Ripe for Picking: a Guide to Collecting your own Bountiful Botanicals

[Guest]

I've spent an hour or so on Google trying to find some definitive info on the toxicity of azalea root, with not much luck. Some think it is toxic, but it's just opinion with no evidence to back it up. However, the degree of toxicity of the plant is influenced by climate, herbivore interactions, and possibly allelopathic interaction with other plants. So the degree of toxicity may vary spatially at both small and large scales. And therefore I should imagine over time too. Either way a very interesting subject. Takes me back to undergraduate plant ecophysiology.

https://www.jstor.org/stable/24763236

Also came across this

Rhododendron molle Chinese Azalea PFAF Plant Database

Rhododendron molle is a deciduous Shrub growing to 2.5 m (8ft 2in). See above for USDA hardiness. It is hardy to UK zone 7. It is in flower in May. The species is hermaphrodite (has both male and female organs) and is pollinated by Insects. Suitable for: light (sandy) and medium (loamy) soils...

pfaf.org

 

[Hanuman]

Found these pods in my wife's family operated school. What you all say this is and if it's aquarium friendly?

 

[John q]

Looks like star anise "Illicium verum" fruit/pod. no idea if it's suitable for an aquarium.

 

[Witcher]

Looks like star anise "Illicium verum" fruit/pod.

I'm afraid it's not, illicium verum pod has 8 nodes, this one has 6.

toxicity of azalea root

Grayanotoxins* (being present mainly in leaves and pollen of azalea) are water soluble so technically we could use azalea roots after some period of soaking.

*There is a very specific kind of honey made (by bees ofc) of pollen coming from azalea, rhododendron, leucothoe and couple of others of ericaceae family of plants and it's called a mad honey. Grayanotoxins (being present in pollen of most of these plants) are considered as neurotoxins an this honey is not an exception, has a highly hallucinogenic properties and (technically) some medicinal properties as well.
Ps. If you'll ever have a chance to try it, don't do it without another sober person being next to you (and controlling your behavior to some extent). Just saying.

 

[Hanuman]

Looks like star anise "Illicium verum" fruit/pod. no idea if it's suitable for an aquarium.

I'm afraid it's not, illicium verum pod has 8 nodes, this one has 6.

I should have taken a picture of the entire tree. I only realized this when I was on my way back home. The tree was gigantic though, not some bush or short plant. It was at least 15-20 meters high. The base of the trunk was a good 50-70cm in diameter.

I'm afraid it's not, illicium verum pod has 8 nodes, this one has 6.

I found. It’s Lagerstroemia floribunda also known as Thai crape myrtle:

NParks | Lagerstroemia floribunda

Grayanotoxins* (being present mainly in leaves and pollen of azalea) are water soluble so technically we could use azalea roots after some period of soaking.

*There is a very specific kind of honey made (by bees ofc) of pollen coming from azalea, rhododendron, leucothoe and couple of others of ericaceae family of plants and it's called a mad honey. Grayanotoxins (being present in pollen of most of these plants) are considered as neurotoxins an this honey is not an exception, has a highly hallucinogenic properties and (technically) some medicinal properties as well.
Ps. If you'll ever have a chance to try it, don't do it without another sober person being next to you (and controlling your behavior to some extent). Just saying.

This is what some people risk their lives in collecting in the Himalayas. It’s called the mad honey.
The effects are known to be pretty hardcore and potentially deadly if overdosed.

 

[AlecF]

Grayanotoxins* (being present mainly in leaves and pollen of azalea) are water soluble so technically we could use azalea roots after some period of soaking.

*There is a very specific kind of honey made (by bees ofc) of pollen coming from azalea, rhododendron, leucothoe and couple of others of ericaceae family of plants and it's called a mad honey. Grayanotoxins (being present in pollen of most of these plants) are considered as neurotoxins an this honey is not an exception, has a highly hallucinogenic properties and (technically) some medicinal properties as well.
Ps. If you'll ever have a chance to try it, don't do it without another sober person being next to you (and controlling your behavior to some extent). Just saying.

Just to be random and off topic, that 'poisonous' honey was also known as green honey and said to have been used in sacred rituals. One example is the theory it was used in the temple at Delphi by the Priestesses, who used their 'trips' to come up with the oracular prophecies they delivered. These days the only answer the oracle gives is "you need more CO2 in that tank."

 

[Buggy]

Partly to give my favourite thread a boost, but also to hear your thoughts on what I assume to be birch catkins.



Seeing the trunk would obviously help in identifying this tree but after looking in my book I've settled on birch. It that correct?

Can the catkins be used in a similar way to alder, or are they very much unsuitable for use in aquariums?

 

[dw1305]

Partly to give my favourite thread a boost, but also to hear your thoughts on what I assume to be birch catkins

They are.

Can the catkins be used in a similar way to alder, or are they very much unsuitable for use in aquariums?

