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Redmoor DSM Jungle

Brian Murphy

Brian Murphy

Member
Joined
20 Oct 2012
Messages
593
Location
Omagh, N.Ireland
So I started this tank back on the 9th June (can't believe it's been that long) and have had some set backs with some plants not doing so well due to soil burn (I presume) and have changed things around a little. Basically this was an experiment to see what I could grow DSM and I tbh I wasn't even sure if and when I would flood the tank but the decision has been taken to do it next week which is why I'm posting this now in the journals section. The previous journey of the tank can be found here My emersed project | UK Aquatic Plant Society

I had a bit of time on my hands over the bank holiday weekend so I gave my rocks a good scrubbing and placed them in the tank as best I could considering the tank is only 30cm wide and I didn't want to disturb the Staurogynes. I also decided to tie on more moss because of my decision to flood, there is still some moss from the DSM and I hope that it will stay attached after just 2 weeks. I moved the redmoor into a different position and plan on ordering some new plants at the weekend for flooding next week.

So the specs will be as follows :

Tank : Standard 90x30x45cm
Filter : APS 1400lph +UV Spraybar for now (new sample range of glassware arriving soon 😉 )
Co2 : Sodastream via UP 16/22 Atomizer
Substrate : ADA Amazonia
Lighting : APS 2 x39w
EI Dosing

Plants: Staurogyne Repens, Alternanthera reineckii 'Mini' and java/fissidens moss

I am planning on maybe getting Proserpinaca Palustris, some bolbitis and java fern and maybe something else but still unsure and open for comments and suggestions.


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3-4 days and not one reply lol ..... I think that says alot on the scape! Anyway I've just put an order in for some plants to arrive next week and my new Glassware has arrived, various pieces which I'm very happy about and not available yet in the UK. Hopefully I will have some for sale in the near future.
Plants ordered are:

Microsorium Pteropus, Java Fern (in vitro), Proserpinaca Palustris (rare plant and I've not seen it many tanks), Utricularia graminifolia (in vitro, trying this again but when the tank has been flooded), Alternanthera Reineckii 'mini' (1-2 Grow!, need more of these to fill in), Rotala Macranda (1-2 Grow!), Bolitus

I'm off for a week from Tuesday onwards, so hopefully plants arrive tuesday/wednesday and I'll get to re-arrange the layout and get planting and get placing all my glassware into the tank and move my already used and full of good bacteria APS 1400 +UV over from my Rio 400 (breaking the tank down gradually).

Only thing missing in my life is the Optiwhite tank I so long for but that will have to wait for a few months and then I'll break this tank down.
 
Looks nice Murf.
I was a little concerned that there would be no height to the scape but I see you now have the pp and rotala on order so I'm guessing they will add height to the left side behind the wood and give a triangle style layout shape to the scape?
You will need to keep the ferns and bolbitis in check to ensure they don't overpower the scape and hide the intricate wood pieces but there are some nice colours and textures included in the plant scheme so it will look very nice.
Look forward to seeing it fully planted 🙂
Cheerio
Ady
 
Tank looks good mate looking forward to seeing grown in, really like the wood

Thanks dean
 
Ady34 said:
Looks nice Murf.
I was a little concerned that there would be no height to the scape but I see you now have the pp and rotala on order so I'm guessing they will add height to the left side behind the wood and give a triangle style layout shape to the scape?
You will need to keep the ferns and bolbitis in check to ensure they don't overpower the scape and hide the intricate wood pieces but there are some nice colours and textures included in the plant scheme so it will look very nice.
Look forward to seeing it fully planted 🙂
Cheerio
Ady
Click to expand...

Yeah, I was a little disappointed with the lack of height in the redmoor, think I might raise the substrate a little here in the 'triangle' and create a 'raised bed' with rocks creating a wall like effect. I will have to move some staurogyne in order to achieve this but if a job needs doing it needs doing right ! :cigar:
 
All the plants and new clear hoses for filter arrived this morning so I was in great form and started the big plant and filter change over straight away. I got all the java fern and bolbitis attached to the wood with blobs of glue and then this evening after moving the filter a major disaster happened when I went to add some water to the tank, it started leaking! :banghead: I had to get the tank outside straight away or else it would have flooded the house and it was then I noticed a big crack on the bottom of the tank. I am almost certain that it was caused by the heat matt. So be careful if ever using one.
I now have pots of 1-2 Grow! plants sitting here and wondering if putting them in the fridge would help them until planting tomorrow? I have re-siliconed an old 3 ft tank that I had sitting about and will use that for the time being when it dries.
 
New tank all scaped, planted and filled. Co2 is on full blast plus I've dosed some Macro nutrients, I'll do a 50% water change tomorrow and dose some micro nutrients before I have to jet off across the shuck to meet some aquascaping know-it-alls in stockport on saturday and then do a water change on sunday when I get home and start the process all over again. No pics as yet as my iphone's wireless is up the left and can't upload them to photobucket. Not much to see yet as its still very murky and full off Co2 bubbles.
 
