Going Dutch by the book - tank sponsored by Tropica

[rebel]

Would love to see updates!

 

[Dr.Phantom]

This is going to be a beautiful planted tank, but I would rather call it a "Pseudo Dutch", it is far from a Dutch tank - too many rules of the Dutch tank are violated 😉 It is not "by the book", sorry.

Again, it is a beautiful planted tank.

 

[Pedro Rosa]

Guys, will try to update today. I swear 🙂

This is going to be a beautiful planted tank, but I would rather call it a "Pseudo Dutch", it is far from a Dutch tank - too many rules of the Dutch tank are violated 😉 It is not "by the book", sorry.
Again, it is a beautiful planted tank.

Can you specify?

 

[Dr.Phantom]

Can you specify?

I'll just comment on the few aspects:
1) for the tank of this size, there is too many plant species - 12 would be ideal, 13-14 would be O.K. (you have 16 something)
2) focal points are not well shaped, say, ludwigia is too much to the right, close to it is alternanthera (which is also red) - according to the rules of thirds, you've made two focal points at the same side of the tank, two reds one in fron of another. Crynum calamistratum is too much to the left, although it is a solitary plant and could make a good focal point (accordint to the rule of thirds). Also, there are too many red/coloured plants in the tank of this size - two would be more than enough, the rest of plants used could be of various shades of green. My opinion: there should be only two focal point oposit to each other. An example could be this:

3) what about the traditional "curtains" in the front corners? these are typical in the Dutch tanks that are made "by the book"
4) groups are not shaped very well and the borders between the groups are not very clear.
5) the side walls of the tank - the true Dutch tank is viewed only from the front side, etc. etc.

I'm not an expert in traditional Dutch aquascapes, but the points I've just mentioned are just a few violations of the Dutch tank rules, as far as I understand them 🙂

 

[LondonDragon]

Just have a look in this thread: http://www.ukaps.org/forum/threads/crash-course-dutch-style-aquascaping.8713/

 

[Robert H. Tavera]

I think the tank is a dutch tank, yes it doesn't follows al the rules but the feeling stills there. Also I've seen many real dutch tanks with more than too red plants and in some cases like in willem's tank an althernantera is agaist the wall of the tank surrounded by higrophyla!! The curtains are nota a rule.

40 Congo tetras!! That seems too much for me but.. Lets see how they look. Ir seems yo me rummynoses are the most used in dutch tanks.


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[Dr.Phantom]

That's the point - it DOES NOT FOLLOW ALL the rules. Then what's the reason in saying, that the author goes Dutch "by the book", which means "following the rules and instructions in a very strict way". Moreover, I do not understand one point: why should we call a planted tank a Dutch tank, if it is not. It's just a planted tank, as the rules of the true Dutch are not followed. So let's call a "spade" a spade 😉
Robert H. Tavera, In most of the NBAT A1 category tanks the "curtains" are present and this is the rule in the classical Dutch tank as they create a feeling of depth.

 

[Dr.Phantom]

http://www.daniorerio.nl/terugblik/district keuring ZHN 2013.pdf

 

[alto]

In most of the NBAT A1 category tanks the "curtains" are present and this is the rule in the classical Dutch tank as they create a feeling of depth.

This begins to sound more like a convention than a "rule" - if it were an actual rule, how could any tanks without the curtains be present, they would be disallowed 😕

Do you have links to 2014/2015 winners?

 

[Dr.Phantom]

alto,
Thank, "convention" seems to be a better word. Sorry, I am not a native speaker of Eglish 😳
As for the links to 2014/15 winners, I'm affraid I don't have them. I've come across 2013 winners by chance 🙂

 

[Pedro Rosa]

Well, I've been caught by the Dutch Tank Police. Help me I thought i could get away with this topic, but no

No for something serious 🙂

Yes, I know about those "problems" and you could also know that i know if you read the first post.
And I even wrote "Thank God that i don’t need to comply with some contest rules!"... things like the one you mentioned about the plants on the sides are more important for the contests and you can see many tanks almost without it. And yes, this is a Dutch Tank that does' t follow a few conventions but it's a NEW TANK! Please go easy because it's growing.

Most important: 1) this is a learning process for me (sorry, i'm in it for the hobby, not a professional!) and most important 2) you should know that a dutch tank just keeps on changing, mainly when you're not happy with it or if you really want tp maintain the rules and make the changes accordingly.
You commented on a tank with pictures from the fist 2 or 3 weeks. You have to think about that. The tank is not mature. The plant groups are not shaped, plants can change, etc... Dutch is about trimming, replanting, changing plant, etc.

Having said that, I'm really not a specialist on Dutch Tank, but I read about them on many good sources, some of them i quoted and Paulo repeated the quote for one of them.
Although not a specialist, this tank is getting attention for Dutch Tanks again, and for that i'm proud! At least in Portugal where i was invited to give a workshop with theory and planting of a Dutch Tank yestarday.

