Chihiros WRGB2 Pro has a separate 'white' LED channel but...

[oreo57]

Any news on this? I'm looking for the best lighting option for my new build. I just want the highest CRI/RA and the most accurate colour reproduction with plenty of power and spectral control via app or controller. Thanks.

Ahhh tricky question.. Do you want a factory one or diy?
Anyways one of the closer ones is the AI Prime freshwater.
Plotting it into RAYCAL to the best of my ability I came up wit ha base output of 5400K and 94 CRI.
Still has the "normal" cyan dip unlike real high CRI white leds.


Bridgelux high cri cob.6290k 98 CRI


A minor disclaimer CRI is obsolete.
The catch is though the closer the cri is to 100 the less "downgrading" is possible in the tm-30 system.
TM-30 Simplified - DMF Lighting

Simple RGB arrays will have a R(g) of over 100 but a R(f) under 100 by a fair amount
R(f) is the new "CRI" part R(g) lists deviations in saturation of colors.

 

[FISHnLAB]

Ahhh tricky question.. Do you want a factory one or diy?
Anyways one of the closer ones is the AI Prime freshwater.
Plotting it into RAYCAL to the best of my ability I came up wit ha base output of 5400K and 94 CRI.
Still has the "normal" cyan dip unlike real high CRI white leds.
View attachment 194943

Bridgelux high cri cob.6290k 98 CRI
View attachment 194942

A minor disclaimer CRI is obsolete.
The catch is though the closer the cri is to 100 the less "downgrading" is possible in the tm-30 system.
TM-30 Simplified - DMF Lighting

Simple RGB arrays will have a R(g) of over 100 but a R(f) under 100 by a fair amount
R(f) is the new "CRI" part R(g) lists deviations in saturation of colors.

Thank you very much for those measurements, it is much appreciated👍.

Probably just a factory one as although I have tried LED reflow and other build projects before, I am currently focusing on learning and mastering planted aquariums right now and my flashlight and LED hobbies are on the backburner. Although a lightboard filled with Yujis or Nichia Optiwhites would sure put everything on the market to shame...

Yes, the Prime Freshwater is at the top of my list I am just not sure I can tolerate the shimmer of a point-source style light. I may risk it but, not sure yet.

What are my best options for standard bar/line array style lights? Is Chihiros the only high end option that fits my criteria? If so what is the best model?

Yes, I am aware of TM-30 but, CRI is still widely used and still has some relevance imo. Deviation from the black body locus, or lack there of, is very important in my flashlight hobby so as not to get a greenish or magenta tinted beams.

Thanks again for all of your help. Hopefully you can help me pick the best option for my new build👍...

 

[oreo57]

Shimmer is controlled by surface agitation.

Magenta is the " preferred" aquarium tint as is exaggerated reds in " normal" lighting.
Just a side comment

Ignoring the " cyan issue" most white with some red green blue diodes can be spectrum tweaked to higher cri.
A compromise between high cri and exaggeration is any light with say 8000 k whites and 660 nm red

Your diy effort could barely take an afternoon..once the parts are gathered

YUJILEDS® CRI 98 18W 2835MX Constant Current LED Linear Module - 10pcs

YUJILEDS® SunWave™ technology succeeds in broadening the spectrum coverage to 400nm - 730nm, which is 40% more coverage than a standard LED spectrum, in addition, this technology eliminates the sharp blue peaks then achieves the homogeneous spectral power distribution hence it mimics 95%...

store.yujiintl.com

Oddly 36 v and they don't list if they are constant current or voltage driven.

Will get back to stock lighting but again any simple white/blue red green with the 3 seperate channels is fine.
A light with RGB secondary or low ( not the major par producer) is best
6450k, 96 cri,
0.7/1/1/6
blue/green/ red/8000k white ratio

Raising green or raising red slightly just adds a green or red tint with minimal impact on cri. May impact tm-30 or the studio" standard TLCI.

 

[oreo57]

Addendum about the Yuji strips posed above. The led use a violet emitter as the pump.
Rest is all done by phosphors.
Now the catch is 1) efficiency is lower than blue pump emitters so more heat less light
2) They have a tendency to fade faster both the pump and possibly the blue phosphor.

 

[FISHnLAB]

Shimmer is controlled by surface agitation.

