# Rimless tank options post-EA?



## Epiphyte (16 Jan 2021)

Evening all,

I'm after two tanks, a 60cm and 90cm rimless, tank only. Now the EA Aquascaper 900 would have been perfect, but since EA sold their aquarium models to D-D with nothing heard for a while and the ADA is a bit pricey for me, what could my options be?

Allpondsolutions have them or course but I'm dubious of them as there is little info out there as to quality.

Any recommendations?


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## castle (16 Jan 2021)

> Allpondsolutions have them or course but I'm dubious of them as there is little info out there as to quality.



They're terrible, I returned mine. 


Aquascapers are about the same price as an ADA tank, aren't they?


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## castle (16 Jan 2021)

Superfish also have a new range out, and they don't look too bad to me.


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## Maf 2500 (17 Jan 2021)

I had the same problem. I had my mind set on Aquascaper 900 for ages but when I went to order in November I found the issues with the change in ownership. After lots of online research I couldn't find anything worth taking a punt on at that size as a ready-made, in stock item, so decided to custom order. 

I tried going the local route and went into my local fishy store to get a quote for an optiwhite tank. The owner wasn't in but the two members of staff took my details and requirements and promised the boss would get back to me. Still haven't heard back from them two months later...

Anyway, after lots more research I ordered a custom built tank from Aquariums4Life. Prices are more than EA but much less than ADA for similar size (excluding delivery). Only problem is a 12-16 week wait, so I haven't actually received the tank yet.  I obviously can't give a review of the tank quality yet, but it is an option for you if no others are forthcoming. They were the only online custom build outfit I felt safe to order from (unseen) after much research, and I am sure there are several recommendations for them here on UKAPS. The customer service/contact is good too.

For the 60cm option I would look at the new Superfish Scaper range (as mentioned in the post above) if you are willing to use their included light.


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## Karmicnull (17 Jan 2021)

You might want to look at Nacd aquariums https://nacd-aquariums.co.uk/shop.


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## Tim Harrison (17 Jan 2021)

I'd wait. I'm sure the range will be up and running again soon.


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## MarkyP (17 Jan 2021)

I have a A4L tank custom made and the quality and finish is great, so great i'm having another one built.


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## Andrew Butler (17 Jan 2021)

Karmicnull said:


> You might want to look at Nacd aquariums https://nacd-aquariums.co.uk/shop.


And then run the other way very fast!

They (he) messed me around something awful, continual delays, wrong product turning up and then finally an aquarium delivered that started to come apart at the seams when I filled it.

It took quite some effort for me to get my money back from Sam (AKA Przemyslaw) and found them to be a company hiding a lot.

One's he made wrong is still up for sale on ebay well over a year later. DO NOT BUY!








						Nacd Aquariums Braceless and rimless Peninsula style Aquarium 1100x500x450 10mm   | eBay
					

Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for Nacd Aquariums Braceless and rimless Peninsula style Aquarium 1100x500x450 10mm  at the best online prices at eBay! Free delivery for many products!



					www.ebay.co.uk


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## Epiphyte (17 Jan 2021)

castle said:


> They're terrible, I returned mine.
> 
> 
> Aquascapers are about the same price as an ADA tank, aren't they?


What was your reason for returning? They're almost so cheap it's worth a punt.



castle said:


> Superfish also have a new range out, and they don't look too bad to me.


Just seen this but seems to be a real shame to pay to waste the light and filter as these will be upgraded to proper items. That said there is a Maidenhead local to me so I'm sure I can go check them out.



Maf 2500 said:


> I had the same problem. I had my mind set on Aquascaper 900 for ages but when I went to order in November I found the issues with the change in ownership. After lots of online research I couldn't find anything worth taking a punt on at that size as a ready-made, in stock item, so decided to custom order.
> 
> I tried going the local route and went into my local fishy store to get a quote for an optiwhite tank. The owner wasn't in but the two members of staff took my details and requirements and promised the boss would get back to me. Still haven't heard back from them two months later...
> 
> ...


Prices seem quite reasonable, however their sizes are very odd. I'll do some more research as perhaps a deeper tank could look nice. 



Karmicnull said:


> You might want to look at Nacd aquariums https://nacd-aquariums.co.uk/shop.


I have come across Nacd, but when you google.it the first result is this thread Product Review - NACD aquariums which doesn't inspire me with confidence! 



Tim Harrison said:


> I'd wait. I'm sure the range will be up and running again soon.


I sure hope so, I would have hoped to have heard something about by now given how long the tanks have been unavailable for.



MarkyP said:


> I have a A4L tank custom made and the quality and finish is great, so great i'm having another one built.


Second recommendation so can't be too bad. I'll definitely take a look.



Andrew Butler said:


> And then run the other way very fast!
> 
> They (he) messed me around something awful, continual delays, wrong product turning up and then finally an aquarium delivered that started to come apart at the seams when I filled it.
> 
> ...


Interesting, I read your thread so I think I'll be keeping a safe distance!!


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## Paul Kettless (17 Jan 2021)

I have an aquascaper on order also, and has been since mid december.  I spoke with my supplier a few days ago and they told me that the delay is the glass getting from China, and that its an import issue.  They have suggested that I ma see it some time mid February.  They are good tanks for a fair price Im going to wait it out.


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## castle (17 Jan 2021)

Epiphyte said:


> What was your reason for returning? They're almost so cheap it's worth a punt.


Where they cut the silicone to make it neat, they'd cut 2mm into the glass. Imagine the pressure/lack of care it takes from the maker to push a blade 2mm into glass. 

I must have some pictures somewhere, also silicone work is not neat.


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## Epiphyte (17 Jan 2021)

Paul Kettless said:


> I have an aquascaper on order also, and has been since mid december.  I spoke with my supplier a few days ago and they told me that the delay is the glass getting from China, and that its an import issue.  They have suggested that I ma see it some time mid February.  They are good tanks for a fair price Im going to wait it out.