So managed to upload some of my pics, still got a way to go before I'm happy with it but that will all depend on growth. Got back from Stockport late on sunday so was too tired to do any water changes. I have noticed a white film type stuff on the redmoor. I did see it before when I was presoaking the wood outside and after a week or so this stuff appeared but I got it off with a toothbrush, only thing is that I have moss delicately painted onto the wood so scrubbing it is not an option at the moment. Would love to add some shrimp and ottos now to hopefully sort it out for me but I think its too soon. I will do a few tests just to check the ammonia and nitrite levels before I would anyway. Other than that I am happy with the progress so far but I could have a small dead spot on the bottom left on the same side as the out lily pipe, but will keep an eye on that.

Re-arranging the aquasoil
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Flooding the tank
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Everything seemed to be going ok but it seems I've got some plant melt! So hopefully someone can pinpoint my problem which I think is certainly too much light??

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Tank Vol. - 100l
Filter - APS 1400lph + 1600 powerhead
Substrate - ADA Amazonia
EI Dosing - Macro/Micro alternate days for 6 days
Lighting - AllPonds 2x39w + 50% xtra with built in reflectors

Flora

Alternanthera Rosaefolia
Ammana Senegalensis (both doing well)
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Staurogyne Repens (doing well but no real growth spurt with all the Co2)
Bolbitis (some of the leaf is going a dark green colour)

Alternanthera Reinekii 1-2 Grow! (Melting)
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Utricularia Graminifolia in-vitro (Melted away)
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Microsorium Pteropus in-vitro (starting to melt away)
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Rotala Macranda 1-2 Grow! (Melted away)
Proserpinica Palustris (Melted away)

I had planned to have near double capacity in a 200l optiwhite tank when I purchased the lighting but I haven't been able to purchase the tank as yet, so I started A tank anyway as I couldn't wait.
The tank is getting Co2 from 10am to 10pm and lights come on at 3pm and off at 12midnight, so the Co2 should be plenty for the plants at lights on and there is plenty of flow!
If I calculate using the watts per gallon method Im getting around 4wpg, so I'm putting it down to light as everything else seems to be done right apart from that imo?
 
Hi Murf,
I think your right, too much light. 4 wpg is a lot. I ran my 180l tank with 2x 39w t5 with inbuilt reflectors and I had to raise them 13" above the water surface to match co2 requirements, fish health and light. Better distribution helps, but I'm sure its a light/co2 imbalance.
Any way you can raise the unit or diffuse the light? Can you remove a bulb or does that prevent the other one from working?
Cheerio,
 
Ady34 said:
Hi Murf,
I think your right, too much light. 4 wpg is a lot. I ran my 180l tank with 2x 39w t5 with inbuilt reflectors and I had to raise them 13" above the water surface to match co2 requirements, fish health and light. Better distribution helps, but I'm sure its a light/co2 imbalance.
Any way you can raise the unit or diffuse the light? Can you remove a bulb or does that prevent the other one from working?
Cheerio,
Click to expand...

It's a luminare type light with no holes to hang it, so raising it isn't really a possibilty without making holes. The tubes are 1 x Growth red and 1 x 10k white(tropical). If I did take 1 tube out would condensation not get into the connectors?
 
I don't think you need to start the CO2 5 hours before lights on. 2 hours should do it and save you some CO2 in the long run.
 
Isn't this melting, if I remember correctly, due to the fact that the plants have suddenly gone from 300->400ppm CO2 in the air to 30ppm (green drop checker) in water ?

Isn't this why DSM isn't really done by "the big boys" and that you should really submerge your plants as soon as you get them, to give them best chance of survival ?

Might be remembering wrong, but my plants I have grown DSM all struggled for a while when submerged. Eventually they get there, but not without melting and algae growth.
 
ian_m said:
Isn't this melting, if I remember correctly, due to the fact that the plants have suddenly gone from 300->400ppm CO2 in the air to 30ppm (green drop checker) in water ?

Isn't this why DSM isn't really done by "the big boys" and that you should really submerge your plants as soon as you get them, to give them best chance of survival ?

Might be remembering wrong, but my plants I have grown DSM all struggled for a while when submerged. Eventually they get there, but not without melting and algae growth.
Click to expand...

Cheers for the replies folks🙂 The plants that have melted have only just been purchased prior to flooding, the staurogynes where the only plants along with the mosses that came through from the DSM, the rest where 1-2 Grow! and put straight into the tank, so that doesn't explain the melting. Thanks anyway. Almost 100% its the lighting, which I've reduced to 2wpg by removing a tube
 
It will be a combination of light and co2 - too much light for the amount of co2 getting to the plants. Reducing the light will definitely help but look at getting the best distribution of flow also. You could move the filter intake to the same end as the lily pipe. That way the flow should go across the top of the tank and then return along the bottom through all those low plants. It looks like it probably just flows right across the top of them at the moment. That should get more of the co2 to where it is really needed. For a couple of days, put your drop checker low down on the front of the glass as close to the melting plants as possible to see what it's doing down there.
 
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