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2000L tank EI Dosing with drip water change
- Thread starter Filip Krupa
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- ei dosing
Filip Krupa
Member
Thats stunning Edvet! Magazine cover stuff
With the plc solution as well as controlling lights, CO2, wavemakers, fertz dosing you could also get it to do the water emptying. Either by opening the inlet valve for say 10 minutes each day letting waste water overflow or pump out for 10 minutes then top up for 10 minutes, easy peasy in a plc.
Also could include some element of safety in that if no water was exiting overflow ie blocked by plants or water level got too high could sound and alarm, run a drain pump do lots of things as much as you can imagine. Could put water leak sensor as well to detect overflows.
Zeus with his tank replaced simple smart switches with a PLC performing quite clever stuff all in order to make operation and maintenance simple. My plc is now in holiday mode, reduced light level, reduced light times, reduced co2, reduced ferts so tank runs slowly whilst I am away. Easy did water, tidy up, switch to holiday mode. Done.
Something to seriously consider to make things easier.
Also could include some element of safety in that if no water was exiting overflow ie blocked by plants or water level got too high could sound and alarm, run a drain pump do lots of things as much as you can imagine. Could put water leak sensor as well to detect overflows.
Zeus with his tank replaced simple smart switches with a PLC performing quite clever stuff all in order to make operation and maintenance simple. My plc is now in holiday mode, reduced light level, reduced light times, reduced co2, reduced ferts so tank runs slowly whilst I am away. Easy did water, tidy up, switch to holiday mode. Done.
Something to seriously consider to make things easier.
wolfewill
Member
What size is the reactor or reactors? And how many inline diffusers are you going to use? I have a 330 g tank with two reactors in series (each ~24 inches long by 4 inches in diameter), with four inline diffusers ahead of that. I also have a devoted Sicce 5.0 pump to run it..... and this is maxed out to achieve the pH drop I need and the flow to distribute it all throughout the tank.
Also you MUST read Zeus's journal for his 500litre tank, before embarking on such a monster tank.
I think he must be about the only person on this forum who has succeeded in getting a large volume (500 litre) high tech, high light planted tank successfully up and running first time. A lot of people have large tanks, but not CO2 injected. He has recorded many mistakes he made, spending wasted, ideas that sound good but were in fact bad, but learnt from mistakes and worked round them. Designed in many things to keep it simple stupid (KISS) and make working with the tank easier and simple. Well thought out and implemented.
It clearly wasn't cheap (500 litre will not be cheap), cost a lot of time, a lot if time and a lot of time & money and a few changes of underwear but I think the result shows what can be achieved. Even more amazing is the tank is a room divider so can't hide any crappyness at back of tank, all is visible in view.
I think he must be about the only person on this forum who has succeeded in getting a large volume (500 litre) high tech, high light planted tank successfully up and running first time. A lot of people have large tanks, but not CO2 injected. He has recorded many mistakes he made, spending wasted, ideas that sound good but were in fact bad, but learnt from mistakes and worked round them. Designed in many things to keep it simple stupid (KISS) and make working with the tank easier and simple. Well thought out and implemented.
It clearly wasn't cheap (500 litre will not be cheap), cost a lot of time, a lot if time and a lot of time & money and a few changes of underwear but I think the result shows what can be achieved. Even more amazing is the tank is a room divider so can't hide any crappyness at back of tank, all is visible in view.
Too kind Ian, But thanks
. I did have lots of help from active members and threads to read, many a sleepless night thinking it though all the same.
Filip Krupa
Member
Reactors in planning stage. Is there any you recommed?
4 inline diffusers?! Fak! Should I be aiming for 6 then? Thats nuts...
My setup will be sumped so I presume plugging the diffusers and reactors to return pump line would do?
I will defo add powerheads to increase distribution.
Filip Krupa
Member
Thanks Ian.
Some good points on the usefulness of a PLC, those plus Zeus' previous points are making me consider one now (holiday mode sounds sweet...).
Also, noted on reading Zeus' journal. Im gathering plenty of homework already!
Just FYI, I am not expecting to beat Zeus at making a 4x larger tank than his work right away 😱, that impossible with my half assed attitude to un-exciting parts of the build. I will probably have a go at high tech, fail or somewhat succeed then turn to mid tech.
And I am fully prepared to take some serious b*tch slapping from you guys for cutting corners.
I am already bracing myself for getting bashed over my planned substrate, which is black blasting sand plus root tabs...
Some good points on the usefulness of a PLC, those plus Zeus' previous points are making me consider one now (holiday mode sounds sweet...).
Also, noted on reading Zeus' journal. Im gathering plenty of homework already!
Just FYI, I am not expecting to beat Zeus at making a 4x larger tank than his work right away 😱, that impossible with my half assed attitude to un-exciting parts of the build. I will probably have a go at high tech, fail or somewhat succeed then turn to mid tech.
And I am fully prepared to take some serious b*tch slapping from you guys for cutting corners.
I am already bracing myself for getting bashed over my planned substrate, which is black blasting sand plus root tabs...
I went down a similar route in theory only, I read
The Soil Substrate Planted Tank - a How to Guide...
