# LED period and Intensity



## Chrispy (23 Aug 2016)

I'm currently at day 16 of my new tank and have asked for advice on lighting in the journal I am writing.  Members have suggested I would be more likely to get a reply if I put the question in the appropriate forum, as opposed to my journal. Below is my original question:

Also if anyone has experience with GroBeam 1500 Ultima tiles I would appreciate any advice on duration and intensity for the first few weeks of setup.  I have 2 tiles, fixed to the lid of my tank, on a 8 channel controller.

CO2 on 0900
Lights on 1030 at 0% ramping up for 30 minutes to 70%
CO2 off 1600
Lights off 1700 at 70% ramping down 30 minutes to 0%
Air pump on 2000
Fert dose 2359 (Macro/Micr. None on day 7)
Air pump off 0800

Picture of the tank at Day 14View attachment 89113[/QUOTE]

I have been doing 50% water changes for the first 14 days and now doing 50% every other day for the next two weeks.  My drop checker is blue/green before the lights come on and green very soon afterwards.  All my plants are growing very well and , as yet, there are no signs of algae.
Since day 14 I've increased my lighting to 75% but kept the duration the same.

Any advice would be appreciated.
Chris.


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## zozo (24 Aug 2016)

I do not have experience with your type of lights, but stil even if i had it's realy hard to give proper advice on that, it's something you have to play with and try things.. Each tank lives its own live and goes through stages of development al depending the way it is setup. Plant sp. Type of substrate, water parameters, temperatur and flowto name a few..

It's best to find a stable schedule where you are satisfied with the results. In the first stage where a tanks is freshly setup, then your plants need first to go through a transplant shock and wont do much for a periode of time and only grow some roots and die off old leaves, this can be days or weeks. Secondly when the rootsystem has grown a bit and  is feeling happy in the substarte go through the transition from emersed to submersed, thats where you see new growth develop.

In this periode it's best to not give to much light, unfortunately there aint a percentage for that to give. Algae growth most likely is the first indicator for you and as long that is absent your on the right track..

Usualy i read the advice to not go over 6 hours for the startup periode..

In my experience with my 3 tanks all with different kind of led light setup. It aint the periode duration making the difference but the intensity.. So my personal experience and conclussion is differrent from that. But this difference is in the type of plants i'm growing.

Plants need light to grow and uttilize the ferts needed for that. And as long as there is light a plant will grow and use ferts. That's something we all can agree on..
But its in the type of plants you are growing and how you want them to grow. Do you have stem plants which tend to grow leggy and not as colorfull in long low light periods and need rather a lot of light to stay compact and develope color.. With these plants shorter periode with higher intensity is required, to prevent them from growing leggy. Do you have other types of plants requiring less intensity you can go down with intensity and extend the periode.. Since, as long as they have light they grow and there is nothing wrong with that.

Research and know your plants is the key to knowing about the proper light above your tank..

I have a little 25 litre low tech tank which has a 12 hour light periode with rather low light from day one and it never grew much algae other then some diatoms on the glass.


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## roadmaster (24 Aug 2016)

+one on intensity over duration.
Something to be said also I think for stability with regard's to lighting period.
Cannot say what level of light might trigger photosynthesis, but ramping up and or down, along with siesta period's, may do little or a lot with regard's to creating or hampering stable environment.(plant'sneed a period of darkness,fish too).
Many suggest straight 6 hour photoperiod with newly planted tank's and slowly over week's,can increase the number of hour's.(work's well for me)
Would try and place the 6 hour photo period to a time where I could get the most viewing time.
Have noted that many ADA tank's,Some here,Tom Barr's tank's,Amano's tank's may have capability to increase light intensity significantly,yet the light's are often hanging high above the surface of the water (less intensity?)
Me think's  there must be good cause, given light bleed into a room with fixture hung too high maybe  ?(my experience only)
Have seen no evidence that ramp up or down, or siesta period's with lighting produce better looking plant's.
Would take better performing plant's over my desire to view the tank at several times during the day.