I was hearing mid-Jan but I guess in the mad world we live in delays are to be expected. A real shame.



castle said:


> Where they cut the silicone to make it neat, they'd cut 2mm into the glass. Imagine the pressure/lack of care it takes from the maker to push a blade 2mm into glass.
> 
> I must have some pictures somewhere, also silicone work is not neat.



I can live with untidy silicone as I'd just neaten it up myself. But a 2mm gouge! Impressive given how strong glass is to scoring. I am really tempted to try at only £65, I can return it if it's crap. That just leaves me something a bit bigger to search for.


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## Paul Kettless (17 Jan 2021)

Epiphyte said:


> I was hearing mid-Jan but I guess in the mad world we live in delays are to be expected. A real shame.


No doubt they are over egging it maybe, to increase customer satisfaction if it comes earlier. As you said life is crazy I work in the car industry and what was 9-11 weeks build on some is now hitting 25weeks+


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## Tim Harrison (17 Jan 2021)

Epiphyte said:


> I am really tempted to try at only £65, I can return it if it's crap. That just leaves me something a bit bigger to search for.


Seriously. @castle is right it's not worth the hassle. APS aquariums are truly dreadful. I took one for the team and ordered an APS tank. The silicon work was as rough as a badgers backside, not just too much but not enough in places. You can't tidy up whats not there. Plus I found hairs and dirt trapped within the silicon. And returning it was a nightmare. APS's after sales service left much to be desired.









						APS Optiwhite Aquarium
					

I've been after an Aqua One AquaOpti for a while, and I've had a mare trying to get hold of one:(  First one had a manufacturing flaw. Second one, ordered from a different company, failed delivery twice and then got damaged. Third one, from yet another company, has been on order sine 13th June...



					www.ukaps.org


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## Epiphyte (18 Jan 2021)

Point taken. My search continues. A4L do look good but the lead times put me off slightly if what @Maf 2500 says is correct.

I have a perfectly fine Juwel Rio 350 right now, but I find the whole thing a bit monolithic and ugly. A nice braceless/rimless tank would soften it up a little I feel. Plus multiple small tanks sounds more interesting than one big one!


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## Karmicnull (18 Jan 2021)

Andrew Butler said:


> And then run the other way very fast!


Blimey.  It's a jungle out there.  Thanks for sharing.


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## Paul Kettless (18 Jan 2021)

Its seems like it actually getting harder to obtain a nice tank. I actually emailed 4 different companies of custom built tanks and only one bothered to reply  Even that was not very good as the reply took six weeks from the date of my mail.


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## alto (18 Jan 2021)

Limited sizes and no idea on local pricing (they’ll be available in Canada, never)

Eheim has released a rimless tank series 








						Tanks
					






					eheim.com
				




(Aquaeden in Portugal has them listed so should give you some idea)


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## Maf 2500 (18 Jan 2021)

alto said:


> Eheim has released a rimless tank series
> 
> (Aquaeden in Portugal has them listed so should give you some idea)


225 Euro for 90 x 45 x 50 is more than competitive. If they can bring that price (or something close) to the UK they will sell a lot of tanks.


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## mort (18 Jan 2021)

Conversely, I have a aps 120cm options white tank and it's flawless. I bought it to make into a terrarium so the silicone wasn't an issue. In truth I wanted to make my own tank like I normally do but couldn't buy the glass for the cost of the tank delivered (I also ordered silicon at the time as i thought id have to fix it). This was 2 years ago and apparently quality has improved from what came before that period. Would I recommend a punt on one, probably not as you can't see them before you buy and I trust tim's and castle's opinions. 
I wouldn't rule out dodgy tanks from any manufacturer though. Ea in the past have had plenty of tanks sent back due to shoddy workmanship. They are much better now and should improve further under d-d but every manufacturer seems to have Friday afternoon rush jobs so make sure you inspect the tank closely on delivery.


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## castle (18 Jan 2021)

My APS tank was ordered 4 years ago, they could have improved.  Additionally, EA tanks silicone has been known to bubble, which will be weakening that single area. Having seen 150?cm EA aquascaper tanks, I couldn't trust them as the deformation of the front/back panels was a little too noticable and two display tanks had bubbles in silicone 

I have found the picture of damage to the APS tank I retruned, but photos were taken using a potato. I'll post 'em up here when I get a chance.

My experience of aquariums, in chronological order.

Juwel - bomb proof. Stands are duds. This rekord still exists, almost 20 years later.
ADA - best imo, 90P is 450£.
ND - solid, poor silicone work.
APS - shoddy.
A4L - exceptional, but 10mm start for optiwhite.
TMC signature - Nice aquariums, nice silicone. not quite ADA.
NACD - fine for a sump.

I've never owened an EA tank, just going by what I have seen. At 90cm the pressure is significantly less, so I would worry less.


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## Wookii (18 Jan 2021)

My current 60 x 40 x 40 is an APS Optiwhite tank also, and it's been absolutely fine so far. Silicone work was great on the vertical panels. It was a little more ropey on the base panel, but then I had to consider it in the context of being one of the cheapest optiwhite tanks available at £67 including delivery.

My (yet to be used) 1500mm tank is a A4L custom one (I actually snagged if off eBay for a bargain due to a cancelled order from one of their customer). They are the Roll Royce of tank, absolutely flawless (though I've not seen an ADA in the flesh as yet).


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## Onoma1 (18 Jan 2021)

Another vote for A4L. I have two. The build is superb and the customer service is fantastic. I would suggest calling them to see what they have available to deliver now.


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## Carl825 (18 Jan 2021)

Recently ordered the A4L 1200 aqua v scape with the double clad cabinet timescale currently is 3 to 6 weeks 👍


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## dsandson (18 Jan 2021)

How about another option, US firm Waterbox Aquariums have setup a UK base. Found them as I was looking for an Optiwhite all in one tank. They seem to now being selling freshwater rimless tanks.

