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dw1305

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Hi all,
This is probably what's happening your plants are adding extra CO2 at night and you already have a high level of CO2 in the photo period
That would be my guess. Because the blood haemoglobin transports both CO2 and Oxygen, it would depend on the <"(Bohr) Root Effect">, which differs between fish.

I've kept Poropanchax normani, but not in a CO2 added tank.
I see the killifish (some of them) gasping for air at the surface but only at night.
11 of the 20 fish died overnight.

I'm not pointing the finger, but in these circumstances I don't see why you didn't just turn the CO2 off? and then leave it off for a few days? If you are more worried about the effect on your plants (of having a short break in CO2), rather than killing the fish, I just don't find that acceptable.

cheers Darrel
 
Last edited:

Andrew T

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Yes, possibly the Amanos would have shown effects of excess ammonia.

I just know from my two recent tanks (both heavily planted) that with Tropica soil that it took a week and a half of 80%+ water changes to get the ammonia levels down to zero (and that is with fully matured 9 month old filter media), and you have Amazonia which puts out a lot more ammonia than Tropica soils. You've added the fish within inside two weeks of setting up the tank, so it was just a thought that ammonia leaching could still be an issue.
That’s true and I thought of that; Amazonia does leech lots of Ammonia; I’ve done huge daily water changes for more than a week before adding the CUC, and had absolutely 0 issues with them.
So days later, drew the conclusion that with a mature filter it should be no issues adding fish based on how great everything was going.
I have one possibility where all this started though considering the other batch of fish and shrimp is still alive and kicking:
Introducing livestock when co2 levels are low say before the photoperiod starts is the way to go in my opinion; that gives them time to accommodate to it slowly and that’s what I’ve done with the CUC.

This batch was introduced in the evening just because I didn’t want them in a bag overnight and I bought them after work.
After the drip acclimation, they were introduced . Could it be that the higher levels of co2 at that time have done more damage in that instance more than anything else and the health declined rapidly because of it?
Questions running through my head...
Don’t want to turn down the co2 rate just yet; Seems like a good level right now for both plants and the CUC.

If all inhabitants would have died then yes...one answer: ammonia...but things are looking more and more like co2 asphyxiation of frankly a weak fish.
Thats my opinion and I’m not saying its right:)
 

Andrew T

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I'm not pointing the finger, but in these circumstances I don't see why you didn't just turn the CO2 off? and then leave it off for a few days? If you are more worried about the effect on your plants (of having a short break in CO2), rather than killing the fish, I just don't find that acceptable.

cheers Darrel
Hi Darrel,
When I noticed the dead fish, the damage was already done. So I turned down the co2 just a notch while aerating the tank with the lily pipe out of the water in hopes that it will resolve the issue.
Had 2 other fish die in this time frame but things look to be back to normal for now.
We will see how it looks today after I’m back home from work.
Here’s another question : does well water contain more co2 than say city water and how does that affect the tank if any when performing a water change?
I know mineral levels can vary greatly in a well summer vs winter time but just throwing this out there...
 

dw1305

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Hi all,
does well water contain more co2
Yes, it could do. If the water was under-pressure, then it would be able to hold more dissolved gases, and there could be biological, or geological, processes that increased the CO2 content.
When I noticed the dead fish, the damage was already done. So I turned down the co2 just a notch while aerating the tank with the lily pipe out of the water in hopes that it will resolve the issue.
Had 2 other fish die in this time frame but things look to be back to normal for now.
That would be one reason for turning the CO2 off, it takes a variable out of the equation if there was something wrong with the fish and the CO2 levels were just a coincidence. I'm never going to be a CO2 user, for me the risks, to the fish you have a duty of care for, are too great.

cheers Darrel
 

Andrew T

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I guess co2 is trial and error and takes a bit of fiddling until you get the right amount for both fish and plants to be happy and sometimes there’s unfortunately casualties involved be it too much (dead fish)...too little (dead plants /algae or being limited to specific low tech plants only).
Maybe one day I’ll switch to low tech, who knows:)
 

Vijay_06

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5 Feb 2019
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SC, USA
That sucks. I hope the remaining fish pull through. I have never seen them before, but they look really good from the photo you has posted.

