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Fluval Stratum & Caribsea Eco-Complete?

FISHnLAB

Member
Joined
4 Aug 2022
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496
Location
Ontario, Canada
Hi guys, I am currently planning my first large planted community tank(49.1 gallon) and am trying to decide on Substrate. I am currently thinking of a mix of Fluval Stratum and Caribsea Eco-Complete. What do you think? Also, I am undecided on whether I should go with Eco-Complete as a base layer and Stratum on top as a cap or the other way around. With Eco-Complete being a heavier lava rock based substrate it seams best as a base layer or filler. Mixing the two homogeneously is also an option giving the best of both worlds maybe. What do you guys think? Thanks.

PS: I plan to add 24 Hour Aquarist APT Jazz root tabs from the get go to whatever I chose.
 
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Lava gravel or "any name product that is like lava gravel" should be used only as a filler in my opinion. Manufacturers of these sometimes like to state that these contain magnificent amounts of minerals, all your plants could hope and dream about. They like to conveniently gloss over the fact that most of these minerals will be insoluble forms and almost entirely useless to your plants.

So if you have a big tank or a big slope fill some of it with some cheap lava gravel, dont spend extra for filler that says it does something for plants.
Then cap it with the soil of your choice, make sure you get the capping layer deep enough and allow for a little bit of settling over time, otherwise you'll get a headache with replanting later down the road.
If your budget is unlimited or you want "all the nutrients" then do all soil.

Definitely dont mix the two, you're not going to like this I promise. You could even contain the filler lava/gravel in mesh bags, that way rescapes will be much easier without mixing between the layers.

The APT root tabs get good reviews from some people and they sound good to me (especially if someone else pays :lol: ) but I would personally save these for adding maybe a month in when your plants have some roots and have had a chance to settle down.
There is rarely a problem of "not enough" nutrients at start up with soil, and it seems needlessly expensive to add root tabs on start up when you'll be doing frequent water changes and trying to mitigate water column levels at first, essentially pouring nutrients down the drain. That said the biggest source of nutrient spikes at startup is the rocket fuel they like to call ADA Amazonia, since you seem to be going for a slightly less spicy soil then this will be less of a problem for you.
 
Lava gravel or "any name product that is like lava gravel" should be used only as a filler in my opinion. Manufacturers of these sometimes like to state that these contain magnificent amounts of minerals, all your plants could hope and dream about. They like to conveniently gloss over the fact that most of these minerals will be insoluble forms and almost entirely useless to your plants.

So if you have a big tank or a big slope fill some of it with some cheap lava gravel, dont spend extra for filler that says it does something for plants.
Then cap it with the soil of your choice, make sure you get the capping layer deep enough and allow for a little bit of settling over time, otherwise you'll get a headache with replanting later down the road.
If your budget is unlimited or you want "all the nutrients" then do all soil.

Definitely dont mix the two, you're not going to like this I promise. You could even contain the filler lava/gravel in mesh bags, that way rescapes will be much easier without mixing between the layers.

The APT root tabs get good reviews from some people and they sound good to me (especially if someone else pays :lol: ) but I would personally save these for adding maybe a month in when your plants have some roots and have had a chance to settle down.
There is rarely a problem of "not enough" nutrients at start up with soil, and it seems needlessly expensive to add root tabs on start up when you'll be doing frequent water changes and trying to mitigate water column levels at first, essentially pouring nutrients down the drain. That said the biggest source of nutrient spikes at startup is the rocket fuel they like to call ADA Amazonia, since you seem to be going for a slightly less spicy soil then this will be less of a problem for you.
I don't think Eco-Complete is just lava gravel. It seams to be a blend consisting of mainly Basaltic volcanic soil in two different grain sizes. It has been used by many successfully by itself in planted tanks and other then its on the larger side grain size it works well from what I hear. Good to know about the insoluble minerals, thanks.

Roger that and thanks for the heads up👍. Yes, I am considering using coarse mesh bags like MD Fish Tanks uses on YouTube for the filler if I go with a 2 product approach. All aquasoil is an option but, definitely the most expensive one and I am far from rich lol. How much benefit would I see with all Aquasoil(say 3 inches deep) vs Aquasoil with mesh pouches of root Tab infused filler under it?

