# Discus tank



## Kogre (29 Apr 2013)

So I'm looking forward to my first planted tank and am looking to have discus as the centrepiece fish, between 9-12 of them.

The shoaling dither will be harlequin rasboras which I think are beautiful. Maybe about 30 of these. Maybe a second shoal of rummy nose tetras, 10-15.

For the lower levels, I'm considering mikrogeophagus (GBR/EBR) of sorts, either 4 or 6. If possible a very different apistogramma pair which will keep the number of rams down to 4. Also, a school of 6 trilineatus corydoras. Finally I'd like a feather tail betta if I can find a beautiful example of one.

That'll be the new fish, then I've got some migrants: a firemouth, black ghost knife fish and angelfish (I'll keep an eye on any nipping between the angels and discus, any issues I'll take the angels to the LFS).

I know its a big bioload for a planted tank, but this won't be from day one and the tank will be quite big, 68"Lx24"Wx30"H, giving me around 700-750 litres. With everything fully grown, there'll be loads of room in the tank still.

What do you think?


----------



## NanoJames (29 Apr 2013)

You'll have to remember about the fact that discus have to be kept at about 29 degrees celcius or there abouts. I don't know the recquirements of all of the fish in that list but you might need to make sure they can handle the high temps!


----------



## Kogre (29 Apr 2013)

The corydoras, tetras, harlequins and rams are all compatible temperature wise. I've seen angelfish with discus before and the rest of my fish I'll acclimatise. If the discus look like they're suffering, I'll get rid of whatever has the lowest temperature requirement until the discus look better. I'll be looking to keep them at 29-30° in slightly acidic to neutral water.


----------



## NanoJames (29 Apr 2013)

Fair enough! What sort of discus are you getting?


----------



## flygja (30 Apr 2013)

Just to share, I have a fully planted 300L tank and original had 4 discus but 3 of them died due to bullying. How many discus you can keep will depend on your planting.

Check out Filipe Olivera's 120L, 240L and 300L discus tanks - FAAO - Aquascaping
Also check out Korakot's discus tank on here - 240ltr Discus planted tank | UK Aquatic Plant Society


----------



## Kogre (30 Apr 2013)

Thanks *flygja*, I'll read up on those. Sorry to hear about your discus deaths. 

I'm hoping not to eat up a lot of space with plants but have enough for the discus to hide in whenever they're a little insecure.

*NJ* im not sure at the moment. I would prefer the same colour but missus wants a mix. I shall have to see what is available and how much of a budget I have when it finally comes time to buying!


----------



## Kogre (1 May 2013)

Does anyone have a discus tank?  Do you use a background?  What substrate do you use?  I understand that using a dark background and substrate can darken and dull the colours of discus so any advice or help would be appreciated.


----------



## roadmaster (1 May 2013)

I raised a group of juvenile Discus a couple year's ago.(Red turquoise,Red  Marlboro).


Five of them to start ,then two more  after a couple week's.(55 gal tank)
I kept the fish over sand(play sand) substrate, with some driftwood pieces and anubia attached to the wood.Painted the background of tank black.
To achieve the growth possible  with these large cichlid's,,I fed them three to five times a day, and this meant near daily 50 % water changes.(to remove organic's from frequent feeding's).
Fish achieved approx five and one half inches in a little over six month's from near quarter size juveniles.
Sterbai corydora's are the only cory's that will do well in the long term with temp's that discus thrive in.Rummy nose and cardinal tetra's ,Ditto.(a fewother's maybe).
Tried to lower the temp with Discus to allow for other species alongside the Discus, but the Discus became lethargic,and bloated due to I suppose decreased Metabolisim.
If I had it to do all over again,,I would raise the young fish in bare bottom tank which makes  cleaning up waste,poop easier.
Would get the planted tank established, and all problem' sorted before introducing the Discus.