CLEAR


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## Paul Kettless (18 Jan 2021)

dsandson said:


> How about another option, US firm Waterbox Aquariums have setup a UK base. Found them as I was looking for an Optiwhite all in one tank. They seem to now being selling freshwater rimless tanks.
> 
> CLEAR


Seem reasonable on price, £50 more than I paid for my aquascaper 900


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## Epiphyte (19 Jan 2021)

Thanks all for taking the time to reply. Lots of interesting info.

The Waterbox aquariums do look good value and certainly something I'll look at further. With that said A4L do a very good value 600x450x450 for £170. If they're as good as everyone says then I might well give them a call.

I've actually rearranged my office and, very conveniently, found this lovely little spot for a 600mm tank. Another good reason to order one 🙃


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## Paul Kettless (2 Feb 2021)

Thought I would give you all a mini update on the EA now D&D tank shortages.  I received an email from my supplier saying they have been advised by D&D that they are still having difficulties getting the stock into the UK, and that is mainly due to the position of brexit.  Complete Aquatics told me that I am unlikely to see it until the end of February at the earliest. So frustrating.


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## Regent (2 Feb 2021)

A4L are excellent I have a 400l tank from them. Good customer service, lovely silicon, polished edges. Worth the wait.

I also have three 90l superfish scapers tanks. For a budget tank I'm very impressed. The filter is a bit pants, I'd plan on replacing if you're stocking heavily or want 10x flow, the light is bright and 7500k, I have mine dimmed right down, they'll be enough to grow plants with co2.


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## becks (2 Feb 2021)

Clearseal do a range the same as the aquascaper tanks, might be worth a look.


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## Epiphyte (2 Feb 2021)

I've read that the new D&D "EA" tanks will be horrifically expensive too. A local Maidenhead told me they wont be stocking them as they don't think they can sell them at the price they are due to come out at. Wonder what they will be like...

I've made up my mind though, I think I'll be ordering a 90x60x45 tank for A4L and making my own stand for it. I've also ordered an APS 60cm tank because I was too curious not to, but I'm quite aware they may well be terrible when they arrive, so we shall see!


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## alto (3 Feb 2021)

Paul Kettless said:


> Thought I would give you all a mini update on the EA


Wasn’t the selling point of EA (back when) that they were a UK company, built in the UK


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## Paul Kettless (3 Feb 2021)

alto said:


> Wasn’t the selling point of EA (back when) that they were a UK company, built in the UK


Honestly, I dont know the answer to that.  The supplier said that the glass is imported from china, and they seemed to suggest that they would be built elsewhere in europe, and then shipped to the UK made up. Im guessing @Siege might be able to give a better insight into the facts.


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## Paul Kettless (3 Feb 2021)

Epiphyte said:


> 've read that the new D&D "EA" tanks will be horrifically expensive too. A local Maidenhead told me they wont be stocking them as they don't think they can sell them at the price they are due to come out at. Wonder what they will be like...


Dont like the sound of that, I wonder how I stand with one pre ordered and paid in full. I shall be really annoyed if they cancel the order after 2 months or demand a huge extra sum of money.


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## Paul Kettless (15 Feb 2021)

Well a further update for you all on the EA, D&D tanks fiasco, and I’m afraid its not good news for me. Unfortunately it appears that there are very long delays, and my supplier cannot give me any information at all on how Long I could end up waiting.  Furthermore, he also informed me that the price of the tanks is going up considerably, and that D&D will not honour the prices of pre-ordered tanks Even when paid in full. To say I’m miffed is an understatement.  I’ve been waiting 7 weeks to now be told this.  I can’t blame the supplier as they are telling me that the information  and progress being given to them from D&D is shocking at best.

Therefore, I’m in the process of getting my monies refunded, and now have the headache of starting again.  Did anyone enquire further with Waterbox? As they seem to be fairly decent product.  Really not even sure where to start without now having to wait weeks and weeks for a custom build.


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## Epiphyte (15 Feb 2021)

What size were you going for @Paul Kettless? A4L have a few sizes in stock ready to go when I called them last. If I hadn't picked up a used ADA on these forums I would have ordered on from there already.

In other news, my APS 60cm tank arrives tomorrow, looking forward to see if I get a good one or a bad one!


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## Paul Kettless (15 Feb 2021)

Epiphyte said:


> What size were you going for @Paul Kettless? A4L have a few sizes in stock ready to go when I called them last. If I hadn't picked up a used ADA on these forums I would have ordered on from there already.
> 
> In other news, my APS 60cm tank arrives tomorrow, looking forward to see if I get a good one or a bad one!


I’m after a 900x500x450, or there equivalent. it may be worth giving them a call maybe.  Thanks for the heads up on that. Good luck with the APS keep us posted.


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## Epiphyte (15 Feb 2021)

Paul Kettless said:


> I’m after a 900x500x450, or there equivalent. it may be worth giving them a call maybe.  Thanks for the heads up on that. Good luck with the APS keep us posted.



Almost entirely sure that's the size they had. About £380 but shipping isn't cheap!!


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## Andrew Butler (15 Feb 2021)

Paul Kettless said:


> Well a further update for you all on the EA, D&D tanks fiasco, and I’m afraid its not good news for me. Unfortunately it appears that there are very long delays, and my supplier cannot give me any information at all on how Long I could end up waiting.  Furthermore, he also informed me that the price of the tanks is going up considerably, and that D&D will not honour the prices of pre-ordered tanks Even when paid in full. To say I’m miffed is an understatement.  I’ve been waiting 7 weeks to now be told this.  I can’t blame the supplier as they are telling me that the information  and progress being given to them from D&D is shocking at best.
> 
> Therefore, I’m in the process of getting my monies refunded, and now have the headache of starting again.  Did anyone enquire further with Waterbox? As they seem to be fairly decent product.  Really not even sure where to start without now having to wait weeks and weeks for a custom build.


But isn't your contract with the retailer? If they're not going to supply you the goods you've paid for at the price agreed then name them and shame them I say.

