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Fluval Roma 200 Light Upgrade T5HO, Will this work?

Jafooli

Jafooli

Member
Joined
21 May 2013
Messages
231
Location
Kent
Hey everyone,

I've had my Fluval Roma 200 for nearly over a year now, and my interest in plants has kind of gone tbh, since things just don't grow that great at the end of the day. It was exactly the same with my Fluval Roma 90. I've also had issues with fish gasping due to CO2, so I stopped that all together last year. I wasn't noticing any fast growth or anything amazing like everyone else's tanks on here anyway. I have got use to the fact of having low light and at one point didn't mind as I kind of learnt you can grow any plant in any light it will just be much slower. I do still add ferts now and then but its got to the point now where I'm bored and depressed with the T8's, nothing exciting ever happens with any of my plants. My largest and best plant is a Java fern all though that has BBA on it lol. The best plants should be my bulbs, or even a nice healthy hygrophila would be nice, I cant even grow echinodorus varieties, they arrive healthy then do nothing then die, while yes nutrients help but imo seems to just prolong the inevitable.

Anyway I was hoping someone could give me some reassurance really or any opinions on this easy as they come upgrade? I'd like to state I am useless at DIY, my dad knows nothing lol, and if I learn anything DIY based its from my Mum. I can stick a shelf up etc but unfortunately doing DIY on my tank hood is a bit to daunting. I don't want to start opening it up and sticking a T5 ballast in. I would also have no idea how to wire it safely. I cant have a over tank luminaire as my tank is next to my tv and I think the brightness might be a bit distracting. Honestly I have done so much research in the past and really cant see my self doing any DIY, I even thought about phoning around local electricians to see if they might take on the job, but if they broke my light unit or scratched it etc id kind of be depressed as I like it all in perfect condition lol. This would probably also make the tank harder to sell in the future if they did a bad job.

I did look into the TMC GroBeam 600 Ultima Twin, and was going to use a MMS rail in between my existing T8 end caps, but my Fluval Roma 200 has a bracing bar in the middle, and when doing the measurements it seems the LED's would hit this as there to long. If I had the Fluval Roma 240 I think they might of worked.

Another alternative with the GroBeams is maybe I could attach them to the lid flaps of my tank as there positioned higher up so then the LED strips would avoid the brace bar, but I'm not sure how much they weigh, the flaps are quite bendy anyway. It might also be a problem feeding the wires of the front flap led to the back of the tank, and also feeding the fish and water changes might become a bit more challenging. If the tank was in another room then I guess I could of somehow attached them to a piece of wood on two brackets or something, but I want to keep it all in the hood.

I have found this upgrade which looks very simple, If someone with more knowledge and experience could have a look at this for me I would really appreciate it. I hope you can tell me if you think there may be any problems that I've not seen. I also planned on not having the T8's running. I presume if all goes to plan I should see a large improvement? I did have a look at the light chart on here, and with about 18inches depth and T5HO it should put me between med/high light? which at the moment the graph says I'm just below having low light lol.

The upgrade I plan on doing: http://www.fishforums.net/index.php?/topic/400038-fluval-roma-lighting-upgrade/

Light Graph
http://i573.photobucket.com/albums/ss176/Hoppycalif/PARvsDistVariousBulbs2.jpg

I always seem to make an essay for such small questions so apologies lol, but just wanted to double check on this forum as I know everyone here knows there stuff. I also hope I'm allowed to post that link.

I just want to have a tank with higher light, I'm not to bothered if I cant dim the light etc as I just want a tank with more light for once. Id rather have algae than having plants that look half dead, or take months to do anything. I'm also kind of interested in breeding plecos at the moment, so I'm sure they wouldn't mind the algae but any opinions on this would be great also, as I don't want an algae infestation obviously but don't mind a challenge. :lol:

Thanks in advance for anyone who takes there time to help me, but I do want to emphasis that I think I'm useless at DIY. I know nothing but if you have an easy idea then go ahead. :lol:

I also worked out with 2x t5 lights included this should cost just under £100. So its real cheap and if it don't work I won't feel like jumping of a bridge :lol: lol jokes, lobbing something out the window might work. :mad:
 
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Jafooli

I've been considering upgrading the lights on my Fluval Roma 240L which is arriving on Thursday.