They don't really have any persistent woody bits, they are just all seeds.

Cheers Darrel

 

[UrbanDryad]

Ohhh this is a very exciting thread! 😁

Ferns are a more difficult botanical to source, as many fall apart when they drop their fronds or shrivel up in autumn. This category of plants will be slowly added to over time, if you are a fern enthusiast who has kept a fern which makes a great botanical, let me know!​

I'm a fern enthusiast! I've been feeding dead fern parts to my terrestrial isopod colonies and they absolutely love them, but I will very happily grab some to experiment with in an aquatic setting. What sort of data do you want? What would make them great botanicals? I'm guessing things you'd want to know include: whether they alter the pH, how long they last, whether snails/shrimp eat them, whether they tint the water. What else am I missing? 🙂

Fern collection:

• Boston fern (Nephrolepis exaltata)
• Maidenhair fern (Adiantum raddianum)
• Cretan ribbon fern (Pteris cretica)
• Silver lace fern (Pteris ensiformis 'Evergemiensis')
• Leatherleaf fern (Rumohra adiantiformis)

I'm excited about the prospect of using houseplants for aquarium botanicals. I see the parlour palm is already on the list; I wonder what other houseplants would work... I know that calcium oxalate crystals are responsible for a lot of my favourite plant species being toxic upon ingestion (at least to humans and mammalian pets) - do calcium oxalate crystals have any bearing on aquarium toxicity, or does the 'delivery method' render them useless?

EDIT: Aha, I see Nephrolepis ferns have already been tested and found wanting.

 

[Tyko_N]

What else am I missing?

It would be great if we could check for toxicity, considering some ferns are carcinogenic, but no idea how that could be done in a simple and relatively quick way. The fact that your isopods eat them should hopefully mean that they're fine for shrimp though, with them both being crustaceans.

do calcium oxalate crystals have any bearing on aquarium toxicity, or does the 'delivery method' render them useless?

You occasionally see tanks completely full of Anubias, where there's bound to be at least a few decomposing leaves somewhere, so I should think they're fairly harmless. Aren't calcium oxalates more of a physical unpleasantness rather than a poison too? Sort of like eating a bag of fine nails won't be comfortable, but won't give you iron poisoning. My congo tetras even eat fresh Anubias shoots (to my great annoyance), although they try to eat pretty much anything...

If you're considering of adding aroid leaves I don't think they'll last long underwater unfortunately, if we go back to the Anubias, as soon as a leaf die it breaks apart fairly quickly in my experience, despite being very tough and rigid before. Worth a try to though if you have some extra space and time.

 

[AlecF]

I've been using small azalea branches for some time with no deaths of shrimp or fish.

 

[UrbanDryad]

It would be great if we could check for toxicity, considering some ferns are carcinogenic, but no idea how that could be done in a simple and relatively quick way. The fact that your isopods eat them should hopefully mean that they're fine for shrimp though, with them both being crustaceans.

Probably, although honestly I can't discount toxicity - generally dead isopods get eaten by the living very quickly. Although I suppose I'd probably see a knock-on effect if toxicity persisted in the bodies?

Aren't calcium oxalates more of a physical unpleasantness rather than a poison too? Sort of like eating a bag of fine nails won't be comfortable, but won't give you iron poisoning.

That was what I was thinking in re: 'delivery method' - an irritant rather than a poison - but I definitely wouldn't want to assume it's completely fine, especially when aquatic fauna might eat them and suffer the same effects. Unfortunately the houseplant toxicity lists I've seen focus on cats, dogs, and (on occasion) horses.

If you're considering of adding aroid leaves I don't think they'll last long underwater unfortunately, if we go back to the Anubias, as soon as a leaf die it breaks apart fairly quickly in my experience, despite being very tough and rigid before. Worth a try to though if you have some extra space and time.

Noted! Thank you 🙂

 

[tam]

Both these two people grow out the top of tanks, which I would imagine involves the occassional decaying part without any reported harm. I would imagine maidenhair ferns are too delicate to be very good for the aquarium though.

Boston fern (Nephrolepis exaltata)
Maidenhair fern (Adiantum raddianum)

Daphnia would probably be a good test I think @dw1305 is a fan of them as waterbutt safety signals.

I've this fern (not sure on the species) growing very well in the top of my tank, but I've checked and no brown leaves at all. Deciduous outdoor ferns might be a more reliable source?

 

[Wookii]

not sure on the species

Would love to get an ID on that if you can dig it out? It's always good to have a list of ferns that do well with submerged roots.