I think Stuart is the director who will get this but drop them an email and tell them exactly what you think.
info@theaquariumsolution.com

Come on @George Farmer - with respect didn't you help EA develop this line and were the face of it?
Please see post #53 where @George Farmer makes it clear his contract finished with EA in 2018, something I knew nothing about and always thought he was the face of this Aquascaper range so apologies George.


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## Paul Kettless (15 Feb 2021)

Well I called the A4L and they have dangled a carrot with a 900x600x500 that they have.  I guess that I can get away with the extra height no real issue from 450-500mm With my ONF flat one, but 600 wide I’m wondering if the light distribution would cover that surface area ok As my light is not the pendant type. Therefore, raising the light fitting is not an option.


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## Paul Kettless (15 Feb 2021)

Epiphyte said:


> Almost entirely sure that's the size they had. About £380 but shipping isn't cheap!!


Yes the sI’ve they have is 900x600x500 £380 but delivery is around 95 quid


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## Siege (15 Feb 2021)

Paul Kettless said:


> Well a further update for you all on the EA, D&D tanks fiasco, and I’m afraid its not good news for me. Unfortunately it appears that there are very long delays, and my supplier cannot give me any information at all on how Long I could end up waiting.  Furthermore, he also informed me that the price of the tanks is going up considerably, and that D&D will not honour the prices of pre-ordered tanks Even when paid in full. To say I’m miffed is an understatement.  I’ve been waiting 7 weeks to now be told this.  I can’t blame the supplier as they are telling me that the information  and progress being given to them from D&D is shocking at best.
> 
> Therefore, I’m in the process of getting my monies refunded, and now have the headache of starting again.  Did anyone enquire further with Waterbox? As they seem to be fairly decent product.  Really not even sure where to start without now having to wait weeks and weeks for a custom build.


I wouldn’t say it is D-D fault. More like the shop shouldn’t have taken the order in the 1st place, or EA should have honoured sales. D-D have been very clear since taking over the brand.

Saying that the supply issues and delays are frustrating and rather out of D-D’s hands #welcometothebrexit 

I haven’t seen a Waterbox tank in the flesh, but what is the etched name at the top of the glass all about?


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## Paul Kettless (15 Feb 2021)

Siege said:


> I wouldn’t say it is D-D fault. More like the shop shouldn’t have taken the order in the 1st place, or EA should have honoured sales. D-D have been very clear since taking over the brand.
> 
> Saying that the supply issues and delays are frustrating and rather out of D-D’s hands #welcometothebrexit
> 
> I haven’t seen a Waterbox tank in the flesh, but what is the etched name at the top of the glass all about?


Honestly I’m not sure, as a customer you can only go by what information is given to you, and I have no idea of knowing if it is factual or not. I would like to hope that they have been upfront and honest. Complete Aquatics told me that at no time have they been instructed to not taken orders, and that in the first instance when I placed the order they were just waiting for stock delivery.

Either way it does now appear that there are big changes for the brand EA, and that yet again D&D get involved with a brand and the prices rocket.


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## Andrew Butler (15 Feb 2021)

Siege said:


> I haven’t seen a Waterbox tank in the flesh, but what is the etched name at the top of the glass all about?


What's all the craze about the ADA logo in the bottom right? 
Interested to hear what the reviews on them are like though.

Hopefully you get something sorted soon @Paul Kettless I know you've been eagerly waiting a while now.


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## Siege (15 Feb 2021)

Paul Kettless said:


> Honestly I’m not sure, as a customer you can only go by what information is given to you, and I have no idea of knowing if it is factual or not. I would like to hope that they have been upfront and honest. Complete Aquatics told me that at no time have they been instructed to not taken orders, and that in the first instance when I placed the order they were just waiting for stock delivery.
> 
> Either way it does now appear that there are big changes for the brand EA, and that yet again D&D get involved with a brand and the prices rocket.



The issue is this -









						Shipping crisis: I'm being quoted £10,000 for a £1,600 container'
					

A shortage of shipping containers, rising costs, and congestion at ports are holding back imports from China.



					www.bbc.co.uk
				




and this as an example -









						Trampoline prices 'to soar 50% on shipping costs'
					

The owner of a toy retailer says high transport costs may mean larger toys become more expensive.



					www.bbc.co.uk
				




D-D donot wish to increase prices unnecessarily, therefore delaying the relaunch of the tanks.

I want a 1200 cabinet (not the glass) and am also waiting and these are made in the UK. Mad times.


ps. EA is a separate company. D-D have just taken over the Aquascaper tanks, that is all. EA needed the space for their mega large filters and shop fitting things. The open topped tanks were small fry in comparison to these I’m afraid.


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## Paul Kettless (15 Feb 2021)

Siege said:


> The issue is this -
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Yes, at the end of the day its just frustrating I guess.  Are you guys at AG seeing longer delays in ADA tanks being ordered.


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## Siege (15 Feb 2021)

Not too bad at the moment, but supplies are now seriously limited.  The main ADA distributors in Europe are seriously low on stock, a pandemic thing. That is the main issue for ADA stock this month.

A 90-P could be a really good solution for you. The best glass you can get. If you donot need a cabinet that would be my choice 100% 👍


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## Andrew Butler (15 Feb 2021)

Siege said:


> D-D donot wish to increase prices unnecessarily, therefore delaying the relaunch of the tanks.


Have you never seen how the prices get increased when D&D take over the UK distribution rights?
Schego Heaters, Jecod Pumps, Jumpguard and AutoAqua products are just 4 in the past couple of years this has happened to.
I know everyone needs to make a living but if a product that was £40 is increased to £50 as they take over the rights then that's excessive in my opinion.


