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Spray bar or not?

Joined
11 Sep 2018
Messages
55
Location
East Midlands
My 60ltr. tank is suffering BBA and poor plant growth, it's looking pretty sad just now. I'm aware that the Fluvial 106 filter is probably not giving sufficient flow around the whole tank to distribute the CO2 (it was the recommended filter when I purchased the set up) So, I'm thinking of upgrading to the Fluvial 207 filter for greater flow. The question is, should I add a spray bar or not? It is suggested that a spray bar would reduce the filter efficiency with regards to output volumes. Any informed advice will be gratefully accepted. Thanks
 
Hello,
According to the specs, the Fluval 106 is rated at 550 LPH, which is near enough the 10X rule to be muscular enough for a 60L tank. It's not clear from your post whether you had been using a spraybar with the 106. If not, why not try a spraybar before spending more money? Perhaps your current flow distribution method is the problem. Perhaps there is too much media in the filter blocking it's flow. Perhaps you are using too much light. Perhaps your CO2 dissolution method is inefficient, and on and on...
It's not always the best path to throw more flow at the tank - although better flow does give a wider margin of error. Since the flow rating is sufficient, however, you may want to think about investigating the other possibilities first.

Cheers,
 
Thanks for the replies. In response I can say that the filter output was checked recently and found to be in spec. I do a WC of 10ltrs. per week. A daily dose of CO2 supermarket 'all in one' fert. is added. Lighting has always been a conundrum. I can alter the intensity with the controller, but have no idea how any useful measurement fig. could be obtained for comparisons with any recommendations. Its hit and miss to be honest. I'm sure a spray bar will help, but can the filter do the business? Previously, a contributor advised the plants should all be swaying in the flow. The 106 will never achieve that in my opinion.
 
Thanks for the replies. In response I can say that the filter output was checked recently and found to be in spec. I do a WC of 10ltrs. per week. A daily dose of CO2 supermarket 'all in one' fert. is added. Lighting has always been a conundrum. I can alter the intensity with the controller, but have no idea how any useful measurement fig. could be obtained for comparisons with any recommendations. Its hit and miss to be honest. I'm sure a spray bar will help, but can the filter do the business? Previously, a contributor advised the plants should all be swaying in the flow. The 106 will never achieve that in my opinion.
Well, as discussed, it is the sum of all things that you do that result in success or failure. Since we do not have either an image or a sketch of your setup it's difficult to assess the effectiveness of your flow/distribution. The lighting is actually not that difficult to manage if it is LED that has a controller. Simply reduce the output to about 20%-30%, at least while you battle the algae. As mentioned by Conort2, massively increase your water change frequency and quantity as much s possible and either spot dose the affected hardscape areas and remove affected leaves. Connect a spraybar and place it in the center near the surface as discussed in the post #11 in the flow thread Water flow in the planted aquarium?
If the filter is packed with media then remove about 2/3rds of the biomedia or replace with foam.
Ensure that the CO2 is turned on earlier than the lights, such that the DC is lime green when the lights first turn on. You can also measure the pH to see if you are able to achieve a 1 unit drop from the natural pH of the tank water to lights on.
If all these things are done and if the BBA returns, then moving up to the next filter model may be the answer.

Cheers,
 
Quote: If the filter is packed with media then remove about 2/3rds of the biomedia or replace with foam.
Curious why you advise this, what is behind it?
Quote: You can also measure the pH to see if you are able to achieve a 1 unit drop from the natural pH
Forgive my ignorance, what is meant by '1 unit'?
Will take advice on light level and WCs. (CO2 does come on ahead of light already Thanks)
 
Quote: If the filter is packed with media then remove about 2/3rds of the biomedia or replace with foam.
Curious why you advise this, what is behind it?
Quote: You can also measure the pH to see if you are able to achieve a 1 unit drop from the natural pH
Forgive my ignorance, what is meant by '1 unit'?
Will take advice on light level and WCs. (CO2 does come on ahead of light already Thanks)
Re bio media: if your filter volume is say 5 litres and you loaded it with 5 litre Seachem matrix or some ceramic etc then that means you should remove about 3 litres of media from the filter. The reason for this is that media reduces the water flow. More media equal less flow. Les flow means algae problems

Re PH unit, say your aquarium water degassed PH is 7. You should aim for PH 6 (1 unit drop) on light on and stay there for as long as light are one. If your PH difference is less than 1 unit and or if your PH fluctuate during the time when lights are on this means algae problems.
 
By the way to measure PH you should use a digital pen or some controller with probe. Generic aquarium PH tests using drops won’t work here as they are inaccurate and Have some colours on the chart identical..
 
Yes, as MrClockOff mentions, the typical biomedia creates hydrodynamic drag and saps energy from the filter throughput. The noodle (or rather the hollow cylindrical shaped) media is actually designed to reduce flow in order to allow the larger particles in the water to fall out of solution. These should be removed entirely as they have the largest negative effect on flow rate.

The parameter "pH" does not have units such as feet or ppm. That's because it is calculated using simple ratios. So as mentioned, this is just a generic way of referring to the measured values. You should have a read of the post Spray Bar and CO2 Diffuser placement confusion
as well as the rest of the thread for further information.

Cheers,
 
Hi all,
If the filter is packed with media then remove about 2/3rds of the biomedia or replace with foam.
Curious why you advise this, what is behind it?
There are a number of reasons, "plant / microbe nitrification" is <"much more efficient than "microbe only"> biofiltration, so the physical volume of biomedia required isn't as great.

The reason for the extra efficiency is partially the <"direct uptake of all forms of fixed nitrogen by the plants"> and partially their <"net oxygen production">. <"Dissolved oxygen"> is the parameter that limits nitrification in nearly all cases, so more flow helps by ensuring all the filter media is kept oxygenated.

Some media suppliers will talk about their media having simultaneous nitrification and denitrification in their filter media, but this is a <"ridiculous idea and I'm not going there">.

cheers Darrel
 
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