I plan to buy a full kit of powdered Macro/Micro/Trace elements and learn to mix my own fertilizer and make my own root tabs but, I can't learn everything at once(not enough time in the day lol) so I plan to use 24 Hour Aquarist products for the first year. I am already using their APT 3 daily(along with Seachem Flourish Advance) in my 3 gallon planted along with API root Tab infused Seachem Flourite Black and it seams to be doing well. Just so you know, I got started in this hobby only 3 & 1/2 months ago and planted my first tank 2 weeks ago. So, I am extremely green but, a faster learner then most.

Roger that on initial root tab usage. I may still add a few though as I want the absolute best growth possible and don't want to disturb the roots for a few months. As for ADA, although I love their stuff and highly respect Takashi Amano, I will be avoiding their Ammonia ridden substrates(they are way to expensive and hard to get in Canada anyway) and don't really like their system as a whole. I plan to go to the other ends of the fertilizer spectrum with either lean dosing or EI in combination with quality root tabs.

Thanks again for all of your help. Any other suggestions or constructive criticisms are more then welcome. Good growing sir👍.
 
Here is my first attempt at a planted tank. It's a 3 gallon rimless...

Inhabitants:
1 x Male Dragon Scale Plakat Betta
1 x Zebra Nerite Snail

Hardscape:
Mountain Stone
Spider Wood

Substrate:
Seachem Flourite Black(API Root Tab infused)

Plant Food:
24 Hour Aquarist APT 3(Daily)
Seachem Flourish Advance(Daily)
API Root Tabs

Plant Species:
1 x Bucephalandra Theia
1 x Anubias Nana "Wrinkle Leave"
Valisinaria Fortifolia
Hygrophilia Difformis
Helanthium Tenellus
Rotalla Rotundifolia "Green"
Taxiphyllum "Spiky"
Vesicularia "Weeping"
Salvinia Auriculata
 

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I don't think Eco-Complete is just lava gravel. It seams to be a blend consisting of mainly Basaltic volcanic soil in two different grain sizes. It has been used by many successfully by itself in planted tanks and other then its on the larger side grain size it works well from what I hear. Good to know about the insoluble minerals, thanks.
Ah I may have been wrong to include it in that group then. I have become increasingly jaded about manufacturers over the years and assumed this was one of the inert substrates sold for plants. But it sounds like you have done your research then and not taken their word for it :thumbup:

All aquasoil is an option but, definitely the most expensive one and I am far from rich lol. How much benefit would I see with all Aquasoil(say 3 inches deep) vs Aquasoil with mesh pouches of root Tab infused filler under it?
I think it will only be a minor benefit vs what it will cost, and there is much more to be gained from good care of the tank, which is almost free.

I plan to buy a full kit of powdered Macro/Micro/Trace elements and learn to mix my own fertilizer and make my own root tabs but, I can't learn everything at once(not enough time in the day lol) so I plan to use 24 Hour Aquarist products for the first year. I am already using their APT 3 daily(along with Seachem Flourish Advance) in my 3 gallon planted along with API root Tab infused Seachem Flourite Black and it seams to be doing well. Just so you know, I got started in this hobby only 3 & 1/2 months ago and planted my first tank 2 weeks ago. So, I am extremely green but, a faster learner then most.
It sounds like you have a good plan so far, definitely a good idea not to try to master every branch of aquarium DIY at the same time. APT ferts are good products and many use them with great success, I think they are a solid choice for a premade fert to lean on while one is busy with all the other gazillion things one needs to learn and wants to get right

Roger that on initial root tab usage. I may still add a few though as I want the absolute best growth possible and don't want to disturb the roots for a few months. As for ADA, although I love their stuff and highly respect Takashi Amano, I will be avoiding their Ammonia ridden substrates(they are way to expensive and hard to get in Canada anyway) and don't really like their system as a whole. I plan to go to the other ends of the fertilizer spectrum with either lean dosing or EI in combination with quality root tabs.
I should probably be honest that I dont actually use soil nor root tabs, so definitely take that part with a pinch of salt. That would just be how I would do it if I were to set up a soil tank, and I dont think it matters a great deal either way. Some of the much more knowledgeable experts around here might chime in differently, and in that case I would rather you listen to them as they have hands on experience.

