Search results for query: light compensation point

...different stimuli. Species such as Anubias and Java fern are adapted to very low light forest conditions and have a very low light compensation point; for instance, they have no need to close up since too much light is never going to be a problem in their natural habitat. They are however, by...

...isn't too low, it usually just means that plant growth will be slower. However, if the light intensity is below a plants light compensation point it will start to die and release organics, and then you'll probably get algae. Its a balancing act between finding the right light intensity and...

Light and CO2 can compensate each other. The higher the CO2, the lower on light you can go. If you back down on CO2, the light compensation point increases, so you need to up the light.......My hydrophila pinnatifida I grew some years back in a non-co2 tank melted until I moved it to better...

Light compensation point is quite low, so i doubt grobeams are below that, but i will look it up and come back on it.

...lights can certainly drive deficiencies but melting isn't one of the issues....Can you show me any proof/evidence, even anecdotal but proven, that melting plants is due to using stronger lights? However, there is evidence that plants melt when the light is below their light compensation point...

...are very few occurrences of plants failing due to insufficient lighting, and that Anubias is virtually bulletproof, having a Light Compensation Point of less than 15 micromoles, so the most probable cause is melting due to poor CO2, not due to poor light. Not sure if this is the same model...

...Between 5 inches and 24 inches the numbers fall somewhere in between. There is something we measure in plants called the Light Compensation Point (LCP). This is the minimum amount of light, measured in PAR, a plant needs to survive. Crypts, ferns, moss and plants like Anubias have an LCP...

PAR meter construction consists of some special filter optics that includes the spectral compensation for the plants spectral absorption, as well as spectral compensation for spectral response of the light sensor. Also includes "cosine" correction for incoming light angles. From the Apogee...

If you have a dimmer to play with you can go as long in periode as you want, if a natural pond can stay relatively algae free with 18 hours of daylight/sunlight. It shouldn't be a problem for an artificialy lit indoor tank. It's all about intensity and the plants compensation point in how far...

...going to receive most of their light energy via transitory bright sun flecks, all of the rest of the time PAR will be below light compensation point. If a plant is nutrient limited it will try to maximise the amount of light it can use, and then it will shed less photosynthetically...

...need lights from the start, I always go for 6hrs to start with. The light intensity will need to be higher than the plants light compensation point, so don't go too low otherwise your plants will suffer and release organics which will make the NTS worse. Like foxfish says pump in the CO2 from...

...the competition photo. I guess the plants listed above can survive and even grow at low light levels because they have a low light compensation point, but it doesn't necessarily mean they are exclusively low light plants. B, heudelotii, for instance, is a complete thug given optimum...

...production, because during photosynthesis one molecule of oxygen is evolved for every molecule of CO2 incorporated. At light compensation point net oxygen production is nil, but as PAR rises plants are massively oxygen producers as the "extra" CO2 is incorporated into carbohydrates. It...

Yeah, very interesting blog...I've always wondered how it's possible to create an artificial system without injected CO2, and still get similar plant growth to that seen in natural/semi-natural ecosystems. I've noted over the years that Darrel has achieved something similar with his high light...

I guess more light could be the answer If light intensity is below the light compensation point of a plant. In this case the plant will start to die and decompose releasing organics which will provide favourable conditions for algae. So more light would be needed to restore the plants health and...

...oxygen. The oxygen is one of the <"products of photosynthesis"> (6CO2 + 6H2O ~ C6H12O6 + 6O2). When light energy exceeds the light compensation point a plant it become a net oxygen producer. It will, but the only way to "preserve" that oxygen would be to seal the tank, so that there is no...

Thank your for your help, Tim. The light is from Giesemann and I asked them too. Haven't heard back yet so I haven't ordered another light. I like your suggestion and might just try it with one light.

...a little longer to cover. But I guess if it's too shady it won't grow at all, or worse just die if intensity is below its light compensation point. Ensuring good flow and distribution of CO2 can help since it will effectively lower the plants light compensation point. Adding enough fertz to...

What type of light are you using, and intensity? One of the plants looks like aponogeton(the curly leaves)...can't remember its proper name but it looked like that in my tank when it didn't get enough light. The leaves should grow wider and even slightly pinkish when grown properly. Plants also...

...the job we need them for. I understand your request for a moonlight that does not stimulate growth but as Mark put it, most lights set to a low level will give enough light to view the tank but not enough light to stimulate growth as they will below the light compensation point. How about...

