# A Little Slice Of Nature



## Deano3 (19 Jul 2020)

Hi everyone just thought would make a start on my new journal  , it will be a while before plant as currently decorating house and very busy but hopefully get a chance to start some hardscapes and play around.

Specs.
Tank-EA aquascaper 900 with concrete grey cabinet.
Filter-oase biomaster 600 thermo (until newer model that is more powerful that george mentioned is coming soon comes out) with aquascaper lilly pipes
Lighting-twinstar 900s
Extras-Twinstar sterilizer
Co2-Pressurised co2 with co2 art dual stage reg and inline diffuser
Ferts-APF EI starter kit

Hardscape will be manzinita wood and mini landscape rock.

Substrate will be tropica aquarium soil and sand. I wil be going for triangle composition again as like a bit negative and open space and hopfully plenty of plants and keep manageable and i am hoping some reds .

A few pics below to start hope you all enjoy as i enjoy all your jurnals and sure i will need plenty of help along the way.

Dean











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## Ed Wiser (19 Jul 2020)

Every nice set EA make great tanks and stands.


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## Melll (19 Jul 2020)

Looking forward to watching this develop


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## oscar (21 Jul 2020)

Yep I second that


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## CooKieS (22 Jul 2020)

Fantastic equipment


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## LondonDragon (22 Jul 2020)

AE A900 everywhere


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## Tim Harrison (22 Jul 2020)

Very nice Dean


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## SRP3006 (22 Jul 2020)

Watching this one with interest, mine will be delivered in the coming weeks. Sudden influx of as900s


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## Deano3 (22 Jul 2020)

i noticed there is a few now so feel under pressure  also for anyone interested i emailed EA about the overhang on side peices and front peice of glass and its totally normal as the bottom peice is fully supported around edge by the frame and sylicone must be enough for the outward pressure of sides and front and back so gives a bit peice of mind.

And yes i have purchased good hardware as it worked for me last time and reliable brands, just hope the oase 600 is enough but hoping to hear more about a new model coming out soon and if so i can upgrade.

I am going to fill with water later to test as i have leveld best i can and more or less level . 

Thanks for all kinds words and all your help for me to get to this exiting point, should be finished decorating soon hopefully but house still upside down.

Dean



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## Deano3 (22 Jul 2020)

SRP3006 said:


> Watching this one with interest, mine will be delivered in the coming weeks. Sudden influx of as900s


You will be very impressed with quality of the AS 900 and litterally just legs to screw in that is it the cabinet and frame is very light and look great looking forward to your jurnal mate

Dean

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## Deano3 (22 Jul 2020)

Also got this little beauty for filling so no more buckets 



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## CooKieS (22 Jul 2020)

What’s you plan to water change the 900?


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## Deano3 (22 Jul 2020)

CooKieS said:


> What’s you plan to water change the 900?


Syphon straight into garden then put bucket in sink use mixer tap to get to temperature and use the above pump in bottom of bucket to pump into aquarium so no more buckets.

Dean

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## CooKieS (23 Jul 2020)

Deano3 said:


> Syphon straight into garden then put bucket in sink use mixer tap to get to temperature and use the above pump in bottom of bucket to pump into aquarium so no more buckets.
> 
> Dean
> 
> Sent from my SM-T510 using Tapatalk



that’s my plan too for the 80p


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## Ady34 (24 Jul 2020)

Awesome tank Dean. I slightly envy your tank on a hard floor as you will get no issue when trying to open the doors (I have thick carpet issues)  
Look forward to following the journal mate, some nice equipment and making water changes easier is definitely a good thing


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## hypnogogia (24 Jul 2020)

Deano3 said:


> Also got this little beauty for filling so no more buckets
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my SM-G970F using Tapatalk


Makes such a difference.  You won’t know what to do with all the time you save.


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## Ray (25 Jul 2020)

Deano3 said:


> I am going to fill with water later to test as i have leveld best i can and more or less level .


Going to run a dark cycle while you finish the decorating?


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## Deano3 (25 Jul 2020)

Ray said:


> Going to run a dark cycle while you finish the decorating?


Hhhmmmm not sure i havnt even messed around with hardscape yet i am wondering if i should leave full and put my manzi wood in there to soak for few weeks or just put them km blue bucket there are already in, filled today to test for leaks and seems all ok , does a dark start start the biological bacteria off.

Thanks dean



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## Deano3 (25 Jul 2020)

hypnogogia said:


> Makes such a difference. You won’t know what to do with all the time you save.


Yeah it worked a treat mate  

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## hypnogogia (25 Jul 2020)

Deano3 said:


> Yeah it worked a treat mate //emoji.tapatalk-cdn.com/emoji106.png


About to do my water change.  I used to lug 6x25l cans around.  Now I use pump to pump water from rainwater butt into a tub by tank.  Leave over night with a filter.  Pump tank water into garden and fresh water into tank.  140lt water change in about 40 minutes.


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## Ray (25 Jul 2020)

Deano3 said:


> does a dark start start the biological bacteria off.


Yes.  Green Machine talk about it in thier book - they do the hardscape, let it run a month without lights so the tank can cycle, then plant.
If you don't have enough mature filter media to seed the new filter, it could be worth running a fishless cycle while you wait.


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## CooKieS (25 Jul 2020)

Ray said:


> Yes.  Green Machine talk about it in thier book - they do the hardscape, let it run a month without lights so the tank can cycle, then plant.
> If you don't have enough mature filter media to seed the new filter, it could be worth running a fishless cycle while you wait.



I’ll do blackstart too, that’s an great technique


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## Deano3 (26 Jul 2020)

Think i will do a blackstart guys but i decided to soak the manzinita wood in aquarium to get to sink, hopfully tannins dont stain the silicon etc inam going to soak until sinks then i have a play with the hardscape then darkstart 

Will that be ok you think ?








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## Deano3 (27 Jul 2020)

The water in tank is full on tannin and very brown would you change water every few days while soak the wood ?

Thanks dean 

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## dw1305 (27 Jul 2020)

Hi all, 





Deano3 said:


> would you change water every few days while soak the wood ?


I would.

cheers Darrel


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## Nick72 (27 Jul 2020)

I would move that wood into a big plastic container / bucket and keep it outdoors.

It's going to stink in a few days and a plastic container is lighter and easier to clean.


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## LondonDragon (27 Jul 2020)

Nick72 said:


> I would move that wood into a big plastic container / bucket and keep it outdoors.


Agreed, I soaked mine in the tank but had the filter running


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## Deano3 (28 Jul 2020)

Ok thanks everyone i will get moved today and soak outside just hope doesnt get full of bugs etc as only have opentop containers. 

Thanks everyone 

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## Melll (28 Jul 2020)

I have wood soaking outside in a tub and in a plastic dustbin as well as a couple of larger pieces that will not fit in those soaking in a tank with the filter running.  So far no visible bugs on the outside tubbed wood, just some very panicked spiders when they realised their home was about to be submerged


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## Siege (28 Jul 2020)

Deano3 said:


> Ok thanks everyone i will get moved today and soak outside just hope doesnt get full of bugs etc as only have opentop containers.
> 
> Thanks everyone
> 
> Sent from my SM-G970F using Tapatalk



Why soak it?

Can you not arrange your hardscape and glue all the wood down?


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## Deano3 (28 Jul 2020)

Siege said:


> Why soak it?
> 
> Can you not arrange your hardscape and glue all the wood down?


I thought may be better to soak and hopefully dont have to glue it mate and no problem as in no rush.

Sure there is enough wood anyway  

Cant wait to try some scapes out.
And secondly using is pump is so convenient and easy such a pleasure  

Dean





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## dw1305 (28 Jul 2020)

Hi all, 





Deano3 said:


> just hope doesnt get full of bugs etc


I wouldn't worry about that, it is only likely to be non-biting midges and their larvae are "blood-worms", so free food. If you get Mosquito larvae they don't cling to the wood, so you will leave them behind when you take the wood out. 

cheers Darrel


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## CooKieS (28 Jul 2020)

Always better to soak, release all the excess nutrients, dirt , tannins and reduce the mold on the wood when starting the tank.


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## Deano3 (28 Jul 2020)

Im the bucket now thanks eveyone well most of it is in the box some sticks out but better than nothing. And water was brown after 1 day in tank hopefully clears i will change water ever couple lf days

Dean

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## Deano3 (8 Sep 2020)

Hi everyone ok so wanting to get planted ordered for early next week how does the list below look i want mainly easier plants and some nice colors, how do you feel about the amounts ?

tropica ludwigia palustris x2
tropica limnophila hippuridoides x2
tropica rotala h'ra x2
tropica 1-2 cryptocoryne undulatus red x2
tropica bucephlandra kedagang x2
tropica bucephlandra sp red x2
tropica bucephlandra wavy green x2
tropica microsorum pteropus trident x3
tropica 1-2 monte carlo x4
tropica hygrophila pinitifida x1 (only 1 in stock will get more)
tropica simensis 53B x2
aquaflora cryptocoryne tropica x2
(please mind any spelling misstakes)

i am hoping to buy a large batch of anubia nana and petit from a forum member and waiting to take some more anubias and bucephlandra from my 45P will this be ok to do in small amounts.

please let me know what you think and also what moss is best thats sticks together and doesnt overtake whole tank .

thanks dean


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## SRP3006 (8 Sep 2020)

Looks good Dean, lots of stem plants. What sort of layout are you going for?
Maybe order an extra pot of monte carlo, mine is part melting so wish I had.

Weeping moss is a nice moss, much slower than java and fine to put up high in water column.


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## Deano3 (8 Sep 2020)

SRP3006 said:


> Looks good Dean, lots of stem plants. What sort of layout are you going for?
> Maybe order an extra pot of monte carlo, mine is part melting so wish I had.
> 
> Weeping moss is a nice moss, much slower than java and fine to put up high in water column.


Thats mate will order couple potts of moss aswel  i will be taking some crypts etc from my 45 aswel and most of the plants actually.



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## Deano3 (16 Sep 2020)

Hi everyone plants arrived and got planted yesterday still not got lights on today as trying to get co2 drop checker green and pouring co2 into the tank . Here are some pics of the process. I tried hardscapes monday but wasnt happy so tried again tuesday and went back to horizon for more rocks and quite happy with it now.

Hardscape is manzinita wood and mini landscape rock in a sort of triangle composition. I have smaller stones to add around the edges one settles.

Here are a few pics from the process, i nearly give up and covered in soil but glad i didnt as this was my original idea.

Used jbl lava and around 2 bags of tropica or just a little less.

Quite happy with end result hope you like it.

Some of rotala pots were bulging out what i was happy with, did large water change this morning and will do all week and dosed with 35ml of macro mix. I will keep eye out for any melt etc, if crypts melt etc should i syphon the deal leaves away ?

Still waiting on some anubias to come sent by a fellow member and put in some plants from my 45p.

Any comments welcome 































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## Deano3 (16 Sep 2020)

Twinstar running



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## SRP3006 (16 Sep 2020)

I like it Dean, looks good. I like the scape, (no constructive criticism as I don't know anything about scaping) 

They are lovely tanks, love the cabinet, especially without the middle bit of wood.

My crypts melted (pygmea), the rest were fine. I just used a turkey baster and siphon. I found 4 hours to be a good time for my co2 to come on, nice and yellow at lights on, could just be me tho  ( I had to have the water closer to the rim to hit the high co2 tho. 

Hopefully those plants turn up soon,


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## Deano3 (16 Sep 2020)

SRP3006 said:


> I like it Dean, looks good. I like the scape, (no constructive criticism as I don't know anything about scaping)
> 
> They are lovely tanks, love the cabinet, especially without the middle bit of wood.
> 
> ...


I have just changed my co2 to come on 4 hours before lights and hopefully works better and yeah hopefully plants land tomorro and will get straight in tank.

Thanks i am hoping for a nice triangle once plants grow in and wanted a nice bit height from the wood, i know not amazing but i like it and cover rocks and wood in epiphyte plants and will blend in well .

