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If CEC>Dosing

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Unexpected

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Hopefully I can relay this correctly.
If I'm dosing X nutrient, expecting to achieve an accumulation total of 2xX, but my testing shows 0ppm; should I dose more?

I'm currently dosing
12ppm NO3
4ppm PO4
15ppm K
.4 Fe (Proxy)
But at weeks end I can't detect Nitrates or Phosphates. I'm using Landen Aquasoil, and apparently it's a nutrient hog. Should I increase my dosing to compensate?

Thank you for any insight,
Mike
 
Hufsa said:
Sounds like it would just become an arms race with your soil, no?
What do your plants tell you? Id just focus on what you know youre putting in, if thats enough for the plants then there is no need to worry about what happens later.
Click to expand...
Makes sense, chasing the dragon doesn't sound like something I want to do. Thank you.
 
It's not unheard of people with top tanks that use fresh aquasoil to dose 6 ppm PO4 per day till soil is saturated. Usually that high dose allows for some detectable values in the water column

I doubt NO3 reduction is related to soil binding it. NO3 is notoriously hard to keep in soil in agriculture. I would suggest checking the test kit response, most NO3 tests are just bad. Take a known volume of water from the tank in a clean container.Add a known amount of fertilizer to it to increase by 10ppm NO3. Mix well, test if test detects the 10 ppm NO3 increase. Add again the same volume of fertilizer, check if the test detects another 10ppm NO3 increase ( 20ppm total). This way the test water is separated from the action of the soil and you are testing the response of the test kit in your water matrix. If test remains 0 or is all over the place that is the weak point and you should keep dosing as normal.
 
Ria95 said:
It's not unheard of people with top tanks that use fresh aquasoil to dose 6 ppm PO4 per day till soil is saturated. Usually that high dose allows for some detectable values in the water column

I doubt NO3 reduction is related to soil binding it. NO3 is notoriously hard to keep in soil in agriculture. I would suggest checking the test kit response, most NO3 tests are just bad. Take a known volume of water from the tank in a clean container.Add a known amount of fertilizer to it to increase by 10ppm NO3. Mix well, test if test detects the 10 ppm NO3 increase. Add again the same volume of fertilizer, check if the test detects another 10ppm NO3 increase ( 20ppm total). This way the test water is separated from the action of the soil and you are testing the response of the test kit in your water matrix. If test remains 0 or is all over the place that is the weak point and you should keep dosing as normal.
Click to expand...

I was dosing 17ppm PO4 a week and it would be undetectable by water change day. This soil is just insane (I think). I have calibrated my nitrate kit and trust it's reading but I will certainly check again.
 
Surprisingly, the plants look good except this tank is a thread algae nightmare. I'm trying everything possible before I start doing blackouts and my thinking was, if a few days are going by with no available nutrients in the water column, then maybe this is contributing to the problem. Thread Algae post here.

Thank you for the help all!
I will say, if the blackouts don't work, this project is getting scrapped. Inert substrates are just easer to manage and I'm seeing no real benefit in using an aqua soil.
 
Unexpected said:
except this tank is a thread algae nightmare
Click to expand...

First we heard of this issue ! which may change the advise we may give

We need more details -tank size, filters -output and media, powerheads, lights, photo period, high tech or Low tech , Water Change (WC) amount and how often and a full tank pic
 
I stopped front loading but everything else is the same. So dosing these totals divided by 3 days.
 

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Tank turnover is low but may be acceptable dependant on Flow generated in tank and filter media fitted. x10 output to tank size would help esp during photoperiod - do you have a power head to boost turnover. Filter output method- lily pipe spray bar etc? Filter media?
pH drop good - any pH profile to confirm the pH is stable from lights on till CO2 off?
WC - good to excellent :thumbup:
Surface agitation ? pic helps 😉
No dKH ! I would add 1.0dKH
I would also increase NO3 levels short term, also adding some dKH and check pH profile and reduce photo period to 5-6 hours and intensity also to 50%
 
Zeus. said:
Tank turnover is low but may be acceptable dependant on Flow generated in tank and filter media fitted. x10 output to tank size would help esp during photoperiod - do you have a power head to boost turnover. Filter output method- lily pipe spray bar etc? Filter media?
pH drop good - any pH profile to confirm the pH is stable from lights on till CO2 off?
WC - good to excellent :thumbup:
Surface agitation ? pic helps 😉
No dKH ! I would add 1.0dKH
I would also increase NO3 levels short term, also adding some dKH and check pH profile and reduce photo period to 5-6 hours and intensity also to 50%
Click to expand...
I'm just using the Eheim Media that came with the filter. I forgot to update the sheet, I swapped the motor on the filter so turnover is about a 1/4 to 1/3 more. It's rated at 358GPH, about double of what the Eheim was rated. I also use a spray bar and skimmer.
 
Honestly, it's a disaster. I really think it needs to be scraped. The last resort is the blackouts per the recommendations from my algae post. I was just wanting to try everything else first. Anyways, I ordered another filter which will take the turnover to 8x.
Here's a picture, it looks scrappy because I don't want to disturb the substrate at all. I could replant the entire tank but I fear it wouldn't help.
 

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Unexpected said:
Honestly, it's a disaster. I really think it needs to be scraped. The last resort is the blackouts per the recommendations from my algae post. I was just wanting to try everything else first. Anyways, I ordered another filter which will take the turnover to 8x.
Here's a picture, it looks scrappy because I don't want to disturb the substrate at all. I could replant the entire tank but I fear it wouldn't help.
Click to expand...
something that stands out to me is low plant mass. the algae looks like spirogyra or cladophora, which are tough to kill without chemical intervention, I'd suggest blackouts and peroxide. lowering light as well.
 
plantnoobdude said:
something that stands out to me is low plant mass. the algae looks like spirogyra or cladophora, which are tough to kill without chemical intervention, I'd suggest blackouts and peroxide. lowering light as well.
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Okay, I'm probably just beating myself up trying everything else and not just going ahead and doing the blackout.
Thank you!
 
Do you have any Amanos in there?
I have two journals Olympus is calling and Pot Scape, Both got same ferts both plants did well, however Pot scape got hair algae and it had no Amanos (they would climb out) So I just lifted the affect plants in the pot popped them in the bigger tank which had an abundance of Amanos, 24hrs later no hair algae and popped them back in smaller tank.
I use to get more hair algae when the plants was in need of a trim and tank turnover was compromised due to mass off plants, good trim tank turnover increase and hair algae got under control. Don't trim your but the extra flow/tank turn over will help big time. The blackout will reduce the hair algae, 5 days no peaking, however if the cause of the hair algae isn't removed it will return.
Amanos and higher tank turnover 😉
 
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