Thanks again for all of your help. Any other suggestions
No problem, hope you will start a journal, we love those around here 🤩
 
Ah I may have been wrong to include it in that group then. I have become increasingly jaded about manufacturers over the years and assumed this was one of the inert substrates sold for plants. But it sounds like you have done your research then and not taken their word for it :thumbup:


I think it will only be a minor benefit vs what it will cost, and there is much more to be gained from good care of the tank, which is almost free.


It sounds like you have a good plan so far, definitely a good idea not to try to master every branch of aquarium DIY at the same time. APT ferts are good products and many use them with great success, I think they are a solid choice for a premade fert to lean on while one is busy with all the other gazillion things one needs to learn and wants to get right


I should probably be honest that I dont actually use soil nor root tabs, so definitely take that part with a pinch of salt. That would just be how I would do it if I were to set up a soil tank, and I dont think it matters a great deal either way. Some of the much more knowledgeable experts around here might chime in differently, and in that case I would rather you listen to them as they have hands on experience.


No problem, hope you will start a journal, we love those around here 🤩
I too have very quickly become jaded with manufacturers and definitely don't take their word for anything. There is just so much snake oil and misinformation in this hobby/industry. Far more then others I have participated in. I really don't know that much about eco-complete overall, it just seams to get ok reviews from people who have tried it and it is one of the cheapest planted substrate options available to me currently. In comparison, it is almost 3 times less expensive then Fluval's Stratum at my costs.

Roger that. I will probably run a filler in coarse mesh bags then to save some cash which can go to more plants(can you ever have enough lol).

That's good. When doing research and seeing what was easily available to me(and what isn't just mainly water lol) I came down to 24 Hour Aquarist and NilocG. I chose APT. I do look forward to both the savings and the adjustability/flexibility of learning to make my own ferts one day though...

Copy, thanks for being so helpful and honest.

Yes, I think I will do one. My new tank will be ordered at the start of November so expect one soon.

Thanks again Hufsa, your experience is much appreciated👍.
 
Your most foolproof and cheapest way for substrate is clean silica sand. Don't get enchanted with 'fertile' substrates. The nutrients in them are either tightly bound chemically and thus mostly inaccessible to the plants, or they are free. In the latter case, not plants but microbes will be the first to benefit from them. That's the source of many difficulties which require experience to handle. If you're a beginner, you're advised not to make things more complicated than necessary.
 
Your most foolproof and cheapest way for substrate is clean silica sand. Don't get enchanted with 'fertile' substrates.
Have to disagree with you there @_Maq_ , even as a sand user myself I think the most foolproof way to get started with a high tech tank is using some kind of soil, especially one of the more moderate ones (not Amazonia V1).
Doing a dark start for a few weeks can allow the aquarist to skip past some of the "microbe&algae free for all - wild west" phase that can be hard on invitro plants, and if they dont blast their photon torpedoes on max high end LED lights on 100% then they should avoid a lot of the melty tragedy.
What the soil substrate does that the sand does not, is smooth over mistakes. If youre dosing a bit too little, or a little too much, the soil releases or captures as needed to make things a little bit easier for the plants. Many plants also seem to like being fed both from the roots and the leaves. Basically the soil acts as a buffer in many ways and makes things a bit more forgiving.
I definitely understand your reasons for preferring sand, I prefer sand too but im not sure I would recommend it for someone looking to set up a high tech tank "the easiest way".
The soil takes a bit of management but I think for many users the benefits outweigh the cons.
 
I think we both know what we're talking about. The difference seems to be, in fact, psychological, so to speak. I take for granted that a beginner is not patient enough. And proper cycling takes well about six to eight weeks minimum.
Yes, silica sand is inert and with low adsorption capacity. However, it won't stay clean for long, no matter what you do. In a few weeks, even if it looks clean, it's full of detritus and living organic mass. Detritus works as an adsorbent for many nutrients.
 
Your most foolproof and cheapest way for substrate is clean silica sand. Don't get enchanted with 'fertile' substrates. The nutrients in them are either tightly bound chemically and thus mostly inaccessible to the plants, or they are free. In the latter case, not plants but microbes will be the first to benefit from them. That's the source of many difficulties which require experience to handle. If you're a beginner, you're advised not to make things more complicated than necessary.
Hi and thanks for the reply👍.

I'm definitely not interested in "fertile" soils per se as I plan to enrich whichever I choose with root tabs. I'm more into a durable long lasting soil with a high CEC.

