Apt Sky with high Tds

[babator]

Hello ...When I adjust 2.5gh water with apt sky..the recommended rate for me is 5 gr. Tds rate is 50 ppm.. the thing I wonder is why Apt sky keeps TDS high..

 

[bazz]

I'm not 100% sure what you are asking here, but APT Sky contains Calcium and Magnesium which will raise the GH.

 

[babator]

Burada ne sorduğundan %100 emin değilim ama APT Sky, GH'yi artıracak Kalsiyum ve Magnezyum içeriyor.

Yes bazz i know.. 12 ca 3.5 mg when I target (5 gr) loading. And the water value suddenly increases by 50 ppm. tank 40 ppm sky then becomes 90 ppm... gh 3

 

[Zeus.]

Whats the Volume of the tank and how much was you trying to increase your gh?

if you was increasing it 0.5gh the TDS will increase by about 12 tds


So for every 1.0gh increase the TDS will increase approximately 25tds

APT Sky is a blend of salts so every 5g will be slightly different as well

 

[bazz]

Yes bazz i know.. 12 ca 3.5 mg when I target (5 gr) loading. And the water value suddenly increases by 50 ppm. tank 40 ppm sky then becomes 90 ppm... gh 3

Well, I do not know for sure and I stand to be corrected, but APT as far as I know do not divulge what Sky consists of, but it may well be also adding Sulphate and/or Chloride which will also increase the TDS.

 

[babator]

Tankın hacmi ne kadar ve GH'yi ne kadar arttırmaya çalışıyordun?

eğer 0.5gh'yi artırıyorsanız TDS yaklaşık 12 tds artacaktır

View attachment 228643
Yani her 1,0 gh artışta TDS yaklaşık 25 tds artacaktır

APT Sky bir tuz karışımıdır, bu nedenle her 5g biraz farklı olacaktır

Tankım 85 LT, hedefim 2.5 dgh. Bu hedefe ortalama 5 gr dozla ulaşabiliyorum..tds aniden 50 ppm artıyor..

 

[dw1305]

Hi all,

but APT as far as I know do not divulge what Sky consists of, but it may well be also adding Sulphate and/or Chloride which will also increase the TDS.

There will be always an anion (Cl-, SO4--, NO3-, PO4--- etc) added as well as the cation (Ca++, Mg++, K+).

cheers Darrel

 

[Zeus.]

but it may well be also adding Sulphate and/or Chloride which will also increase the TDS.

Correct. The data sheets on APT SHY gave us limited data

However the IFC calculator does account for your choice of salt and does account all the cations and Anions 'Cl and SO4' and does the maths for the increase in TDS. However when we clone it it doesn't clone the trace elements, so there will also be an increase in TDS with them also, however given there concentrations this will be minor IMO

 

[babator]

Aslında emin değilim ve düzeltilebilirim ama bildiğim kadarıyla APT Sky'ın nelerden oluştuğunu açıklamıyor ama Sülfat ve/veya Klorür de ekliyor olabilir ki bu da TDS'yi artıracaktır.

Anladım, teşekkür ederim.🙏

 

[Zeus.]

Tankım 85 LT, hedefim 2.5 dgh. Bu hedefe ortalama 5 gr dozla ulaşabiliyorum..tds aniden 50 ppm artıyor..

Translated -My tank is 85 LT, my target is 2.5 dgh. I can reach this target with an average dose of 5 gr..tds suddenly increases by 50 ppm..


So increasing 85l of water by 2.5gh adds another 59 TDS when we use SO4 salts


When we use CL salts it increases the TDS by 47

APT Sky will probably be a blend of both 🤷‍♂️

 

[Zeus.]

Anladım, teşekkür ederim.

Rica ederim

 

[bazz]

Hi all,

There will be always an anion (Cl-, SO4--, NO3-, PO4--- etc) added as well as the cation (Ca++, Mg++, K+).

cheers Darrel

Just out of interest, are Chelates not an option?

 

[Zeus.]

are Chelates not an option?

I think the Chelates increase the TDS as well
when we target an Fe 5ppm for example - pick a high ppm for Fe as with trace amounts it adds very little

comparison of Fe 11% DTPA and Solufeed Sodium free




Obvoisly the Solufeeds sodium free abouts nearly double the TDS compared to the Fe 11% DPTA as the extra trace elements in the Solufeed adds th extra

 

[Oldguy]

I think the Chelates increase the TDS as well

The chelated ion containing Iron will be negatively charged and therefore will have a positive ion (Na or K) to balance the charge. People need to google the chemical formulas.

As an aside why are people concerned about TDS values? Hydrogen carbonate and alkalinity I can understand. With EI dosing you can stand your spoon up in the tank water.

 

[bazz]

People need to google the chemical formulas.

Unfortunately not all of us are blessed with the aptitude to decipher chemical formulas and physics equations, and as such it is part of the reason why we come here to the forum, for help, to deliberate, to share knowledge and most of all, to learn.

As an aside why are people concerned about TDS values?

I personally think TDS is a fairly simple and reasonably accurate way to keep a check on certain parameters when fiddling around with, and remineralising RO water, a consistent recipe should equate to a consistent TDS reading. I also probably would not so easily have realised my new substrate was leaching vast amounts of Calcium and Magnesium (and possibly Potassium) without a TDS meter, apart from being cumbersome, titration does not bode well for me being slightly colour blind.

Hydrogen carbonate and alkalinity I can understand.

That is the easy bit, you either add them or you don't.

With EI dosing you can stand your spoon up in the tank water.

My Eirmotus would not survive many days under those parameters.

Cheers!

 

[Zeus.]

With EI dosing you can stand your spoon up in the tank water.

😂, On my 500l my TDS by the end off the week of EI dosings was about 1000 TDS, tap water had about 120ppm Ca to start with

 

[dw1305]

Hi all,

I personally think TDS is a fairly simple and reasonably accurate way to keep a check on certain parameters when fiddling around with, and remineralising RO water, a consistent recipe should equate to a consistent TDS reading.

That is why I like (and use) it. Conductivity is a <"plug and play"> measurement.

cheers Darrel

 

[Happi]

Well, I do not know for sure and I stand to be corrected, but APT as far as I know do not divulge what Sky consists of, but it may well be also adding Sulphate and/or Chloride which will also increase the TDS.

We can be quite certain that it doesn't contain SO₄. The calcium and magnesium are likely sourced from CaCl₂ and MgCl₂, while the micronutrients are probably derived from either chlorides or chelated forms such as EDTA/DTPA. Sulfates in such a solution would pose a stability issue.

 

[Andy Pierce]

Just out of interest, are Chelates not an option?

Yes. For example if you used Fe(III)-citrate, the counterion would be citrate(3-). In this case the counterion is organic rather than inorganic. You can also get Fe(III)-EDTA-K (e.g. Kalifer products from Solufeed) where the counterion is K+ instead of Na+, where you were probably going to add some K+ as fertiliser anyway.

 

[Oldguy]

Eirmotus

If you keep sensitive fish then a truly inert substrate and careful water parameters are important. I would not thought such fish would be suitable for a tank devoted to plant growth.

titration does not bode well for me being slightly colour blind.

I used to work with a guy that was slightly colour blind, he was a genius at getting the right shade of grey at the end point. We were typically within half a drop of each other. Happy days now long gone.