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Live food cultures

dw1305 said:
Hi all, I keep <"Grindal worms">, <"Micro-worms">, <"Vinegar Eels">, <"Daphnia">, <"Asellus, Crangonyx pseudogracilis"> and <"Black-worms">. I also "ranch" Blood-worms and Mosquito larvae. I would normally have <"vestigial winged Fruit-flies"> as well, but I don't have a culture at the moment.

I was going to suggest buying a copy of Mike Hellweg's <"Culturing Live Food"> but that doesn't look to be an option, unless you win the lottery. I'm offering a discount on my copy, yours for just £400 (plus p&p) but only for friends😵.

Vinegar Eels are good for very small fry, particularly ones that swim high in the water column. They are practically no maintenance to keep, but fiddly to feed.

I've had the same Grindal and Micro-worms cultures for ~10 years. I keep the Micro-worms in the coleslaw pots you get from supermarkets etc. I feed them on rolled oats, and I sub-culture them every 6 weeks or so. My Micro-worms may be Banana worms, but in use it doesn't matter. They eat yeast, rather than the oats themselves, but when you buy them the worms bring the yeast with them. They are good for fry, and some adult fish are keen on them. They are a favourite food item for Threadfin Rainbows and Dwarf Corydoras.

Grindal worms I keep on potting compost in one litre ice cream tubs. They also get oats, I grind rolled oats, but you can use "Instant Oat" cereal. There are a couple of problems with Grindal worms cultures, they tend to boom and bust, and it is really difficult to keep <"Cereal and House Mites out of the cultures">. I've learnt to live with Mites and I add a couple of red-worms (Lumbricus rubellus) to the culture, to act as a "Canary". I keep four cultures at any one time, this means that I haven't lost them all in a "crash".

Grindal/Micro and Vinegar eels are productive all through the year.

I don't keep specific cultures of Daphnia, Asellus or Lumbriculus any more. They have all done well outside in water butts and/or buckets, and I also get Blood-worms and Mosquito larvae from these in the summer. I keep a few Black-worms (Lumbriculus) inside during the winter (just in ice-cream containers, with some moss & floating plants) as an insurance, and there are normally a few in the filter as well.

cheers Darrel
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any tips on culturing microworms without the god awful smell?

I've got some hungry clown killifish, and looks like I'm going to need to feed them live; I've cultured microworms before, but the smell isn't the best. Unless I just sub-culture every couple of weeks, might be a solution?
 
Aqua360 said:
but the smell isn't the best.
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How you doing this? I did the porridge oats and yeast version and it isn't that bad just the smell of yeast when you open the lid which isn't the worst smell in the world. My understanding is when it smells vinegary it's time to start a new culture. The only issue I have is they are so small nothing seems interested in them.
 
Hi all,
AverageWhiteBloke said:
I did the porridge oats and yeast version
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I use porridge oats (cheap at Aldi, Lidl etc) as well, and the cultures don't smell. I've never tried dried instant potato, but I think these cultures smell more.

The worms bring the yeast themselves (so you don't actually need to add any), but if you want a lot of worms quickly you can add yeast (the worms actually eat the yeast, the oats are just the substrate for the yeast).

I keep mine in the clear pots you get for coleslaw, hummus etc. in the supermarket. I just punch a couple of holes in the lid, and re-culture every 6 weeks or so (small blob from existing culture into the dried oats, moisten and then adjust the moisture with water or more dry oats).

Usually the culture looks a bit like hummus, and you can see a surface sheen, caused by the worms moving. When it gets wetter (it looks more like emulsion paint) I add some more oats, when the surface dries out I usually re-culture.

cheers Darrel
 
When i did microworms i had them in plastic tubs (icecream tubs and so). I mixed oatmeal with water and put it in the microwave till quite "solid" (like thick porridge i guess), let it cool and add fresh worms. I kept spare cultures in a fridge (stayed good for over a year). In the feeding tubs i put strips of coffee filter. The worms would cover those and then i could use a brush to wipe them off and feed them without touching the oatmeal. Transport a few scoops of the oatmeal to the fresh batch and you can keep them running.
 
dw1305 said:
if you want a lot of worms quickly
Click to expand...

In the early days we did it in the garden with an old charged car battery, some wire and 2 screwdrivers, connect all to the battery stick the screwdrivers into the ground, wait a few minutes and they all come up, ready to collect. 🙂
worm.jpg
 
Hi all,
zozo said:
In the early days we did it in the garden with an old charged car battery, some wire and 2 screwdrivers,
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I've tried that, and washing up liquid, but "English Mustard" powder (Sinapsis alba) works really well.

