Crystal Mountain

Paulo Soares

Member
Joined
6 Nov 2014
Messages
603
At one scape you used two filters with two sets of in-/out-flow. Another time I think you used two filters, but with only one in-/out-flow. And in this scape you used only one (large) filter.
Do you have a final recommendation? With my limited experience, I have found it difficult to get good flow in all parts of the tank with only one in-/out-flow without adding an extra flow pump like many do – but you do not use that?
Good evening,

Conneting filters in line or in paralel is not a solution and you won´t have any gain. Remember.. you always have the same power! One filter will not increase the power of the other. Simple as this.
You may have a tiny tiny help by the OUTflow that will connect in the Inflow of the other but no reward will be achieved ...
I believe you will have some issues by the time comes to clean them ;)

Now.. you say you have difficult to get good flow in all parts of the tank. Well this is quite vague.. what you mean precisely?
Any tank has areas where there is less flow than other areas but that´s normal. Even if you put two filters one in each side of the tank you´ll never have the same flow in all tank.
Of course that if your filter is not proper to the size of the tank you´ll have more issues.

But has long as you have a proper filter and the IN / OUT well assembled (you should try your best combination for your layout) no issues will come along.

As for light Nuno was testing for PAR measures and he acomplished that a PAR between 40 or 50 will do for any plant purpose. In other words use Medium Light.
 

jesperl.dk

Member
Joined
23 Jan 2017
Messages
50
Location
Copenhagen
Evening :)

Good evening,
But has long as you have a proper filter and the IN / OUT well assembled (you should try your best combination for your layout) no issues will come along.
Thanks! :)
I pretty much follow https://www.ukaps.org/index.php?page=setting-up-a-higher-tech-planted-tank, and for my current 100x40x50 I have an Eheim 2075 as well as a Hydor nano for extra flow. Originally years ago I saw good improvement when I added the Nano, but I might try and drop the Hydor for my current scape.

Good evening,
As for light Nuno was testing for PAR measures and he acomplished that a PAR between 40 or 50 will do for any plant purpose. In other words use Medium Light.
Yes I am pretty much aware of that. I probably did not phrase it well, but my question was mostly how it looks to us humans ;)

Do you or Nuno have any thoughts regarding my question about fertilizing?

Thanks again! :)
 

Paulo Soares

Member
Joined
6 Nov 2014
Messages
603
Do you or Nuno have any thoughts regarding my question about fertilizing?
Hi again dear Jesperl,

Me and Nuno are friends here in Portugal, and we debate a lot the "Ei - T.Barr" system.. and i´m one of those guys that is a UNbeliever of "EI" and consequences of using this method or dry salts.
I allready used it, as for ADA or Tropica system and i can garantee that with "EI" i did have plenty more issues on my tanks than any other fertilizers. And i´m not saying anything new.. cause if you scroll/search on the web you´ll find more people having lot´s of problems by using "EI" than others using Tropica, Aquarebbel, Ada, kramer or elese for instance.

The "EI" method is very well described by T. barr and it´s not suitable for our tanks and is not being understood as it should be. People start to aply it without any regard or caution or even methodology. Just doing a receipe, placing a target and get on the gas with it it in the highway..
Well.. looks quite easy comparing the issues people do have don´t you think?
But let´s just forget this by now.. cause i think i allready did have my "dose" on "Ei" discussions and his Followers..

As for me i don´t do any fert in my tank for now. I doing an experiment on my fertil substrate (Tropica Plant Growth) and till now is working pretty well.

But if i have to choose i honestly point Tropica Specialised. What an amazing fertilizer. ;)

And you do not have to spent so much on it as people used to say.

As people is accostumed to "EI" method where they aply large amounts of ferts they think that by using "Tropica Specialised" they will spent lots of money cause they try to accomplish the same targets of "EI" but using Tropica.. wich is a big mistake ;)

I´m going to let you a tip to think about:
If you try to acomplish a target of 20 to 30 Ppm of No3 (for instance) by using tropica Specialized or ADA you will have to spent lots of money on ferts of course. So.. do you think the manufacturers used this targets? Are they foolish?
Is it really needed it? Do you believe that a plant needs this kind of targets? Remember this targets are aplyed on "EI". (?) ;)
There you go...