Doing water change i literally just drained the water and wiped glass nothing else (so easy with pump ) then dosed 35ml of macro is that what you did for first week mate ?
Dean

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## SRP3006 (16 Sep 2020)

Deano3 said:


> Doing water change i literally just drained the water and wiped glass nothing else (so easy with pump ) then dosed 35ml of macro is that what you did for first week mate ?
> Dean
> 
> Sent from my SM-G970F using Tapatalk



Nice and easy with a pump isn't it, much easier for me being 200+litres less. I dosed straight away with full EI as per APFUK on alternate days, then I switched over to @LondonDragon formula to get me started on DIY all in one mixtures. Seems to going OK at the moment but to be honest I'm not completely sure what I need to look out for anyway. 
I also dosed a little dry magnesium (epsom salts) after the daily water changes as I read this can help the plants, not sure where I read it though.


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## Deano3 (16 Sep 2020)

Yeah i will stick with EI for now and dose alternate days keep it simple hopefully doesnt lack in anything as changing 80 percent or so of the water.

Dean

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## LondonDragon (16 Sep 2020)

SRP3006 said:


> I also dosed a little dry magnesium (epsom salts) after the daily water changes as I read this can help the plants, not sure where I read it though.


If you're using my formula there is plenty of  magnesium in there already no need to add more


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## alto (16 Sep 2020)

Gorgeous tank and I’m sooooo jealous of that manzanita - don’t hide the wood too much 

I’d break up that 1-2-grow H pinnatifida so it looks more natural - it will grow out from even the small pieces
(definitely no need for a second pot unless you’re just impatient)
Assuming you’re going for a bit of a wild look, I’d add some Juncus repens (mixed in with stems Filipe Oliveira style) and might swap out the Siamensis 53B (though this is a good nutrient indicator plant) for Rotala green at some point - wait for everything to grow in before deciding

As soon as you see a crypt leaf showing first sign of melt, just trim and remove - no need to wait until it’s sludge, melt never just goes partway


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## DannyH (16 Sep 2020)

Hey Dean,
Looking good. are you just sitting the ahem pump in your sink?
Danny


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## Deano3 (17 Sep 2020)

alto said:


> Gorgeous tank and I’m sooooo jealous of that manzanita - don’t hide the wood too much
> 
> I’d break up that 1-2-grow H pinnatifida so it looks more natural - it will grow out from even the small pieces
> (definitely no need for a second pot unless you’re just impatient)
> ...


Thanks mate appreciate that and i will eventually take out the 53b just using it as a fast grower for now, i have a few loveley peices but couldnt get to work and defently want the wild look, i will try splitting the pinitifida aswel i also could have split the moss more to be honest.

Thanks again

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## Deano3 (17 Sep 2020)

DannyH said:


> Hey Dean,
> Looking good. are you just sitting the ahem pump in your sink?
> Danny


Pump into a bucket in the sink mate 

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## Deano3 (17 Sep 2020)

Plated a huge bunch of anubias kindly sold to me by SRP3006  thanks again mate put into crevices around the rocks.




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## LondonDragon (17 Sep 2020)

Deano3 said:


> Plated a huge bunch of anubias kindly sold to me by SRP3006 //emoji.tapatalk-cdn.com/emoji16.png thanks again mate put into crevices around the rocks.


Looking good, now just need those plants on the right to get tall


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## SRP3006 (17 Sep 2020)

Deano3 said:


> Plated a huge bunch of anubias kindly sold to me by SRP3006  thanks again mate put into crevices around the rocks.
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my SM-G970F using Tapatalk


Finishes it off nicely mate. Those stems will pick up quickly, watching with interest.


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## Deano3 (17 Sep 2020)

LondonDragon said:


> Looking good, now just need those plants on the right to get tall


Hopefully doesnt take to long, i have lights at 40 percent will leave it at that for a week or more what you think ?

Quite happy woth layout , keep getting air in filter and skimmer bobbing up and down so mey need a oring or something on to stop it any ideas opened the bottom right up but still happens. 

Dean


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## LondonDragon (17 Sep 2020)

Deano3 said:


> Hopefully doesnt take to long, i have lights at 40 percent will leave it at that for a week or more what you think ?


The more light you feed it the more CO2 and nutrients you will need and the less room for error you got, so if you are happy and things growing healthy and steady leave as is.



Deano3 said:


> keep getting air in filter and skimmer bobbing up and down


I have not used one of those filter intakes with built-in skimmers, could it be too low/high? or too close to the filter return lily pipe?


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## SRP3006 (17 Sep 2020)

Deano3 said:


> Hopefully doesnt take to long, i have lights at 40 percent will leave it at that for a week or more what you think ?
> 
> Quite happy woth layout , keep getting air in filter and skimmer bobbing up and down so mey need a oring or something on to stop it any ideas opened the bottom right up but still happens.
> 
> ...


It took me a while to find a sweet spot, you have to adjust it at the bottom and just gently push the head under the surface and let it bob back up to where its comfortable. I have most of my water being taken in through the bottom as I have a separate skimmer.
Once you stop it bobbing it doesn't make anymore annoying sounds 

My lights are on at 50% for 6 hours,


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## Deano3 (17 Sep 2020)

Its the filter intake thats the problem will post in filter section as i know others have had similar problems but not sure how they fixed.

I will up lights eventually but happy for the moment, the twinstar s lights are much redder then the e takes some getting used to, how much EI solution are you dosing mate ? I does 35ml .

I am worred that doing daily water changes i will be lacking as dosing micro one day macro the next so worried i am lacking npk on the days i dose micro if that makes sence but hopefully be fine   


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## SRP3006 (17 Sep 2020)

Ah I see, maybe give the filter a little shake to remove excess gas?
I dosed around 35ml too, 10ml per 50l per Apfuk. If you can dose in the morning that would be best as I (think) read on here before that the plants take their fill of nutrients pretty early on in the photoperiod so I think water changes after lights go out shouldn't make any odds. However dosing a little more in the beginning isn't going to do any harm. In fact I did daily water changes and dosed just after I refilled.


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## Deano3 (17 Sep 2020)

SRP3006 said:


> Ah I see, maybe give the filter a little shake to remove excess gas?
> I dosed around 35ml too, 10ml per 50l per Apfuk. If you can dose in the morning that would be best as I (think) read on here before that the plants take their fill of nutrients pretty early on in the photoperiod so I think water changes after lights go out shouldn't make any odds. However dosing a little more in the beginning isn't going to do any harm. In fact I did daily water changes and dosed just after I refilled.


I am doing water change early before co2 goes on currently as off work for a week then dosing EI.

It was jist with changing 70 percent water i was worried about lack of nutrients but hopefully fine mate

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## Jayefc1 (17 Sep 2020)

Tank looks really good mate like the hardscape and the plant choices a pump is the way forward to water changes i go from tap to tank tank to garden at the same time and just leave it going for about an hour while I clean wood rocks and glass wear sometimes its more like 2 hrs but I really enjoy it


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## Deano3 (17 Sep 2020)

Got some great organisers from b&m for less than £10 very handy indeed



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## alto (18 Sep 2020)

Deano3 said:


> I am worred that doing daily water changes i will be lacking as dosing micro one day macro the next so worried i am lacking npk on the days i dose micro


Try dosing both an hour or so apart 

Though if your water is usual UK tap (or rainwater that you remineralize), plants will likely not notice - most plants will uptake excess when there is excess available, so have that nutrient storage against the next “drought”


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## Deano3 (19 Sep 2020)

When i stop doing daily water changes I will most likely have to adjust co2 wont i ? 

As on morning the drop checker is dark green but after a 70 percent water changes goes more blue as taking any remining co2 out of the water column so when only every other day the co2 will still he present in water colour so need less to get lime green ?

Currently co2 on at 10.00 and lights on at 14.00 trykng to get lime green but still tweaking. 

At moment its uncountable bubbles in the bubble counter.

Also when doing water change i use same hose that i drain with so need another at some point but i set draining and wave plants around etc but think need a hose i can move around the tank to get as much detritus as possible instead of having inlet u-tube on from filter and leaving in same place as dont think sucks up detritus as efficiently, what do yous use ?

Dean

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## ChrisD80 (19 Sep 2020)

Deano3 said:


> think need a hose i can move around the tank to get as much detritus as possible instead of having inlet u-tube on from filter and leaving in same place as dont think sucks up detritus as efficiently, what do yous use ?



I recently started using a 12mm ID 2m long silicone hose when I need more accurate siphoning. Goes into a plastic box on the floor in front of the aquarium and then I just scoop from the box using a bucket to the toilet in the next room. The use of the box is just incase I siphon up any livestock. Find the silicone material and the shorter length much nicer to use than my main longer pvc hose. Originally got the idea from Ryo Wanatabe on YouTube. 

Cheers
Chris 


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## SRP3006 (19 Sep 2020)

Deano3 said:


> When i stop doing daily water changes I will most likely have to adjust co2 wont i ?
> 
> As on morning the drop checker is dark green but after a 70 percent water changes goes more blue as taking any remining co2 out of the water column so when only every other day the co2 will still he present in water colour so need less to get lime green ?



Is the co2 on before you do your water change? 
My drop checker is always blue before my gas comes on in the morning as I try to gas off any remaining co2 in the water and increase oxygen saturation. The way I understand it is that helps the whole system as high o2 in turn helps high co2 levels. 
Do you lift your lily pipes at night or turn on a surface skimmer?

I get what you mean with the hose not siphoning the crud out of the water and around the plants. I use a turkey baster about 15min before I start the water change to get as many pieces up in the water column. Today I've rigged up a spare very small external filter to try and use to siphon out the rubbish.


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## Deano3 (19 Sep 2020)

SRP3006 said:


> Is the co2 on before you do your water change?
> My drop checker is always blue before my gas comes on in the morning as I try to gas off any remaining co2 in the water and increase oxygen saturation. The way I understand it is that helps the whole system as high o2 in turn helps high co2 levels.
> Do you lift your lily pipes at night or turn on a surface skimmer?
> 
> I get what you mean with the hose not siphoning the crud out of the water and around the plants. I use a turkey baster about 15min before I start the water change to get as many pieces up in the water column. Today I've rigged up a spare very small external filter to try and use to siphon out the rubbish.


No i dont lift lilly pipe as got good surface movement and lily pipe is always on as got the EA set.

Also the water change is done before co2 comes on at 10. So co2 on for a good 4 hours at uncountable rate and i have drop checker near inlet.

The drop checker is more green than blue before water change and blue after so mustnt be gassing off as much.

The skimmer still bobbin up and down so put a cable tie on for now until.can get a o-ring from work 

Dean

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## Deano3 (21 Sep 2020)

Quick update things seem to be going well, some crypt leaves melted and just fell off and removed some monte carlo from rocks, still struggling to lime green drop checker and doesnt seem to be much growth from the rotala looking a vit worse for wear but hopefully still in transition.

Should i removed the melting crypt leaves ? Also be doing water change every other day from tomorro and have some algae on wood but sure its normal.

Dean











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## LondonDragon (21 Sep 2020)

Deano3 said:


> Should i removed the melting crypt leaves ?


I cut all the leaves on mine, they are growing in fine now but has taken 3 months!! Just chop the melting ones they will just pollute the tank anyway!


Deano3 said:


> have some algae on wood but sure its normal.


That white stuff, just add some Amanos to the tank, and they will eat it in no time!


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## Geoffrey Rea (22 Sep 2020)

Deano3 said:


> The skimmer still bobbin up and down so put a cable tie on for now until.can get a o-ring from work



Use a syringe to put enough air in the float to keep it buoyant.


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## Deano3 (22 Sep 2020)

Thanks Geoffrey and paulo how long you recommend waiting to add amanos as have 4 in 45p 

And i have tried turing the adjister on bottom of intake and also tried syringe to add air under the float with no success.

It is now fully open at bottom and and still bobs up and down then sucks skimmer under the water and happens if bottom closed or open , got a xable tie holding at correct level at moment.

The sand i am using is very very fine and seems to cover some of buce leaves etc but will wipe off, i will start doing water change every other day after today and may have to do after work so be after lights off in future.

Hopefully start seeing some growth soon will the plants still he adjusting after a week ?

Lastly when would you start upping the light ? 5 percent a week or so ? Currently at 40 percent 

Thanks dean

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## Jayefc1 (22 Sep 2020)

I find my skimmer  bobs up and down when the pre filter is dirty and in the first few weeks had to rinse sponges almost daily


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## Deano3 (22 Sep 2020)

Jayefc1 said:


> I find my skimmer bobs up and down when the pressure filter is dirty and in the first few weeks had to rinse sponges almost daily


I havnt had main filter aprt yet just changed pre filter sponges today though

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## Geoffrey Rea (22 Sep 2020)

Deano3 said:


> Thanks Geoffrey and paulo how long you recommend waiting to add amanos as have 4 in 45p //emoji.tapatalk-cdn.com/emoji16.png



Second month onwards here. They tend to jump if you introduce them too early and there’s the possibility there isn’t much for them to eat in a new setup.


