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Can an external canister filter be run with a separate pump? :-)

Sudden outbreak of BBA after changing your light? To me that sounds like the new light is more powerful, can you raise it?

May well be that you can't provide enough CO2 to keep up with the amount needed under the new light, rather than your CO2 having a new issue. Might be worth a quick leak check at some point, but I'd definitely focus on the one definite change that has coincided with the issue, and play with the light.
 
Rahms said:
Sudden outbreak of BBA after changing your light? To me that sounds like the new light is more powerful, can you raise it?

May well be that you can't provide enough CO2 to keep up with the amount needed under the new light, rather than your CO2 having a new issue. Might be worth a quick leak check at some point, but I'd definitely focus on the one definite change that has coincided with the issue, and play with the light.
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Hi,
Thanks for reading my post.
I don't think the BBA is due to light in my opinion.
The specs of the T5 light set is as below:
4 pcs of T5s at 54 watts each 12000K

But I'm running only 2 T5s. That means 108 watts for 120 cm/4 feet (76 gallons) tank for 6 hours.
That works out to 1.40 watts per gallon and this is actually considered low.
http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b631/Zak_Rafik/wattspergallon_zps4f4024f6.png


Rahms said:
Might be worth a quick leak check at some point,
Click to expand...
I have checked many timse using soapy water but none so far.

The main problem for me now is that however much I increase the Co2 rate, the DC doesn't change to lime green. I'm now seeing again some plants melting again 🙁
Now I'm afraid to increase the light and get more algae problem.
 
First off, watts per gallon is only a good measure if you're both talking about the same type of light. From what I've seen it generally refers to T8? 1 watt of T8 is not the same as 1 watt of T5 (1 watt T5 should be more light).

Melt as far as I am aware is caused by your plant not being able to keep up (by growing/repairing) with the damage being caused by the light. If your plant can't keep up in low light, its most likely a flow/CO2 problem. If pumping infinite CO2 isnt changing your drop checker, then it must be flow which is your problem.

As (I think) I said before, its about balance of CO2/nutrients/light. If you have low light, your plants will require little CO2 and nutrients, and so poor flow may not cause issues. If you up the light, the demand for CO2 increases. In your case it seems to have increased beyond your supply, and hence you get melt and algae.
 
Rahms said:
From what I've seen it generally refers to T8? 1 watt of T8 is not the same as 1 watt of T5 (1 watt T5 should be more light).
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I don't know about that. The internet is full of #@*&%# ! They don't seem to be specific.
Maybe some experienced members can give more info.
I don't why suddenly why the members here are keeping quiet. Usually they are active.

Rahms said:
If pumping infinite CO2 isnt changing your drop checker, then it must be flow which is your problem.
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If you have read the first few posts in this thread, You will know that I have fixed 2 Eheim 2080s (1200XL) for a 4 feet tank. Isn't this enough? I'm sure many people here will think this is an overkill for a 4 feet tank. But I'm desperate to improve the flow in the tank.

To the truth I'm getting very frustrated with this hobby. I'm having problems after problems ever since Sept 2014. The most severe is plants melting and BBA.
A hobby is something one enjoys and looks forward to but it my case it seems to be the opposite.
Now I have given myself the end of April. If I see no progress, I have decided to get out this hobby. I have spent a lot of money and time on the tank and I have had enough of disappointments and changing items in the tank just to grow plants and fish.

Thanks
 
Zak Rafik said:
I don't know about that. The internet is full of #@*&%# ! They don't seem to be specific.
Maybe some experienced members can give more info.
I don't why suddenly why the members here are keeping quiet. Usually they are active.


If you have read the first few posts in this thread, You will know that I have fixed 2 Eheim 2080s (1200XL) for a 4 feet tank. Isn't this enough? I'm sure many people here will think this is an overkill for a 4 feet tank. But I'm desperate to improve the flow in the tank.