Tom's Bucket O' Mud - The End
Then
How to Mineralize Soil Substrates?
Then it all made sense substrate wise, great threads as well.
Filip Krupa
Member
Thanks again Zeus! More homework reading for when Im at work (?)
Seriously. Love it!
Seriously. Love it!
wolfewill
Member
I've done that to avoid gurgling from undissolved gas trapped in the reactors. I don't like the noise and the inline diffusers can only deliver so much gas until the bubbles get too big to dissolve, even with the high dwell time of the large reactors. I have a GLA gang kit of four bubble counters hooked up to four Up Aqua 16/22 mm diffusers. The reactors are diy - about 24 inches long by 4 inches in diameter, made of PVC. They run in series, and with all the head created by the hoses, diffusers and reactors, I needed a devoted pump to return it to the tank. This CO2 line pressure is 40 psi, and the bubble counters are useless to count the bubbles 'cause they have to be on in excess of what is possible to count.... maybe 200 bubble per minute from each??
Oh, and dropping the pH in a tank of 330 gallons takes considerable time. The good news is that the CO2 doesn't gas off as quickly as for a smaller tank. But that is dependent on surface to volume ratio. My tank is 6 ft by 3 ft by 30 inches high. The pH cycles from about 7.0 to 6.3 in about two hours and back again slowly at night.
This system was way more than I had expected I would need. I originally had the two reactors running separately off of two separate filters (both Eheim 1500XLs). But they reduced the flow so much that the CO2 wasn't getting down below about 12 inches from the top of the tank. The pH would be killing livestock in the top 6 inches and not falling at all below a foot. I now have the two reactors on 45 degree angles, in series and on a devoted pump line (the Sicce 5.0), the two 1500s and a Fluval FX6. This really works well: No micro bubbles in the tank, no gurgling, huge growth from plants and very healthy livestock. It took a lot of trial error to get to this point but I finally got it to where I want it.
Edvet
Member
I got a 1.4 pH drop in a soft water 400 gallon tank with a homemade reactor driven by a separate Eheim pump (2000l/hour), reactor was 120 cm long and 8 cm across.
Citrix
Member
Thats crazy amount of co2, what is your water KH and how many BPS ure runing?Thats deep, mine has 500mm water depth, tank is 600mm deep and with hindsight I wish I had only done it with 400mm water depth, as keeping the carpet going is hard with deep water getting the light right is hard eg carpet struggles so up the lights, CO2 consumption increases with the higher light then the CO2 levels fluctuate then the taller plants melt with the higher light and fluctuating CO2 levels.
Have a braced tank myself and getting reach to the substrate is tricky, hood really needs to be off, how your going to reach the centre of tank substrate level if your 7 foot tall you would still struggle IMO.
I use 6.5Kg of CO2 a month with a high [CO2] light yellow to clear on the Drop Checker (DC)
Weighed up that option when I did mine and they sound good but they can be hit and miss with there connections. PLC can be used to control your dosing pumps, auto topup, dim lights and temp control even pH, but not cheap. But once setup easy to change settings Via PC or smartphone once programmed via 'LOGO! softcomfort'. Plus we do have a DIY Wizard 'Ian_m' on the forum helped me loads with mine
wolfewill
Member
That's a terrific drop, and the reactor volume is about the same as mine. What is the KH of your make up water? And what kind of diffuser(s) were you using? Do you know the flow rate into the tank? This is great! I've never had anyone with which to bounce these numbers around. There are very few people with these sizes of tanks that are willing to discuss it.
Pretty hard kH is 8+, TDS is 400.
as for BPS
dont think my CO2 uptake is very efficient but 'Clive' did use to use a lot of CO2 in his Big tank of the same order of magnitude
Edvet
Member
It was soft water, i never measure KH, but i was adding 90 liter RO/day, but also using EI.
No diffusors, just direct CO2 in the reactor, the flow in the reactor is slower because of the added diameter, it should take the bubbles down a bit but dissolve it all before it leaves the reactor tube, I used clear acrylic so i could see the behaviour of the bubbles. CO2/air that gets trapped at the top side was sucked away by an airhose size tube to a venturi just above the reactor and brought back into the waterstream that way. The clear reactor lets you adjust the flow to optimal function.
I made a prototype first ,it's stil in a shed, i can show a pic tomorrow.
No diffusors, just direct CO2 in the reactor, the flow in the reactor is slower because of the added diameter, it should take the bubbles down a bit but dissolve it all before it leaves the reactor tube, I used clear acrylic so i could see the behaviour of the bubbles. CO2/air that gets trapped at the top side was sucked away by an airhose size tube to a venturi just above the reactor and brought back into the waterstream that way. The clear reactor lets you adjust the flow to optimal function.
I made a prototype first ,it's stil in a shed, i can show a pic tomorrow.
Edvet
Member
Edvet
Member
Aye, venturi causes low pressure area sucking whatever it can suck back into the flow, water if no gas is present, or gas which isn't dissolved.
The venturi part can be a bit wider, as long as it is less the the size before and behind, it needs to speed up the flow, thus causing the lower pressure.
The venturi part can be a bit wider, as long as it is less the the size before and behind, it needs to speed up the flow, thus causing the lower pressure.