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## Deano3 (23 Sep 2020)

Yeah actually i remember having jumpers last time but been fine for last 10 months or so, i will wait till after a month , i do want to add nerite snails to this set up how long you recommend waiting for that few weeks ?

Also how often and when would you reccomend upping the lights currently at 40 percent and been a week now without seeing much growth at all but i imagine plants still adjusting to submerged state?

Still struggling with co2 coming on 4 hours before lights come on but goes yellow before lights off, i will measure ph levels today for first time as maybe have to turn bps down and maybe put on earlier but see what happens today.

Thanks for help
Dean

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## Deano3 (23 Sep 2020)

Ph levels
10.00-7.58
12.00-6.55
13.00-6.43
14.00-6.34

Drop checker was green at 12.00 but darker green and at 14.00 bice lime green.

First pic is at 12.00 (only put lights on for a second to take pic)

Second pic lights on at 14.00





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## SRP3006 (23 Sep 2020)

I'd turn the bps up higher, you don't have any stock in there yet do you. Whack it up higher. My co2 comes on 4 hours before and was a yellowy colour before I added shrimp. I've turned it down a bit now to save gassing everything. 

I had to add another drop checker to mine as a reference, one was reading slightly off, don't know whether i accidently added some water I'm not sure.


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## Geoffrey Rea (23 Sep 2020)

Deano3 said:


> i do want to add nerite snails to this set up how long you recommend waiting for that few weeks ?



Consider how much food you have available for them Dean. If you’re running a couple of tanks with the same water parameters you can always move them between tanks. If you siphon out the sand monthly and replace, leave it bare for a day so they can clean up diatoms on the bottom glass. If you treat them kindly like this with multiple food sources they seem to stay hungry and slightly more active. A few nerites can do a tremendous job with cleanup.

To answer your question, when there’s consistent food available to them.




Deano3 said:


> Also how often and when would you reccomend upping the lights currently at 40 percent and been a week now without seeing much growth at all but i imagine plants still adjusting to submerged state?



Then...



Deano3 said:


> Still struggling with co2 coming on 4 hours before lights come on but goes yellow before lights off



Co2 management spot on before upping light, can’t stress this enough. Careful adjustment with each significant increase of lighting is the usual suggestion. However, as @SRP3006 has said and if there is no stock currently, aiming high on the Co2 is not a problem. You can up the lighting through the increments knowing you have adequate Co2 throughout. Once you’ve reached your desired lighting level, tune down your Co2 carefully to match your lighting. Your plants will transition from emersed to submersed more effectively. The benefit of not rushing livestock into your tank 😉

As for how often and when to increase the lighting increments, depends on what’s in the tank. As @LondonDragon mentioned earlier, you can just cut all the leaves off your crypts at start up. No low light plants to cater to, can go up the increments quicker. The crypts will come back once the stems are there for cover later, so win for all.


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## Deano3 (23 Sep 2020)

Geoffrey Rea said:


> Consider how much food you have available for them Dean. If you’re running a couple of tanks with the same water parameters you can always move them between tanks. If you siphon out the sand monthly and replace, leave it bare for a day so they can clean up diatoms on the bottom glass. If you treat them kindly like this with multiple food sources they seem to stay hungry and slightly more active. A few nerites can do a tremendous job with cleanup.
> 
> To answer your question, when there’s consistent food available to them.
> 
> ...


Thanks for the detailed response appreciate it 

Tomorro i will trim all crypt leaves and i will do large water change.

I will also up co2 slightly and leave lights as they are, how long does transition period usually last i am used to fast growing stems just not used to nothing happening so sorry for questions.

I will hopefully get some nerites in week or so not sure how many maybe 2-4 then amanos after month 1 say around 12 then hopefully other shrimp but not what ones yet i do like look of the black and white onces.


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## Geoffrey Rea (23 Sep 2020)

Deano3 said:


> how long does transition period usually last



At this point Dean should imagine like many the lockdown measures will have you at home more than usual. Use it to your advantage fella. If you can monitor and observe you can only learn more.

Try upping the light in 10% increments when you want to with at least three days between light intensity changes. Sounds fast and loose but with aquasoil available, EI at your disposal and the ability to go above your tanks Co2 needs its low risk. If there’s no stock in the tank, you can afford to play around and learn. If it seems too much, back off the lighting, but keep Co2 input consistently high as a safety net whilst there’s no stock in the tank.

Clean up crew have their place, but fast growth mitigates a lot of the need for them. Wouldn’t rush to put anything in unless you have a persistent problem that they can solve. Your persistent problem is their food source so it’s a balance.


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## Deano3 (24 Sep 2020)

Geoffrey Rea said:


> At this point Dean should imagine like many the lockdown measures will have you at home more than usual. Use it to your advantage fella. If you can monitor and observe you can only learn more.
> 
> Try upping the light in 10% increments when you want to with at least three days between light intensity changes. Sounds fast and loose but with aquasoil available, EI at your disposal and the ability to go above your tanks Co2 needs its low risk. If there’s no stock in the tank, you can afford to play around and learn. If it seems too much, back off the lighting, but keep Co2 input consistently high as a safety net whilst there’s no stock in the tank.
> 
> Clean up crew have their place, but fast growth mitigates a lot of the need for them. Wouldn’t rush to put anything in unless you have a persistent problem that they can solve. Your persistent problem is their food source so it’s a balance.


I may put lights to 50 percent to try get more growth, have to be honest tank not looking great the pinatafida was brown and very soft looking like mush so removed most of it also cut all the crypt leaves at soil level hopefully they grow back  

53b and ludwigia palustrus seem to be doing well but the rotala not so much along with some bucephlandra i syphoned the leaves away hopefully grows back. 

I am back at work saturday but maybe order some plants for next week maybe a few pots of rotla and some pinitifida.

I think i should remove all the pinitifida as just brown dont think was healthiest when i got it.

I have upped co2 again and did large water change today hopefully start to see some positive signs, also did full filter clean and was immaculate inside when doing water change i tried to syphon up as much detritus as possible melted plant leaves etc so hopefully its enough



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## Geoffrey Rea (24 Sep 2020)

The last picture of the Pinnatifida, it’s leaves are oriented upside down. Not uncommon as if it were a 1-2-Grow pot you have used they’re growing in all directions. Let it do it’s thing, if I remember correctly your scape is just eight days old. It looks to be doing just fine in the photos quite honestly.

If you have an established tank Dean and you want to move things along, take a thimble of soil from the established tank and dump it on the new substrate. Same with filter media, take just a couple of what you use for bio media in an established filter and pop it in your new filter. Let nature do it’s thing.

Get the impression you’re weary of upping your Co2.  It won’t do any harm whilst there’s no stock in the tank if that drop checker were yellow 24/7 right now, steadily graduating up the light intensity. Pretty sure a lot of members start their setups this way? @Siege ? @Jayefc1 ?

From your photos and description you seem to be tracking happily through a successful start up


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## Jayefc1 (24 Sep 2020)

Yeah I definitely start new tanks with no live stock with co2 blasting into it yellow and slowly dial.down as the weeks pass


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## Deano3 (24 Sep 2020)

Thanks Geoffrey and jay  i am going to buy a few more pots of plants tomorro as want more limnophila hippuridoides and hra and pinitifida, the reason picture looks like leaves facind down and blowing all over and very mushy and thin so will get some fresher pots.

Thanks for reassurance and i will get yellow DC.

Dean

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## Siege (25 Sep 2020)

Jayefc1 said:


> Yeah I definitely start new tanks with no live stock with co2 blasting into it yellow and slowly dial.down as the weeks pass



easiest way to get new plants adjusted to life underwater 👍


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## Deano3 (25 Sep 2020)

I have upped co2 as said so thanks yellow dc and ended up spending more money today got more plants.

2x Christmas moss
2x hygrophila pinitifida (one origionally on wood was mush)
1xalternanthera reineckii mini
1x rotala hra
1x blyxa japonica
2x limnophila hippuridoides 
1x limnophila (cant remember name of it its the bish one on the left)

Did a large running water change and got planted but was a bit rushed so dodnt split pots maybe as much as i should.

Looks a lot better and pinitifida was very fresh and 100x better than first pot as i went to collect today took wife she loved horizon aquatics and said would love a nano in kitchen and she even wanted the blyxa .

Bit more density at the rear now hopefully moss attatched well to the wood.








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## Deano3 (26 Sep 2020)

Would you advice doing daily water changes a day as added 10 pots or every other still be ok ?



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## SRP3006 (26 Sep 2020)

I'd say it depends if you are still seeing plants melting or not, but it's looking good Dean.


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## Geoffrey Rea (27 Sep 2020)

Looking good Dean! Better get sharpening those scissors 😍


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## Deano3 (30 Sep 2020)

Well 2 week update already, so be doing water change every 3 days now , been doing running water changes what i like as gives a chance to drain tank and lift detritus, usually drain to less than half then leave running and draining for 10 mins or so.

Plants looking well apart from monte carlo what was in rocks and even in soil always struggle with this for some reason and also my new alternanthera reinckii what is getting discolouration on the leaves any idea what best course of action is ? 

Also the rotala h'ra is looking terrible and hasn't really took evan after adding more.

Love the new limnophila sessiliflora.

Lights still at 50 percent and ferts at 35ml EI but dosed 40 today and not having a rest day at minute due to all water changes.









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## Deano3 (1 Oct 2020)

Any hekp on above be great also may stick to every other day water change as a few bits of floating detritus and diatoms, also the hra is terrible may need to buy some stems off someone as the pots arnt working.

Also ended up with loads of snails from somewhere  will they help at start up ? I wanted nerite snails but can spot loads of these small ones 







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## SRP3006 (1 Oct 2020)

Not sure on the alternanthera reinckii as I can never get it to grow healthily, between me and my Amanos we always kill it. The rotala I'm not sure really, what's the flow like in that area of the tank because your pipes are on that side of the tank so the planted corner would have the lowest flow in the aquascape. Maybe try the lily's on the other side so it's blowing co2 directly into the scape instead of into the sand? Just thinking out load here. I know my flow drops in that area.

Probably just waffling TBH but your limnophila is doing well so might be co2 and flow related. Not sure I'm sure someone else will have a better idea.


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## SRP3006 (1 Oct 2020)

Not sure on the species of snails but I'd leave them for now if they don't bother you too much, they are helping with the diatoms and ditritus that you may miss.


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## Siege (1 Oct 2020)

I’d remove the Snails at water change and get them out off the glass at other times. The dennerle snail catcher/remover is brilliant! 

clean and wash out the filter.

Take a zero tolerance approach.

it’s normal to have a snail bloom at start up. They then decline and you are always left with the odd few, as long as there is minimal waste they will not become an issue and are really part of nature. That’s coming from someone who hates seeing a snail!


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## Deano3 (2 Oct 2020)

I did water change today and removed as much detritus as possible as seems a lot (need to clean pipes as when switch filter on it blows thin flim into tank) will do today or tomorro.

Anybideas on the alternanthera reinckii?

I think you may be correct as the rotala hra is all behind the large wood so wondering if it is a flow issue, would it help buying stems that are longer so can get access to the co2 etc ? 

Also found a shrimp in The tank no idea were he came from but removed and adddd to my 45p and lastly when carrying out water change i seen a lot of very small white things swimming around in tank but to small to photograph any ideas ?

Thanks dean



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## dw1305 (2 Oct 2020)

Hi all,
Do the <"new leaves look really pale?"> (and on the _Anubias_) or is that just an effect from the camera?

cheers Darrel


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## SRP3006 (2 Oct 2020)

Can you add a skimmer or possibly change the pipework to the other side? It's free compared to buying new plants. It's probably what I'd try.


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## Deano3 (2 Oct 2020)

dw1305 said:


> Hi all,
> Do the /www.ukaps.org/forum/threads/a-little-slice-of-nature.61721/page-5#post-615882']new leaves look really pale?[/URL]"> (and on the _Anubias_) or is that just an effect from the camera?
> 
> cheers Darrel


The newer leaves are paler but some of leaves have damage etc.

