Packing my own ferts

[FerdinandPorsche]

Hi guys, new not long here. I am trying to get this puzzle solved on getting the dry ferts. I found out the suggested sponsor do not deliver outside of Europe. Hence I recalled a website that I was first introduced.

aquariumfertilizer.com

My guess the mandatory is to prepare the standard NPK which is the macro nutrient.
For the micro nutrients, Planted CSM + B.
I am not sure about magnesium sulfate, does it fall under micro or macro. I did refer to here. Is magnesium sulfate a compulsory composition then or what is the purpose of it?


According to the dry salt article, a complete list of nutrients include KNO3 (Potassium Nitrate), KH2PO4 (Monopotassium Phosphate), MgSO4 (Magnesium Sulfate), and also CSM + B

Sunday – 50% or more Water Change then dose [3/16 teaspoon KNO3] + [1/16 teaspoon KH2PO4] + [½ teaspoon MgSO4]
Monday – 1/16 teaspoon CSM+B
Tuesday - [3/16 teaspoon KNO3] + [1/16 teaspoon KH2PO4] + [½ teaspoon MgSO4]
Wednesday - 1/16 teaspoon CSM+B
Thursday - [3/16 teaspoon KNO3] + [1/16 teaspoon KH2PO4] + [½ teaspoon MgSO4]
Friday – Rest
Saturday - Rest

If I ordered KNO3, KH2PO4, MgSO4 and CSM+B and I mix these into bottles. Can I break them into (or am I doing it wrongly?) :

i. KNO3 and KH2PO4
ii. CSM+B and MgSO4

The above mix based on the sponsors guide. Can I assume that chelated trace refers to CSM+B?

 

[Vazkez]

Hello there,

I am not expert but I think I could answer few bits...
You do not need MgSO4. MgSO4 is used if you have high Ca in your water but low Mg to bring it on good level. Also if you use RO water you will need MG. If your water has enough MG you will not need it.FYI it fall under Macro.
If you want to mix it DO NOT MIX MACRO + MICRO.
One bottle for macro - NPK and one for micro.

Vaz

 

[ceg4048]

You do not need MgSO4. MgSO4 is used if you have high Ca in your water but low Mg to bring it on good level.

This is completely untrue. The need for Magnesium has nothing to do with Calcium. Magnesium is of primary importance for the molecular structure of Chlorophyll, which is probably the most important pigment in the world. Please review the thread About Magnesium | UK Aquatic Plant Society

MgSO4 is a micronutrient, however, it can be mixed either with the CSM+B or with the KNO3/KH2PO4 bottle, or you can put a little in both bottles.

The only time you don't need to add Magnesium is when you have Magnesium already present in your water supply.

Cheers,

 

[parotet]

I only use tap water and my water company says that the Mg content is 37 ppm... I have always assumed that this was enough, especially because I haven't noticed any problem. Can this amount be considered as an unlimited source of mg for the plants?

Cheers,
Jordi

 

[ceg4048]

If the plants confirm this, yes. What I mean by that is that if they do not suffer Mg deficiency and if you are not adding Mg then the plants themselves have confirmed that there is high Mg content.

Cheers,

 

[Vazkez]

Vazkez said: ↑
You do not need MgSO4. MgSO4 is used if you have high Ca in your water but low Mg to bring it on good level.
This is completely untrue. The need for Magnesium has nothing to do with Calcium

Hi ceg,

what I mean with this is:

The only time you don't need to add Magnesium is when you have Magnesium already present in your water supply.

I am not expert as I always say but I do not recomened to suply Mg before you can see a Mg deficiency. As if you are not cerefull you can end up with Ca deficiency....

If the plants confirm this, yes. What I mean by that is that if they do not suffer Mg deficiency and if you are not adding Mg then the plants themselves have confirmed that there is high Mg content.

^^^ this

About Magnesium | UK Aquatic Plant Society

Thank you for this very nice reading 🙂

Vaz

 

[FerdinandPorsche]

Hello there,

I am not expert but I think I could answer few bits...
You do not need MgSO4. MgSO4 is used if you have high Ca in your water but low Mg to bring it on good level. Also if you use RO water you will need MG. If your water has enough MG you will not need it.FYI it fall under Macro.
If you want to mix it DO NOT MIX MACRO + MICRO.
One bottle for macro - NPK and one for micro.
Vaz

Thanks Vaz, I do understand the rule MACRO does not mix with MICRO, but please see below.

