape. Consider species, their growth characteristics, textures and intended size.
> 
> Whichever layout you choose, I'm very confident it will lead to a great result and potentially one of UKAPS's finest ever.



Thanks George, couldn't agree more regarding the planting. And that's something ive considered when viewing the 7 different layouts which is why 1 2 and 3 are my ideal ones as I think (or hope) that some of the hardscape will still be viewable to a degree. The others would look odd I think. 
Ive based how ill plant it on the rate a low tech grows but given the speed at which my current and previous low energy tanks have shot off ive also included this. 
I also think that with the particular ferns ill be using might enhance certain areas once grown in despite covering the hardscape.  
Using the marimo moss will help keep alot of the original layout on show too as it doesnt go wild like alot of mosses ive used.  
I think a long hard think of a definite species list and a quick paper sketch will help me to decide. 
One of UKAPS finest would be something.... if ever! 

Thanks for your words of wisdom mate.  




Aron_Dip said:


> Humm I like 1 and 7 ... Number 7 I think would look better if the left hand woods were coming from the rear left corner into were the large branch comes to the center ... If that makes sense ??
> 
> Sent from my HTC Desire C using Tapatalk 4


I know what you mean mate. With 7 though once in the tank and full of water it will look extremely close to the front glass given how you get the magnification.  



Ian Holdich said:


> They will all look good mate, the wood is great!
> 
> 
> No pressure with this one mate! Lol



Awesome cheers mate.  Hope so. The planting is the one thing I dont want to mess up as ive seen hardscapes done before beautifully and then planting hasn't looked as expected so charz mate.... just a lil bit of the old pressure ha ha.


----------



## tim

I like em all al, number 1 is superb though. This tank is gonna be something else mate outstanding


----------



## Orlando

Sweet jesus! It wont matter what one you choose, its going to be marvelous with that hardscape material. On the carpet looks good already!


----------



## sanj

No. 2. I can imaginge trident growing in those branches. Whatever you choose it will work out great. Take your time.


----------



## plantbrain

Adding on to what George states:

I would suggest you consider some rock/stone to add height and depth to the sediment.
My 120 Gal was too shallow to do much there, I even skimped on the sediment depth to max the height I have to work with.

With your tank, you can really do some fun things with it.
I think the Manzy would look best hanging over the open areas and the other piece would look good creeping over and around the rocks, as if the roots grew over the rocks.
You can add bits of the extra smaller branches you have to add to this theme also.
The rocks also allow you to scape and position the wood better. Not to mention keeping the sediment where you want it.


----------



## Alastair

tim said:


> I like em all al, number 1 is superb though. This tank is gonna be something else mate outstanding



Thats what I thought too Tim. I was stuck between 1 and 2 but number 2 kind of has an eery feel about it. The wood top right should be in Edward scissor hands garden ha ha. 
I hope it looks as appealing planted. 
Im just writing out my list now.  

By the way has anyone noticed in pic 4 the top right piece of wood looks like a horse turning round????? 



Orlando said:


> Sweet jesus! It wont matter what one you choose, its going to be marvelous with that hardscape material. On the carpet looks good already!



Thanks Orlando. Really appreciate that alot mate and its nice to see you on here  



sanj said:


> No. 2. I can imaginge trident growing in those branches. Whatever you choose it will work out great. Take your time.



Thanks Sanj. This one im definitely taking my time with. Im not wracking my brains over it or anything now like I originally was. 
I was over thinking too much which was clouding my ideas. 



plantbrain said:


> Adding on to what George states:
> 
> I would suggest you consider some rock/stone to add height and depth to the sediment.
> My 120 Gal was too shallow to do much there, I even skimped on the sediment depth to max the height I have to work with.
> 
> With your tank, you can really do some fun things with it.
> I think the Manzy would look best hanging over the open areas and the other piece would look good creeping over and around the rocks, as if the roots grew over the rocks.
> You can add bits of the extra smaller branches you have to add to this theme also.
> The rocks also allow you to scape and position the wood better. Not to mention keeping the sediment where you want it.



Thanks very much Tom. I have been looking around for some pieces of stone and will be having a ride out through some trails to see what the rivers have stone wise. If not im thinking of petrified wood which I think will contrast nicely with the samoa substrate. 
 I cant unfortunately use seiryu stone as it will affect my water stats which is a shame as I like the colour.  

The tanks here in 2 days but wont be In its correct place until a week or 2 but I can tweak the wood a little in this time as it could look totally different inside it.


----------



## Lindy

number 1 is my favourite. Let me know when you are ready for your shrimp.


----------



## zanguli-ya-zamba

48 hours to wait !!! I am sure that these 48 hours will be very long for you haha.
Cant wait to see this tank with hardscape in it !!!

How are the baby chocolate ? 

regards


----------



## Alastair

ldcgroomer said:


> number 1 is my favourite. Let me know when you are ready for your shrimp.



Think number one seems to be doing well. Ive picked that anyway but might look different in the tank.  
And yep ill let you know when im ready for them thanks 



zanguli-ya-zamba said:


> 48 hours to wait !!! I am sure that these 48 hours will be very long for you haha.
> Cant wait to see this tank with hardscape in it !!!
> 
> How are the baby chocolate ?
> 
> regards



Its already feeling a long 48 hours. Ive been pretty busy all day sealing the mdf (slightly light headed)  and getting sorted for some custom light arms from the same place who have done the steel frame. 
2 very shiny polished arms. Stand is here tomorrow morning which means ill be taking the doors off 

I think the longest wait will be getting started as im away in the lakes in 2 weeks so it will be after that. 

The new baby chocolates are doing fantastic and the slightly older ones are getting real character too.


----------



## Alastair

This isnt its final position but its arrived all shiny and powder coated in white gloss and ive just put on the varnished base for the tank to sit in. 
The adjustable feet havent arrived yet im just hoping theyre here before the tank arrival tomorrow 

Ill be adding on the white matt panels once the tanks up and running too. 

 its just going here until I take down the chocolate box and start scaping this. 

stand frame by Mr-T-, on Flickr

stand frame by Mr-T-, on Flickr


stand frame by Mr-T-, on Flickr


stand frame by Mr-T-, on Flickr


----------



## BigTom

Ooo, the excitement! Are you really going to run off for a fortnight and leave us all hanging?

Would you like that trident fern before or after you go away?


----------



## Edvet

You do know you can't close the doors now do you?


----------



## Little-AL

So why hasn't there been a picture of the wood arrangement on top of the frame yet?!

Slacker.


----------



## malawistu

Omg yes why not shame on you 

Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## Alastair

BigTom said:


> Ooo, the excitement! Are you really going to run off for a fortnight and leave us all hanging?
> 
> Would you like that trident fern before or after you go away?


Nooo im not going away for a fortnight mate.  Ill be taking down your to be tank next weekend then im away for 3 days the weekend after so prefer to start it so im here when its first set up etc.
Im itching to get it started but im being very patient. Gives the wood longer to soak too from tomorrow. 

Can we sort the trident to come for when im back mate????



Edvet said:


> You do know you can't close the doors now do you?


Ha ha yeah. They dont really get closed anyway but that's not where the tank is being placed when its scaped.  



Little-AL said:


> So why hasn't there been a picture of the wood arrangement on top of the frame yet?!
> 
> Slacker.





malawistu said:


> Omg yes why not shame on you
> Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 2



I was thinking ill wait until tanks here tomorrow then try the wood scape in it before its put out to soak??


----------



## BigTom

Alastair said:


> Can we sort the trident to come for when im back mate????


 

Yup no problem, just give me a shout when you're ready.


----------



## Alastair

Thanks tom


----------



## Alastair

It's massive


----------



## Lindy

Alastair said:


> It's massive


 
You've only realised this now? It isn't a tank, it is a pond!


----------



## Lee Sweeting

Alastair said:


> It's massive


 

I can't wait to see this up and running.


----------



## Edvet

B.t.w. I'm copying your inline reactor for my 1500 liter tank at the moment


----------



## Aron_Dip

Alastair said:


> It's massive


That's what she said!.... It really is massive lol

Sent from my HTC Desire C using Tapatalk


----------



## Samuran

Alastair said:


> It's massive


Tanks arrived then? 

Ben


----------



## Ady34

Oh Al, its a whopper!
I like hardscape 1 with the largest longest bottom wood positioned like in number 3.....the uprights are then similar and balanced. I think the upward pointing branches look great and very natural, plus will flow nicely with the fern leaves and plants generally once planted and allow more interest above water for the emergent growth. Kind of opens the scape up rather than confining it if you get me? Just my opinion though, it may all change like you say when you get it in the tank. Rocks will help add a natural feel too so will be good when you have them.
Try to imagine the bits that wont be planted (perhaps the tips of wood, a length of bare wood etc) as they will provide some focal points of the hardscape to draw the eye rather than the rest which is a framework for planting. The unplanted bits can be as important as the planted bits in balancing the scape.

Good luck mate,
Cheerio,
Ady.


----------



## Alastair

ldcgroomer said:


> You've only realised this now? It isn't a tank, it is a pond!


I dont even think ponds are as heavy as this light ha ha. Its got a label on to say not to fill with water until after 25th which was a shame as im seriously itching to get this up and running now.  
It arrived with black silicone though which I dont remember asking for but either way its stunning work.  The silicone is so neat.  Best ive had so far. 




Lee Sweeting said:


> I can't wait to see this up and running.



Me too mate. Itchy feet is understated.  


Edvet said:


> B.t.w. I'm copying your inline reactor for my 1500 liter tank at the moment


Good luck edvet let me know how it goes mate. Curious to see how it goes. 


Aron_Dip said:


> That's what she said!.... It really is massive lol
> 
> Sent from my HTC Desire C using Tapatalk


 did the picture impress the mrs then mate  


Samuran said:


> Tanks arrived then?
> 
> Ben


 Absolutely.  


Ady34 said:


> Oh Al, its a whopper!
> I like hardscape 1 with the largest longest bottom wood positioned like in number 3.....the uprights are then similar and balanced. I think the upward pointing branches look great and very natural, plus will flow nicely with the fern leaves and plants generally once planted and allow more interest above water for the emergent growth. Kind of opens the scape up rather than confining it if you get me? Just my opinion though, it may all change like you say when you get it in the tank. Rocks will help add a natural feel too so will be good when you have them.
> Try to imagine the bits that wont be planted (perhaps the tips of wood, a length of bare wood etc) as they will provide some focal points of the hardscape to draw the eye rather than the rest which is a framework for planting. The unplanted bits can be as important as the planted bits in balancing the scape.
> 
> Good luck mate,
> Cheerio,
> Ady.



Totally agree ady. Its a whopper 
Im with you on the hardscape mate. Ive had a trial go tonight in the tank and it does look better but until substrate rocks etc go in it could all look different again. 
Plus I know ill have to take off an inch or 2 on some bits of wood as they are a tight squeeze now and obviously swell when wet.  
I cant take any decent shots either as theres no light over the tank. 

Funny too as I was just thinking earlier that I need to make sure some of the ends of the branches still need to be on show and not let them get over run. 
Shame there's a black rim round the top as I wanted to be able to see the woods transition from below to above water.  May take the strip off if it doesn't look right. 

Here's the tank from dragging out of the van to placing on stand in temporary position.  Will look better once its panels are put on to hide the frame and base and foam...


----------



## Alastair

Oops pics would help. I wont show pics of purple faced guys almost popping veins lifting it. 



Untitled by Mr-T-, on Flickr

Untitled by Mr-T-, on Flickr

Untitled by Mr-T-, on Flickr

Can't seriously wait to get started


----------



## Michael W

That is so big!


----------



## Gary Nelson

Holy cows!!!! It's  big, it's going to look fantastic with that wood in....  What a home for those chocs, can't wait to see more mate!


----------



## NanoJames

Good luck planting that one Al! I've tried to replicate your style of tank in mine, only in about 1380 litres less! Your tanks are really inspiring mate!
Cheers


----------



## Nathaniel Whiteside

I LOVE this! I'm excited too...


----------



## Lee Sweeting

Alastair said:


> Me too mate. Itchy feet is understated.


 
It's gonna be awesome mate. I've been showing the wife, trying to convince her that we should replace our dining table with a tank like yours. She's not having any of it though, haha!


----------



## Ian_lawton

Without having to go threw all these pages in your thread, where did u order the tank from?


----------



## Deano3

cannot get over the size, everyone seems to be looking forward to seeing this one, no pressure then mate 

Dean


----------



## ghostsword

Could you get one of those underwater cameras, attach it to a submarine and film an adventure in that landscape?


----------



## Lindy

Wow, that's like having a cinema in your home!


----------



## steveno

Wow, that is one huge tank... This going to be awesome... Good luck with it...


----------



## Alastair

Michael W said:


> That is so big!


 just a bit... I cant wait 



Gary Nelson said:


> Holy cows!!!! It's  big, it's going to look fantastic with that wood in....  What a home for those chocs, can't wait to see more mate!


Thanks matey. I hope it does look as good when set up. I dont want to ruin it with the planting side of it ha ha. 
Im hoping the choccos settle in and have lots of Minnie ones. Ill of course be buying a good 100 more though


NanoJames said:


> Good luck planting that one Al! I've tried to replicate your style of tank in mine, only in about 1380 litres less! Your tanks are really inspiring mate!
> Cheers



Cheers james that's a really nice compliment to hear ive inspired people. Great feeling thsnk you 


Nathaniel Whiteside said:


> I LOVE this! I'm excited too...


 me too matey me too 


Lee Sweeting said:


> It's gonna be awesome mate. I've been showing the wife, trying to convince her that we should replace our dining table with a tank like yours. She's not having any of it though, haha!


 ha ha good luck trying mate.  Im lucky in that sense my home is my own. 


Ian_lawton said:


> Without having to go threw all these pages in your thread, where did u order the tank from?


 its from nd aquatics ian 


Deano3 said:


> cannot get over the size, everyone seems to be looking forward to seeing this one, no pressure then mate
> 
> Dean


 yeah theres a wee bit of pressure on now I think. Hope it looks good when set up I really do. 


ghostsword said:


> Could you get one of those underwater cameras, attach it to a submarine and film an adventure in that landscape?


 im sure I could try getting one of the waterproof cases for my little point and shoot and setting it to film luis.  Might give that a try actually. That's my mission once its running. 


ldcgroomer said:


> Wow, that's like having a cinema in your home!


Funnily enough I had the garden chair in the dining room yesterday evening after id climbed out of the tank and sat just staring at it for a while. 



steveno said:


> Wow, that is one huge tank... This going to be awesome... Good luck with it...


Thanks mate


----------



## Alastair

Couldn't resist getting in to see if the wood fits. This isnt how it will look but found it hard to stare at it empty. The wood will also be flowing from the back right corner when in properly


----------



## Aron_Dip

Alastair said:


> Couldn't resist getting in to see if the wood fits. This isnt how it will look but found it hard to stare at it empty. The wood will also be flowing from the back right corner when in properly


Fresh par of boxers pleeeeease! 

Sent from my HTC Desire C using Tapatalk


----------



## zanguli-ya-zamba

Huuuuge !!!! that tank will be a nice challenge mate !!
Your fish will be very happy in that volume and I can't wait to see it planted with inhabitant !!

cheers


----------



## Lindy

It looks brilliant already. Green with envy


----------



## steveno

Simply breath taking... now with the timber in the tank, really can't wait to see this planted up.

Something I been wondering thou, with such a large tank are you considering covering top to minimise evaporation and condensation in room. I have to top up my 120l open top tank regularly...


----------



## NanoJames

ldcgroomer said:


> It looks brilliant already. Green with envy


 Are you sure you aren't green from the reflections of the millions of plants that will be going in there?! Can't wait to see the plant deliveries!


----------



## Alastair

zanguli-ya-zamba said:


> Huuuuge !!!! that tank will be a nice challenge mate !!
> Your fish will be very happy in that volume and I can't wait to see it planted with inhabitant !!
> 
> cheers



Thanks mate. Im really really looking forward to getting it all set up. Its torturous having to wait until the 8th of november to get it started. 
Its a real struggle leaning into the tank. Ive no idea how Sanj did his.  



ldcgroomer said:


> It looks brilliant already. Green with envy


 thank you . Only 3 weeks until set up day



steveno said:


> Simply breath taking... now with the timber in the tank, really can't wait to see this planted up.
> 
> Something I been wondering thou, with such a large tank are you considering covering top to minimise evaporation and condensation in room. I have to top up my 120l open top tank regularly...



Cheers Steve.  
Good question and I definitely am going to be having an acrylic top to minimise the evaporation yes.  Obviously it cant cover the whole area as it will have cut outs where the wood is above water. My current tank has been losing quite alot since the weather has gotten colder. The summer wouldnt be a problem. 
Ive even got the dehumidifier on during the night. 



NanoJames said:


> Are you sure you aren't green from the reflections of the millions of plants that will be going in there?! Can't wait to see the plant deliveries!


----------



## Ian Holdich

Looks like you've placed that wood perfectly!


----------



## Iain Sutherland

thats a bad boy al and can envisage how look its going to look when planted, not to mention with 100 chocolates serenely drifting around.  Absolutely will be booking a trip up to you in the new year!!
I actually quite like the wood layout in the image above mate but thats just me.  What are your thoughts plant wise to filling in behind the wood and around the back areas or leaving open?


----------



## Ian Holdich

That's it then, party at Als in the new year...


----------



## Iain Sutherland

Ian Holdich said:


> That's it then, party at Als in the new year...


you have all the best ideas pal.


----------



## Alastair

Ian Holdich said:


> Looks like you've placed that wood perfectly!


 phew thanks ian... wasnt sure as it looks so different In the tank. 



Iain Sutherland said:


> thats a bad boy al and can envisage how look its going to look when planted, not to mention with 100 chocolates serenely drifting around.  Absolutely will be booking a trip up to you in the new year!!
> I actually quite like the wood layout in the image above mate but thats just me.  What are your thoughts plant wise to filling in behind the wood and around the back areas or leaving open?


Cheers mate. Realisations finally set in as to how big this really is now. I seriously need to curb turning my day dreams into reality ha ha.....
That's anothet plus on the wood position too which is great.  It's all in bins soaking now. The huge tree peice just sank so that's good. I was worried about that piece. 
Thought wise for planting behind the wood I was thinking of banking the substrate up towards the rear right and have crypts going up and towards the back on the right with some retro spirals behind those and actually behind the wood rear right I was thinking either vallis nana or something similar so it hits the surface and is pushed across. I dont want it dominated by plants I still want to see a fair bit of the wood. 
Im writing out my plant list this morning.. 


Ian Holdich said:


> That's it then, party at Als in the new year...





Iain Sutherland said:


> you have all the best ideas pal.



ABSOLUTELY. ... Im up for that 100%


----------



## Iain Sutherland

Alastair said:


> Thought wise for planting behind the wood I was thinking of banking the substrate up towards the rear right and have crypts going up and towards the back on the right with some retro spirals behind those and actually behind the wood rear right I was thinking either vallis nana or something similar so it hits the surface and is pushed across. I dont want it dominated by plants I still want to see a fair bit of the wood. Im writing out my plant list this morning..


 
sounds like a good plan, no doubt youll nail it.  
Retro spiralis has been a real PITA in Asian dreams, leaf edges arent crimped and is very slow growing.  I even moved a plant to the 60 with high light and plenty of co2 in amazonia and its still not happening.... have no idea why??  Maybe it likes hard water or more low tech??  Can i ask where you your buying?  took me ages, ended up via a german site and they were really in a bad way when i received wrapped in asian newspaper.  Well worth buying twice as much as you need if your going the same way to allow for waste.




Alastair said:


> ABSOLUTELY. ... Im up for that 100%


woop


----------



## Alastair

Iain Sutherland said:


> sounds like a good plan, no doubt youll nail it.
> Retro spiralis has been a real PITA in Asian dreams, leaf edges arent crimped and is very slow growing.  I even moved a plant to the 60 with high light and plenty of co2 in amazonia and its still not happening.... have no idea why??  Maybe it likes hard water or more low tech??  Can i ask where you your buying?  took me ages, ended up via a german site and they were really in a bad way when i received wrapped in asian newspaper.  Well worth buying twice as much as you need if your going the same way to allow for waste.
> 
> 
> 
> woop



Hope so mate.  I want it to look aged once planted if that makes sense. As if its grown in from the start..
The retro spiralis I have in the chocolate box is at the surface and has only very slight crimped leaves. Could be just spiralis but its extremely healthy and vibrant. Maybe your right with it preferring low tech. Its shaded by floaters too. 
In fact its one you sent me that was about 3 cm tall. 
I can get both varieties from my lfs. I get them cheap as I gave my shallow puddle to them for free.  If you want any let me know iain. 
And think we need to arrange a meet up at mine once done.. few beers good food and a massive armchair right infront of the tank


----------



## Iain Sutherland

You still got space for a massive armchair?!

