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Noob from Edinburgh

IrvineHimself

Member
Joined
22 Jun 2023
Messages
85
Location
Edinburgh
Okay, time for a belated introduction: I retired last year; have a number of health issues and was moved into an assisted living facility last Christmas. Not thinking in terms of lugging 20 litre buckets of water around, Aquascaping seemed like a great hobby which would not require a great deal of physical labour🤣 (I assure you, the python water change system is next on my shopping list)

Noting that I am a completely new to this hobby, I seem to be specialising in slow growing plants, and the tank has only been up and running for less than a month, you will want to see some photos :)

Public.jpg


Public View

Private.jpg

Private view

Looking from the public view, the left hand wall is planted with Weeping Moss as is the far right corner and the para-cord liana. The near right corner is planted with Christmas Moss as are the rocks which, together with the drift wood form a network of caves running the length of the aquarium.

In the foreground I have a large Anubis along with a few Pygmy Bucephalandra and some Crypts. I had a couple of Nana Anubis, but the rhizomes turned to mush. There is still one hanging on on top of the right hand piece of drift wood, its' rhizome is still okay but it only has one leaf😪

At the back I have a number of both varieties of Bucephalandra, along with rooting plants for which I cannot remember the name (I think they might be 'Lobellia Cardinalis'?)

This week, I also started to cultivate Red Root Floaters, for which, in conjunction with the sponge filter, I have set up air stones in the corners, each with their own thumbnail control valve to get them to gently circulate under the flood-light.

I want some more faster growing stem plants, preferably red, to camouflage the sponge filter; soak up nitrates, and provide a bit of colour. I am also looking for more epherites, of any colour, to replace the unfortunate Nanas

Oh yes, I almost forgot, I have also planted a couple of riparian plants: Pothos and Spathiphyllum, (see attached photos for the little plant holders I built from stainless steel mesh))

Livestock:
This is where I made the classic beginners mistake of being too quick with the cycling. After initially stocking with: half a dozen X-ray Tetras; 3 Rock Gobies [rarely seen] and 10 Cherry Shrimp [also rarely seen], I waited a week and, apart from an initial, very slight rise in ammonia, everything seemed okay. So, last weekend, I introduced: half a dozen Pygmy Corys, 10 Endlers and 2 Rabbit snails [also rarely seen]. As a result, I have been battling nitrite spikes all week. Ammonia and nitrates are perfect! In fact, the extremely low level of nitrates may be contributing to the BGA problem I mention in my initial post?

I would really like to get half a dozen Kuhlis; 3 more Rock Gobies a different, larger, more visible variety of shrimp and some Nerites. Also, once the mosses start to grow in, I would like a female Betta as a show-piece fish.

Lighting:
I tried a proper Hyger Aquarium light which rested on the tank, but bloody thing was constantly getting in my way and uses PLC technology that I considered archaic back when I was a student engineer. So, I bought an IP67, RGB+Daylight floodlight which is bolted to the roof of the tank alcove. Not only is it out of my way during tank maintenance, but I can program an automatic lighting schedule on my Google Nest. This schedule is currently a work in progress, and my initial unrealistic attempt to simulate a natural dawn through dusk environment may have contributed to my BGA problem.

Testing:
I initially bought the SeaChem 'Ammonia Alert' monitor, NT Labs 'Aquarium Lab' test kit, and, for convenient quick daily testing, the API '6 in 1' test strips. Now, with a bit of experience under my belt, I think I will use the SeaChem Nitrite/Nitrate test kit along with daily test strips that only test for nitrites/nitrates.

Subsequently, when designing my CO2 injector, I bought the JBL 'Easy 7 in 1' test strips to monitor CO2 levels. With regard to this product, I definitely feel suckered. Baring in mind the only reason I bought these strips was to test CO2 levels, the instructions are very obscure. Noting that they sell the same test strips at the same price with a colour chart to use in an app with a privacy policy that can only be described a abysmal and whose primary purpose appears to be to advertise JBL products, this obscurity appears to be quite intentional. What really irks however, is that the strips work by calculating changes in acidity from CO2 and comparing this to the KH value of the tank water. In other words, I could have got the same result from my API test strips, or, even better, a combined digital ph/temperature monitor.

CO2 Injection:
After looking into this, and in order to save money for more important things like the Python Water changer and good quality testing equipment, I decided to give the DIY approach a try. The two main methods appear to be vinegar or citric acid and baking soda, or fermentation. With a few mods, my system is basically based on this video.

CO2 Injector
CO2-Injector.jpg


The regulators are comprised of a thumbnail valve and a test tube filled with water. By cracking open the release valve, I have a degree of control as to how much CO2 is delivered to the tank. The purpose of the water filled test tube is partially to indicate if the valve is open and by how much, but also, to act as a diaphragm. In practice I may have to increase the depth of the test tube, but during pressure testing it seemed to work.

The scrubbers clean off any gunk from the fermentation

The CO2 check valves mean that I can initially start the fermentation with one vat. This will take a few days to get into full production, but towards the end of the cycle, I can connect up the second vat and start its fermentation thus delivering a constant supply of CO2.