----------



## Kogre (1 May 2013)

Thanks for the useful tips! I only have a 50 litre as a spare so don't know how to go about getting the juveniles to grow in a separate tank prior to being housed in the main tank. Could I wait for the planted tank to establish and then add juveniles to it? I'm guessing not.

What effect did the dark background have on the fish if any?


----------



## bridgey_c (1 May 2013)

I cant think of why it would be a problem to wait until the plants establish themselves before adding the discus? Surely it would only help with keeping the water quality high. Somebody more experienced will know more though.

Ive got a 7 month old planted discus tank running but its my first one so im a beginner without much history in tanks in general. In that time though I havent had one fish suffer any type of ill health ( apart from one discus I added later that had gill flukes). In my 55g Ive got 5 discus, 20 cardinals, a few ottos and a million shrimp. I didnt add the fish all in one go though. If I remember correctly I waited about 6 weeks before added the discus. Like roadmaster, I raised the discus from juveniles and that is the one thing I would change if I was to do it again. I know you save a lot of money by buying them small but you will save so much time and energy if you can afford to buy them at 3-4 inches. 

I used an aquasoil topped with gravel but as youngsters they struggled to pick food from off the gravel so I put in a sand area where they could graze from. I have got a black background and mine have coloured up great. I dont know your experience of discus etc but all I did was read, read and read. Go on the Stendker site and keep reading everything they say until it all makes sense...

I will help you however I can though.


----------



## Kogre (1 May 2013)

Much appreciated, *bridgey_c*.

Do you have the same kind of discus or various types? Do you have pictures of your tank/discus?

I'm really new to this but want to get it right first time.


----------



## Kogre (1 May 2013)

Sorry, phone won't let me see the edit window...

What's the URL for the Stendker site?


----------



## bridgey_c (1 May 2013)

DISKUSZUCHT STENDKER GMBH & CO. KG - Diskusfische - Diskusfutter - Diskus- und Aquaristik-Informationen

Another thing I would advise is to buy your discus from a breeder with similar water parameters to your own, in fact I would say this is very important....(but I could be wrong!?) 

Oh and I have 5 various strains. I wanted just blue turqs but part of the bargaining with the missus was to let her make a few decisions. I soon got rid of her cherry barbs though!! kept chasing my shrimp..


----------



## sciencefiction (2 May 2013)

From what I understand and as already suggested, you may have a problem raising young discus in a planted tank, even established one. They eat a lot, they are messy eaters, lots of the 3-4 time meals a day will rot inside the tank and they can't tolerate high organics. From a planted tank it will be hard to remove even with the daily water changes one should be doing. So the best is to either buy them as big as you can afford, or raise them in a bare bottom with daily water changes and a lot of feeding, then move them to your display tank when adults.
It's also better if you buy them all from the same place as it will avoid cross contamination. They can be kept in tap water just fine depending on where you got them from.



> Sterbai corydora's are the only cory's that will do well in the long term with temp's that discus thrive in.


 
From what I know there are other species of corys that tolerate higher temperatures as well as sterbai:
oiapoquensis, goessi, suessi, haraldschultzei, adolfoi(possibly duplicareus too)

Here is an old article too from coryman himself:
/articles/authors/i_fuller/


----------



## Kogre (2 May 2013)

Thanks for the feedback on tankmates; I'm pretty much 95% on them and have been since the beginning of the thread anyway.

I might look into the type of corydoras I end up with though, I quite liked the trilineatus but am not sure whether I'll be able to get them.

I think Maidenhead had a few but all of their corys were ridiculously expensive.


----------



## dw1305 (2 May 2013)

Hi all,


sciencefiction said:


> From what I know there are other species of corys that tolerate higher temperatures as well as sterbai: oiapoquensis, goessi, suessi, haraldschultzei, adolfoi(possibly duplicareus too) Here is an old article too from coryman himself: /articles/authors/i_fuller/


Useful list, straight from the font of wisdom for all things Cory. _C. adolfoi_ are fine at higher temperatures as well, a lot of _Hypancistrus_ keepers keep them with L46 etc.


