Making biochar root tabs infused with urea ++

[FISHnLAB]

I feel you. I guess it has to do with the fact that in SG all is more expensive?, I don't know. In the meantime it just costs me 2.26USD to make my 1L DIY fert, so that's that 😂 - But I know not everyone is inclined to do DIY ferts or they just can't justify buying all the dry salts and hardware because they don't have enough tanks etc. That is understandable.

Yep, personally I will probably buy dry salts eventually but, at the same time with my current tanks, it costs me £21 per year to dose a full EI dose daily of NilocG so, it doesn't exactly break the bank lol. In fact, my opinion is its probably not worth getting into dry salts unless one wants another dimension to the hobby or more maintenance work really(or has a severe case of multiple tank syndrome maybe).

As I said though if people want to buy at those prices then I guess everyone is happy. Truth it only Denis is in a position to know if it's hurting him or not. My guess though is that his business is doing well, but that's just my opinion. I mean look at ADA, their prices are just insane yet people buy them.

I think most people that buy ADA do it for the Prestige of the name. Without Mr. Amano's namesake to exploit, ADA would go out of business pretty quickly I think. They are just like Apple, good at marketing and brainwashing the sheeple...

What color are the balls inside? The capsule itself is irrelevant as it will melt away.

No balls, just powder. Will the coating on the balls not melt away too just slower?

Yeap large difference. Please open that capsule. I'd be interested to know what's in them.

I believe the ingredients are listed on NilocG's site. They are a powdered mix so no fancy osmocote but, seam to work fine in my limited experience none the less.

😉 - I'll just post a recipe and leave all the cooking to you all.

Sounds good. You are a great member of the community👍.

Honestly I think Denis' root tabs have a lot good points except the price of course. Other than that I'm pretty sure his root tabs would be at the top of the list.

I'll believe it when I see the tests😁.

 

[FISHnLAB]

The NilocG root tabs are unfortunately just powder inside. If you have a sand cap then maybe they wouldn’t leech, but otherwise because they also contain just standard potassium nitrate as their no3 source they would just leach no3 into the water column.

I have been using them for at least 2 months in tanks with sand, clay gravel, and aquasoil without issue(no Ammonia or Nitrite detected at all and plants and wildlife thriving) and my gravel tank's Substrate is only 1.5inches deep in places. So, I'm not sure there is any issue with the powder fill other then maybe they potentially don't last as long without the slow release coating(only on part of the contents anyway right). Nilocg says they last 2-3 months I believe but, who knows. Maybe someone who has used them longer knows?

 

[dw1305]

Hi all,

Magnesium Ammonium Phosphate is micro-soluble in water, so very slow release of nutrient, acid conditions speed up the release.

That would work, but there are only traces of phosphate (PO4---) and even by the time you've taken the <"quoted as P2O5"> into account it really is just a trace (~0.25% PO4---).

To convert P2O5 to P you multiply by 0.436.

If you want to know how much PO4--- that is, it is bit more complicated because you need to know the percentage of P in P2O5 (43.7) and the percentage of P in PO4 (32.6), the divide 43.7/32.6 = 1.34, so 10 mg/L P2O5 = 13.4 mg/L PO4, to go the other way around PO4 to P2O5 its 32.6/43.7 to give you multiply by 0.747.

Same for the magnesium (Mg), quoted as the oxide (MgO), so 0.6% MgO is only ~0.36% Mg++. (24.3/ (24.3 + 16)) = 24.3/40.3 = 0.6 & (0.6 * 0.6) = 0.36. The formula for magnesium ammonium phosphate is (NH4)Mg(PO4).6H2O, so that is 1 : 1 : 1 as a ratio. This means there is a lot of "spare" TAN (NH3 / NH4+) to mop up.

Urea (CO(NH2)2) would be a lot safer, and you could always use another sulphur (S) source to reduce pH.

cheers Darrel

 

[Hanuman]

I believe the ingredients are listed on NilocG's site. They are a powdered mix so no fancy osmocote but, seam to work fine in my limited experience none the less.

Potassium Nitrate, Potassium Phosphate, Potassium Sulfate, Magnesium Sulfate, Boric Acid, Iron DTPA, Iron EDTA, Ferrous Gluconate, Manganese Sulfate, Zinc Sulfate, Cobalt Sulfate, Sodium molybdate, Nickel Chloride, Iron Rich Clay, Mineralized Top Soil.

