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Can theese cichlids go together?

Elroy

Elroy

Member
Joined
15 May 2022
Messages
67
Location
Denmark
Hi,

Im (hopefully) about to get some new inhabitants in my 350 liter tank. But I need some advice regarding the new inhabitants behavior towards each other.

Some old ones will leave and some new will move in. Those who will leave are 12 five banded barb. Those who will stay are 12 red phantom tetra, 9 Siamese algae eater, 9 Corydoras sterbai and 4 Bolivian Ram (Mikrogeophagus altispinosus).

Now I would like to add either 2-4 Firemouth cichlid (Thorichthys meeki) or 2-4 Rainbow cichlid (Herotilapia multispinosa). Best scenarie would be if I could get both the Firemouth cichlid and the Rainbow cichlid to go together with the Bolivian Ram , but I guess It will be overkill - or what do you say?

If needed, I could also drop the red phantom in order to get another pair of cichlids if the tank gets too overcrowded.

Cheers Elroy
 
Elroy said:
Firemouth cichlid and the Rainbow cichlid to go together with the Bolivian Ram
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I would say no. Both get pretty big and are Central American cichlids which have a fair amount more aggression than a South American dwarf, the rams wouldn’t do well. I’d recommend keyhole cichlids are maybe something like a guinacara if you’re dead set on having another medium sized cichlid in there.

Cheers
 
Firemouths aren't the most aggressive cichlids but can get to a decent size. We had a group of 5 in a 6 foot tank for about ten years when I was growing up and they got to 6 inches and were a real pain when breeding. I seem to remember they got replaced by ellioti's when they passed so my dad never learnt the lesson. Firemouths are an order of magnitude more aggressive than the Bolivian rams and not really a community fish unless you go for a central American community with bigger sturdy tankmates or just bigger fish in general.
I've always been a fan of the humble festivum. They can get to a reasonable size but are more timid than the average cichlid and quite graceful like pearl gouramis. The other species mentioned by Conort2 would make great replacements as well depending on how big your tank is.
 
Thanks for reply,

According to "Seriously Fish — Feeling fishy?" the Thorichthys meeki do have a maximum standard length of 10-12 cm and the Herotilapia multispinosa will typically have a standard length of 10 cm in a aquarium. If they tend to bully the Ram I can drop the Ram as long as the two others get along fine (Firemouth + Rainbow). Could that do well?

Cheers Elroy

​

 
@mort you came with a reply while I was typing, so I just saw it. Looks like I got to make a new choise. I will look more into the two mentioned by @Conort2 and do some more reading on the subject
 
Elroy said:
Thanks for reply,

According to "Seriously Fish — Feeling fishy?" the Thorichthys meeki do have a maximum standard length of 10-12 cm and the Herotilapia multispinosa will typically have a standard length of 10 cm in a aquarium. If they tend to bully the Ram I can drop the Ram as long as the two others get along fine (Firemouth + Rainbow). Could that do well?

Cheers Elroy

​

Click to expand...
They’ll do well with each other but you have corydoras which won’t do well with these cichlids. I think your current selection compatibility wise is perfect, I don’t see how the Central American cichlids fit in to be honest.

Cheers
 
Ok, seems that there are quite a few things to be aware of. Now I just read that Bolivian Rams and Rainbow Cichlid are compatible tank mates, as these two species share similar water parameters as well as exhibit similar temperaments. (Rainbow Cichlid (Herotilapia multispinosa): Care Guide | Fish Laboratory) So I guess my goal is to get one or two pair of Rainbow Cichlids. And the 12 five banded barb I got goes down the drain, so I need a replacement for them. Any suggestions what that could be - and how many?

Cheers Elroy
 
Are you not afraid these Herotilapias could harm your plants?
 
Yeah, I just got aware of the problem - or, what colud be a problem.

Didnt know that: (Rainbow cichlids eating plants?) + (H. Multispinosa or C. Panamensis experiences?)

A member from cichlid-forum say; "Right, Rainbows and plants. Rainbows will eat plants at times. The only plant I have known them leave is Java Fern. Pretty much anything else may well get nibbled. But.... Rainbows seem to prefer cucumber, courgette, marrow. Live Bloodworm and pretty much anything else. The other issue with Rainbows and plants is Rainbows will almost certainly not allow plants near their spawning site. Plants hide predators. They will not eat these plants, they will remove or destroy them. A common Rainbow strategy is to grab the base of the stem and barrel roll".

Well, seems like I get to reconsider again.

Thanks for input
 
Elroy said:
I just read that Bolivian Rams and Rainbow Cichlid are compatible tank mates,
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I find that hard to believe. I have kept both, and I wouldn't try keeping them together. Rainbows can be aggresive, and are much bigger than Bolivians,
I would think about Keyholes (as @Conort2 said) or Laetacaras. These also will be safer with your plants.
Edit;
Or Nannacara anomala. :)
 
Elroy said:
But I also looked at the Nannacara anomala - Golden Dwarf Cichlid. It looks interesting and might be the one Im going for. Whats best, a pair or 1 male/3 female?
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I've enjoyed a lot of fun with these small American cichlids, mostly Apistogrammas. In the end, I came to a view that a pair of them kept even in a big tank is ideal. I know, the tank looks rather empty at first spot, but observing them absolutely undisturbed, relaxed, leading a 'family life' was most revealing (they breed easily and pretty often).
 