Totally forgot i sent you some mate, next scape in my head has a good amount of spiralis (if i make it do as its told) so may take you up on that al.


----------



## Alastair

Iain Sutherland said:


> You still got space for a massive armchair?!
> 
> Totally forgot i sent you some mate, next scape in my head has a good amount of spiralis (if i make it do as its told) so may take you up on that al.



Ha ha no I dont think there's room for a massive armchair.  Maybe a small one. My bikes have been sent to my bedroom for now  
Absolutely mate any spiralis you need ill get you for free. 

My lighting has arrived today too which im looking forward to having a play with later.  
Tmc grobeam 1500 nd's and multi controller.  
No lenses over the crees which will give a much better spread and reduce par levels


----------



## Samuran

Woo looks expensive 
Ben

Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk


----------



## Edvet

Whole tank with only three of those?


----------



## Alastair

Edvet said:


> Whole tank with only three of those?



Yep its only low tech remember with low light loving plants such as crypts anubias ferns etc and the tiles will be 5 cm above the water surface. These with out lenses will give a good 120 degree spread each. 
If one unit is fine for a 60cm tank 3 should do for this and most of the planting is around and on the wood  
I can always add one more if it really needs it


----------



## Edvet

Well i've got two of those already , but also 2x 80W T5 and 2x 150W HQI, but i could go low tech later with just one tile more? That's food for thought. I could go that route if i have the plants as i would like.


----------



## Alastair

Edvet said:


> Well i've got two of those already , but also 2x 80W T5 and 2x 150W HQI, but i could go low tech later with just one tile more? That's food for thought. I could go that route if i have the plants as i would like.



Wow that's a lot of lighting.  What size tank is that lot on ha ha.  
Ive ordered a 4th light to be on the safe side and can always add it if 3 isnt enough


----------



## sanj

Hi Alistair,

its all looking great. You got wood like that in this country! I could not find anyone selling it before.

I was looking at lighting from TMC tiles a little while ago, but I was looking at around 8 for my tank. Just thinking about light spread I take it you are focussing it in a few areas. 5cm seems pretty close to the water surface, but have a play. I do know from my own personal experiance from my low tech breeding tanks some of the plants are growing in only 8 par, slowly though. I would imagine if you had somthing like 20-30 at the substrate, that would not be bad for non co2 injection.


----------



## Little-AL

That is ridiculous...

...ly brilliant.

Jealous Al, very jealous!


----------



## Alastair

sanj said:


> Hi Alistair,
> 
> its all looking great. You got wood like that in this country! I could not find anyone selling it before.
> 
> I was looking at lighting from TMC tiles a little while ago, but I was looking at around 8 for my tank. Just thinking about light spread I take it you are focussing it in a few areas. 5cm seems pretty close to the water surface, but have a play. I do know from my own personal experiance from my low tech breeding tanks some of the plants are growing in only 8 par, slowly though. I would imagine if you had somthing like 20-30 at the substrate, that would not be bad for non co2 injection.


Hi Sanj
Hope your ok mate.  Ive got some of this small grass to send out to you yet. 
I think I struck very lucky on the wood.  The huge piece sinks but the rest is jammed inside flooded bins out back and weighted down.  
Well with the new 1500nds they dont come with lenses over the leds now so you get a really good 120 degree spread from them. If I had the lenses in this drops to 80 degrees but increases the par considerably 
I may use the 4 and have them all 10cm above water level. Most of the planting will be on or around the wood so I dont have to worry too much about the outer edges and very front of the tank as I want this quite open. 
I think ill purchase a par meter or unless someone on the forum has one I could borrow.......... 
Hows your coming along mate. Are you going for the tmcs then on your big tank??? 



Little-AL said:


> That is ridiculous...
> 
> ...ly brilliant.
> 
> Jealous Al, very jealous!



Ha ha thanks little Al. Im getting giddy for plant up day. Just getting the new bike set up for a peddle out to find rocks 

commencal meta 2013 by Mr-T-, on Flickr

commencal am 2013 by Mr-T-, on Flickr


----------



## Nathaniel Whiteside

Must be wedged!


----------



## malawistu

Nice bike similar to mine but I ride hard tail iv had problems with the shram botton bracket tho keeps clicking 

Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## Alastair

Nathaniel Whiteside said:


> Must be wedged!


If only mate if only. .... 



malawistu said:


> Nice bike similar to mine but I ride hard tail iv had problems with the shram botton bracket tho keeps clicking
> 
> Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 2


Ive also got an ns bikes core hard tail with sram bottom bracket and had the similar click problem but just replaced it and its been great.


----------



## malawistu

Replaced mine too but still doing it again

Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## Alastair

malawistu said:


> Replaced mine too but still doing it again
> 
> Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 2


 Bearings maybe???


----------



## sa80mark

Thread alignment ?  in my younger working days I was a cycle specialist ( my first proper job title lol  ) at halfords and used to get quite a few bikes with this as a recurring problem and 9/10 it was misaligned threads due to manufacturing errors so it might be worth having it checked out


----------



## BigTom

For goodness sake. Less bikes more enormous tanks, please.


----------



## Orlando

That bike is killer. Love the internal cable routing. I still love my Kona's. But your Commencal is pretty boss.

Oh yeah, love those TMC leds.


----------



## hydrophyte

Nice lighting I look forward to seeing how this performs.



Alastair said:


>


----------



## Michael W

If the Chocolate Lake is already as interesting as this it does get you thinking what the Chocolate Sea will be like


----------



## Deano3

wow lighting looks great seen many people with that lighting and looks awesome and very adjustable, really looking forward to this  and agree try 3 if not enough then spend the money for another but only when u have to lol

Dean


----------



## Samuran

Any new pictures for us today Alistair?

Ben

Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk


----------



## Deano3

Deano3 said:


> wow lighting looks great seen many people with that lighting and looks awesome and very adjustable, really looking forward to this and more pics hopefully coming soon  and agree try 3 if not enough then spend the money for another but only when u have to lol
> 
> Dean


----------



## Alastair

Orlando said:


> That bike is killer. Love the internal cable routing. I still love my Kona's. But your Commencal is pretty boss.
> 
> Oh yeah, love those TMC leds.


Hey Orlando.  
Thanks mate. Im a big fan of konas but they havent changed much and im a 26er bot into all the 650s and 29ers which is what theyre all making now. 
I love the commencal.  Its an awesome bike and easily tackles anything. Quite unique too. 
Yep the tmcs look really swish. 



hydrophyte said:


> Nice lighting I look forward to seeing how this performs.


Hiya yeah me too. I easily think ive got enough spread length wise with 3 its just front to back but trial and error. Im not mithered about slow growth at all. If a 4th needs to be added then it can 



Michael W said:


> If the Chocolate Lake is already as interesting as this it does get you thinking what the Chocolate Sea will be like



Aargh michael dont be adding to my already forward thinking. That will be my final aim to have an amanos home sized tank in a couple of years. 


Deano3 said:


> wow lighting looks great seen many people with that lighting and looks awesome and very adjustable, really looking forward to this  and agree try 3 if not enough then spend the money for another but only when u have to lol
> 
> Dean


Cheers Dean. Certainly does look like some great bits of kit and given the results and look they've given to George and Ians tank I cant wait.  


Samuran said:


> Any new pictures for us today Alistair?
> 
> Ben
> 
> Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk


Hi Samuran. 
Only new pics ill have are when I try out the lighting tomorrow and also of all the rocks I collected yesterday


----------



## Alastair

Fancied giving the 3 1500nd tiles and multi controller a quick try tonight. What do people think??
I havent attached the light arms or anything as yet though these were just rested on the brace to test them out


----------



## Andy D

I think they look really good. Seem to give plenty of light!


----------



## Alastair

Andy D said:


> I think they look really good. Seem to give plenty of light!



Thanks andy.  Still unsure about adding a 4th. Theyll be suspended higher up too from polished arms.


----------



## Nathaniel Whiteside

Turn Room lights off and take a picture pal?


----------



## Andy D

Nathaniel Whiteside said:


> Turn Room lights off and take a picture pal?



Good idea. 

(Depending on finances) You could get the fourth just in case and try it. I suppose it is easy to make an empty tank look lit.


----------



## Alastair

Nathaniel Whiteside said:


> Turn Room lights off and take a picture pal?


Its the light from the other tank mate. Ill take a new pic in ten when they go off mate....



Andy D said:


> Good idea.
> 
> (Depending on finances) You could get the fourth just in case and try it. I suppose it is easy to make an empty tank look lit.



My thinking too andy. Any empty tank looks bright with out water etc in. 
Going to wire up the unit again now


----------



## Bufo Bill

Al, I don't know what to say mate, I thought the last tank was big, but this . . . How do I book a scuba diving holiday in your private ocean?

This is going to look awesome!
All the best from Bill.


----------



## Alastair

Bufo Bill said:


> Al, I don't know what to say mate, I thought the last tank was big, but this . . . How do I book a scuba diving holiday in your private ocean?
> 
> This is going to look awesome!
> All the best from Bill.



Hiya Bill, hope your ok mate not seen you post for a while. All things good??? 

Yes it is a bit big. Im really excited about this one. This tank and one bigger after and no more tank buys lol. 

You can book a swim anytime matey.


----------



## Alastair

4th 1500nd will be added thursday


----------



## Bufo Bill

Yeah, all things good mate, but sometimes real life has a way of cutting in without asking first. I would pin my hopes on winning the lottery, but every spare penny goes on lovely shiny fish stuff. 
Thanks for asking mate, 
All the best from Bill.


----------



## Iain Sutherland

Alastair said:


> This tank and one bigger after and no more tank buys lol.


 
seriously mate, you cant possibly be thinking about the next!! i believe you may need to talk to someone on a couch haha


----------



## Alastair

Bufo Bill said:


> Yeah, all things good mate, but sometimes real life has a way of cutting in without asking first. I would pin my hopes on winning the lottery, but every spare penny goes on lovely shiny fish stuff.
> Thanks for asking mate,
> All the best from Bill.



Im with you on that bill. It certainly does cut in.  Glad your well mate hope to see more of you  



Iain Sutherland said:


> seriously mate, you cant possibly be thinking about the next!! i believe you may need to talk to someone on a couch haha



 my main tank ambition has always been to have an amano esque type home tank once ive got a bigger house. Right from the start. So really im not thinking about my next..... thats always been my first. 
No shrink needed now


----------



## tim

Iain Sutherland said:


> seriously mate, you cant possibly be thinking about the next!! i believe you may need to talk to someone on a couch haha


Well if the couch is in front of your tank, I'll volunteer to be your shrink Al


----------



## Edvet

Bah, those lights don't work at all. Just send them to me


----------



## sanj

Alastair said:


> Ive got some of this small grass to send out to you yet.


 
Oh yes, I forgot all about that. I will pm you my address.


----------



## Alastair

Just doing the fill test and trying out all 4 tiles at 70 percent brightness.  They really are bright at 100%. 
Its taken over an hour to fill to this level.....and ill have to drain it tomorrow  






ill be glad when I can put on the panels And attach the light arms


----------



## Aron_Dip

just think................ we will be skinny dipping in there soon!


----------



## John S

If there's a drought in your area we know why


----------



## Alastair

Aron_Dip said:


> just think................ we will be skinny dipping in there soon!



If thats what ideas youve got when your up im getting worried


----------



## Nathaniel Whiteside

If it takes over 2 hours to fill... you may be able to get it upto 25 degrees for Christmas..


----------



## Aron_Dip

Alastair said:


> If thats what ideas youve got when your up im getting worried


Fine ...... ill put my man mankini away!


----------



## Iain Sutherland

Nathaniel Whiteside said:


> If it takes over 2 hours to fill... you may be able to get it upto 25 degrees for Christmas..


 
LOLS
hope you have a few spare heaters.

Im looking forward to the pics of your foraged rocks................ .


----------



## malawistu

If I get my heaters back off a certain women you could have them if needed also why has there been no images of said stones 

Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## Alastair

Iain Sutherland said:


> LOLS
> hope you have a few spare heaters.
> 
> Im looking forward to the pics of your foraged rocks................ .


Yep... 2 eheim jager 300s and fluval e300 heaters. Ill be keeping a acrylic top on during winter which will help with keeping evaporation to a minimum.  
Ill get some shots of the rocks ive found plus the 40kg of petrified wood (think I got too much ha) 



malawistu said:


> If I get my heaters back off a certain women you could have them if needed also why has there been no images of said stones
> 
> Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 2



Doubt youll be getting anything back stu. Im sorted on the heater front anyway. 

Another addition to what's going on the tank too


----------



## Brian Murphy

Just catching up on your journal from a couple of weeks ago and all I can say it wow! How many filters are you using and what are your ideas for flow patterns?


----------



## Alastair

Brian Murphy said:


> Just catching up on your journal from a couple of weeks ago and all I can say it wow! How many filters are you using and what are your ideas for flow patterns?



Hiya mate. 
The set ups been delayed by a couple of weeks but filtration is just going to be one of the 2080 and the fx6 on this tank. Im going to have or try to make an acryclic outlet for the fx6 which will get rid of the awkward twin outlet and soften the flow a little. Ive already managed to come up with a clear inlet strainer for the fx6 which will help to put foam over to stop babies getting sucked up.
 Ill  have this blowing across and down from back right to left and then the lily outlet of the 2080 from front left to right which will be much gentler. Ill be removing some of the media from the 2080 too so overall turnover is improved. 
I want as much turn over but as soft a flow as possible for the fish but enough to keep the water clear.


----------



## Lindy

You could do a full length spraybar with really big holes or a slot cut the length of it? Or would that turn it into a jacuzzi?


----------



## Brian Murphy

Alastair said:


> Hiya mate.
> The set ups been delayed by a couple of weeks but filtration is just going to be one of the 2080 and the fx6 on this tank. Im going to have or try to make an acryclic outlet for the fx6 which will get rid of the awkward twin outlet and soften the flow a little. Ive already managed to come up with a clear inlet strainer for the fx6 which will help to put foam over to stop babies getting sucked up.
> Ill have this blowing across and down from back right to left and then the lily outlet of the 2080 from front left to right which will be much gentler. Ill be removing some of the media from the 2080 too so overall turnover is improved.
> I want as much turn over but as soft a flow as possible for the fish but enough to keep the water clear.


 
Get pics etc of your DIY ventures aswell.  If anyone can do these things you da man!


----------



## Alastair

ldcgroomer said:


> You could do a full length spraybar with really big holes or a slot cut the length of it? Or would that turn it into a jacuzzi?


I did think of a spray bar but the wood being so long would interfere with the flow from front to back.  I think if I just have outlets/lily pipes it will look less cluttered. ....I hope ha




Brian Murphy said:


> Get pics etc of your DIY ventures aswell.  If anyone can do these things you da man!



Yeah for sure mate. Ill do a photo guide when it comes to bending an outlet for it.... im guessing about 5 attempts ha ha 


Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk


----------



## Alastair

I just noticed too on the fill test picture how much depth front to back is lost once there's water in the tank


----------



## Lindy

Alastair said:


> I just noticed too on the fill test picture how much depth front to back is lost once there's water in the tank


Thats cos there isn't any plants or wood to give depth and perspective


----------



## Alastair

ldcgroomer said:


> Thats cos there isn't any plants or wood to give depth and perspective



Ha yeah I know but if you look at the picture above and below water, the below only looks about 30cm from back to front lol

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk


----------



## BigTom

Send it back and get a square one


----------



## Lindy

Alastair said:


> only looks about 30cm from back to front lol


Ah, didn't notice that! Bet you're glad you're getting a bigger one


----------



## zanguli-ya-zamba

Hi Al,
How are you doing mate ? 
Hope to see your tank set up man ! It is becoming too long to wait haha. 

I was to my parents house Sunday and I found a nice huge piece of wood there. I don't know why but it made me think of you haha. So I took some pic. 











I think I will use it in my next scape. I will cut the base like that I will have different roots for scraping. 

Cheers


----------



## Edvet

Man i can't wait to see how you will fare with that tank depth.  I'm always struggeling to get it the way i want it to be. (and i put myself in trouble only using South American plants).


----------



## Alastair

zanguli-ya-zamba said:


> Hi Al, How are you doing mate ? Hope to see your tank set up man ! It is becoming too long to wait haha. I was to my parents house Sunday and I found a nice huge piece of wood there. I don't know why but it made me think of you haha. So I took some pic.


Hiya mate, im not too bad thanks. im hoping so too. slight set back as somethings come up but ill be scaping, planting, panelling, acrylic tube bending and filling next Friday Saturday and sunday.
nice to know when you a see a big tall erect wood you think of mpoi ha ha ha . nice pice though, i couldnt chop any off that.


Edvet said:


> Man i can't wait to see how you will fare with that tank depth. I'm always struggeling to get it the way i want it to be. (and i put myself in trouble only using South American plants).


 
i think im lucky in that the wood helps split the tank up a bit. ive got a lots of plants going in so should help a bit. Why dont you add some non sout american plants to the tank, be differnet....go on


----------



## t.doyle

My current tank is with the same idea as yours but much smaller! 
I have a 130 litre extremely soft water tank (GH 2, kH 1) for breeding my '10 strong' group of _Nannostomus mortenthaleri. _I too am trying to get maximum filter flow through with absolutely minimum tank water movement...

I also have a nice little group of _Sphaerichthys vaillanti _on the way!

Will be following this thread. My breeding thread will be available for viewing within the next couple of months hopefully!


----------



## Alastair

Look forward to your breeding thread mate. ..


----------



## Alastair

Todays the day its getting started


----------



## Lindy

Take LOTS of pictures!


----------



## Rob P

Good luck Alistair! Looking forward to some updates 

(Feel honoured to have a part of your old tank now in mine!  lol)


----------



## aliclarke86

Yay super fun times!! 

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk


----------



## krazypara3165

Cant wait!!


----------



## Wallace

What do we want ................ UPDATES!!!

When do we want them ..................NOW!!!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## sanj

Ha ha.... its no stress free job setting up an aquarium that big... sometimes it just feels like work, but it will be worth it. Have fun!


----------



## darren636

Enjoy pal. Setting up is the best.


----------



## Gary Nelson

Really looking forward to seeing this mate, I'm sure whatever you do, it will be great and you will do those chocs proud


----------



## Alastair

Sorry everyone we havent long started it but just trying to get wood placement etc right


----------



## aliclarke86

Wow long night ahead or you gonna sleep on the placement and start tomorrow?

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk


----------



## Monk d'Wally de Honk

A lot to read here, and it's very impressive, but has anyone pointed out that you won't be able to close the door to the room.



Sorry to break it to you if not.


----------



## Bufo Bill

Agape and agog, hurrah!

All the best from Bill. 
P.S. May have been overdoing the P.G.Woodhouse books of late.


----------



## Alastair

sanj said:


> Ha ha.... its no stress free job setting up an aquarium that big... sometimes it just feels like work, but it will be worth it. Have fun!



Totally agree Sanj.  Massively stressful but very worthwhile.  
Ps you were right on tank volume id put the wrong dimension down ha ha





aliclarke86 said:


> Wow long night ahead or you gonna sleep on the placement and start tomorrow?
> 
> Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk


Hi ali. Placement of the hardscape has changed slightly since that photo and petrified wood has been added. But very happy with how we've got it looking.  Arondip is getting stuck in with me as he was collecting his tank plus cutting up and fixing the panels.
Planting day today cant wait. One let down is my light arms havent been done so not happy at all. 



Monk d'Wally de Honk said:


> A lot to read here, and it's very impressive, but has anyone pointed out that you won't be able to close the door to the room.
> 
> 
> 
> Sorry to break it to you if not.



Thanks glad you like it. The door to the room can close hs ha



Bufo Bill said:


> Agape and agog, hurrah!
> 
> All the best from Bill.
> P.S. May have been overdoing the P.G.Woodhouse books of late.



Ha ha thanks bill. Hope your ok mate.  

Will upload some photos of the setting up and get a full tank shot of hardscape once ive placed lighting over the tank as you cant see it properly with out.

Acrylic outlet and inlet for the fx6 too


----------



## darren636

Monk d'Wally de Honk said:


> A lot to read here, and it's very impressive, but has anyone pointed out that you won't be able to close the door to the room.
> 
> 
> 
> Sorry to break it to you if not.


 he won't be leaving the room. Ever.


----------



## Aron_Dip

Ding ding round 2! 

Sent from my HTC Desire C using Tapatalk


----------



## aliclarke86

I hope you both have your cameras out 

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk


----------



## Edvet

just put one on a tripod and have it take a pic every 30 secs and make a movie, easypeasy


----------



## tim

Bloody 14 pages and not a picture of a plant yet     scaping this must be epic Al looking forward to all future updates  now get a move on


----------



## darren636

I bet they got in the tank and can't get back out


----------



## tim

^^^bloody Aron paddling in his mankini


----------



## Little-AL

Is it not finished, wet and full of fish yet?  

