Biding Time (22 gal, no CO2)

[ElleDee]

So I upgraded my light.

Top: Chihiros WRGB 2 red: 43% green: 34% blue 41%
Bottom: Finnex Planted+ ALC white: 70% red: 100% green: 50% blue: 60%

I had suspected this was coming, and as soon as I hit full power on the red channel I knew my original light wasn't going to cut it long term. It might be ok from either a PAR perspective on max brightness or a color rendering perspective at lower light, but I can't have both with the ALC. It's got way too much green/cyan for my taste as I approach full power. It would work great if I just had green plants, but that's not what this aquarium is about right now.

I am still playing around with the spectrum on the Chihiros to get the balance perfect, but I'm loving how much flexibility there is. I am probably flirting with too much red at this point at the expense of my greens, but it's not a problem I mind after fretting about the ALC for so long. I can't believe how bright my fish look, and obviously any red/orange tones in the plants have been amplified with no effort on my part. One thing I am picky about is not having purple sand and aquasoil - nope, not doing the blurple lighting no matter how it makes my plants look.

This change has made it clear I'm going to have to do a background for the tank at some point because now I have all this light hitting the wood paneling and instead of being dark and neutral it's a warm orange. Gross. You can't see how bad it is from a high angle, but from straight on it's very annoying. I don't have a plan for that yet. I need to give the canister it's first proper clean, swap out the spray bar, and finally glue down the wood, so adding a background is pretty far down on the priority list.

 

[ElleDee]

Well, well, well.


I think I'm finally getting somewhere with this new light. This is Rotala 'Super Mini Red' and I'd say it's actually looking pretty red right now in the new growth. I'm seeing lots of pearling and color improvement in the tank, but this is the clear winner on color today. I'm also getting more algae on the glass and rocks, but I'm going to hold the light steady for the time being and let the plants adapt to the higher light.

Also, I have news! My 75 gallon tank is arriving stateside the second week of July! I'm not totally sure when it will land in my possession, but I think it will be ready to plant in about six to eight weeks. This journal is called "Biding Time" in part because I needed a project to hold me over until the arrival of the big tank and now that the time is in the foreseeable future! That also means Phase 1 will be coming to a close. It will technically be a bit premature as I don't think the plants will be fully adapted by then (the other reason this is “Biding Time” is because things progress so slowly without supplemental CO2), but I look forward to editing down the number of taxa and redesigning the planting area. Right now I'm thinking I will keep this tank more experimental with higher light and more ambitious plants and build the big tank to be a lower energy system - medium light, a midground full of crypts, that sort of thing.

 

[saundersbp]

Fantastic plants and one of the best I have seen! Great you aren't using CO2 as well. Whatever the rights and wrongs of it, when I mention the idea to non aquarium friends they are shocked to the core. Look forward to seeing more pics.

 

[ElleDee]

Fantastic plants and one of the best I have seen! Great you aren't using CO2 as well. Whatever the rights and wrongs of it, when I mention the idea to non aquarium friends they are shocked to the core. Look forward to seeing more pics.

Thank you. It's been a learning process and I'm excited to see how it unfolds from here.

 

[ElleDee]

Life has been pretty busy lately and while I’ve done all my normal maintenance, I haven’t really given the tank any extra attention.



The tank is in what I hope is an ugly duckling period. Algae is more prevalent than I would like, but it’s not growing very fast. There are small tufts of BBA in some spots and the old growth of some plants have algae (green dust? Green spot? I’m not sure). I’m getting brown algae on the glass as well.

It looks very similar to a phase I went through with my first tank and to get through that I... (checks old notes) …oh, it looks like I pretty much did nothing. I was planning on tackling the algae, but then I got busy like I am now and was just very consistent with my weekly upkeep and it somehow fixed itself in the duration. After that the tank was mature and balanced and I haven’t had algae issues since. I give the real credit to solid tank fundamentals, a stable environment, and time.