To the truth I'm getting very frustrated with this hobby. I'm having problems after problems ever since Sept 2014. The most severe is plants melting and BBA.
A hobby is something one enjoys and looks forward to but it my case it seems to be the opposite.
Now I have given myself the end of April. If I see no progress, I have decided to get out this hobby. I have spent a lot of money and time on the tank and I have had enough of disappointments and changing items in the tank just to grow plants and fish.

Thanks
Click to expand...

I think people keep quiet on the threads where they have to convince the poster of the problem. There are loads of threads where someone asks their problem, is given the answer (CO2), and then has to be told over and over before they accept it.

I know its very annoying, I also quit a while ago and am just picking it up again. But if plants are melting, they most likely dont have enough CO2 for their conditions. So you can either go back to the conditions that worked (i.e. lower light equivalent to your LED), or increase CO2 concentration. You seem to be looking at all of your issues as one source, when your tank was actually doing well on the 20th, and then you immediately changed something (out of your control) and encountered new issues.

If you are increasing the injection of your CO2 massively and seeing no change in concentration, then this clearly shows a problem and there absolutely isn't another thing you should be looking at or thinking of. You said you leak checked multiple times, so the gas is being put in to the water. If adding CO2 in to your water doesnt increase the CO2 concentration, then its either all being used up (demand > supply) or just venting off at the surface. Your setup is obviously very complicated because you have two of everything, with the chiller making one system far weaker, and as such its difficult to get right. But to reiterate, IT SEEMS YOU HAD IT RIGHT ON THE 20TH.

Good luck anyways!
 
Afaik the Par value of lights should be used instead of watts, no? There are many charts and graphs out there that will help you determine roughly how much par you are running at the substrate level. Anything over 50 par at substrate is overkill imho and will lead to co2 issues if it's not spot on.
 
Rahms said:
But to reiterate, IT SEEMS YOU HAD IT RIGHT ON THE 20TH.
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Exactly. Maybe I'm now in panic mode.

The thing that really baffles me was that when I installed the 2 filters, the Co2 was so high that I had to reduce the Co2 as the fish were all gasping. After that I'm not able to get the DC to be lime green.

Rahms said:
I know its very annoying, I also quit a while ago and am just picking it up again.
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Well it kind of comforting to know that I'm not the only person going through this. Thanks.🙂

Rahms said:
You said you leak checked multiple times,
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I even did one this afternoon. Nothing found.

BTW I know this may sound silly but does 12000K light spectrum cause algae. I have read many post on the net that says 12000K is more for reef and that there is not much the plants can use from this.
Do you know any reliable source on the net about T5s for planted tank.

Rahms said:
Good luck anyways!
Click to expand...
Thanks. I need loads of it now.:thumbup:
 
ian_m said:
Original EI research was done with T5 lights.
Click to expand...

is that where his picture/list of wattages and their "classifications" are from? I thought the point of EI was to provide unlimited nutrients for any conceivable growth rate, I don't see where classifying WPG for any particular source comes in... granted its been a while since I read up on EI so its very possible I'm missing your point

back to zak: it is very strange and I think it'll have to be one of the more experienced lot that helps you out. I'm stumped my friend
 
Zak Rafik said:
Sorry but I don't understand what you mean. Can you please explain further? Thanks.
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The original EI research the Watts/gallon (US liquid gallon) was watts from T5 tubes.

T8 do produce less lumens per watt (no a lot T5 85lm/W and T8 65lm/W) , but the main advantage of T5 is in the lumens per unit length. T5 is 40lm/cm and T8 20lm/cm, meaning moving to T5 from T8 can double the light fro the same tank (actually slightly less as T5's lengths are a bit shorter than nearest T8 size).
 
ian_m said:
The original EI research the Watts/gallon (US liquid gallon) was watts from T5 tubes.