Sent from my GT-I9305 using Tapatalk


----------



## Alastair

aliclarke86 said:


> I hope you both have your cameras out
> 
> Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk





Edvet said:


> just put one on a tripod and have it take a pic every 30 secs and make a movie, easypeasy





tim said:


> Bloody 14 pages and not a picture of a plant yet     scaping this must be epic Al looking forward to all future updates  now get a move on





darren636 said:


> I bet they got in the tank and can't get back out





tim said:


> ^^^bloody Aron paddling in his mankini





Little-AL said:


> Is it not finished, wet and full of fish yet?
> 
> Sent from my GT-I9305 using Tapatalk



Hi everyone. Sorry for not posting for the past 2 days.  
All is finished anf filled now, aron did a great job cutting all the mdf for the panels and getting stuck in helping me with hardscape layout and planting. (Not bad considering he was only coming for a tank ha ha)
  It took ages and everytime we did something, something would happen to delay things. 
Especially the light arms wed been and bought which we then decided against so few more hours wasted. 
Id finally finished planting at around 3 this morning and left it to fill whilst I cleaned up only to find all the wood has lifted up and I had to redo the tank again. It was daylight by the time id finished ..
So the tank is a little cloudy at present but I am just going to upload photos from the camera first and get them on. 
Once tge tanks clear ill get some shots.  

I need to get more plants too as despite have lots and lots,it doesn't look that many at all. 

Also made acrylic inlet and outlet for the fx6 




Think it looks pretty good.


----------



## Alastair

Here's a during planting shot just taken on the phone 

1300 litre chocolate gourami tank by Mr-T-, on Flickr


----------



## darren636

Meh...


----------



## Andy D

Looking good Alastair! Looking forward to future updates.


----------



## aliclarke86

I'm surprised the wood floated...major bummer but I think you have earned a good couple days sleep now 

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk


----------



## Gary Nelson

Lovely jubbly! Can't wait to see more


----------



## BigTom

Alastair that's looking brilliant. Great sense of depth and the wood looks really natural - much better than the layouts on the carpet! Will get some ferns off to you tomorrow.

Enjoy your sleep tonight!


----------



## Nathaniel Whiteside

Looking Great alistair mate. Bet your Knackered!
Wheres the tank situated? cos condensation off that bad boy will probably turn said room into a tropical jungle.


----------



## sanj

Lol, its great! You must be chuffed. 


Does the guy who sold you the wood still sell it or was that a lucky one off? Ive been asking Tom for Tree stumps to complement the two I got or even a fallen one...

Is that gravel or sand... unipac stuff?


----------



## Deano3

looking good Alistair love the layout and the wood looks great real sense of depth looking forward to more pics 

Cheers dean


----------



## Plunket

After all the drama, finally getting there  - cracking mate, well done!


----------



## jojouk

How much is the substrate sloped up at the rear? Cant quite make it out  Maybe if you get 5 mins, take a shot of the side view? Pretty please?


----------



## Ian Holdich

Awesome mate! Nuff said...


----------



## Aron_Dip

Its a beast trust me! Im just hanging my swin suit up...... 

Sent from my GT-I9305 using Tapatalk


----------



## Michael W

Fantastic start! Aron I'm surprised you didn't bring your speedos


----------



## sanj

Michael W said:


> Fantastic start! Aron I'm surprised you didn't bring your speedos


 
Budgie smugglers... hmm a bit risky, I think there is a young lady about the house.


----------



## Michael W

sanj said:


> Budgie smugglers... hmm a bit risky, I think there is a young lady about the house.


 
Quite true, quite true.


----------



## steveno

Speechless!


----------



## darren636

Looks like a Rio 240 to me


----------



## Samuran

Looking really good Alistair, makes my efforts over the weekend look like a bit of a wet squib.... thanks


----------



## Nathaniel Whiteside

Sprung a leak pal? It was 1400 litres before  

Jokes.

How you doing? Exhausted?


----------



## Rob P

That'll be the displacement after one of the bits of wood  lol


----------



## Andy D

Perhaps he has got stuck in there...


----------



## Edvet

why am i thinking of this?


----------



## BigTom

That's exactly how my room looked after changing the pond soil in my tank.


----------



## Lindy

Ha, doesn't look only 30cm depth now does it? Its MaHoooosive! So jealous...


----------



## George Farmer

Alastair said:


> 1300 litre chocolate gourami tank by Mr-T-, on Flickr


BOOOOOM!!!  

Looking great mate. 

Let's not underestimate the challenges you've experienced getting to this point. But you've risen to them, and beyond. The hardscape layout looks perfectly balanced already and will only get better once the tank is full and the plants start to grow in.

This is going to be a true aquarium plant paradise where flora and fauna will absolutely thrive in the most beautiful of environments. 

Brilliant.


----------



## NatureBoy

Looking awesome, to add even more to the sense of depth that you have, have you thought about moving the substrate away from the front panel and corners then levelling it off? I find this lets your eyes "into" the scape easier, and will let you follow the wood in left corner into the "mound" even more dramatically, you'll get more apparent height too. Just a thought mind, you're the boss!....


----------



## Aron_Dip

NatureBoy said:


> Looking awesome, to add even more to the sense of depth that you have, have you thought about moving the substrate away from the front panel and corners then levelling it off? I find this lets your eyes "into" the scape easier, and will let you follow the wood in left corner into the "mound" even more dramatically, you'll get more apparent height too. Just a thought mind, you're the boss!....


Hope Al dont mind me replying to this message... if you look close the sides go up past the tank base so when you see the full front shot you dont see much if any gravel. 

Peace out

Sent from my GT-I9305 using Tapatalk


----------



## NatureBoy

Aron_Dip said:


> Hope Al dont mind me replying to this message... if you look close the sides go up past the tank base so when you see the full front shot you dont see much if any gravel.
> 
> Peace out
> 
> Sent from my GT-I9305 using Tapatalk


 
aw yeh...gonna look so good!


----------



## Alastair

Andy D said:


> Looking good Alastair! Looking forward to future updates.


 thanks Andy. Ill be taking weekly photos to update. 


aliclarke86 said:


> I'm surprised the wood floated...major bummer but I think you have earned a good couple days sleep now
> 
> Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk


I was too ali. I think the main problem was that the wood was sat out in the air in the tank for 2 days and the thinner parts had begun to dry out despite misting them and I think it was these that caused the whole lot to shift. Good job I over ordered on the petrified wood which is holding it all down. 
Thanks mate ive slept like a log. 


Gary Nelson said:


> Lovely jubbly! Can't wait to see more


 cheers buddy. Itll be nice to get some fts when the water has cleared more but ill be posting up photos later today.



BigTom said:


> Alastair that's looking brilliant. Great sense of depth and the wood looks really natural - much better than the layouts on the carpet! Will get some ferns off to you tomorrow.
> 
> Enjoy your sleep tonight!



Thanks millions mate. I was worried how this would turn out but the wood kind of fell into place.  Just the one piece that comes up and out the top had us "STUMPED" for a while as it just wouldnt look right. Took about an hour before it was settled in it spot.  The massive brace bars didnt help. Im trying to get it clear to take some photos.  It was crystal before the wood floated.  



Nathaniel Whiteside said:


> Looking Great alistair mate. Bet your Knackered!
> Wheres the tank situated? cos condensation off that bad boy will probably turn said room into a tropical jungle.


Thanks nath. Yeah im knackered mate. Total lack of sleep coupled with basically having to plant the tank twice was a bit frustrating but like I tell people nothing is ever straight forward for me. 
Condensation??? Its more like a waterfall mate. Ive got the dehumidifier on over night and just ordered two pieces of acrylic sheet to place over the top for during the winter. 



sanj said:


> Lol, its great! You must be chuffed.
> 
> 
> Does the guy who sold you the wood still sell it or was that a lucky one off? Ive been asking Tom for Tree stumps to complement the two I got or even a fallen one...
> 
> Is that gravel or sand... unipac stuff?



Hiya Sanj 
Im over the moon. It really has turned out far better than I thought. Id have seriously struggled with this on my own so hats off to you for setting yours up alone sanj. It would have taken me ages to do. Get in get out get in get out. No thanks. You should see a couple of the photos I look like amano bossing one of his pa's about on where to place things. 
I got the wood from 2 seperate people. Do you mean the big oak piece of the other stuff. The other stuff she has a garage full to the roof with wood. Ill pm you sanj. 

Its Unipac Samoa fine sand but really just small grains of gravel. I love the stuff.  


Deano3 said:


> looking good Alistair love the layout and the wood looks great real sense of depth looking forward to more pics
> 
> Cheers dean



Cheers Dean I appreciate your kind words.  Im excited about this tank alot. 
Pics of the planting etc ill pop up shortly but full tank shot I cant take yet as its cloudy. 


Plunket said:


> After all the drama, finally getting there  - cracking mate, well done!


I know ha ha. Thanks so much mate . Its certainly done me proud. Im very happy with this. 



jojouk said:


> How much is the substrate sloped up at the rear? Cant quite make it out  Maybe if you get 5 mins, take a shot of the side view? Pretty please?


Hi jojo. 
Yep ive got some pics on the camera ill pop up this evening. At the back right corner its 28 cm high  with the tmc nutrasoil. Lots of it.


----------



## Alastair

Ian Holdich said:


> Awesome mate! Nuff said...


Confidence boost right there thank you mate.  Really appreciate that thanks Ian 


Aron_Dip said:


> Its a beast trust me! Im just hanging my swin suit up......
> 
> Sent from my GT-I9305 using Tapatalk





Michael W said:


> Fantastic start! Aron I'm surprised you didn't bring your speedos



At one point he only wanted hia socks on. I really had to tame him. He was far too excited.



sanj said:


> Budgie smugglers... hmm a bit risky, I think there is a young lady about the house.


 certainly was sanj, 2 young ladies there was. 


steveno said:


> Speechless!


Thanks steve  


darren636 said:


> Looks like a Rio 240 to me


I know. .... far too small. Think I need to upgrade to the 400  


Samuran said:


> Looking really good Alistair, makes my efforts over the weekend look like a bit of a wet squib.... thanks


Lol sorry samuran. Wasnt intentional. 


Nathaniel Whiteside said:


> Sprung a leak pal? It was 1400 litres before
> 
> Jokes.
> 
> How you doing? Exhausted?


Gosh don't say that mate lol. But no, near the beginning of the thread sanj had worked out it was just short of 1300 and me 1400 but id got the front to back dimension wrong by ten cm. 
Really exhausted mate but all refreshed today thanka bud. 


Rob P said:


> That'll be the displacement after one of the bits of wood  lol


 lol yep ha ha


----------



## Alastair

Edvet said:


> why am i thinking of this?





BigTom said:


> That's exactly how my room looked after changing the pond soil in my tank.



What????? Tom your girlfriend was rolling around the floor covered in mud :-0


----------



## Alastair

ldcgroomer said:


> Ha, doesn't look only 30cm depth now does it? Its MaHoooosive! So jealous...


No ha ha it's crazy how a bit of wood and gravel can change that ha. It looks bloody huge.  Looking from the left side into the tank it goes on for ever. . I chose not to black out the back of the tank too as thought it would spoil it. 




NatureBoy said:


> Looking awesome, to add even more to the sense of depth that you have, have you thought about moving the substrate away from the front panel and corners then levelling it off? I find this lets your eyes "into" the scape easier, and will let you follow the wood in left corner into the "mound" even more dramatically, you'll get more apparent height too. Just a thought mind, you're the boss!....





Aron_Dip said:


> Hope Al dont mind me replying to this message... if you look close the sides go up past the tank base so when you see the full front shot you dont see much if any gravel.
> 
> Peace out
> 
> Sent from my GT-I9305 using Tapatalk


^^^^^^ what aron said lol.... thanks nature boy.  Id have done exactly that if id not decided to have the panels come above the base of the tank.


----------



## Alastair

George Farmer said:


> BOOOOOM!!!
> 
> Looking great mate.
> 
> Let's not underestimate the challenges you've experienced getting to this point. But you've risen to them, and beyond. The hardscape layout looks perfectly balanced already and will only get better once the tank is full and the plants start to grow in.
> 
> This is going to be a true aquarium plant paradise where flora and fauna will absolutely thrive in the most beautiful of environments.
> 
> Brilliant.



thanks George. Thats some seriously confidence Inspiring words.  ( and im not kissing butt here lol). 
Your right theres been challenges that have been so deflating which you yourself know about and delayed the set up plus had me thinking to not carry on. 

Its been a tough set up as nothing wanted to go smoothly which added to the time this took to come together and the wood deciding to have a play and pulling the lot up didn't help. I didnt do the calming press ups though mate ha ha. I was on auto pilot. 
 im shocked by that fact this tank has so many plants in but doesn't look it at all. I may add some more to it if I can afford it. 

It really has come together very well, im made up with how it looks and to hear that feed back and very postive opinion on the layout and the eventual look from the man himself has given me a massive boost thank you very much mate.


----------



## Edvet

Welcome to the world of large tanks, where everything is a struggle, but the rewards are as big as the tank


----------



## James D

Looking amazing Alastair, truly inspirational. Hat's off to your better half as well, I can imagine the reaction in my house to such a proposal.


----------



## Alastair

Edvet said:


> Welcome to the world of large tanks, where everything is a struggle, but the rewards are as big as the tank


True true. I could not have put it better myself.  Very rewarding.  I even like it with lights off ha. 



James D said:


> Looking amazing Alastair, truly inspirational. Hat's off to your better half as well, I can imagine the reaction in my house to such a proposal.



Thanks kindly james. Im hoping it has just as much appeal when its growing in and fish go in. 
Ps I dont have a better half who lives with me ha ha


----------



## Lindy

Alastair said:


> Ps I dont have a better half who lives with me ha ha


Apart from the staffie


----------



## Lee Sweeting

Looks amazing Alastair! I'm really looking forward to seeing this develop.


----------



## Monk d'Wally de Honk

Alastair said:


> Ps I dont have a better half who lives with me ha ha


 
Now you are making people jealous.


----------



## Alastair

ldcgroomer said:


> Apart from the staffie


Ahhh true true.  Hes a boy though so not sure that sounds quite right ha ha. 


Lee Sweeting said:


> Looks amazing Alastair! I'm really looking forward to seeing this develop.


Hi Lee thanks very much mate. Been trying to get to grips with taking hakf decent shots with the new camera which ill get up tonight. 


Monk d'Wally de Honk said:


> Now you are making people jealous.



Hehe. How else would I get away with my big tanks addiction


----------



## Alastair

Just whilst I upload all the cam shots to flickr I took a couple of mobile shots if the tank last night. They dont show the true size of it unlike the camera does.  
Excuse the haze from the uprooting and the rocks weighting the wood down

My acrylic outlets are just at the side of the tank waiting to go on too. 

chocolate lake by Mr-T-, on Flickr


Untitled by Mr-T-, on Flickr

Few more plants to add and need to level off the substrate at the front and raise it just behind the wood


----------



## Lee Sweeting

It's looking great al! I defiantly have tank envy 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## aliclarke86

Wphats happened to your flickr? There is very few photos on there!!

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk


----------



## Alastair

aliclarke86 said:


> Wphats happened to your flickr? There is very few photos on there!!
> 
> Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk


Very few photos???? Of this or in general ali. I can see lots


----------



## aliclarke86

In general. Maybe its my phone app. It is only showing back to a couple photos of the maidenhair fern in your last tank

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk


----------



## Alastair

Could be the app mate. They're all set to view publicly


----------



## Lindy

Looking at those pictures I found myself making a noise akin to Homer simpson looking at cake.


----------



## Nathaniel Whiteside

Love Ali. Wow.


----------



## Aron_Dip

Pics dont do this tank justice... you have too see it

Sent from my GT-I9305 using Tapatalk


----------



## Nathaniel Whiteside

Aron_Dip said:


> Pics dont do this tank justice... you have too see it
> 
> Sent from my GT-I9305 using Tapatalk



I'm considering that an invitation..


----------



## sanj

Its looking LUBBERLY!




> I got the wood from 2 seperate people. Do you mean the big oak piece of the other stuff. The other stuff she has a garage full to the roof with wood. Ill pm you sanj.


 
Yes please!

Damn Naggit... you are making me think i need to re-scape... I dont know if I can face it.

TB is sending some wood for my ehem "baby tank" but also some stumps that will hopefully complement the existing ones on the biggy.


----------



## Gary Nelson

its a stunner!!!  you really have done this justice mate... the hardscape is just right  looking  forward to seeing more pics too.


----------



## Dan Crawford

BOSH! Absolutely stunning mate. I know how much hard work, time and money you've put in to this and hopefully it now feels worth it.

Massive respect for pulling this one off


----------



## Aron_Dip

Nathaniel Whiteside said:


> I'm considering that an invitation..


Count me in ... 

Sent from my GT-I9305 using Tapatalk


----------



## Nathaniel Whiteside

Aron_Dip said:


> Count me in ...
> 
> Sent from my GT-I9305 using Tapatalk



No pants party at the Chocolate lake!


----------



## Ben C

Tank envy


----------



## jojouk

sanj said:


> Its looking LUBBERLY!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yes please!
> 
> Damn Naggit... you are making me think i need to re-scape... I dont know if I can face it.
> 
> TB is sending some wood for my ehem "baby tank" but also some stumps that will hopefully complement the existing ones on the biggy.


 
So where is this mysterious lady with her garage full of wood? Can you pm me too? However, Im sure it will be miles and miles away from me!


----------



## Alastair

Gary Nelson said:


> its a stunner!!!  you really have done this justice mate... the hardscape is just right  looking  forward to seeing more pics too.



Thanks Gary. Its clearing up really well now so will begin adding some corydoras habrosus next week whilst the choccos continue their breeding frenzy in the storage tank. 
Im struggling seriously with taking pics on the dslr though.  Daytime shots are awesome.  Night Time are crap and grainy no matter what I try 



Dan Crawford said:


> BOSH! Absolutely stunning mate. I know how much hard work, time and money you've put in to this and hopefully it now feels worth it.
> 
> Massive respect for pulling this one off



Charz matey, thought youd like it from the early pics of the wood youd seen. .really appreciate your comments pal means alot mate really does 

Definitely feels worth it now. All the set backs are behind me now. Im looking forward to this growing in and becoming a nice equilibrium for both plants and fish.


----------



## Alastair

Added a few cherries and ramshorns in today to get chomping on the white fungus type growth that sometimes appears on wood. 
Never had it before in any set ups but theyre doing a good job. 







Having some major crypt melt with the petchi on the far right though.  Unusual as its only these affected. Everyone of them is melting away. Arrrrrgh


----------



## sanj

I had white stuff all over my wood... dont worry its natural.

I think it was there for some weeks eventually went away.


----------



## Alastair

sanj said:


> I had white stuff all over my wood... dont worry its natural.
> 
> I think it was there for some weeks eventually went away.



Great stuff thanks Sanj. Ive syphoned as much as possible but its back the day after so ill leave it be. 

Ive just been setting up a bigger shrimp tank today and went to pop some more leaves in the gouramis temporary home and noticed one of the females has let her babies go finally. 
So im now the proud owner of another bundle of little choccos. Im contemplating leaving them in for a while as theyre all showing breeding  behaviour. 
It appears ive either got one very dominant colourful male who won't allow the other males to breed or I only have the one male. I figure if I leave them in and just concentrate on getting my small corys and chillis, then ill have more female choccos holding and I can leave them to have some peace and catch the rest to put in the big tank. 

Im really gutted about the crypt melt though. They look awful.


----------



## sanj

Dont worry about crypt melt, they nearly always recover in my experiance.


----------



## Samuran

Any more pics Alistair? 

Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk


----------



## RichardJW

Fantastic new setup - like everyone else , looking forward to seeing it develop . Keep the updates ( and pictures) coming !!


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


----------



## Alastair

sanj said:


> Dont worry about crypt melt, they nearly always recover in my experiance.


Yes they do your right sanj. Just not as quick in a non co2 tank lol....much much slower. Strange how its mainly the one species.  


Samuran said:


> Any more pics Alistair?
> 
> Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk


Yes ill get taking some this weekend with the camera now all the rocks keeping the wood down have been removed.  
No change look wise though. 



RichardJW said:


> Fantastic new setup - like everyone else , looking forward to seeing it develop . Keep the updates ( and pictures) coming !!
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk



Will do richard thanks mate.


----------



## Alastair

Just a quick photo update from my phone.  Im seruously struggling to get good shots with my dslr so unfortunately cant put up any crisp shots and my phone squashes in the picture so the tank looks small 


4 weeks after fill. by Mr-T-, on Flickr

Its got a big shoal of corydoras pygmaeus which are stunning little things and all choccos other than some babies are in along with the paros and ottos. 
Growth is doing great for 4 weeks barring the major crypt melt which im not happy with so the far right side and slope arw bare and all the crypts along the rear and left are just beggining to appear so doesnt look great. 