Maybe the same do-nothing strategy will work here, but only if my fundamentals are good and I can’t make up my mind if I have too much light right now. Currently I have my fixture running for 6.75 hours at red 60%, green 40%, blue 45%, plus an extra 30 minutes for ramp up/down time. My plants are consistently pearling, so that seems to be a positive sign, and growth is on the whole slow and steady. My rotala ‘Super Mini Red’ is still the reddest stem plant, and there aren't even any other real standouts. I mean, the AR is red, the tiger lotus is red, and Cryptocoryne affinis 'Red' is red, but the other Rotala and Ludwigia are green to yellow. Again I’m not sure if the problem is not enough light, or just not quite happy plants.



Another thing I'm thinking about is that I have both Ludwigia repens and 'Rubin' growing with better color in my long established low-light tank. Look at the color change on this L. repens:


The top is from June 25th and I had just moved it from my low light tank, where it admittedly was at the top of the water right under the light, and the bottom is from this week. Do I think it's getting less light now (with a much more powerful fixture, but the stem is now further away) or is the color loss from the tank being unbalanced? I'm not sure.

So what am I going to do? I don’t really have the time nor inclination to make big changes right now, especially since I'm not totally convinced what the root of my problem is. I still need to swap out the spray bar, which should reduce water velocity and might help with the BBA. The arrival of my larger tank should be soon, so that is going to cause a shake up in this tank as I harvest plant material and move around livestock. I'll do a review of all the new stuff I tried in this tank for the start of phase 2.

 

[_Maq_]

The top is from June 25th and I had just moved it from my low light tank

I can detect signs of light relative deficiency of calcium.

 

[ElleDee]

I can detect signs of light relative deficiency of calcium.

The undulating leaf margins are due to the stem growing along the water's surface and the leaves contorting a bit to stay perpendicular to the light. Calcium levels are sufficient in both tanks.

 

[ElleDee]

Upon further reflection, I have cut the light back to 6 hours at 45% red, 30% green, 35% blue. (I just revised the light numbers in my last post because I wrote them from memory and was wrong - blue and green were higher than I said initially. Whoops!)

This is slightly weaker than when I first installed the chihiros, but even as some of my color has improved, the algae just keeps getting worse and it's to the point where it's affecting growth. I am confident I can balance the tank, but not if I'm pushing light at the same time. I'll finally swap the spray bar tomorrow and reevaluate in a week.

I will resume my trials with light and color in the future, but not until the tank is more mature and algae is tamed. My primary goal right now is healthy growth.

 

[ElleDee]

The algae situation is still not great, and at the same time my big tank is on the way to my house (!!!). I had really wanted this tank to be stable before starting on my next project, but it looks like it’s not going to work out that way. I’m a few weeks out from planting that set up, so I’ve got some time to turn things around. I ordered a slew of new plants that are ultimately destined to be background plants in the new tank, but for the moment I have crammed them into this one. I’m hoping that the additional plant mass will help stabilize things.


The new plants are all (hopefully) easy, bulletproof weeds: Pogostemon stellatus ‘Octopus’, Potamogeton gayi, star grass (Heteranthera zosterifolia), and water sprite (Ceratopteris thalictroides). I’ve grown water sprite before as a rooted plant and found it to be amazing at putting on massive growth in immature, unbalanced tanks, so I hope it works its magic again. I actually don’t like how it looks and will eventually get rid of it again if all goes to plan. The others are new to me, but hopefully at least one or two really takes off.

I’m also going back to two water changes a week to keep conditions extra clean.

On the plus side, I have yellow neocaridina shrimp that I added to this tank as tiny babies that are now breeding. I have at least 4 berried females running around.

 

[ElleDee]

I haven't updated in a while because I've been very busy and haven't had the time to devote to my tank beyond the minimum, meaning one water change a week and feed the fish regularly. In times like this I'm glad I don't keep more demanding livestock, because even though I'm on autopilot I don't feel their care is being shortchanged in any way.



I think the plants could use a little more attention, but I just don't have it in me right now. That said, there are some encouraging signs since my last report. The new plants have been growing and don't seem to have any algae on them, so that's great. The Potamogeton gayi gets the gold medal for growth, but it also came already converted, so that probably gave it a leg up. It is definitely not a texture I want to keep in this tank long term, but I appreciate the clean plant mass it is providing and I have good feeling about it in the big tank. I have removed a couple species that were just getting overrun with algae, but I have backups elsewhere and may reintroduce them down the road. Even though I have lost a good bit of color since turning the light intensity down (boo!), I still get daily pearling and descent growth for most things, enough to require a major trim today.

