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Discus tank

Kogre

Kogre

Member
Joined
14 Apr 2013
Messages
214
Location
Derby
So I'm looking forward to my first planted tank and am looking to have discus as the centrepiece fish, between 9-12 of them.

The shoaling dither will be harlequin rasboras which I think are beautiful. Maybe about 30 of these. Maybe a second shoal of rummy nose tetras, 10-15.

For the lower levels, I'm considering mikrogeophagus (GBR/EBR) of sorts, either 4 or 6. If possible a very different apistogramma pair which will keep the number of rams down to 4. Also, a school of 6 trilineatus corydoras. Finally I'd like a feather tail betta if I can find a beautiful example of one.

That'll be the new fish, then I've got some migrants: a firemouth, black ghost knife fish and angelfish (I'll keep an eye on any nipping between the angels and discus, any issues I'll take the angels to the LFS).

I know its a big bioload for a planted tank, but this won't be from day one and the tank will be quite big, 68"Lx24"Wx30"H, giving me around 700-750 litres. With everything fully grown, there'll be loads of room in the tank still.

What do you think?
 
You'll have to remember about the fact that discus have to be kept at about 29 degrees celcius or there abouts. I don't know the recquirements of all of the fish in that list but you might need to make sure they can handle the high temps!🙂
 
The corydoras, tetras, harlequins and rams are all compatible temperature wise. I've seen angelfish with discus before and the rest of my fish I'll acclimatise. If the discus look like they're suffering, I'll get rid of whatever has the lowest temperature requirement until the discus look better. I'll be looking to keep them at 29-30° in slightly acidic to neutral water.
 
Thanks flygja, I'll read up on those. Sorry to hear about your discus deaths.

I'm hoping not to eat up a lot of space with plants but have enough for the discus to hide in whenever they're a little insecure.

NJ im not sure at the moment. I would prefer the same colour but missus wants a mix. I shall have to see what is available and how much of a budget I have when it finally comes time to buying!
 
Does anyone have a discus tank? Do you use a background? What substrate do you use? I understand that using a dark background and substrate can darken and dull the colours of discus so any advice or help would be appreciated.
 
I raised a group of juvenile Discus a couple year's ago.(Red turquoise,Red Marlboro).


Five of them to start ,then two more after a couple week's.(55 gal tank)
I kept the fish over sand(play sand) substrate, with some driftwood pieces and anubia attached to the wood.Painted the background of tank black.
To achieve the growth possible with these large cichlid's,,I fed them three to five times a day, and this meant near daily 50 % water changes.(to remove organic's from frequent feeding's).
Fish achieved approx five and one half inches in a little over six month's from near quarter size juveniles.
Sterbai corydora's are the only cory's that will do well in the long term with temp's that discus thrive in.Rummy nose and cardinal tetra's ,Ditto.(a fewother's maybe).
Tried to lower the temp with Discus to allow for other species alongside the Discus, but the Discus became lethargic,and bloated due to I suppose decreased Metabolisim.
If I had it to do all over again,,I would raise the young fish in bare bottom tank which makes cleaning up waste,poop easier.
Would get the planted tank established, and all problem' sorted before introducing the Discus.
 
Thanks for the useful tips! I only have a 50 litre as a spare so don't know how to go about getting the juveniles to grow in a separate tank prior to being housed in the main tank. Could I wait for the planted tank to establish and then add juveniles to it? I'm guessing not.

What effect did the dark background have on the fish if any?
 
I cant think of why it would be a problem to wait until the plants establish themselves before adding the discus? Surely it would only help with keeping the water quality high. Somebody more experienced will know more though.

Ive got a 7 month old planted discus tank running but its my first one so im a beginner without much history in tanks in general. In that time though I havent had one fish suffer any type of ill health ( apart from one discus I added later that had gill flukes). In my 55g Ive got 5 discus, 20 cardinals, a few ottos and a million shrimp. I didnt add the fish all in one go though. If I remember correctly I waited about 6 weeks before added the discus. Like roadmaster, I raised the discus from juveniles and that is the one thing I would change if I was to do it again. I know you save a lot of money by buying them small but you will save so much time and energy if you can afford to buy them at 3-4 inches.