Magenta is the " preferred" aquarium tint as is exaggerated reds in " normal" lighting.
Just a side comment

Ignoring the " cyan issue" most white with some red green blue diodes can be spectrum tweaked to higher cri.
A compromise between high cri and exaggeration is any light with say 8000 k whites and 660 nm red

Your diy effort could barely take an afternoon..once the parts are gathered

YUJILEDS® CRI 98 18W 2835MX Constant Current LED Linear Module - 10pcs

YUJILEDS® SunWave™ technology succeeds in broadening the spectrum coverage to 400nm - 730nm, which is 40% more coverage than a standard LED spectrum, in addition, this technology eliminates the sharp blue peaks then achieves the homogeneous spectral power distribution hence it mimics 95%...

store.yujiintl.com

Oddly 36 v and they don't list if they are constant current or voltage driven.

Will get back to stock lighting but again any simple white/blue red green with the 3 seperate channels is fine.
A light with RGB secondary or low ( not the major par producer) is best
6450k, 96 cri,
0.7/1/1/6
blue/green/ red/8000k white ratio

Raising green or raising red slightly just adds a green or red tint with minimal impact on cri. May impact tm-30 or the studio" standard TLCI.
View attachment 194961
View attachment 194962

Yes but, unfortunately one often needs high flow in a large planted tank so at least some surface agitation will always be there. That said, I'm not fully against shimmer, I am just worried it will get annoying as this tank is going in my main living room where I spend most of my time and where my home theater system is.

Yes, I too prefer magenta tint(under the black body locus) vs green tint(above it) if I have to have any. In general home lighting use though you want no tint or right on the bbl, pure white(CCT dependent of course). In aquariums, plant growth aside, I also prefer no tint but, can deal with magenta if it helps the plants grow. I don't however like strong magenta or blurple like what some of the traditional cheap plant grow lights have. This is where having spectral control really shines. Just dial it in to ones liking.

Yes, I know, it's more that all of my soldering gear is put away and I'm not really looking to get into a light build project right now. I also want some of the features offered in the controller and app based factory lights and I can't get that with a DIY option.

So, ultimately I think finding the best factory option is my path forward. Maybe in a couple of years when I am further along in my learning with fish and plant keeping I can get into trying to build a custom aquarium light with the ultimate colour rendition.

Thanks again for all of your help Oreo👍.

 

[FISHnLAB]

Addendum about the Yuji strips posed above. The led use a violet emitter as the pump.
Rest is all done by phosphors.
Now the catch is 1) efficiency is lower than blue pump emitters so more heat less light
2) They have a tendency to fade faster both the pump and possibly the blue phosphor.

Where does Nichia Optisolis stand? The ones I have are nicer then the Yujis I have to my eye(I only have the 95+ CRI Yujis though). I have a custom flashlight with a 4000K Optisolis in it and it's colour rendition is amazing. The same lighting they use in some high end art galleries apparently...

I would like to see an aquarium light built with the new Nichia Hortisolis...

Hortisolis™ Lighting | NICHIA CORPORATION

 

[oreo57]

Where does Nichia Optisolis stand? The ones I have are nicer then the Yujis I have to my eye(I only have the 95+ CRI Yujis though). I have a custom flashlight with a 4000K Optisolis in it and it's colour rendition is amazing. The same lighting they use in some high end art galleries apparently...

I would like to see an aquarium light built with the new Nichia Hortisolis...

Hortisolis™ Lighting | NICHIA CORPORATION

A 4000k 97cri bulb measured against a 6500k "standard" (D65) has a cri of like 53..
As you can see there is a catch to this.
Now I've run high cri 4000k's over my now defunct 55gal.
It has nice color rendering but imparts that "tungsten look" to the tank. Many would find it too err "yellow".

As human nature goes they would sell few lights using the likes of the Hortisolis.
It looks to be a blue/green/phosphor converted red light..
There is an arguement to make about phosphor converted red leds being more beneficial than just adding red or deep red diodes.
Plenty of people have used what the Chinese call "full spectrum" 3 watt leds in diy arrays.
Fluval uses "pink" which I assume is a phosphor converted diode high in red.

I don't doubt there are nicer looking diodes than the Yujis just as there are a ton of not nicer looking diodes 😉
For most people it would probably be splitting hairs yet orders of magnitude different than what they were used to.\

LED test / review - Nichia Optisolis 3000 / 5000 K - ultra high light quality, even with high performance in mid-power class

LED test / review EN Nichia Optisolis 3000 / 5000 K NF2W757G-F1 / NF2L757G-F1 Some months ago Nichia announced a press release fort he new Optisolis LED series, emitters with ultra-high CRI „that demonstrates the closest match to that of the standard...

budgetlightforum.com

I also want some of the features offered in the controller and app based factory lights and I can't get that with a DIY option.

Well depends on what you need. Some like the
corallux storm or bluefish mini have a lot of features..