I also broke down and got floating plants few weeks ago. I have had them in the past in my other tanks and eventually ditched them for being annoying, but I need to enlist their aid in balancing the tank. I got both salvinia and red root floaters. I had salvinia before and know it will take off, while the red root floaters are a first for me. I got those thinking I might actually enjoy having them long term - they grow more slowly and are very cute when they are happy. At present I am using them to shade my spray bar (I read they like to stay in one spot, but idk if that's a real requirement) and letting the salvinia go wherever. Both species have already started to multiply and I do think that they are already helping the situation as the algae on the glass is accumulating a little more slowly.

It has been a hot summer and the water from my tap is lukewarm; I expect that everything will get easier once the temps come down a bit more. I have a list of ideas I would like to implement, and I remain confident I can fix all the problems with the tank (though maybe this is hubris?), but it's just not happening right now due to lack of time and energy. I miss my pink plants and am tired of the algae, but I have to admit things could be a lot worse. After all, I still enjoy watching the tank, and that's the main thing, right?

 

[Hufsa]

At present I am using them to shade my spray bar (I read they like to stay in one spot, but idk if that's a real requirement) and letting the salvinia go wherever.

They prefer relatively still water but can tolerate a little bit of movement across the surface, as long as they are not bobbing up and down or getting pushed under.
I have killed a lot of floaters with the surface agitation on my tank 😅

After all, I still enjoy watching the tank, and that's the main thing, right?

Definitely Im enjoying the update, and I bet you will get back into the tank more once the time is right for you 😊

 

[ElleDee]

They prefer relatively still water but can tolerate a little bit of movement across the surface, as long as they are not bobbing up and down or getting pushed under.
I have killed a lot of floaters with the surface agitation on my tank 😅


Definitely Im enjoying the update, and I bet you will get back into the tank more once the time is right for you 😊

Ah, ok. Yeah, this is the first time I've had floaters of any kind with a spray bar and I'm not having any issues with them getting dunked at all. I'm no stranger to the problem though - that was a constant issue with HOBs and I never found a solution that worked 100% of the time for me despite my efforts. It was never enough to kill the salvinia off, but I could see that doing in something less tenacious.

Thanks for the support as always!

 

[ElleDee]

Just a quick check in to note that I think I'm turning a corner on the algae. The green dust algae is clearly in retreat and leaving the hardscape and glass, and all the new growth and any plants I added in the last few weeks are completely clean. There is still green spot algae on the older leaves and some minimal tufts of BBA on some older crypt and java fern leaves, but since the new growth is clean I am optimistic I can just prune it out over time. I've still got significant BBA and green spot algae on the hardscape that I've just begun spot treating daily with H2O2. And I still need to change out the spray bar; I am hoping this is the key to the BBA issue.

 

[ElleDee]

Long time no see! I don’t have a whole lot to report, but it’s been a while and I suppose I should do a quick check in. No huge changes on my part for a few months now - I’ve had my focus on other parts of my life, though I have been doing my weekly WC and feeding the livestock of course. I did bump the light intensity back up 6 or 8 weeks ago and the color returned, even surpassing where it was previously, with no negative knock on effects. Ahh, the joys of a maturing tank. I still enjoy watching the tank quite a lot, so this kind of lazybones status quo is honestly just fine with me.



I’m at peace with the algae level at this point. It’s not the cleanest tank I’ve ever run by a long stretch, but it’s largely confined to the hardscape (which I never clean and haven’t spot treated in months) and it doesn’t grow very fast. I do scrape the glass during water changes… if I feel like it. Here’s a comparison from the end of August (top) to now:



Now, the light settings are different and the two photos were taken with different cameras, but you get the idea. My notes indicate that the BBA was actually receding by the time I took the first pic, but I’m not sure I have a great shot of the worst of it.