Also, unlike in the linked video, I am using a proper CO2 diffuser.

However, as previously mentioned, I bought my CO2 testing strips under a misapprehension and, and, while the kit is installed and ready to go, I am reluctant to start the fermentation until I get a proper drop checker.

Well, That is me and my tank properly introduced.:rolleyes:

Edit: I forgot to mention I am using 'TNC Aquatic Plant Nutrient'
 

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Welcome :wave:
Tank looks really cool, and I take it you like a bit of DIY :thumbup:
If you dont feel like you really want to mess with CO2, running a non CO2 injected tank is really nice and cheerful without having to worry about that bit, and theres soo many plants you can grow anyway 😃
I would do a fair bit of water changes for a while to keep nitrites very low, and definitely delay more stocking until the maturity ("cycle") of the tank has caught up :geek:
 
Oh well, another day and another water change. At just over 1mg/l, nitrites are still too high, but, at just over 20mg/l, the improvement in my nitrate levels demonstrate I am starting to develop the correct levels of bacteria. [Note this was measured with the API test strips rather than the more accurate NT labs Aquarium Lab]

I suspect part of the problem is that, along with new livestock, at the weekend, I also introduced the Pothos into the tank. I am fairly sure that introducing the Spathiphyllum was the primary culprit in my initial spike in ammonia when I first stocked the tank with Tetras, Rock Gobies and Shrimp. Basically, I believe it takes a few weeks for terrestrial plants to adjust to an aquatic environment, and, as a result, while adjusting, they are constantly sloughing off dead cells. These rot and produce ammonia. After removing the Spathiphyllum a couple of times and thoroughly cleaning off all the gunk, I got the ammonia spikes under control. So, this morning, along with a major water change, I removed both riparian plants; gave them a thorough cleaning, and cut off any dead and/or discoloured tissue. The Spathiphyllum seems to be adjusting well to the new environment, but the Pothos, having only been recently introduced, had a fair amount of gunk to remove.

I take it you like a bit of DIY :thumbup: ....

Yes and no: I like designing things. Before dropping out to live in a tepee in the south of France I worked in R&D and, for my own entertainment, still do paper designs and costings for things like solar-powered e-bikes, secure operating systems, and even spaceships... etc, etc.

Anyway, I am glad you can all see past the initial mess of a newly planted tank to see the vision of my intentions. Many thanks for the encouragement.
Irvine
 
Hi all,
I suspect part of the problem is that, along with new livestock, at the weekend, I also introduced the Pothos into the tank. I am fairly sure that introducing the Spathiphyllum was the primary culprit in my initial spike in ammonia when I first stocked the tank with Tetras, Rock Gobies and Shrimp. Basically, I believe it takes a few weeks for terrestrial plants to adjust to an aquatic environment, and, as a result, while adjusting, they are constantly sloughing off dead cells. These rot and produce ammonia. After removing the Spathiphyllum a couple of times and thoroughly cleaning off all the gunk, I got the ammonia spikes under control. So, this morning, along with a major water change, I removed both riparian plants; gave them a thorough cleaning, and cut off any dead and/or discoloured tissue. The Spathiphyllum seems to be adjusting well to the new environment, but the Pothos, having only been recently introduced, had a fair amount of gunk to remove.
Cleaning up any dead tissue is a good idea, but I'm pretty sure that the emersed plants are not the culprits. Assuming that you do have <"measurable levels of ammonia (NH3) and or nitrite (NO2-)"> the issue is the fish, and you just need to keep changing water until the <"plant / microbe biofiltration stabilises">.

I know everyone will tell you to "test, test, test", but many of the <"test kits we have available to us"> aren't really accurate enough to base decisions upon, <"so I don't">.

cheers Darrel
 
I now feel doubly sick about the '7 in 1' JBL test strips I mentioned in thread starter. I was exploring the site a bit more and just found the CO2 calculator. A brilliant idea and many thanks to whoever developed it:D
 
Im not sure the charts can be used at all to measure real CO2 in an aquarium. This calculator appears to be based on such a chart, its just rewrapped into an interactive design.
Didnt know we had a link to this on the site tbh.
As far as I know the charts are only applicable to pure water in a laboratory setting, not something as complex and with multiple acid sources other than carbonic acid such as an aquarium.
Ill tag in @Hanuman who likely knows more about it.
 
Im not sure the charts can be used at all to measure real CO2 in an aquarium. This calculator appears to be based on such a chart, its just rewrapped into an interactive design.
Didnt know we had a link to this on the site tbh.
As far as I know the charts are only applicable to pure water in a laboratory setting, not something as complex and with multiple acid sources other than carbonic acid such as an aquarium.
Ill tag in @Hanuman who likely knows more about it.
Pretty useless indeed. This Rotala Butterfly CO2 calculator is merely based on the infamous PH/KH chart that has been polluting aquarium knowledge since the dawn of humankind, at the very least.

Screen Shot 2023-06-26 at 13.57.41.jpg
screen-shot-2010-10-05-at-5-00-45-pm.png

@IrvineHimself Simply target as a starter a 1 PH drop from a degassed water sample of your tank and you will be good to go.
 