T8 do produce less lumens per watt (no a lot T5 85lm/W and T8 65lm/W) , but the main advantage of T5 is in the lumens per unit length. T5 is 40lm/cm and T8 20lm/cm, meaning moving to T5 from T8 can double the light fro the same tank (actually slightly less as T5's lengths are a bit shorter than nearest T8 size).
Click to expand...

What about T5 HO?

So is the below chart for T5?
http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b631/Zak_Rafik/wattspergallon_zps4f4024f6.png
 
OK, an update.🙂
I have since 5 days ago, connected the chiller to a separate pump.
So now the 2 Eheim 2080s are connected direct to tank and more flow. (1500 Litres per hour X 2 = 3000 Lt / hr)

But the plants are not doing so great. Whatever progress they made during the past few week is now done. 😳

I have tried to increase the Co2 slowly and I think I have hit the maximum. This morning all the fish were at the surface gasping.
But the DC told a different story. It was showing green.😱

Its only when I placed a folded piece of paper behind the DC did I see the true colour of the DC. It was lime green.😉
So it seems that the 12000K colour (bluish colour) from the T5 HO was altering the actual colour in the DC.

Now that I have hit the maximum for Co2, I'll now try to turn down very slowly.


http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b631/Zak_Rafik/IMG_1832_zpsbisan2dt.jpg
http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b631/Zak_Rafik/IMG_1830_zpsinl4qa0t.jpg
http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b631/Zak_Rafik/IMG_1831_zpsjjue3zod.jpg

http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b631/Zak_Rafik/IMG_1828_zpsb1hfrjyb.jpg
http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b631/Zak_Rafik/IMG_1829_zpsca6diu88.jpg
 
Does the filter produce a lot of surface movement? At night CO2 is produced by the plants, having plenty surface movement helps degassing the surplus (and increase O2 uptake a bit). This can be done with a nighttime functioning airpump too.
 
Edvet said:
Does the filter produce a lot of surface movement? At night CO2 is produced by the plants, having plenty surface movement helps degassing the surplus (and increase O2 uptake a bit). This can be done with a nighttime functioning airpump too.
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Hi
I'm not sure but the spray bars are horizontally positioned. Maybe I'll take a video and upload tomorrow.
I'hv also taken off the Eheim surface skimmer. Does the skimmer play any major part in degassing?

Does the gassing at night play any role in the next day's Co2 level? (Silly question I think.)
 
Zak Rafik said:
Does the skimmer play any major part in degassing
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Yes anything that causes agitation with air will result in CO2 degassing. I have noticed my drop checker more blue'y green that green yellow (ie less CO2) when I have left my spray bars pointing upwards causing a large amount of surface agitation.

I use an air pump to degas at night, which is does, but has two other advantages. I got a surface film when first starting my tank and air pump got rid of that and it also creates a different pattern of water movement picking up those settled bits of detritus into water column to be filtered away.
 
Too much light. is what causes bba in our sons low tech tank. It's full of the stuff, but he like the natural look.😀
 
OK. I have tried all that I can think of to improve Co2 level in the tank. Day by day BBA was spreading more.
I even removed the centerpiece of my tank, a nicely shaped rock about 45cm. It was covered with BBA and GSA as you can see from the photo of it while it was in the tank. I was shocked to see the state of the plants behind the rock. I've removed them as well (please see the 3rd photo)

Even after removing the stones, I did not see any significant improvement in the plants' health. So I have decided to remove the spray bars! The spray bars were such an eyesore. I hated it every time I looked at my tank.
Here's a small video I made of the tank before taking off the spray bars.


http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b631/Zak_Rafik/IMG_1866_zpsd14qsrlf.jpg
http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b631/Zak_Rafik/IMG_1872_zpswfx7byrt.jpg
http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b631/Zak_Rafik/IMG_1875_zpsjaoygtto.jpg
 
that was a really nice tank, I think you're just focusing on the "perfect" result of 0 algae, all plants 100% in all places. All I see is a small patch of algae next to a big rock (understandable), and a lot of happy looking plants in a nice scape!
 
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