I’ve reached the point where the floating plants have started to struggle to put on mass due to shrimp herbivory and increased competition from the submerged plants. The salvinia in particular is looking rather ratty. I’ve never been able to get floaters to work long term, but they do the trick when they are needed most.

The plants would benefit from a reshuffling, both from a design and a horticultural perspective, but I’ll get to it when I get to it, you know? What remains is largely an artifact of my growing so many new-to-me plants and not knowing how they would grow in, both in color and size, so I’ve got some short plants in the back, all the best reds right next to each other, etc. Whoops! But the good news is that I’ve got a lot of different things thriving, some contrasting textures and colors. It all just needs to be remixed.



So overall I’m pretty content where I am. Perfect? Ha! No, and I really ought to put some more effort in. And I’m sure I will when the mood strikes. But right now I'm doing modest upkeep and just enjoying the returns from the work that went into planning and getting the tank started. I’ve learned a lot and it’s a step up from my earlier efforts, so this counts as a win in my book.

 

[ElleDee]

Well, that last update was a little overly optimistic! What actually happened was I didn’t invest much attention to the hobby for most of the last year for lots of reasons (I had a baby, for instance), but all of my tanks are still up and running. I kept the livestock fed and comfortable, but my plants have been pretty neglected. In the past couple weeks I have been getting back in the game and I am finding that my perspective has shifted and I’m still figuring out where to go from here.

First, what actually happened to my tanks when I let them go for a year?

Fortunately, the plants kept my water quality pretty good judging by nitrates and TDS. My TDS did slowly creep up over the year, but it's nothing too drastic, and my nitrates were between 0 and 10 ppm when I checked at various points. It’s hard to believe the value of the environmental services performed by the plants. There’s more algae in the Biding Time tank, especially the BBA and green dust on the hardscape and glass, but the other two are fairly clean.

More interestingly, the plants in each of my three tanks all did very, very different things. The crypts in my nano shrimp tank came to totally dominate the space, just wall to wall and top to bottom happy crypts, while their growth stagnated in the other two. However, my old 20 long can grow buckets of pink Rotala ‘Blood Red’ and Ludwigia repens with basically no input from me, but any stems I move over into the Biding Time tank just sit there. Biding Time has grown gigantic, algae-free java fern ‘Narrow K’ though and had a long period when Potamogeton gayi and Bacopa caroliniana went bonkers, though they began to decline in the last few months.

I’m not surprised that there are differences between my tanks, but the specifics have manifested much differently than I would have guessed. I wish I could say the tank with the aqua soil, the fancy light, or the canister filter gave me the best plant growth, but that was the case at all. Now, that tank still looks the best because it has the most interesting hardscape, layout, and attractive spectrum, but the plant growth has been the worst overall, especially when you consider that some of those same plants look amazing in my other more “primitive” tanks. I suspect that the biggest factor is simply that my 20 long and nano tank are significantly older. They were very stable for a few years before all this and maybe being so well established has given them a big advantage that all the superior equipment couldn't match. My nano tank has adequate (not great) light, but my 20 long had a single weak light and a lid so the stems were able to hog the available light at the detriment of everything else.

In the last few weeks I have focused on renewal maintenance in my larger tanks and slowly getting the TDS back down to where it should be. I am happy to report that most everything is showing new growth and I'm optimistic that everything that remains can be brought back to health. I'll have to go into my current efforts and my future plans in another post because this one is getting long. Maybe I'll even include pictures.

 

[_Maq_]

The plants would benefit from a reshuffling, both from a design and a horticultural perspective, but I’ll get to it when I get to it, you know? What remains is largely an artifact of my growing so many new-to-me plants and not knowing how they would grow in, both in color and size, so I’ve got some short plants in the back, all the best reds right next to each other, etc. Whoops!

Everyone has his/her own eyes, but I can tell you I prefer rather "untidy" looking tanks. Aquascapers diligently calculate every detail and the result is... well, calculated. Personally, I'm tired of such tanks. I think we should permit our plants some liberty to grow the way they like. At the very least, we are safe not to create a kitch.

