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Leaving hobby or move to Low Tech (260 litre bow fronted tank)

Hi all,
sciencefiction said:
If you ask me, I used too tick layer of soil, the sand was too fine acting as a concrete wall, and the soil was killing the plants within days so they couldn't even spread roots to ease the problem.
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I think your probably right, the substrate became anaerobic and probably fairly acidic in strongly reducing conditions.

cheers Darrel
 
sciencefiction said:
The product I used was JBL aqua soil, so shouldn't have been toxic. It was capped with JBL sansibar black. One or the other, or both combined didn't agree with either plants or fish. The tank and filters had been running for years prior to that.
If you ask me, I used too tick layer of soil, the sand was too fine acting as a concrete wall, and the soil was killing the plants within days so they couldn't even spread roots to ease the problem.
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Perhaps I've misunderstood but did you use plain aquatic compost or JBL aqua-soil? Either way how deep was the soil layer, can you remember?
 
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Troi said:
Perhaps I've misunderstood but did you use plain aquatic compost or JBL aqua-soil? Either way how deep was the soil layer, can you remember?
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My fault. My apologies. I called it aquatic compost because it's produced for an aquatic environment but its not really compost but the JBL aqua soil. I never really looked at the composition of it. It's probably available online.
I think I had about 4-5cm of soil layer at the bottom. I can't quite remember how much sand I put on top, but not as much as the soil.

It was a very bad experience as my fish started getting sick within 2 months of me putting that substrate. When I tore the tank down the substrate stunk of hydrogen sulphide, same as if you leave a filter not running and closed for a month. I've torn down other tanks and never ever smelled hydrogen sulphide from a substrate like that.

At some stage I replaced the JBL sand with a larger quartz sand I had and it somewhat eased the problem a bit with the fish along with daily water changes but the tank never really fully recovered plant or fish wise so it had to be torn down.

Also, for the record, the tank never measured any ammonia or nitrite after changing the substrate so it wasn't that affecting the fish or plants. I guess the two cycled filters had a say in this. But the TDS jumped up a lot and was very high for months which was annoying me because the soil specs claimed it doesn't change the stats. The TDS eventually dropped to tap water level after a ridiculous amount of water changes for months. I think that soil was quite rich in organics. In comparison, using mineralized garden topsoil didn't increase the TDS much at all.
 
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Sounds like you had terribly bad luck with that tank, something definitely wasn't right. Maybe it had something to do with that particular batch of JBL?
I have used a much deeper soil layer but that was with my mix of peat and aquatic compost, not least my latest and ongoing low-energy scape Cryptic Haven, which is also capped with fine sand and effectively sealed off from the water column. Both soil and sand cap are about 6cm deep at the back a total of 12cm.
 
Hi everyone, sorry I've not been on for an update for a while, to be honest apart from waiting for the postman not much has happened yet.

So, i havent yet taken down the 260 high tech as there are a few bits needed still and thankfully the c02 hasn't run out yet

I now have pool filter sand for my cap, the greenhouse mesh, powdered red clay, dolomite and muriate of potash.

My soil should be mineralised although it's still a little too wet wrapped up in a plastic tarp still. Not getting home until dark from work isnt helpful, i dare not leave it unwrapped all day alone in case of rain and cat dung!
So, ideally my soil could do with a bit more drying out time that way i think it would be easier to add the powdered clay evenly etc.
I've ordered a large piece of redmoor which will need soaking for a few days too. A couple of plants are in my tank still in their pots too. A couple of crypts and another 2 bolbitus
Been umming and erring over rock, i do have a couple of pieces already in the tank not sure what they are tbh as got them a couple of yrs ago from MAquatics locally, cant stretch to 12 kilo of manten stone at the moment so will go with what i have and buy plants instead.
Sorry, the laptop is on a go slow so its painful using my shiney new lg phone.
I had planned to do the change over this coming weekend but due to being behind on things it may be better to hope my gas lasts another week and hopefully I'll be fully prepped in another week, or i can go for it and add more plants next week when i order some or post a wanted thread on ukaps

So here's my existing plant list to see what i can use moving them from high to low tech.
Anubias barteri nana x 3 (2 are huge)
Crypt willisii
Crypt nevelli
Bolbitus heudelotii x 3
Stauro (lots but looking a bit tired)
Blyxa (lots, maybe 30 stems)
Aponogeton boivinianus x 2
Clinopodium brownei (maybe 35 stems)
Alternanthera reineckii pink

I'm ok with the crypts, bolbitus, anubias, and the 2 bulbs and hopefully the stems being clinopodium and blyxa japonica can at least be used to get things off to a good start?
I'm unsure about the Stauro as it's maybe not at it's best and there maybe a bit of algae bba in amongst it so may look to replace this with more stem plantage for early doors?

Plants I'd like are
Xmas moss
Echindorus unsure what yet
Java moss maybe
Suggestions welcome..........

So i have to say a big shout out to Hoggie took some great floaters from him last week and they're top notch, so thanks mate great big bunch of healthy plants

This maybe my last week with the tank as i know it, it's a first for me to take down a tank as only being in the hobby 2 and a bit years, this forum has taught me the bits i know so far and now begins my low tech experience, maybe it's back to front going high tech first, but oh boy what a fast learning curve
I'll post a pic of my wood (no pun intended) when it arrives, and a snapshot of my tank before it gets taken down, I'd really like to change my username too as this tank was a gift for my Mrs who uses the handle of Pinkmummy79, however i started planting and do all the work so after setting Fran up on the forum just let it ride im more of a Reddaddy67 but my friends call me Clive.
Laterz peeps
 
Yep you can't change your name now it's against the law...Ed's pic would make an epic avatar tho'
 
:clap::joyful:ha ha ha cheers chaps
ok, I'll remain as Pinkmummy79, it makes no odds, does sometimes cause amusement and maybe confuses others

Nice pic Ed, I would like to take up Troi's suggestion, would you mind me snagging this splendid likeness for my avatar?
 