Any idea on the tiny white things mate that were darting about darrel ?

I never really think of flow when setting up and i should as think the position of rotala may be the issue as you can see flow of blocked, if i got stems already grown would that help mate as have some in my 45p ?

Also dont really want to move the lily pipes plus i have crypts etc in there hope there ok but the stems hopefully will grow tall at back so dont want to move the pipes. I do have a spare eheim skim wonder if worth putting that in to try.

Sp think getting some algae maybe bba on anubias.
Dean



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## SRP3006 (2 Oct 2020)

I have some a small amount of bba on my anubias, always seem to grow a little on the bba when I haven't shaded them as much as I probably should, all the other plants are doing fine so one for me to live with I think. U could try the skimmer as it would help pull the flow towards it as well as push it away. Could improve things, I have one running on mine, at night just to add extra oxygen. Try and see, if it works the stems should pick up really quickly.


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## dw1305 (2 Oct 2020)

Hi all, 





Deano3 said:


> Any idea on the tiny white things mate that were darting about darrel ?


Either Copepods (like _Cyclops_) or "Seed shrimps" - Ostracoda. _Cyclops_ <"tend to move in a series of short bursts"> like ........ . ..........    .   ............ . Ostracods are smoother movers.

You don't need to worry about them, whatever they are. 





Deano3 said:


> The newer leaves are paler


It looks like it might be iron (Fe) deficiency.  Have a look at <"Duckweed Index says ">.

I'd try adding an <"iron chelator that is suitable for harder water">, it won't do any harm and if you are short of iron it <"takes a while for new, non-deficient leaves to grow">.

cheers Darrel


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## Deano3 (2 Oct 2020)

Think may be ostracoda thanks darrel.

I am annoyed at myself about the flow and now wanting to strip it all down and rescape but dont think that would be good idea at minute and not exactly a quick job.

I dont know wether to add some more wood there or add my eheim skim and if so where? 

What is best course of action for my alternanthera reinckii , or is there any plants that do great in low flow or would adding longer stems work ?

Dean

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## Jayefc1 (2 Oct 2020)

I think mate you should keep on top of your maintenance and give it a few weeks the plants are all still transitioning it has only been 2 weeks i had hra just hanging in there for nearly 2 month then 💥 off it went patience is the biggest factor in a new scape dont change things let it balance out


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## SRP3006 (2 Oct 2020)

I wouldnt change anything plant wise, I'd add a skimmer because it would bug me worrying about the flow . Adding a skimmer won't hurt at all and I know quite a few use one, even if you use at night to increase oxygen.


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## Deano3 (2 Oct 2020)

Thanks jay i know i sometimes just get disheartened, once settles i could try some new stems but will leave that area for time being.

Already looking forward to next scape but want plants healthy by then.


I will stick with it for a while would you advise upping lights to 55 percent for more growth ?

Dean

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## Jayefc1 (2 Oct 2020)

Dont think 55% would hurt mate just don't go changing too much 🙄 let it settle its 2 weeks old mate


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## Deano3 (8 Oct 2020)

Hi everyone quick update, tank been running just over 3 week and seems to be doing well apart from spot in middle of tank, i have since added skimmer to rear left for better flow and hope the dead spot in middle gets co2.

I added some rotal hrs i purchased from rowland today and hoping as longer the co2 and ferts can be taken in by leaves at top ( is this how it works if cant get at bottom ? )

If not i will need to move skimmer somewhere else, the 53b isnt growing as good as i though and monte carlo near from has melt, also noticed the 53b has red tinge as in pics ?

Also found a shrimp in tank that mist have came om plant's  i want cherries bit want good dark ones so going to be some decent grade ones.

I am also going to make a AIO fert solution this week so easier i got a recipe from jay so looking forward to seeing results.

Also had to trim a few stems  loads of ditritus on the sand so did huge running water change today, had this sand as very powder like i want larger particles a a more sandly looking one less white.
















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## Jayefc1 (8 Oct 2020)

Deano3 said:


> I added some rotal hrs i purchased from rowland today and hoping as longer the co2 and ferts can be taken in by leaves at top ( is this how it works if cant get at bottom ? )


I don't think that's how the ferts work mate if there in the water colloum they will reach every where c02 is a little different if its fully dissolved the plants will feed of it but the also like the micro bubbles across there leaves but be careful cause new stems don't take kindly to being blown around either


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## dw1305 (8 Oct 2020)

Hi all, 





Jayefc1 said:


> .....in the water column they will reach every where


Yes, it is just like the salt in your soup, once it is fully dissolved give your soup a stir and all your soup is equally salty. 

Added CO2 is different, because it is constantly escaping at the gas exchange surface as it attempts to equilibrate with atmospheric CO2 levels.

cheers Darrel


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## Deano3 (8 Oct 2020)

I will see how they go guys thanks for that information as i was a little unsure  hopefully with the skimmer it has better flow as hard to see bubbles in middle of tank behind the micro bubbles at front.

Dean

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## nat.willis (9 Oct 2020)

Looking good, cant wait to see finished version and pics


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## Deano3 (10 Oct 2020)

Quick update, things going relatively well lights at 60 percent and nice like green drop checker before lights on.

Hoping to get some nerite snails and shrimp next week i already have 4 amanos in my 45p not sure what to get first maybe some good grade cherrys (hopefully no low grade ones in tank as found 2 doing water changes since my plants went in  still unsure of snails aswel as so many say the eggs irritate them, i need to biu a snail trap aswel as keep finding snails in the tank obviously came on some plants.

Pinitifida grows great still not sure how to trim in and replant, i take i can snip off a stem and just glue elsewere ? Still no sign of my cryptocoryne growing yet and still unsure if have better flow in middle.

Getting some algae think a lot of it is just diatoms browm with hair looking bits that wipes off and browning on anubias that is harder to remove and think got some bba etc around edges of anubias and bucephlandra leaves but not much trying to treat with excel.

Think in general everything growing , the 53b etc not as fast as i though but hopefully the rotala takes off soon as not growing straight towards lights. Also ne making a new AIO fertiliser this weekend for ease . 














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## Ady34 (11 Oct 2020)

Stems look to be getting there now Dean, the effort is paying off.
Love the in situ shot also. Always like seeing tanks within their surrounding space.
Cheerio,


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## Deano3 (12 Oct 2020)

Ady34 said:


> Stems look to be getting there now Dean, the effort is paying off.
> Love the in situ shot also. Always like seeing tanks within their surrounding space.
> Cheerio,


I love seeing on situ shots aswel to give a better sence of scale, yeah tank looking, good a few bits of bba on anubias here and there but not to bad, spot dosing with excel.

Seem to get a lot of detritus on the sand i am now wanting larger grain sand as this is so fine like a powder.

Also see a few tiny little things moving on the sand and them very small white things in the water but not concerned.

I did large water change last night and now working till thursday night so hopefully will tick along till then, just wanting tomsee some growth from the 53b, lots of diatoms on leaves etc hopefully a clean up crew get right to it. What would you advise buying first amanos or cherrys? And do you ever buy nerite snails mate

Dean

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## Ady34 (12 Oct 2020)

Hi Dean,
I’d increase ferts a touch and see if anything changes. Perhaps wait another week to add livestock so you can really ramp up the co2 and get the small amount of melt under control first.
I’d definitely go for amano shrimp first and a group of ottos. The diatoms will go with time and good maintenance. I do have nerites also and they are definitely not a bad thing. I don’t get too many eggs as my water is soft and I think it discourages them.
cheerio,


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## Deano3 (12 Oct 2020)

Ady34 said:


> Hi Dean,
> I’d increase ferts a touch and see if anything changes. Perhaps wait another week to add livestock so you can really ramp up the co2 and get the small amount of melt under control first.
> I’d definitely go for amano shrimp first and a group of ottos. The diatoms will go with time and good maintenance. I do have nerites also and they are definitely not a bad thing. I don’t get too many eggs as my water is soft and I think it discourages them.
> cheerio,


Thanks ady i will up ferts slights and will he another week anyway mate, think will go with amanos forst and maybe nerites, how many amanos you recommend? I already have 4 and how many snails ?

Think need to catch all the pest snails first

Dean

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## SRP3006 (12 Oct 2020)

Looking good Dean, you're not the only one finding sand a pita, little black parcels everywhere or just general ditritus even though we clean it every week 
I have 30 Amanos in my tank, lost 5 due to them climbing out so be on the look out. They will jump at night/end of photoperiod when co2 is still high. Nerites I have 20 and they are great, buy the little horned variety, can't remember the scientific name sorry, as they don't leave any eggs on the hardscape.
To be honest, if I set my tank up again I wouldn't add Amanos, they are a pain with the soil and cherries do just as much imo.
I actually like my ramshorns too, they are constantly cleaning something.


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## Deano3 (12 Oct 2020)

SRP3006 said:


> Looking good Dean, you're not the only one finding sand a pita, little black parcels everywhere or just general ditritus even though we clean it every week
> I have 30 Amanos in my tank, lost 5 due to them climbing out so be on the look out. They will jump at night/end of photoperiod when co2 is still high. Nerites I have 20 and they are great, buy the little horned variety, can't remember the scientific name sorry, as they don't leave any eggs on the hardscape.
> To be honest, if I set my tank up again I wouldn't add Amanos, they are a pain with the soil and cherries do just as much imo.
> I actually like my ramshorns too, they are constantly cleaning something.


Hi mate i might get 10 amanos or so next week to help woth algae om wood etc then around 6 ottos i keep changimg mind on snails , i need to catch all the littles ones in my tank but always more so hard. I just keep removing manually when i see bigger ones.

I want some better grade cheerys not sure how the grades work but want some good colour ones and maybe get 20 or so just hope stay away from my intake amd skimmer.

Had some Nice pearling today when got home from work







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## SRP3006 (12 Oct 2020)

Deano3 said:


> i keep changimg mind on snails , i need to catch all the littles ones in my tank but always more so hard. I just keep removing manually when i see bigger ones.


The snails will help clean up any melt or diatoms and if the tank is clean in the long run they won't reproduce quicker than their food if that makes sense. But if you want to remove them then better now than later. You can always try dosing the tank or leaving a lettuce leaf in the tank overnight and dispose of in the morning.


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## SRP3006 (12 Oct 2020)

eSHa Gastropex worked for me when I wanted to remove pond snails and Malaysian trumpet snails. Supposed to be fine for shrimp.


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## Jayefc1 (12 Oct 2020)

Looking good @Deano3 patience is a vertu mate have you started the new ferts


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## Deano3 (12 Oct 2020)

Jayefc1 said:


> Looking good @Deano3 patience is a vertu mate have you started the new ferts


Just this morning mate my tank as 186l so be adding 20ml from now on cheers for the mix jay 

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## Deano3 (12 Oct 2020)

SRP3006 said:


> The snails will help clean up any melt or diatoms and if the tank is clean in the long run they won't reproduce quicker than their food if that makes sense. But if you want to remove them then better now than later. You can always try dosing the tank or leaving a lettuce leaf in the tank overnight and dispose of in the morning.


I will try the lettuce leaf or maybe the chemical you recommend mate  

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## Ady34 (12 Oct 2020)

Deano3 said:


> Thanks ady i will up ferts slights and will he another week anyway mate, think will go with amanos forst and maybe nerites, how many amanos you recommend? I already have 4 and how many snails ?
> 
> Think need to catch all the pest snails first
> 
> ...


I would go for as many as you can afford, up to 20. I added 10 to my 600.
Also you are now on EI ferts, I’d be dosing 30-40ml per day, I’m sure it’s 10ml per 50l tank water?
plants are looking good to be honest. I think you are on the right path and need to persist and be patient. Keep up with the good practice, make sure co2 is good and I’m sure the plants will reward you


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## Deano3 (13 Oct 2020)

Ady34 said:


> I would go for as many as you can afford, up to 20. I added 10 to my 600.
> Also you are now on EI ferts, I’d be dosing 30-40ml per day, I’m sure it’s 10ml per 50l tank water?
> plants are looking good to be honest. I think you are on the right path and need to persist and be patient. Keep up with the good practice, make sure co2 is good and I’m sure the plants will reward you


Iv made a AIO mix and been told 5ml per 50l on this mix mate. Thanks mate for kind words and i will keep up the maintenance etc.



