Aquarium Plant Food UK Closing Down

[dw1305]

Hi all,

Try directing a new starter who has never even heard of a dry fertiliser salt to a website and telling them they need to buy some potassium nitrate, some mono-potassium phosphate and some magnesium sulphate, and most are going to be so bamboozled they're simply not going to bother

Agreed and that is why I'd point them at <"Solufeed 2 : 1 : 4"> or similar.

Charging £20 for a pre-packaged set of salts with the kit necessary to mix it as APFUK did is a bargain in my opinion given it gives you tens of litres of mix to make up and last years. I don't really see the ethical issue to be honest - in fact it works in the opposite way, and stops people being ripped off by the mainstream expensive waters.

I'd agree again, I haven't got much time for the competitors in the "World's most expensive water" contest. I'm just not sure it is a commercially viable option and whether the present economic climate makes it <"more or less viable">.

cheers Darrel

 

[Wookii]

Agreed and that is why I'd point them at <"Solufeed 2 : 1 : 4"> or similar.

Is that product suitable for making up as a stable solution and dosing over a period of, say, 2-4 months? Would you be happy recommending that product to beginners given the Urea content?

If 'yes' to both, that's enough for me, and I'll happily recommend the same product. My only skin in the game is to have a simple location to direct someone for cheap reliable safe ferts - it always used to be the APFUK starter kit, but we don't have that anymore and so need a good alternative.

I'm just not sure it is a commercially viable option and whether the present economic climate makes it <"more or less viable">.

I don't think it is a commercially viable option, that's why no-one else is doing it - though I'm surprised Aquasplantcareuk hasn't thrown together a starter kit given they sell much of the stuff already - and in part why I suggested it might be better on a 'charitable' basis for the joint benefit of newbies and UKAPS - it just needs someone (that isn't me) willing to administer it for free 😂

 

[Hanuman]

it just needs someone (that isn't me) willing to administer it for free 😂

Best sentence of the thread.

 

[dw1305]

Hi all,

Would you be happy recommending that product to beginners given the Urea content?

No, probably not. I'd guess that is one of the reasons why those vendors who sell products containing ammonium nitrate (NH4NO3) or urea (CO(NH2)2) produce an incredibly dilute mix.

cheers Darrel

 

[Wookii]

Best sentence of the thread.

You get to cop out as you're so damn far away, so relax @Hanuman 😂

 

[Hanuman]

I'm taking no responsibility for this, blame lies entirely @Zeus. & @Hanuman's door)

Reminds me an update is on the way.. Minor tweaks specially to Fe gluconate.

 

[ScapingScotsman]

Hi all,

I understand that, it is not the technical difficulties that concern me. I've often made up <"plant nutrient solutions, from scratch">, in the past.

You could do it as a DIY activity, but as soon as it becomes a commercial operation things change.

The issue would be that, using salts, would entail a lot of paperwork and storage issues (KNO3 is an explosive etc.), mixing and packaging would need to be done in a premise with extraction, a flammables vault, a poisons cupboard etc. Costs would soon mount up.

As an example of what I mean, <"I have a colleague"> who looks at pharmaceutical usages for food products (anthocyanin in Cranberries etc.). Developing a new drug is incredibly expensive, but a food product has already passed a lot of those regulatory requirements.

That would be the advantage of re-branding an existing fertiliser mix, it is already a "food product".

cheers Darrel

This is something I'd be more than happy to do here at work Darrell? I handle some insanely unstable chemicals daily, and always testing in my lab etc.
We are licensed for all and every kind of chemical, storage and handling. I can always make up a batch of 1kg pouches and or 500g pouches, label the necessary warnings on the back as we do with everything, and just a case of slapping a ukaps label on the front. It's cheap enough to send as we have accounts with all couriers.

I can also always make a heavily concentrated npk, and trace and make x amount of stock for people so they're not worried about buying powders.

 

[Chrispowell]

This is something I'd be more than happy to do here at work Darrell? I handle some insanely unstable chemicals daily, and always testing in my lab etc.
We are licensed for all and every kind of chemical, storage and handling. I can always make up a batch of 1kg pouches and or 500g pouches, label the necessary warnings on the back as we do with everything, and just a case of slapping a ukaps label on the front. It's cheap enough to send as we have accounts with all couriers.

I can also always make a heavily concentrated npk, and trace and make x amount of stock for people so they're not worried about buying powders.

I would get one straight away


Chris

 

[John q]

This is something I'd be more than happy to do here at work Darrell?

So where's the impasse here... S scot supplies chemicals at cost to ukaps members, adds a service charge which is donated to ukaps. 👍

Ukaps can't take on this role, as Darrel mentioned, far to much red tape.

@ScapingScotsman if you need a middle man to assist in this I'd be happy to help. 😀

 

[Hanuman]

it just needs someone (that isn't me) willing to administer it for free 😂

This is something I'd be more than happy to do here at work Darrell

Someone heard you @Wookii. In the meantime I am so happy to be so far away....

 

[Wookii]

So where's the impasse here...