Those are mere dry salts in powder form then. Adding them in a capsule and shoving them in the substrate would definitely leach in the water column in less time it took you to add them. Good things is those salts are safe but I don't really see the point in adding them in a capsule. Adding it in the water column would be virtually the same.

 

[FISHnLAB]

Those are mere dry salts in powder form then. Adding them in a capsule and shoving them in the substrate would definitely leach in the water column in less time it took you to add them. Good things is those salts are safe but I don't really see the point in adding them in a capsule. Adding it in the water column would be virtually the same.

I disagree. With a thick sand cap I think they should last quite a while. I personally don't think nutrients leach into the water column though 3 inches of fine to medium sand, just for instance, very fast at all. Considering NilocG recommends refreshing only every 2-3 months, and they probably like to make money, I don't see why they wouldn't recommend more often if they did leach that fast. I have also personally observed left over powder in the Substrate months after using other clay based tabs(API Root Tabs). Now, how much of that is nutrients vs clay or other filler is up in the air but, the clay is a fine powder too and stays put even after dozens and dozens of 80% Water changes. Others have also observed good plant growth in heavy root feeding plants several weeks or even months after adding root tabs with no additional water column dosing. I just really think people underestimate a sand caps ability to isolate what's underneath from the rest of the tank. I mean it even traps gasses...

 

[Freshflora]

I disagree. With a thick sand cap I think they should last quite a while. I personally don't think nutrients leach into the water column though 3 inches of fine to medium sand, just for instance, very fast at all. Considering NilocG recommends refreshing only every 2-3 months, and they probably like to make money, I don't see why they wouldn't recommend more often if they did leach that fast. I have also personally observed left over powder in the Substrate months after using other clay based tabs(API Root Tabs). Now, how much of that is nutrients vs clay or other filler is up in the air but, the clay is a fine powder too and stays put even after dozens and dozens of 80% Water changes. Others have also observed good plant growth in heavy root feeding plants several weeks or even months after adding root tabs with no additional water column dosing. I just really think people underestimate a sand caps ability to isolate what's underneath from the rest of the tank. I mean it even traps gasses...

I agree with everything here. Vin Kutty took water column measurements with lab equipment in his insanely loaded up substrate with a sand cap and found there was zero leaching. Also, there are for sure benefits, at least for some plants, to focusing on mainly root feeding at least when it comes to producing the most aesthetically pleasing specimens (such as some lythracae) or growing them successfully in higher KH tap waters. The NiloCg root tabs just may not be the best option for people without caps like those with pure aquasoil who want to maintain tight control of their dosing parameters because the nitrate is just going to go straight into the water column.

 

[plantnoobdude]

I agree with everything here. Vin Kutty took water column measurements with lab equipment in his insanely loaded up substrate with a sand cap and found there was zero leaching. Also, there are for sure benefits, at least for some plants, to focusing on mainly root feeding at least when it comes to producing the most aesthetically pleasing specimens (such as some lythracae) or growing them successfully in higher KH tap waters. The NiloCg root tabs just may not be the best option for people without caps like those with pure aquasoil who want to maintain tight control of their dosing parameters because the nitrate is just going to go straight into the water column.

There is a difference between him putting straight soil, clay and whatnot which will somewhat absorb the nutrients as well. to adding KNO3 powder into sand substrate. And it’s not like he didn’t see leaching either. he had a massive algae bloom from nutrients leaching. I honestly don’t think there’s any benefit to adding KNO3 to substrate especially sand. Maybe K, but usually K is usually plentiful in our collumn anyway.

 

[X3NiTH]

That would work, but there are only traces of phosphate (PO4---) and even by the time you've taken the <"quoted as P2O5"> into account it really is just a trace (~0.25% PO4---).