Silica sand is not an option for me as my tap water is already high in silicates, I don't want to worry about Hydrogen Sulfide pockets, I don't want to damage my expensive brand new canister filter/UV light/Inline Heater setup or worry about cleaning fine sand out of it, I don't want to worry about excessive silt or disturbances while cleaning and planting, I want the detritus to permeate the soil to help feed the root feeders, and I don't like the look of white or beige sand. If I were going sand it would be something black, grey, or red/brown most likely(think Flourite sand, Onyx sand, or black diamond sand).

I am definitely not looking to make a choice that would cause me great difficulty. But, at the same time, I enjoy complicated problems, the learning process, and am not your average beginner as you can probably tell by the fact that I got into this hobby only 3.5 months ago in an unexpected trial by fire when I rescued an ill family members Betta at the edge of death. I started with learning basic fish keeping in an artificial decoration filled tank and went onto converting to a fully planted ecosystem tank and my plants and animals are thriving. I learn very fast and already had a knowledge base in chemistry and biology before I got into this which helps.

Thanks again for your help and suggestions👍.
 
All of that said, I will eventually have issues I'm sure and will be here to ask for help as needed if you kind folks will have me. I don't want you to think I'm a no it all or am not open to suggestion or criticism, I'm just trying to outline my ambitions, skills, and where I currently stand and want to go in the hobby.
 
Have to disagree with you there @_Maq_ , even as a sand user myself I think the most foolproof way to get started with a high tech tank is using some kind of soil, especially one of the more moderate ones (not Amazonia V1).
Doing a dark start for a few weeks can allow the aquarist to skip past some of the "microbe&algae free for all - wild west" phase that can be hard on invitro plants, and if they dont blast their photon torpedoes on max high end LED lights on 100% then they should avoid a lot of the melty tragedy.
What the soil substrate does that the sand does not, is smooth over mistakes. If youre dosing a bit too little, or a little too much, the soil releases or captures as needed to make things a little bit easier for the plants. Many plants also seem to like being fed both from the roots and the leaves. Basically the soil acts as a buffer in many ways and makes things a bit more forgiving.
I definitely understand your reasons for preferring sand, I prefer sand too but im not sure I would recommend it for someone looking to set up a high tech tank "the easiest way".
The soil takes a bit of management but I think for many users the benefits outweigh the cons.
Good info, thanks. On this note of Lighting intensity, can you help me on this one? I'm not really sure where I stand here on my 3 gallon above. I planted just over 2 weeks ago and ramped the light up slowly. But, I have no idea if I'm too bright or not bright enough. Can you help if you can? This is the light I am using...

NICREW RGB+W 24/7 LED Aquarium Light with Remote Controller, Full Spectrum Fish Tank Light for Planted Freshwater Tanks, Planted Aquarium Light with Extendable Brackets to 12-18 Inches, 12Watt https://a.co/d/byF0z6X

I am currently running it as follows during peak hours of the day...

White - 50%
Red - 90%
Green - 30%
Blue - 25%

Peak duration is 9 hours with a much dimmer 1 hour ramp up in the morning and a 2 hour ramp down at night.

I own a high end light meter but, not a par meter unfortunately. Not sure if this will help or not. This light specs at 600 Lumens at 12 watts at full power fyi.

Thanks👍.
 
Silica sand is not an option for me as my tap water is already high in silicates
No worry, it has nothing to do with that, silica sand is perfectly insoluble and would add less dissolved silica than any other substrate. Mind you, your tank is made from silica. Glass is a silica with some additives. Beside that, in freshwater aquariums, dissolved silica is harmless. For your info, I fertilize with hydrated silica.
I don't want to worry about Hydrogen Sulfide pockets
For that, silica sand is your best option.
I don't want to damage my expensive brand new canister filter/UV light/Inline Heater setup or worry about cleaning fine sand out of it
Never heard of such concerns. Unless you're using under-gravel filter, substrate will not enter your filter. Only if you use soil substrate it may contain lightweight particles which may possibly clog your filter media.
I don't want to worry about excessive silt or disturbances while cleaning and planting, I want the detritus to permeate the soil
The only way to avoid such trouble is silica sand of suitable size. I'd recommend 1.5 to 2.0 millimeter fraction.
I don't like the look of white or beige sand. If I were going sand it would be something black, grey, or red/brown
You can use colored sands. I don't like them. The silica grains are covered with dyes, essentially plastics. Unnatural, with unnatural physical features. Admittedly, many hobbyists use dyed sands without apparent issues.
In reality, silica sand will never remain snow-white. Biofilms of various microbes incl. microalgae will quickly make it look 'dirty'.
 
