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LED penetration

sa80mark

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2 Oct 2007
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Leicester
Im only just starting to read up on leds but I think im right to say that the depth they can get down to is dependent on the lenses used, for instance a 40 degree lense will punch more light further down than a 120 degree lense
 

Samjpikey

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22 Mar 2013
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Devon
Really .... My LEDs are currently 2ft from the substrate in my tank and I've been getting aglea .... Also i get insane pearling but I've had to back off the intensity and duration and increase the injection rate.
I'm really happy with them ,
I have a dual t5ho overhead lamp but the LEDs see them into the ground , just my experience of coarse :)


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Samjpikey

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22 Mar 2013
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No I'm using bridgelux .
1 watt 350ma 110lm . But they are driven at 300ma .
I have 28 of these @ 10000k :)
These are a fraction of the cost of Crees and the only difference I found In my homework is they run a fraction hotter ..


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flygja

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12 Mar 2008
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Penang, Malaysia
Really? I have 15x Cree XR-E LEDs being driven at 1A with 60 degree lenses hung 34 inches over the substrate of my 60L tank and the PAR reading is 100 over the substrate. Design and choice of LEDs is very important.
 

Samjpikey

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22 Mar 2013
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Devon
I did want to use Crees originally but came across a very decent seller on eBay ( not the one in the link. ) and he suggested bridgelux .
He supplied me the LEDs + driver. .
My light cost me around £60 including glue + lenses .
After making the the light I bought some cheap Chinese LEDs and cheap £1 drivers from eBay to have a little play around,( for another project)
5 x 1 watt 6000k and 5 x 1 watt 3000k cost me £5 . The LED drivers run a max of 3 LEDs and they worked that good I included them into my set up .
He is a pic of cheap 9 watt Chinese LEDs in action
uV1sDX7.jpg


I only use this setting for 1 hr before the main photoperiod and an hour after as a dusk/dawn setting . But I thought I would share as I didn't use Crees and I'm getting very good results over my 125 liter . The LEDs have run for a year so far with no problems. :)
Cheers
 

Samjpikey

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22 Mar 2013
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Devon
Yes on paper Crees seem the bees knees when it comes to LEDs ,
But currently mine are 2ft above the substrate and I'm seeing great results :)


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Curvball

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22 Feb 2013
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Colchester
LEDs are the future of all aquarium lighting. Using the correct lenses/optics for your application will ensure you get the best from your lighting.

The mere fact that led has proven to be viable in the reefkeeping circles shows it will work for planted tanks.


Posted from the comfort of my iPhone...
 

tubamanandy

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28 Feb 2013
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Thornton, Lancashire
I really wish I had been more careful with my recent purchase of a Fluval Aqualife & Plant Freshwater Performance LED for my 50cm deep tank !! Whilst the unit is stylish, well built with great colour rendition it clearly does not use good LEDs as the strength of light and penetration is just not there. PAR at base of tank is max 35 which puts the tank in the low-medium lighting. I'm thinking of moving onto 2 x T5's in an Arcadia Luminaire (see my other post)
 

Troglodyte

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17 Apr 2013
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Hi Folks,
The dependent criteria for depth penetration are, the type optic used, ie angle spread, manufacturer make and material grade used, but more importantly what wattage of LED you are using and how they are driven. An LED unit using 0.25w/0.5 watt LEDs will not penetrate anywhere near a 3w/10w LED for depth no matter what optic is used.
This is where you need to be comparing apples with apples. You cannot compare a 1w/350ma LED with a 0.25W/350maLED as it has roughly triple/quadruple the power factor.(Depending on losses) There is also a certain point where increasing the current will not improve the lighting level produced.
NB This is not a comparison of the above lights mentioned above in my example, but a guidance to the specification comparison criteria.
Most light units have low powered LEDs to keep the price low in manufacture. However the higher wattage ones have more heat dissipation issues, so you need to ensure that you have good heat sinks.
There is a lot of good information available on the web if you look under LED manufacturers ie OSRAM/CREE/LUXBRIDGE etcetc.
 

GreenNeedle

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Lincoln UK
I don't think it is that important which LEDs you use. I use the cheapo luxeon copies from China and they do fine in terms of penetration. I only use just over 1WPG and the are normally set 2ft from substrate (14inches water depth) and have no problems. I don't know why any retailer would try and suggest otherwise as it just isn't true. It 'might' be true if they are talking about the LED tubes that are made to look like flouro tubes but even then I would think they could at the very least match flouro tubes. If it is tile or grid style then tubes will not match them W for W.

All mine are the cheap 3W from china under-driven at circa 2.45W. Lenses are also the cheapo china ones @ 60 degrees so they aren't like bike light ones meant to focus a narrow beam a long distance. The only reason I use optics is because the height luminaires are at is just above the eyeline when you are sitting down and the glare can be annoying if it is in your view when watching TV etc. I used to run them without lenses.

Picture%20009.jpg
 

Troglodyte

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17 Apr 2013
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SuperColey1,
I believe you may have sent your comment as I wrote mine. If you read my response you will find it does matter very much. If you are comparing like for like LEDs your statement has more support.:)
 

GreenNeedle

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I did read your comment. Maybe I phrased mine poorly. I agree that a cree or bridgelux will outperform these China cheapies. I was just trying to say that any high power LED will outperform Flouro W for W even without lenses. My first setup had no lenses and was noticeably better in terms of brightness to the eye and speed of growth in the tank than the flouro it replace even though it was only 66% of the wattage. So yes better LEDs, better performance but all I am saying is the China LEDs are fine to use. I just get puzzled why a leading retailer suggests otherwise?

The pic below has the same china cheapys (luxeon III copies bought in 2007 from ebay) and is using 60 degree lenses. The LEDs are just over 2ft from the substrate in this picture and allowing for them being underrun that is 1.12 WPG. This is noticeably brighter than when I was using 48W of T5 even though the T5 were 6 inches closer to the tank.
CIMG4795.jpg
 

Samjpikey

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22 Mar 2013
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Devon
Nice build you have done there :)

I also only used the lenses as the light was visible on the eye line .
I also bought cheap Chinese 60degree lenses , I also bought a couple expensive uk sourced ones and the quality was even between both and visibly they looked to perform the same but without the proper equipment to measure intensity I will never know for sure .

The thing about Crees is that the data is readily available and there is nothing on cheaper LEDs which is probably why people stay clear .
Cheers


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