I don't fish any more, but if I did our compost bin (a large concrete block structure) has tens of kilo's of worms in it.

cheers Darrel
 
Hi all,
Edvet said:
I kept spare cultures in a fridge (stayed good for over a year).
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That is useful to know.
Edvet said:
In the feeding tubs i put strips of coffee filter. The worms would cover those and then i could use a brush to wipe them off and feed them without touching the oatmeal.
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With a "see through" container you can see the worms extending up the side of the tub, and you can just swab them off the side with your finger (or a cotton-bud).

cheers Darrel
 
dw1305 said:
With a "see through" container you can see the worms extending up the side of the tub, and you can just swab them off the side with your finger (or a cotton-bud).
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I never got them "up" over the oatrmeal more then a few milimeter, but you can almost cover the substrate with filterpaper and use the whole surface to collect without the risk of collecting "porridge" too🙂.
 
Edvet said:
I never got them "up" over the oatrmeal more then a few milimeter, but you can almost cover the substrate with filterpaper and use the whole surface to collect without the risk of collecting "porridge" too🙂.
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Mine are all up the sides and on the lid.d529a19fe4e556517004da4733de848f.jpg61fddddd83e61559761b3cb73a7a82e1.jpg

Sent from my STH100-2 using Tapatalk
 
dw1305 said:
Hi all,Time to re-culture.

cheers Darrel
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Ahh OK, thanks for the tip. It's only 6 days old this one. Been saving Chinese food tubs so I might as well get another one going in case anything happens to this one.

Sent from my STH100-2 using Tapatalk
 
While we're on the subject, I harvest mine with an ice lolly stick and just scrape it off and straight in the tank. Worries me about the amount of yeast in the water column, can it cause problems?
 
AverageWhiteBloke said:
f yeast in the water column, can it cause problems?
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"in the old days; grandpa said": there was a theorie yeast would be beneficial, so we got a packet of bakers yeast, dissolved it in a liter of tapwater, and dispensed this straight in the tank😛.
Never hurt, not sure it was realy beneficial either
 
dw1305 said:
Hi all,Brilliant, just add some more oats, and it should calm down.

When they explode like that usually you go into boom and bust usually it is when you've added some more yeast.

cheers Darrel
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Yeah I added a pinch of yeast on this one with it being my first but as you say I'll just use the yeast that comes in with some worms on the next one.

Sent from my STH100-2 using Tapatalk
 
Edvet said:
I've been messing around with live food cultures a lot last year. Had microworms (3 spp) (on oatmeal), no problems, but didn't need them anymore so neglected (and lost) cultures. I've had vinegar eels but didn't manage to keep those longer time.
Hyalella mexicana: ( aka scuds) finaly got a culture going ( bought starterpack in Germany). They are easy now, i put them in just a small tank, but also had them in all kind of tubs. I feed them cucumber. These i collect for my big tank mainly, the scuds are a bit to big for most small fish (apisto and smaller). The non eaten ones stay alive in the tank and are eaten when they are noticed. I've tried them in large quantities in a smaller tank ( breeding, so all sizes where in it), to see how self sustaining they where, but they harassed/ tickled a pair of apisto's that much in the night they jumped out of the tank (at least i guess that happened). These can be in lower numbers and probably sustain themselves in a densly planted lightly stocked tank.
Enchytreae en grindal worms: soil based cultures tend to crash every now and then, and i have mites on them ( these could originate from feeding bread). When i started them on clay granulate (Seramis) they are much more stable. When a culture starts to smell i can just rinse it in tapwater, carefully so the worms don't wash out, and feed them again. Mites are having a far harder time on granulate, and removing them after the food is gone is 1) easier and 2 ) more effective . I am sure i can get rid of them eventually. I feed the worms with soaked dog kibble, (soak in hot water for 30-60 mins, squash them onto the surface) , refeed when it's gone. I put a plastic card on top of the food, the worms will crawl onto that an i can brush them of with a wetted brush and dip that in the tank. I have found that the worms will need a bit of air, so leave a corner open or use a non- airtight container. Due to the high quality dogfood i believe this is a good food. I've used these exclusively on fish during a long time and ketp them healthy, and not to fat.
I've tried, and failed on Moina. but i want to try those again.
Brineshrimp: i've done those, but always found them to be a bit tedious. I am trying the daphnia dish right now (by Hobby)
grindal/enchytraeen
37241208201_06383c20e2_c.jpg20170922_120057 by Ed Prust, on Flickr

Hyalella mexicana
36986067480_b2a8172289_c.jpg20170922_120258 by Ed Prust, on Flickr
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Hi Edvet, I like the idea of using clay for grindal cultures. Do you reckon I could use some Seachem Flourite- which clay based- mixed with some gravel?
 
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