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Hi all,
Shout it loud, Pothos is innocent!
I'm shouting.
Im not sure the charts can be used at all to measure real CO2 in an aquarium. This calculator appears to be based on such a chart, its just rewrapped into an interactive design.
Like @Hanuman and @Hufsa have said, based on the chart. The derivation of the chart, and the assumptions it makes about the level of CO2 in the tank, have had a <"quite a few run-outs on the forum">.

I'm <"not a CO2 user">, but if I was? I'd <"use a drop checker">, partially because <"I'm too mean to spend out on a good pH meter">.

cheers Darrel
 
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Pretty useless indeed. This Rotala Butterfly CO2 calculator is merely based on the infamous PH/KH chart that has been polluting aquarium knowledge since the dawn of humankind, at the very least.

That makes a lot of sense: When I first realised how the JBL test strips worked, I was pretty sceptical about the whole idea. I mean, in a real, live working aquarium, there are just far too many factors at play. But then, seeing the calculator on this site, I thought: "mmmm, Maybe there is more to this than I thought."

Thanks for clearing that up. You just saved me a lot of expense, I spent a couple of hours early this morning looking for a Wifi or USB based PH/Thermometer I could plug into my computer network. Although, having said that, I feel even more suckered by the JBL tests strips who's primary purpose, in my opinion, is to induce even bigger suckers to load an app that will hoover up personal data.:rolleyes:
 
Hi all,
I spent a couple of hours early this morning looking for a Wifi or USB based PH/Thermometer I could plug into my computer network.
You can get them "plug and play", some people have DIY'ed their own with a <"Raspberry pi"> or <"Arduino boards">. There are also <"Inkbird temperature controllers"> (scroll down past the BBQ section). This is a Marine Raspberry pi example <"reef-pi Guide 6: pH Monitoring">

In terms of electronic control / measuring temperature should be fine, but I'd be a <"little bit wary about pH">. It isn't a route I'm ever going to go down, <"but if I was">? I would want <"a solid state">, (have a look at @ian_m 's comments) <"ISFET pH probe"> with REFET technology.

Personally, <"as a luddite">, I'm a <"spirit thermometer fan">, they don't have anything that can go wrong and last eternally (or until you drop them). I also use the <"snail-shell index"> now as my pH / dKH monitor. I'm not a CO2 user so I don't need real time pH measurements

I know that <"inferential techniques and biotic indices"> may appear <"less scientific"> than test measurements with analytical equipment, but they have advantages.

cheers Darrel
 
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I actually find the JBL 7 in 1 test strips very useful, I use them all the time. Measuring CO2 with them is not though and I tell everybody this when I recommend them, specifically what’s been said above about not accounting for other acids in the water.

Where I find they are accurate is when it comes to the detection of the presence or non-presence of Nitrite and Nitrate, they may give inaccurate total amount readings at least for Nitrate I find that it states 100% more than actually present (erring on the side of caution for the user), presence detection for me is key not the total amounts and over time trending values.

°GH and °KH are fairly accurate as with the other indicators it’s ballparking values because it’s down to interpretation when you have mid values between the guide, if you know what you’ve added to water and in what amounts of things that adjust °GH and °KH then you gain accuracy by trusting the values being tested for.

pH can be wildly inaccurate and difficult to read especially with very soft water but with this test you have to read it immediately upon removing from the sample as CO2 in the water in the sample will start coming out of solution and the pad changes colour accordingly. Where it can be useful is confirming °KH as the sample after a few minutes will indicate above neutral pH, the stronger the colour change the higher the °KH.

The Chlorine test only tells me if the sample came straight out the tap or out of a tank that had undergone a waterchange without the use of dechlorinator and the sample was taken very soon afterward.

How I use the strips is that for safe parameters I’m looking for the presence of Nitrate and the non-presence of Nitrite. If I see only Nitrate and no Nitrite indicated then I can tell that the bacterial remediation in the Nitrogen cycle captured in that moment of time appears to be functional, when I say functional is that the bacterial assemblage within the aquarium is able to convert free Ammonia/um readily into Nitrite and Nitrate in quick order. If I detect the presence of only Nitrite and no Nitrate then I know that there is or has been a concentration of Ammonia high enough that it has or is still inhibiting the function of the bacterial assemblage that converts Nitrite to Nitrate. If I detect the presence of both Nitrate and Nitrite it tells me the bacteria conducting the nitrogen cycle is struggling to cope with the presence of Ammonia.

@dw1305 above posted a very good video in a correspondence discussion thread (he will definitely have the link) of a lecture by Tim Hovanec where there is talk on the Nitrogen Cycle, my takeaway from this (and it serves me well) is that there are two different assemblages of bacteria that complete the Nitrogen Cycle, the first of which converts Ammonia to Nitrite and the second assemblage converts Nitrite to Nitrate, the first assemblage constitutes around 70-80% of the total bacterial population and the second assemblage the rest, what is important is that the presence of Ammonia will inhibit the activity of the second assemblage.

Best way to improve removal of Ammonia is more surface area for bacteria to thrive on usually through increased filtration, you can improve that even further by adding more plants that both provide more surface area with the added benefit of being able to feed on it.

:)
 
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