Cats Amazonia - first planted tank adventure

[AndyVox]

Current State of Tank 29/7/12:

Ive been keeping fish for the last 3-4 years, but never had any luck with plants so i decided I'd create a setup just to grow plants successfully and create a beautiful view for my lounge

So I started out with this:

Juwel Rio 300 aquarium, at this point I was using two T8 bulbs and some CO2, nothing great and growth was very slow. And sometimes even dying...

I then upgraded to a 4x54w Arcadia T5HO unit which pushed things alot. Dosing more CO2 and additives, everything seemed to be coming along nicely. It's only been four days since I got the light but the difference is unbelievable.

I couldn't get enough CO2 out of the diffuser to turn my test green so I used the homemade yeast setup to push bubbles onto the filter outlet pipe which spreads the bubbles nicely along the tank and have since stopped using the Tetra Plan bottle and diffusers.

Now looking like this (apologies for the awful photo)

Little video of the Photosynthesis going on, crazy amount of bubble coming from the plants!



Any advice or help on improving the layout I'd be keen to hear.
I'm hoping once it grows through a bit it'll look much better. Considering I have only been at high light and decent CO2 levels for 3-4 days I'm very pleased.
Java moss on the left is getting hacked down tonight, It's out of control!!

 

[hinch]

Re: Juwel Rio 300 - First planted tank - Upgrade to T5's

yeast co2 is very unreliable you'd be better off switching back to your pressurised bottles and injecting that into an inline diffuser or reactor on your external filter

 

[spyder]

Re: Juwel Rio 300 - First planted tank - Upgrade to T5's

yeast co2 is very unreliable you'd be better off switching back to your pressurised bottles and injecting that into an inline diffuser or reactor on your external filter

This. If you have a pressurised system hook it up.

This huge increase in lighting is going to up demand the need for good co2. DIY can be unstable at the best of times but in larger volume tanks, even more so. How long are your lights on each day? If it's any more than 6 hours then you can cut back to 6 hours for a while while your plants adjust and you get your co2 right.

Are you running an external filter, or just the juwel internal? Good water flow is essential to carry the co2 and nutrients around the tank to the plants. You mentioned "additives", I presume this is ferts. What ferts are you using? How much and how often are you dosing these additives?

Sorry it may seem like a lot of questions but it would help people to guide you.

Welcome to high light and co2.

 

[AndyVox]

Re: Juwel Rio 300 - First planted tank - Upgrade to T5's

Im using the internal filter at the moment, I'm considering going external if needed, I'm not sure exactly how much flow I'd need but currently it seems to be working nicely.
It is currently breaking the surface slightly as you can see from the video, would you suggest allowing it to break the surface more?

My lights are on for 10 hours currently which is the same as with the T8's, at which point I was using the Tetra plan small CO2 bottles and diffusers, which worked fine but they can't cope with the current demand and DIY seemed like the only option until I can afford something more reliable.

As for ferts, im using searchem Flourish, Flourish Iron, Flourish Excel band Flourish Trace. Adding as per the instructions, can't remember off hand what exactly they are.
I am getting to the back end of them so I was considering using dry ferts, but I'm yet to look into this as a plausable option, with the rate the plants are growing Searchem is getting to get really expensive really quickly. Especially as the dosage is huge for a 300l tank.

 

[hinch]

Re: Juwel Rio 300 - First planted tank - Upgrade to T5's

300 litre tank so you're looking at a filter providing about 3000l/ph turnover the only single filter close to this would be an fx5. so what you may need is a couple of smaller externals or a single external (as large as you can go) or just supliment with powerheads. at the end of the day your substrate and heavy planting should provide the bulk of the actual filtration and the filter becomes more about water movement and debris clearing.

Your internal should be more than enough for debris clearing so perhaps you could supliment with a couple of power heads instead to provide the movement.

Cut down your lighting to 5-6 hours no more you've more than doubled your lighting amount the plants will take time to adapt (run only 2 tubes if you can rather than full whack too)

For your ferts ignore what it says for dosage as going to high light and co2 will mean you will have to massively increase your fert dosing look for signs of leaf damage etc to work out what needs increasing etc.
Swap to APF's all in one (one of the sponsors here you get 10% discount its basically predone EI) will save you a fortune.