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## zozo (24 Aug 2016)

I nice way to compare and understand how it works a bit.. Is looking at naturaly lit waters like clear ponds or a pond in your garden. Not realy about tropical plants tho some can be grown (also submersed) in our outside ponds if the condition allow it. These ponds start up naturaly when temps and light hours increase which is in springtime starting from march. So this starts with about a 12 hour periode of daylight and slowly getting towards a 18 hour periode in the summer and then go down again. And still it is possible even if the pond gets relatively lot of sun, to keep it clear (from algae) with very happy growing plants.

There aint a lamp invented yet exceding the suns (daylight) power.. And if it works with a pond if you do it al the right way.. Then you might ask the question.. Why should this be any different above an indoor tank?

I grew rotala's in my pond last year seeing it color in a way nearly impossible i guess to get this grow form in an indoor tank with artificial lights. At least not with the lights i'm using.

Again the only difference and limitations are in here is the choice of plants..


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## zozo (24 Aug 2016)

I just looked in my garden tub, to see if anything shows up again of this kind.
Here you see a Rotala Indica in the morning sun, close to the surface but submersed.




Funny is, emersed this plant is just green, only what grows submersed has this color.. 




And the longest day is already past us but still we have over 12 hours of light.. This tub gets relatively a lot of sun, but is so full with plants also floaters, there is not a spec of algae to be found.


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## Chrispy (24 Aug 2016)

Thank you Zozo and Roadmaster for your replies.
The picture in my original post above shows the plants that I have started this tank with.  As I'm new to high tech tanks I have chosen 'easy' stem plants that need strong to high light and are fast growing. The idea being they out compete algae for nutrients.  The only exception is the Vesicularia montagnei (Christmas Moss) which is tied onto the top of the cave I created.  As you can see from the picture everything appears to be growing well.  My only concern is that the Ludwigia repens and Ludwigia repens 'Ruben' have grown tall and are starting to loose some of their lower leaves.  I'm only in week 3 from first planning but maybe I should start to cut them back and encourage bushier growth?  I read a common cause of 'leggy' plants is not enough light; and that's why I wondered if I should up the intensity of the lights.  Yet I read on the forum of members using the Growbeam tiles at 20-30% and worrying that the intensity is too high?  It would be good to hear the experience of members who use the same lights.
Your advice on keeping the lighting period the same is very welcome and I will stick at 6 hours until I'm really confident the tank is matured and balanced.
I'm going to run for at least nine weeks before I move my fish over to the new tank so I hope all will be in balance by then.
Thank you both again,
Chris.


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## zozo (24 Aug 2016)

These are just things you have to try to find out.. Like increase the intensity with 5%, wait a 10 days or till you see changes and keep increasing it like that till you can no more.. There is no way to tell up front what it will do, even for someone with the same lights..  Just keep looking out like a hawk if you see things apear you don't want and if so go back a step or even a step further back or back where you came from.

The only thing with on off switches are the electrical equipment.. The rest can't be switch as fast and needs time.. Time to come and time to go.. Unfortunately algae usualy comes faster then it goes. But at least you see rather soon if it's increased to much..

It's the same with duration, if you plan to increase it do it slowly with 15 minutes every 14 days or some like it..


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## roadmaster (24 Aug 2016)

I can grow ludwigia Repen's in my low tech affair's and it really only look's good with good red color on tops and bottom of leaves once it as reached the surface.
I then cut down to where the leaves have begun to drop, and plant the top's that look good,/red,and discard the lower scraggly portion and begin again.
I wait until a fair bunch of it has grown along the surface before cutting it to re- plant, and try not to plant anything under it that need's much light so I can let it grow more along the surface.


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## Chrispy (25 Aug 2016)

roadmaster said:


> I can grow ludwigia Repen's in my low tech affair's and it really only look's good with good red color on tops and bottom of leaves once it as reached the surface.
> I then cut down to where the leaves have begun to drop, and plant the top's that look good,/red,and discard the lower scraggly portion and begin again.
> I wait until a fair bunch of it has grown along the surface before cutting it to re- plant, and try not to plant anything under it that need's much light so I can let it grow more along the surface.


I'm thinking I will do the same with the Ludwigia Repens.  It is growing really well and the leaves on the 'Rubins' are turning a orange/red.  It hasn't quite reached the surface yet but I think it will have by the weekend.  I may well experiment with just to few stems to start with and see how I go.  Thank you for your advice.
Chris.


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