Kogre said:


> I quite liked the trilineatus but am not sure whether I'll be able to get them.


Nearly every shop sells them, but labelled as "_C. jullii_".


sciencefiction said:


> From what I understand and as already suggested, you may have a problem raising young discus in a planted tank, even established one. They eat a lot, they are messy eaters, lots of the 3-4 time meals a day will rot inside the tank and they can't tolerate high organics. From a planted tank it will be hard to remove even with the daily water changes one should be doing. So the best is to either buy them as big as you can afford, or raise them in a bare bottom with daily water changes and a lot of feeding, then move them to your display tank when adults.


This is honestly a myth, all fish are better in planted tanks (and I really mean all, even if the fish have to be physically separated from the plants, and by plants I mean  any photosynthetic organisms), the same also applies to a substrate, there are plenty of advantages, and very few disadvantages.

A lot of successful breeders use bare bottom tanks, are OCD about cleanliness, feed with beef-heart and do huge water changes, but there is a reason for this, they have a specific aim (as fast a growth as possible), to stop their fish "growing out of profit". You can think of it as like battery farming chickens.

Once you have a bare tank you are obliged to keep the tank really clean and do lots of water changes, because you don't have any spare filtration capacity or inherent stability in your system, but this doesn't make it the only way to keep them, or the best system.

If you work from the assumption that Discus originate in very clean, nutrient poor clear and black waters, where food is in short supply and they will eat whatever is available, you can then tailor the tank to their requirements, which aren't necessarily the same as those of a commercial breeder. If you keep away from a beef-heart based diet you can feed them a more natural diet, and a lot of problems disappear.

I'd really recommend having a look at Larry Waybright's ("Apistomaster") Discus threads on various forums ("simplydiscus" etc), he is some-one for whom I have the greatest respect.

Here is his Heckel Discus thread at the "cichlid room companion" <The Cichlid Room Companion • View topic - Heckel Discus "biotope" tank>, and a "Nhamunda Blue" thread: <The Cichlid Room Companion • View topic - New photos of some of my discus>.

cheers Darrel


----------



## roadmaster (2 May 2013)

Kogre said:


> Thanks for the useful tips! I only have a 50 litre as a spare so don't know how to go about getting the juveniles to grow in a separate tank prior to being housed in the main tank. Could I wait for the planted tank to establish and then add juveniles to it? I'm guessing not.
> 
> What effect did the dark background have on the fish if any?


 
As mentioned,,I kept the young fish over sand, and plant's (anubia) were attached to wood, which I could easily remove to clean the substrate.
Could use potted plant's as well.
Also employed floating plant's to help diffuse light which they did not much care for,and to help with water quality .
I managed to raise the fish without offering Beefheart,blood worm's,but did offer wide variety of protein; rich food's from Ocean nutrition (nearly 55% protein),to Spirulina pellet's,bit's of earthworm's,meal worm's, Dried marine algae hung from veggie clip,cichlid pellet's,Tetra bit's,Fluker's freeze dried cricket's (as Adult fish).
I was not trying to breed the fish,simply wishing to see the fish achieve their potential without resorting to purist's method's .(Bare bottom)
Black background and floating plant's seemed to help the fish be less skittish from the beginning,and in my expieriences ,,nearly all fishes respond favorably to dimmer lighting as opposed to mega watt's that some run over planted tank's.
As to the Corydora's,, I have no doubt as mentioned,,that maybe a few more species will tolerate(perhap's not thrive) in the temp's that Discus enjoy, but by and large,,my expieriences since early 1970's ,have proved to me anyway, that given ideal water conditon's,good diet,,that the majority of this species(have kept many) ,will live longer at cooler temperatures closer to the middle range of most published temp ranges.Ditto for Ancistrus.
This is easy to test for oneself ,if one were so inclined. (I did).