Cheers Ed..

Question on raising my substrate level without increasing the depth of my soil or cap.

As I currently have akadama which will be coming out, could I use this inside a filter media bag? I presume the akadama wouldn't cause any anaerobic issues by being buried? this will be new to me, but with the 260 having quite a large footprint, it may give me more layout options if I can factor in some height, not lots just enough of a change to make it more appealing.

ta
Pink
 
Sounds like it could work well. I've used Tesco cat litter and inert silicon gravel before to similar effect. I have a dozen zip up filter media bags which I use in a modular way to build slopes etc.
 
Cool
cheers for that, gives me something to muse about..
I've not decided on my scape yet, although I have a few ideas it will need to come together slowly as paydays are monthly😉
so what stems I plant can always be changed at a later date, rocks etc can be added as I go but i'll hopefully get a few main plants to start with too.
off to read some more journals and try and get some inspiration now.
 
Right then, i'm finally giving some thought to additional plants and possible layout, I really need some rock, I also need another payday and would rather have everything in place to set this harsdcape up as I initially want it rather than shuffle things around in just two weeks, so I may get one more FE so I don't run out and into algae issues.
Hardn decision as I had planned on this weekend for the change but I just don't feel I would be giving my all if all I was doing it for was becuase my c02 wouldn't last! I want to be getting on with this bnow but haven't everything I need yet.
I need plants and rock, I like rock 🙂

anyway back to the nitty gritty..
Can anyone please suggest which of the following would be a better low tech option for a maybe not very compact carpet?
E-Tenellus or Lilaeopsis Brasiliensis? I like them both, maybe the Lil Bras better but i've read it's demanding and needs c02 to flourish? i'm sure i'm wrong as this was on my possible list of requirements...
thanks
Clive
 
[quote="Pinkmummy79, post: 785L3, member:Right then, i'm finng some thought to additional plants and possible layout, I really need some rock, I also need another payday and would rather have everything in place to set this harsdcape up as I initially want it rather than shuffle things around in just two weeks, so I may get one more FE so I don't run out and into algae issues.
Hardn decision as I had planned on this weekend for the change but I just don't feel I would be giving my all if all I was doing it for was becuase my c02 wouldn't last! I want to be getting on with this bnow but haven't everything I need yet.
I need plants and rock, I like rock 🙂

anyway back to the nitty gritty..
Can anyone please suggest which of the following would be a better low tech option for a maybe not very compact carpet?
E-Tenellus or Lilaeopsis Brasiliensis? I like them both, maybe the Lil Bras better but i've read it's demanding and needs c02 to flourish? i'm sure i'm wrong as this was on my possible list of requirements...
thanks
Clive[/quote]


Hi mummy.
Ive just set up a low/medium tech dirted tank as previously mentioned a few pages back and have primarily gone for crypts, crypts and more crypts which id like to add are all doing fantastically well.
I also planted some Lilaeopsis Brasiliensis along the front,with the intention of creating a lawn effect , which i fear will be soon overtaken by the ever expandeing crypts ,but its no big deal. What i can inform you is: lilaeopsis Brasiliensis is an incredibly slow grower, with an average of one new leaf per runner a week.at least it was in my tank.Thats if you can get the darn thing to grow in the first place!
 
cheers Wick, top stuff, I do prefer this plant tbh, slightly less uniform and maybe a tad shortter than tenellus, has a bit more character, it's on my hit list now.
ta
 
Yes that's fantastic, I must read all that thread again later when home from work, some great food for thought.

I have another noob low tech question please

As I do plan on keeping any plants I currently have in my c02 enriched tank, wel as much as I can and at least for start up until I can purchase all I would like, plants as listed above, will they not automatically start getting algae when placed in a low tech as they have been so used to the C02?
Such as happens in my current set up if I run out of c02 for a day, BBA shows up quite quickly.
I presume they may just need time to adjust? maybe crypts melting etc, should I be readying myself for some trouble, obvioulsy I would rather not be spot dosing my own glut mix in my soon to be low tech.
I'll be doing the stepped 50% water changes for a few weeks I presume regardless of having two fully establised large external filters until things settle fully or is this overkill?
 
Yes, some plants may need time to adjust if switched from high tech to low tech. But not a great amount of time, probably a few weeks or so, they may melt rapidly and stuff. Just cut the healthy portions and replant.
Algae wise, I play around with the light intensity/duration a lot at the start. It normally takes about two weeks for changes to take place for me. So for example if I've given too much light, in 2 weeks I can see a tiny start of algae forming. I then would decrease with an hour or an hour and a half duration wise, or decrease intensity and such but intensity seems to affect some light loving plants so you've got to watch each plant individually, and at the same time watch how the tank is doing overall. That's another two weeks wait to see if I've done right 🙂
Water changes are no problem, do as many as you like if you feel like. I do 50% on all my tanks every week, all low tech and there's no downside to it. You can get away with none as far as plants go but I still think my fish are happier this way and I see no downside to plant growth.

In a low tech in about 6 months to a year the most common nutrient deficiencies for me are potassium being N1 and then iron, but the latter is because my water is hard but I haven't had any iron issues in my soil tanks as I have red clay mixed in the soil in them. And I've been dosing nitrates too, probably because of my big water changes. I've never dosed other micros or macros.
 
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