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Light, Ferts, CO2 Matrix and Maintenance Expectations

waters

waters

Member
Joined
18 May 2014
Messages
34
Location
Bangkok, Thailand
Hi All,

I've posted earlier on my experiences with my first planted tank. It's been challenging so far, and I've learned a lot over the past few months.
http://www.ukaps.org/forum/threads/green-hair-algae-battle.33219/

Thinking about the fundamental matrix of 'Ferts, Light and CO2' I'm wondering what some general views might be on a strategy for planting, stocking and maintenance would be for a 60cm/2ft tank (17 gallons/64 litre) standard tank - that has two T5 24W Giesemann Midday 6000K suspended 5inches/12.5cm above an 11inch/28cm water column (the substrate is fairly deep) on a 7 hour photoperiod (from 2pm to 9pm).

Here are a few questions and goals:

1) Does this work out to about 2.8 watts per gallon?

2) Would this be considered a high-light tank? Medium? Where on the scale of low- to high-tech might this place the tank?

3) I'm aiming for 30-40% partial water changes every two weeks (or even less frequently). Does the amount of light I'm using automatically mean I'll have an increased maintenance schedule?

4) I have pressurized CO2 on a solenoid, and I think I have this under control. I'm able to set and maintain pretty much whatever bubbles per second rate I like (I have 4dK water and a drop checker). I turn the CO2 on about 2 hours before light (noon) and an hour before lights off (8pm). I also use an airstone from midnight to 8am, but only for the moment, as my planting is a bit thin.

5) For ferts, I'm hoping I can use a daily regime of Tropica Plant Nutrition with a mix 1:2 of +NP and regular TPN - at about about 0.8ml per day of the mix. This isn't EI - and my understanding of EI is that you supply a surplus of ferts and CO2, therefore limiting light, and then do weekly water changes to reduce the excess ferts. I'm hoping for a slightly lower maintenance schedule.

6) I've started using Flourish Excel at the recommend amount every day as a kind of 'background' algae control measure.

7) I've planted swords, vals, and what I think is Hottonia along with some Hygrophila corymbosa 'Siamensis'. I started with ADA Amazonia as the substrate, although in hindsight, and given how little I knew at the time, I'm wondering if this was wise. The big ammonia peak in the first 6 weeks means that you should ideally plant heavily with ADA from the start (if I've understood this correctly). Given the roller-coaster ride I've been on - I'm considering taking everything I've learned so far - and starting again, using Black Earth Premium from Cal Aqua (http://www.calaqualabs.com/BEP.html)

I'm not expecting to achieve the perfect planted aquarium, but I'm hoping that having removed my cheap Chinese (and over powered) LED unit, and starting with some generally well-known parameters, that I may be able to achieve better plant grown overall, and a somewhat more rewarding planted tank experience. 🙂

It may seem odd to start with light - but that's my 'known known' at the moment. I have seen a few tanks at the markets/shops where I buy most of my stuff with 4 x T5 24w above the same size tank, and at the moment (still suffering from algae shock), I simply don't understand how they can run a setup with this much light.

Any thoughts or suggestions greatly appreciated.

Best,

waters
 
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Hi waters, having read through this it seems you would like a high tech tank with low tech maintenance, which just doesnt happen at least until a tank is very mature and can handle a more relaxed regime.
If you are running 2 x 24w on a 60 then you can consider it high light which means daily 50% water changes to start with backing down over the course of a month to 50% per week.
Personally with a 60 I always do 90% water change, it so quick to do with small tanks the more the better.

50% water changes are not only done for ammonia spikes, it is because plants under high light create high volumes of waste which need exporting, especially during start up as plants transition from emersed form and some leaves will invariably die off or melt.

Ferts wise, 0.8ml a dail is very small with high light. Again this is just personal experience but i was adding 5 pumps tropica specialised daily on high tech 60's.

Flourish excel can melt vals so be careful with that.

Why change substrate if restarting? Just replant the amazonia and save the money for more plant mass.

best of luck.
 