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## Maf 2500 (16 Feb 2021)

Paul Kettless said:


> Well a further update for you all on the EA, D&D tanks fiasco, and I’m afraid its not good news for me. Unfortunately it appears that there are very long delays, and my supplier cannot give me any information at all on how Long I could end up waiting.  Furthermore, he also informed me that the price of the tanks is going up considerably, and that D&D will not honour the prices of pre-ordered tanks Even when paid in full. To say I’m miffed is an understatement.  I’ve been waiting 7 weeks to now be told this.  I can’t blame the supplier as they are telling me that the information  and progress being given to them from D&D is shocking at best.


Bummer, but I kind of expected something like this was going to happen... I was very suspicious of ordering an EA Aquascaper tank due to the fact that Aquarium Gardens stopped taking pre-orders while most other shops seemed to just carry on regardless...

(Still waiting for my A4L tank, but was fully aware of lead time when ordering.)

Also, isn't Pilkington Optiwhite made in this country?


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## Krzysztof 82 (Kris) (16 Feb 2021)

Hi,
Has anyone been considering Viv ultra clear?





						Ultra clear aquarium | Ultra clear aquarium accessories
					

A clear aquarium will keep your little aqua creatures happy and healthy. Use effective aquarium accessories from the store for an ultra-clear aquarium.




					www.viv.com.hk
				



In Poland are highly recommend as per price is lower than ADA and quality is similar. 
Regards.


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## Maf 2500 (16 Feb 2021)

Paul Kettless said:


> Well I called the A4L and they have dangled a carrot with a 900x600x500 that they have.  I guess that I can get away with the extra height no real issue from 450-500mm With my ONF flat one, but 600 wide I’m wondering if the light distribution would cover that surface area ok As my light is not the pendant type. Therefore, raising the light fitting is not an option.


Possible option depending on what you are planning on planting at the front. Many scapes I see are largely bare in the first 10cm or so; if that was the case then just move the light 5cm towards the back from the centreline and treat the main planting area as the back 500mm of the tank. If you are planning a high tech carpet right up to the front glass then this wouldn't be the solution.


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## alto (16 Feb 2021)

Krzysztof 82 (Kris) said:


> Hi,
> Has anyone been considering Viv ultra clear?
> 
> 
> ...


I have ADA, UNS, VIV 

The silicone is slightly better on ADA vs UNS (same factory, same glass quality but ADA has a patented silicone process)
VIV looked great in the shop, not as great side by side the other two (and VIV is similar price locally ... the ADA rep refused to order the tank  - much better than when he pretends to order and 2 years later mentions that he won’t afterall ...)


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## George Farmer (16 Feb 2021)

Andrew Butler said:


> But isn't your contract with the retailer? If they're not going to supply you the goods you've paid for at the price agreed then name them and shame them I say.
> 
> I think Stuart is the director who will get this but drop them an email and tell them exactly what you think.
> info@theaquariumsolution.com
> ...


My consultation contract with EA ceased in 2018 and since have had no involvement.  Please spread the word.


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## Andrew Butler (16 Feb 2021)

George Farmer said:


> My consultation contract with EA ceased in 2018 and since have had no involvement. Please spread the word.


Thanks for that information George


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## George Farmer (16 Feb 2021)

Maf 2500 said:


> Bummer, but I kind of expected something like this was going to happen... I was very suspicious of ordering an EA Aquascaper tank due to the fact that Aquarium Gardens stopped taking pre-orders while most other shops seemed to just carry on regardless...
> 
> (Still waiting for my A4L tank, but was fully aware of lead time when ordering.)
> 
> Also, isn't Pilkington Optiwhite made in this country?


Pilkington is a UK brand that use the brand name “OptiWhite”. Most glass tanks are made in China and use their own low iron glass.


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## Wookii (16 Feb 2021)

These all sound like good reasons for those in the UK to support a UK manufacturer like Aquariums 4 Life, who are using another UK companies materials, rather than paying to ship an empty glass box half way around the world from China? A potentially moral choice for those that have half an eye on carbon footprint too I guess.


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## aaron.c (16 Feb 2021)

Been looking at A4L - shame their website is so hard to use.


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## Maf 2500 (16 Feb 2021)

aaron.c said:


> Been looking at A4L - shame their website is so hard to use.


Yes, not the easiest website to navigate, I am sure it puts people off. If it might help anyone, here is a direct link to their page for rimless aquascape tanks (without cabinets): A4L

On the upside their communications are very good and will definitely get back to you with a quote via email etc.


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## Andrew Butler (16 Feb 2021)

aaron.c said:


> Been looking at A4L - shame their website is so hard to use.


Just drop them an email then, maybe worth giving them the feedback though about the website.


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## Wookii (16 Feb 2021)

Agreed, they are in serious need on an online makeover . . . hopefully @Aquariums4life will read this thread, as a forum sponsor . . .

This is their page that have the complete tank/cabinet option similar to the EA tanks: Aquariums4Life Aquarium Manufactures

Slightly more expensive that the EA tanks, but then, slightly larger tanks, thicker glass, and solid wood cabinets . . .


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## aaron.c (16 Feb 2021)

Andrew Butler said:


> Just drop them an email then, maybe worth giving them the feedback though about the website.


I am going to drop them an email about a custom size


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## not called Bob (16 Feb 2021)

George Farmer said:


> Pilkington is a UK brand that use the brand name “OptiWhite”. Most glass tanks are made in China and use their own low iron glass.


that’s bonkers that its still cheaper to send a box of air over than a container of glass or even use the UK or French (believe they make an awful lot of glass there) manufactured glass and put it all together here.


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## Paul Kettless (16 Feb 2021)

The thing that is putting me off A4L is being charged £100 to have a a tank only delivered. I bought a pizza oven weighing considerably more and bigger footprint and was only charged half that. Maybe Im losing touch with reality


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## not called Bob (16 Feb 2021)

is there any one local that does custom builds? even if the building costs more, there must be some saving to be had on the delivery/collection


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## Maf 2500 (16 Feb 2021)

Paul Kettless said:


> The thing that is putting me off A4L is being charged £100 to have a a tank only delivered. I bought a pizza oven weighing considerably more and bigger footprint and was only charged half that. Maybe Im losing touch with reality


Yes, they do seem expensive. You are unlucky that you are about as far away as it is possible to get from them in England. My delivery is about 70 quid and I'm 120 miles or so closer than you are. If I lived nearer to the North West I would have just gone and collected it myself.