I suspect that the biggest factor is simply that my 20 long and nano tank are significantly older.

I agree. I've observed that well-established and maintained tanks, namely their sediments, grow very strong and stable in time. A substrate reasonably filled with detritus and complete microbial community develops 'buffering' capacity against many sorts of events. Among others, it features a significant stock of nutrients and their full cycling. Nutrient deficiencies then seldom occur, even if you neglect fertilizing for quite a time.
Of course, not all tanks are happy enough to develop into such a blessed shape.

 

[ElleDee]

Everyone has his/her own eyes, but I can tell you I prefer rather "untidy" looking tanks. Aquascapers diligently calculate every detail and the result is... well, calculated. Personally, I'm tired of such tanks. I think we should permit our plants some liberty to grow the way they like. At the very least, we are safe not to create a kitch.

One benefit of leaving things alone for so long is I've gotten to actually see what can develop organically, because I'm bad at conceptualizing it at planting. I'm definitely moving more towards plants that can be left in place and away from stems because rooted plants tend to get better with time (assuming their needs are met) rather than constant fussing, so this long term knowledge should help me make better decisions at the initial planting.

I agree. I've observed that well-established and maintained tanks, namely their sediments, grow very strong and stable in time. A substrate reasonably filled with detritus and complete microbial community develops 'buffering' capacity against many sorts of events. Among others, it features a significant stock of nutrients and their full cycling. Nutrient deficiencies then seldom occur, even if you neglect fertilizing for quite a time.
Of course, not all tanks are happy enough to develop into such a blessed shape.

The more I reflect the more I think this is an incredibly underrated point, and one most people don't get to appreciate because they just don't keep their setups running for that long. I was initially worried about substrate longevity in my dirted tanks, but now I am thinking that was misguided. Honestly, the advantage may largely be a function of the mature substrate making more CO2 - I have measured a larger than expected daily ph drop in my 20 long before, though I had forgotten about that until now. I'm sure there're also nutrient availability benefits as well, but I bet CO2 is a sizable chunk of the puzzle. I need to think more about this.

 

[dw1305]

Hi all,
Congratulations on your new arrival and on the tanks having done so well with benign neglect. You have <"had a mention"> on UKAPS why you've been otherwise engaged.

The more I reflect the more I think this is an incredibly underrated point, and one most people don't get to appreciate because they just don't keep their setups running for that long.

I agree with you and @_Maq_ on this one. I <"always come back"> to Dr Stephan Tanner's article <"Aquarium Biofiltration - SWISSTROPICALS">.

I just think a <"bit of benign neglect"> and then <"good things come to those who wait">.

cheers Darrel

 

[ElleDee]

Hi all,
Congratulations on your new arrival and on the tanks having done so well with benign neglect. You have <"had a mention"> on UKAPS why you've been otherwise engaged.

I agree with you and @_Maq_ on this one. I <"always come back"> to Dr Stephan Tanner's article <"Aquarium Biofiltration - SWISSTROPICALS">.

I just think a <"bit of benign neglect"> and then <"good things come to those who wait">.

cheers Darrel

I am very flattered! And endlessly impressed at your ability to recall and find what has been said in the past. I run across my old posts from time to time and often either teach myself something or am mortified to have previously held such a wrong opinion.

 

[dw1305]

Hi all,
You can't forget <"an analogy"> like this:

..... I think you're spot on with the craft vs. art distinction. I was thinking about this topic while driving and had the thought that the judging reminded me of the state/county fair - no one is breaking any new ground in the blackberry jam category, but I expect the winner is very good jam indeed.......

It is right up there with the <"best UKAPS has to offer">.

I run across my old posts from time to time and often either teach myself something or am mortified to have previously held such a wrong opinion.

<"I think we've all been there">- <""Aquarium Science" has some new planted tank articles">.

...... When I first read about EI my initial thought was that it had a <"snowball in hell's"> chance of working, but as you read through the forum (and particularly look at the pictures) it becomes obvious that it does work. At that point, after the pictures, you really have two options, you can either try and <"understand what is happening">, or you can become an "EI denier", in face of overwhelming evidence.

cheers Darrel