Hi Iain,

Thanks very much for the reply. So 2 x 24W T5s definitely puts me in the high-tech category then?

Also thanks for the tropica tip. I'll add that to my 'thinking' 🙂

My vals melted when they were first planted, (6 months ago) but came back fine. So far 1ml of Excel per day is doing okay.

One of the reasons I'm wondering about restarting, is that around 3 months in, and after another clumsy attempt at clearing algae with a black-out, there was some kind of brown bloom that placed an entire carpet of small brown stuff on the substrate. Most of this is now 'below' the substrate, after having attempted to remove as much as I could. I have a feeling it may be contributing to root rot and slower growth of some of my pigmy chain sword.

Apologies for the very unscientific description of 'brown stuff' - but I had no idea what it was at the time, and had yet to join the forum.
 
no problem, all tanks with co2 added are high tech, but it would put you in the high light group, however with good co2 its a manageable amount of light.

Sounds like it was diatoms, its not uncommon on new tanks and tends to burns its self out after a while.
Generally if its below the substrate then it will just be detritus, this isnt normally an issue and you will get more issues from trying to clean it out. It shouldnt hinder growth of plants. It is far more likely the issues you have are co2 related. Look at your flow, co2 amount and distribution, up the ferts- use ei to eliminate one headache and/or raise the height of your lighting to decrease demand for co2. 99% of plant growth issues in high tech will be a co2 issue.

Keep it simple, forget about worrying about light level charts, what substrate you have, water tests etc... if you have algae reduce the light first off then look at co2/ flow and increase water changes. They are basic steps but the key to success most of the time.
 
Thanks again Iain - sounds good. 😉 Out of curiosity - roughly how many ml is '5 pumps tropica'. Here in Thailand they're still selling the older style Tropica bottles and I'm using a syringe to put it in the tank (after mixing 2:1 of the 'without' NP and 'with').
 
Hi all

Each pump of Tropica is 1.2 ml if I am not wrong...

I have a 60 liters with 2x24w T5 right now.... And without any doubt it is a high tech tank with EI dosing (dry salts) and pressurized CO2. My light fixture spent at least 3 or 4 months at least 45 cm above the tank during 7 hours/day. Believe me, if you are not very experienced you don't want more light. I never had any serious issue with algae but I could see in some places how BBA were trying to establish.

Lowering your lights means a serious research work on other issues: in my case what I did is to do it step by step (let's say 5 cm each time) and adjust the setup. I though that everything was fine tuned from the beginning, but with the first phase of lowering my lights I changed from normal inlets to spraybar, I revised seriously my PH drop, I changed to an inline atomizer, I changed the hardscape... Once gain because the tank was showing no good reaction to more light.

Two months ago I achieved 'my goal', having my light fixture just 15-20 cm above the water (at the LFS I was told that my mistake was having the lights so high and that in that tank and with that light, I should have it nearly touching the water)... Well, I did it. At that time I knew it was the worst advice, but I wanted to try the limit. I did it bu now the light is again 27 cm above the water. Why? Very simple. Co2 is never perfect. Plants grow and flow is not that good, thus co2 is sometimes not well diffused. Sometimes I travel for some days and the evaporation leaves my spraybar to close to the water surface with too much degassing, I make 2x50% WC weekly, but sometimes I just can do one... and of course, I have to learn much more.

So, if I'm not playing that hard with lights all this is not a problem. I have room for mistakes, time for my other tank.... Right now my tank is a high tech low-medium maintenance tank. 1-2 weekly WC (can be reduced to one if needed) and trimming once a month. That's all.

Jordi
 
Hi Jordi,

Thank you very much for the reply. Yours and Iain's were exactly what I was looking for - just trying to get a sense of things and what to expect, and what levers to pull (and where I currently sit on the scale of low- medium and high-tec in terms of light, ferts CO2 etc.).

I think I'm going to raise my lights a little, as based on the above, I'm probably not dosing enough ferts. I'll trying increasing ferts and CO2, and then slowly bring the lights down again if all is well.

Thanks again.

waters.
 
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