I like the suggestion above to find a custom builder closer to home. Not always possible though, my local fish store ghosted me when I asked for a quote and I did not know where else to turn.


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## Paul Kettless (16 Feb 2021)

Maf 2500 said:


> Yes, they do seem expensive. You are unlucky that you are about as far away as it is possible to get from them in England. My delivery is about 70 quid and I'm 120 miles or so closer than you are. If I lived nearer to the North West I would have just gone and collected it myself.
> 
> I like the suggestion above to find a custom builder closer to home. Not always possible though, my local fish store ghosted me when I asked for a quote and I did not know where else to turn.


If there is a custom manufacturer in norfolk/suffolk I am not aware of them. And I dont seem to be able find any when doing internet searches.  I would gladly do a round trip to collect but not a 10 hour trip😂


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## LondonDragon (16 Feb 2021)

I will swap my rimless for a non-rimless  keep getting blinded by the light


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## Sammy Islam (16 Feb 2021)

LondonDragon said:


> I will swap my rimless for a non-rimless  keep getting blinded by the light


My tank light is essentially my office light 🤣


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## LondonDragon (16 Feb 2021)

Sammy Islam said:


> My tank light is essentially my office light 🤣


I know the feeling, I have mine come on early in the day so that by the time I go to watch TV in the evening the tank is off!  Which means I don't get to enjoy it as much!


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## Epiphyte (17 Feb 2021)

Shipping costs was one of the major points that made me away with A4L. I know pallet shipments can be expensive but it's a hard pill to swallow.

In other news my 60cm APS tank arrived today. Exceptionally well packed and the tank seems really good quality. I filled it up today just to throw some plants in it from my recent rescape but will take a proper look when I move the plants on either way, for the price, I'm happy with it, will be ideal for a nice iwagumi tank im thinking of doing.


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## Andrew Butler (17 Feb 2021)

Not many custom tank builders will take on a minimal silicone type construction, most frown at clear silicone!
I struggled finding someone last time around and A4L were the best I could find and had very bad experience elsewhere.


Siege said:


> A 90-P could be a really good solution for you. The best glass you can get. If you donot need a cabinet that would be my choice 100%


I think this is your best option and absolutely agree with Steve here, I always thought the ADA aquariums were overpriced junk that bent under the weight of the water, how wrong I was.
If the cabinet is your issue here then it's something you could either build yourself or contract out, depending on budget of course - I'll happily help talk you through this and options you have if you needed, you know where I am.


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## alto (17 Feb 2021)

Paul Kettless said:


> The thing that is putting me off A4L is being charged £100 to have a a tank only delivered. I bought a pizza oven weighing considerably more and bigger footprint and was only charged half that. Maybe Im losing touch with reality





Paul Kettless said:


> I would gladly do a round trip to collect but not a 10 hour trip



Contradictory statements here 

I’m guessing you haven’t seen what happens when even very well packed glass boxes get stuck with a slightly careless driver somewhere along the shipping route - every single one was glass shatter
Sure insurance covers some costs but far from the whole cost to company selling and company receiving (and clients waiting)

But really only 5 hours  each way, leave at 7, have a grand lunch somewhere, home for dinner ... a fine adventure

Depending on aquascaping goals and fish interest, I’d definitely choose the 90 x 60 x 50cm (high)


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## Ady34 (17 Feb 2021)

Just to make everyone aware, forum sponsors Horizon Aquatics now stock waterbox aquariums and I believe drop shipping is foc.
Anyone wanting a replacement quickly for the ea tank such as @Paul Kettless maybe worth contacting them for more information.
The cabinet colour choices aren’t as varied with black, white and natural wood, however the tanks and stands are well built, with the cabinets in particular vastly superior build quality than the ea alloy framed one IMO. The larger systems doors are triple hinged and soft close and partially double end panel strengthened which I guess will account for a slightly higher price.
Cheerio,
Ady.


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## Wookii (17 Feb 2021)

Paul Kettless said:


> The thing that is putting me off A4L is being charged £100 to have a a tank only delivered. I bought a pizza oven weighing considerably more and bigger footprint and was only charged half that. Maybe Im losing touch with reality





Paul Kettless said:


> I would gladly do a round trip to collect but not a 10 hour trip😂





alto said:


> Contradictory statements here



Have to agree with @alto, @Paul Kettless. If the personal cost of a 10 hour round trip is too much, then you can imagine the costs of shipping a tank on a pallet via a similar trip might not be that unreasonable at £100.

As someone who has to ship large bespoke products around the country for a living I can attest that transport costs are immense and always going up. For a decent quality pallet carrier, you're generally looking at a minimum of £45+ VAT per 1200mm square pallet - that cost goes upwards for more out of the way postcodes, doesn't include any insurance (which means any damage is an immediate loss), nor packaging costs (including the pallet itself!).

It is worth remembering that ultimately, you always end up paying the same carriage costs  - some suppliers choose to quote the actual cost for clarity and fairness to customers at different distances, others simply build the cost into their product price and offer reduced or free delivery - in which case all customers share the cost irrespective of the physical delivery distance.


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## Wookii (17 Feb 2021)

LondonDragon said:


> I know the feeling, I have mine come on early in the day so that by the time I go to watch TV in the evening the tank is off!  Which means I don't get to enjoy it as much!



Couldn't you fashion a removable wood or acrylic front valance that sits on the tank front edge Paulo to shield your view of the light?


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## mort (17 Feb 2021)

Hate to be that guy, but you have to factor in a potential £200 fine at the moment as well, apparently norfolk is very hot on cars moving out of the county. 