Im removing the trident fern on the wood at the front too. Its taking focus away and when it grows in fully it'll ruin the look 

 Im going to trim the trident too as the original leaves are wilting which ive experienced every time in a low tech. Think its due to the not keeping constantly wet during plant up.  Its growing rampant though. 
A couple of pieces of rock are still in to hold down one floating bit of wood and need to add more plants over the next few weeks. 

 Running all 4 1500 tiles at 40 percent for 4 hours a day with a ten min ramp up and down and one tile stays at 2 percent through out the the night to create moonlight. 

Overall im quite happy so far. Just need to wait until the plants really settle in 

Ill be getting some good photo tips this week so can do lots of photos.


----------



## Gary Nelson

It looks great mate! Remember on a tank this size it will take a while to settle and adapt... I'd say for its age it's perfect and you are going great guns!


----------



## RichardJW

Looking good ! I like the patient approach , in the long run you'll certainly benefit .

BTW did you get any more pictures at P@H ?


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


----------



## sanj

Heh looks like one of the trees that blew over in the storm last week. It is looking nicely balanced, but you know I only get the sense of scale when I look at the eheim intake, otherwise it could be as large as Amano's monster.


----------



## Alastair

Gary Nelson said:


> It looks great mate! Remember on a tank this size it will take a while to settle and adapt... I'd say for its age it's perfect and you are going great guns!


Thanks matey.  Im slightly in 2 minds as something doesnt look right to me but cant put my hand on what. 



RichardJW said:


> Looking good ! I like the patient approach , in the long run you'll certainly benefit .
> 
> BTW did you get any more pictures at P@H ?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


Thanks Richard.  Have to be extra patient with a tank this big low tech as it obviously takes longer to grow in. 

Ill get those pics up.


----------



## Alastair

sanj said:


> Heh looks like one of the trees that blew over in the storm last week. It is looking nicely balanced, but you know I only get the sense of scale when I look at the eheim intake, otherwise it could be as large as Amano's monster.



A tree blown over ha ha. Not sure whether to take that as a compliment or not he he. Originally I wanted to use that one big piece and do just that.  Have it look like a tree had sunk. 
The sense of scale is way off Sanj as the s4 camera has squashed the photo in width ways so doesnt look as long as it is.


----------



## Alastair

Sad news currently.  Ive lost almost all the pygmy corys. They began acting intoxicated and swimming into things, upside down all sorts. I used a test kit (shhhhhh) and all parameters were spot on. Chocolate gouramis licorice gouramis ottos and a couple of cherries that had been put in are all perfectly normal and showing breeding behaviour.  
I was baffled at this and slowly one by one they began dying or I had to put them to sleep. 2 are left but they're thr same. 

On the branched ends of the big piece of oak I have a strange kind of white hair that grows back the day after I brush it off and theyd seemed very interested in this so not sure if this was the cause. Darrel mentioned to me that all fungus has some form of toxic substance but ill not know. .they could have even had a diseaese before they even arrived. Very sad to see this as fish arent just fish to me. 

Ill wait until its fully planted before adding any other fauna. Ive got more plants arriving this week I hope and am wondering whether to switch out the trident on the top right side as not sure if this looks unbalanced when you see the windelov in the left. Any ideas would be great. 
This next lot of plants will hopefully make it look much more grown in. 

Going to run twin fx6 filters too which are sat boxed up in my living room waiting to go on.  The adjustable outlets are great for getting flow right down to substrate level I keep having particles settling on the gravel. I guess you dont see this when you have a dark planting substrate as it all falls through.  

Also going to be starting a hopefully lovely shrimp scape journal this week too.


----------



## BigTom

Ah, really sorry to hear that Al. I get incredibly mopey about losing fish as well. I've only ever kept cories once a long time ago so don't have much useful to contribute, but if the licorice and chocoloate gouramis are OK then it seems unlikely to be a water quality issue.

What are new plant additions going to be?


----------



## sa80mark

Sounds very strange I cant think of anything to help, as tom said considering the gouramis etc are fine it cant be water issues,

A bit of a long shot but is your ph to low ? I know its written that ph for them is between 6.5 - 7.5 but from experience closer to 7.5 is best for them

The only other thing is like you said the fungus but even this would be a long a shot as I would have thought the shrimp would be the first on to this and be the first to suffer  ?


----------



## nybraby

Had some down time in work today so going through journals...I like the look of this giving me some good ideas for my tank.


----------



## James O

Sorry for your losses Al. I love my Pygmy Corys.

On the positive side if/when you get some more they'll have one hell of a home


----------



## roadmaster

Have never had ANY species of corydoras do well for me for very long at temp's much above 76 degree's F
Also have had some waste away from causes unknown.
I now offer anti parasite food = small bottle of Jungle lab's anti parasite food (metro,prazi) crushed up with pestle ,and mixed with equal part's of flake or pellet food and garlic extract to form a paste which I then freeze.
I feed only this food for four to seven day's for new fishes, and have completely stopped offering blood worm's which have become linked to possible issues in recent year's by more and more fishkeeper's.


----------



## Lee Sweeting

Sorry to hear that Alastair. It's always a shame to lose fish.


----------



## Bufo Bill

So sorry mate, I know how you feel. Afraid I have no advice for this one, just lots of sympathy. Remember though: you tried your best and that counts for everything. 

Looking forward to your shrimp journal, and the lake is shaping up wonderfully; very impressed. 
All the best from Bill.


----------



## RichardJW

Just catching up with this thread I note Roadmaster mentions an anti-parasite treatment . Save looking for it - it's a USA product ( now discontinued ), here on UK these types of products are Vet only products .


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Alastair

Just a little update, ive added a lot more plants to the tank over the past week, and also re done the lwft side of wood where the windelov was as it didnt look right. They just looked placed and not natural. 
 Its looking great now and when everything takes off which its starting too ill be adding in the full fauna. 
Its got a nice partial carpeting of parva added too. 

Ive not had much luck with moss in this tank though which im stumped at as ive never ever had problems. What ever it i put in just doesn't stay green and starts to go a dull colour.  

Im now dosing tropica specialised and premium on alternate days but at 1/4 the stated dosing as im not adding co2. 

Ive also got 2 fx6 running alongside the other filter too with minimal bio media which is helping with flow as its a pain in a tank this size. 

Ive been taking pics with my dslr but due to having a bright room and the tank being so big im getting reflections from everywhere so the camera is not focusing past the reflections so pics are grainy and not sharp. Had some great help from George Farmer (thanks mate) on dealing with this and getting a good full tank shot so going to get stuck in next week and post up lots of shots.


----------



## RichardJW

If you've got a tripod I would suggest setting the camera to full manual and switching Autofocus OFF . That way you can control exactly which point you want to focus on can go for a good Depth of field . 


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----------



## GHNelson

Alastair said:


> Sad news currently. Ive lost almost all the pygmy corys. They began acting intoxicated and swimming into things, upside down all sorts.


Hi Alistair
Could be that you have different water parameters from the fish store you bought them from.
Do you use RO?
hoggie


----------



## Alastair

RichardJW said:


> If you've got a tripod I would suggest setting the camera to full manual and switching Autofocus OFF . That way you can control exactly which point you want to focus on can go for a good Depth of field .
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk



Thanks richard. Yep I have an oldschool solid tripod and use manual focus all the time now on tank shots. Its just the reflections which are a pain but ive got some great tips which ill put into practice. 


hogan53 said:


> Hi Alistair
> Could be that you have different water parameters from the fish store you bought them from.
> Do you use RO?
> hoggie



Hi hoggie 

No I dont use ro as my water is stupidly soft and acidic anyway. The shop is right near by. The corys had only been in the shop tank overnight and straight to me but spoke with darrel and he thinks they may have already been slightly unwell and underfed etc. Guess ill never know but the tanks inhabitants are thriving already. 
Chocolate gouramis showing the male pecking order and chasing females and the licorice gourami males are showing some anazing territorial bouts. They really do seem to like this tank. Even the ottos shoal around all day together.  

Hoping for another 10 ottos, 40 choccos, 20 more licorice gouramis and will try pygmy corys again if I can find them local


----------



## GHNelson

Well that rules that out
hoggie


----------



## James O

Try a circular polarized filter for getting rid of reflections

Can wait for your pic updates......


----------



## Alastair

Here is a couple of photos off my phone prior to just finishing off the rest of the planting this evening. Not great quality but waiting until I get some good shots with my dslr and sorted the reflection. 
Not sure why my phone makes everything look so small though 



 

and the maiden hair which im having to trim every weekend now 


 

Looking forward to seeing it grow in now and adding the rest of the occupants over the next few weeks


----------



## Gary Nelson

It's looking fab mate! I'd love a tank like that  if you ever have any trimmings of the maiden hair I'd be interested in buying a tiny bit off you please.  I'm after something to grow on the exposed bits of the manzi - think this would be ideal?


----------



## Lee Sweeting

It's looking great mate. I bet the choco's are happy!? 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## tim

This is epic, you think it looks small until you notice the tank makes that fx strainer look tiny. Top job Al.


----------



## Ian Holdich

Looks great Al, I can't help feel that there's something missing in that gap on the left, just where you have the rock. Why not pack that with java fern?


----------



## Alastair

Lee Sweeting said:


> It's looking great mate. I bet the choco's are happy!?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Thanks lee. Yes they are really settled in and using every bit of space In the tank to swim in. I think they prefer the size of this and they come up to me every time im near the tank. 



tim said:


> This is epic, you think it looks small until you notice the tank makes that fx strainer look tiny. Top job Al.


Too kind mate too kind.  Ha ha yeah I didnt realise how tiny they looked until you mentioned it. Ive made clear acrylic inlets for both fx6s and am trying to make the acrylic outlets more lily pipe. Problem is I dont want velocity too much as theyll just hide but at the same time its such a big bloody tank that flow everywhere is a struggle. 



Ian Holdich said:


> Looks great Al, I can't help feel that there's something missing in that gap on the left, just where you have the rock. Why not pack that with java fern?



Hiya mate. Thanks ian and appreciate your feedback. Do you mean the piece of petrified wood that's off centre up on the mound??? Ive got 2 echinodorus aquartica up just above the two bits now and some more parva flowing down and around the wood at the front.  
Where abouts do you mean. 
I want to keep a little open substrate at the front left


----------



## Alastair

Gary Nelson said:


> It's looking fab mate! I'd love a tank like that  if you ever have any trimmings of the maiden hair I'd be interested in buying a tiny bit off you please.  I'm after something to grow on the exposed bits of the manzi - think this would be ideal?



Sorry gary I missed quoting this. Thanks mate. If you want a cutting drop me a pm mate and ill send you some out for free


----------



## sanj

Simply brilliant Alastair.


----------



## Ian Holdich

Hey Al, it's not on the actual substrate, it's in that little nook. Where the valley leads up to the wood. I was think nig more around or on the base of the wood. 

This is very minor though mate, still looks ace!


----------



## Alastair

sanj said:


> Simply brilliant Alastair.


Thanks sanj, hopefully have a nice lush garden like yours in around ermmmmm 4 years time  


Ian Holdich said:


> Hey Al, it's not on the actual substrate, it's in that little nook. Where the valley leads up to the wood. I was think nig more around or on the base of the wood.
> 
> This is very minor though mate, still looks ace!



Think im having a blondo moment mate.. still cant picture where you mean


----------



## Iain Sutherland

Alastair said:


> hopefully have a nice lush garden like yours in around ermmmmm 4 years time


youll have another tank in 6 months 
looks good though mate, what you got hiding round the back that is yet to show itself?
windelov looks better in its new home.. more natural.  im just not a fan of it.
maybe some mircrosorum mini around the gaff would add a little detail?? just a thought..

will look stunning in 6 months or so..


----------



## BigTom

It's looking ace already Alistair.

If I can make a comment on composition however - you've very cleverly created at least 9 hardscape lines which all lead the eye to the same place in the tank:







Furthermore, that spot is almost bang on a major intersection of the golden ratio, making it an extremely powerful focal point for the tank.

*But there's nothing there!*

It's crying out for a big focal plant so much that it makes my eyes hurt


----------



## aliclarke86

I think that may be the spot in was talking about but I'm note sure, maybe a couple more arrows would help  

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----------



## Ian Holdich

BigTom said:


> It's looking ace already Alistair.
> 
> If I can make a comment on composition however - you've very cleverly created at least 9 hardscape lines which all lead the eye to the same place in the tank:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Furthermore, that spot is almost bang on a major intersection of the golden ratio, making it an extremely powerful focal point for the tank.
> 
> *But there's nothing there!*
> 
> It's crying out for a big focal plant so much that it makes my eyes hurt




^^^this Alastair.


----------



## tim

I think big tom got it


----------



## BigTom

Hahah, sorry it appears I stole Ian's constructive criticism. That'll teach me to skim-read.


----------



## Ian Holdich

I have a broke pc, Tom, so couldn't use paint to show where I was coming from...great minds and all that ; )


----------



## sanj

I think you should place a gnome right in the g spot....just to make everyone happy 

In terms of focal plants I think of Echinodorus, but maybe that is a bit too obvious...


----------



## plantbrain

I think Belem grass would be ideal for this foreground area. 
It'll make a nice long term rug.

Some other plants around the edges of the wood like you have on the right side, those crypts look good.
The Belem grass will match well and it does get nice and dense, even in the plain sand.

If you decide to moss the wood, this will give a very old aged look, or you can leave the wood clean if you want to highlight the wood itself.
Blyxa japonica in the rear perhaps, or if you want stems and swords, you could use those and trim them more often.
The H. tennellus will thicken and make a nice lawn as well.


----------



## George Farmer

Looking good mate.

I concur with Tom's focal point idea.


----------



## sanj

Do we get Belem grass over here? Is it a type of Eleocharis?


----------



## tim

sanj said:


> Do we get Belem grass over here? Is it a type of Eleocharis?


Plant Details


----------



## Alastair

BigTom said:


> It's looking ace already Alistair.
> 
> If I can make a comment on composition however - you've very cleverly created at least 9 hardscape lines which all lead the eye to the same place in the tank:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Furthermore, that spot is almost bang on a major intersection of the golden ratio, making it an extremely powerful focal point for the tank.
> 
> *But there's nothing there!*
> 
> It's crying out for a big focal plant so much that it makes my eyes hurt


Ha ha thanks Tom. Appreciate you putting that up. 
I kind of thought Ian was meaning this area, and your right it is crying out for a big focal plant.
 The photo I put up was one taken prior to me adding the rest of what I needed to.
 Right bang on where the arrows point to is a really nice E.Reni but just below this on the ridge below is a beautiful Leganandra Meeboldii Red which will be a big focal plant as it colours up and grows out. Never tried this species before but Google images show it looking really nice. 
I was actually editing the picture on my phone with some squiggles to see where in meant but you got there with a much more prominent pointer  



aliclarke86 said:


> I think that may be the spot in was talking about but I'm note sure, maybe a couple more arrows would help
> 
> Sent from my GT-I9505G using Tapatalk





sanj said:


> I think you should place a gnome right in the g spot....just to make everyone happy
> 
> In terms of focal plants I think of Echinodorus, but maybe that is a bit too obvious...


 Ive got a garden gnome Sanj ha ha. Might just do that for a fun photo. 


plantbrain said:


> I think Belem grass would be ideal for this foreground area.
> It'll make a nice long term rug.
> 
> Some other plants around the edges of the wood like you have on the right side, those crypts look good.
> The Belem grass will match well and it does get nice and dense, even in the plain sand.
> 
> If you decide to moss the wood, this will give a very old aged look, or you can leave the wood clean if you want to highlight the wood itself.
> Blyxa japonica in the rear perhaps, or if you want stems and swords, you could use those and trim them more often.
> The H. tennellus will thicken and make a nice lawn as well.



Hi Tom, 
Belem grass or eleocharis so mini is actually in there now coming from the valley downwards but obviously don't have enough to carry it all the way. 

Funny you mention moss, as since Ive had this tank planted I have had 3 different varieties of moss attached to the large oak piece as I want it to look aged but for some peculiar reason none have faired well at all. The Xmas moss is just barely holding its colour along the main trunk of wood. Never had problems with moss before. 
I've got some cladaohora moss which I'm trying now to see if that holds well but I wanted the wood covered in moss really. 
I've got e. Reni, ocelot and Barthii at the back of the tank which you can't see properly from the angle that photo was taken and some e. Aquartica..



George Farmer said:


> Looking good mate.
> 
> I concur with Tom's focal point idea.



Thanks mate. Glad you think so. Hopefully the next photos I get up will show the additional planting I've done 


Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk


----------



## plantbrain

Xmas moss is your best bet, can handle high or low KH's.
Good CO2= good moss growth.

Grass and ferns are pretty though, so the Moss would be the canary in the  mine.


----------



## aliclarke86

Bloody Christmas moss grows toooo well. I have glasses of it sitting around as I'm not willing to pass it on due to a bit of algae but I can't bring myself to bin it 

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----------



## faizal

Hey Al,.... Totally speechless,...i have just finished reading the entire 20 pages of your journal. This is going to be an epic. Have you taken any PAR readings at substrate? Nice one Al. Just keeps getting better.


----------



## Bufo Bill

This looks superb, well done. I know all about teething problems myself ATM, moss and Crypt troubles with me though. Anyway you have my sympathy! 
All the best from Bill.


----------



## Alastair

faizal said:


> Hey Al,.... Totally speechless,...i have just finished reading the entire 20 pages of your journal. This is going to be an epic. Have you taken any PAR readings at substrate? Nice one Al. Just keeps getting better.


Hiya Faizal nice to see you back on mate and thanks for tje kind words. Glad you like it pal. Its all starting to grow in well now. 
I haven't taken any par readings as yet.  I just need to buy a meter from the states as im curious myself. Ive got zero algae what so ever touch wood so alls looking good. 


Bufo Bill said:


> This looks superb, well done. I know all about teething problems myself ATM, moss and Crypt troubles with me though. Anyway you have my sympathy!
> All the best from Bill.


Thanks Bill.  Sorry to hear your problems. Whats wrong with your crypts???


----------



## Alastair

Ill be posting some photos up of the tank very soon now it's growing in, everything is very healthy. Still no luck with moss so have tried the moss balls and all seems well so far. 
Ive also give into the urge tp get a nice bright betta so purchased a gorgeous red one along with ten more ottos . 



 



 

adds a lovely splash of colour to the tank. The tmc tiles make it really stand out


----------



## Westyggx

Just spend the afternoon at Alastair's, the pictures on the journal don't do the tank justice. Its absolutely huge, i couldn't believe it when i walked in the back room its like one of Amanos massive tanks.

Everything in the tank is perfect, wood placement, rocks you name it. Its probably the best tank i've seen and its got a good few months to grow in yet too!

Well done pal!


----------



## aliclarke86

Wow that is some solid red! I like it and I'm sure he will be happy in a tank of that size!!!

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----------



## foxfish

Arrrrh a fighting fish in a nice home, makes a lovery change from the average community tank, great choice mate.
I don't know much about them but can you get him a mate?


----------



## Andy D

foxfish said:


> I don't know much about them but can you get him a mate?



Certainly not another male. Given the size of the tank you might get away with a few females too. Emphasis on might!

Superfish seem to think it is possible although most Betta keepers out there certainly would not mix females and males unless breeding but then they also keep them in much smaller tanks.


----------



## aliclarke86

I think you would have to keep an eye on them. They like it rough don't you know 

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----------



## darren636

He tolerates the choccos?


----------



## Alastair

aliclarke86 said:


> Wow that is some solid red! I like it and I'm sure he will be happy in a tank of that size!!!
> 
> Sent from my GT-I9505G using Tapatalk


Hi ali thanks mate.  Yes the red on him was stunning. Really beautiful.  Ive since read that they only show such bright cokours in shops when stressed or having a flare up at another male. Hes turned a lovely deeper red with a faint purple sheen when the light hits him. 


foxfish said:


> Arrrrh a fighting fish in a nice home, makes a lovery change from the average community tank, great choice mate.
> I don't know much about them but can you get him a mate?


Hey mart thanks mate. Ive always felt really sad that they get stuck inside such tiny boxes in fish shops too which added to me buying him but with the upper surface if my water being gentle and stats needed are similar to that of the cgoccos etc im hoping hell do fine. Greedy little so n so though. 
Mates wise I believe I can get a female or 2 but he looks very happy with out. 



Andy D said:


> Certainly not another male. Given the size of the tank you might get away with a few females too. Emphasis on might!
> 
> Superfish seem to think it is possible although most Betta keepers out there certainly would not mix females and males unless breeding but then they also keep them in much smaller tanks.


 thats what I read too. Ill just stick with the one although saying that I helped plant up a young lads tank new year and he has both a male and 2 female and no fighting at all. 


aliclarke86 said:


> I think you would have to keep an eye on them. They like it rough don't you know
> 
> Sent from my GT-I9505G using Tapatalk


Ahhh ha ha. Oooo I say  


darren636 said:


> He tolerates the choccos?