Now its getting hard to pick the right Apistogramma. Quite a lot to choose from. Must be over 90 species, I think. Is the Nannacara anomala from the Apistogramma family or is it another species?

@_Maq_ Which pair of Apistogramma did you have?
 
Elroy said:
Is the Nannacara anomala from the Apistogramma family or is it another species?
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Apistogramma is a genus. Nannacara anomala is in a different tribe to apistogramma, but they share the same family called Cichlidae.

I have been a bit doubtful about the Aquarium Laboratory website because it is not clear who the authors are, and wouldn't be persuaded by the information that they present.

If I was looking for advice with relation to Cichlids compatibility, then I would turn to a breeder and hobbyist who has compiled detailed records across numerous species of this family. Alexander Williamson is the person that lots of people tend to turn to. He is very friendly and helpful. His YouTube channel is called - The Secret History Living in Your Aquarium. He normally sets aside a few minutes to help people at the start of each chat stream, and sometimes has enough time to go into a good level of depth, or email him. He has done quite a bit with all of the species' that you are looking at.
 
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Ive kept keyhole with rams with kribs and aquidens curviceps(sheepshead arcara) in 5x2x2 tank plants were left alone. only problem i had was female keyhole chichlid killed her mate after the fry had hatched. The kribs and acara both spawned non were overly agressive living with tetras Aires tetra neons tetra and cherry barbs and checker barbs.
 
Elroy said:
@_Maq_ Which pair of Apistogramma did you have?
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Quite a few of them. They all behave similarly. You can choose by an appearance. Rather soft and acidic water is required. Living in pairs or harems. They do not damage plants. An important difference from Nannacara anomala is that they accept only live food. Also, Nannacara anomala tolerates neutral water. Less demanding. But their family life is less interesting because only the female looks after the fry. In the case of Apistogramma, the male does not participate directly but protects the outer perimeter.
You can also try some small West African cichlids (Pelvicachromis sp.). They mostly accept artificial food and both parents protect the fry together.
 
Thanks a lot for your replys. I will lok into Mr. Alexander Williamson´s YouTube channel for more info.

Wondering if you can say how big a Apistogramma territory got to be, as a minimum? My tank is 350 liter (121x51x66) and I wonder if it is big enough for 2 pair of dwarf cichlids (e.g. Apistogramma Agassizii + Apistogramma Borellii) - besides the ones I already got, which are - 4 Bolivian Ram, 12 red phantom tetra, 9 Siamese algae eater and 9 Corydoras sterbai.

I really would like to acquire two pair of different Apistogramma but shall I settle for for the harem of Bolivian Ram i already got and add a harem or a pair of just one Apistogramma e.g. the Agassizii?

Cheers Elroy
 
Elroy said:
Thanks a lot for your replys. I will lok into Mr. Alexander Williamson´s YouTube channel for more info.

Wondering if you can say how big a Apistogramma territory got to be, as a minimum? My tank is 350 liter (121x51x66) and I wonder if it is big enough for 2 pair of dwarf cichlids (e.g. Apistogramma Agassizii + Apistogramma Borellii) - besides the ones I already got, which are - 4 Bolivian Ram, 12 red phantom tetra, 9 Siamese algae eater and 9 Corydoras sterbai.

I really would like to acquire two pair of different Apistogramma but shall I settle for for the harem of Bolivian Ram i already got and add a harem or a pair of just one Apistogramma e.g. the Agassizii?

Cheers Elroy
Click to expand...
The tank is big enough. Two pairs of Apisto's will not ruin the life in it. Yet there will be tensions. Some fish will dominate and others will be in submissive position. The latter will not show their best behavior.
Also, Corydoras sp. will disturb them, esp. when breeding and tending their fry.
You know, cichlids are fish with advanced sexual behaviour. That's their most attractive feature. If you have a good pair of them, you don't really need more fish to enjoy much fun. It's rather the contrary.
 
Elroy said:
Wondering if you can say how big a Apistogramma territory got to be, as a minimum?
Click to expand...
My female apistogramma lineata takes over half of my five foot tank when she spawns, don’t underestimate how defensive these little cichlids can be when spawning. I’d either up the number of your Bolivian rams or go for just one pair of one of the easier apistogramma like borelli, cacutoides or macmasteri.
 
Well, there's no denying that choosing cichlids for your aquarium isn't as simple as it may sound. I learnt that now. So I keep what I got, minus the 12 five banded barb, and then I go for a pair of Apistogramma Macmasteri .

Which to choose of theese two: Apistogramma Macmasteri Red Mask or Apistogramma Macmasteri Gold?

Hope they will be gentle on my Corydoras sterbai. And if I estimate that the space is there, then I will acquire some Cardinal tetra. But that will be later on.

Thanks everybody for help and input

Cheers Elroy
 
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