I'll just comment on the few aspects:
1) for the tank of this size, there is too many plant species - 12 would be ideal, 13-14 would be O.K. (you have 16 something)

My first post: "The rule of one plant for each 10 cm (with ~50 cm depth) should be respected. Could have more, but not for much." So I know!
But what really was funny about your advice is that you write on your topic that are making a Dutch by the book with 13 species on a 1m tank!!! You and me have more 30% of plants... exactly! 😀

2) focal points are not well shaped, say, ludwigia is too much to the right, close to it is alternanthera (which is also red) - according to the rules of thirds, you've made two focal points at the same side of the tank, two reds one in fron of another.

I know about the Ludwigia / Althernathera. I wrote: "Focal point: Rotala Macrandra and Ludwigia Palustris… red althernathera at the front can lead to Ludwigia at the back but this can also collide with the rule of two color plants next to each other (although they’re separated by Flame Moss) -> Opinions?"

Crynum calamistratum is too much to the left, although it is a solitary plant and could make a good focal point (accordint to the rule of thirds).

But Crynum is at the right to make that curtain you mentioned before!!! It's not to by a solitary plant.

Also, there are too many red/coloured plants in the tank of this size - two would be more than enough, the rest of plants used could be of various shades of green. My opinion: there should be only two focal point oposit to each other. An example could be this:

Yes, i know. I wrote: "- I'm seeing up to 4 strong colors in some well known dutchs, but they're 1,40m or 1,60m... so i could have a problem because i have four also on 1,20m", so i know that.
Funny you haven't used you suggestion also on you tank for the Focal Points (bottom third / upper third) 😉

3) what about the traditional "curtains" in the front corners? these are typical in the Dutch tanks that are made "by the book"
4) groups are not shaped very well and the borders between the groups are not very clear.
5) the side walls of the tank - the true Dutch tank is viewed only from the front side, etc. etc.

This is a 6 week tank. In here you have only pictures form the first 2 or 3 weeks. You're saying that groups are not shaped? really? ... of course!!!

Thank you very much for the time taken to analyse it and for the suggestions. Let's keep on getting the tank better and better.

 

[Dr.Phantom]

But Crynum is at the right to make that curtain you mentioned before!!! It's not to by a solitary plant.

Funny you haven't used you suggestion also on you tank for the Focal Points (bottom third / upper third) 😉
.

😀
Crynum is not a very good choice for the "curtain" 🙂 But it is your choice.

For the upper focal point I have ludwigia glandulosa and echinodorus lena (in front of rotala) for the opposite bottom focal point (though it is still too young and has not yet reached its full size).

PEACE!

As a fan of Dutch scapes I just wanted a good discussion and that's it. No offence. 😉

P.S. My tank is about 8 weeks after the restart, just a bit older than yours 😉

 

[Guest]

Semantics and competition rules aside I dunno what all the fuss is about...
What's in a name? that which we call a rose by any other name would smell as sweet.
It's a cracking tank whatever...😉

 

[Pedro Rosa]

Time for an update...

Day 22 - Needing a trim.



Day 24 - Small trim.



Day 30 - I was away for a week!!!! It's not a Dutch, it's a jungle 🙂



Day 36 - Trimmed but i'm still letting plant grow... will certainly start trimming to get the "Dutch feeling" on the next two weeks.



What went wrong? Eleocharis sp. and UG melted. I replanted a small amount of UG from a Wabi Kusa...
After I've trimmed the "jungle" look, water started to get "white"... never had it. It's certainly a filter issue. Made a small clean and it's still the same. I'll wait.

40 Congo tetras!! That seems too much for me but.. Lets see how they look. Ir seems yo me rummynoses are the most used in dutch tanks.
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Yes, maybe, but there are still young (started with 3 - 4 cm) and growing. I'm seeing the orange starting to appear. In one or two months i will know if they are many.

Pedro.

 

[akwarybka]

What a stunner, can't wait to see how it will look in a month. Well done!

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[rebel]

Very nice growth.

Do you find that the reds are rendered pleasantly with those lights? In the photos, the reds look slightly brown. How would you compare the effect to the T5HO fiji purple sort of color?

 

[Greenfinger2]

Wonderful

 

[BruceF]

How do you get growth like that?

 

[Pedro Rosa]

Do you find that the reds are rendered pleasantly with those lights? In the photos, the reds look slightly brown. How would you compare the effect to the T5HO fiji purple sort of color?

Yes, I see no difference and i've been comparing to other aquariums (mainly Ludwigia Palustris) with T5 or other good led solutions.
Macandra I honestly have never seen another one so healthy and with such a good growth and regrowth after trimming.

Pedro.

 

[rebel]

How do you get growth like that?

You gotta have green thumbs my friend.... [ looks at his own thumbs and realises that they are not green ]