I think the impasse was this:

@ScapingScotsman if you need a middle man to assist in this I'd be happy to help. 😀

. . . and you've just bridged it John! 👏👍

@John q and @ScapingScotsman - Once you've got all your joint ducks in a row, it might be worth setting up a new thread in the ferts section of the forum, where you can list the pack contents and pricing, and ask @LondonDragon to make it a sticky?

 

[John q]

@ScapingScotsman
Drop me a pm mate and let me know which areas you need assistance with, hopefully then we can try and flesh out the details.

 

[ScapingScotsman]

I think the impasse was this:

. . . and you've just bridged it John! 👏👍

@John q and @ScapingScotsman - Once you've got all your joint ducks in a row, it might be worth setting up a new thread in the ferts section of the forum, where you can list the pack contents and pricing, and ask @LondonDragon to make it a sticky?

Would this be OK to go ahead with @LondonDragon ? Purely for ukaps members only initially. I can make up the relevant size packs, work out an identical wee trace mix, and then offer as a complete starter package or just individual foil packs. The difference between the cost and SMALL sale price would then all be donated to ukaps each month? Or I work out what any member pays, and ask that they donate that difference to ukaps then purchase the salts?
There won't ever be a shortage, we have 27 barrels of KNO3 alone at 22kgs each so its not going anywhere soon. If there could be a pm started with the relevant ukaps founders and myself and John q if necessary we could discuss this going forwards? Or I could set up a small brand solely for the fertilisers and bottles for all the members and a basic website? I wouldn't offer anything to anyone unless founders are happy to do so.

 

[gamersinc]

Any update on this whether UKAPS going ahead with their own fert mix. Been using APFUK EI ferts and it is close to finishing and realised that they have shut down and cant buy anymore.

 

[John q]

Any update on this whether UKAPS going ahead with their own fert mix

From what I can gather "guessing words into the horses mouth" it was unfeasible to offer these salts at the current wholesale price levels, and compete, or even break even at the price apfuk were selling them for.
For me it would have been a worthwhile venture , I tried to embrace it... possibly think geopolitical nonsense got in the way.

 

[Courtneybst]

From what I can gather "guessing words into the horses mouth" it was unfeasible to offer these salts at the current wholesale price levels, and compete, or even break even at the price apfuk were selling them for.
For me it would have been a worthwhile venture , I tried to embrace it... possibly think geopolitical nonsense got in the way.

To be honest, I think I would pay a slight premium just to get them from one place. Now that APFUK has dissolved, I'm having to source salts from here and hither, and I'm paying the premium anyway in delivery fees!

Although I use them, I find Aqua plants care to be unpredictable in stocking and they're not all that cheap.

Trace elements are another thing I haven't had to think about yet as I still have APFUK stock but it will run out eventually...

This is not a complaint btw, just a matter of fact lol.

 

[Myrtle]

The faff of trying to source everything is why I've stuck to pre-mixed. I was just considering dry salts when they shut so now it's too complicated to do anything else

 

[dw1305]

Hi all,

Trace elements are another thing I haven't had to think about yet as I still have APFUK stock but it will run out eventually...

Been using APFUK EI ferts and it is close to finishing and realised that they have shut down and cant buy anymore.

I'd probably try Solufeed in both cases. If you don't mind the urea (CO(NH2)2) content then the <"Solufeed 2 : 1 : 4 mix"> should do and they also sell <"trace nutrients"> mixes.

This the nutrient breakdown for <"the 2 : 1 : 4 mix"> and the <"calculation for 10 ppm NO3 for a 180 litre tank">.

I'll use nitrate (NO3-) again as my target nutrient, but I'll go for 10 ppm NO3-, rather than 10 ppm N (~44 ppm NO3-). So the only differences are tank volume and nutrient dosing level. I still assume that all the nitrogen is as NO3.

• The tank is a nominal 180 litres and
• I want 10 ppm NO3
• Solufeed 2 : 1 : 4 is 15% nitrogen (N).
• There are 1000 mg in a gram, so 1 gram of Solufeed contains 0.15g or 150 mg N, "mg / L" and "ppm" are equivalents.
• 150 / 180 = 0.83 ppm N in 180 litres. To convert from N to NO3 we multiply by 4.43.
• 0.83 x 4.43 = 3.69, so 1 gram of Solufeed 2 : 1 : 4 supplies 3.69 ppm NO3
• 3.69 * 2.71 = 10 ppm
• You need to add 2.7g of Solufeed 2 : 1 : 4 to 180 litres to give 10 ppm NO3.

cheers Darrel

 

[Tim Harrison]

I'd probably try Solufeed in both cases.

Ordered mine last night. Still only £13.99 for a 1Kg pack, inc delivery.

 

[John q]

now it's too complicated to do anything else

Send me a pm mate 😀

I'd probably try Solufeed in both cases. If you don't mind the urea (CO(NH2)2) content then the <"Solufeed 2 : 1 : 4 mix"> should do

Definitely the kiss option 👍