No worry, it has nothing to do with that, silica sand is perfectly insoluble and would add less dissolved silica than any other substrate. Mind you, your tank is made from silica. Glass is a silica with some additives. Beside that, in freshwater aquariums, dissolved silica is harmless. For your info, I fertilize with hydrated silica.

For that, silica sand is your best option.

Never heard of such concerns. Unless you're using under-gravel filter, substrate will not enter your filter. Only if you use soil substrate it may contain lightweight particles which may possibly clog your filter media.

The only way to avoid such trouble is silica sand of suitable size. I'd recommend 1.5 to 2.0 millimeter fraction.

You can use colored sands. I don't like them. The silica grains are covered with dyes, essentially plastics. Unnatural, with unnatural physical features. Admittedly, many hobbyists use dyed sands without apparent issues.
In reality, silica sand will never remain snow-white. Biofilms of various microbes incl. microalgae will quickly make it look 'dirty'.
Good to know. Silicates are the main source of food for Diatoms I thought? Before I went planted I used Phosguard to lower my silicates and it immediately stopped growth of diatoms.

My research indicates that tightly packed small grain sand like silica is usually the cause of hydrogen sulfide pockets which can cause spikes if you disturb them. Am I off base here?

Well, fine sand causing problems is in most beginner tutorials so I'm not sure what to think here. There are reports all over the net of damaged or prematurely worn impellers and just general annoyance with fine sand getting into everything. It just seams like more of a hassle all around verses gravel. I think if I ever go sand it will be a very coarse variety.

Roger that. Coarse sand or gravel for me.

I'm pretty sure none of the sands I listed are dyed. I just don't like light coloured Substrate other then for a riverbed accent or foreground strip maybe.

How does black diamond blasting sand compare?
 
Silica sand is not an option for me as my tap water is already high in silicates, I don't want to worry about Hydrogen Sulfide pockets, I don't want to damage my expensive brand new canister filter/UV light/Inline Heater setup or worry about cleaning fine sand out of it, I don't want to worry about excessive silt or disturbances while cleaning and planting, I want the detritus to permeate the soil to help feed the root feeders, and I don't like the look of white or beige sand. If I were going sand it would be something black, grey, or red/brown most likely(think Flourite sand, Onyx sand, or black diamond sand).
As Maq said, silica sand is not soluble, it will not contribute to any silicate levels. The Amazon river system runs over very well worn sand, almost pure silica. The water has been running through the terrain there for thousands of years, washing almost everything soluble away. The silica sand is still there 😁

The matter of hydrogen sulfide pockets is a topic that could easily need its own thread, but the general view here on the forum is that there is a lot of warnings and fear, and not quite as much evidence. Its possible that this could be a problem in some setups, but from what I have seen and experienced so far in around 20 years of fishkeeping, it seems that the problem may be somewhat overstated. I have used sand all these years and have not had a problem like this. Currently I am using very fine sand, 0,1-0,5 mm grains. I dont experience any smelly pockets or problems with plants rooting. You are unlikely to experience a lot of sand getting into your filters and equipment, I only saw notable amounts of sand when I was keeping this very fine grain sand and also had large whiptail catfish. The sand only ended up at the bottom of the canister filters, none of it made it to the impellers. Properly washed sand will be the least messy substrate for a tank that frequently sees plants uprooted, the dutch masters use sand for a reason. So in that case the soil will cause the most silt/disturbance. Your other points are totally fair and I dont want it to seem like I am trying to sell you on sand, I really am not and I think it is best for your plans and preferences to stick to your original plan of soil. I just had to clarify a few things 😁