I used an aquasoil topped with gravel but as youngsters they struggled to pick food from off the gravel so I put in a sand area where they could graze from. I have got a black background and mine have coloured up great. I dont know your experience of discus etc but all I did was read, read and read. Go on the Stendker site and keep reading everything they say until it all makes sense...

I will help you however I can though.
 
Much appreciated, bridgey_c.

Do you have the same kind of discus or various types? Do you have pictures of your tank/discus?

I'm really new to this but want to get it right first time.
 
From what I understand and as already suggested, you may have a problem raising young discus in a planted tank, even established one. They eat a lot, they are messy eaters, lots of the 3-4 time meals a day will rot inside the tank and they can't tolerate high organics. From a planted tank it will be hard to remove even with the daily water changes one should be doing. So the best is to either buy them as big as you can afford, or raise them in a bare bottom with daily water changes and a lot of feeding, then move them to your display tank when adults.
It's also better if you buy them all from the same place as it will avoid cross contamination. They can be kept in tap water just fine depending on where you got them from.

Sterbai corydora's are the only cory's that will do well in the long term with temp's that discus thrive in.
Click to expand...

From what I know there are other species of corys that tolerate higher temperatures as well as sterbai:
oiapoquensis, goessi, suessi, haraldschultzei, adolfoi(possibly duplicareus too)

Here is an old article too from coryman himself:
/articles/authors/i_fuller/
 
Thanks for the feedback on tankmates; I'm pretty much 95% on them and have been since the beginning of the thread anyway.

I might look into the type of corydoras I end up with though, I quite liked the trilineatus but am not sure whether I'll be able to get them.

I think Maidenhead had a few but all of their corys were ridiculously expensive.
 
Hi all,
sciencefiction said:
From what I know there are other species of corys that tolerate higher temperatures as well as sterbai: oiapoquensis, goessi, suessi, haraldschultzei, adolfoi(possibly duplicareus too) Here is an old article too from coryman himself: /articles/authors/i_fuller/
Click to expand...
Useful list, straight from the font of wisdom for all things Cory. C. adolfoi are fine at higher temperatures as well, a lot of Hypancistrus keepers keep them with L46 etc.
Kogre said:
I quite liked the trilineatus but am not sure whether I'll be able to get them.
Click to expand...
Nearly every shop sells them, but labelled as "C. jullii".
sciencefiction said:
From what I understand and as already suggested, you may have a problem raising young discus in a planted tank, even established one. They eat a lot, they are messy eaters, lots of the 3-4 time meals a day will rot inside the tank and they can't tolerate high organics. From a planted tank it will be hard to remove even with the daily water changes one should be doing. So the best is to either buy them as big as you can afford, or raise them in a bare bottom with daily water changes and a lot of feeding, then move them to your display tank when adults.
Click to expand...
This is honestly a myth, all fish are better in planted tanks (and I really mean all, even if the fish have to be physically separated from the plants, and by plants I mean any photosynthetic organisms), the same also applies to a substrate, there are plenty of advantages, and very few disadvantages.

A lot of successful breeders use bare bottom tanks, are OCD about cleanliness, feed with beef-heart and do huge water changes, but there is a reason for this, they have a specific aim (as fast a growth as possible), to stop their fish "growing out of profit". You can think of it as like battery farming chickens.

Once you have a bare tank you are obliged to keep the tank really clean and do lots of water changes, because you don't have any spare filtration capacity or inherent stability in your system, but this doesn't make it the only way to keep them, or the best system.

If you work from the assumption that Discus originate in very clean, nutrient poor clear and black waters, where food is in short supply and they will eat whatever is available, you can then tailor the tank to their requirements, which aren't necessarily the same as those of a commercial breeder. If you keep away from a beef-heart based diet you can feed them a more natural diet, and a lot of problems disappear.