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## Deano3 (16 Oct 2020)

1 month update.

Tank doing well the pinitifida growing very well so chopped some off and moved to along the wood. Also the limnophila hippuridoides growing well just not as much or fast growth as i thought so going to up my ferts.

The blyxa looks well along with the alternanthera reinckii stopped melting and starting to looks ok now so happy about that  some stems need another trim after a week  

Going to purchase a dozen amanos this week coming up you think thats enough for one time then wait until add some cherries and otos ? 

Also sand looks a mess as want larger grains so less powdery but tank looking good still some diatoms but hopefully clears up and lasty dosed some snail killer today as getting to be a lot. Lights still at 60 percent may up what you think ?










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## Deano3 (18 Oct 2020)

Off to biy some amanos tomorro thinking of getting 10 as already got 4 in there now, also cant make mind up about a couple of snails or just stick with shrimp for now but not getting snails yet as still trying to get rid of pest ones.

You think i should buy any ottos tomorro or just stick with shrimp for now just dont want to add to much bioload at once or you think will be ok.? 

Cant wait to get some very red shrimp in there i have a couple of cherries but worried end up with low grade ones so going to start a fresh with good grades in there bit i dont know whats classed as good grades.

Any help will be great

Dean


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## Wookii (18 Oct 2020)

Deano3 said:


> Off to biy some amanos tomorro thinking of getting 10 as already got 4 in there now, also cant make mind up about a couple of snails or just stick with shrimp for now but not getting snails yet as still trying to get rid of pest ones.
> 
> You think i should buy any ottos tomorro or just stick with shrimp for now just dont want to add to much bioload at once or you think will be ok.?
> 
> ...



As long as your tanks is cycled, I don’t think adding more Amanos and some Otos will be a significant bioload. The Otos will certainly clear up any diatoms in short order, and your bigger issue will be making sure they have sufficient food available, which means a chunk of blanched cucumber every few days and half an algae wafer in between (I recommend a glass dish a low flow area for the latter, as they are messy).

As for red cherries, I can thoroughly recommend Bloody Mary’s - expensive, but worth it for the colouration.

Horned nerites are also very effective at tank cleaning. I also wouldn’t worry too much about the ‘pest’ snails. As long as they are not plant eaters, they will also help to deal with algae, CO2 injection (and the resulting shell attrition), along with lack of food availability (due to having other more efficient algae eaters) will control their numbers.


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## SRP3006 (18 Oct 2020)

Personally I'd add more shrimp and wait on the otos until there is significant algae or food for them to eat. They can be quite fragile in my experience. I'd probably try to get cherry's in first if it was me, but Amanos are still good.


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## Jayefc1 (18 Oct 2020)

I don't like amanos they will munch on your reckitti for sure like its a salad bar


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## Deano3 (18 Oct 2020)

Thanks for replys guys , there is algae in the tank on the wood and glass and certain plants so.maybe 5 ottos or so and another 6 amanos so i have 10 in there will do.

Also looked at the bloody marys and agree there colouration is stunning i am only worroed about loosing to my skimmers and inlet as dont want to add a guard to it. Do you have any problems with the inlets ?

Thanks again

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## Deano3 (20 Oct 2020)

Tank tickimg along nicely got 10 amanos and 6 ottos in there, 2 of the ottos looked like they were dead and floating but when touched them swam away so left them and cant see them floating so hopefully ok, i did acclimatise them very slowly aswel.

Hopefully wont have to feed as a bit of algae in there for now, really looking forward to getting some colourful shrimp in there  

If you look below the wood there is some soil and a little bit monte carlo seems to be very little flow there, removed the skimmer as dodnt seem to he making much difference and most plants have a gentle sway apart from that area and were the rotla is, any recomendations for that area something small or will it suffer due to flow and co2 ?

Thanks dean







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## Deano3 (21 Oct 2020)

That is the spot struggling to grow montecarlo carpet is there any plants you recommend i could add there to grow with little flow and not much co2 as seems to be a bit of a dead spot amd dont think the soil is very deep at the front, only want something small and low just not sure what to do in that area.

Dean

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## Deano3 (25 Oct 2020)

Tank still ticking along ok doing water changes on average every 4 -7 days , lights are at 75 percent and have good pearling most of the day.

Since adding the ottos i think i have only seen 4 out of the 6 and same with amanos never seen all 12 but hopefully they there somewere. I still have a lot of brown looking plants like the sessiliflora isnt a vibrant green and more brown i was hoping this would pass and was diatoms what do you think ?

Also the dead spot with the rotala is still not growing or lookong great but the higher stems are doing ok for now so see how it goes.

Also thinking of removimg the large anubias at the rear and maube the wood and adding more small anubias and bucephlandra. Think the anubias looks out of place and to large leaves and maybe without the wood will help a little with flow up the rocks. Looking foward to adding some cherries very soon, still insire of amount maybe 20-30 to start i also may buy a few more amanos.

Also added esha gastroplex and snails reduced but starting again so may get more and add a lot just unsure if will harm any other inhabitants?

Dean









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## Deano3 (27 Oct 2020)

Forgot how much better trimmed plants look, the sessiliflora was at the surface so give it a good trim, to be honest want to remove it once my limnophila hippuridoides grows and needs a trim and will put along the back as looks great and love the plant were as the limnophila looks brownish and not vibrant or maybe even pit some more alternanthera reinckii instead,Also removed wood at rear and the large anubias and placed in 45p for now think looks much better and allows for better flow i think as a gradual incline of the rocks pushes flow over the tops.

What you think ?

How many cherries should i get ?







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## Deano3 (1 Nov 2020)

Cherries will he coming later this week but purchased 12 rummy nose tetras today from horizon aquatics, stunning fish amd amazing shouling fish.

Also got 2x 5kg co2 FEs for £25  they are huge so be much better









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## Deano3 (7 Nov 2020)

Limnophila hippuridoides has to be one of my favourite plants and syarting to pink up nicely now, tank going very well now looking forward to adding more rummy nose tetras and some shrimp 







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## Ady34 (7 Nov 2020)

Looking great Dean.
Some height on the stems now offering some nice visuals


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## Jayefc1 (7 Nov 2020)

Looking good mate stems have taken off now have they I like my tanks after a trim too looks so much tidier


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## Deano3 (8 Nov 2020)

Thanks @Ady34 and @Jayefc1 yeah the stems have taken off and going to let rear hit surface befire any trimming, still have a spot in middle were rotala is what doesn't grow much so need to do something there.

Any plants recomendations that can take the light but do well in lower flow and co2 

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## Mr.Shenanagins (8 Nov 2020)

What moss do you have growing on that large branch? It’s growing beautifully and compact.


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## Ady34 (8 Nov 2020)

Deano3 said:


> still have a spot in middle were rotala is what doesn't grow much so need to do something there.
> 
> Any plants recomendations that can take the light but do well in lower flow and co2 //emoji.tapatalk-cdn.com/emoji4.png


Perhaps try ludwigia repens.


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## Deano3 (8 Nov 2020)

Ady34 said:


> Perhaps try ludwigia repens.


I have ludwigia palustrus in there is there much a difference mate ? Does it normally do ok in lower flow areas ? The rotala has never really taken off in that area.


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## Deano3 (9 Nov 2020)

Did large water change today things going well noticed a few bits of staghorn on the java fern and buce just at the front also noticed some dead leaves etc at the rear right as the flow through the denser leaves must be hard as now starting to grow a lot thicker.

Some grear reds on the ludwigia palustrus and the moss is looking great but i need to start taking bits off and movong it down i think should i remove the deD leaves woth some tweezers ?

Getting 20 bloody marys on wednesday and maybe another half a dozen rummy nose.

Dean









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## Ady34 (10 Nov 2020)

Deano3 said:


> I have ludwigia palustrus in there is there much a difference mate ? Does it normally do ok in lower flow areas ? The rotala has never really taken off in that area.
> 
> 
> Sent from my SM-G970F using Tapatalk


Hi,
unsure tbh, never tried palustrus but repens is easy so should do ok.
Only way to know for sure is to give it a try. May have a few stems I could give you next time i trim however you may be better getting a pot or two instead for filling out the space.
Cheerio,


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## Mr.Shenanagins (10 Nov 2020)

Looks really great I’m jealous of your moss as I’ve already told you!


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## Deano3 (11 Nov 2020)

Ady34 said:


> Hi,
> unsure tbh, never tried palustrus but repens is easy so should do ok.
> Only way to know for sure is to give it a try. May have a few stems I could give you next time i trim however you may be better getting a pot or two instead for filling out the space.
> Cheerio,


Yeah may give it a try mate, i am wanting some more bucephlandra for around the rocks and i will eventually get to that dead spot but things are taking off well now so glad about that , as i say bit of staghorn now and bit of melting etc at rear of the stems but gues this is normal.

I am wanting to extend the limnophila hippuridoides along the rear eventually as such a good looking plant and now starting to colour up nicely.

20 bloody marys coming tomorrow from horizon at a great price coulnt get there in person so getting posted. Hopefully with only 20 they still breed  can get more eventually if seen to little amount. 

Would you advise acclimatiseing them very very slowly i usually hang the bag on the aquarium and add small amounts or water bit by bit over a hour or 2 then net them and add to tank.

Dean

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## Deano3 (11 Nov 2020)

Mr.Shenanagins said:


> Looks really great I’m jealous of your moss as I’ve already told you!


Thanks mate 

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## Ady34 (12 Nov 2020)

Deano3 said:


> Would you advise acclimatiseing them very very slowly i usually hang the bag on the aquarium and add small amounts or water bit by bit over a hour or 2 then net them and add to tank.


Personally I drip acclimate them with airline and a gang valve for control over a couple of hours. 
Little and often if your doing it in the tank.


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## Deano3 (12 Nov 2020)

Thanks mate i did over a 3 or 4 hour period and shrimp look great just hope stay away from the inlet, i am sure one is pregnant (hope so)

Suffering from staghorn algae so dod water change today i cleaned filter and added some seachem matrix i had as wanted to add it anyway and removed a large blue sponge. Also tdied getting all the leaves from under the 53b that were dead etc

Spot dosing with excell aswel, the worst hit is the buce that us under the light and end of the java fern any other recommendations?






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## Deano3 (18 Nov 2020)

Update time, did large maintenance session yesterday cutting some stems and replanting etc also moved a few plants.

How do you keep pinitifida low as dont want growing very long leaves and high ?

Also suffering from a huge amount of snails on the glass and getting a yellow film any recomendations?

Lastly i dont know what happened but unfortunately i seem to have did something to cause a few of the fish to die 3 were floating not long after water change not sure if temp was a few degrees higher or what and if this would effect them bit seem to be missing 5 of the rummy nose tetras that have been fine previously.

Dean





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## SRP3006 (18 Nov 2020)

Looking good Dean, the right corner is looking great with all the stems and colours.
I'd manually remove the snails as much as poss, and if you remove as much as poss then try baiting them, remove one everytime you see one and they'll start dwindling.
My pinnatifida I'm constantly breaking bits off of it, but like you I get big leaves, keeping it low is as simple as stopping it growing upwards but as for the leaves I've got no idea, maybe light intensity.
As for the fish the temp doesn't usually effect mine, I always lower my temps when refilling, I'm not sure 1 or 2 degrees higher would've made any difference to the fish.


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## Wolf6 (18 Nov 2020)

You could add one assassin snail, they will reduce the amount of snails quite fast. Once you are down to a level you are comfortable with you could remove it again, or just leave it till all snails are gone. Very nice tank!


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## Jayefc1 (18 Nov 2020)

I think i read somewhere if you just keep nipping the tips out and the bigger leaves of you can almost train it to grow smaller


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## Deano3 (18 Nov 2020)

No idea what killed all the fish and foind a cherry dead, i did move some plants unless a ammonoa bloom or something, hopefully rest are ok.did karge water change after.

As for snails do assassin snails not lay eggs or breed as dont want overrun with them.

And i need to find out how to stunt the pinitifida and make leaves small what do you mean by nip them ?