Most shops can easily get custom tanks made. So its worth asking around. Even not so local shops might be able to get you a good deal as sometimes they get discounts for volume and you might be able to pick them up from there.


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## castle (17 Feb 2021)

mort said:


> Hate to be that guy, but you have to factor in a potential £200 fine at the moment as well, apparently norfolk is very hot on cars moving out of the county.
> 
> Most shops can easily get custom tanks made. So its worth asking around. Even not so local shops might be able to get you a good deal as sometimes they get discounts for volume and you might be able to pick them up from there.


There is a forced road block between the two roundabouts before thetofrd and the elveden bypass, I saw them set it up on Chirstmas day. Pulling over every 1 in a few cars, or so I'm told.


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## Epiphyte (17 Feb 2021)

alto said:


> Contradictory statements here
> 
> I’m guessing you haven’t seen what happens when even very well packed glass boxes get stuck with a slightly careless driver somewhere along the shipping route - every single one was glass shatter
> Sure insurance covers some costs but far from the whole cost to company selling and company receiving (and clients waiting)
> ...



Ooh I do like that, especially, as you say, that extra height and all that free swimming space!

I did consider a drive to get a A4L tank but the 400 mile round trip would probably cost me £100 in fuel anyway. Then unless you have an estate or 4x4 (which I don't) there's a good chance the thing won't fit in your car, as @soggybongo can testify trying to fit a 75cm tank in to my very standard sized saloon/coupe the other week!

£100 is good value in all reality, but I guess it's just an extra cost that's not factored in to our budgets more often than not which puts us off.

Rather stupidly, buying a £350 tank with £100 p&p is off-putting, yet if I were to buy the same tank at £450 with free shipping I'd probably not think twice. Brains are funny like that I guess.


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## Paul Kettless (17 Feb 2021)

Under the current lockdown restrictions there is no way that I would even consider making the journey at this time.  Therefore, this would have been something that I maybe would have considered once we have more free movement.  I understand what you are saying regarding the insurance and I guess transporting glass is far more risky than brick, despite the fact that my oven value was considerably more than the aquarium.  The more I think about it, I suppose the delivery cost is more justified.

I have had a conversation with Horizon today about the waterbox aquariums, and they seem to be an option.  They said that they are very happy with the build quality and silicone work, and that they have only been available in the UK for just over a couple of weeks.  I have to admit that I am tempted by the fact that the tank has the same dimensions an an Aquascaper 900, and at £349.00 delivered seems to be a good price.


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## becks (17 Feb 2021)

Epiphyte said:


> Ooh I do like that, especially, as you say, that extra height and all that free swimming space!
> 
> I did consider a drive to get a A4L tank but the 400 mile round trip would probably cost me £100 in fuel anyway. Then unless you have an estate or 4x4 (which I don't) there's a good chance the thing won't fit in your car, as @soggybongo can testify trying to fit a 75cm tank in to my very standard sized saloon/coupe the other week!
> 
> ...



Not just the cost factor but time too..Sod driving 400miles to save a £100


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## Paul Kettless (17 Feb 2021)

becks said:


> Not just the cost factor but time too..Sod driving 400miles to save a £100


Would never have entertained the idea, your right just for a tank, but my work occasionally takes me near Manchester so it would have been a detour at best.


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## Wookii (17 Feb 2021)

@Paul Kettless is that price tank only?


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## oscar (17 Feb 2021)

Paul Kettless said:


> Would never have entertained the idea, your right just for a tank, but my work occasionally takes me near Manchester so it would have been a detour at best.


I have a EA 600 , I’ve had it for over a year now/ very well made and nice silicone work/ glass. 
If I was you I would purchase the waterbox, I’ve heard some good reviews also.


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## Paul Kettless (17 Feb 2021)

Wookii said:


> @Paul Kettless is that price tank only?


Yes indeed tank only


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## Paul Kettless (17 Feb 2021)

Well guys, I have bitten the bullet and ordered one of the Waterbox 3620 from one of our forum sponsors, Horizon Aquatics.  It doesn't seem that this brand is very well known at the moment this side of the pond so I guess in some ways I can be a test case. I will make sure that I do a product review when it arrives.


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## becks (17 Feb 2021)

Paul Kettless said:


> Well guys, I have bitten the bullet and ordered one of the Waterbox 3620 from one of our forum sponsors, Horizon Aquatics.  It doesn't seem that this brand is very well known at the moment so I guess in some ways I can be a test case. I will make sure that I do a product review when it arrives.



They are a US company and popular over there, atleast in the reefing world.


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## Paul Kettless (18 Feb 2021)

becks said:


> They are a US company and popular over there, atleast in the reefing world.


Yes I have seen the company advertised in the reef world, its seems like they are now going to have a bigger presence in the freshwater side in the UK. The good news is that Horizon have suggested delivery will only be 2-4 weeks🤞


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## andy198712 (23 Feb 2021)

this has been a helpful read as i'm in a similar boat to you, postage it a killer, especially as in cornwall i seem to come under a excess postage charge, just cancelled my APS order.
also prices have seemed to be going up alot for postage and tanks.

waiting on a local shop to get these in stock.....

https://www.aquael-aquarium.co.uk/w...8mRCo_FOlIF17BqcX6EK3aRTz_C9yCZmD4Ct00iZvyiEk 

its £250 for the tank and lid and light..... they think


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## aquascape1987 (23 Feb 2021)

Think you’ve made a good choice with the water box. The tank glass and silicone work is as good if not better than the EA. And the the cabinet is better built. The guys at horizon gave me a shake test comparison of an EA 900 and the water box equivalent. (Grab the glass and shake it) The water box didn’t move a CM whereas the EA cabinet moved quite a lot.


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## Wookii (23 Feb 2021)

aquascape1987 said:


> Think you’ve made a good choice with the water box. The tank glass and silicone work is as good if not better than the EA. And the the cabinet is better built. The guys at horizon gave me a shake test comparison of an EA 900 and the water box equivalent. (Grab the glass and shake it) The water box didn’t move a CM whereas the EA cabinet moved quite a lot.