Also consider swapping to FE based co2 too rather than the small disposable bottles.

no co2 is better than DIY co2!

 

[AndyVox]

Re: Juwel Rio 300 - First planted tank - Upgrade to T5's

OK, well I have another internal filter knocking about from my old 100l tank so ill get that in this evening.
In terms of placement, would it be best on the opposite corner to the current one or placed on it pointing in the same direction? Should the filters be breaking the surface of the water or just moving the water?

I'll switch to two bulbs and reduce the lighting to 5-6 hrs this evening. Is that permanent or can I ramp things up slowly to increase growth?

I've had a look on APF, are you talking about the liquid plant nutrition?
The 500ml bottle according to the directions would only last half a month. I know its only £16 a month but is there a cheaper option? Such as mixing it myself? This is all very new to me I must admit so sorry if I'm asking some obvious questions, I just want to ensure I do things right while keeping the cost to a minimum.

I can't afford to move from my current CO2 supply to FE based.
If i remove the DIY I imagine that by placing the diffusers with more flow across the bottom I will get a faster CO2 dispertion rate? Or is there another, better way to disperse the CO2 from the disposable bottles rather than using the tetra plan diffusers?

Thanks for the help so far, I can see this getting very consuming, bring on the challenge!

 

[hinch]

Re: Juwel Rio 300 - First planted tank - Upgrade to T5's

this stuff http://www.aquariumplantfood.co.uk/fert ... fills.html

£16 for a 2 litre supply that would be enough for your tank for about 2 months only real cheaper option is fully mixing your own EI.

you can ramp your lighting up over time in intensity though certainly not really duration 5-6 hours max at a time. remember increasing the light though to those levels will increase the demand for ferts and co2 through the roof which you simply cannot supply until you go with pressurised co2. what you've got is a crap tonne of light which if you're not careful can only end badly for you.

you need more flow than the standard juwel internal (its pretty crap) so thats either more internal filters or cheap power heads or something. the filter off your little 100 litre will help but its again not got enough grunt its still going to leave you with dead spots where youll get die off due to lack of ferts and co2.

for distributing more co2 around the tank perhaps buy a small atomiser and put it directly below your filter outlet so the powerhead distributes the co2 around the tank for you though tbh swapping to a FE based system isn't that costly can be done for sub 100 quid if you shop around. diffusers should always be at the full depth of the tank regardless of co2 source as the co2 disolves the longer it stays in the water. smaller bubbles from the atomiser and more depth is a good start.

 

[AndyVox]

Re: Juwel Rio 300 - First planted tank - Upgrade to T5's

Right I'll get some of that ordered today. £16 every two months is ok!

Right two extra internal filters it is until I can find a suitable external replacement.
In terms of placement is it just a case of ensuring there are no dead spots with no flow?
Curious still regarding the flow from the filters, should they be breaking the suface of the water or just moving the water around?

The atomiser wont work with my disposibles because they aren't pressurised, well they are I imagine but they are almost like deodorant cans, on or off. The diffusers it has with it hold the CO2 in the chamber and allow it to difuse slowly almost like a bottle with the bottom cut off and a pipe into the top to supply the CO2 in an on off fashion. I wondered if I could place it with alot of water current from the filter outlet below it to increase the rate in which is diffuses.

 

[spyder]

Re: Juwel Rio 300 - First planted tank - Upgrade to T5's

You don't want to agitate the surface too much as this will help gassing off your co2. You want to keep it in the water.

As with setting up for flow. A spraybar from the back wall facing forward is usually the best approach in larger rectangle tanks. You need to try and keep the flow working together as apposed to working against each other, so if your internal flow goes from right to left, you don't want to put another on the left going to the right.

 

[hinch]

Re: Juwel Rio 300 - First planted tank - Upgrade to T5's

eliminate the deadspots is the goal if all the plants are swaying then you're getting good fert and co2 distribution.
as for breaking the surface i'd say don't bother with all of them just perhaps use the built in internal as you currently are.