I think the intention is not 1:1:1 and entirely MAP but instead forming a conglomeration matrix of MAP that holds the compounds together isolating pockets of Ammonium between the MAP so the release is inhibited. From what I read on Osmocote manufacture it’s the same compounds as the ones discussed here and it’s a precipitative reaction to form the uniform sized granules, drip formed under gravity. I’m going to assume that the substrate to form this precipitation reaction is an alcohol (? IPA/PolyGlycol etc which start to boil at around 50°C ish) and the reaction chamber is being heated so that the prills falling evaporate the alcohol before they hit the bottom otherwise they’ll re-solubilise into a slurry at the bottom of the collection chamber. An aid to the slow release is a dried Linseed oil coating of the prills (the traces I assume will be mixed in this oil).

I might be wrong but I can’t see both Ammonium Sulphate and Magnesium Nitrate not immediately solubilising entirely once you are through the Linseed Oil slow release coating or if it’s damaged unless they are contained within a precipitate.

The method of manufacture may be why it’s slightly expensive (unless it’s straight up price gouging).

🙂

 

[dw1305]

Hi all,

I think the intention is not 1:1:1 and entirely MAP but instead forming a conglomeration matrix of MAP that holds the compounds together isolating pockets of Ammonium between the MAP so the release is inhibited. ........ I’m going to assume that the substrate to form this precipitation reaction is an alcohol (? IPA/PolyGlycol etc which start to boil at around 50°C ish) and the reaction chamber is being heated so that the prills falling evaporate the alcohol before they hit the bottom otherwise they’ll re-solubilise into a slurry at the bottom of the collection chamber. An aid to the slow release is a dried Linseed oil coating of the prills (the traces I assume will be mixed in this oil)............

I didn't know that, I'll see what else I can find. There has to be a reason.

cheers Darrel

 

[X3NiTH]

My reasoning for assuming a precipitate is because I’m reminded by a dry/semi dry precipitation reaction in one of my previous remineralisation mixtures I stored in little baggies for ease of use and the Potassium Phosphate reacted with the Calcium Nitrate (owing to Calcium Nitrate having an affinity to absorb water the compound wasn’t entirely dry, slightly greasy to the touch, in hindsight I should have baked it beforehand) and forming an Apatite like precipitate. The conglomerated mixture formed small round rocks hard as Teeth, at this point I’d assumed the mix was done and unusable but out of curiosity or laziness to weigh out fresh I used a baggy at water change a while back and it took about 3-4 weeks for the Calcium Phosphate rocks (around 5mm diameter) to fully solubilise. Magnesium Sulphate was also in the bag so it may have joined in on the reaction but no Ammonia compounds were present.

🙂

 

[dw1305]

Hi all,

I'll see what else I can find

This is a some controlled release fertiliser bits here <"Controlled-Release Fertilizers in the Production of Container-Grown Floriculture Crops">.

.......Controlled-release fertilizers are also called coated or encapsulated fertilizers because the release is controlled by a polymer coating that contains a water-soluble fertilizer. The first coatings were made of sulfur urea. Due to cracks or uneven thickness of the coating, these materials produced irregular results. Today's coatings are made of resins allowing for better control of nutrient release. These modern coatings are made of acrylic resins, polyethylene, waxes and sulfur. The two main families of common resins in use are the alkyd-type resins (e.g., Osmocote) and polyurethane-like coatings (e.g., Polyon, Plantacote and Multicote). The release of nutrients from the prills (the small spheres made of coated fertilizer) is controlled mainly by the thickness of the coating and the temperature..........

cheers Darrel

 

[plantnoobdude]

I'm on a quest to making root tab clones of the APT Jazz root tabs. Why you ask? Simple, because I want to and because I need to find something to do in my boring life 🙂
I might be wrong but APT Jazz seems like biochar infused root tabs so maybe I'll fail, but we will all learn.
So I can find bamboo biochar, easy, and I have a stash of urea + other compound laying around that need to be used before I die.
So, the question is, how would you go about and infuse the biochar with those ferts? I was thinking of preparing a really concentrated solution of urea + potassium monophosphate + potassium chloride (or sulfate) and dump the biochar in there for a good several hours to make sure it's fully saturated. I have no clue if this is the proper way of doing it or if it would even work so I thought I would ask before starting this silly experiment and to see what the community has to say about it.

Roger, over and out.

Did this experiment ever get finished? I'd love to try once I get soil.

 

[Hanuman]

Did this experiment ever get finished? I'd love to try once I get soil.

I haven’t been able to source quality biochar although I could use charcoal but I think it wouldn’t be very effective.