I am definitely not looking to make a choice that would cause me great difficulty. But, at the same time, I enjoy complicated problems, the learning process, and am not your average beginner as you can probably tell by the fact that I got into this hobby only 3.5 months ago in an unexpected trial by fire when I rescued an ill family members Betta at the edge of death. I started with learning basic fish keeping in an artificial decoration filled tank and went onto converting to a fully planted ecosystem tank and my plants and animals are thriving. I learn very fast and already had a knowledge base in chemistry and biology before I got into this which helps.
All of that said, I will eventually have issues I'm sure and will be here to ask for help as needed if you kind folks will have me. I don't want you to think I'm a no it all or am not open to suggestion or criticism, I'm just trying to outline my ambitions, skills, and where I currently stand and want to go in the hobby.
I hope you dont take mine and Maq's comments the wrong way, we just love a good discussion, we cant resist 😉 I could tell that you already have a lot of research & knowledge behind you, and I think its very good that you know what you want and dont want. If you ask 5 aquarists their opinion I bet you will get at least 6 different answers, so knowing what you want helps to navigate what can be a really confusing start for most. Im still pretty confused tbh and sometimes feel like the more I learn the less I know 😅

Good info, thanks. On this note of Lighting intensity, can you help me on this one? I'm not really sure where I stand here on my 3 gallon above. I planted just over 2 weeks ago and ramped the light up slowly. But, I have no idea if I'm too bright or not bright enough. Can you help if you can? This is the light I am using...

NICREW RGB+W 24/7 LED Aquarium Light with Remote Controller, Full Spectrum Fish Tank Light for Planted Freshwater Tanks, Planted Aquarium Light with Extendable Brackets to 12-18 Inches, 12Watt https://a.co/d/byF0z6X

I am currently running it as follows during peak hours of the day...

White - 50%
Red - 90%
Green - 30%
Blue - 25%

Peak duration is 9 hours with a much dimmer 1 hour ramp up in the morning and a 2 hour ramp down at night.

I own a high end light meter but, not a par meter unfortunately. Not sure if this will help or not. This light specs at 600 Lumens at 12 watts at full power fyi.
Ill be quick to say that specific lighting units isnt my area of expertise (although im very passionate about uhh... sand, plants and certain families of fish😅 ), so this one might be best answered by someone else.
But my initial impression is that 9 hours is a little longer photoperiod, you might be a-ok with this but the super standard advice is to start out somewhere between 6-8 hours. Another super standard safest advice is to limit ramp up and down to 30 minutes each, but again this is a guideline rather than an absolute fact. The longer you have the ramping the greater the odds are that something unintentional is going to enjoy your periods of low light (so possibly algae). Your intensity doesnt sound too bad, but you should take into account that depth of tank plays a factor in how much light gets to the plants.


Good to know. Silicates are the main source of food for Diatoms I thought? Before I went planted I used Phosguard to lower my silicates and it immediately stopped growth of diatoms.
Silica sand wont give your water any more silicates. Theres sadly a bit of misinformation still going around the hobby about this, including from generally ok sources like Green Aqua.
We have several threads on this on the forum if you dont mind a search, I found one of Darrel's latest posts about this, you might be able to follow the links back to the other thread.

How does black diamond blasting sand compare?
Dont get this if you are planning to get corydoras or similar bottom dwellers. Black diamond blasting sand looks downright nasty under magnification. I know some people insist that its fine, but for me the close up pictures say enough.
 
My research indicates that
There are many sources of 'knowledge'. I cannot provide any certificate that 'I am the right one'. And that's good because I keep in high esteem many colleagues who often think differently. ...
fine sand causing problems is in most beginner tutorials
... It takes time to read through all those guides and tutorials etc., and you'll have to try for yourself, too. Some things arguably resist comprehension until you try for yourself.
Fine sand in itself does not make these problems. Sand is harmless. Problems with toxic substances come with poor maintenance and faults. They may occur regardless the substrate you actually use.
I'm pretty sure none of the sands I listed are dyed
Perhaps. You know, I live far from your place and the substrates marketed here are definitely different from those in yours. Yet I suggest to be cautious before you say 'sure they are not dyed'. They don't look like that, and that is precisely the point.
 