I've decided that if necessary, I'll add some Interpet LEDs. They do several lengths in single/double and even triple (I think). They should be quite easy to fix to either the underside of the lighting unit or maybe along the inside of the glass at the front, where the hood trim is. Fitting to the glass would be favourite, as there will be heat coming off the T8 fitting.

Personally, I wouldn't fanny about trying to modify the lighting by fitting T5's and new control gear etc. I'm an electrician/inspector retired on medical grounds- I don't like electricity at the best of times (scare the living daylights out of me, and I've got SOME idea about what I'm doing ;)).

Why not have a look and see if they would fit?

Hope this helps!

PS Please don't fiddle about with electrickery if you don't know what you are doing, it has a nasty habit of going bang!
 
Hey naughtymoose

Thanks for the quick reply,

I've never heard of the Interpet LEDs, so I just had a quick look and found some reviews from Amazon and they look quite good.
I also see they come with sticky pads, but there not that great :(

I will have to do some more research on them, but they seem very good. Do these give of more light than T8s?
 
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Have you tried buying some cheap t8 tubes from the various online lamp shops? The Fluval lamps look a bit dim but they'll grow whatever you want, you could also get a set of decent reflectors to bump the PAR up a little. I hacked my Roma to fit a t5 ballast in the hood, it's pretty simple and water tight if you use cable gromets to seal the wiring. I use T5NO rather than T5HO so my par is at t8 levels anyways and it's more than enough light so was kind of a wasted exercise.
 
I changed my Juwel Vision 180 T8 lighting unit to the newer T5 unit, £100 odd from Ebay, rather than faff with LEDs' and/or clip on T5 lights. I could imagine the clipped on T5 tubes and/or LED's on flaps being a real pain in the asre at water change/tank fiddling time, so just went for the Juwel T5 unit. Open box, place unit on tank, turn on, job done.

T5 is much brighter, if my flow wasn't so high, most plants start pearling towards end of light period and growth is certainly faster than T8. Did suffer from algae when I first switched over as I initially failed to rotate the reflectors round, to reduce the change in light level. So rotated reflectors round, cleaned away algae and after couple of months started increasing the light level and no algae.
 
I switched from T8 bulbs to T5 over my low tech but had to raise the fixture considerably high over my tank to avoid the algae.
More light means more demand for CO2 and nutrient's.
Sure you can flood the tank with uber lighting but if you cannot, or will not be adding more CO2,then you will have gained little.
CO2 in my low tech is what it is by natural process (bacterial activity,and by- product of fish respiration).
I also add nutrient's weekly at level that favors the plant's judging from their growth which I measure in weeks,month's.(is difference between low tech and high tech to me).
This leaves only lighting that defines the growth of plant's and algae.
So long as I do not use too much light,,the algae does not appear.
 
Hey guys,

Thanks for the replies,

Ender I have only ever used the tubes that came with the tank, on my old Roma 90 I did try a Power Glo / Life Glo combo but there wasn't much difference. I could buy lamps from somewhere else that might be a option, however I'm fed up and just want more light. I would rather be back on this site creating a thread saying help algae outbreak lol, although I would then be told to raise lights or to rotate the reflectors which in this case I wouldn't be able to do lol.

Ian I'm not sure I could do what you did, the Fluval Roma's have this nasty little rim around the tank which is curved so it kind of makes all upgrades complicated. I presume this is why everything Fluval Roma based is about some kind of DIY upgrade. The current light unit does rest upon a tiny lip so I guess if the Juwel unit was the same size and could also rest on the tiny lip it would work, but not sure if its worth the risk to find out it don't fit.

I do think the LEDS mentioned from naughtymoose might be a good idea, but it does look like it might be hard finding the correct place for them. I also don't know how much light it would give me as there not in the graph above.