That´s why Nuno is a trully remarcable guy by testing and testing over and over and also sharing what he observes and he aply a "EI" method using ADA for an example so you can do a fertilization not spenting so much money.

He will come here and response as soon as he can. He´s now on a new job challenge and for now dosen´t have too much spare time.

But i felt i should let you my opinion and my point of view.

Best regards
 

xim

Member
Joined
19 Mar 2010
Messages
513
As for light Nuno was testing for PAR measures and he acomplished that a PAR between 40 or 50 will do for any plant purpose. In other words use Medium Light.
Tom Barr called this level low light....

I guess many members think 40-50 is medium and then follow the advice of using low light. So they go lower than that, resulting in newbies having problem about dying or not growing plants while never having green coloured algae (only brown or black).
 

Nuno M.

Member
Joined
23 Dec 2012
Messages
305
Great work mate. Good luck with contests.
Thank you Alexander

One of the best aquariums and definately one of the best journals I have seen. Full of information, tips and amazing and stunning photos. I am planning an almost identical spec aquarium myself with some small variations mainly in filtration. Other than that will be same equipment. What I really enjoyed was all the infos about the chihiros lights, cause I was quite sceptical about their penetrating power but all this info about the PAR convinced me go for them.
Thank you Skiper,

They are quite good fixtures price wise :thumbup:

Think you will be hard pushed to beat this one.
Thanks for sharing your fantastic scape.
Good luck with the contests.
Thank you Daveslaney,

Not really concerned on doing better or worse next time, I have to like it the rest is secondary ;)

Sad news indeed, agreed this is one of the best journals I have read, love reading your updates and looking at your quality photos and videos. Thanks for all the tips, looking forward to seeing what you create next!
Thank you doylecolmdoyle,

Let's wait and see what the future holds, I've sold the tank and cabinet already, going for something smaller (ADA 60P), because I don't have time at the moment to keep something this big !!!

Fantastic scape and a truly great journal. All your journals are great and I am learning a lot from reading them.
I am starting to plan a 120x50x50 and are of course looking for what you have done. And you have done differently at different times. Do you mind a few questions?

At one scape you used two filters with two sets of in-/out-flow. Another time I think you used two filters, but with only one in-/out-flow. And in this scape you used only one (large) filter.
Do you have a final recommendation? With my limited experience, I have found it difficult to get good flow in all parts of the tank with only one in-/out-flow without adding an extra flow pump like many do – but you do not use that?

At this last scape you used the Chihiros fixtures. They sure look good at you can obviously grow plants with them. Do you think they are as good as the previous fixtures you have used? More importantly, how do they look to your eye? – do the plants and colors look great? Obviously that will be subjective, but it is also obvious that you have great taste :) My concern is that they are 8000K – quite cold.

You have tried different dosing regimes at different times.
Do you have a conclusion on your DIY ADA dosing experiment? In you Crystal River journal you are in 2014 very enthusiastic about Aquarebell Makro Spezial N and KramerDrak, but it seems your are now mostly doing more common EI?
Thank you for your words jesperl,

I will answer the best way I can ;)

One large good filter for me it's the way to go, and if you can go for a thermofilter, in the past I've bought the JBL 1501GreenLine and one of those wasn't enough for my aquarium, then I bought the second one pair them in line and in parallel and the final outflow from that was most likely what I have now with only one EHEIM 600T this one is the perfect fit actually it's the only piece of equipment that I wont be selling as the pump is electronically controlled, I will use it on my future aquarium an ADA 60P :D

As for the CHIHIROS fixtures, they are quite good one's for the price tag they have, as for the color rendition, I really like it on the colder side so the 8000K was on spot for my personal taste, if you watch the video the color rendition is pretty much what you get no color correction or edition on it !!!