Also getting some bba on anubias at minute not sure wether to lower the light intensity but want the nice reds

Dean

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## Jayefc1 (18 Nov 2020)

Moving plants around could well have caused a spike and killed the fish and shrimp 
Nip the tops out of the pinta by that I mean take the very top off the crown  the smallest bit right at the top then it will grow out and become more bushy then just keep taking the bigger leaves from lower down the or along the stem


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## dw1305 (18 Nov 2020)

Hi all,


Deano3 said:


> cause a few of the fish to die 3 were floating not long after water change


Sorry to hear that, my guess is that it was something in the water. If it was tap water, possibly emergency chloramine dosing. if it was warmer it would hold less dissolved gases (but that would be the same for both oxygen and CO2).

cheers Darrel


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## Deano3 (20 Nov 2020)

dw1305 said:


> Hi all,
> 
> Sorry to hear that, my guess is that it was something in the water. If it was tap water, possibly emergency chloramine dosing. if it was warmer it would hold less dissolved gases (but that would be the same fro both oxygen and CO2).
> 
> cheers Darrel


Thanks Darrel yeah i lost 4 fish with that water change and some shrimp very strange indeed never had that issue before and hopefully not again. Did large water change today and got right into the bottom of the plants to get as much ditritus up as possible and all fish seem fine today sl wonder if it was a emergency chemical added to water.

Thanks for the info mate

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## Deano3 (20 Nov 2020)

Few pics 





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## Deano3 (25 Nov 2020)

Hi everyone hope you are all well, fish seem to be fine and i think @dw1305 was correct and maybe some diet due to emergency chlorine dosing or somthing similar in the water but settled now.

Cut back the pinitifida today and moss for first time.also cut some bucephlandra for first time literally cut the top and stuck to some rock so hopefully grows ok.also took months but can just see a crypt growing at bottom of the ludwigia palustris(lobe the off cuts with green and red in the leaves)

Seem to be struggling with some bba on the anubias currently any idea what is best course of action ? I will attatch some pictures,also seems to be some sort of deficiency as getting holes in one of my bucephlandra (only one of them for some reason) and a few of the leaves have a red patches on ?

What you think of the scale so far everyone ? I must say i really enjoy the few hours maintenance on my forst day off as i do 4 days on 4 days off so do maintenance forst morning off and last mornong off a quicker water change. 

Thanks dean













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## Wolf6 (25 Nov 2020)

Looking very nice! If BBA is limited like that, just remove some leaves and spot dose with easycarbo or something like that. I'm currently doing the same in my tank, spot dosing wherever I suspect BBA is rearing its ugly head. I had some black dots on my wood like you have, and I just dosed them to be sure they dont turn into bba. They vanished now, a few days later, so I think I might have been correct. I've spotted one buce leaf with a bit darker edge that I'm now keeping my eye on. Going to dose that too soon, just to be sure. Mosses dont like being dosed though, at least my fissidens hated it, its still struggling to recover after 3 weeks, so maybe cut it out if it shows up in there.


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## SRP3006 (25 Nov 2020)

Looking good Dean, I've been spot dosing my anubias and a few buce with glut every other day and it seems to be working, I upped my water changes and try to do 2 in the week. I've recently attached some airline tubing to my turkey baster and use that to remove crap as I blast the plants (seen that on a video somewhere, not sure where now). I do 2 80% water changes on the bounce whenever I trim or mess about with the plants or substrate.

Maintenance is just a pleasure with these tanks.


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## Deano3 (25 Nov 2020)

Thanks guys i spot dosed today with seachem liquid carbon but it's on a lot of the anubias so will keep spot dosing but going through the bottle quickly.

And yeah maintenance luckily i am enjoying and i do one water change on first day off then another 3 days later then none for 4 days then start again, just how the shifts work, 4 on 4 off.

Dean

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## Paul Willi (26 Nov 2020)

Hi Dean
Tanks looking lovely with nice colours, am i right in thinking your making up a all in one fert mix. What is your ingredients for the all in one please.
Cheers
Paul


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## Deano3 (30 Nov 2020)

Hi everyone i have a problem seem to be getting a lot of algae on the buce and anubias and on the pinitifida etc, i am doing 2 water changes in 8 days and lights at 75 percent ( reduced to 65 last night)

Suggestions ? I am on my first day off thursday so will give the soil and sand a good clean even though i am doing this every time, will also strip the whole filter and give a clean.

Any other recomendations and how long should i clean the filter out etc should the algae start disappearing?

Think its bba and staghorn i am wondering if its the fish that died as never found 1 of them.

Also getting defficencys in the bucephlandra with red spots on leaves etc ?








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## SRP3006 (30 Nov 2020)

Hi Dean, I'm struggling with similar at the minute, I've been doing what you've said in your post with cleaning the filter, soil everything I can think of. Not getting any staghorn that I can see but BBA and GSA (I think) on the anubias. 
I wasn't sure whether it's just still the tank settling?
Mine came on a little after I cut back the pinnatifida so maybe I removed too many fast growers I'm not sure.
I've redone my pH profile just to check if I have any fluctuations. Be interesting to see what you do with this.


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## Deano3 (30 Nov 2020)

Paul Willi said:


> Hi Dean
> Tanks looking lovely with nice colours, am i right in thinking your making up a all in one fert mix. What is your ingredients for the all in one please.
> Cheers
> Paul


Sorry paul i will get this for you it totally slipped my mind but i will find my list for you

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## Deano3 (30 Nov 2020)

SRP3006 said:


> Hi Dean, I'm struggling with similar at the minute, I've been doing what you've said in your post with cleaning the filter, soil everything I can think of. Not getting any staghorn that I can see but BBA and GSA (I think) on the anubias.
> I wasn't sure whether it's just still the tank settling?
> Mine came on a little after I cut back the pinnatifida so maybe I removed too many fast growers I'm not sure.
> I've redone my pH profile just to check if I have any fluctuations. Be interesting to see what you do with this.


Yeah i am panicking a bit as been getting worse and all of a sudden seems to be all over on all plants not as bad as it sounds but unsightly.

I pivked off the bad affected leaves and lowered lights to 65%, hopefully doing 2 water changes in 8 days is enough i may do an extra one this week but cant until off work thursday. I will try to get up as much detritus as possible and clean internals of filter in the aquarium water.

Should the bba etc start to subside if cleaning filter etc ? I always change pre filter sponges every maintenence session.

Dean

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## Nico Felici (30 Nov 2020)

Hi Dean,
In my own experience staghorn are quite likely to appear at the start (first 2/3 months) and really just as likely to disappear on their own later on. I can see some on the pinnatifida - I'd remove as much of them as possible by hand and wait for a full maturation to do its thing.
BBA are pesky beasts but I am really not that experienced with them I'm afraid. Don't feel like giving any particular recommendations on filter cleaning either, but personally I'd be even more careful and gentle when handling sponge and bio filter now with some algae presence/slightly more unstable system than I would normally.


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## SRP3006 (1 Dec 2020)

Deano3 said:


> Yeah i am panicking a bit as been getting worse and all of a sudden seems to be all over on all plants not as bad as it sounds but unsightly.
> 
> I pivked off the bad affected leaves and lowered lights to 65%, hopefully doing 2 water changes in 8 days is enough i may do an extra one this week but cant until off work thursday. I will try to get up as much detritus as possible and clean internals of filter in the aquarium water.
> 
> ...



I always understood bba to be caused by excess waste in the water or poor/fluctuating co2?? 
So I'm trying to limit the excess waste and checking my pH. I hope I'm on the right track. I've found my prefilters on the oase get clogged pretty quickly so I do them twice a week now, in tap water too.
I guess it's quite difficult to keep the anubias and buce algae free whilst blasting the stems with light.


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## Deano3 (2 Dec 2020)

SRP3006 said:


> I always understood bba to be caused by excess waste in the water or poor/fluctuating co2??
> So I'm trying to limit the excess waste and checking my pH. I hope I'm on the right track. I've found my prefilters on the oase get clogged pretty quickly so I do them twice a week now, in tap water too.
> I guess it's quite difficult to keep the anubias and buce algae free whilst blasting the stems with light.


I always swap sponges over when do maintenance, i am going to do 3 water changes over the next 4 days.

I never know whatbthey mean by fluctuating co2 as it always starts a lot lower then raises.

Do they mean fluctuating from lights on ?
I had my bps uncountable and usually a green at photoperiod but maybe lighter at end of my photoperiod.

Will try get as much detritus up as possible tonight may clean internals of filter also tonight and same on sunday morning and like i said i will throw in a extra session this week maybe friday morning.

Dean

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## Jayefc1 (2 Dec 2020)

If your co2 isn't a constant through the photo period meaning the plants are using more than you putting in the levels will flutuat do a ph profile deano ph drop of one all the way through the photo period mate


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## Jayefc1 (2 Dec 2020)

Maybe too much light also what's it on now


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## Deano3 (2 Dec 2020)

Jayefc1 said:


> Maybe too much light also what's it on now


Dropped to 65 percent other day, i will check ph every hour when i am off tomorrow. I usually drop 1 ph within a hour but drop checker still green , i will do a ph check every hour tomorro hopefully the ph oen is accurate enough i usually dip it in a low flow area for a min or so as ph will keep dropping. 

Dean

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## Deano3 (11 Dec 2020)

Hi everyone, purchased some more rummy nose tetras and 5 nerites today after my loss.

Still having some algae issues and what look like defficencys so any help would be great, been spot treating the staghorn what i seem to have a lot of and turned red and also upped the water changes, want some more amanos and ottos soon.

Seem to be some melting on pinitifida what was originally growing great and some browning on the anubias and holes in leaves of various plants etc everything just not looking good as it should be tbh moss also lookong brown with algae and not vibrant green.

Think maybe a nutrient problem but thays where my knowledgeis really bad and help is needed







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## Jayefc1 (11 Dec 2020)

Dont really see how it can be nutrient mate as your mix is the same.as mine and my plants are going crazy have you tried to adjust the.flow moving the lily's around is your co2 100% dialed in what your ph profile like  just don't see how the mixes.could be producing two things so.diffrent I've even.dropped my amounts to.25ml every other day.and still.getting amazing.growth


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## Deano3 (12 Dec 2020)

Jayefc1 said:


> Dont really see how it can be nutrient mate as your mix is the same.as mine and my plants are going crazy have you tried to adjust the.flow moving the lily's around is your co2 100% dialed in what your ph profile like just don't see how the mixes.could be producing two things so.diffrent I've even.dropped my amounts to.25ml every other day.and still.getting amazing.growth


You may be right mate as i am dosing 20ml daily, did you keep the mix the same ?

What could i do with flow maybe move to front of rear left of the tank what you think will be best ? Just staghorn and plants not looking as green as they should be and seeing a bit deformity on leaves etc in certain places, the worst for staghorn is the left were the flow is blasted down and swirls. 

If the lily pipes were left hand it would eather blast the stems at the rear or go down front and around the stems.

Also my crypts never really came through or they hVe just but would love so crypts in here maybe where the rotala is would it be ok with the light ? Light is at 75%.

Thanks dean

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## Sammy Islam (12 Dec 2020)

Deano3 said:


> You may be right mate as i am dosing 20ml daily, did you keep the mix the same ?
> 
> What could i do with flow maybe move to front of rear left of the tank what you think will be best ? Just staghorn and plants not looking as green as they should be and seeing a bit deformity on leaves etc in certain places, the worst for staghorn is the left were the flow is blasted down and swirls.
> 
> ...


I would say it's definitely flow. I have been thinking about what i sort of scape i would go for if i was going rescape mine one day. I love traingle layouts, they always just look great. But i realised flow would be a big issue in a triangle layout mainly because you wouldn't be able to great flow right in the middle of the plants unless you point the outlet at them, but even then the flow would be strongest around the edges where there is not many plants, as we are going for circular flow.

I would definitely put the lily pipes pointing at your scape rather than away from it, as you will get more flow around the dead areas as the flow will hit the glass and go round and get dispersed downwards aswell. 

In my scape some some of my rotala do get battered from the lily output, but once they grow in properly and become dense and bushy they hold their shape. I also have a small pump in the opposite corner of my tank, only like 450lph, but it does a good job of getting a good flow all the way around without completely battering all my other rotala.