...since it is a matter of taste) can achieve is using a spot light for that. As said as long as you stay bellow the plants light compensation point you can use what ever light you want, what ever looks good to you. It wont be strong enough for the plant to do anything much with it anyway and...

...with all the intensity control provided by my own software. It works. As far as a moonlight effect is concerned, search the forums for light compensation point. Generally speaking running your lights at 2-5% will give the effect you are looking for without driving plant growth. Regards, Mark

...a very dim natural white color as most pleasing. :) Something to think about when having lights on at night is the plants Light Compensation Point. But also this, if you stay in the plants compensation point you'll be far above a moonlight effect, so this also isn't realy a thing you need to...

What is a normal low tech approach first of all? And where did you get the info about co2 being 1-2ppm in a low tech? Regardless, there is scientific info that higher light compensates for lower co2 and vice versa. So when one sets up a real low tech tank with low light and no CO2, they are...

Well, I definitely have the type of BBA that grows in shade as well as in good light....Lowering the light surely doesn't work for me. As I said in my last tank the BBA appeared when the light was already quite low, below the compensation point for almost any plants, even the emersed peace...

Don't forget to mention, the majority of plants we grow do not grow submersed in nature. Rather marginal and only submersed in the rainy seasons. If a plant grows submersed in nature it is mainly in places where it is unchaded in rather clear waters.. Like i see where the Calitriche grows in the...

...During photosynthesis one molecule of oxygen is released for every molecule of CO2 taken up. When the light levels reach light compensation point plants become net oxygen producers, when light levels are below light compensation point plants are oxygen consumers, due to respiration, but...

Sorry I was being abrupt. I was posting from my phone and I hate them mobiles :p The light compensation point for plants is increased when you add more CO2 to the tank. So essentially plants that are lacking light can improve if more CO2 is added. The opposite is also true. Therefore the thread...

C02 and light compensate for one another. Read about light/co2 compensation point.. Upping one of them may resolve the problem providing the plants get light above the min required for the species. The pics i posted are after my lights failed when the valis was still hanging. I had a lot more...

...net oxygen producers, basically for every molecule of CO2 used in photosynthesis a molecule of oxygen (O2) is produced. At light compensation point CO2 use and oxygen evolution is in balance, but during active photosynthesis plant growth is a measure of the carbon capture. At the end of the...

Yes, I agree Andy. CO injected tanks are different. But sometimes what one thinks is helping is actually masking the main issue and making it worse. There's no issues with heterotrophic bacteria in any tank as long as the tank is balanced and it isn't the only functioning bacteria...

I was just thinking about light compensation points and I read a comment that said 'if a plant is growing it is receiving light above its light compensation point'. I was just wondering that if a plant went from high light/high co2 to low light/high co2 and the plant had lots of mass, if the...

Hi, guys! Do you know what the light compensation point (in µmol / mˉ² sˉ¹) of pogostemon helferi and glossostigma elatinoides? Or just post the LCP of others plants you know. Thank you.

...the same. In a planted tank, during the photo-period, plants are net oxygen producers and CO2 users (when PAR exceeds the <"light compensation point">). During this time period dissolved CO2 will be depleted by photosynthesis, and submerged aquatic plant growth will be carbon limited...

Thanks a lot for these infos. Tank water is hard so this could be an issue. Dosed a bit more iron yesterday and today saw a bit better condition. Too early to say it's improving though. Will keep an eye on this. Sent from my XT1022 using Tapatalk

Hi all, Yes light can definitely be limiting. Every plant will have a <"light compensation point" (LCP)>, where photosynthesis and respiration are balanced, if the light level doesn't reach the LCP in a leaf, then that leaf will be shed. Because you have green leaves lower down the plant I don't...

It's possible, it's probably more likely in an open top tank. However, it depends on the light intensity and the species light compensation point (LCP) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compensation_point. It also depends on CO2 saturation since high CO2 will lower a plants LCP, and coincidently...

...always mean the plants run out of CO2. Higher light lowers the CO2 compensation point in some plants. Higher CO2 lowers the light compensation point. But neither can do anything about compensating for a nutrient deficiency. Experience wise, when the sun starts blazing at my small tank next...

By my observations, overstocking->high organics does lead to BBA in particular. So I see the point of Andy here, BBA being dependent on B12 to grow surely relies on heterotrophic bacteria for production and high organics lead to more heterotrophs. That's what they do, "eat" organics for energy...

...For instance, soil may guard against the impact of resource limitation, or it may give off just enough CO2 to lower the light compensation point of some plant species etc...all these little advantages probably add up to something that is more than the sum of parts and could conceivably make...