Looking on their website, I quote fancy one of their AIO cubes as a shrimp tank - tempting!


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## aquascape1987 (23 Feb 2021)

@Wookii , they look really good in the flesh and like I said the build quality looks exceptional.

The *only* aspect I could see where the EA tank seemed to have the edge was that the EA cabinets have a lot more colour choice.

Perhaps though, this may be something that will change with the Waterbox tanks.

I’ve spoken to quite a few different sources recently regarding the EA Aquascaper tanks because my plan was for the next tank to be a 900, and although the official party line is that we are waiting for DD to start producing them again, after acquiring from EA, the general consensus from everyone I spoke to seemed to be that they don’t hold out much hope that we will ever see them in production again. At least not anytime soon.

I was really pleased to see the Waterbox though, as it seemed to measure up and even excel in most ways.


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## shangman (23 Feb 2021)

I noticed last time I want to my local shop The Aquatic Design Center in London that they seemed to be selling their own custom made optiwhite aquariums with stands, and on their website they have a calculator for custom tanks. I thought they seemed well made and reasonably priced though I wasn't paying it too much attention (kept staring at the fish instead), I know they have another side of the business making big special tanks for commercial spaces so it makes sense. If someone is looking for a tank they could send them an email. Next time I go there I will check out the prices and ask them about it. Could be good for people who are closer to London! Seems like local is the way to go with these shipping prices.


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## Sammy Islam (23 Feb 2021)

aquascape1987 said:


> Think you’ve made a good choice with the water box. The tank glass and silicone work is as good if not better than the EA. And the the cabinet is better built. The guys at horizon gave me a shake test comparison of an EA 900 and the water box equivalent. (Grab the glass and shake it) The water box didn’t move a CM whereas the EA cabinet moved quite a lot.


The EA cabinet does move quite a lot if pushed from the side, i only realised recently. It's quite scary and i get quite paranoid about it now as it definitely moves with very little effort.


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## Paul Kettless (23 Feb 2021)

No Fault of Horizon Aquatics but it does seem that there are some delays on supplying the Waterbox orders 2-4 weeks delivery is now 6. It seems that the shortage with other manufacturers is now have a ripple effect as more and more people are trying alternative methods

Worth bearing in mind if you are thinking of ordering one.


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## Alex Papp (26 Feb 2021)

dsandson said:


> How about another option, US firm Waterbox Aquariums have setup a UK base. Found them as I was looking for an Optiwhite all in one tank. They seem to now being selling freshwater rimless tanks.
> 
> CLEAR


I know somone with a reef waterbox aquarium. It is flawless.


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## Tim Harrison (26 Feb 2021)

Wookii said:


> Agreed, they are in serious need on an online makeover . . . hopefully @Aquariums4life will read this thread, as a forum sponsor . . .
> 
> This is their page that have the complete tank/cabinet option similar to the EA tanks: Aquariums4Life Aquarium Manufactures
> 
> Slightly more expensive that the EA tanks, but then, slightly larger tanks, thicker glass, and solid wood cabinets . . .



Their AquaVScape range looks like a good alternative to EA....





						Aquariums4Life Aquarium Manufactures
					

Leading Manufacturers of Standard and bespoke Aquariums. Outstanding Quality. Reef, marine, tropical and aqua scaped. Specialists in Steel Framed Cabinets.



					www.aquariums4life.co.uk


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## Alex Papp (26 Feb 2021)

shangman said:


> I noticed last time I want to my local shop The Aquatic Design Center in London that they seemed to be selling their own custom made optiwhite aquariums with stands, and on their website they have a calculator for custom tanks. I thought they seemed well made and reasonably priced though I wasn't paying it too much attention (kept staring at the fish instead), I know they have another side of the business making big special tanks for commercial spaces so it makes sense. If someone is looking for a tank they could send them an email. Next time I go there I will check out the prices and ask them about it. Could be good for people who are closer to London! Seems like local is the way to go with these shipping prices.


The organisation of that place is a mess.  The tanks are just ok. Messy silicone and a lot of bubbles in my tank. Bubbles! Took 4 months to come.
Then the cabinet they said they'd make never came @Seige that's why I still haven't assembled the hardscape I bought from the AG last year... or maybe over a year ago. It was pre coronavirus!


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## shangman (26 Feb 2021)

Alex Papp said:


> The organisation of that place is a mess.  The tanks are just ok. Messy silicone and a lot of bubbles in my tank. Bubbles! Took 4 months to come.
> Then the cabinet they said they'd make never came @Seige that's why I still haven't assembled the hardscape I bought from the shop last year... or maybe over a year ago. It was pre coronavirus!


Yikes! I was thinking I might get one via them at some point, thank you for pointing it out, what a big shame!!  

I hope you can get a cabinet soon so you can finally start your scape.


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## RudeDogg1 (26 Feb 2021)

Paul Kettless said:


> Honestly I’m not sure, as a customer you can only go by what information is given to you, and I have no idea of knowing if it is factual or not. I would like to hope that they have been upfront and honest. Complete Aquatics told me that at no time have they been instructed to not taken orders, and that in the first instance when I placed the order they were just waiting for stock delivery.
> 
> Either way it does now appear that there are big changes for the brand EA, and that yet again D&D get involved with a brand and the prices rocket.



Complete aquatics are a bloody nightmare they don’t have most the stuff they have for sale in stock despite the website saying otherwise. If u look on their feedback a lot of people say the same. I ordered my tank from them because they were the only place that said in stock. Took months then when it turned up the light was missing. Wasn’t until I chased them up that they said that was also out of stock but it was ok because it was deff gonna be there the end of the week. 2 weeks later no show. Ended up getting a refund and it arrived from aquarium gardens which arrived the following day. They gave me £40 worth of their loyalty points as an apology for being crap. The irony is when I spent them have of it ended up being out of stock


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