Good to know. Silicates are the main source of food for Diatoms I thought? Before I went planted I used Phosguard to lower my silicates and it immediately stopped growth of diatoms.
There's a good thread on diatoms here;
Diatoms
All diatom 'cures' work in almost every case. But diatoms usually disappear of their own accord shortly after they appear. You can use any treatment you like or none at all; they soon go away. :)
My research indicates that tightly packed small grain sand like silica is usually the cause of hydrogen sulfide pockets which can cause spikes if you disturb them. Am I off base here?
Silica is what it's made of, - could be any size; sand, gravel, pebbles, boulders. :)
Well, fine sand causing problems is in most beginner tutorials so I'm not sure what to think here. There are reports all over the net of damaged or prematurely worn impellers and just general annoyance with fine sand getting into everything. It just seams like more of a hassle all around verses gravel. I think if I ever go sand it will be a very coarse variety.
Even if it gets into the filter, to reach the impeller the sand would have to pass through all the filter media. That would suggest something badly wrong with the filter; design, construction or maintenance.
Roger that. Coarse sand or gravel for me.
Yes, not very fine sand (silica or otherwise).
I'm pretty sure none of the sands I listed are dyed. I just don't like light coloured Substrate other then for a riverbed accent or foreground strip maybe.

How does black diamond blasting sand compare?
Black Diamond is an industrial abrasive. No guarantee that it's aquarium safe, even if a previous batch gave the user no problems. And I wouldn't use it with any fish that rummage in the substrate. IE catfish (inc corys), cichlids (inc dwarfs), barbs, loaches, - that's about half the fish in the aquarium trade.
hth
 
As Maq said, silica sand is not soluble, it will not contribute to any silicate levels. The Amazon river system runs over very well worn sand, almost pure silica. The water has been running through the terrain there for thousands of years, washing almost everything soluble away. The silica sand is still there 😁

The matter of hydrogen sulfide pockets is a topic that could easily need its own thread, but the general view here on the forum is that there is a lot of warnings and fear, and not quite as much evidence. Its possible that this could be a problem in some setups, but from what I have seen and experienced so far in around 20 years of fishkeeping, it seems that the problem may be somewhat overstated. I have used sand all these years and have not had a problem like this. Currently I am using very fine sand, 0,1-0,5 mm grains. I dont experience any smelly pockets or problems with plants rooting. You are unlikely to experience a lot of sand getting into your filters and equipment, I only saw notable amounts of sand when I was keeping this very fine grain sand and also had large whiptail catfish. The sand only ended up at the bottom of the canister filters, none of it made it to the impellers. Properly washed sand will be the least messy substrate for a tank that frequently sees plants uprooted, the dutch masters use sand for a reason. So in that case the soil will cause the most silt/disturbance. Your other points are totally fair and I dont want it to seem like I am trying to sell you on sand, I really am not and I think it is best for your plans and preferences to stick to your original plan of soil. I just had to clarify a few things 😁



I hope you dont take mine and Maq's comments the wrong way, we just love a good discussion, we cant resist 😉 I could tell that you already have a lot of research & knowledge behind you, and I think its very good that you know what you want and dont want. If you ask 5 aquarists their opinion I bet you will get at least 6 different answers, so knowing what you want helps to navigate what can be a really confusing start for most. Im still pretty confused tbh and sometimes feel like the more I learn the less I know 😅


Ill be quick to say that specific lighting units isnt my area of expertise (although im very passionate about uhh... sand, plants and certain families of fish😅 ), so this one might be best answered by someone else.
But my initial impression is that 9 hours is a little longer photoperiod, you might be a-ok with this but the super standard advice is to start out somewhere between 6-8 hours. Another super standard safest advice is to limit ramp up and down to 30 minutes each, but again this is a guideline rather than an absolute fact. The longer you have the ramping the greater the odds are that something unintentional is going to enjoy your periods of low light (so possibly algae). Your intensity doesnt sound too bad, but you should take into account that depth of tank plays a factor in how much light gets to the plants.



Silica sand wont give your water any more silicates. Theres sadly a bit of misinformation still going around the hobby about this, including from generally ok sources like Green Aqua.
We have several threads on this on the forum if you dont mind a search, I found one of Darrel's latest posts about this, you might be able to follow the links back to the other thread.


Dont get this if you are planning to get corydoras or similar bottom dwellers. Black diamond blasting sand looks downright nasty under magnification. I know some people insist that its fine, but for me the close up pictures say enough.
There seams to mixed opinions and arguments on both sides of this topic but, either way I don't like white/beige sand so it's a non-issue for me.

Good to know, thanks.