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## Deano3 (12 Dec 2020)

Sammy Islam said:


> I would say it's definitely flow. I have been thinking about what i sort of scape i would go for if i was going rescape mine one day. I love traingle layouts, they always just look great. But i realised flow would be a big issue in a triangle layout mainly because you wouldn't be able to great flow right in the middle of the plants unless you point the outlet at them, but even then the flow would be strongest around the edges where there is not many plants, as we are going for circular flow.
> 
> I would definitely put the lily pipes pointing at your scape rather than away from it, as you will get more flow around the dead areas as the flow will hit the glass and go round and get dispersed downwards aswell.
> 
> In my scape some some of my rotala do get battered from the lily output, but once they grow in properly and become dense and bushy they hold their shape. I also have a small pump in the opposite corner of my tank, only like 450lph, but it does a good job of getting a good flow all the way around without completely battering all my other rotala.


Thanks sammy yeah i love the look in the picture above and next scape i will have a carpet i think, where you think will be best left hand front so goes along glass then round into the stems or at the rear so straight into the stems ?

Dean

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## Jayefc1 (12 Dec 2020)

Let's put this into perspective we both use the same mix your 900 is what 200ltr and your adding 140ml of ferts a week 20ml×7=140 
My 1200 is 284ltrs and I'm adding 75ml a week 
25ml×3= 75 
Unless you have made a drastic error when making the recipe up I don't see how it is possible for it to be ferts 
I think sometimes people always look at the wrong things it is more than lightly your co2 or flow IMO I know every tank is different and from the looks of my tank to yours I have a much bigger plant mass so in theory I should be using much more ferts but am actually using almost half of the amount 
Maybe you need to just find the balance of light co2 and ferts


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## SRP3006 (12 Dec 2020)

I am using the same ferts and I am dosing 10ml per day, so compared to Jay's tank I am still dosing too much, I'm slowly lowering it and trying to reduce the nitrates. I had an issue with iron a little while ago but that was down to the way I mixed the salts.


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## Deano3 (12 Dec 2020)

I am terrible at ferts and knowing what causes certain issues etc, obvioisly not the ferts then. So i need to look at flow and co2, i will do another ph profile when I get a chance.

I want to try lilly pipe in different position where you think will be best left hand front or rear ?

Thanks dean

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## Jayefc1 (12 Dec 2020)

Deano3 said:


> I want to try lilly pipe in different position where you think will be best left hand front or rear ?


Its going to be trial and error mate give them both a try for a month and see how they go its not going to hurt till you find the righ place my stems get a light flow over them I run 2 filters 1 front left 1 back right and thats only the thermo 350 I probs dont need both but it help distribute the co2 around the tank and the stems dont mind the gentle waft at all


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## Sammy Islam (12 Dec 2020)

Deano3 said:


> Thanks sammy yeah i love the look in the picture above and next scape i will have a carpet i think, where you think will be best left hand front so goes along glass then round into the stems or at the rear so straight into the stems ?
> 
> Dean
> 
> Sent from my SM-G970F using Tapatalk


I would put the lily front left, maybe an inch or two further in than you normally would. The water will still travel around the glass, but more importantly you would get downward flow from hitting the glass and going through your plants at substarte level.

You could also get a small pump like me and put it in the opposite corner behind you stems so it pushes the water through and back around to input/output. Obviously with this option means more stem movement which isn't always desirable.


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## Deano3 (12 Dec 2020)

Thanks jay and sammy i will try repositioning the pipes tomorro and see how it goes.



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## Geoffrey Rea (12 Dec 2020)

Hey @Deano3

Alternative proposition for flow if it’s possible. Looking back through your journal your soil height may just allow it:







Position your intake in the back right corner. It would pull flow through your stems and improve distribution. May require removing leaves from the lower intake with pinsettes regularly, but on the plus side the intake won’t get as dirty as quickly being exposed to less light.



Deano3 said:


> getting a lot of algae on the buce and anubias and on the pinitifida



All epiphytes in your setup with no access to soil. Betting the anubius and buce haven’t yet achieved good adherence to hardscape, Pinnatifida may just be a casualty susceptible due to another factor. If they don’t have good adherence to something they melt their leaves from the outer edges inwards from experience and BBA buffet time. Think in a time scale of months to correct this but once it’s well attached it calms down.


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## Deano3 (13 Dec 2020)

Geoffrey Rea said:


> Hey @Deano3
> 
> Alternative proposition for flow if it’s possible. Looking back through your journal your soil height may just allow it:
> 
> ...


Thanks Geoffrey  i am hoping it all calms down and settles but happy with the overall look at the minute just a few smaller problems. Think i may need to pull out and plant tops soon after a few nore trims.

And regarding the lily pipes i will have a play about cant make mind up what way to try first . Was thinking left rear at first bit dont know of the stems would distript the flow pattern to much. 

Thanks mate 
Dean

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## Wookii (14 Dec 2020)

My layout is very similar top yours Dean (just mirrored) here, I have my filter inlet and outlet where @Geoffrey Rea has suggested. I find it works really well - the flow creates some CO2 rich turbulence over the top of the stems, hits the end glass and is forced downwards to the substrate, and then flows around and along the rocks at the front of the tank, before being drawn back over the rocks and through the stems to the outlet. It seems to cover all areas, and as two bonuses a) hides the pipework, and b) seems to push any detritus into the bottom corner (which would be the front right corner on your tank) for easy vacuuming.

I'm not sure which filter you have currently, but I'm essentially using an Oase 850, but because I use a large CO2 reactor, I have to supplement with a stream pump also to get sufficient distribution, and my tank is only a 60cm - so you may need to consider adding to the turnover somehow?


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## Deano3 (14 Dec 2020)

Wookii said:


> My layout is very similar top yours Dean (just mirrored) here, I have my filter inlet and outlet where @Geoffrey Rea has suggested. I find it works really well - the flow creates some CO2 rich turbulence over the top of the stems, hits the end glass and is forced downwards to the substrate, and then flows around and along the rocks at the front of the tank, before being drawn back over the rocks and through the stems to the outlet. It seems to cover all areas, and as two bonuses a) hides the pipework, and b) seems to push any detritus into the bottom corner (which would be the front right corner on your tank) for easy vacuuming.
> 
> I'm not sure which filter you have currently, but I'm essentially using an Oase 850, but because I use a large CO2 reactor, I have to supplement with a stream pump also to get sufficient distribution, and my tank is only a 60cm - so you may need to consider adding to the turnover somehow?


Thanks mate, i have put the inlet behind the stems hopefully make flow a little better.

I currently have the oase 600 thermo but thinking of upgrading to the 850 for that little extra flow, maybe a Christmas present for myself then sell the 600 as only used for 3 months.

Got some cool pics of snails not sure if trying to breed or what.

Also my trident seems to be dying off for some strange reason.

Thanks dean









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## Wookii (14 Dec 2020)

Juts to clarify Dean, I think you should have the outflow lily pipe in the back corner also, otherwise you could end up with a U-shaped rather than circular flow, and potentially a dead spot in that area at the right hand end between then inlet/outlet.


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## Deano3 (14 Dec 2020)

Wookii said:


> Juts to clarify Dean, I think you should have the outflow lily pipe in the back corner also, otherwise you could end up with a U-shaped rather than circular flow, and potentially a dead spot in that area at the right hand end between then inlet/outlet.


 Geoffreys suggested putting the inlet in rear right corner i thought would try that first as didnt need much to adjust. Sorry mate thought you meant same thing  my bad

Where would you advise the pipes rear left next to each other so flow hits the stems and goes around front and into the inlet ? Willing to try everything mate if improves the flow and make best possible environment i can.

Also what you think avout upgrading the filter, and not sure why the trident seems tk have died off.

Thanks dean 

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## Wookii (14 Dec 2020)

Deano3 said:


> Geoffreys suggested putting the inlet in rear right corner i thought would try that first as didnt need much to adjust. Sorry mate thought you meant same thing  my bad
> 
> Where would you advise the pipes rear left next to each other so flow hits the stems and goes around front and into the inlet ? Willing to try everything mate if improves the flow and make best possible environment i can.
> 
> ...



See what @Geoffrey Rea thinks on the outlet placement mate, he's the resident expert - I just always try and keep inlet and outlet next to one another to maintain a circular flow, and as I say, in my rock scape where I have a full tank height at the front, it seem to work well having the flow sweep along the front and up over the rocks.


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## Geoffrey Rea (14 Dec 2020)

Resident muppet more like... 🤪

Your suggestion offers the superior flow pattern @Wookii . Only thing that I would add is @Deano3 would have to keep his plants at a sensible height so they don’t directly get blown about and stressed. Letting growth get too long would also block flow from the outlet as well. That was the only reasoning for solely trying a move of just the inlet first.

With Dean’s outflow being a lily pipe compared to the flattened nozzle style in your tank Wookii, the flow will be relatively dispersed (possibly downwards) rather than concentrated outwards over the plants. As ever Dean it’s best to try these things out so you can see for yourself.


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## Deano3 (14 Dec 2020)

Thanks guys i will try it like this for few weeks see how it goes, seems to be ok flow around front right so see how it goes.

Thanks guys appreciate it
Dean

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## Deano3 (22 Dec 2020)

Hi everyone hope everyone is well and all set for Christmas  quick update.

Currently treating for planeria i added the premade solution on saturday so want to give it a week tank has some bad staghorn currently what i am hoping to start treating and working hard to get rid of straight after this treatment.

Due to the white solution i added you can clearly see the staghorn and it looks rubbish currently, still wanting to upgrade to the oase 850t after xmas for bit extra flow.

Moved the inlet back to origional position as kept getting woken up by leaves blocking the inlet in middle of night and making a horrible slurping noise,i have however added eheim skim upsode down to add vit flow to rear, am gutted as off now so could have done more water changed but will after saturday as off till 2nd. Trying to just leave treatment to do its thing. Hoping more maintenece and excel and getting a load more amanos and ottos and cherries will help with algae as even when it turns purple doesnt seem to get eaten.

Thanks for reading and any input welcome 
Dean





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## SRP3006 (22 Dec 2020)

That treatment does need a few days @Deano3 to work properly, definitely try to do the water change as soon as you can after the treatment time has passed though and probably a good idea to do a couple on the trot. I did 5 in 3 days, 80% ones. Just in case there was an ammonia spike from the planaria.
How do the fish seem? Their breathing rate increased or do they had red gills? My embers didn't like it very much.


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## Deano3 (22 Dec 2020)

SRP3006 said:


> That treatment does need a few days @Deano3 to work properly, definitely try to do the water change as soon as you can after the treatment time has passed though and probably a good idea to do a couple on the trot. I did 5 in 3 days, 80% ones. Just in case there was an ammonia spike from the planaria.
> How do the fish seem? Their breathing rate increased or do they had red gills? My embers didn't like it very much.


Hi mate, the fish seem fine at the moment, the person who made ot up is very knowledgable indeed as says 7 days will be enought for the planaria and eggs so going to leave it for 7 days then work on getting rid of the staghorn. 

Lowered lights to 50% for now. You got any other recomendations on the algae, hoping the extra flow will help also.

Dean

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## Deano3 (8 Feb 2021)

Wow been a long time since update, unfortunately i lost the rummy nose tetras with the treatment but since then tank been going great, i did lower the lights but today did a big maintenance session and upped lights to 70 percent again also did a trim but due to currently doing kitchen etc so no spare time for rescape at the minute so maybe match/april time .

All algae practically gone think was caused due to a dead otto i never relised was missing but foind a body under plants one maintenance session, i think this must have caused ammonia spike.

All the shrimp and ottos doong really well and keep seeing baby shrimp etc , keep feeding red pepper once ever so often leave in for 2-3 days then do same after a few day break so they are happy. 

Anyway added sand again today as seen no more planaria thankfully since treatment and did large water change etc.

Dean







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## Deano3 (22 Feb 2021)

Not much to update really still one water change a week and very low maintenance with lights at 50 percent.

Purchased normal ista lily pipes as sick of aquascaper skimmer gurgling sometimes when in bed also currently using eheim skim 350 and Purchased a new top skimmer for it that doesnt let shrimp and fish get sucked in so dont need the aquascaper one. 

Also added a load of bucephlandra from @Iain Sutherland thanks again . 

Still no fish in there apart from ottos that i am feeding pepper and sometimes algae waffers.

Dean





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## Karmicnull (22 Feb 2021)

Sitting playing with hardscape at the moment for my next venture, and it makes me really appreciate the balance you have here between the stone, the wood and the planting.  It looks beautiful and effortless, and I know fine well it's far from that!