----------



## sciencefiction (2 May 2013)

> A lot of successful breeders use bare bottom tanks, are OCD about cleanliness, feed with beef-heart and do huge water changes, but there is a reason for this, they have a specific aim (as fast a growth as possible), to stop their fish "growing out of profit". You can think of it as like battery farming chickens.
> 
> Once you have a bare tank you are obliged to keep the tank really clean and do lots of water changes, because you don't have any spare filtration capacity or inherent stability in your system, but this doesn't make it the only way to keep them, or the best system.


 
He, he. I like the chicken comparisson. It's essentially like that I suppose considering discus in captivity are actually grown bigger than the ones in nature.
One has to evaluate all points and see what works best for them and the fish, including the food given. Discus are quite expensive too so it's a decision to make. I personally dislike bare bottom tanks even for raising fry.


----------



## Kogre (2 May 2013)

You guys are like sages!  Thanks for the links and keep all the information coming (I'll have a read of the linked threads in the evening).

I was originally planning black background and aqua soil (which isn't quite black but does look dark) but then came across information about colours on discus darkening and peppering in some cases.  I take it nobody here has experienced this?  I may need to cap the aqua soil with PFS but then if I do end up planting into the substrate I imagine it'll be a mess when moving things.  At least the discus would colour well?

I've got an order on a tank and need to know for sure whether or not to get a background.


----------



## roadmaster (2 May 2013)

Fishes color's to me,, seem to wash out, or fade with light colored substrates,background's,higher lighting,at least initially.
Maybe they become used to it after a while,? but Dark colored substrates ,background's ,appear to be well received by most of the fishes I have kept.(comfort).
Other than Stress Bar's appearing when fish were new to the tank,,they colored nicely with play sand and black background.
Believe coloring of fish can be more directly tied to diet,Water quality,Genetic's.


----------



## Kogre (3 May 2013)

Will discus be okay in a tank with 1850l/h from a 2078 and 2300l/h from an FX5?

I think I'll go with a black background afterall but may cap my aquasoil with PFS.


----------



## roadmaster (3 May 2013)

I think the water movement would be a bit much for the Discus .
Could try just one filter, and see how thing's go.I think for these fish,,the FX5 would be plenty.
If sand is smaller grain than the aquasoil? then more than a little sand will eventually find it's way to the bottom and throughout the aquasoil.


----------



## Kogre (3 May 2013)

I've been looking into substrate still, Akadama topped with PFS is what I'm beginning to lean towards and it'll keep costs down.  I may use greenhouse shading to seperate one layer from another; roots will still be able to get to the bottom layer; that is if the akadama is courser than the PFS.

I may use two filters with the flow turned right the way down and do lots more water changes.


----------



## flygja (5 May 2013)

This sounds like its gonna a really great tank! What I've always dreamed of. Unfortunately I don't have time to feed my discus more than once a day because I leave for work at 6.30 in the morning and won't be back till 6 in the evening. Lights out at 10. Also not willing to feed beef heart so my discus don't grow at all.

I have a black background with ADA Amazonia at the back and white play sand in front. I made a mistake of putting in Congo Tetras before adding the discus, which I think spooked them out and made them shy. Also, i think an excess of CO2 killed at least one of them. Wasn't enough to gas all the other fish, but the discus became lethargic and feel sick. My discus were also constantly looking for shade to hide under!


----------



## Kogre (5 May 2013)

How high was your CO2 in ppm? I'm looking to achieve around 25ppm. It'll take a while to build up to that as the tank is big, so light can slowly be phased to its highest brightness.

Lighting is a huge problem for me as I'll have loads of it (TMC Gro tiles) but use tall leaning grass and floaters to shade areas. The tank will definitely have to have matured by the time I add discus. I'm in no hurry anyway, this project may take me up to September/October before I've bought everything I need anyway so at least another 6-12 months before discus are added.