I personally just had some drivers/controllers built to spec for relatively cheap.
Now they are stripped down to bare minimum as I wanted. No storms,lightning alarms ect..but functional.
Dig around the world and there are some pretty amazing people..
Unfortunately that was "then" now is different.

 

[Wookii]

A 4000k 97cri bulb measured against a 6500k "standard" (D65) has a cri of like 53..
As you can see there is a catch to this.
Now I've run high cri 4000k's over my now defunct 55gal.
It has nice color rendering but imparts that "tungsten look" to the tank. Many would find it too err "yellow".

As human nature goes they would sell few lights using the likes of the Hortisolis.
It looks to be a blue/green/phosphor converted red light..
There is an arguement to make about phosphor converted red leds being more beneficial than just adding red or deep red diodes.
Plenty of people have used what the Chinese call "full spectrum" 3 watt leds in diy arrays.
Fluval uses "pink" which I assume is a phosphor converted diode high in red.

I don't doubt there are nicer looking diodes than the Yujis just as there are a ton of not nicer looking diodes 😉
For most people it would probably be splitting hairs yet orders of magnitude different than what they were used to.\

LED test / review - Nichia Optisolis 3000 / 5000 K - ultra high light quality, even with high performance in mid-power class

LED test / review EN Nichia Optisolis 3000 / 5000 K NF2W757G-F1 / NF2L757G-F1 Some months ago Nichia announced a press release fort he new Optisolis LED series, emitters with ultra-high CRI „that demonstrates the closest match to that of the standard...

budgetlightforum.com

Well depends on what you need. Some like the
corallux storm or bluefish mini have a lot of features..

I personally just had some drivers/controllers built to spec for relatively cheap.
Now they are stripped down to bare minimum as I wanted. No storms,lightning alarms ect..but functional.
Dig around the world and there are some pretty amazing people..
Unfortunately that was "then" now is different.

Are these Optisolis LED's similar to the Sunlike ones we discussed in this thread: FUN high CRI LED strips

I stumped up recently for a couple of the Sunlike strips and controller here:

LumiBarTW-112-4098+ Toshiba-SSC TW LED Strip Zhaga Sunlike CRI98 white 2700K+3500+5000K 990lm 24V 112 LEDs 11.02" module (1060lm/ft 12W/ft)

3 channel Tunable White SunLike LED module: 2700K, 3500K and 5000K Natural light spectrum with CRI98+ 24VDC operation for easy installation Very bright, up to 1060lm/ft

www.uk.lumistrips.com

The strips have three different colour temp LED types on that can be independently controlled, so I figured they would provide the widest possible spectrum whilst also 'adjustment to taste'. I've not yet had chance to get them set up, which I hope to do in a few months.

 

[oreo57]

Are these Optisolis LED's similar to the Sunlike ones we discussed in this thread: FUN high CRI LED strips

I stumped up recently for a couple of the Sunlike strips and controller here:

LumiBarTW-112-4098+ Toshiba-SSC TW LED Strip Zhaga Sunlike CRI98 white 2700K+3500+5000K 990lm 24V 112 LEDs 11.02" module (1060lm/ft 12W/ft)

3 channel Tunable White SunLike LED module: 2700K, 3500K and 5000K Natural light spectrum with CRI98+ 24VDC operation for easy installation Very bright, up to 1060lm/ft

www.uk.lumistrips.com

The strips have three different colour temp LED types on that can be independently controlled, so I figured they would provide the widest possible spectrum whilst also 'adjustment to taste'. I've not yet had chance to get them set up, which I hope to do in a few months.

Optisolis vs sunlike..Both use a violet pump (Optisolis high k @ around 420, not sure about low k, Sunlike, can't detrming violet wavelength) . Phosphor packs seem to differ by the data.
optisolis top

 

[FISHnLAB]

A 4000k 97cri bulb measured against a 6500k "standard" (D65) has a cri of like 53..
As you can see there is a catch to this.
Now I've run high cri 4000k's over my now defunct 55gal.
It has nice color rendering but imparts that "tungsten look" to the tank. Many would find it too err "yellow".

As human nature goes they would sell few lights using the likes of the Hortisolis.
It looks to be a blue/green/phosphor converted red light..
There is an arguement to make about phosphor converted red leds being more beneficial than just adding red or deep red diodes.
Plenty of people have used what the Chinese call "full spectrum" 3 watt leds in diy arrays.
Fluval uses "pink" which I assume is a phosphor converted diode high in red.