I am worried though as like ian said having any lights added could make maintenance a bit harder. I must admit I don't remove my light unit when doing maintenance, its heavy, bulky, if it slips from my hand its broke lol. So I just slide it either side of tank and do my work. If I attach the T5's to the T8's I cant see it making maintenance that much harder, from the pictures they don't stick out that much at all, infact both bulbs fit inside the metal reflector so it should be all snug, but hey what do I know. My concern would be the lighting unit bowing from the extra weight as its bowed ever so slightly already.

I appreciate everyones advice, please keep it coming. At the moment I still think the upgrade in the link above looks like the safest option and its not over expensive. It would only cost £50 if you don't include the T5 tubes, but like I say I'm worried something might not go to plan.

I don't want to go of topic, but is T5 really that bad for algae? like I said I've kind of lost interest due to my lights. The only algae I see is BBA, apart from that I have to take a visit to my pond to remember what algae looks like lol. I would ideally like to just dose EI without CO2. I don't mind using liquid carbon if needed. Could this not be achieved? I've forgotten a lot over the last year or so, but surely people do genuinely buy tanks out there with T5's and they have no idea about EI , CO2 etc. They must have something good to say about there new tanks, surely it wouldn't be a algae farm? If I purchased the correct plants for the new light level surely it would be the same process at just a faster rate, I could also include some floating plants to help reduce light. I cant see myself being happy with T8's. I'm not sure if I'm genuinely doing something wrong, or is there actually a possibility that my tank is not well suited for plants as I'm not the only one with a Fluval Roma who has learnt to hate the lights.

My girlfriends Fluval Ebi shrimp tank looks amazing, and this is low tech, low light, and no nutrients. The growth is much slower in her tank, but all her plants are healthy, vibrant, even the reds are nice. The plants look real happy and healthy. I obviously don't want my tank to be as slow as that, but I've hardly ever had happy plants in my Roma and I've tried so many types, all recommended for low light, and I know plants can grow in any light, but I don't think there happy in my tank for some reason.
 
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This is the other way, replace the electrics with T5 version. You can also get dimmable T5 ballasts as well.
http://www.ukaps.org/forum/threads/fluval-roma-200-–-lighting-upgrade-to-t5ho.15207/

I have replaced ballasts in Juwel unit before, had to cut it open. The link above has done it right, cutting it open from the top, where it is "dry", as I was unable to 100% seal any openings I made that were inside the hood near the water, eventually water got in and corroded things. Silicone, most glues etc does not stick the plastic Juwel use, eventually water leaking past.

Jafooli said:
is T5 really that bad for algae
Click to expand...
T5 lights have nothing to do with algae, many people successfully grow algae with T8 tubes, standard light bulbs etc. It's just that T5 produces more light and if not managed correctly with ferts (and carbon source) may produce algae.

Jafooli said:
I would ideally like to just dose EI without CO2. I don't mind using liquid carbon if needed. Could this not be achieved?
Click to expand...
Yes you can dose EI and use liquid carbon.
For example this, 5ml every day will last you 200days.
http://www.aquaessentials.co.uk/neutro-co2-medium-p-6377.html

Liquid carbon can also be used kill BBA. Also be careful as liquid carbon can melt some sensitive plants.
 
Hey Ian

That's great cheers for the reply.

I got to be honest though, I really can not see myself replacing the ballast. To start off I would be upset if I broke or scratched the top of my tank, and then actually replacing the ballast seems quite hard, especially the bit with the wiring. If I wasn't so ocd and had the money to lose I would love to give it a try. I just want to keep it simple as unfortunately me and my family are not that good at DIY :( Between me and you I blame my dad. :mad: He does nothing in the house not even painting, so me and my mum do everything DIY based. However he has a thing about changing bulbs in the house when they blow, but yet knows nothing about lights what a coincidence. I mean who doesn't know how to change a bulb. :lol:

I hope with the correct plants I can find the correct balance, if I avoided CO2 and Carbon wouldn't the plants just adjust to the level of CO2 which would be provided from surface agitation. In my head I plan to add many types of different plants. If my plants started to respond to the higher light, and nutrients are still provided, then algae would not be able to attack them. I should really do some more research on med-high light low tech tanks. I'm not ruling out CO2 its just I seem to get bad things happen to my fish when I go down that route, even with liquid carbon under dosed I lose fish.