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## SRP3006 (22 Feb 2021)

Looking really good Dean. I like the scape, plants have filled in really nicely. Wish I could keep my sand that tidy 😔
What are you thinking stocking wise or are you holding on until your planned rescape?


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## Ady34 (23 Feb 2021)

Pleased it’s going well mate


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## Deano3 (25 Feb 2021)

SRP3006 said:


> Looking really good Dean. I like the scape, plants have filled in really nicely. Wish I could keep my sand that tidy
> What are you thinking stocking wise or are you holding on until your planned rescape?


Thanks mate i just use 16/22 hose and hover 10mm or so above sand minding the shrimp to get the detritus off it mate and not sure  current decorating house so no time for rescape so may get fish sooner.

I love green neons and also like harlequin rasboras maybe one of them 
, green tetras shoul well what you think ? Numbers ?



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## Deano3 (25 Feb 2021)

Ady34 said:


> Pleased it’s going well mate


Thanks mate, amazing how eventually a tank seems to just click and hit a sweet spot then seems to need barley no maintenance . Certainly not complaining . 

I would like better colours so lights up to 60 percent but dont want to go to high as currently cant be bothered with regular trimming if you know what i mean as love the lower maintenance as so busy. 

Dean

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## SRP3006 (25 Feb 2021)

Deano3 said:


> Thanks mate i just use 16/22 hose and hover 10mm or so above sand minding the shrimp to get the detritus off it mate and not sure  current decorating house so no time for rescape so may get fish sooner.
> 
> I love green neons and also like harlequin rasboras maybe one of them
> , green tetras shoul well what you think ? Numbers ?
> ...


I have 30 wcmm in mine with 15 celestial pearl danio, I know they are all juvenile but i feel like I want to add some more. Maybe a feature fish I'm not really sure TBH,
Green neons look good in the scapes I've seen, as for numbers I'd say 30 would easily be a good place to start. They are quite small fish so you could stock more than the slightly bigger harlequins IMO.

And yes the shrimp are a pain when trying to clean the sand.,seem to want to follow the siphon 🤦


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## Deano3 (19 Mar 2021)

Hi everyone kitchen nearly done so hopefully will have more time for the tank and maintenance, also thinking of dipping my toe into a bit of photography so any advice or links etc welcome . 

Did a large maintenance session today and cleaned the filthy lilly pipes and added some seachem matrix into filter. 

In the filter now is 
1 empty tray
1 blue sponge
1 empty tray
1 (very thin blue sponge to stop matrix falling through tray) tray full of matrix
1 small red sponge

All prefilter sponges the red ones with karger pores.

Dont seem to be getting many baby shrimp but spotted some today, think will buy some more to bump up the population. Also no fish yet but hopefully not be long, think going to go green neons, you think be ok to add 20 at a time ?

Still enjoying this tank and love the 2 crpts that are growing so hoping to remove some of the rotala and add some crypts when next at horizon aquatics.

Loving as it matures the plants mixing and moss lying in areas and growing , still got a problem mid tank with flow as pinitifida etc struggles more here, also never done a proper rip up of plants and plat the tops bit not sure advanced enough yet 

Thanks for looking
Dean








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## Deano3 (4 Apr 2021)

Hi everyone tank still doing well had a large trim last week and upped lights to 80 percent today, found the water cloudy yesterday not sure what caused this so did large water change today and also have a major outbreak of pest snails any ideas best way to catch ? put some lettuce in bottom over night maybe. 1 or 2 of my crypts are starting to show after 7 months or so  and i love them they are stunning colours.

also some plants at rear looking a bit sorry for them selves so upped my AIO ferts to 20ml daily to hopefully make a bit difference. i have never pulled the plants and out and planted the tops so may be worth me doing them next trim what you think ? so advice on that would be very helpful.

lastly i purchased a decent camera so can do better pictures and updates, also wanted to take nice family pictures etc, purchased a SONY A6000 mirrorless with kit lens 3.5-5.6/16-50 seems great but a whole new world to me so been trying to get to grips and watching YouTube videos and reading etc. trying to learn the whole exposure thing with the shutter speed ISO and aperture 🤯 any advice on this or links etc would be very helpful and as always appreciated.

(p.s literally shot my images in raw so quickly took some there anyway in jpeg)
thanks and here is a couple of better pics for now.
dean


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## Deano3 (16 Apr 2021)

Tank doing ok still struggling with plants in middle of tank and still no fish as no stock yet, i was wanting green neons but may get something different any ideas? Maybe harlequin rasboras  wanted a good shouling fish thats why wanted a large group of green neons, how many fish do you think is safe to add at once 20 or so ? Was wanting 40 or so and maybe some nerites as had a few shrimp jumped lately and stuck in inlet so maybe snails will help a bit.

Getting some defficencys at the moment and some bbA so going to up maintenance. Anybideas what would cause this in the pinitifida? Maybe it needs totally removed and trimmed as a huge mound now

Thinking about putting into IAPLC just for the hell of it once got fish etc noyhing serious at all just think why not.

Thanks dean



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## Deano3 (22 Apr 2021)

Tank doing well however still got the defficencys above any ideas ?

How and what fish you recommend as unable to get any greens at the moment and how many you think to add straight away 20 ?

The moss is getting a little out of hand keep finding bits all over and having to pull off etc and starting to look a bit over grown and everything growing into other plants but ok for now.

Also my bloody marrys seem to be breeding well loads of babys 

Thanks dean







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## Deano3 (29 Apr 2021)

Ran out of co2 today and used my first 5kg FE and i had to turn the regulator over as didnt fit in the cabinet  so much cheaper thank getting a few 2kg ones but huge. Still debating what fish to get rummy nose tetras, harlequins or green neons  or do i wait till rescape to make it easier.



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## Deano3 (7 May 2021)

I know seems like not much changes on my tank but it is looking very full with all plants growing into each other and looking very natural, still waiting on green neons to be back in stock.
think i need to trim the stems soon as near the surface again, may remove some this time and replant the tops as never removed the bottoms yet of the limnophila hippuridoides .
Loads of baby bloody marys so hoping they get lovely and dark 

Lastly i need a better way to siphon water from tank as keep sucking up shrimp when doing the sand so need to get some sort of filter for eld of pipe and do sand separately. 









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## Karmicnull (8 May 2021)

That's looking really lovely!


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## Deano3 (8 May 2021)

Karmicnull said:


> That's looking really lovely!


Thats mate appreciate that, it must he very mature now as just ticks along worry free these days what is what you want i suppose.
Want to rescape this summer when off for a few days but always changing my mind on what i want, i will certainly reuse a lot of the plants though but be a nightmare getting the crushed lava rock from under substrate to reuse , wish i put it into sacks of some sort.

Dean

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## Karmicnull (8 May 2021)

I just scaped over the BH weekend - aiming for this style of tank.  Completely missed the target though!


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## Deano3 (19 May 2021)

Tank most certainly needs a trim tonight  after a little advice as i have never removed and replanted the stems but think i need to now.

Should i trim plants low then pull up the stem roots then replant the trimmed tops ?

Then large water change ?

Still havnt done a pic for iaplc will it be ok without any fish just for fun ? Not bothered really was just thinking why not.

Thanks dean





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## Deano3 (7 Jun 2021)

Hi all hope everyone doing well, small update did a huge trim recently, all ticking along nicely i only have 1 problem pest snails, i have had so many for as long as i can remember and i barley feed, i add a shrimp pellet every couple of days and some red pepper for the ottos every so often but the snails dont decline 

My moss is covered along with all the plants they are literally all over and the glass and i seriously need to do something but just dont know what wothout rescape and using all new tropica plants and using a new filter media so be totally rid. 

Nice pic of the shrimp that also love the moss and one of some snails on the glass but they are all over and thats a few days after a clean and WC.

Any recomendations.
Dean









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## Deano3 (9 Jun 2021)

Any hints or tips as to many to remove and when rescape dont want them if possible as so unsightly, i know they arnt causing harm but loads on glass and all over plants and have been for a long time even though barley feeding. 

Dean

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## Deano3 (11 Jul 2021)

Hi everyone quick update lights down to 50 percent or so and just ticking along effortlessly, upgraded filter to a 850 and also purchased a rector but not set the reactor up yet, the 850 flow is defently a bit stronger.

Only problem is the aquascaper inlet keeps sucking in small bubbles at the bottom of the float any ideas how to remedy or any tips ? Thinking about trimming the bottom off the float to see if makes any difference so further away from the glass bend. 

Thanks dean 











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## Deano3 (12 Oct 2021)

Hi everyone hope you are all well, this scape has been been plodding on nice and easy and pretty trouble free to be honest. Been stocking up on hardscape and hoping to rescape maybe this month but will certainly be doing a jurnal so will let you know still got a few bits to buy etc.

Took a few final images of this scape thanks for reading and hopefully you enjoyed the jurnal. It has been a great low maintenance scape and throughly enjoyed it and thanks everyone for you help 



Dean











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## Deano3 (12 Oct 2021)

Sorry for low quality images my tappatalk app doesn't seem to let me upload medium quality images and just says upload failed. Do many people pay for the vip ?

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## SRP3006 (12 Oct 2021)

Deano3 said:


> Sorry for low quality images my tappatalk app doesn't seem to let me upload medium quality images and just says upload failed. Do many people pay for the vip ?
> 
> Sent from my SM-G991B using Tapatalk


Try the actual UKAPS app @Deano3 . Tapatalk always had some form of issue in my experience.


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## Tim Lee (12 Oct 2021)

Beautiful tank, a real inspiration.
You never added any fish?


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## Deano3 (12 Oct 2021)

SRP3006 said:


> Try the actual UKAPS app @Deano3 . Tapatalk always had some form of issue in my experience.


I never knew there was a dedicated app i have looked on google play store and cant seem to find ? Tapatalk is a nightmare sometimes. 

Thanks  

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## Deano3 (12 Oct 2021)

Tim Lee said:


> Beautiful tank, a real inspiration.
> You never added any fish?


Thanks so much i appreciate that,I had rummy nose tetras in there but all died due to i susspect too much chlorine when did a water change and always planned more but wanted to rescape first and never got round to it buy this setup is just over a year old npw so pnce rescape will certainly be getting fish 

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## Ady34 (13 Oct 2021)

So pleased this tank settled into itself and has been relitively trouble free for you for a good period of time. 
The scape has matured beautifully and has some really rich colours.
Thanks for taking the time to share your experiences in this journal and I’ll look forward to seeing the next scape and following along.
Cheerio,
Ady.


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## Tim Lee (13 Oct 2021)

As a newbie could you explain why you would break down and start again when it looks so good?


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## Deano3 (13 Oct 2021)

Ady34 said:


> So pleased this tank settled into itself and has been relitively trouble free for you for a good period of time.
> The scape has matured beautifully and has some really rich colours.
> Thanks for taking the time to share your experiences in this journal and I’ll look forward to seeing the next scape and following along.
> Cheerio,
> Ady.


Thanks ady appreciate that and yeah it was a breeze for a long time just regualr weekly maintenance, thanks for following along and all your help and advice .

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## Deano3 (13 Oct 2021)

Tim Lee said:


> As a newbie could you explain why you would break down and start again when it looks so good?


To be honest i am bored with the scape and ready for a change, literally only touch for a hour and half during maintenance and want a different scape and change of plants and hardscape etc been running over a year and if i dont chance i will get bored in the hobby , hopefully push myself to do a better scape and learn some more . Bottom line just ready for a change and a new challenge and to see a tank mature and fill in.

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## SRP3006 (13 Oct 2021)

Deano3 said:


> I never knew there was a dedicated app i have looked on google play store and cant seem to find ? Tapatalk is a nightmare sometimes.
> 
> Thanks
> 
> Sent from my SM-G991B using Tapatalk


There ya go. Apparently only works for android though 








						Have  You Seen? - Install Forum as an App! (except for iOS/Safari)
					

Firstly what is this? This technology is called Progressive Web App (PWA) and what it enables the user to do, is convert a website/forum into an App/Icon on your mobile device, and you can have it on your phone home screen for example and with the added Push Notifications that I have enabled...



					www.ukaps.org


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## Deano3 (13 Oct 2021)

SRP3006 said:


> There ya go. Apparently only works for android though
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Thanks mate thats great 👍


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## Tim Lee (13 Oct 2021)

Thanks for the reply. 
Well look forward to your next tank!


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