I don't doubt there are nicer looking diodes than the Yujis just as there are a ton of not nicer looking diodes 😉
For most people it would probably be splitting hairs yet orders of magnitude different than what they were used to.\

LED test / review - Nichia Optisolis 3000 / 5000 K - ultra high light quality, even with high performance in mid-power class

LED test / review EN Nichia Optisolis 3000 / 5000 K NF2W757G-F1 / NF2L757G-F1 Some months ago Nichia announced a press release fort he new Optisolis LED series, emitters with ultra-high CRI „that demonstrates the closest match to that of the standard...

budgetlightforum.com

Well depends on what you need. Some like the
corallux storm or bluefish mini have a lot of features..

I personally just had some drivers/controllers built to spec for relatively cheap.
Now they are stripped down to bare minimum as I wanted. No storms,lightning alarms ect..but functional.
Dig around the world and there are some pretty amazing people..
Unfortunately that was "then" now is different.

I wouldn't use 4000K for an aquarium, that is just my preferred temp for flashlights so I had this one built in 4000K. Optisolis is available in most CCTs. I would go 5000 - 7000K if I were to use them for an aquarium light.

You are above my knowledge base with that part. I know next to nothing about grow lights specifically. Most of my knowledge pertains to high end "white" LED's for home lighting and flashlight use. I just noticed Nichia makes a grow specific emitter the Hortisolis and figured I would bring it up.

Yes, once you are to that level of lighting you are splitting hairs really. I can definitely see the difference between say a 90+CRI/80+RA Nichia 219B R9080 and a 98+ Optisolis though.

 

[FISHnLAB]

Well depends on what you need. Some like the
corallux storm or bluefish mini have a lot of features...

I personally just had some drivers/controllers built to spec for relatively cheap.
Now they are stripped down to bare minimum as I wanted. No storms,lightning alarms ect..but functional.
Dig around the world and there are some pretty amazing people..
Unfortunately that was "then" now is different.

Never heard of them, I'll have to look them up.

Yeah, things may be harder now. It's ok, I'm really not looking to get into a custom light project right now anyway. I'm probably going to jusy buy a factory option. The AI Prime Freshwater and Chihiros WRGB 2 Pro are at the top of my list. Any others I should consider? I still have to check out a suggestion from my thread(Aqua-Grow) too...

 

[Wookii]

AI Prime Freshwater and Chihiros WRGB 2 Pro

I have both light (well the older WRGB II) - both are great lights, but very different form factor and colour rendition.

 

[oreo57]

e:

LumiBarTW-112-4098+ Toshiba-SSC TW LED Strip Zhaga Sunlike CRI98 white 2700K+3500+5000K 990lm 24V 112 LEDs 11.02" module (1060lm/ft 12W/ft)

3 channel Tunable White SunLike LED module: 2700K, 3500K and 5000K Natural light spectrum with CRI98+ 24VDC operation for easy installation Very bright, up to 1060lm/ft

www.uk.lumistrips.com

The strips have three different colour temp LED types on that can be independently controlled, so I figured they would provide the widest possible spectrum whilst also 'adjustment to taste'. I've not yet had chance to get them set up, which I hope to do in a few months.

Interesting modules..
Nice to have 2x the 5000k diodes.
Curious about all the extra "stuff" on the boards.

Uses constant voltage but are those constant current drivers on board?
Doesn't look like normal resistors you'd expect to see.

Expensive controller if it just a a simple 24v PWN controller.. but not horrible.

PowerController V2 Control Unit Casambi Classic | the leading LED-shop by LUMITRONIX

Powerful and extremely flexible control unit with Casambi support for many luminaire types

www.lumitronix.com

• Up to 10 A can be switched via the output channels (1x 10 A / 2x 5 A)
• For controlling constant voltage LED modules (output voltage from 12 - 30 V)
• Input voltage depending on LED module (12 - 30 V)

Soo no constant current drivers on board or it is a weird system. Seen it used though (rare) , shutting off (via pwm) power to a "proper" driver to dim it.
I've had questions about this methodology that were never answered.

 

[FISHnLAB]

I have both light (well the older WRGB II) - both are great lights, but very different form factor and colour rendition.

Thanks for the reply Wooki👍. Can you please go into further detail? It would be much appreciated. Any chance you have a pic of both setups with as much of the same conditions as possible?

 

[Wookii]

Expensive controller if it just a a simple 24v PWN controller.

Its a wifi app controlled controller if you didn't spot that. The app looks designed more for advertising display an dpro usage, but looks like it should give lots of control options for timer and ramps.

 

[oreo57]

Its a wifi app controlled controller if you didn't spot that. The app looks designed more for advertising display an dpro usage, but looks like it should give lots of control options for timer and ramps.

No I got that.. I understand it wants to build a universe like others of its kind.. like "Hue" and a dozen other brands.
you can buy Chinese "versions" for 1/4 (or less) that price though.
This is only 3 channels but you get my point.
Amazon product ASIN B07FMNHZP74 channel..