As for feeding you don't need to give beef heart, just high protein diet will do it. I think a singular diet would be boring for the fish anyway. My hours away from home are similar to your own but I may use an auto feeder to supplement a midday meal. This only needs to be done while they're in the adolescent stages to boost their growth rate. When they're mature you should be okay to dial back the feedings.

Is there any reason why you're against feeding beef heart?


----------



## Dan (6 May 2013)

Kogre said:


> You guys are like sages! Thanks for the links and keep all the information coming (I'll have a read of the linked threads in the evening).
> 
> I was originally planning black background and aqua soil (which isn't quite black but does look dark) but then came across information about colours on discus darkening and peppering in some cases. I take it nobody here has experienced this? I may need to cap the aqua soil with PFS but then if I do end up planting into the substrate I imagine it'll be a mess when moving things. At least the discus would colour well?
> 
> I've got an order on a tank and need to know for sure whether or not to get a background.


 
The dark background and black substrate may effect the fish slightly, but not as much as water quality/ good food and general happiness of your fish.
Over the past couple of years I've basically done exactly what your planning on doing but on a slightly smaller scale. What i would say is that if peppering is something you wish to avoid, your best off not going for Pigeon Blood Varients of Discus. These fish are likely to show some peppering under ideal conditions and adding things into consideration like poor stock/water quality/stress/dark substrate and background could possibly make them pepper quite badly. However on the other hand my breeding male lives in a planted tank with black substrate and background and shows very little peppering because he was quality stock to start out with.

So your best off sticking with things like Turq's, Snakeskins and Cobalts. And possibly avoiding the likes of any PB varient/Red Melons/Red Marlborough etc. Any that has come from PB genes.


----------



## Dan (6 May 2013)

dw1305 said:


> This is honestly a myth, all fish are better in planted tanks (and I really mean all, even if the fish have to be physically separated from the plants, and by plants I mean any photosynthetic organisms), the same also applies to a substrate, there are plenty of advantages, and very few disadvantages.
> 
> A lot of successful breeders use bare bottom tanks, are OCD about cleanliness, feed with beef-heart and do huge water changes, but there is a reason for this, they have a specific aim (as fast a growth as possible), to stop their fish "growing out of profit". You can think of it as like battery farming chickens.
> 
> ...


 
This ^^
My group was raised getting 2 feeds a day and 1 30% water change per week. No deaths, and only parted with most the group as the 2 largest paired up and kicked seven bells out of the rest. 
One thing i would highly recommend however would be a purchase of a HMA filter. Will make things a zillion times easier and it was the best purchase i ever made.


----------



## roadmaster (7 May 2013)

Raised the group of juveniles I mentioned, with two Hydro IV sponge filter's powered with Luft air pump, and Aquaclear110 HOB filter.


----------



## Kogre (7 May 2013)

I'll be getting discus for my tank once its matured and as the tank needs lots of flow and co2 to help boost the growth rate of the plants, I'll be using two big filters.

Once the tank has matured can I dial back flow and co2 or will the plants suffer?


----------



## roadmaster (7 May 2013)

Sorry can't help with CO2 ,it still scares me a bit. I think if it was done slowly,and lighting was not too strong,,that growth would just slow down.
If done quickly,,I shudder to think..


----------



## Dan (7 May 2013)

I would think there is some middle ground that would be fine for both plants and Discus. I wouldn't have thought it needs to be like a whirlpool to get the plants to grow. 
On my 400 litre tank i have a 1400 lph external and a 2000lph external and the flow isn't to bad for the Discus, especially with spray bars fitted, but still gets decent circulation and allows to me play around so i don't get any dead spots.


----------



## Kogre (7 May 2013)

This will be in the region of 198 gallons and I'm looking to have an Eheim 2078 and an FX5. That might not turn over as much water as yours but I'm hoping it should be sufficient. If discus are okay in the tank with those filters (and I'll only know if I try) then I should be okay, providing there aren't any dead spots as you said.