Yes I have a final thought on ADA's DIY fertilization VS EI, actually It worked like a charm, no deficiencies on the plants, good colors, much less maintenance on the tank, less algae on hardscape and glass, and slower growth rate really really happy with it ;)

I've used EI for quite a good time now I like the ratio between nutrients originally given by Tom Barr, I then tested Spezial N from Tobias Coring with urea the results wore stunning since then I use UREA in my EI Recipes, but my dosing is adjusted to my tank needs and that is the major problem with EI, people do not adjust the dosing, not any aquarium need this soup of nutrients, this will lead to more algae, more maintenance, bigger water changes and more frequent ones, overall an EI dosed tank need's lot's more maintenance than a low dosing regime with nutrients mainly in the substrate, I always use ADA Aquasoil in me setups for me there's no better substrate system so I tend to be dosing leaner and leaner and always with good plant response, I really think that dosing leaner but with UREA/NH4 on the mix things work really really well ... If you see most of N fertilzers on the market use one of those N sources, Tropica, ADA, EasyLife, Seachem, EQUO, VIMI you name it and they use it, so all those plant fertilizers have to be doing something right , despite the method of dosing, they are good fertilizers ... That's the main reason for also using UREA, I will order some NH4NO3 for my next experience with DIY fertilizers ;)

Good evening,

Conneting filters in line or in paralel is not a solution and you won´t have any gain. Remember.. you always have the same power! One filter will not increase the power of the other. Simple as this.
You may have a tiny tiny help by the OUTflow that will connect in the Inflow of the other but no reward will be achieved ...
I believe you will have some issues by the time comes to clean them ;)

Now.. you say you have difficult to get good flow in all parts of the tank. Well this is quite vague.. what you mean precisely?
Any tank has areas where there is less flow than other areas but that´s normal. Even if you put two filters one in each side of the tank you´ll never have the same flow in all tank.
Of course that if your filter is not proper to the size of the tank you´ll have more issues.

But has long as you have a proper filter and the IN / OUT well assembled (you should try your best combination for your layout) no issues will come along.

As for light Nuno was testing for PAR measures and he acomplished that a PAR between 40 or 50 will do for any plant purpose. In other words use Medium Light.
You are wrong Paulo,

There's several benefit's from having filters connected in-line or in parallel, in line I can say that you have a good flow boost actually one JBL 1501 full real test runs at 800-900L 1400l/h pump head in the in-line configuration was pumping around 1100l/h in parallel assembly this went up to 1500-1600 L/H doubling the filters outflow but to much for my tank, the benefit's for me wore having more space for bio and mechanical filtration, less pipes going in/out of the tank, boosted filter outflow ;)

As for PAR I've accomplished nothing Paulo, this info is out there for many years now I just measured the lights and then gave you guys the results ...

Hi again dear Jesperl,

Me and Nuno are friends here in Portugal, and we debate a lot the "Ei - T.Barr" system.. and i´m one of those guys that is a UNbeliever of "EI" and consequences of using this method or dry salts.
I allready used it, as for ADA or Tropica system and i can garantee that with "EI" i did have plenty more issues on my tanks than any other fertilizers. And i´m not saying anything new.. cause if you scroll/search on the web you´ll find more people having lot´s of problems by using "EI" than others using Tropica, Aquarebbel, Ada, kramer or elese for instance.

The "EI" method is very well described by T. barr and it´s not suitable for our tanks and is not being understood as it should be. People start to aply it without any regard or caution or even methodology. Just doing a receipe, placing a target and get on the gas with it it in the highway..
Well.. looks quite easy comparing the issues people do have don´t you think?
But let´s just forget this by now.. cause i think i allready did have my "dose" on "Ei" discussions and his Followers..

As for me i don´t do any fert in my tank for now. I doing an experiment on my fertil substrate (Tropica Plant Growth) and till now is working pretty well.

But if i have to choose i honestly point Tropica Specialised. What an amazing fertilizer. ;)

And you do not have to spent so much on it as people used to say.

As people is accostumed to "EI" method where they aply large amounts of ferts they think that by using "Tropica Specialised" they will spent lots of money cause they try to accomplish the same targets of "EI" but using Tropica.. wich is a big mistake ;)

I´m going to let you a tip to think about:
If you try to acomplish a target of 20 to 30 Ppm of No3 (for instance) by using tropica Specialized or ADA you will have to spent lots of money on ferts of course. So.. do you think the manufacturers used this targets? Are they foolish?
Is it really needed it? Do you believe that a plant needs this kind of targets? Remember this targets are aplyed on "EI". (?) ;)
There you go...

That´s why Nuno is a trully remarcable guy by testing and testing over and over and also sharing what he observes and he aply a "EI" method using ADA for an example so you can do a fertilization not spenting so much money.

He will come here and response as soon as he can. He´s now on a new job challenge and for now dosen´t have too much spare time.

But i felt i should let you my opinion and my point of view.