I've found that with a high plant biomass and low nutrient levels in the water column it is possible to increase the light intensity and get relatively high growth rate without encouraging algae, (higher light can reduce the CO2 compensation point), and it can also increase the list of plants...

Oh yes. I buy cheap but if I buy a tank I want to know its capacity, the watts/lumens of a light, the flow a pump can deliver the concentrations of ferts etc etc. How would you know 30 ppm is normally safe for our fish? That the more O2 you have the more co2 you can inject? If a certain soil...

...but all plants are net users of oxygen outside of the photo-period. It is only when light intensity increases above the light compensation point (LCP) plants become net oxygen producers (LCP is when the oxygen evolved from photosynthesis exceeds the oxygen used by respiration)...

as far as I've gathered from round here, the point at which plants don't get enough light to grow (light compensation point) is very low, and light intensity only really affects growth rate and colouration. However, I also know that rotala macrandra is one of the most fussy plants going....

There is such a thing at too little light. Different plants have varying requirements. Each has a LCP (light compensation point), below which the plant will fail to grow and eventually die. CO2 can raise the LCP a bit but then the plant is forced to adapt to resource limitation and that is often...

Yes you did.. Blush.. Excuse me, it's my English got a litlle rusty over time and sometimes i have to read things 3 times over (or even better, think twice and hush) to get the correct interpretation. Biophytum sensitivum :) indeed a very wonderfull plant.. Nice medical potential too.. Funny is...

...scientific papers that I gathered (all values are in µmol PAR): LS = Light saturation Km = Half-saturation constant LCP = Light compensation point Cabomba caroliniana (grown at 30°C), LS = 700, Km = 160, LCP = 55 µmol PAR. Ceratophyllum demersum (30°C), LS = 700, Km = 145, LCP = 35 µmol PAR...

Hi all, Yes, some plants will have a very low light compensation point. It is because we won't have experimentally defined PAR values that you have to guess which plants need the least light, and why I wrote this earlier in the thread. That is actually to do with the way that we perceive light...

Thanks :) nice reads again. In what i've experienced and observed by chance i just have a hard time to believe that the compensation point is the same for each plant on this planet. I've observed some plants initiat growth with very low light input. That low that it is hard to believe it would...

Hi all, That is slightly different, light levels below the light compensation point can have all sorts of effects on cell extension and initiating flowering etc. Have a look at <"phytochrome"> & <"light">. cheers Darrel

Hi all, You need sufficient light intensity to reach <"light compensation point">, if you don't then it doesn't matter how long you run the lights for, the plants won't be able to grow. Same for me, I have my tanks on a 12 hour day, all with a covering of floaters. If I was going to try a long...

First of all please define high light(our opinions may differ). If you can please post par values from your tank. Also I'd like to see some pictures of the tank. (I'm a low tech guy too and love to see others work)

Yes, my tank worked great on the same principle as Darrel's from what I understand from his posts. No, they didn't. The part about lowering the CO2 compensation point with extra light is from a different scientific paper which they have referenced as Maberly 1983; Maberly 1985 It is your...

They didn't attempt to lower the co2 compensation point, they found the minimum of both light and co2 and increased them from there. I'm not saying high co2 and low light will give you better growth than low co2 and higher light. Their experiment shows it doesn't. They don't state about any...

Keyword.... May. Also it seems to suggest it's limited to certain species of plants. Assuming it's possible(I'm not say it isn't), I don't see why this would be a desirable condition to attempt to achieve in the aquarium as it would result in too little wiggle room.

Quote: High light availability may also allow aquatic plants to lower CO2 compensation point (Maberly 1983; Maberly 1985) This may be particularly advantageous of matforming photoautothrophs in shallow water. In such systems, the light is often abundant, whereas concentration of CO2 inside the...

Not my understanding of it sorry. Light is always the accelerator, plants have a coping mechanism for dealing with lower levels of co2 and adding more light will just get you closer to the point where the plants won't cope but just before you get there your plants will grow well. Adding co2...

Yes, but addition of light lowers the co2 compensation point too, allowing them to grow with less CO2. It's not one sided.

Not quite correct, addition of co2 lowers the light compensation point of the plants allowing them to grow with less light.

...50 µmol PAR at the substrate to hardly grow. But some of them may grow at lower values as each plant species has different light compensation point. But most aquatic plants will grow at their maximum growth rate under 500-1000 µmol PAR. So supplying them with just 50 µmol PAR is not much...