By the way what's a HMA filter? Is it like an RO unit


----------



## Dan (7 May 2013)

Similar, i think its short for Heavy Metal Axe, It basically does what a good water condition does, but instead of binding the heavy metals its removes them, along with Chloamine/Chlorine etc. It will save you so much expense and heartache with dead Discus lol.
I'm not sure if your in the UK or not but the guy i buy all my Discus related stuff from has them for a excellent price at the moment.


----------



## Kogre (7 May 2013)

I live in Derby and work in Birmingham. At present, I don't even have the tank yet. All I have is the desire, some upcoming disposable cash as a result of quitting smoking cold turkey and a very understanding and wonderfully beautiful wife. I've put down a deposit on a tank from ND Aquatics and it has a 6-8 week lead time. That's the first step towards my commitment to a beautiful aquarium.

I'm guessing it'll be August by the time I've bought everything I need for the tank bar the fish. Then once its done cycling I'll add dither fish and some rams/apistogrammas and corydoras. I may acclimate my fire mouth and black ghost knife fish to the new tank so at least I have something to look at until the angels are in. 

Once I've planted I'll want the tank to have matured  before adding discus, and I'd rather have either all mixed wild purchased at roughly the same size or mixed wild/domestic. I may either save and buy 12-15 discus or buy them at different times as and when I find something appealing.

If this isn't the way to go about it, let me know.

Will I need a large water butt on the end of a HMA filter? The tanks huge man.


----------



## Dan (7 May 2013)

I've done it both ways regarding water changes, i've got a 200 litre barrel that i used to use, i would fill it up and leave it running with a heater/air pump and then use a large pump to get it into the tank (the barrel was in the shed). Unfortunately when i moved this was no longer viable due to no space to keep the barrell so now i simply run the HMA straight into the tank, i also fill a couple of kettles full of HMA water and boil it so that the temp doesn't drop to much. I do 30% water change weekly on 400 litres, that combined with a couple of kettles full drops my temps from 28 Celsius to around 25.5-26. Fish don't mind and it gets back to temp within a few hours.


----------



## Dan (7 May 2013)

Oh and regarding your stocking. If your planning on buying young Discus you will have a uphill battle keeping the likes of Angel's and Firemouth with them. Its highly unlikely the Discus will be able to compete with those guys for food, and you will probably only have limited success. You do have a large tank and may be able to work around it by tempting the aggressive feeders to one end and feeding the less aggressive at the other, but it will be difficult. If you can afford to buy adults (or at least 4.5" +fish) you will stand a much better chance of success.


----------



## Kogre (8 May 2013)

I could keep the fire mouth and angels in the tank they're currently in until the discus grow out, or get rid of them and buy juveniles once the discus have grown?


----------



## Dan (8 May 2013)

Yes that sounds more sensible, There is always going to be a risk involved with mixing Cichlids, but if you had somewhere to keep the angels/firemouth separate until the Discus got to young Adult size that would give you a better chance. I would never say "get rid" as like anything its a learning curve and what works for one might not for another. Just make sure you have a plan B.


----------



## Kogre (8 May 2013)

I've read into HMA filters and am beginning to like the sound of them. 

Can anyone confirm whether using one changes the pH in a detrimental way? 

The cost of this project is slowly creeping up!  I'd rather pay up now than pay later on down the road though.


----------



## dw1305 (8 May 2013)

Hi all,


Kogre said:


> Can anyone confirm whether using one changes the pH in a detrimental way?


They don't effect carbonate hardness, so pH shouldn't be altered. They are just basically a super-duper carbon filter.

A lot of people who use RO for Discus etc, and have hard tap water, use a HMA filter to filter the tap that they then cut their RO with to give them some dGH/dKH.

cheers Darrel


----------



## Kogre (9 May 2013)

Are there any problems with keeping wild discus with domestic strains?