Best regards
As I said before in my opinion Estimative Index is the best way to grow aquatic plants (I'm no believer I know this for a fact and experiencing with it), better and faster growth better colors, better plant health overall, but much more maintenance work to do !!! But has Tom said time and time again, but no one seems to listen, the dose has to be adjusted to the tank/plant needs ...

Every plant need's some degree of fertilization especially K+ Paulo and Fe Micro-elements, maybe you have enough on your tap water ;)

As for Fertilizing Lines/Brand's I also think they are doing things right, In the case of Tropica, ADA the fertilization is added based on their substrate systems and this results in a perfect symbiosis !!!

Today these fertilizers are very easy to replicate using dry salts, and to do them your self spending less money and at the same time learning a little bit more about this hobby :)

Thank you for your words regarding me, I really like to share this things with you all, and it's good when actually someone else uses that info to do well in their own tanks !!!
 

jesperl.dk

Member
Joined
23 Jan 2017
Messages
50
Location
Copenhagen
I've used EI for quite a good time now I like the ratio between nutrients originally given by Tom Barr, I then tested Spezial N from Tobias Coring with urea the results wore stunning since then I use UREA in my EI Recipes, but my dosing is adjusted to my tank needs and that is the major problem with EI, people do not adjust the dosing, not any aquarium need this soup of nutrients, this will lead to more algae, more maintenance, bigger water changes and more frequent ones, overall an EI dosed tank need's lot's more maintenance than a low dosing regime with nutrients mainly in the substrate, I always use ADA Aquasoil in me setups for me there's no better substrate system so I tend to be dosing leaner and leaner and always with good plant response, I really think that dosing leaner but with UREA/NH4 on the mix things work really really well ... If you see most of N fertilzers on the market use one of those N sources, Tropica, ADA, EasyLife, Seachem, EQUO, VIMI you name it and they use it, so all those plant fertilizers have to be doing something right , despite the method of dosing, they are good fertilizers ... That's the main reason for also using UREA, I will order some NH4NO3 for my next experience with DIY fertilizers ;)
That makes a lot of sense. I make my own EI mix, and will order some UREA to use as well. A bit further along I will try slowly lowering my doses as well. Thanks! :)
 

Penta

New Member
Joined
14 Apr 2014
Messages
5
Location
Bulgaria
Great journal indeed !
I've made almost any DIY copy of fertilizer that exists, but never tried ADA fertilizers. And since I'm curious by nature I have a question for you :
So there is a table with ADA fertilizers and the total amount of all four of them match the ppm of your ADA DIY (UREA). This means that your DIY consist of all four ADA fertilizers gathered in one bottle (and MicroMix in separate)? As far as I know they are not used all together but depending on your tank age ?
If so, you are dosing this "all-in-one" 1ml/10l every day, right ?
Thanks in advance and keep posting your knowledge ! :)
 

Nuno M.

Member
Joined
23 Dec 2012
Messages
305
Great journal indeed !
I've made almost any DIY copy of fertilizer that exists, but never tried ADA fertilizers. And since I'm curious by nature I have a question for you :
So there is a table with ADA fertilizers and the total amount of all four of them match the ppm of your ADA DIY (UREA). This means that your DIY consist of all four ADA fertilizers gathered in one bottle (and MicroMix in separate)? As far as I know they are not used all together but depending on your tank age ?
If so, you are dosing this "all-in-one" 1ml/10l every day, right ?
Thanks in advance and keep posting your knowledge ! :)
Hi there Penta,

It's not a all-in-one solution but it could be, just add some potassium sorbate and ascorbic acid to the solution to avoid the precipitation of the Fe with PO4 this will also preserve the solution for a longer time ...

In my plan I have a bottle for Macros and a bottle for Micros separating the total amount of K2SO4 between the Micro and Macro bottle for better solubility ;)

And yes I was dosing all of them in a daily basis 1ml/10L you can dose exactly as ADA by doubling the amount of salts on a 500ml
 

Penta

New Member
Joined
14 Apr 2014
Messages
5
Location
Bulgaria
Thank you for the answer Nuno,
I've made DIY TPN+ in the past, so I know how to mix iron and phosphate . What I had in mind by "All-in-one" was all ot the ADA ferts (Brighty Lights, Shade, K and Step 3) in one solution and another with MicroMix. As for the K2SO4, I know your way of doing it since i'm following your journal since the beginning.
Just wondering if I try it with Dennerle Scaper's Soil, as i said I'm too curious to try everything :)

Thanks again !
 