Think i'd also rip out the co2 completely and go for just ferts and lowered lighting levels for now until you can get a proper co2 system setup to compensate for the immense amount of light you have. (put it in perspective I run less light than you on a tank 3x the size!)

 

[AndyVox]

Re: Juwel Rio 300 - First planted tank - Upgrade to T5's

I've put in a powerhead that I'd forgotten all about and now have decent flow across all plants, I've managed to conceal it quite well too.
I've cut down the light time to 6 hours, and reduced the output to two bulbs. Hoping when I get home from work everything is still ok with the changes.
I'm putting in a blue night led tonight and currently I'm pricing up an purchasing the bits for a FE co2 system.
My APF ferts were dispatched today too so it's well on the way.
Is there anything else I can do to aid healthy growth at the moment?
I've got a couple of leaves that have holes in I imagine from the lack of light with the T8's or maybe a lack of nutrients?

I also chopped away at the java fern on the left so I'll get a picture later.

 

[hinch]

Re: Juwel Rio 300 - First planted tank - Upgrade to T5's

more likely lack of nutrients and co2 than lack of light.

 

[spyder]

Re: Juwel Rio 300 - First planted tank - Upgrade to T5's

I've got a couple of leaves that have holes in I imagine from the lack of light with the T8's or maybe a lack of nutrients?

This would be Co2 issues due to the increased lighting. Good move on reducing the length and intensity.

Don't fall into the "need more light" problem. Once you have figured out reasonable light you can push your boundries a little, but more light = faster things will go wrong if something is missing or out of balance.

 

[AndyVox]

Re: Juwel Rio 300 - First planted tank - Upgrade to T5's

Ok so I've made a few adjustments since my last last post.
I now have a koralia and a FE co2 setup. Thought I'd drop a few photos on as an update. Loads of growth going on.

Only issue really has been the white spot breakout, then I used the treatment and it destroyed my vallis, it's come back but some is very brown. Any ideas on how I can resolve this?

 

[AndyVox]

Re: Rearrange, new bits and bring on the HC challenge

So a few more upgrades, interal filter is gone, external in its place with a Hydor 300w inline heater. Got the flow perfect using the koralia, I'm really happy with it at last. I had a move around and went shopping for some HC, trying to grow a carpet

Apologies for the iPhone pics. Not tooooo bad, should probably make an effort to use the DSLR, but getting ur the laptop and plugging it in is so much harder.

I feel it's gone from something wild out of control and not very well thought out to a decent spec and layout. Any hints or tips to make it look better would be appreciated. Also any tips for the HC would be great, I put it n 4 hrs ago and it's bubbling away already, and as you can see my koralia is pointed at it above the co2 diffuser.

 

[AndyVox]

Re: Rearrange, new bits and bring on the the HC challenge

Quick update:

The HC is growing well and seems to be spreading slowly. It's pearling towards the end of the photo period so I must be doing it right!


In January my tank looked like this! Shocking!

 

[johnski]

Re: Rearrange, new bits and bring on the the HC challenge

Great transformation Andy. Keep us updated on the HC, should look great when it fills in.

 

[AndyVox]

Re: Rearrange, new bits and bring on the the HC challenge

Great transformation Andy. Keep us updated on the HC, should look great when it fills in.

Thanks! I hope so although the angels wont stop nibbling it. I'm hoping after the growth over the last 10 days it'll probably take a month to grow in fully. Maybe more.

I'm fairly new to all this so my thought was to grow things a little wild, experiment with trimming, growth rates etc then rip it all out and start again with the knowledge I'll have gained. However the more I look at tanks on here the more I feel I need to learn before I can create something stunning.

 

[AndyVox]

Re: Rearrange, new bits and bring on the the HC challenge

Rescape time.

Before:

During:

new bogwood. See where this is going?

After, just waiting for it to go dark and the water to clear then I'll get another.

 

[AndyVox]

GoodWood - first planted tank adventure

Some updated photos taken.

Comments welcomed.