----------



## roadmaster (9 May 2013)

Wild Discus may be a bit more sensitive to GH,KH, so may want to store water to ensure stability before use, and replace R/O membranes on regular basis.
Domestic Discus,much more forgiving with regard's to water chemistry.IMHO


----------



## Dan (9 May 2013)

I wouldn't suggest going for Wild Discus yet, as Roadmaster said they are a lot less forgiving. Given your questions regarding tank mates/ water etc, i would say your almost guaranteed to have a exceptionally expensive flop that will probably put you off having Discus in the future.
My advice would be to be find a quality local Discus supplier (Not chain stores) and buy all your Discus from one guy, not only will you get much better quality, they will be a ton cheaper. For example my local Pet shop and chain stores sell small Discus for around £40-50 quid a fish, my local specialist sells the same size but better quality for around a tenner. There can also be issues mixing strains bred from different areas ie German/Czech/Asian and i would imagine adding Wild into the mix only complicates things further which isn't something i'd recommend for someone getting the hang of things.


----------



## Kogre (9 May 2013)

Great replies, I guess I'll stick to domestic bred, then I don't need to mess about with an RO filter; just the HMA filter. 

I've been looking online and there were very few domestic strains that I like.  I'm not up to scratch on discus names but I've seen some deep oranges with vertical banding, deep blue with vertical banding and solid yellow/gold ones that I like.  Everything else will probably send me and my missus into a fit from all the bright colours.  I had a look at discosmodo's wild strains and instantly fell in love with the Rio Japura and Tefe Green.  Just wow.  If there was a domestic strain of something like that, I would snap it up in an instant.

Chens discus are ridiculously priced, I've found.  Any reputable breeders recommended?


----------



## roadmaster (9 May 2013)

SimplyDiscus .com ,there are some trusted sources there.(Kenny)


----------



## sciencefiction (9 May 2013)

Try to find a place where they are kept in water similar to your tap water. Then you won't have issues and it's a great idea buying them all from one place too, so you don't cross contaminate them in case you don't get lucky with one. I am living in Ireland but around here it's quite easy to find a breeder for decent prices and good quality too. I wouldn't buy from chain store.

I don't know what these are called, but I love their colour. They seem to be still babies.


----------



## Dan (9 May 2013)

Its strange to hear that Chen's are expensive, that's where all my Discus originally came from and are quite reasonable in price. What you have to take into account is that from strain to strain the price can vary massively. 
As far as reputable breeders i would suggest taking a look on such sites as aquarist-classifieds.co.uk and search the counties around yourself. Most likely one of them will have a good Discus trader.
You also can't go far wrong if you join a good Discus forum. Simply Discus is a solid forum but mainly Yankies. Bidka.org is a good uk forum, and also has solid links to most the uk traders.


----------



## Kogre (9 May 2013)

I'll check out some of the links posted above once I get home.

Check these out... Are there domestic breeds that look anything like these that you know of:

wild


----------



## Dan (9 May 2013)

Possibly Red Alenquer, which happen to be a "cheap" strain, or maybe Red Turquoise.


----------



## Kogre (15 May 2013)

Just a thought, but with the fairly chunky bioload in a planted community tank, will cleaning the substrate become a hassle as the tank matures?  I'm not sure whether I'll have the whole of the substrate engulfed in some kind of carpet plant yet.

How have some of you handled it?


----------



## Juliusz (15 May 2013)

I don't know where you are based, but in St. Albans there is a guy called Artur (his offer is listed on ebay). You could get a decent youngster for 8-10 pounds. And it is fun to watch them growing and fighting for food. They are always hungry - I think during weekends I feed them 7 times a day (small portions) just to see how brutal they are.


----------



## Kogre (15 May 2013)

Many thanks for the heads up. 

I would imagine loads of water changes with seven feeds in a day!

I couldn't find Artur on eBay. Do you have a link to his seller account?

Other than the cleaning issue I raised earlier, I understand F0s are difficult to keep, how about F1s?


----------