Do you mind checking the exact thickness of the ADA light screen? I don’t know if you or anyone else can answer this question - If evolution aqua light hanging kit is fitted at the back of a stand, will there be enough clearance between the back glass of the tank and the vertical legs of the light stand to fit the ADA light screen between them?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

Conort2

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This batch was introduced in the evening just because I didn’t want them in a bag overnight and I bought them after work.
After the drip acclimation, they were introduced . Could it be that the higher levels of co2 at that time have done more damage in that instance more than anything else and the health declined rapidly because of it?
One thing I always do when adding fish to a CO2 enriched tank is not turn the CO2 that day at all. This then gives the fish a chance to acclimate slowly to the co2 as it slowly increases the following day. Rather than going from an aquarium in your local shop where CO2 levels are low to then being dumped in water with high co2 levels.This along with the stress of being transported can be lethal. Leave the lights off the whole day too as this will allow the fish to settle and also will mean that your plants won’t actually have any demand for co2.

Adding fish to a CO2 enriched tank near the end of the photoperiod when co2 is at its highest is a recipe for disaster.

cheers

Conor
 

Andrew T

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About as much light as I get when I start to fish the rivers:)
A124C8FE-6B03-4EFE-82BE-4D9FFA12602F.jpeg

All inhabitants are well at the moment. No more unfortunate incidents..
 

Andrew T

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So I talked to the LFS owner, apparently these particular fish are wild caught and the survival rate is hit or miss with them.
He recommended going with some rasboras or other tetras that are hardier in the future. Espei / embers etc and not the delicate blue or chilli rasboras...

Unfortunately this particular store doesn’t have any kind of warranty on fish like the other one I use so I’ll take my fishy business to the other store because of things like these and the peace of mind. Having a 2 week money back guarantee in case something goes south is great especially since 15-20 fish at 5$ a piece isn’t exactly cheap...
Anyway...I’m glad the rest of the fish are well.
 

PARAGUAY

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Would have been informative to know the stores quarantine time for these fish from the store going off what was said
 

Andrew T

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Would have been informative to know the stores quarantine time for these fish from the store going off what was said
No one really knows. And if they tell you, how do you know it’s the truth?
Sometimes I wish I picked my own fish out of their tanks...
 

PARAGUAY

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No one really knows. And if they tell you, how do you know it’s the truth?
Sometimes I wish I picked my own fish out of their tanks...
Get to know the shop ask them can you see the quarantine area. Do it when it's a quiet time. If theres a issue with a purchase a good shop will advise beforehand.
 

Andrew T

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Everything doing mostly well. Some stringy diatom algae started appearing on the most upper branch within the moss strands. Looks like light related.
Turned the light down to 60% intensity.
I need to start trimming the Rotala and the carpet . Getting too big and it’s shading the nearby plants.
 

Andrew T

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Just when I thought everything couldn’t go any better...Ive started to have some issues with the CO2 and plants suffered as a result.
The Neo in tank diffuser was making some fine bubbles but also some large ones that shot straight to the surface.
I tried placing it under the flow, opposite side of it, put a small powerhead in to blow the bubbles across the carpet etc etc..I was just not getting enough co2 down to the bottom 1/3rd of the tank even with 5bps the fish were doing just fine which was kinda weird but ok; got to work...
Plants started to partially melt . So I got the GLA in-line diffuser out of the closet and installed it . Turned the co2 down to 3bps and the mist coming out of it was just crazy. Sprite water quite literally...
The fish started gasping for air so turned co2 and light off for the day. That was yesterday...
Today I started off with only 2bps and by the time it got to the middle of the photoperiod I noticed the fish were hanging around near the water surface.
I’m going to leave it like this hoping the fish will acclimate to the levels. The surface aeration is vigorous and I’m planning to leave it like that with the current injection rate.
The plants were literally pearling out of this world today so we will see in a few days if the melting continues or not but as far as in-line vs in-tank diffuser, the in-line wins hands down. Only downside is the not so clear water while the co2 is on but I’ll get over it.
That’s the story for today...
 

Nico Felici

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Bit of a niche question Andrew, will you be trimming the Pinnatifida's roots soon or keep them hanging longer and longer? I will be trimming my epiphyte's roots every now and then for aesthetic reasons but I wonder if that could be compromising?
 

Andrew T

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Bit of a niche question Andrew, will you be trimming the Pinnatifida's roots soon or keep them hanging longer and longer? I will be trimming my epiphyte's roots every now and then for aesthetic reasons but I wonder if that could be compromising?
Hi Nico,
I think they’ll stay like this for now until they reach the bottom I’ll see how I feel about them after that:)
 
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