Yes mate. Swims with them all the time they seemed to welcome him in straight away


----------



## Alastair

Westyggx said:


> Just spend the afternoon at Alastair's, the pictures on the journal don't do the tank justice. Its absolutely huge, i couldn't believe it when i walked in the back room its like one of Amanos massive tanks.
> 
> Everything in the tank is perfect, wood placement, rocks you name it. Its probably the best tank i've seen and its got a good few months to grow in yet too!
> 
> Well done pal!



Cheers mate. Was good to have you over. Been a while. Its like santas grotto for you ha ha. Always plenty of freebies to take back  

Really kind words mate thanks. I could tell you liked it. I wouldnt say best tank but its appealing enough. Just wish I good give it some oomph to grow quicker. 
Your welcome anytime pal as are others too


----------



## sanj

Betta splendens is the fish that got me into keeping tropicals back in the late 80s. I havent kept them for years, but its still that iconic dragon i'll always love. If I had a tank like yours I think I would probably be tempted.


----------



## justissaayman

Alistair been reading this on my phone so ran down stairs and got my laptop as I know how you can sort out the reflections. Its a technique I learnt from Scott Kelby some years back when I was shooting high level portraits professionally. Plus, its a very very simple little trick.

Use the SLR to take the pic as per usual then start identifying hotspots or reflection points. Get some black sheets, gaffer tape and some black pieces of paper (large rolls work best). All you then do is put black paper over the sources of hotspots/reflections and reshoot, identify and repeat.

Once the majority is gone you can use the sheets to almost funnel your lens, what I mean by that is using the sheet or even paper closer to your lens to stop stray light coming in and reduce hotspots/reflections even more.

Hope this helps, helped me a TON when i took portraits inside offices with huge windows with reflections of me...


----------



## Puntius

WOW man really awesome tank just went threw the whole thread, any new fts of this monster


----------



## Lindy

Updates?


----------



## James O

ldcgroomer said:


> Updates?



Here! Here! 

Ooh and pictures too please.  I'm in need of some jumbosorus tank inspiration 

You do know we are all living vicariously through you and Sanj


----------



## Lee Sweeting

+1 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Alastair

Hannes said:


> WOW man really awesome tank just went threw the whole thread, any new fts of this monster



thanks Hannes Really appreciate that. Ive got quite a few shots on my dslr of the tank and inhabitants now ive sorted reflection out just need to do some ps editing but can take a quick phone shot now.....with reflections though as not getting all the black roll out just for a quick phone shot  


ldcgroomer said:


> Updates?





James O said:


> Here! Here!
> 
> Ooh and pictures too please.  I'm in need of some jumbosorus tank inspiration
> 
> You do know we are all living vicariously through you and Sanj


Ha ha ok james. One quickie on its way.  I promise when ive edited the dslr photos there will be lots of photos added.


----------



## Edvet

Yeah it takes some time to shop all those algae away.............


----------



## justissaayman

@alastair, did you use some of my / Scott Kelby's advice?


----------



## Alastair

Sorry for such a long delay in updating my journal. Ive been busy recently and had few problems with fluctuating crypt melt. 
All seems well at the moment. I came home after the weekend to find I have 3 female choccos with full mouths so fingers crossed I will have lots of babies again. This means for now ill have to take off the fx6 as that bad boy will suck up any little ones and pop it back on once they get to a fairly good size. 
Plants are doing well, slowly growing but looking very healthy indeed. 
The Legenandra Meeboldii red is really flourishing and acts as a fantastic focal point. Very very nice plant. 

Ive upped the tmc tiles to 50 percent but after a chat at weekend this might not even be near enough given the size of the tank so ive kindly been offered a par meter on loan so when I get that ill know whats what. 

Dan Crawford has loaned me a cal aqua labs efflux f3 which for large tanks is bloody perfect so im on the hunt for a second hand one. 

Im adding LOTS more plants today or tomorrow. 
Extra C.petchi 
More c.wendtii mi oya
C.undulata
Vallis nana 
Ranunclus inundatus
Micranthamum monte carlo (thanks Iain) 
Hygro auraguaia
and some more eleocharis sp mini as an accent around the leganandra

So currently (crappy phone shot) this is how she looks




 
you can see where the crypt melt has happened at the right side. 

not enjoying the gravel cleaning though  I didnt realise how much detritus there is in a low tech. 

Overall im very happy with how its looking and once ive added in all the extra plants tomorrow ill get some pictures up. 

I think I may have to rehome my betta though as he likes to swim at the surface but keeps getting caught in the flow. 
 added 30 corydoras habrosus. Lost a couple but the rest seem to be doing great and added a stunning farlowella 2 weeks ago. He/she has coloured up much better than this picture now. Will be getting one more to add to.


----------



## Lee Sweeting

Looking great mate, good news that the choco's are breeding.  They are obviously very happy. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## justissaayman

OMG....


----------



## Andy D

Alastair, that looks great mate!!


----------



## Edvet

Can yo enlighten me on that efflux? i never used one and i can't see what is special about it.
Just an idea on the FX6: get a large piece of filterfoam, make a hole in it (i use some copperpipe i sharpened the edge of, swivel it between my hands (like old skool fire making you see on documentaries) and drive it into the foam, thus cutting out a tubeshaped piece of foam, yank it out)and shove that big foam piece over the filterinlet. Thus you can keep the filter, and protect the young, Just rinse the foam out every 2/3 days.

Watchout with to many "woodcleaners" they produce quite a lot of unsoluble mulm.

Looks good, btw


----------



## James O

Thanks for the Great update Alastair.  The chocolate lake fan club are resting easy once again .  Glad your new Cory's are happy.



Alastair said:


> not enjoying the gravel cleaning though  I didnt realise how much detritus there is in a low tech.



Time for a question to reduce my ignorance: what's the difference between hi/lo tech tanks regarding detritus?


----------



## Lindy

Alastair said:


> added a stunning farlowella 2 weeks ago.


Fantastic to see one of these in a tank it won't out grow. Ever.
Tank looks great. We are always the greatest critics of our own creations.


----------



## Lindy

Alastair said:


> not enjoying the gravel cleaning though


If you didn't clean the substrate in the old tank why are you cleaning this one?


----------



## dw1305

Hi all,





Alastair said:


> This means for now ill have to take off the fx6 as that bad boy will suck up any little ones and pop it back on once they get to a fairly good size.





Edvet said:


> ust an idea on the FX6: get a large piece of filterfoam, make a hole in it (i use some copperpipe i sharpened the edge of, swivel it between my hands (like old skool fire making you see on documentaries) and drive it into the foam, thus cutting out a tubeshaped piece of foam, yank it out)and shove that big foam piece over the filterinlet. Thus you can keep the filter, and protect the young, Just rinse the foam out every 2/3 days.


 I use Edvet's type of pre-filter foam (and cleaning regime) on all my filters, although I usually buy a pre-drilled foam. It works really well for keeping fry out of the filter, and also gives them a browsing surface.

I buy these drilled "Koi" foams <Foam Blocks Filter Media - Kockney Koi>.

cheers Darrel


----------



## Alastair

Lee Sweeting said:


> Looking great mate, good news that the choco's are breeding.  They are obviously very happy.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Thanks mate. Yeah im happy to have come back to 3 full females. Im wondering if with me just leaving one tile only to come on to 30 percent whilst I was away has spurred them on. 


justissaayman said:


> OMG....


 cheers Justis 



Andy D said:


> Alastair, that looks great mate!!


Hey Andy thanks mate. Im hoping when ive finished this planting today it will fill it in a bit more. I cant believe how many plants are in this already



James O said:


> Thanks for the Great update Alastair.  The chocolate lake fan club are resting easy once again .  Glad your new Cory's are happy.
> 
> 
> 
> Time for a question to reduce my ignorance: what's the difference between hi/lo tech tanks regarding detritus?



Haha your welcome James cheers mate. 

With the low techs, the detritus in my previous set ups falls through the substrate which in turn helps to feed the plants.  The same in a hi tech too I suppose but obviously certain substrates dont allow it to sift through. 


ldcgroomer said:


> Fantastic to see one of these in a tank it won't out grow. Ever.
> Tank looks great. We are always the greatest critics of our own creations.



Absolutely Lindy. He or she is stunning. Hard to spot but it always out and about


----------



## Alastair

ldcgroomer said:


> If you didn't clean the substrate in the old tank why are you cleaning this one?



Purely because im using mostly unipac samoa which is on view and the detritus on this area is settling as I have gentle flow and looks unsightly. Its not a deep gravel clean I do just a wave over with a gravel vac


----------



## Alastair

dw1305 said:


> Hi all,
> I use Edvet's type of pre-filter foam (and cleaning regime) on all my filters, although I usually buy a pre-drilled foam. It works really well for keeping fry out of the filter, and also gives them a browsing surface.
> 
> I buy these drilled "Koi" foams <Foam Blocks Filter Media - Kockney Koi>.
> 
> cheers Darrel



Yeah I usually do thanks Darrel. Especially when ive had shrimp in but havent used the sponges in this just yet. 
Ill be putting them on later 

Cheers mate


----------



## Iain Sutherland

another nice addition with the armoured cat mate, they are stunning fish. and top news on more babies.
great to see the tank on something  bigger than your phone.   Certainly takes a lot of plants to make a tank this big not look bare!! 
 how is the Cladophora getting on following the moss issues?


----------



## Andy D

Saw this and thought of you - For Sale Very large public aquarium style tank - Practical Fishkeeping Forum


----------



## Ady34

Looking great Alastair, and good to hear the choccos have carried on where they left off!
Love farlowella catfish too, they'll love your large branches.
Cheerio,
Ady.


----------



## Lindy

Your samoa sand looks quite pale in the photos. Is is darker in person? I 've been looking at the senegal as it looks a bit darker. Really need to see it in a shop before deciding though.


----------



## James O

The think fish website stocking calculator reckons your tank could cope with about 443 adult Chocolate Gouramis  but I cant see a single fish in your recent whole of tank pic of the chocolate 'inland sea'   Its a good thing your Gouramis are breeding.  It'd cost more than the tank to fill it 

How many fish are hiding away in there?


----------



## Michael W

James O said:


> but I cant see a single fish in your recent whole of tank pic of the chocolate 'inland sea'


 
I just took it upon myself to look for a fish and saw a chocolate gourami next to the top left of the middle curved branch. One more above a group of ferns to the right of the moss ball left side of the tank.


----------



## James O

Oh yes! its the brown on brown camo thing  It doesn't help I'm looking at a phone image on my 27' iMac - The pic is 52x29cm before I 'click to see full size image' 

Wheres those DSLR image got too


----------



## Matt Warner

Hi Alastair, I've just been having a good read of your journal and its looking really good. Wish I had the room for such a big project! 
Sorry to hear about your crypt melt. Why do you think they melted. My crypts seem to grow really well and then a few leaves just melt for no apparent reason.
Hope you are well mate


----------



## JohnKoncz

Alastair said:


> I thought of that but sounds a bit wrong or inappropriate ha ha
> Ive been looking for a 2180 but havent found one at anywhere near that price and buying the heated version second hand can be a bit of a risk if its not from anyone I know.
> 
> Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk 2


Hello. I'm also looking for an eheim 2180 at the moment. Can you help me out finding one?


----------



## Deano3

looking great alistair hope yhe crypt melt has passed and started recovering as everyone says the amount of plants and fish it will take for this to  look (full) is unreak and very expensive only way is replanting and breeding and hopefully works iut that way and sure it will keep the pictures and updates coming looking forward to seeing it thrive and grow



Sent from my SM-T310 using Tapatalk


----------



## Phil Edwards

Wow Alistair, that's looking great!  I've regularly considered doing a similar set up with the other big beast currently sitting empty in the basement.  I love the heavily wooded look in a tank full of Crypts, Anubias, and Ferns.  It'll be a stunning home for your gouramis when it's all grown in.  The simple quartz sand was an excellent choice too.   

I'm seriously considering getting some of the CAL Efflux pipes for one of my tanks and would be interested in hearing more about them. Why do you feel they're "bloody perfect"?  Do you think the same outlet (17mm) would be suitable for a long, but shallow tank?


----------



## Alastair

Iain Sutherland said:


> another nice addition with the armoured cat mate, they are stunning fish. and top news on more babies.
> great to see the tank on something  bigger than your phone.   Certainly takes a lot of plants to make a tank this big not look bare!!
> how is the Cladophora getting on following the moss issues?



Thanks mate. The farlowella is stunning.  Even more so in that I purchased another to accompany it only to find out once it had settled and got its full colour they are 2 different species.  Oh well. They certainly 'stick' together ha ha. 
There's a lot of plants in their iain theyre slowly now just starting to take off. I think with it being such a big amount of water im struggling to get lighting levels correct. Even though they are running at 50 percent, that night at Dans, George Jeremy and Dan and myself had a long chat about the level of lighting in their and that its actually much lower at substrate level than I think. 
The Cladophora moss is fantastic.  Its very lush, colourful and is extremely healthy. The other mosses just didnt keep. Something isnt right but not sure what regarding moss in this tank. It grows but almost brown. 

Definitely agree on having a ukaps invite over soon. 


Ady34 said:


> Looking great Alastair, and good to hear the choccos have carried on where they left off!
> Love farlowella catfish too, they'll love your large branches.
> Cheerio,
> Ady.



Hiya Ady great to hear from you mate. I hope your marine tank isn't tearing you away from us......dont gooooooooo ha ha. 
Strangely they spend more time on the substrate. Im getting 2 more I think but will leave it until these 2 grow up. 



ldcgroomer said:


> Your samoa sand looks quite pale in the photos. Is is darker in person? I 've been looking at the senegal as it looks a bit darker. Really need to see it in a shop before deciding though.


 yep its darker in the person. Not vastly by much but a shade or 2 darker. 
Senegal was what I was stuck between but I got it right with my choice as it seems to blend well with the wood and petrified wood. 



James O said:


> The think fish website stocking calculator reckons your tank could cope with about 443 adult Chocolate Gouramis  but I cant see a single fish in your recent whole of tank pic of the chocolate 'inland sea'   Its a good thing your Gouramis are breeding.  It'd cost more than the tank to fill it
> 
> How many fish are hiding away in there?


Hiya James, 
Ha ha yep I think other than a photo a few pages back which you can see the choccos its hard to see them. They do tend to swim in pairs or alone unless feeding time. I will take one of feeding time with filters off which will show all inhabitants. 
There's roughly 30 choccos plus the babies I added, quite a lot of licorice gouramis but theyve now taken there territories up but come out when they see me, corydoras habrosus,  about ten cherry shrimp, 30 ottos (one appears pregnant) 2 farlowella and a new group of fish ive added which will post up shortly.  Im due another 20 licorice gouramis and 100 choccos. 



James O said:


> Oh yes! its the brown on brown camo thing  It doesn't help I'm looking at a phone image on my 27' iMac - The pic is 52x29cm before I 'click to see full size image'
> 
> Wheres those DSLR image got too


Theyll be up shortly mate 



Matt Warner said:


> Hi Alastair, I've just been having a good read of your journal and its looking really good. Wish I had the room for such a big project!
> Sorry to hear about your crypt melt. Why do you think they melted. My crypts seem to grow really well and then a few leaves just melt for no apparent reason.
> Hope you are well mate


Hi Matt Thank you for the kind comment. 
I wish I had the room for such a big project ha ha. I lost most of my dining room for this. Planning on opening up front and back room to create space and allow viewing of the tank from both sides. 
The crypt melt I think ive gotten to the bottom of. 
When I fill back up with a hose, the flow from it came out directly at them and if the boiler went off for a few seconds and then kicked in again it would effectively be pouring out cold water and its this instant temperature fluctuation that caused it. I know some people never have problems with crypts I never have usually but they dont like change imo. 



Deano3 said:


> looking great alistair hope yhe crypt melt has passed and started recovering as everyone says the amount of plants and fish it will take for this to  look (full) is unreak and very expensive only way is replanting and breeding and hopefully works iut that way and sure it will keep the pictures and updates coming looking forward to seeing it thrive and grow
> 
> Sent from my SM-T310 using Tapatalk


Cheers Deano. Crypts are all looking great again now.  Nice bright green leaves showing already.  Its taking off now and really looking forward to it progressing. 
its times like this I want co2 but I want this tank long term ie 3 or 4 years but do a little something co2 wise in my living room.


----------



## Alastair

Phil Edwards said:


> Wow Alistair, that's looking great!  I've regularly considered doing a similar set up with the other big beast currently sitting empty in the basement.  I love the heavily wooded look in a tank full of Crypts, Anubias, and Ferns.  It'll be a stunning home for your gouramis when it's all grown in.  The simple quartz sand was an excellent choice too.
> 
> I'm seriously considering getting some of the CAL Efflux pipes for one of my tanks and would be interested in hearing more about them. Why do you feel they're "bloody perfect"?  Do you think the same outlet (17mm) would be suitable for a long, but shallow tank?



Hi Phil thanks lots. Im VERY happy with this one. I was with my others but love this alot. Wish I could go forward in time to see what it will look like ha ha. 
I think just something such as wood anubias ferns etc can be a very bold natural look and also look equally as impressive as some of the more advanced plants/set ups. 
Although this was never simple to set up ha ha. I think I chose wisely on the unipac samoa. I dont want it all covered either. Front left to the wood in the middle will be open area. 

The cal aqua efflux gets flow straight down much earlier than most lily pipes. So with this the plants about ten centimetres from the rear right are swaying heavily and flow reaches much much further where as with the others it wasnt until about half way you got the flow from it. 
Ummmm long tank yes definitely and shallow yes but depends how shallow and at what velocity. Either way it would look stunning.


----------



## Alastair

Just a little update. I wanted to add in something colourful fish wise to break up the browns and creams of the various gouramis but still have the choccos as the largest main fish. 
So there are now 50 Celestial pearl Danios in happily and greedily eating.  They're very small at present so arent coloured up yet but think theyll be nice and round soon. 

Have been taking some par readings today and was surprised at how much effect such a deep amount of water has on penetration. 

So im going to upgrade my lighting some point soon.  

Will hopefully know what to get above this over the next few days.


----------



## darren636

Would enjoy a picture of your cpds en masse


----------



## James O

CPDs are fabulous little fish. I have 20 of the little critters, now fully coloured and growing.  They are always on the move chasing each other about.  They LOVE lobster eggs btw.

As they're small do you worry about them getting eaten? Lfs warned me about setting them up with congo tetras (same size as your choccos)


----------



## Alastair

darren636 said:


> Would enjoy a picture of your cpds en masse



When theyve filled in a little I will darren as theyre pale as only just gone in. 


James O said:


> CPDs are fabulous little fish. I have 20 of the little critters, now fully coloured and growing.  They are always on the move chasing each other about.  They LOVE lobster eggs btw.
> 
> As they're small do you worry about them getting eaten? Lfs warned me about setting them up with congo tetras (same size as your choccos)



These are, mainly around the centre of the scape darting too and fro. 

I may up the group but will see. I believe there may also be two species of them on a forum devoted to these.  You get the red and black and the orange and black.  Cant tell on mine yet. 

I wouldnt say congo tetras are the same size as chocolate gouramis,  plus, have you ever seen a choccos mouth mate??? They are really tiny. Id never put any fish in a tank knowing there will be risks of them being eaten. Fry is a different matter though.


----------



## darren636

Of course mate. Give em time to settle.

Funny thing is, my local has a batch of cpds, and their colouring is remarkable considering their temporary lfs housing. Im gonna grab some. Never seen any looking so colourful at a shop before. All the best with your new additions chap.


----------



## James O

Alastair said:


> These are, mainly around the centre of the scape darting too and fro.
> 
> I may up the group but will see. I believe there may also be two species of them on a forum devoted to these.  You get the red and black and the orange and black.  Cant tell on mine yet.
> .



Yeah they hang about in open water, but within just a short dart for cover.  I have both red & orange.  Was following Seriously fish explanation that red=male orange=female

I missed that the word giant that was in front of chocolate gourami in the description!!!  Oops.  I know you care for your fish mate.  My 20 CPDs really catch the eye and demand to be watched!  I can only imagine what 50 looks like . They'll defiantly be worth a video


----------



## Alastair

a very quick phone video as the main lights have dimmed and the night light is dimming down too. The fish seem even more at ease like this but for darren you can make out all the little CPDS at the top 


best played in 1080 or 720


----------



## aliclarke86

Stunning mate. I'm so envious of this.. I don't even have room for my 180lt to be set up. I'm really really keen to have a "fish" tank again. My tmc is way to much about plants and I miss my fish!! 