This is completely untrue. The need for Magnesium has nothing to do with Calcium. Magnesium is of primary importance for the molecular structure of Chlorophyll, which is probably the most important pigment in the world. Please review the thread About Magnesium | UK Aquatic Plant Society

MgSO4 is a micronutrient, however, it can be mixed either with the CSM+B or with the KNO3/KH2PO4 bottle, or you can put a little in both bottles.

The only time you don't need to add Magnesium is when you have Magnesium already present in your water supply.

Cheers,

How can I know if there is magnesium deficiency from my plants? Chlorophyll is basically used for photosynthesis if I recall my science basics properly. If I can see my plants pearling, can I say that magnesium is sufficient?

Why is it a micro and yet it can be mixed with macro?

How do I know if magnesium is already present in the water supply? What tests should I perform for this? Not like parotet, I don't think I can get these accurate information from the water supplier.

If the plants confirm this, yes. What I mean by that is that if they do not suffer Mg deficiency and if you are not adding Mg then the plants themselves have confirmed that there is high Mg content.

Cheers,

Back to this question again, how does the plants confirm this? Photosynthesis?

 

[Vazkez]

Hello again,

hopefully I can help you a bit more...

Optimal levels of magnesium (Mg): 5 – 10 ppm

Magnesium deficiency is usually similar to iron deficiency because lack of magnesium prevents to absorb iron.

All old and new leaves are thus pale, there is a strong chlorosis. In contrast to a potassium deficiency,veins of leaves remain the same. Chlorosis is only on
the leaf tissue.

This is just a small guide....

I am sure ppl with better EN will explain It to you more.

Only Macro which should not be mixed with Micro Is PO4 as P react wit Fe.

Do not buy any test kits. Waste of money and test kits which measure Mg are expensive.

You will have Mg in water the question is if it's in good amount.

Vaz

 

[ceg4048]

How can I know if there is magnesium deficiency from my plants? Chlorophyll is basically used for photosynthesis if I recall my science basics properly. If I can see my plants pearling, can I say that magnesium is sufficient?

No. You need to forget about pearling as an indicator for anything. Pearling is a phenomenon that has to do with a lot of different variables. Both healthy and unhealthy plants can pearl. Magnesium deficiency can often be seen by a yellowing of the leaves, however, yellowing can also be caused by shortages in Nitrogen as well as shortages in Iron.

In general, the best way to ensure that there are no Mg deficiency is to simply add it for a few weeks and see if there is a difference in the appearance of the plants. If not then delete it and carry on.

As mentioned, you don't need to do any tests or become stressed about this at all.

Magnesium is a micronutrient. That means although it is a critical element, the plant does not need very much of it at all. It just has to be present.

I am not expert as I always say but I do not recomened to suply Mg before you can see a Mg deficiency. As if you are not cerefull you can end up with Ca deficiency....

No, this cannot happen. It may occur in terrestrial plants but absolutely not in aquatic plants.

Cheers,

 

[FerdinandPorsche]

Magnesium deficiency can often be seen by a yellowing of the leaves, however, yellowing can also be caused by shortages in Nitrogen as well as shortages in Iron.

Well I do face yellowing of leaves currently on my anubias. Even my hairgrass and flame moss are yellowish. After an increase on NPK for a week, no improvements on my hairgrass at all. Maybe my anubias are turning slightly greener, but at the same time, new leaves are turning pale yellow. Perhaps I can increase on magnesium.

 

[ceg4048]

As I mentioned, yellowing is also caused by poor Iron as well so add more of both.

Since I don't know how much of anything you are adding, or how often, it's not possible for me to say exactly which of the three main causes it is. Some people dose such low values that even when the increase the dosing, it's still too low. If this is a CO2 injected tank then NPK should be dosed 3X per week at sufficient values, otherwise there is the risk of onset of algae and poor performance.

Plants need 100X more Nitrogen than they Magnesium or Iron.So I always suspect Nitrogen shortages first, however, if old leaves are green and new leaves are pale then this does suggest a mcronutrient fault, so adding more Fe and Mg should solve the problem.

Also, poor distribution of flow and/or low values of flow can have a negative effect on nutrient/CO2 uptake so this is actually at least as important the the amounts being dosed.

Cheers,

 

[FerdinandPorsche]

Some people dose such low values that even when the increase the dosing, it's still too low.