I would however be smiling for a year if I added CO2 and witnessed pearling or even achieved a planted tank like members on here, but I don't want to start dreaming about something that won't happen. I just want a tank where plants can grow and actually look like a plant, not a single stem which takes months to grow and you can tell its grown tall and bare because its trying to reach the light. It then eventually reaches the top of the tank and starts sending out leafs and other stems with leafs in all directions, as if its sending runners out at the surface level and not at the bottom.

I've also noticed this with my crypts they send runners out above the crypt, they snap off then float around the tank. I also have left my hygrophila's to grow, and eventually the thick growth at the top bends the stem down, it then sends all these runners up on the stem. I could cut this off and plant it, but then it does nothing. If I leave it so the runners are mid way up the tank they shoot off and grow fast. In theory the higher a plant grows in my tank the more you see its beauty. Once the big leafs die, it seems like the plants struggle to get a new shoot out, and if they do its really tiny, and in the end it dies. I'm convinced its my light but yet people have succeeded where I cant.
 
Hi Jafooli,
Jafooli said:
The upgrade I plan on doing: http://www.fishforums.net/index.php?/topic/400038-fluval-roma-lighting-upgrade/
Click to expand...
If you do this, make sure you buy the right length tube(s) for your tank first and then buy the starter ballast unit to match it. ie. T5 and T8 wattages and lengths are not like-for-like, so you don't want to wire in a 30W T5 ballast and then discover 30wT5 tubes are too long!
You can get adapters to fit T5 tubes into T8 endcaps But I guess you can't see your ballast unit to see if it covers a range of wattages? I had a ballast unit that was 30-36W which gave me various options.

as naughtymoose says, electrics bite; wires have a habit of going under what you are drilling! (or mowing) {and electrical-test screwdrivers only work if the diode/led isn't broken...} .

cheers phil
 
Hey Phil,

Thanks for taking the time to reply.

My current ballast is 30w, I'm not sure if it can take anything lower I wouldn't know how to find out. Do you have a link to these end caps just so I could maybe have a read. I'm sure I found a thread once in the past where someone was trying to do what you have said, but apparently the endcaps turned out not that safe so they stopped making them type thing. I'm probably totally wrong but I'm sure I read something similar.

My current T8 30w bulb is 91cm/36" and I plan on using the same type of bulb, aka hagen power glo in this case. The T5 version will be 34" so a bit smaller and is 39w.
I also plan on using the hagen glo electronic ballast which says its best suited to use with halgen glo bulbs. I presume I could use other 39w T5 bulbs if I wished. I cant see how it can be designed specifically for glo bulbs but hey. The T5 ballast is the 39w version so should be fine I hope.

I just hope both bulbs will fit like they do in the picture, quite amazing how both bulbs fit in the reflector. I did see one guy on another forum who purchased the same T5 ballast but he chose to superglue the T5 clips to the sides of the hood and he said it holded the bulbs up fine. I presume he didn't know about the reflector idea. If it don't work out this could be a option although I don't want to ruin my hood with superglue. I think the guide looks quite idiot proof so I'm just being patient and not buying anything yet until I'm 100% sure. I didn't want to rush and buy everything just because I've seen how easy it looks.

Thanks again for covering that, I would of probably not noticed. The only reason I kind of already new is that someone on the guide at the bottom says the T5 bulbs were to long for his Fluval Roma 90. Obviously not the case for the larger Romas. :D

I am however concerned about running all 4 bulbs, from what people said above the T5's might already give me an issue with algae if I'm not careful. I do plan on just running the T5's but if I did run the T8's as-well I was concerned with heat being an issue. I don't want an explosion or something lol. I was thinking maybe having them on midday for an extra burst of light, but without doing CO2 etc I guess its irrelevant but maybe an option to play with in the future if I choose to go back to CO2.
 