When we moved to a bigger house I didn't think I would have to get rid of some of my tanks.... Its the wrong shape though.  

Sent from my GT-I9505G using Tapatalk


----------



## Lee Sweeting

Awesome mate. The tank is looking amazing 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## BigTom

Alastair that is immense. I totally hadn't appreciated the sense of scale it must have in the flesh until seeing a video. Awesome.


----------



## Lindy

That is so relaxing to watch I think I'd be in there with a pile of chips n dips and never move again! Those are very lucky fish...

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk


----------



## James O

I see fish 

The way the CPDs play really adds that certain 'realism' of the wild. Totally stunning

This is making me think I shouldn't add big (congo tetra) fish for my tank so I can use my CPDs.  Stick with several large groups of smaller fish.  I CPDs soooo much.  That oto doing his dance on the glass is really funny

Once again Alastair.....inspirational


----------



## darren636

There's a lot to enjoy,  layers of activity.


----------



## Alastair

ldcgroomer said:


> That is so relaxing to watch I think I'd be in there with a pile of chips n dips and never move again! Those are very lucky fish...
> 
> Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk



Thanks lindy . I do spend a considerable amount of time sat infront of it. There's just so much going on inside such a big tank. Especially as the lights start to dim right down. It completely changes the look and feel of the tank. 
Albeit I have to use my 9 year olds chair which is a tad uncomfortable and small. 

I should have knocked down the chimney breast and had the tank top end of the room and I could have had a dining table back in. Ahhhh well. 


James O said:


> I see fish
> 
> The way the CPDs play really adds that certain 'realism' of the wild. Totally stunning
> 
> This is making me think I shouldn't add big (congo tetra) fish for my tank so I can use my CPDs.  Stick with several large groups of smaller fish.  I CPDs soooo much.  That oto doing his dance on the glass is really funny
> 
> Once again Alastair.....inspirational


Ha ha yeah I think someone referred to the otto as a ballerina when she was doing that. I presume she as it looks very pregnant.  

I wouldnt personally put big fish in my tank as I find even though its big, that smaller fish make the display appear even bigger


----------



## Alastair

BigTom said:


> Alastair that is immense. I totally hadn't appreciated the sense of scale it must have in the flesh until seeing a video. Awesome.



Thanks Tom. Very kind of you mate. 
Its hard for me to get a decent enough quick phone shot which shows the scale of the tank which is why ive been playing about with the dslr so hopefully have some good shots up soon. 
Youll have to stop by for a brew when your next heading down to Cornwall.  Always welcome to catch some zzz's overnight too.


----------



## Alastair

Ohhh nearly forgot to do a little update.  
The plants are still picking up with a new growth spurt and all looks very very healthy. It did seem to take a while to get going this one. Not sure why but then the substrate system is different in this. 

Have finally got flow sorted with adjustable flow power heads so their is much more movement everywhere now. 


Also ive got a few more inhabitants due in this Thursday consisting of 30 more licorice gourami (species currently unknown until I get them and can identify them) and another 15 Celestial pearl Danios.  
All thats left then is to add in the remainder chocolate gouramis and it can be left to do its thing. 

Ill actually be setting up another tank in my living room  soon to create a true paro biotope with very very low ph etc and hopefully have a much higher survival rate of babies so a few of these will be going in their along with another species.  

Hopefully will be uograding the lighting over the course of the next few weeks to get a bit more colour in. 

Thanks for all the kind comments so far everyone


----------



## nduli

i love this alastair, its the monster tank i am sure we'd all love to have


----------



## RichardJW

Licquorice gouramis are not something previously on my radar - on looking on a Google I'm intrigued at how many species there are . The variety remind me of Apisto's particular Agassizi - do they hybridize or is there not enough around for this to be an issue ?? 


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


----------



## BigTom

RichardJW said:


> Licquorice gouramis are not something previously on my radar - on looking on a Google I'm intrigued at how many species there are . The variety remind me of Apisto's particular Agassizi - do they hybridize or is there not enough around for this to be an issue ??



There is a potential issue with hybridisation, yes. It is very unclear how many of the different populations and forms constitute separate species, and this is compounded by the fact that many exporters don't provide collection or even reliable species information and may ship individuals from different collection locations together. Ideally if planning to breed them then one should only really keep fish of known providence from a single location together, but this is very difficult if buying fish from the trade.

There's good infor over on the Parosphromenus Project - Species

And the comments at the bottom of the SF profile provide a very good demonstration of the uncertainties involved -   Parosphromenus deissneri &#8211; Deissner&#8217;s Liquorice Gourami (Osphromenus deissneri) &mdash; Seriously Fish

There does seem to be growing interest in these fish in the UK at the moment. It would be excellent if people joined in with the PP and tried to make a concerted effort to distribute and maintain populations of these fish within the hobby as they are under massive threat from habitat destruction (admittedly along with many other species).


----------



## RichardJW

Interesting stuff from the PP - find the descriptions of the 1st two a bit weird though - 27.7cm in the wild 4cm in Aquarium ??? Some fantastic looking fish - interested to see what Alistair gets !


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


----------



## BigTom

RichardJW said:


> Interesting stuff from the PP - find the descriptions of the 1st two a bit weird though - 27.7cm in the wild 4cm in Aquarium ??? Some fantastic looking fish - interested to see what Alistair gets !



Typos 

Should be 2.7cm I guess.


----------



## darren636

Alastairs tank may be the last reserve for these fish.
Now mostly confined to ditches.
We truly are a plague on this planet.


----------



## Alastair

darren636 said:


> Alastairs tank may be the last reserve for these fish.
> Now mostly confined to ditches.
> We truly are a plague on this planet.



Couldn't have said it better myself Darren. 
Im not keeping them purely to look at. My intention was to get some and let them breed as I have very soft water and that they did. 
They are doing currently in my big tank in the moss covered clay cave tubes. Well one tube in particular.


----------



## ourmanflint

Hi alastair, aren't the celestial pearl danios from Lake Inle, a hardwater lake? Are they just as happy in softer water?
Cheers


----------



## darren636

ourmanflint said:


> Hi alastair, aren't the celestial pearl danios from Lake Inle, a hardwater lake? Are they just as happy in softer water?
> Cheers


 no, danio erythromicron are from inle.


----------



## ourmanflint

darren636 said:


> no, danio erythromicron are from inle.



Hi Darren, celestials are from near Inle as well, I'd be surprised if they weren't actually found in Inle as well to be honest. I remember seeing these in 2006 at Chatuchak Market in Bangkok, before they hit the fish world, and asked where they came from and was told Inle lake, but seeing as that is more well known than Hopong maybe that was wrong. 30km is not far for a fish to find its way into a different water system, and presumably water chemistry would be similar as they are found at the foot of the same hills, although on opposite sides.

Cheers


----------



## darren636

ourmanflint said:


> Hi Darren, celestials are from near Inle as well, I'd be surprised if they weren't actually found in Inle as well to be honest. I remember seeing these in 2006 at Chatuchak Market in Bangkok, before they hit the fish world, and asked where they came from and was told Inle lake, but seeing as that is more well known than Hopong maybe that was wrong. 30km is not far for a fish to find its way into a different water system, and presumably water chemistry would be similar as they are found at the foot of the same hills, although on opposite sides.
> 
> Cheers


 indeed, they hybridise in the wild so there is overlap in populations.  I've never heard of cpds In inle, but definitely erythromicron In the surrounding water ways .


----------



## Alastair

ourmanflint said:


> Hi alastair, aren't the celestial pearl danios from Lake Inle, a hardwater lake? Are they just as happy in softer water?
> Cheers



I believe both the cpd and erythromicron prefer soft water according to the danio site. 
I read up on the cpds quite intensively as I do all my inhabitants and found that they prefer softer water. Maybe not near as soft and acidic as ive made my water go for my choccos and licorice but they're thriving non the less and super greedy. 
They add a nice touch to the upper layer and havent seen thy shyness theyre supposed to have.


----------



## Edvet

Which Danio site?


----------



## darren636

Danio and devario website


----------



## Edvet

thx i'm new to this, i focused on South america the last 20 years.....


----------



## faizal

The tank's looking so huge Alastair . It must be such a treat to watch it in the flesh . Just like Tom mentioned earlier, the sense of depth in your tank is just amazing. I love the way the chocholate gouramis move,...they are really cute to watch. I have never had the opportunity to see one in any of the LFSes in my area.


----------



## Alastair

faizal said:


> The tank's looking so huge Alastair . It must be such a treat to watch it in the flesh . Just like Tom mentioned earlier, the sense of depth in your tank is just amazing. I love the way the chocholate gouramis move,...they are really cute to watch. I have never had the opportunity to see one in any of the LFSes in my area.



Hiya Faizal hope your ok mate. 
It certainly is a treat. I need to build some kind of breakfast bar so as to sit and watch it all evening.  
Both chocolate gouramis and the licorice move so elegantly. The chocolates even more so as you cant really see their fins so they appear to glide. I can't wait to get another 100.


----------



## Alastair

Well ive collected my paros an hour ago and there in the bags being slowly acclimatised. No idea what species these ones are just yet but it appears to be more than one.
Also one of them has very black fins which ive never seen. 

Here they are waiting for release and soon to join the existing group
. Should colour up after a few days and hopefully id them.


----------



## RichardJW

Very interested to see what you've got there Alistair -good luck.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


----------



## Ady34

It's just crazy to talk about adding hundreds of fish at a time! This tank is massive


----------



## Fern

I just love this tank,  I have watched your vid quite a few times, very relaxing and lovely fish


----------



## Alastair

Here's a few of the established paros ive had for 2 years. Theyve come out to nosey at their new relatives.  Theyre not camera shy at all. 
These are the lightest ones I have 

licorice gourami by Mr-T-, on Flickr


licorice gourami by Mr-T-, on Flickr


licorice gourami by Mr-T-, on Flickr

All quick phone pics


----------



## Edvet

Gotta say this tank is making me rethink amazon biotopes Together with Big Tom's tank South east asia is becoming an option. Would be a real job on the current tank, but maybe the next one i am planning could be a black water creek


----------



## Gary Nelson

They look stunning mate and look very much at home already


----------



## James O

More happy campers with acres of tank to explore. They'll get tired before they get bored...

Nice new avatar btw. Saw it on deviantart


----------



## Bufo Bill

This is so cool. Al, this looks like something you would see at a Sealife Centre or one of the great zoo aquariums . . . Either that or like one of those Bond Villain lairs from the seventies. You could feed your enemies to the fish and save yourself a fortune in Aquarian . . . 
All the best from Bill.


----------



## ourmanflint

Jealous much?? Yup, sat here wimpering with envy!! You're a lucky fella...


----------



## RichardJW

How are the new Liquorice's coming on ? Suppose the project should now be called 1300litre  Sweet shop - Chocolate & Liquorice !


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----------



## Alastair

Gary Nelson said:


> They look stunning mate and look very much at home already


Certainly do mate. Theyve settled in well. Only lost one but he or she did look a little weak when in the bag.  Still impossible to id as so young but some are showing little tinges of blue and one male has very dark almost black fins. 


James O said:


> More happy campers with acres of tank to explore. They'll get tired before they get bored...
> 
> Nice new avatar btw. Saw it on deviantart


Cheers james. Once the new lighting is on I think it will look great. Hopefully get that sorted in next week or two. 


Bufo Bill said:


> This is so cool. Al, this looks like something you would see at a Sealife Centre or one of the great zoo aquariums . . . Either that or like one of those Bond Villain lairs from the seventies. You could feed your enemies to the fish and save yourself a fortune in Aquarian . . .
> All the best from Bill.



Ha ha hey Bill hope your ok mate? ? 
Yeah I think my phone camera compacts the image so it looks way smaller than it is. Im hoping my camera shots will show its real size. Ive stunned a few people with it when theyve walked in the dining room. 



ourmanflint said:


> Jealous much?? Yup, sat here wimpering with envy!! You're a lucky fella...


 


RichardJW said:


> How are the new Liquorice's coming on ? Suppose the project should now be called 1300litre  Sweet shop - Chocolate & Liquorice !
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk



Not a bad title that Richard. Theres over 50 licorice in now and soon to be 130 in total chocolates so.... 
Theyre doing great though. Really settling in and making homes amongst the plants and clay tunnels ive buried in the substrate. 
Still have a pair who are chasing away anything that comes near theirs so not sure if theyve got young in their but its at an angle which makes it impossible to see in to :/


----------



## Ady34

I think we need a scale shot....maybe you stood infront of it


----------



## James O

Yeah tank sized selfie ftw!!!


----------



## akwarium

awesome!

Be aware of hybrid Parosphromenus if you keep more then one species in the same tank.


----------



## Edvet

Parolicoricephromenus alistairi


----------



## James O

That's longer than the fish


----------



## sanj

I think you keep the coolest looking freshwater fish. It even made me reconsider rainbows at one time, but the practicality is virtually non existant... I dont have the right water type being moderately hard, RO and large water changes are prohibitive on anything above a few hundred litres.


----------



## Robert H. Tavera

O..M...G !! those guramies are incredible.. and they are tiny too !!


----------



## Alastair

Will reply to everyones posts shortly but had to say that with huge sadness, this morning ive found the pregnant female dead floating on the surface. Absolutely gutted. I hadn't seen much of her over the last day or two but usually you dont. 

Here she is with mouth still full 




I feel terrible doing this but going to see if I can take out the eggs/fry from her mouth and put in a seperate tank but my hopes on them surviving or being alive are very very slim. Im gutted


----------



## aliclarke86

Oh mate I feel for you this is terrible.....

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----------



## Lee Sweeting

Really sorry to hear that mate, terrible news..


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----------



## Andy D

Sorry to hear that Alastair!


----------



## tim

Such a shame mate


----------



## Gary Nelson

Sorry to hear this mate  do you have any ideas what may have happened?


----------



## Aron_Dip

Gutted mate


----------



## Martin in Holland

That's sad news indeed. I do hope that you can safe the eggs


----------



## James O

Very sad  She was an excellent dedicated & protective mother to the last.......

Hopefully you can raise her brood onwards mate.


----------



## Robert H. Tavera

Such a shame, realy beautiful fish, and pregnant... chocolate guramis are awesome, are a good example of how beauty can be in the more tiny and sober things


----------



## Lindy

Alastair said:


> I feel terrible doing this but going to see if I can take out the eggs/fry from her mouth


This is very sad news and there isn't anything else that you can do. Worth a try though, you never know.


----------



## OllieNZ

Sorry for your loss.
Did you manage to recover the eggs? Stripping mouth brooders is fairly common in the cichlid world not sure about other fish though


----------



## Four50

Truly sorry to hear that Alastair


----------



## Brian Murphy

Sorry to hear that m8, did you save any?


----------



## Alastair

aliclarke86 said:


> Oh mate I feel for you this is terrible.....
> 
> Sent from my GT-I9505G using Tapatalk



Yes it was. Seriously gutting. They're like family to me. Id had her for a long time too. 


Lee Sweeting said:


> Really sorry to hear that mate, terrible news..
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Thanks lee



Andy D said:


> Sorry to hear that Alastair!


Cheers pal 


tim said:


> Such a shame mate


Tjsnks mate. Truly gutted. 



Gary Nelson said:


> Sorry to hear this mate  do you have any ideas what may have happened?


Non mate. No physical signs of disease or wounds.  The only thing I noticed was a seriously bad smell but shed not been dead long by her colour. 


Aron_Dip said:


> Gutted mate


 thanks pal



Martin in China said:


> That's sad news indeed. I do hope that you can safe the eggs


I wished so too martin but no such luck. They were dead too  


James O said:


> Very sad  She was an excellent dedicated & protective mother to the last.......
> 
> Hopefully you can raise her brood onwards mate.



Couldnt have said it any better myself mate.  Really couldnt. The length of time the mums go with out food whilst holding is a true testament to willpower and care.  


Robert H. Tavera said:


> Such a shame, realy beautiful fish, and pregnant... chocolate guramis are awesome, are a good example of how beauty can be in the more tiny and sober things


Thank you Robert.  Very very kind words. 


ldcgroomer said:


> This is very sad news and there isn't anything else that you can do. Worth a try though, you never know.


  


OllieNZ said:


> Sorry for your loss.
> Did you manage to recover the eggs? Stripping mouth brooders is fairly common in the cichlid world not sure about other fish though


Had no luck. They too had travelled onwards and upwards which is even worse......


Four50 said:


> Truly sorry to hear that Alastair



Thanks four50. Really kind


----------



## faizal

Oh man.I don't know how i missed this. I am really sorry to hear this. I'm truly sorry for your loss mate.


----------



## Alastair

faizal said:


> Oh man.I don't know how i missed this. I am really sorry to hear this. I'm truly sorry for your loss mate.



Thanks faizal. Really kind words. Seems my really long lived male is not looking to good either. Had him for the last 4 years. Just sat in the corner with his mouth to the surface


----------



## Lindy

Alastair said:


> Just sat in the corner with his mouth to the surface


He has been a busy boy with all those girls to chase so I suppose this is just natural? Fish may have survived longer in captivity(i don't know how long they usually live in the wild or captivity?) but yours have been breeding, competing to breed and generally living life to the full. There is probably a young male waiting to take his place.


----------



## James O

Nice thoughts Lindy!  They both certainly seem to have fulfilled their evolutionary/parental potentials


----------



## Edvet

If each produces 2 breeding offspring they did their job! (according to either mother nature or Darwin, depending on your believes)


----------



## Dan Crawford

Hi Folks, I was oop north last week so dropped Alastair a line and arranged to come visit this epic piece of genius. 

What can I say? Well, whilst Alastair's house is not a public aquarium - It certainly should be! The Chocolate Lake is even nicer than you may imagine, it seems impossible to use cameras to capture it's brilliance. The first thing that struck me was the water clarity, so many times have I seen vast aquariums like this and they are often cloudy, this was gin clear from end to end. The fish are simply stunning, especially the Liquorice Gouramis. Both flora and fauna were so healthy it was sickening LOL 

This was one heck of a project to have undertaken and a huge round of applause is deserved for persevering with it, fair play mate.

Being able to sit and watch your fish explore the fantastic home you've created must surely make it all worth while


----------



## faizal

Alastair said:


> Thanks faizal. Really kind words. Seems my really long lived male is not looking to good either. Had him for the last 4 years. Just sat in the corner with his mouth to the surface



I know how you feel mate,....like you mentioned earlier.,....you start to accept them as a member of the family once they've been with you for so long. And Al,...you really treat them well,....with a big home like that. And as Lindy so positively put there,...you've given him the best possible life. He might have got eaten by a bigger fish in the wild. God gave him a lovely life through your deeds mate.


----------



## Lindy

Got the lights up yet? Pics?

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk


----------



## Alastair

faizal said:


> I know how you feel mate,....like you mentioned earlier.,....you start to accept them as a member of the family once they've been with you for so long. And Al,...you really treat them well,....with a big home like that. And as Lindy so positively put there,...you've given him the best possible life. He might have got eaten by a bigger fish in the wild. God gave him a lovely life through your deeds mate.



very very kind words faizal, this chappy has been with me a long long time, so really felt emotional, ahe must have been desperate for a calm spot to just go to sleep but had gotten himself into a fast flow area. i think once id put him in the netted floater he finally could go to sleep naturally.

so now ive got a couple of males doing the chasing around for contender and another 30 going in next week which will be fun to watch but non will ever take his place to me [DOUBLEPOST=1395966604][/DOUBLEPOST]





Dan Crawford said:


> Hi Folks, I was oop north last week so dropped Alastair a line and arranged to come visit this epic piece of genius.
> 
> What can I say? Well, whilst Alastair's house is not a public aquarium - It certainly should be! The Chocolate Lake is even nicer than you may imagine, it seems impossible to use cameras to capture it's brilliance. The first thing that struck me was the water clarity, so many times have I seen vast aquariums like this and they are often cloudy, this was gin clear from end to end. The fish are simply stunning, especially the Liquorice Gouramis. Both flora and fauna were so healthy it was sickening LOL
> 
> This was one heck of a project to have undertaken and a huge round of applause is deserved for persevering with it, fair play mate.
> 
> Being able to sit and watch your fish explore the fantastic home you've created must surely make it all worth while



massively kind words mate, really is. Especially from thee.
 i was a little unsure of exactly what you thought ha ha but that picked me up.
just a shame the positioning of the tank doesnt allow a nice big sofa infront of it.

 was great to have you over and im going to really push on with this now and have it looking much thicker and lusher than it currently is. just a few more hundred plants should do the trick 

be great to get together and time it for a photo shoot mate.


----------



## Alastair

ldcgroomer said:


> Got the lights up yet? Pics?
> 
> Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk



Certainly have.  Did a small review of them here lindy 
http://www.ukaps.org/forum/index.php?posts/343911. Need to update this journal too later


----------



## BigTom

More videos please!