Nuno M.

Member
Joined
23 Dec 2012
Messages
305
I've never used or known someone that uses Dennerle Soil, but if it's rich in nutrients I would give it a go !!!

STEP 3 is replicated in my mix with MicroMix Plus as this is the stronger FE dosage from ADA Line ;)
 

Nuno M.

Member
Joined
23 Dec 2012
Messages
305
Hi Nuno
When you dose your ADA diy with Urea or EI with Urea as shown in the tables.
Do you dose macro one day micro the next? Or do you dose both macro and micro on same day?
Going to give both a try in the near future.
Regards Dave.
Hi there Dave,

I dose both on the same day/everyday 30min apart, just before lights ON !!!
 

Nuno M.

Member
Joined
23 Dec 2012
Messages
305
No problem Dave,

Give some feedback after a while of using the recipes !!! Have in mind that ADA DIY will only work if you use Amazonia or similar product rich in Ntrogen, otherwise it can be to little of a dose !!!

If you have further answers make them on the thread as someone else can have similar doubts and in that way all can share the experience !!!

Good mixing and do not fire near KNO3


Enviado do meu iPhone usando o Tapatalk
 
Joined
26 Nov 2016
Messages
81
Location
Benedita
Excellent journal and (you guys don't know him in person) a great guy. Always willing to help.
Congrats Nuno for this amazing aquarium and I am eagerly waiting for the final photo.

Abraço
 
Joined
16 Jun 2014
Messages
264
Location
Leicester
Great journal. That's what we call a real aquascaping, nice hardscape, super healthy plants, great quality photos and everything based on high level of knowledge. A lot to learn from. Thanks for sharing.
 

mohsen12251

New Member
Joined
2 Feb 2016
Messages
9
Location
iran
Hi everyone,

Here it goes a my new home tank layout started last week, hope you guys have time to follow this one :)

Here goes the setup:

Started:
24/08/2016

Tank:
120x50x50cm Extra-Clear Optiwite Glass

Stand:
DIY - 122x51x82cm

Light:
CHIHIROS A-1201 x2
8000K 5630 SMD LED's 65w

Filter:
1x EHEIM 2178 (600T) THERMO-FILTER

Filter Midia:
Original Blue Pad
Sera Siporax 2l
Seachem Matrix 4l
JBL Symec Syntetic Filter Floss

Other Equipment:
Kit CO2 aquaristic.tec 13kg FE
JBL ProFlora PH Control
ADA Pollen Glass Beetle Ø50
ADA Glass Counter
ADA CO2 Indicator
CHIHIROS DOCTOR SUPER
VIV Lily Pipes 17mm (outflow)(inflows)
Jebao DP-4

Hardscape:
Local Rocks
Entwood

Substrate:
ADA Aquasoil Amazónia

Ferts:
EI Daily

Weekly Target:
20ppm NO3
30ppm K
3ppm PO4
10ppm Mg
0.5ppm Fe

Plants:
Bucephalandra Belindae
Bucephalandra Motleyana "Braun/Rot Narrow"
Bucephalandra Motleyana "Riam Macam"
Bucephalandra Fake Catherinae
Bucephalandra "Kedagang"
Bucephalandra Velvet Leaf "Entikong"
Eleocharis Acicularis "Mini"
Hemianthus Callitrichoides "Cuba"
Hygrophila "Araguaia"
Hygrophila Pinnatifida
Ludwigia Arcuata
Rotala "Rotundifolia"
Rotala "Green"
Staurogyne Repens

Photos:

Final Hardscape
View attachment 91022_MG_2420 by Nuno Matos, on Flickr

After Filling with Water
View attachment 91023_MG_2440 by Nuno Matos, on Flickr

Photos from today with clear water and diferent angles
View attachment 91024_MG_2451 by Nuno Matos, on Flickr

View attachment 91025_MG_2450 by Nuno Matos, on Flickr

View attachment 91026_MG_2449 by Nuno Matos, on Flickr

View attachment 91027_MG_2444 by Nuno Matos, on Flickr

Hope you guys like it ...
Hello buddy
The equipment inside the aquarium cabinet Please let me see.
Thankful
 
Top