I'm not sure I would agree. More NPK+Fe -> higher uptake of NPK+Fe seems to be correct. PO4 and CO2 do have a relationship. It may have more to do with increasing efficiency - not what is a needed CO2 level. Something that always helps me is to remember that plant growth will increase in low...

No worries parotet no offense taken, Im just interested in debating and getting to the bottom of things. Hi ardjuna, First of all I would like to know if you have a fertile substrate in your densely planted tank? Nutrients in a planted tank cannot be compared to light or CO2 in the way that...

Not sure I agree with that. That statement seems (forgive me if I'm not understanding properly) that plants have individual and independent 'compensation points' for each nutrient/light. I pretty much agree with the statement earlier. All this talk of slowing plants down by limiting nutrient...

...PAR, and you give them only 100 µmol PAR, then they'll grow maybe on 70%. As long as they have more light then is their "light compensation point", they'll grow just fine. The same applies for nutrients (incl. CO2). If some plants have CO2 saturation point at 35 ppm, and you give them only 10...

...that most colour temperatures of white light (from even fairly modest wattage fixtures) produce enough PAR to exceed the <"light compensation point"> (LCP) of most plants. This is largely to do with the <"accessory pigments"> in the chlorophyll molecule, which will harvest different...

That's a heck of a lot of light, I did something similar a while back (2x24W T5) it worked surprisingly well, I got amazing growth rates, for a low-energy. No fertz, just soil, so most of the nutrients were in the substrate feeding big root feeders, but after 3 months or so I found different...

...approx. 3/4 coverage down to ~ 1/3) the planted plants will begin to undergo leaf death, because leaves that are now below light compensation point will be shed. This process will continue through the darker months, with I'd estimate tank plant biomass about 1/3 lower in the winter than...

...CO2 at 400ppm) and nutrients (via EI), so that only leaves light. If the light intensity (really <"PAR">) doesn't reach <"light compensation point">, increasing the length of the photoperiod won't help, but increasing the PAR will. If light intensity exceeds LCP, and nutrients, including...

I often wondered this as well in my low tech affairs. I began to look at one or two plants, and noted the frequency with which new leaves appeared and so long as the new growth leaves looked healthy, then ... I would actually count the numbers of new leaves on the majority of the plants (over...

Thanks man very nice articles! One question....how do I know that I am not at or below the light compensation point? Any signs e.g no growth or little growth or melting or no sustainability?

...but it is a different figure for each plant. The minimum amount of light necessary for survival is a value called The Light Compensation Point (LCP). More info in the following threads: LED Lighting | Page 2 | UK Aquatic Plant Society Do t8 lights really degrade over time? | UK Aquatic Plant...

A lot of plants are grown emergent, so when you submerge them there often tends to be some die off whilst they adapt. My latest hi-energy effort has suffered massively from die off and has only recently turned a corner around 2 months later. Just keep up with the water changes and removing as...

I don't necessarily agree, but each to their own I suppose, and I guess it all depends on your own unique tank conditions and how a siesta period is applied. The quote below was taken from the recent discussion here http://www.ukaps.org/forum/threads/split-photoperiod.32744/#post-348017 just in...

...if I remember came out around 25 PAR. I have to admit I also stuck CO2 on it as an experiment in seeing how low I could grow certain plants under. CO2 injection raising the "light compensation point" (i think that is the right phrase) of the species in the tank. Unnecessary but it deffo helped.

I'm not so sure it's that simple. In a low energy tank light levels are traditionally relatively low anyway, and in the case of my tank there is probably enough ambient daylight to maintain photosynthesis during the siesta period - especially since it has an open top - all be it at a slower rate...

Hi all, Either of those. Take the paper off, that is pretty low light even at full efficiency. There isn't much point in running either without more light, I'm not a CO2 user, but those who are will tell you that added CO2 slightly lowers the LCP, but even so your 60W isn't a lot of light for...

Hello, guys! What the symptoms of a plant under the LCP (light compensation point)? It becomes yellowish and die? Or just begins to decay?

...is a net consumer, rather than a net producer, the plant will shed it. If a leaf is in the light, but it never gets above "light compensation point" <Compensation point - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia>, the plant will shed it. You can't compensate for this by a longer light period, the...

No, I don't have any list. It's not really necessary and it really wouldn't help. There is no such thing as preference outside the context of CO2/flow/distribution. There are plenty of websites, including suppliers, who list "PAR requirement" such as high light, low light and so forth. Those are...

