vallisneria spiralis Not growing tall and sword leaves curling

[ceg4048]

I will try reducing the light a bit, at the moment it’s on 7 hours a day I will change to 6. I also removed about a third of the leaves and since the growth has slowed quite a bit. Although the crypt has also stared curling.

Hi,
It's unlikely that reduction from 7 hours to 6 hours will result in much of an improvement, although this is possible.

What is more important, by far, is to reduce the light intensity. If the intensity is significantly reduced, the photoperiod can be 7 hours or 8 hours or more.

It is not clear what type of lighting is being used, i.e LED or T5/T8 or the number of bulbs etc.

If multiple bulbs in a T5 or T8 unit are being used then one of the bulbs can be deactivated.
If an LED unit is being used and if a controller is connected, then it is a simple matter to reduce the power to a tolerable level.

If none of these options are feasible then determine a way to obscure the lighting using some type of barrier such as wax paper or using clip-on reflectors and turning them on the bulbs so that they interfere with the amount of light entering the tank.

Another way is to increase the use of floating plants to obscure the light. Some members prefer the use of duckweed, but there are a few other floating species that would work.

Cheers,

 

[Kerryn]

Hi,

OK that makes sense but makes thing more complicated, the light unit is a cheap led one so can’t be turned down easily but I can add more floating plants. I added dwarf lettuce while cycling but that all died pretty quickly leaving some frogbit, could it have died because of the ammonia I added?

Thanks.

 

[ceg4048]

Hi,
Well, CO2 deficiency is an extremely complicated problem and none of the solutions are very elegant. It's been estimated that 95% of problems in planted tanks are CO2 related, so it's not as if you will be able solve this problem by next week.

I studied your photos again more closely, and really, I must say that if this is anon CO2 enriched tank, it's really something to celebrate. The Sword plants has grown massive and looks robust, with good color. The crypt to the left also looks in good health. So do the Vals. I also see that the anubias has nice thick waxy looking leaves - at least the leaves out in front.

I do not see much algae on the wood or on other decor.

The only plant that looks doomed is the little fern attached to the shell in the front. That really should not have happened since it is shaded by the sword.
The tank looks otherwise in excellent shape.

As a result, my personal opinion is that you should probably accept the curled leaves as a compromise.

I also noticed in your OP that you are, or were, dosing EI levels of ferts.

If this is a non Carbon enriched tank then you really do not need to dose that much at all.

The reason I mention this is that feeding high nutrient levels causes the plants to demand more CO2 and conversely, feeding them more CO2 causes them to demand more nutrients.

So if you are feeding a large amount of fertilizer then this will expose the fact that there is a shortage of CO2.
EI dosing shown in your photo is typically associated with Carbon enriched tanks such as those with CO2 gas injection or daily Excel/Easycarbo (or equivalent) addition.

So again, if in fact this is a non Carbon enriched tank, you should consider lowering the dosage gradually over the next few weeks to reduce the stress of high CO2 demand.

That, in combination with the frogbit and adding some more lettuce might help.

I cannot really say for certain whether the ammonia killed the lettuce.
I don't really recommend adding ammonia to tanks because it does not really do what folks think it does and it causes damage that you cannot detect visually.

In any case, do try and add some more lettuce and see how it goes.

Cheers,

 

[Kerryn]

Thanks for the info, I’ve said it before but I really do appreciate the time you’ve taken to help!

It is non C02 and I guess it pretty healthy especially as this is my first proper attempt at a planted tank, also the fern is out of another tank and is slowly coming back to life.

I am ei dosing but only 20ml of each per week rather than the suggested 120ml so quite reduced already, do you think reducing further would be a good move?

The ammonia is horrible stuff but none of the other plants seemed to suffer and it got the tank cycled.

I have bought some lettuce from someone off here so will see how that goes.

Thanks.

 

[ceg4048]

Hi,
You're quite welcome.
I think you have done spectacularly well for a first attempt.

OK, well, yes i think you could cut it by half and still be OK, because of all those root tabs you have stuck in the sediment.
You can try the reduction and then see if you there are any improvements in new leaves.
The leaves that are already curled may never recover so you should probably look for improvements in the younger leaves.

I'm fairly certain that the tank doesn't cycle any faster than if you had not used the ammonia.

Ammonia is very toxic and that's why it is used to sterilize surfaces (i,e, kills bacteria). So it kills the bacteria that you are trying to grow, even the ones that use ammonia.

No one actually measures their bacteria, they only use a hapless test kit that really cannot tell the truth and they use this reading as a proxy for the bacterial count (but that's another story).

In any case, let's see if you can get some improvements with the lettuce.

If you start to see the beginnings of nutrient related algae then resume your original dosing.

Cheers,

 

[zozo]

The leaves that are already curled may never recover so you should probably look for improvements in the younger leaves.

Had this issue with a bunch of Crypts curling the leaf edges down, it never occured to me that to much light was the culprit. I asked but nobody had a clue, didn't got an answer.. But thinking back on the situation it makes complete sense it indeed was the light. Thanks for that, mystery finaly solved elsewhere. But indeed the curled leaves didn't recover, in the end saw most of them slowly melt off, i trimed them all out. And all went back to normal.

 

[Kerryn]

I think I will take out some of the curled leaves then, they are starting to look worse for wear. I will also reduce the ei dose for a couple of weeks and see what that does.

I have just added in the lettuce but it is getting washed about a lot so will try lowering the spraybar a bit to give it a better chance.

Thanks.