I totally understand this, hence I had tried increasing the suggested dose up to 3x before.

if old leaves are green and new leaves are pale then this does suggest a mcronutrient fault, so adding more Fe and Mg should solve the problem.

This is the exact problem I have. Old leaves are green and growing BBA while new leaves are yellow.

Also, poor distribution of flow and/or low values of flow can have a negative effect on nutrient/CO2 uptake so this is actually at least as important the the amounts being dosed.

I tested my affected area by moving the dropchecker there. Seems it is also co2 sufficient over there. But the BBA is particular over there.

 

[ceg4048]

If you have BBA then that means that the CO2 is not sufficient. This is the last time I will warn you not to put faith in your DC.

Cheers,

 

[G H Nelson]

This is the last time I will warn you not to put faith in your DC.

You naughty boy😵

 

[FerdinandPorsche]

If you have BBA then that means that the CO2 is not sufficient. This is the last time I will warn you not to put faith in your DC.

Cheers,

Thanks. I get what you mean. BBA is now growing on annubias on the left side of the tank. Using the duckweed index, the plant does not have discoloring / yellowing like the plants under water. Maybe slightly, but it seems like it is already like that when it came. Probably this confirms the co2 insufficiency. But I am not sure how can I increase my co2 any more. I am planning to get a new inline diffuser to replace this faulty one. Misty bubbles should do it!

 

[ceg4048]

There are lots of ways to improve CO2.
The first and best way is to reduce the DEMAND for CO2 by restricting the light intensity.
Flow rate can be improved by increasing the filter output or by supplementing the flow with powerheads.
Distribution can be improved by optimizing the filter and pump output orientation.
CO2 dissolution can be improved by porting the gas directly into the filter inlet.
The timing of the gas can be improved so that the water is saturated with CO2 prior to lights going on.

Cheers,

 

[FerdinandPorsche]

The first and best way is to reduce the DEMAND for CO2 by restricting the light intensity.

Yea, but sadly, my LED has no controller to reduce the intensity and I don't have a hanging stand for the light fixture.

Flow rate can be improved by increasing the filter output or by supplementing the flow with powerheads.

I'm not sure about this, but what I think is powerheads are supplemented where there are deadspots. My plants in the open are also yellowing.

Distribution can be improved by optimizing the filter and pump output orientation.

The output is placed strategically.

CO2 dissolution can be improved by porting the gas directly into the filter inlet.

I have read somewhere in UKAPS that bacteria in the filter likes oxygen and not co2? Is this a myth? It is also mentioned that the gasses will be trapped or clogging the filter system. Not to mention the noise due to airlock.

The timing of the gas can be improved so that the water is saturated with CO2 prior to lights going on.

I have made the timing turned on 3hours earlier. However, with the checking of pH level, I suspect the problem is with the diffuser.

 

[ceg4048]

The output is placed strategically.

Sorry, I have no idea what this means. Might want to check the strategy to see if uniform flow is achieved between the various pump outputs.

I have read somewhere in UKAPS that bacteria in the filter likes oxygen and not co2? Is this a myth? It is also mentioned that the gasses will be trapped or clogging the filter system. Not to mention the noise due to airlock.

Liking oxygen has nothing to do with CO2. Bacteria also like CO2. Airlock, bubbling and noise issues can be solved.

Cheers,

 

[ian_m]

Yea, but sadly, my LED has no controller to reduce the intensity and I don't have a hanging stand for the light fixture.

Loads of ways to reduce the light level.
- Sheet of darkened plastic under the light.
- Stick insulation tape strips to the light.
- If it has a reflector, angle it upwards slightly.
- Wrap foil loops around the light.
- Wrap stockings around the light
- Buy a LED controller

 

[FerdinandPorsche]

Sorry, I have no idea what this means. Might want to check the strategy to see if uniform flow is achieved between the various pump outputs.

I'm sorry, I might have understood correctly. I thought you meant by the location of the output pipe.

Liking oxygen has nothing to do with CO2. Bacteria also like CO2. Airlock, bubbling and noise issues can be solved.

I have modified the inline diffuser to point to the intake pipe. Basically co2 travels through my filter into my chiller, I can see the bubbles travelling through the hose (between filter to chiller). The outlet contains finer bubbles but I face gas hiccups every 10 minutes, probably stuck co2 in the chiller are being pumped out altogether once the airlock gets big.

Any advise on this? Planning to get the Intense Bazooka diffuser.