...but it is a different figure for each plant. The minimum amount of light necessary for survival is a value called The Light Compensation Point (LCP). More info in the following threads: LED Lighting | Page 2 | UK Aquatic Plant Society Do t8 lights really degrade over time? | UK Aquatic Plant...

Well in theory yes. Darrel pointed out that the plants may struggle due to not being able to reach the light compensation point. The idea of the light compensation is when the rate of photosynthesis matches the rate of respiration. If the plant does not get enough light then its health could...

Hi all, I definitely turn the light back on for some period every day. At this time of year ambient light levels are pretty low, and even low light plants will struggle to reach light compensation point. cheers Darrel

Quite true. A 'low light tank' with CO2 addition will outperform a 'low light tank' with CO2 in terms of growth. Whether you are after faster growth is a seperate question.

Trying remember the thread but if recall correctly co2 lowers the light compensation point of plants so you can actually use less light.....

I don't think that too much light is a trigger for BBA, because (as you could read on my website) light compensation point for BBA is only 30-70 µmol PAR, which means that this algae grows at its max at medium light, so it doesn't need more light (this algae just can't utilize any more light)...

...thinks they are running the underwater equivalent of a cannabis farm. The fact is that each plant has a property known as Light Compensation Point (LCP). This is the minimum amount of light that a plant can use to make carbohydrates. A plant operating at LCP intensity levels is only able to...

...and Pennywort have intercepted the PAR, and this has meant that the lower leaves of the Water Wisteria have not reached light compensation point (LCP) and have been discarded. At this time of year I give the floaters quite a trim as the tanks will receive less ambient light during the winter...

Hi all, Yes. Your plants die. Have a look at these links <Search Results for Query: light compensation point | UK Aquatic Plant Society> cheers Darrel

...leaves within the canopy are at the point where light, CO2 and nutrient levels are balanced and any leaves that are below light compensation point will be discarded by the plant. Because I always have floaters (or emergents) these aren't CO2 limited, and as long as they have sufficient...

And vise-versa...elevated light levels will reduce the CO2 compensation point... from the same paper - 'With more light available, less investment in the light utilisation system is necessary and the free energy can be invested into a more efficient CO2 uptake system so that the CO2, which is...

...PAR, nutrients and growth. I've some-how managed to post the same link twice in my previous post, but the other old thread I meant to link to was this one (from 2010): <Light Compensation Point and optimal PAR levels | UK Aquatic Plant Society>, and particularly this post. cheers Darrel

That's what it says about the light and CO2 levels in the article without specifying much:

This is a really useful page. Effectively what the tropica experiment shows is that both light and co2 affect plant growth. So it is not the case that you cannot underlight an aquarium. For example they state Both fluorescent light and highpressure-quicksilver lamps may produce sufficient...

...are really plants that have low potential growth rates in lower light conditions. Each individual plant species will have a "light compensation point" (LCP), where the amount of incident PAR means that production exceeds consumption <Compensation point - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia>, if...

Hi Darren, Michael's post is good but if your camera is a basic point and shoot then you may not have control over aperture, shutter speed and ISO (but learning these is fundamental to becoming a good photographer). I used to shoot a lot of aquarium stuff with a basic compact and even had...

...and you have higher residual levels of CO2, the fish may be stressed. As soon as the light is on ("above photosynthesis light compensation point") the plants are using CO2 and producing oxygen. You can do, or you can increase the surface ripple. Have a look at this thread: <Surface...

...it now infact, I've had a drum of water ready since last Thursday!! As for the hairgrass, I'd be surprised if I was at the light compensation point, but its possible I suppose.....liquid carbon was being dosed at good levels, especially given the low light intensity, and distribution is good...

...of light, do not pay attention to flow and CO2, and the result is meltdown. While there is little doubt that HC has a higher light compensation point than say, Ferns, the LCP for HC is not very much higher than it is for Ferns. Even if it's 100% higher that just means that a Fern will grow at...

...it would be impossible to be precise, but i dont think aside from redirecting all of the light, that you will fall below the light compensation point so your plants will be fine. Have you tried removing one tube to see if the unit still powers the remaining tube...im sure the old juwel...

The conclusion is based on an optical illusion. I've also grown this plant for years in a CO2 enriched tank and have NEVER experienced loss of leaves or shriveling. In fact, when pruning, I've simply thrown away the tops. It doesn't matter whether the tank is CO2 enriched or not. The cause is...