• You are viewing the forum as a Guest, please login (you can use your Facebook, Twitter, Google or Microsoft account to login) or register using this link: Log in or Sign Up

Traces question

Joined
27 Oct 2009
Messages
2,919
Location
Cumbria
which traces do you base your ei recipe on if you don't know what the exact recipe is? I have some AE+ trace which has been sitting about for a while because I needed to use some others up first and now AE don't sell it so can't find the mix with water formula. Tried AE but they can't remember.
 
Honestly, you just go to the garden center or hydroponics outlet and get any box of trace that is cheap.
I used GardenDirect chelated trace mix for years without any problems. As long as the basics are covered, Fe, Mn, Zn, Mo, B and Cu, then just call it good. Any trace sold by our sponsors will be a good buy and will work. If the mix contains Mg then more power to you. I f you only feel comfortable with brand names then get any of the commercial mixes like TPN, Flourish, Ferka, Placebo, whatever - just be sure to add 3X as much as what the bottle suggests if you are dealing with a CO2 enriched tank, as these are all mostly water.

Cheers,
 
Should clear up Clive I already have the traces just not sure what's actually in there. I guess it will be just the same as the majority of dry traces sold. When I look at dosing calculators they always seem to specify the type. Csm-b etc so wasn't sure which to go off. Most reckon 10 gram in 250ml then 2.5ml per 50ltr does that sound right? I'll keep an eye out for the cheaper garden centre ones, nice tip for future. 0g Chelated Trace Element Mix (TNC Trace, CSM+B)

250 ml Water then 2.5 ml per 50ltr does that sound about right? I will keep an eye out for the cheaper garden stuff in future though, nice tip.
 
Way back, when the first of us were freed from The Matrix, CSM+B was, at the time a cheap and widely available trace element mix due to the fact that it was a popular product with hydroponic gardeners. So, Paul Sears & Kevin Conlin included it in their original PMDD (Poor Mans Dosing Drops) formula. There was no special analysis used to determine what the ratio and percentage of elements should be in the trace mix. The choice to use CSM+B was simply a matter of economy, expedience and convenience. In fact, at first it started out as just using CSM, but later it decided that Boron was needed, that's what the "B" in CSM+B is. In areas where only CSM and not the "+B" was available, Boron could be added by simply adding small amounts of a white powder detergent additive product known as Borax, which is a hydrated form of Sodium Borate (Na2B4O7)

People who don't know this history assume that the trace mix formula of CSM+B is some kind of template for success and should not be deviated from. This is a false assumption. Because of the way trace elements are used by plants, any chelated trace element mix that covers the basics I mentioned, works. Some mixes will have more or less of any of the metals, but that doesn't matter. The most important of these metals is Fe, which is 10X or even 100X more necessary than the other metals. Therefore, Fe is used as a proxy for the other elements. When you look at the ingredient list of any trace mix, the Iron content is the most important. If the Fe content is not as high as CSM+B this is not a big deal, just add a little more of it to the dosing and carry on.

The amounts of trace element that are required by plants is so minute that it really is not worth stressing over. The micronutrients concentration levels just have to be non-zero. If the Fe content is too low, or if the dosing level is too low then you will see yellowing in young leaves (assuming Magnesium and Nitrogen levels are adequate). If this happens then just add more and by fixing the Fe content, the other elements will automatically be taken care of.

Because of this simple procedure of observation, the recipe you propose is fine to begin with. Monitor the color of new leaves and make adjustments from there if necessary.

Cheers,
 
Cheers Bud, I dose the macros at EI level so should be covered. No problems with young leaves at the minute so I guess every things fine. I have been mixing 10 gram per 250ml and dosing 10ml, being the measure in the lid of my dosing container for easiness. I bought the traces when I didn't need them really to keep postage costs down rather than having to buy other items or paying p&p for just one item but by the time I needed to use them AE stopped selling it so wasn't sure if it was the same mix as the majority of others sold.
 
Back
Top