Ohhh this is a very exciting thread! 😁



I'm a fern enthusiast! I've been feeding dead fern parts to my terrestrial isopod colonies and they absolutely love them, but I will very happily grab some to experiment with in an aquatic setting. What sort of data do you want? What would make them great botanicals? I'm guessing things you'd want to know include: whether they alter the pH, how long they last, whether snails/shrimp eat them, whether they tint the water. What else am I missing? 🙂

Fern collection:

• Boston fern (Nephrolepis exaltata)
• Maidenhair fern (Adiantum raddianum)
• Cretan ribbon fern (Pteris cretica)
• Silver lace fern (Pteris ensiformis 'Evergemiensis')
• Leatherleaf fern (Rumohra adiantiformis)

I'm excited about the prospect of using houseplants for aquarium botanicals. I see the parlour palm is already on the list; I wonder what other houseplants would work... I know that calcium oxalate crystals are responsible for a lot of my favourite plant species being toxic upon ingestion (at least to humans and mammalian pets) - do calcium oxalate crystals have any bearing on aquarium toxicity, or does the 'delivery method' render them useless?

EDIT: Aha, I see Nephrolepis ferns have already been tested and found wanting.

I'm keen to hear your findings - I think dried fern leaves look great as botanicals, but I'm also cautious as to which ones are safe.

I recently added some Marsh Fern (Thelypteris palustris) to my emersed pots on my tank on the basis that being a dedicated bog fern, it should be happy with its roots in water (already have Maidenhair fern in there too, but it doesn't seem to get getting very big). I've also assumed (hopefully correctly) that is a safe for fish given it is sold as a marginal pond plant. I think its deciduous, so hopefully it'll drop some leaves for me to try underwater.

 

[dw1305]

Hi all,

You occasionally see tanks completely full of Anubias, where there's bound to be at least a few decomposing leaves somewhere, so I should think they're fairly harmless.

I'm pretty sure they are harmless.

if we go back to the Anubias, as soon as a leaf die it breaks apart fairly quickly in my experience, despite being very tough and rigid before.

True, as soon as they go yellow (the plants has withdrawn the chlorophyll) they decay fairly rapidly.

Daphnia would probably be a good test I think @dw1305 is a fan of them as waterbutt safety signals.

<"I am">.

I've this fern (not sure on the species) growing very well in the top of my tank

Would love to get an ID on that if you can dig it out? It's always good to have a list of ferns that do well with submerged roots.

That one is a "Sword Fern" (Nephrolepis sp.), either N. cordifolia or N. exaltata, you can see the thin green stolon growing obliquely across the photo.

I've got some that are doing very well (but not in the tank). I'll get a photo.
Nephrolepis cordifolia

Nephrolepis exaltata


cheers Darrel

 

[tam]

Would love to get an ID on that if you can dig it out? It's always good to have a list of ferns that do well with submerged roots.

Here's a leaf picture. I ran it through a plant ID app and it suggested a Fragile Bladder Fern (Cystopteris fragilis) but I think IDing ferns is a bit of an art lol It came from my brother who keeps terrariums and he probably collected it from somewhere so it's likely to be a UK native. It seems very happy and sends out hairy feelers which then form new shoots - I think there is one down the back if you'd like a baby one?

 

[Wookii]

I think there is one down the back if you'd like a baby one?

Yeah, I'd love one thanks, that'd be great. I'll drop you a PM.

 

[UrbanDryad]

Both these two people grow out the top of tanks, which I would imagine involves the occassional decaying part without any reported harm. I would imagine maidenhair ferns are too delicate to be very good for the aquarium though.

Boston fern (Nephrolepis exaltata)
Maidenhair fern (Adiantum raddianum)

Daphnia would probably be a good test I think @dw1305 is a fan of them as waterbutt safety signals.

I've this fern (not sure on the species) growing very well in the top of my tank, but I've checked and no brown leaves at all. Deciduous outdoor ferns might be a more reliable source?

View attachment 211046

Sounds like further impetus for me to start a daphnia culture, then 🙂

 

[dw1305]

Hi all,

I ran it through a plant ID app and it suggested a Fragile Bladder Fern (Cystopteris fragilis)

I don't think it is, although it looks similar and C. fragilis does grow on wet rocks. This was one was in Derbyshire, growing on a tufa dam on the river Lathkill <"Brittle Bladderfern (Cystopteris fragilis)">. It isn't a common plant in the S. of the UK, but more frequent further N.

It seems very happy and sends out hairy feelers which then form new shoots

I think the presence of runners is why it is a Nephrolepis sp.

If they don't have <"tubers"> on the runners? It is likely to be a Nephrolepis exaltata cultivar and possibly <"Nephrolepis exaltata "Smithii"> which has a "frilly" leaf.

cheers Darrel

 

[tam]

I think the presence of runners is why it is a Nephrolepis sp.

If they don't have <"tubers"> on the runners? It is likely to be a Nephrolepis exaltata cultivar and possibly <"Nephrolepis exaltata "Smithii"> which has a "frilly" leaf.

I checked and can't see any tubers. I also quizzed my brother and he confirmed he foraged in a reptile shop for this one and it was a 'boston fern' of some type - AKA Nephrolepis. - as usual Darrel nailed it! 😀