----------



## BigTom

Come to think of it, a streaming HD webcam would probably keep me entertained for hours


----------



## James O

BigTom said:


> Come to think of it, a streaming HD webcam would probably keep me entertained for hours



No more feeding you chochies in ya birthday suit then Alastair


----------



## Alastair

BigTom said:


> More videos please!





BigTom said:


> Come to think of it, a streaming HD webcam would probably keep me entertained for hours


 ha ha. Ya know I was thinking about one of those live cams you can have running 24/7 that you can view from a comp or phone. Would be great. 



James O said:


> No more feeding you chochies in ya birthday suit then Alastair


 lmao nope not anymore. Although I could do a live amano style feed and tap the tank to get all the fish to come to me lol. 

Not too much has changed in this.  Everything's slowly growing in, and had put a carpet of mc around the main focal point as seen in the picture below 




 Straight from mr farmers one pot iwagumi. Sad to say it started melting so its in propagators growing rampant for now so will try again and also add some to my terrarium/paludarium thingy. 
So for now its got elecheocharis and mini tennelus mixed together.  

Soon to add in another 30 choccos and am picking up 30 more cpds tomorrow morning.


----------



## faizal

Alastair said:


> and had put a carpet of mc around the main focal point as seen in the picture below


Al,...what does "mc" stand for?


----------



## Edvet

http://www.tropica.com/en/plants/plantdescription.aspx?pid=025 i guess


----------



## James O

That, or its the dude with the mic up by the DJ who keepin' it real in da place ta beeeeeee 

Why oh why did ever I watch Ali G?  


Nah cant be that.  Go with Edvert's idea


----------



## Alastair

faizal said:


> Al,...what does "mc" stand for?


 vvvv what edvet says faizel. Micranthumum monte carlo. I know iain sutherland has had success growing this in his shrimp tank which is non co2 but I think the jump from georges injected tank to the low tech it didn't like and started melting so took it out and put it into propagation.  It's literally a lawn of the stuff. 


Edvet said:


> http://www.tropica.com/en/plants/plantdescription.aspx?pid=025 i guess


 yup cheers ed. 


James O said:


> That, or its the dude with the mic up by the DJ who keepin' it real in da place ta beeeeeee
> 
> Why oh why did ever I watch Ali G?
> 
> 
> Nah cant be that.  Go with Edvert's idea


 lol


----------



## BigTom

I've got the Micranthemum MC going in 3 tanks, all low tech - pretty steady growth in all 3, it's a great wee plant.


----------



## faizal

Alastair said:


> ..... but I think the jump from georges injected tank to the low tech it didn't like and started melting so took it out and put it into propagation.



I'm sorry to be bugging you with newbie questions again Al but how do you put it into propogation? I remember Clive telling me once to let it float on the water surface for about a couple of weeks & then submerge it,....is that how you propagate it?


----------



## Mr. Teapot

I'm so in awe of this tank!  Something inside me get a bit scared thinking my little tank could eventually evolve into a whole ecosystem in a room. It must be a dilemma just thinking about which side of the room to view it from. 

Second newbie question of the day: Are the roots of your maidenhair fern tied on and do they eventually grip the wood themselves? Do they need a little planting pocket of substrate or are they just bare rooted?


----------



## Alastair

faizal said:


> I'm sorry to be bugging you with newbie questions again Al but how do you put it into propogation? I remember Clive telling me once to let it float on the water surface for about a couple of weeks & then submerge it,....is that how you propagate it?



Hey faizal dont be sorry. Bug away mate we are all here to learn from one another and give each other advice. 
The way I am propagating it is by adding a fine layer of tmc nutrasoil on the base of a large takeaway tub and laying the mc over it. Misted it and popped on the lid which has pierced holes and under the lighting on the tank and its growing rapidly into a mat. 
Ill get pics up tomorrow 


Mr. Teapot said:


> I'm so in awe of this tank!  Something inside me get a bit scared thinking my little tank could eventually evolve into a whole ecosystem in a room. It must be a dilemma just thinking about which side of the room to view it from.
> 
> Second newbie question of the day: Are the roots of your maidenhair fern tied on and do they eventually grip the wood themselves? Do they need a little planting pocket of substrate or are they just bare rooted?



Yes they certainly are. They are tied on and then begin to attach over a short period of time but depending on the wood. My last tank they just attached above water but onto wet wood..
This one the roots are much more into the water. No substrate needed


----------



## faizal

Alastair said:


> Hey faizal dont be sorry. Bug away mate we are all here to learn from one another and give each other advice.
> The way I am propagating it is by adding a fine layer of tmc nutrasoil on the base of a large takeaway tub and laying the mc over it. Misted it and popped on the lid which has pierced holes and under the lighting on the tank and its growing rapidly into a mat.
> Ill get pics up tomorrow



Al,.. Cheers mate.


----------



## RichardJW

Out of interest Al , how many times per hour do your filters turn over the volume of your tank 
??? 


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----------



## andyh

Epic Journal, Epic Tank.....One of my favourites

Love the mix of livestock. I still have my 6 chocs, they seem to be doing well.


----------



## Alastair

RichardJW said:


> Out of interest Al , how many times per hour do your filters turn over the volume of your tank
> ???
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk



Hi richard 
Sorry for the delay. Hadnt noticed your post. 
The filters roughly 3 times id say but there are 2 adjustable 1600 ltre per hour power heads that run when lights on AND.......... I finally gave in and decided to inject this tank with co2 from today. 
Im injecting via a diy reactor and tmc v2 2200 lph pump and acrylic inlet and outlet so total turn over will be roughly 8000 lph give or take a few so 8x turn over during lights on from 2pm today hopefully 
Ph is already around 6 so im guessing the inmates will love the co2 more as itll drop the ph even lower. 
I know ive gone against what I initially intended and that was to run this low tech right through but with the tank being so big it is taking forever to grow in so for now ill use co2 then maybe gradually reduce back to low tech before I upgrade to the final bigger tank


----------



## Jason King

You did say bigger? Lol sounds great. 

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----------



## Alastair

andyh said:


> Epic Journal, Epic Tank.....One of my favourites
> 
> Love the mix of livestock. I still have my 6 chocs, they seem to be doing well.



Hiya mate. 

Thanks very much for those kind comments mate really appreciate it and very happy its one of your faves. 
Yeah I think your one of the only ones who has managed to do well with them too and they go perfect with your scapes. 
Its a shame everyone kind of lives southwards as it would be nice to have a small gathering at mine and maybe bbq etc. 
Something to get arranged at some point this year????


----------



## James D

We need photos Alistair.....


----------



## Edvet

Welcome to the wonderfull world of large tanks
Where growth is slow and algea are large!


----------



## RichardJW

Alastair said:


> Hi richard
> Sorry for the delay. Hadnt noticed your post.
> The filters roughly 3 times id say but there are 2 adjustable 1600 ltre per hour power heads that run when lights on AND.......... I finally gave in and decided to inject this tank with co2 from today.
> Im injecting via a diy reactor and tmc v2 2200 lph pump and acrylic inlet and outlet so total turn over will be roughly 8000 lph give or take a few so 8x turn over during lights on from 2pm today hopefully
> Ph is already around 6 so im guessing the inmates will love the co2 more as itll drop the ph even lower.
> I know ive gone against what I initially intended and that was to run this low tech right through but with the tank being so big it is taking forever to grow in so for now ill use co2 then maybe gradually reduce back to low tech before I upgrade to the final bigger tank



Extra flow with lights on seems a good solution - saves the little ones drifting off ( literally ) in their sleep !! In a separate post about flow rates there was discussion about going up to x25 with wide bore multi holed spray bars !! I'd like to see their utility bills .. 

Do like the idea of switching between Hi & Lo tech approach to get desired planting balance . Looking forward to more piccies soon .



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----------



## aliclarke86

Wow co2 in that size tank will have to be a large canister? 

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----------



## Edvet

I am using a 10 KG one once every 3 months. I have an extra 3kg one running to get better pH drop on an DIY diffuser at app 1 in 3 weeks.


----------



## sanj

Edvet said:


> I am using a 10 KG one once every 3 months.


 
My usage is similar; 2x 5kg roughly refil once in every maybe 4 months.


----------



## andyh

Alastair said:


> Hiya mate.
> 
> Thanks very much for those kind comments mate really appreciate it and very happy its one of your faves.
> Yeah I think your one of the only ones who has managed to do well with them too and they go perfect with your scapes.
> Its a shame everyone kind of lives southwards as it would be nice to have a small gathering at mine and maybe bbq etc.
> Something to get arranged at some point this year????



Manchester aint that far


----------



## Ady34

Alastair said:


> Its a shame everyone kind of lives southwards as it would be nice to have a small gathering at mine and maybe bbq etc.
> Something to get arranged at some point this year????


Do it, BBQ and big tanks are cool  I'm sure a few would travel to see this monster!


----------



## Iain Sutherland

I'm game, been a while since I got pissed and made an idiot of myself 


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----------



## Alastair

James D said:


> We need photos Alistair.....


Will get some photos up this week  




aliclarke86 said:


> Wow co2 in that size tank will have to be a large canister?
> 
> Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk





sanj said:


> My usage is similar; 2x 5kg roughly refil once in every maybe 4 months.



Yep big canisters Ali, 2 x 22kg (full) cylinders in the cupboard behind the tank. One ready for when the other runs low. 

I felt myself drifting away from the original layout I started on this tank with the sense of depth I had done at first. I'd added plants at the back left etc. They've all come out now as did all the plants in the Samoa sand. 
I have put one species of special carpet plant in the other day so with the co2 on I'm hoping it will adapt and take off and cover all the open space. Then adding LOTS  more crypts in the next few days far right,  rear right and along the back with more moss on the wood to have it all built up towards that section. There's a nice young aponogetan c. Red in too for colour eventually. 
Even though I've added co2 it's not massive amounts but just enough to maintain a nice steady amount and thicker growth. 
I'm adding ei dosing and doing 2 x 25 percent water changes per week so less big jumps in water parameters. 

Want to say a big thanks to John @ www.aquariumplantfood.co.UK for my large parcel of powders and dosing spoons getting delivered in mega fast time. (pics of it all too soon) 


My paros and chocs love it though as my ph is reading 5.2 during lights on. 
I've got 2 paros in a buried ceramic tube chasing away anything that comes near and a female choccos holding babies in her mouth so small tank set up for the babies for a better survival rate. 

I'll Def get photos up of how I've rigged co2 via a large diy reactor, external pump and acrylic pipes. 

But for now I had to get up this rushed photo taken just as an amano had molted. It was fantastic. 
Gave me chance to have a quick go of the Xperia z2 camera too 


2014-05-05_11-19-49 by Mr-T-, on Flickr

Sent from my D6503 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## Brian Murphy

Co2! This should look sweet when it gets going lol ..... loads of pics please


----------



## Lindy

I know the tds of the tank but what is the gh? Brought mine up to gh 5, tds 116 and now worrying it's too high.


----------



## parotet

Wow mate... 2x25% WC means 650 liters/week. This is a lot of work/time!
I'm sure you have minions like Amano... 

Jordi


----------



## Edvet

(that's why i have my tank hooked up to a mains drain, i can just chuck in the garden hose and let it run a few hours)


----------



## James O

Nice shot there mate.  B&W ftw


----------



## Alastair

Brian Murphy said:


> Co2! This should look sweet when it gets going lol ..... loads of pics please


Certainly will murf. Bloody crypt melt everywhere the minute co2 is running grrrr. 


ldcgroomer said:


> I know the tds of the tank but what is the gh? Brought mine up to gh 5, tds 116 and now worrying it's too high.


 it's gh4 lindy 


parotet said:


> Wow mate... 2x25% WC means 650 liters/week. This is a lot of work/time!
> I'm sure you have minions like Amano...
> 
> Jordi


Hi Jordi
To be honest it doesn't take long at all. It's the gravel vaccing that is time consuming. I'll definitely be going back to low tech after a few months. 



Edvet said:


> (that's why i have my tank hooked up to a mains drain, i can just chuck in the garden hose and let it run a few hours)


Ditto. Garden Hose is hooked over the side of the tank draining water into the garden whilst I trim and vac. Takes about 40 mins total but will be longer as it fills in. 


James O said:


> Nice shot there mate.  B&W ftw



Cheers James. I've just got the Sony xperia z2 and had some fun last night doing underwater videos ha ha. Was greatc

Sent from my D6503 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## Lindy

Alastair said:


> it's gh4 lindy


Thanks for that, changed the sand for the nutrasoil today and pretty pleased. I chose the brown and it's a nice colour.


----------



## Alastair

ldcgroomer said:


> Thanks for that, changed the sand for the nutrasoil today and pretty pleased. I chose the brown and it's a nice colour.



Ooo be interesting to see the brown. 

Sent from my D6503 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## 1stgolf

What a good read and fantastic setup.


----------



## Richardbunting

Alastair said:


> gradually reduce back to low tech before I upgrade to the final bigger tank



Your going to get a bigger tank ???

*Removing jaw from keyboard and reattaching to face*


----------



## BigTom

I was lucky enough to stop in and see Alastair and this tank last week, while making an extremely exciting collection (more on which in the coming weeks). Idiotically I'd managed to pack my camera without a memory card, so no photos unfortunately.

I know Al's had a few frustrations with crypt melt and transitioning between low and high tech, but the tank still has massive impact. The hardscape is genuinely great - managing to blend that many disparate large pieces of wood into a cohesive scape is no mean feat. The stars really are the fish though - seeing them in a tank with enough area and structure that different individuals/species visibly occupy different territories and niches and exhibit very natural looking behaviour totally made my day. None of the shyness that you might associate with species like Paros and galaxy rasboras was apparent, even with lots of people crowding around the tank.

I think I might start recommending 1000 litres as a minimum acceptable tank size


----------



## RichardJW

BigTom said:


> I was lucky enough to stop in and see Alastair and this tank last week, while making an extremely exciting collection (more on which in the coming weeks). Idiotically I'd managed to pack my camera without a memory card, so no photos unfortunately.
> 
> I know Al's had a few frustrations with crypt melt and transitioning between low and high tech, but the tank still has massive impact. The hardscape is genuinely great - managing to blend that many disparate large pieces of wood into a cohesive scape is no mean feat. The stars really are the fish though - seeing them in a tank with enough area and structure that different individuals/species visibly occupy different territories and niches and exhibit very natural looking behaviour totally made my day. None of the shyness that you might associate with species like Paros and galaxy rasboras was apparent, even with lots of people crowding around the tank.
> 
> I think I might start recommending 1000 litres as a minimum acceptable tank size



Sounds like Alastair should be selling tickets to view ! You're observation that the Fish are the Stars is very valid - being a long time Aquarist (40+ years) my main beef about a lot of the wonderful contributions on this site are let down by the attention to detail when stocking the final setup !

I say " Well done Alistair " , let's see some more pictures please !


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


----------



## Greenfinger2

Hi Alastair,Superb Aquasape  Fab thread


----------



## parotet

BigTom said:


> I think I might start recommending 1000 litres as a minimum acceptable tank size


Bad news for Miss... I will let her know your recommendation 

Jordi


----------



## Alastair

BigTom said:


> I was lucky enough to stop in and see Alastair and this tank last week, while making an extremely exciting collection (more on which in the coming weeks). Idiotically I'd managed to pack my camera without a memory card, so no photos unfortunately.
> 
> I know Al's had a few frustrations with crypt melt and transitioning between low and high tech, but the tank still has massive impact. The hardscape is genuinely great - managing to blend that many disparate large pieces of wood into a cohesive scape is no mean feat. The stars really are the fish though - seeing them in a tank with enough area and structure that different individuals/species visibly occupy different territories and niches and exhibit very natural looking behaviour totally made my day. None of the shyness that you might associate with species like Paros and galaxy rasboras was apparent, even with lots of people crowding around the tank.
> 
> I think I might start recommending 1000 litres as a minimum acceptable tank size



Hi Tom, 

Very kind words mate really are. Was great to finally catch up and will look forward to a trip down over the next month or two to have a proper chinwag. 

An exciting yet very heavy collection and one I'm looking forward to seeing get underway. It'll all look nice together. I could see that mind of yours ticking away on all the possible options. 

I'm really glad you got to see it finally and was pleased I'd gotten ontop of the melt etc by the time you'd arrived. Just my silly mistake of doing filter clean on both filters gave you a nice cloudy look ha ha. 

I couldn't agree more on your words. The wood was the hardest part to put together but think it was the perfect pick for this tank. 
The inhabitants really have come out of any shells they may have had and was great to see them out and about as usual. Shame you couldn't stay long Tom and HOW could you have forgotten to bring the sd card Pffft lol 



RichardJW said:


> Sounds like Alastair should be selling tickets to view ! You're observation that the Fish are the Stars is very valid - being a long time Aquarist (40+ years) my main beef about a lot of the wonderful contributions on this site are let down by the attention to detail when stocking the final setup !
> 
> I say " Well done Alistair " , let's see some more pictures please !
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk



Thanks Richard, I couldn't agree more about what you just said. Although my way of doing things is building a scape around the inhabitants so they feel comfortable and at home. 
I keep all of mine too and not take them back to shops after final shots etc or pass them to someone I know who'll look after them just whilst I change tanks. 

The planted tanks is a hobby I really love doing and won't ever stop, I'm constantly thinking what to add or change or what's next but my true passion is these species of fish. I fell in love with them a few years ago and any set ups I do will have these inhabitants requirements taken into account. 

Your very welcome to pop over for a brew and what not Richard. I know your not far.


P's update to follow shortly


----------



## Alastair

Just a quickie before I start tinkering. 

Spent last night knocking up a bigger version of my "diy reactor for an fx5". 

I'm running a tmc 2200 pump separately for co2 but the current reactor couldn't handle the amount of bubbles per second needed which lead to bba, so built this in about ten to 15 mins
I used acrylic for the tube so I can see what's happening inside and will be mounting it on the left rear side as it's a wee bit too big to go under but the hose will all be hidden inside the cabinet. 
Managed to find an adhesive to bond pvc to acrylic


I've also made a quick 25mm clear acrylic inlet too. The outlet will currently be reduced to 16mm for a lily pipe until I've made up a few 25mm outlets today
. 
Here are the bits 

DSC_0399 by Mr-T-, on Flickr

DSC_0400 by Mr-T-, on Flickr
When it's all plumbed in shortly I can do a proper update and take photos.


----------



## Martin in Holland

massive piping for a massive tank


----------



## Edvet

Yup, good job.


----------



## foxfish

Can you link the adhesive please mate?


----------



## Tim Harrison

Richardbunting said:


> Your going to get a bigger tank ???
> 
> *Removing jaw from keyboard and reattaching to face*


Doood...me too. I've just been catching up with this wonderful journal, and I know this is now slightly off topic since the conversation has moved on...but seriously Alastair...I've decided that you are now my most favorite crazy person...err sorry, ever so slightly eccentric person...or perhaps just passionate

...But your final bigger tank...I'm not convinced...I think you should save yourself the extra expense and hassle of any intermediary tanks and just go all out like Jack Heathcote, as featured in PFK March 2014 http://www.practicalfishkeeping.co.uk/content.php?sid=6236...


----------



## aliclarke86

And get huge bills that mean you have to rehome all your fish that are too big for pretty much anyone in the UK? Noooo don't do it we will all be devastated  

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk


----------



## Edvet

I'd prefer this:


----------



## Lee Sweeting

Edvet said:


> I'd prefer this:



Wow!! That's awesome Ed. Where's this at? 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Tim Harrison

Wow that's amazing...it looks like Center Parcs sprung a leak...


----------



## Edvet

Cosmoxaica Barcelona, It even has daily rainfall:


----------



## aliclarke86

Bloody hell I want!!!!!

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## Martin in Holland

This is crazy....but I want one too


----------



## Tim Harrison

When I finally get round to doing that self-build I'm going to get me one, and live in a big buttressed tree like an Ewok...


----------



## Iain Sutherland

Troi said:


> When I finally get round to doing that self-build I'm going to get me one, and live in a big buttressed tree like an Ewok...


haha i want to see this!!


----------



## Lee Sweeting

Troi said:


> When I finally get round to doing that self-build I'm going to get me one, and live in a big buttressed tree like an Ewok...



Sounds like a nice place to live, not sure the mrs would be happy though. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Bufo Bill

How much would it cost to import Ewoks? Could I pay extra and have Han and Chewy deliver them personally?


----------



## X3NiTH

Bufo Bill said:


> Could I pay extra and have Han and Chewy deliver them personally?



As it has been nearly 30 years since Luke has used the force and Han has used the Falcon, both are a little rusty. So when Han asked for help with the rusty Falcon door and Luke had to resort to 'Open Sesame' to open it Han ended up in hospital.......so

Chewy maybe, Han not until he's recuperated!



(Ps. Get well soon Han!)