I'd really recommend having a look at Larry Waybright's ("Apistomaster") Discus threads on various forums ("simplydiscus" etc), he is some-one for whom I have the greatest respect.

Here is his Heckel Discus thread at the "cichlid room companion" <The Cichlid Room Companion • View topic - Heckel Discus "biotope" tank>, and a "Nhamunda Blue" thread: <The Cichlid Room Companion • View topic - New photos of some of my discus>.

cheers Darrel
 
Kogre said:
Thanks for the useful tips! I only have a 50 litre as a spare so don't know how to go about getting the juveniles to grow in a separate tank prior to being housed in the main tank. Could I wait for the planted tank to establish and then add juveniles to it? I'm guessing not.

What effect did the dark background have on the fish if any?
Click to expand...

As mentioned,,I kept the young fish over sand, and plant's (anubia) were attached to wood, which I could easily remove to clean the substrate.
Could use potted plant's as well.
Also employed floating plant's to help diffuse light which they did not much care for,and to help with water quality .
I managed to raise the fish without offering Beefheart,blood worm's,but did offer wide variety of protein; rich food's from Ocean nutrition (nearly 55% protein),to Spirulina pellet's,bit's of earthworm's,meal worm's, Dried marine algae hung from veggie clip,cichlid pellet's,Tetra bit's,Fluker's freeze dried cricket's (as Adult fish).
I was not trying to breed the fish,simply wishing to see the fish achieve their potential without resorting to purist's method's .(Bare bottom)
Black background and floating plant's seemed to help the fish be less skittish from the beginning,and in my expieriences ,,nearly all fishes respond favorably to dimmer lighting as opposed to mega watt's that some run over planted tank's.
As to the Corydora's,, I have no doubt as mentioned,,that maybe a few more species will tolerate(perhap's not thrive) in the temp's that Discus enjoy, but by and large,,my expieriences since early 1970's ,have proved to me anyway, that given ideal water conditon's,good diet,,that the majority of this species(have kept many) ,will live longer at cooler temperatures closer to the middle range of most published temp ranges.Ditto for Ancistrus.
This is easy to test for oneself ,if one were so inclined. (I did).
 
A lot of successful breeders use bare bottom tanks, are OCD about cleanliness, feed with beef-heart and do huge water changes, but there is a reason for this, they have a specific aim (as fast a growth as possible), to stop their fish "growing out of profit". You can think of it as like battery farming chickens.

Once you have a bare tank you are obliged to keep the tank really clean and do lots of water changes, because you don't have any spare filtration capacity or inherent stability in your system, but this doesn't make it the only way to keep them, or the best system.
Click to expand...

He, he. I like the chicken comparisson. It's essentially like that I suppose considering discus in captivity are actually grown bigger than the ones in nature.
One has to evaluate all points and see what works best for them and the fish, including the food given. Discus are quite expensive too so it's a decision to make. I personally dislike bare bottom tanks even for raising fry.
 
You guys are like sages! Thanks for the links and keep all the information coming (I'll have a read of the linked threads in the evening).

I was originally planning black background and aqua soil (which isn't quite black but does look dark) but then came across information about colours on discus darkening and peppering in some cases. I take it nobody here has experienced this? I may need to cap the aqua soil with PFS but then if I do end up planting into the substrate I imagine it'll be a mess when moving things. At least the discus would colour well?

I've got an order on a tank and need to know for sure whether or not to get a background.
 
Fishes color's to me,, seem to wash out, or fade with light colored substrates,background's,higher lighting,at least initially.
Maybe they become used to it after a while,? but Dark colored substrates ,background's ,appear to be well received by most of the fishes I have kept.(comfort).
Other than Stress Bar's appearing when fish were new to the tank,,they colored nicely with play sand and black background.
Believe coloring of fish can be more directly tied to diet,Water quality,Genetic's.
 
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