Wi-Fi RGBW LED Controller - Alexa/Google Assistant/Smartphone Compatible - 5 Amps/Channel

This Wi-Fi RGBW LED controller lets you operate RGBW LED strip lights with your Alexa- or Google Assistant-enabled devices or your smartphone. Link the Smart Life app by Tuya with your Amazon Echo, Google Home, etc., and adjust brightness, color, white or color-changing modes (scenes), or turn...

www.superbrightleds.com

Not saying it is equivalent though.
Most Chinese interfaces are horrible in my "limited" experience though German and American apps seem to be catching up if you listen to reefers complain about Moebus in Radions or GHL Mitras's 🙂

 

[Wookii]

Thanks for the reply Wooki👍. Can you please go into further detail? It would be much appreciated.

The RGB combination chips used in the Chirhiros units (also used in similar lights from ADA, UNS, Week Aqua etc) give superb colour rendition, and real 'pop' to aquariums. They do require a little tailoring, otherwise that 'pop' can look a little too over saturated and artificial.

My only criticism is that whilst, the colour rendition is very good, and a lot wider than the incredibly peaky colour spectrum graph suggests, it is apparent that there is an under-emphasis of certain colours between those peaks such as amber and certain greens.

However it's one of those things, once you'd had a light with those sorts of saturation characteristics, you can't go back to white LED's very easily as everything looks washed out. The anology I use is it's like water your first high definition blu-ray (or 4K these days) and then trying to go back to VHS.

That said I still want to find a light that accurately replicates natural sunlight, which is why these finds of @oreo57 always interest me, and why I stumped up cash to test out the Sunlike LED strips.

Any chance you have a pic of both setups with as much of the same conditions as possible?

I don't I'm afraid, and the colour rendition is incredibly difficult to capture on camera.

 

[FISHnLAB]

Ok, this looks interesting and you can get a wifi controller too. What do you guys think?...

UNIQ FS 900

Aufgrund von gestiegenen Rohstoffpreisen und Transportkosten, müssen wir den Preis der UNIQ FS Reihe leider um ca 5% anheben. Es tut uns sehr leid…

aqua-grow.de

 

[FISHnLAB]

The RGB combination chips used in the Chirhiros units (also used in similar lights from ADA, UNS, Week Aqua etc) give superb colour rendition, and real 'pop' to aquariums. They do require a little tailoring, otherwise that 'pop' can look a little too over saturated and artificial.

My only criticism is that whilst, the colour rendition is very good, and a lot wider than the incredibly peaky colour spectrum graph suggests, it is apparent that there is an under-emphasis of certain colours between those peaks such as amber and certain greens.

However it's one of those things, once you'd had a light with those sorts of saturation characteristics, you can't go back to white LED's very easily as everything looks washed out. The anology I use is it's like water your first high definition blu-ray (or 4K these days) and then trying to go back to VHS.

That said I still want to find a light that accurately replicates natural sunlight, which is why these finds of @oreo57 always interest me, and why I stumped up cash to test out the Sunlike LED strips.



I don't I'm afraid, and the colour rendition is incredibly difficult to capture on camera.

Thank you, that was very helpful. What about the AI Prime Freshwater? Where does it stand? Judging by this thread it has a much fuller spectrum..

 

[Wookii]

No I got that.. I understand it wants to build a universe like others of its kind.. like "Hue" and a dozen other brands.
you can buy Chinese "versions" for 1/4 (or less) that price though.
This is only 3 channels but you get my point.
Amazon product ASIN B07FMNHZP74 channel..

Wi-Fi RGBW LED Controller - Alexa/Google Assistant/Smartphone Compatible - 5 Amps/Channel

This Wi-Fi RGBW LED controller lets you operate RGBW LED strip lights with your Alexa- or Google Assistant-enabled devices or your smartphone. Link the Smart Life app by Tuya with your Amazon Echo, Google Home, etc., and adjust brightness, color, white or color-changing modes (scenes), or turn...

www.superbrightleds.com

Not saying it is equivalent though.
Most Chinese interfaces are horrible in my "limited" experience though German and American apps seem to be catching up if you listen to reefers complain about Moebus in Radions or GHL Mitras's 🙂

Depends what they do I guess. I think with that dedicated controller I should be able to set on/off and ramp times for each channel independently. I thought that might make for quite a good sunrise/sunset schedule start fading the 2700K LED's on first then fade on the 3500K LED's, and finally the 5000K LED's, then fading the 2700K and 3500K down as the 5000K ramps up to max.