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Hi Jafooli,
This pic shows T8 and T5 pin comparison - identical on aquarium lights. My LFS gave me the rubber conversion rings you see which go over the T5 tube and push into the T8 endcap. I guess O-rings 16 mm internal dia and 1" ext dia would work.


https://www.flickr.com/photos/40143719@N06/16445872915/

Someone more knowledgeable can hopefully comment but there appear to be 2 different pin spacings for T5 tubes, the same as T8 and a narrower 5mm spacing.

http://suntop001.en.ec21.com/offer_detail/Sell_t8_to_t5_adaptor--10314430.html?gubun=S
this appears narrower;

http://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/Quick-install-plug-in-t8-to_1697049391.html?s=p
this appears to be T8-T8 spacings.

Bear in mind the plastic converters would add length.

This would only work if you match the wattage to your existing starter ballast unit, and you would have to change the clips anyway, so you are probably as well off adding new kit anyway.

hope I haven't confused things.
cheers phil

edit: deleted failed pic - left link.
 
Hey Phil

Thanks for showing me the adaptors, that route does look a bit more confusing for me and it will require more time in finding the right size tubes etc. I think i'll stick to the new ballast like you say.
Strange how one adapter says T8-T5 but like you mentioned it looks T8-T8 lol.

I am however not sure on one or two things in the guide I plan to follow, firstly he says in step 1 "You will need to purchase your own screws for this" I presume as the drill bit will be 3mm I need 3mm screws that are also small, as if there to long the reflector won't fit back into the hood.

Another worry is drilling the holes themselves, seems like it will be tad tricky as its a curved reflector but I hope I can get it nice and straight, cant be to hard.
Finally in step 2 he says "Attach your T8 clips and Screw in your T5 clips " There is nothing to screw them into apart from the reflector obviously but I guess the screws are just going to be held in position by the bulbs weight. So I'm concerned it's not going to be solid. I don't want to accidentally knock the bulb and it falls off into the tank lol. I thought it might work better if I use a small bolt screw instead if I can find anything so small.

I'm sure I would find a way for it to all work if I took a visit to bnq anyway, but they were the only things that seem the challenge especially for my lack of diy knowledge as you can now probably tell.

Also I'm not sure if its best to make another thread for this question: but then I worry its going to get very confusing as I found out last nite:
http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/showthread.php?t=128603
http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/forumapc/lighting/38014-lighting-spectrum-photosythesis.html

I have always used Aqua Glo and Power Glo with my Fluval Tank. I did try Life Glo / Power Glo once on my old Fluval Roma 90 and don't remember noticing much a difference.
However I thought I would try buy the best T5 bulbs, so I was thinking Life Glo and someone mentioned Zoo Med Flora sun along side it is the best combo.

I see many people have different views when it comes to all this bulb stuff. I'm not sure how important it actually is so I've never tired to learn and understand it all.
I guess some say its mainly just down to how you want the tank to look. I'm actually not sure. I have seen someone post pictures with different combinations of the glo lights in there tank.
They seemed to think the Life Glo at the back and the Power Glo at the front was the most pleasant. I'm stuck between Power Glo with Life Glo or Life Glo with Zoo Med Flora.
What bulbs does everyone here use? besides LEDS. :D





.
 
Jafooli said:
Hey Phil

I see many people have different views when it comes to all this bulb stuff. I'm not sure how important it actually is so I've never tired to learn and understand it all.
I guess some say its mainly just down to how you want the tank to look. I'm actually not sure. I have seen someone post pictures with different combinations of the glo lights in there tank.
They seemed to think the Life Glo at the back and the Power Glo at the front was the most pleasant. I'm stuck between Power Glo with Life Glo or Life Glo with Zoo Med Flora.
What bulbs does everyone here use? besides LEDS. :D

.
Click to expand...