No, you guys are great. I enjoy a good discussion too. Yes, this is a very peculiar hobby that way. So many different opinions and "right" ways to do things. Not to mention buckets of misinformation, disinformation, and snake oil. It's pretty annoying to me really as I generally value doing things the "right" way. It's made me jaded towards YouTube and forums like these honestly. I like talking with like minded hobbyists and sharing the hobby with others otherwise I would just stick to my biology text books and research papers from the likes of Diana Walstad and other PhDs. It just seams like more people get by with good water and a constant supply of new fish and plants vs actually knowing what they are doing and the science behind it. But, I digress, maybe that is just my cynical side lol.

Good to know. I have decided to buck the standard advice and use a 12 hour on off light cycle. I will use intensity to dial things back if needed but, I hope to be able to get my aquariums into balance eventually so I don't need to. MD Fish Tanks on YouTube runs a 14 hour on light cycle on all of his tanks successfully for years so I think it can be achieved. Time will tell😬... Thanks for the advice on the ramps as I hadn't considered that. I will at least dial my sunset one down to 1 hour like my sunrise. They ramp for 30 min into each light phase too. If I have problems I can go down to just a 30 min ramp.

I'll have a quick look but, it is kind of irrelevant anyway as I don't plan to use white or beige sand in anything other then a small highlighting role. I just prefer dark substrates and the way they make my fish/tank look.

Roger that. I have heard it is pretty sharp for the bottom feeders. Maybe I should have left out the "blasting" part of the description though. I don't mean just the cheap industrial abrasive sold at welding shops, I'm talking about products like this too...

AquaNatural Diamond Black 10lb, Premium Gravel and Substrate for Aquariums, Fish Tanks and terrariums, 2-4mm https://a.co/d/gqY5o3P

What do you think?
 
There are many sources of 'knowledge'. I cannot provide any certificate that 'I am the right one'. And that's good because I keep in high esteem many colleagues who often think differently. ...

... It takes time to read through all those guides and tutorials etc., and you'll have to try for yourself, too. Some things arguably resist comprehension until you try for yourself.
Fine sand in itself does not make these problems. Sand is harmless. Problems with toxic substances come with poor maintenance and faults. They may occur regardless the substrate you actually use.

Perhaps. You know, I live far from your place and the substrates marketed here are definitely different from those in yours. Yet I suggest to be cautious before you say 'sure they are not dyed'. They don't look like that, and that is precisely the point.
Yes, more in this hobby then most.

Yes, hands on learning is my preference as well. And, yes people cause a lot of their own problems but, at the same time fine sand is harder to deal with then coarse sand or gravel for a number of reasons imo.

Good point. I'm sure they don't always advertise. That said, one has to like his tank to keep enjoying the hobby and I really don't like light coloured substrates. So, although I generally prefer natural products, I'm ok with anything that doesn't leach anything into the water column or hurt my wildlife really dyed or not.
 
There's a good thread on diatoms here;
Diatoms
All diatom 'cures' work in almost every case. But diatoms usually disappear of their own accord shortly after they appear. You can use any treatment you like or none at all; they soon go away. :)

Silica is what it's made of, - could be any size; sand, gravel, pebbles, boulders. :)

Even if it gets into the filter, to reach the impeller the sand would have to pass through all the filter media. That would suggest something badly wrong with the filter; design, construction or maintenance.

Yes, not very fine sand (silica or otherwise).

Black Diamond is an industrial abrasive. No guarantee that it's aquarium safe, even if a previous batch gave the user no problems. And I wouldn't use it with any fish that rummage in the substrate. IE catfish (inc corys), cichlids (inc dwarfs), barbs, loaches, - that's about half the fish in the aquarium trade.
hth
I have already read several but, thanks👍.

I'm aware of that as I have a background in Chemistry thanks. I was referring to the silica pool sand most people buy at Walmart and the like.

True enough, the mechanical media should stop it but, I don't want to clean sand out of anything really. I used to live on a beach and it drove me nuts🤣🏖️.

Agreed.

Sorry, I shouldn't have said "blasting sand". I am aware the industrial abrasive sold for sand blasters is not ideal for bottom feeders. There are other aquarium specific products available like this though...

AquaNatural Diamond Black 10lb, Premium Gravel and Substrate for Aquariums, Fish Tanks and terrariums, 2-4mm https://a.co/d/gqY5o3P

What do you think?
 
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