----------



## Greenfinger2

X3NiTH said:


> As it has been nearly 30 years since Luke has used the force and Han has used the Falcon, both are a little rusty. So when Han asked for help with the rusty Falcon door and Luke had to resort to 'Open Sesame' to open it Han ended up in hospital.......so
> 
> Chewy maybe, Han not until he's recuperated!
> 
> 
> 
> (Ps. Get well soon Han!)


That made me giggle


----------



## Alastair

Martin in China said:


> massive piping for a massive tank


Certainly is Martin. Think I just about did the right length too. Any shorter and it would possibly be spitting out bubbles. It's even got bio balls inside now too..


Edvet said:


> Yup, good job.


Thanks ed.  I'm quite please with the acrylic.. It's nice to see the churning of the co2.



foxfish said:


> Can you link the adhesive please mate?


Sure will mate I'll edit this post when I find the receipt from who I got it. It has definitely done the trick. Welded solid. 


Sent from my D6503 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## Alastair

Finally got co2 where it's needed and plants are doing really well now. Flow is spot on now with additional powerheads and the flow from the external pump running the reactor. 
Bba has almost gone too and all inhabitants look very happy. Finally the tank is coming along to where I wanted it. 
 I'm now doing 2 x 50 percent water changes a week to keep ontop of the detritus that collects amongst all the foliage and light substrate vacs, trims etc. Anubias are all happy as they're all sending out flowers. 
There were more chocolate Gouramis put in and also some Sphaerichthys vaillanti or the vaillanti gourami which look beautiful but are quite shy. 
Here's one of the little guys from the day after introduction  




Purposefully taken in a aftermarket app to add colour to the whole picture lol. 

And two have made a definite pair, and seem to be creating a bubble nest under some water lettuce. Must be happy as one has begun changing to magnificent colouring. Have lots of photos of the tank on my camera that I'll upload next week. 
Just awaiting some more choccos and 12 more vaillanti and fish wise then I'm done. 

Will update with photos soon thanks everyone so far for the kind feedback. I can't wait to see how it looks in another month or two time now it's kicking in


----------



## aliclarke86

So how many sp. of choco do you have in here mate?

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## Sebastian Costin

wow!


----------



## Alastair

aliclarke86 said:


> So how many sp. of choco do you have in here mate?
> 
> Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk


Just two variants currently Ali. The vaillanti are different too In that the male is the one who does all the egg/fry carrying. I've currently got 3 baby licorice gourami that have survived after being looked after from their dad which to be honest I'm really happy about given the sheer amount of other fish in their and the fact the eggs tend to get fungus. Oh and a female chocco who's currently got a mouthful oo err. I'll need to start covering the powerheads with sponge for when they appear as they stay at the surface for a month. 


I've just started to add Easylife's 'Catappa X' to the tank which has made a big difference to them. It's completely clear in the tank yet still has all the benefits of the leaves etc. 
Ph has shifted just a little but it's 5.6 during co2 anyway but colours of the Paros and choccos has really deepened. Brilliant product.... Seriously good stuff


----------



## aliclarke86

Ah not come across that one but I have to say I've been impressed with all easylifes products that I have used so far. 

I'm a big fan of vaillanti the colours can be so beautiful!! 

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk


----------



## Alastair

aliclarke86 said:


> Ah not come across that one but I have to say I've been impressed with all easylifes products that I have used so far.
> 
> I'm a big fan of vaillanti the colours can be so beautiful!!
> 
> Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk



I've never used the easylife range until recently but really impressed with it. 

Agreed. Once these have matured a little I'm sure I'll see much more colour. Just wish my local MA orders would arrive 

Sent from my D6503 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## Alastair

Sebastian Costin said:


> wow!



Thank you Sebastian


----------



## CanisDraco

I've been meaning to join this site for awhile, now, having just read this entire blog, seems like as good a time as any 

This tank is awe inspiring, when I move house I'm hoping to set up a tank that will be even half as lovely as this. I have some practising to do in the meantime!

If you don't mind me asking, where do you get your plants from? I'm always looking for more places in Manchester to explore and throw money at


----------



## RynoParsons

Still waiting for those photo updates.........


----------



## Alastair

Sorry for such a long delay, I've been quite busy lately so not had chance to update this. 

The tank is looking really well, however even though sad news, at the same time it's good news. 

I've decided to move house purely for space purposes, and a future bigger project later next year in the pipeline, so sadly this tank is being stripped down. 
It will also make it so much easier to take photos and have zero reflection interfering. 

There will be a new journal for it starting in September with a completely different scape, something more amano style on a big scale, and new equipment. 

I'll be using Kessils new e series freshwater tunas for lighting too on the biggie  
Jeremy Gay was over yesterday discussing my big project for next year and loaned me one of the older Kessils on this tank and the lighting was absolutely phenomenal so I'm sure the new e series Kessils will be out of This world. I've spoken to rob at j n k aquatics as they are the sole importer for Kessil and They will be available very soon. 

The choccos paros etc will be going in a lovely NA set up from ady, and will be set up to imitate their natural habitat. But with some scaping to it. A few however will be relocating all the way up to Scotland to lindy. 

I will get some photos added later of how the tank was looking up until yesterday, but just wanted to say a really really big thank you to everyone who has shown so much interest in this journal, and the amount of comments and sheer number of views the journal has had is amazing. 

Also a great thanks to unipac for supplying me direct with the Samoa sand and petrified wood. 

I look forward to getting it going again in a few weeks time and hopefully creating something even half as good as the likes of stu worral ady, George and Mr Crawford. 

Thanks everyone


----------



## Iain Sutherland

My mum would say you've got ants in your pants mate 

It's a shame not to see this one fully mature but I guess that would be a year or so. 
However your aspirations will certainly be our gain and can't imagine what the new one will be like.... No doubt a whole new level of scaping!

Can't wait!


----------



## Edvet

Looking forward to the next project, still waiting to see what you managed in the lake.
I am sure with the experience of the lake your next one will be great, i do think larger tanks work in a different way compared to smaller ones, so this will have been a usefull in between.
I have wondered the last year if i could start realy fresh how a new tank would look.
Well good luck with the move!

Ed


----------



## James O

Iain Sutherland said:


> My mum would say you've got ants in your pants mate



I dont care what he got in he's undies - he said _*1,400 litres of 'something more amano style'*_   
need to lie down for a bit.......

Good on you for the (usual) generosity mate.  Cant wait.....


----------



## aliclarke86

I can't bring my self to tear down an 80lt tank let alone a 1400.... That's a lot of patients!! 

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk


----------



## Nathaniel Whiteside

Massive shame Al in one respect, this would be even better in months to come.
But as always with you, onwards and upwards. 

I've got the use of a van now, so if your wanting a hand with the move, all you have to do is shout.  
I'll only charge you a ten minute glance. (Into the tank)


----------



## Tim Harrison

Bloomin' 'eck Alastair you don't do things by halves...makes me exhausted just thinking about the amount of effort you put into this hobby.
Very much looking forward to your NA scape, in terms of scale alone it'll be awesome...and that's aside from your obvious talent as a scaper


----------



## Hamza

Wow! Am speechless at the scale of this project.
I really adore such huge tanks with small fish. It looks more like a Lil world for them then a confined box.


----------



## Alastair

Iain Sutherland said:


> My mum would say you've got ants in your pants mate
> 
> It's a shame not to see this one fully mature but I guess that would be a year or so.
> However your aspirations will certainly be our gain and can't imagine what the new one will be like.... No doubt a whole new level of scaping!
> 
> Can't wait!



Ha ha I know. I feel like it too now with me being on my feet for the next few weeks non stop. 

I'm absolutely gutted to have to take it down now it's all taking off properly and I got ontop of the bba and what not. Im tempted to do the same but I have the chance to give it a whole new different layout and it's not a tank I can just take down and put up every few months. 

Thanks mate that's very kind to say. Now I'm back onto co2 I want to give silly growth and lots of stems etc a go. I've watched some of amanos videos for some ideas and think I have a layout I want to do. 
Welcome to help out he he  



Edvet said:


> Looking forward to the next project, still waiting to see what you managed in the lake.
> I am sure with the experience of the lake your next one will be great, i do think larger tanks work in a different way compared to smaller ones, so this will have been a usefull in between.
> I have wondered the last year if i could start realy fresh how a new tank would look.
> Well good luck with the move!
> 
> Ed



Thanks ed. I don't think I could have said it better myself. 
Tanks of these sizes really are a challenge in terms of flow, high co2 levels nutrients etc and this journal going from low tech to high has given me a massive refresher. 

I'll pop a quick phone photo up shortly. 

P's rescape it, you know you want to


----------



## Alastair

James O said:


> I dont care what he got in he's undies - he said _*1,400 litres of 'something more amano style'*_
> need to lie down for a bit.......
> 
> Good on you for the (usual) generosity mate.  Cant wait.....



lol......well I do keep my things big  ha ha. 

Thanks dude, it'll be a challenge but one I'm all geared up for. Daily maintenance and frequent water changes to keep it almost George farmer like clean 



aliclarke86 said:


> I can't bring my self to tear down an 80lt tank let alone a 1400.... That's a lot of patients!!
> 
> Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk


Unfortunately I can't do anything but take it down. It's sad, very sad as this is the happiest I've ever seen my fish . 



Nathaniel Whiteside said:


> Massive shame Al in one respect, this would be even better in months to come.
> But as always with you, onwards and upwards.
> 
> I've got the use of a van now, so if your wanting a hand with the move, all you have to do is shout.
> I'll only charge you a ten minute glance. (Into the tank)



Cheers mate. Kind words as always nath. Hope its upwards. I nice seriously high tech tank for the next 12 months before I start on the big one. 

Yes yes man with a van would be perfect. If you can spare some time I'd appreciate it. I'd cover fuel and you can take some goodies back with you for payment???? 



Troi said:


> Bloomin' 'eck Alastair you don't do things by halves...makes me exhausted just thinking about the amount of effort you put into this hobby.
> Very much looking forward to your NA scape, in terms of scale alone it'll be awesome...and that's aside from your obvious talent as a scaper



Waar thank you very much Troi. That's pleased me zillions knowing someone thinks I'm a talented scaper. More pressure now to perform hey. 

I love this hobby, yes, which I think is the reason I put as much as I do in. That and I've got big tank ocd 


Hamza said:


> Wow! Am speechless at the scale of this project.
> I really adore such huge tanks with small fish. It looks more like a Lil world for them then a confined box.



Thank you hamza. That was and will always be my aim with these species of fish I have. To create a natural habitat for them, a true slice of nature for them. If I wasn't moving it would be left to grow and grow which makes me kind of sad to not see that in this tank


----------



## Alastair

And, as I mentioned, here is the final photo taken of the tank using only a phone camera as the fish were out playing. 

I'm keeping this photo for my desktop background 

Another 2 months and it would have been a jungle. I've pulled up some of the e tennelus already hence the gaps in the substrate 


Chocolate gourami lake by Mr-T-, on Flickr

Here's to the next set up. 
Thank you everyone


----------



## Deano3

Looking forward to it alastair been a great one


----------



## Andy D

Looks great! 

Looking forward to the next one!


----------



## Ady34

epic Al!
I hope your new home is some kind of mansion to house an even bigger project in the future!! 
Seriously though, setting up and running a tank of this scale takes a huge amount of time and effort so hats off to you for committing to it and making it work. The fish really are lucky to be housed in such a special home and although its a shame that it is coming down so soon, I'm really looking forward to the new incarnation 

Hope the move goes well mate, will look forward to a catch up soon and you'll do the NA proud 
Onwards and upwards!
Cheerio,
Ady


----------



## tim

It's a stunner al, real shame to see it come to a premature end, your new scape sounds epic I'll definitely subscribe for the ride  good luck with the move fella


----------



## CanisDraco

Ahh, I just comment on this thread to ensure I get updates when lovely new photos go up and you cruelly take it away from me  

Never mind, I'm very much looking forward to what you'll come up with next, especially since I'll be able to watch this one unfold instead of turning up late to the party!


----------



## Alastair

Ady34 said:


> epic Al!
> I hope your new home is some kind of mansion to house an even bigger project in the future!!
> Seriously though, setting up and running a tank of this scale takes a huge amount of time and effort so hats off to you for committing to it and making it work. The fish really are lucky to be housed in such a special home and although its a shame that it is coming down so soon, I'm really looking forward to the new incarnation
> 
> Hope the move goes well mate, will look forward to a catch up soon and you'll do the NA proud
> Onwards and upwards!
> Cheerio,
> Ady



Such kind words Ady thanks mate. I am quite sad to have had to start taking this down and was feeling a little deflated. Someone should invent ways to move tanks no matter what size so they don't have to be taken apart.

It does take alot of time and effort, especially once the co2 was eventually put on. Hats off to sanj for running his monster and all his other tanks too at the same time. I don't know how he does it. 

I wish the house was a mansion, but enough room to go bigger next year..

Doubt I'll have the NA quite like you but will be a very nice posh home for the choccos etc. 

Look forward to the catch up too pal 



tim said:


> It's a stunner al, real shame to see it come to a premature end, your new scape sounds epic I'll definitely subscribe for the ride  good luck with the move fella



Thanks very much Tim, definitely a real shame. Looking at it tonight just makes me feel sad, seems to have changed somehow  

Thanks for subscribing when it's up again mate. Nice to have a few followers. Dreading this take down 

Sent from my D6503 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## Alastair

During strip down and removed 3 pieces of the emersed wood and thought it looks so much better with out. 

If no amano style or iwagumi would this look good but replanted???? Hmmmmm





Huge open space more light and no flow being hindered 

Sent from my D6503 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## Tim Harrison

Liking that very much...


----------



## Edvet

Looks natural, me like long time......


----------



## Nathaniel Whiteside

Yes man! Draws you right in. 

Awesome.


----------



## James O

Wide open spaces 



Edvet said:


> Looks natural, me like long time......



Cost more than 'ten dolla' though 

Looks


----------



## CanisDraco

I like this  it looks completely different!


----------



## tim

It looks epic, the plant choices would be endless too due to the size, stems, swords crypts all reaching their full potential, only slight thing I'd change would be to move that hose clamp about 4 inches to left  have often read through your high tech journal Al when I first joined the site and this as a high tech, I know you'll come up with something special.


----------



## Alastair

Edvet said:


> Looks natural, me like long time......


 my thoughts too ed.  


Nathaniel Whiteside said:


> Yes man! Draws you right in.
> 
> Awesome.


 I liked it too mate. To the point I nearly left it running for a few days and wish I had now. Read below mate



tim said:


> It looks epic, the plant choices would be endless too due to the size, stems, swords crypts all reaching their full potential, only slight thing I'd change would be to move that hose clamp about 4 inches to left  have often read through your high tech journal Al when I first joined the site and this as a high tech, I know you'll come up with something special.



Kind words tim very kind. I loved my old high tech journal, a playground for trying almost every type of plant and ridiculous amounts of pearling. Can't wait. 
Awww I thought the hose clamp was placed perfectly ha. 

I haven't been on as of late to update this finally and close it... But
I've moved house finally but sadly this tank was damaged whilst moving in the old house, it's sat in my new living room currently looking pretty small 





But will be gone in a few weeks to be replaced by a braceless rimless optiwhite version and a new journal. 
Tank sizes will be either 180x60x100cm or a 180x60x120 minimal silicone and thick glass with some really nice lighting over and a true NA/amano scape. 

Was a bit gutted the other week though when Mr farmer rang me to ask to do a feature on it for pfk and I'd just took it down grrrrr. 
Anyway thanks everyone for following this and I'll start a new journal in a few weeks


----------



## Nathaniel Whiteside

Oh my. No way. What happend Al? Whats the damage?


----------



## BigTom

Oof sorry to hear about the damage Alastair. Beyond repair?

On the plus side the new place looks like it's got plenty of room for a new monster!

Sent from my LT30p using Tapatalk


----------



## James O

Pop it behind the sofa so it's viewable from all sides. True 360 big tanks are few and far between. I think it's your duty


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## Edvet

60 waterheight and rimless: 15mm  i guess?
Sounds good


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## James O

Btw if you're going 180 x 60 braceless in optiwhite, you might as well go 120 front to back. It's the same as the two smaller Amano tanks at Sumuda aquarium and they're AMAZING


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## Crossocheilus

120cm front to back, that's deeper than my tank is long... I guess you'd have no trouble achieving a good sense of depth in that . Whatever size you choose I'm sure it'll be amazing; a real monster AND a real beauty.
Good luck Alastair!


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## Edvet

My tank is 80 cm deep one side and 120 cm deep the other side, gives a better angle from the couch


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## BigTom

Edvet said:


> My tank is 80 cm deep one side and 120 cm deep the other side, gives a better angle from the couch



Trapezoid tanks are possible then are they? I'm eyeing up a mildly trapezoid room divide as somewhere to put a new tank for a family member. Would look much better if it could completely fill the space rather than having wasted edge space on one side.


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## Crossocheilus

Sorry to say but I thought Edvet was joking there... So trapezoid tanks, how do they do the silicone/joins? Must be super expensive and difficult to find a tank manufacturer willing and able to do that.


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## Andy Thurston

Crossocheilus said:


> Sorry to say but I thought Edvet was joking there... So trapezoid tanks, how do they do the silicone/joins? Must be super expensive and difficult to find a tank manufacturer willing and able to do that.


 No more difficult than a corner tank  with a flat front or a hexagon tank. You'll just pay more for the wasted glass they just bevel the glass when they polish the ends for the silicone work. Finding someone prepared/capable to do it may be a little harder but i imagine most tank builders would like to build an odd shaped tank for a change


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## Nathaniel Whiteside

Yeah beveled edge


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## Edvet

Wel i kinda smuggled a bit. I was befriended with a discusbreeder/seller (Discus Hans) who in turn had a friend (Rob) working in the glazing/glass industry. I bought the glass of Rob, who prepared it all in the shop, and the three of us put it together in my house. Still quite a job. It's not a minimal silicone job (). we did put in some extra strips around the bottom and one in the <90 degrees corner, to get some extra room for silicone (so it's glued to 3 cm i.s.o.1,5 cm). The glass was bevelled a bit,  not a extremely clean design though.[DOUBLEPOST=1408969219][/DOUBLEPOST]





Crossocheilus said:


> So trapezoid tanks, how do they do the silicone/joins


 Lot's of it........


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## Crossocheilus

Ahh ok that explains it, but I think I'll stick with rectangular/cube tanks


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## nduli

Just read this journal top to bottom, great read, sorry to see it end with the damaged tank. Making me now consider upgrading my living room tank, much smaller than this but much bigger than I have at the moment. I'd say thanks but not sure my wallet will thank you Alastair.

Rich


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## Alastair

nduli said:


> Just read this journal top to bottom, great read, sorry to see it end with the damaged tank. Making me now consider upgrading my living room tank, much smaller than this but much bigger than I have at the moment. I'd say thanks but not sure my wallet will thank you Alastair.
> 
> Rich



My wallet hates me Rich so don't worry about it haha. 
I was a little gutted to be honest, as a scale could have been running in it by now, however fear not, it was a good thing as I now have this beauty ready for scaping in two weeks 





E


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## BigTom

Yay Al's back! Dimensions?


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## Crossocheilus

What's the plan for this one Alastair? Low/high tech? Emmersed growth? Liquorice and chocolate gourami? What sort of scape, similar to the lake or something different?


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## Voytek

Awesome size  Can't wait for scape


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## Edvet

He can keep goats in there
Just looking for the correct hardscape:


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## ADA

Wow!!! How will you be filtering that lol!!!


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## James O

If I remember correctly we might be in for Amanoesque awesomeness


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## nduli

dear god its a hot tub.....


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## Edvet

Or a mansized Garra rufa Spa:


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## James O

Htm....thats a girl....I think.....


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## Tim Harrison

Yep...definitely a girl...


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## Mark-jan

Nice indoor pool you have there! Curious about your plans!


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## James O

Pls


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## Smells Fishy

Loving reading through this Alastair. Up to page 22 atm. I'm struggling with whether to look at the rest of your journals or just get stuck in and finish this one. Hmmm. I dropped my laptop and it broke, well the screen did but luckily I have a projector. So I'm using it atm and I just watched your video and WOW! I now know the meaning of a home cinema, just then sat in the dark was probably the best experience I've had using the projector. Hope there's more kushti videos along the way. A view of the whole tank is good to show a sense of scale and all that but some closer shots of the fish interacting or feeding or even just follow one fish or a group around the tank would be lovely. A longer one like that would be a treat indeed. Since there's a lot of space here's an idea. What about adding some Sparkling gourami to add a bit more flavour and more action? An article in PFKM I read a while ago said they're easy to breed if I remember rightly. Curious and haven't seen anyone ask, how much did this tank even cost?


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## Smells Fishy

Balls. What a shame I really liked this journal. Well I've got a taste for you now so I'll start on your next one.


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