I used a 880 (8000K) at the back and a 841 (4100k) at the front gives a nice balance of brightness and deep reds to my eyes. You can check out the thread here.

I got frustrated with the reflectors in my Roma 125 and ended up ditching them and screwing the t5 holders direct into the side of the ballast tray. I used M3 screws and nuts along with rubber washers. I also used some PG7 black cable glands rather then silcon to seal the cables to the ballast tray, looks a little bit more proffessional.

If you don't want to damage the hood have you thought about the aquarium ballast units that come pre assembled, you'd just have to attach the t5 tube holders. Then you'd probably just rest the ballast unit on top of the hood.
 
Jafooli said:
I am however not sure on one or two things in the guide I plan to follow, firstly he says in step 1 "You will need to purchase your own screws for this" I presume as the drill bit will be 3mm I need 3mm screws that are also small, as if there to long the reflector won't fit back into the hood.
Click to expand...

Hi Jafooli,
Yes, I'd use nuts and bolts like EnderUK rather than screws, once I had the T5 clips I'd see what size bolt fits them and drill that size hole. (I'm probably over cautious but I wouldn't be happy using self tapping screws on metal that heats/cools and gets moved around).
You might find it easier to use a hand-drill rather than a power-drill as you have more control.



Jafooli said:
There is nothing to screw them into apart from the reflector obviously but I guess the screws are just going to be held in position by the bulbs weight.
Click to expand...
They look to be self-tapping screws so friction holds them in place. Better to use nuts and bolts to keep electrics above the water.

cheers phil
 
Hey EnderUK & Phil

Thanks for helping me out,

Ender I had a quick look at the thread you linked and did like the look of Sylvania Grolux + Osram Lumilux 880 Skywhite.

I'm also a bit confused as you said:
EnderUK said:
I got frustrated with the reflectors in my Roma 125 and ended up ditching them and screwing the t5 holders direct into the side of the ballast tray.
Click to expand...
How did you then screw the nut on? I guess you opened the top of the T8 ballast up and also stripped away the T8 caps etc? (Don't worry I read your first reply, you did state you hacked away at it so question answered lol)

Also regarding the aquarium ballast units that is what I plan to do, unless I'm missing what you mean. I also plan to just sit the unit on the top of the tank at the back unless the wires will allow it to sit on the shelf inside the cabinet.

Thanks both for the tips, I'm glad I asked now as it gives me more of a clearer picture on what I'm doing. I could always try a hand-drill like you say Phil. I was thinking maybe just marking it out with a marker pen then maybe tap a nail or something into the reflector to try make a dip then drill in, or my mum was saying something about plasters stop the drill bit slipping lol.

Anyway I best stop asking questions, don't want to make a book about a already written simple guide lol. I think I've got it all covered now.
I could even attach the lights to the inside of the rim in the tank as it has a rim which overlaps the glass, so if I could make a hole that would just work the same, but that would make maintenance even more tricky.I just hope the reflectors with both bulbs attached won't be to much of an issue when doing maintenance, not that I do much right now as nothing grows. :lol:

EnderUK did you do exactly the same upgrade I plan to do then? as you said you got frustrated with the reflectors.

Thanks again.
 
Cheers Phil,

I'm just looking forward to the day its all done so I can enjoy the plant side of things again.
I just had a look at the Arcadia Classica Stretch LED. I'm not sure how I would get that attached to the Arcadia T8 reflector I will be using. I presume I'm missing something you thought off lol.

I think for now I'm stick with the T5's, and then who knows maybe when I'm more confident one day I could look at LEDS. I don't want to risk the money to find out I can't fit something as I'm useless at all this DIY :(
If my tank was in another room then at least I could have an open top tank which would make mounting options easier due to brackets etc. I would love to one day have a tank running TMC GroBeam 600's for example with all the day/night transitions and being able to control the brightness. I would still like to hear your idea though if you did have one, just for future reference regarding how to attach it.

Thanks again.
 
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